Marriage After God

This episode is brought to you by our 31 prayers for my son and daughter devotionals.Click here to get "31 Prayers For My Son"Click here to get "31 Prayers For My Daughter"-----2 Corinthians 5:17Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away; behold, the new has come.Ephesians 5:8 for at one time you were darkness, but now you are light in the Lord. Walk as children of lightRomans 12:2Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfectAre we choosing to hold onto ways of being because of the past? Often these things can be subconscious, but for the believer, eventually, God will work these things to the surface.We tend to believe we see our spouse and their faults and sins so clearly but have such a hard time identifying areas we need to repent of and mature in.Once you recognize something in you that needs to be cleaned out, transformed. What are actionable steps to do next? Humble yourself to hear and receive the truthConfess it and acknowledge how it is could be tripping you upPray and ask God to sculpt youRequest accountability - ask your spouse or friends for help when they see it in you to call it out2 Corinthians 3:17-18[Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom. And we all, with unveiled face, beholding the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from one degree of glory to another. For this comes from the Lord who is the Spirit.Weekly Challenge:Take each other by surprise. Sweet or sneaky. Prank, scare, or silly. A friend of mine surprised her husband over the weekend and cleaned the garage and got him a toolbox to organize everything Do something for your spouse they haven't had time for - clean out the car or garage, organize a closet, paint that dresser, shred those papers, clean out the fridge, do the lawns. PRAYERDear Lord, Thank You for the way Your truth transforms our lives. Thank you for not giving up on us. Our hearts ache over the sin in our lives that cost you everything. We pray we would honor you by acknowledging and confessing our sin. We pray we would not hold onto anything that we shouldn’t. If we are hoarding anything from our past that is having a negative effect on us we pray we would be diligent and courageous to take that step to reconcile with you and restore any parts of our marriage we broke down because of things we hold onto or ways we believed about ourselves or each other. We pray we would be willing to surrender to you every day. In Jesus’ name AMEN! READ TRANSCRIPTJennifer (00:09):Hi, and welcome to the Marriage After God podcast. Aaron (00:12):We're your hosts Aaron Jennifer Smith. We Jennifer (00:14):Have been married 15 years and have five sweet children who are growing up way too fast. Aaron (00:18):We love God and we love marriage Jennifer (00:20):And we love to be honest about it Aaron (00:21):All. Marriage is not always a walk in the park, but we do believe it has a powerful purpose. So Jennifer (00:26):Our goal here is to open up the conversation to talk about our faith and our marriage, Aaron (00:30):Especially in light of the gospel. Jennifer (00:32):We certainly don't have all the answers, but if you stick around, we may just make you Aaron (00:35):Laugh. But our hope is to encourage you to chase boldly after God's purpose for your life together. Jennifer (00:39):This is after God. Aaron (00:47):Ready, set, go. Jennifer (00:49):Welcome back to another episode of Marriage After God. I'm your host, Jennifer Smith. Aaron (00:54):I'm Aaron Smith. Jennifer (00:55):No, I said I'm your host. I was kidding. Oh, Aaron (00:57):Aaron's here too. We are. It's we. Jennifer (01:00):I know, but you let me do the intro so Aaron (01:02):You can change however you want. Jennifer (01:05):Well seriously, welcome back. Thank you for being here today. We hope that today's episode blesses you and encourages you. And yeah, Aaron (01:13):What's today's episode about? Jennifer (01:15):Today we are going to Aaron (01:18):, Jennifer (01:20):We're going to discuss how our past AKA baggage, so people say it's nevermind. Aaron (01:27):. What do people say? I dunno. You got baggage. Jennifer (01:30):How it may be affecting your present. Aaron (01:33):Right. So we're going to be talking about those past things that kind of crept into our present. Nows. Jennifer (01:41):Okay. Aaron (01:41):We should just move on. Okay. Jennifer (01:44):Sponsor is Aaron (01:45):. Jennifer (01:46):Oh, Aaron (01:47):Can you do? The sponsor Jennifer (01:49):Episode is brought to you by our 31 prayers for my son and daughter devotionals next to our marriage. Our children are the greatest ministry that we have been given. They truly are a gift from God and he desires us to not only take care of their physical needs, but also their emotional and spiritual ones. And so Aaron and I created these devotionals for all parents to be able to pray for their son and daughter or sons and daughters. And so yeah, we just wanted to encourage you guys to build a daily habit of praying for our little ones. Praying for your little ones. Aaron (02:21):After this episode, please pick up your copy and begin a lifelong journey of interceding for your children. You can get yours today@amazon.com or shop dot marriage after god.com. Jennifer (02:33):So I'm going to set up the scene here as we intro into today's topic. I don't know if you guys remember when I told you we signed up for CC this year. It's called Classical Conversations and once a week you go to community day, which is just, I don't know why I feel like I'm stuttAarong or something. It's community day and we get to meet up with our class and our friends and we go through what we're learning about, which is really fun. But every day, every time when we come back home, I get out of the car and I'm telling the kids, you know what we're doing the rest of the day. And they kind of just fly. They're like, Aaron (03:13):They're gone and everything gets dumped at the front door. Jennifer (03:16):Well, half of it at least. And so the other half is still stuck in the car in the van. Aaron (03:20):That's also Jennifer (03:20):True. And they're overflowing with their schoolwork or Ziploc baggies or whatever they had that day. So yeah, like Aaron said, the others are just left in front of the doorway to trip over or be in my way. So that's kind of just how it's been every Wednesday working on things. This is our first year actually having backpacks and there's five of 'em. And so the kids are just like, we're homeschooled. We don't know what to do with backpacks. I dunno. Aaron (03:48):Well they don't have a place to put. Yeah. But also we have this thing in our home where every flat surface is stuff gets put stuff, it's a place to put stuff on. Jennifer (03:56):What's really funny about that is I spent all day trying to clean off countertops and the laundry room has been kind of an eyesore for me cuz it sits behind the kitchen and we've just been stockpiling a bunch of stuff back there that needs to go out to the garage or be put away. And so today I was like, I'm going to do this. And so I get it all clean, I wipe it down, I'm so happy. The laundry room's looking sparkly clean. And then we had to clean out the van and there was bike helmets and stuff from Home Depot and I'm like four Aaron (04:25):Months of Jennifer (04:25):Clothes. So I'm taking all this stuff out and I'm realizing I'm just putting it on the laundry counter and I'm mad at myself Aaron (04:32):Flat surface. Why am I doing this? It's right there. We do it. Yeah. Jennifer (04:35):It's not my kids' fault. their backpack situation. It's totally mine. Aaron (04:39):Maybe it's all that baggage. Yeah. Jennifer (04:41):Well why ? Thank you. I brought this up for a reason. I was painting a picture for you guys. So the point is that it's a process of learning and then the need is that ev by every Wednesday we need the backpacks cleaned out and ready to go and prepared for the following week. Aaron (05:03):So it could be used again. So Jennifer (05:05):It could be used again the right way. Aaron (05:06):Yeah, the right way. Jennifer (05:08):Anyways, I'll move on. Today we want to find those bags in our lives that have been left to collect dust or the ones that we kind of leave right there to consistently trip us up and be in our way. And we want to encourage you to take an intentional moment to sift through it and clean it out and put it away, Aaron (05:24):Or at minimum at least let the Holy Spirit point out stuff to us that we've been holding onto and that we were, you actually were just talking about this book you're reading and this idea of going on family hikes. Yeah. And they were discussing having the kids have a backpack and you were saying, well, Jennifer (05:43):I was laughing because as I'm reading it, she's put a couple small snacks in there, which is a great idea. Aaron (05:48):I know we put water Jennifer (05:49):Bottles in. Yeah. I'm like, no, I'm only bringing three backpacks, not five or seven. And I load 'em up and then they're two heavy Aaron (05:55):Parts and we always end up, we're carrying all the Jennifer (05:57):Backpacks. Yeah. I've got two kids and five Aaron (05:59):Members. The backpack, the baggage, the reason that term is used is because it's things that we carry with us Jennifer (06:07):And weigh us down and make things Aaron (06:09):Hard. And sometimes we don't even know those things are there. And so hopefully in this episode, Jennifer (06:14):But other times it's things that we don't wanna let go Aaron (06:16):Of. Yeah. We're like hoarders of our past stuff. So hopefully, first of all, you're encouraged as always. That's what we want to also make you laugh a little bit. But are we just going to be allow the Holy Spirit to make us aware and open our eyes and point things out to us for the purpose of being better, growing, mature, maturing being free from those things. So mm-hmm What the zips about? Jennifer (06:48):So I think the first thing that needs to happen in order for anyone to be able to start unloading the past or being able to move forward from it is to recognize that we're multifaceted creatures complex. Well, we're a little bit complex. Aaron (07:05):I think we oversimplify ourselves and we think, oh, this is who I am. And we forget that there's a plethora of variables in our life that affect us. And so not only do we have our flesh, our biology, how our brain works, the things that we like, the things that hurt us and our pain thresholds and all these things about our biology, but we also have a heart. Or in other words our will like things that we desire, things that we want ways of thinking. We also have our spirit, which is our eternal identity. We're eternal creatures. And all of those things can and are affected in by many different things. This whole idea of nature and nurture, what was it your environment or was it your D n a or both outside influences and situations as well as personal choices and beliefs, things that, all of these things. And each one of us can just look at the whole of our life, how we were raised, relationships, we've had ways of thinking things. Things that we had no control of that have happened to us and how those things have affected us and have crept into our today and how we respond and act and think. And so I think at least for me, it's hard sometimes to recognize certain things about myself to see ourselves objectively. Jennifer (08:37):But you say it's hard for me, I'm resistant , like I'm not going to Aaron (08:40):Look. But it's also hard, it's even when it's stuff's presented like wait a minute, that's not real. But things that exist. And so I think it'd be foolish for us to continue in life and just believe that we are who we are and that's it. Jennifer (09:01):Well it's a process that needs to be learned, just like how I was talking about our kids. They need to be told by someone, Hey go put your backpack away cuz they don't know the consequence yet of tripping over a backpack or how mom feels when it's stuck in the car. Aaron (09:15):Or the worst one of them getting in a bad habit their whole life. Jennifer (09:18): bad habit, their not putting stuff away, not being prepared or ready for the next one. So, so just, they need the direction and the guidance and the know-how. Sometimes we maybe always we need someone telling us, Hey, maybe you should do this. So that's what we are here for today. Hey, so we're going to tell you, hey, maybe you should do this. Aaron (09:39):And there's a term that we've used throughout our marriage, this idea of self-awareness. Yeah, it's something that we should get better at and just grow in. And it's not just a self-awareness that we kind of only look from our own eyes, but we look through God's eyes, we look through his word and we say, okay, who are we? And that's the beauty of God's word, is that it is always a true reflection of us, of who we are without Christ and of who we are with him. Jennifer (10:12):That's good. Explain that real quick. Aaron (10:14):Well we can have a self-evaluation and we look at ourselves, no, who I am is who I am. And you can't say nothing about it. But all that is is just saying, this is my view, my position. Jennifer (10:26):When you have a cute offer on and you look in the mirror and you're like, man, I look good today, but you never turned around to see, Aaron (10:30):Yeah, you're Jennifer (10:31):Dresses, it's going on back there, Aaron (10:33):Mullet. It's got mullet back there. But when we look at the word, it's not it. It's not going to take into account how you see you, but it will tell you how you see you. And whether that's right or wrong, but what it's going to, what it really is, what the word of God is doing is it's telling us who we are and that it either way, whether we're with Christ or not, it's saying, oh here's, here's who you are without Christ. Here's who you are with Christ and who Christ is making you to be. And so second Corinthians, just like a handful of verses I want to just throw out here, just kind of start this conversation off. Cuz if we don't believe these things then it doesn't matter what we say today, you're just going to always remain where you're at cuz that's what you believe. But if we believe these things, then a whole new world gets opened up for us and there's some awesome things. Jennifer (11:26):So you're about to hold up a mirror. Aaron (11:28):Yeah. Here's the mirror, second Corinthians five 17. This is who we are in Christ. Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The oldest passed away, behold the new has come. This is a hard verse for a lot of believers to we read it, we're like, yeah, that sounds great. But I personally and I, I'm sure other people have felt this way on many different things because of different ways of being different sin in my life. I look at this, I'm like, that sounds great, but not for me because it doesn't seem to be working for me. Jennifer (12:01):In which times that you Aaron (12:03):Couldn't Jennifer (12:03):Change, couldn't Aaron (12:04):Change anything, there's a sin I couldn't overcome. There a way of being that wouldn't be transformed. And I would say, well, where's that new creation? The reality is this is true. I was just believing the lie that I couldn't be, that I'm not a new creation. And so the reality for every believer who is in Christ, they are a new creation. That is their current status, new creation. And the old has passed away and the new has come. So that's the truth. Ephesians five, eight, for one time you were darkness, but now you are light in the Lord, walk as children of the light. Also true currently, Romans 12, two, do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind. That by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect. So we have these two verses that are like, this is your current status. And then you have this third verse that is like, here's how your current status, but also your current operation be transformed by the renewal of your mind. Jennifer (13:11):And I just wanna encourage you guys sending this verse about being transformed by the renewal of your mind is not like a one time look. Your mind is transformed more. So it's a continual process of being transformed when you're in the word daily and you're abiding in the word, it's transforming you. And I think sometimes we get caught up as Christians, especially those of us who have been Christians for a long time. We think, oh, I was transformed. And then we wrestle and we get confused and we get frustrated over things not changing. But how long has it been since we've been actively in the word? Aaron (13:53):And it's also a lifelong transformation. I love about this verse right here in Romans 12, two, there's this contrast of being conformed versus being transformed. Conformed is, if you imagine setting play-Doh into a mold, you just set it on top and it's slowly just forms to the mold. It's very passive. This is what happens when we do not actively believe what the word says. We just solely conform to the world and its standards. But being transformed, that's an active thing that Christ does through his word, by that renewal of our minds. So when we read his word, our minds actually change and we change with it. So when our minds change, our lives change, we are being transformed. So Jennifer (14:41):Which that is not a passive thing, that's it's not Aaron (14:43):Passive at all. Active thing. Yeah, it's very active. And then it says by testing you may a certain. So all of those things about transformation are very active things. Transformation, renewal, testing, all good things. So all this to say is that part of this new creation that we are is that we're being changed, transformed, renewed every day if we like God, if we allow his word to transform us and renew our minds. And so that's where we're moving forward in this conversation is, hey, let's let God's word reveal things to us. Let's let his spirit point out to us areas that he desires to change in us. The Bible calls it the circumcision of Christ, him coming into our lives and cutting away dead flesh and transforming us. Jennifer (15:30):One of the reasons we wanted to share this specific topic with you guys today, the why is this important is we think it's worth exploring our hearts to see if there's anything that has been in there for a while, something that's been affecting us, or maybe something that gets triggered when certain things happen and we feel a certain way because marriage is full of consistent interactions with one another. , right. We're Aaron (15:58):Cons. Millions of, yeah. Jennifer (15:59):Yeah. Little ways and big ways. So because this happens on the daily all the time, it's important to know what comes out of us and is it coming from somewhere in the past? Is it coming from a more recent past and how is it motivating our reactions and responses? Aaron (16:20):I can't remember the scripture reference, but it's out of the overflow of the heart. The mouth speaks and what's in our hearts and things come out of us. And Jesus even says this, he says, it's not what goes into the stomach that defiles a man, but what comes out of him. Jennifer (16:39):And we were talking about the difference between reactions and responses. And I mean, we talk about our responses to each other all the time. Because if I say something in a way that hurts you, we're talking about it. If you do it, we're talking about it. And so it's just a thing that marriage has to do. And so you said this, you explained it really good, you said a response is intentional and thoughtful, it's self controlled. Aaron (17:06):And a reaction is just prompt. We acting in our flesh based off of our dispositions. And Jennifer (17:14):So those things in the baggage area, are going to come out in a reaction. Aaron (17:23):But if we are more thoughtful, more self-aware, just walking in, keeping step of the spirit, we can learn and practice and grow and being able to respond thoughtfully to all circumstances in life. Not just our spouse, not just our kids. But that's what I wanna be. Be a person that learns to respond rather than just react. Right. Jennifer (17:47):Okay. So let's talk about some of these things that we would find in our bags, in our backpacks. Aaron (17:53):Yeah, let's talk about all yours. No. Oh Jennifer (17:55):Kidding. My list is a little longer than S. No, no. Well this is kind of Aaron (17:59):Just like I have them too. This Jennifer (18:00):Is mixed of ours, but also general. Aaron (18:03):And sometimes as were, when we were writing our notes are these things can be very subtle and actually hard to identify sometimes. But I am praying that God does reveal these things in me. So I have some too. For sure. I imagine that probably the most commonplace where we have stored up issues, baggage, stuff that we've drugged from the past or just Jennifer (18:26):Held onto to Aaron (18:26):Oh yeah. And held onto it is past hurts in relationships with our spouse, with our friends, parents probably parents is a big one. And so huge influence whether they were around or not. Both can have profound influence on our life and effect in the kind of people we are and how we react in situations. And these come in many different forms. Betrayal, which is a big, big one. When someone we love betrays us, betrays our trusts broken Jennifer (19:00):Trust, that's Aaron (19:01):A huge one. Fights that we've had either physical or emotional or verbal. These types of things that we've had between people that mean a lot to us issues with our mother, father of both that has an effect on us and how we move forward in life. And the kinds way we view our spouse and the way we view our children and the way we respond in certain C circumstances, like you said, use the word trigger. There's lots of things that trigger us and we might respond based off of those old hurts. Jennifer (19:35):So that's a really good summary of just relationships. Like relationships affect us. For others it could be P T S D, maybe it's guilt or regret from choices previously made bad habits that kind of just stuck with you, Aaron (19:52):Right? They just kept going Jennifer (19:55):Debts. And also a huge one is addiction. Aaron (20:00):These could be a lot of these things. I brought addiction into our marriage and I've talked about that a lot. Debt also things that actually shaped quite a bit of the first parts of our marriage, like years. So those all have things. So don't, some of these other things I may not personally deal with and you may not, but there are people that do. But all of these things, all of these different triggers, all of these different types of baggage that we could bring in. God redeems and he works through and he's patient with us and desires to grow us and change us. So another one is and I feel like you've struggled with this a lot just throughout the years and it's something that God's totally been working in you and slowly is bringing to the surface. But inner criticisms, Jennifer (20:52):Judging myself and being my worst critic, Aaron (20:59):Those things, that way of thinking, it comes from when you were younger and it gets amplified by certain things and built on. And if they're not dealt with, then that's going to always be viewing yourself from that lens. Jennifer (21:16):For sure. I can see that. And when I let those types of thoughts consume me, I do get irritated. And if I'm bothered by one thing already, then there's an interaction with us. I just, I'm stuck there. That's what it feels like. Aaron (21:33):Well and that stuck feeling that in inadequacy or that criticism of yourself sometimes manifests in a way of failure to continue on not wanting to give up, wanting to Jennifer (21:47):Feeling paralyzed per that's a thing emotionally. Yeah. Paralyzed, Aaron (21:51):Which affects us, like you said, and affects you and it affects your relationship with the Lord and your kids and even friends some other, another area that baggage manifests in fears. Jennifer (22:07):Fears from actual circumstances that have happened to people that who have gotten hurt or kind of doing that whole worst case scenario type thing. Aaron (22:19):Yeah. I've known people that they respond certain ways when they see si situations that mimic something that bad that happened to a friend or a family member. And so there's this fear that ends up being a controlling factor in their way of thinking and responding and being Jennifer (22:41):Control. That's a big one. Yeah. Other ones are just doubts or insecurities from way back in childhood that become a trigger for anxiety. I know something that I've struggled with is things lies that I've believed about myself. And in the present, when I experience stress, those things get affirmed. Cuz I remember, oh see yeah, I'm bad at this or I can't think of anything in this particular moment, but I Aaron (23:12):Know that, no, it's almost like self-fulfilling prophecy. Like, oh look, I mess up in this area again. I, oh, I couldn't get this bedroom clean or this or I, in the way I communicated to my friend, oh look what I did again. Yeah. Who I am rather than Which Jennifer (23:28):You brought up that verse about being a new creation and that's what makes it hard to believe that when you're stuck believing the lies that Yeah, Aaron (23:35):Because look what I did again. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Well and that's a very common thing that we fall into is believing that because we maybe succumb to a pattern a way of being that we've had for a long time or that comes with this baggage that is who we are. But that very thing that we think is what keeps us from growing past that. Mm-hmm. From truly repenting of that way of truly being transformed in that area. Because what we're really saying is, I'm not new in that area. That is who I am. Therefore it's going to happen again rather than when it does happen again, I'm going to repent of that thing and know that that's not who I want to be. . Okay. Something that, this is baggage from my life and it's, I've been confronted with it a lot and it's a really hard thing to just constantly confronted with. But I think I've been making strides in the last most recent years, more than I have in my whole life. Because I've finally believed it was an issue where before I believed this lie that no, it's just who I am. Oh, it's because of the way I was raised. Jennifer (24:55):You should just tell 'em what it is I was going to say. Or minimizing it. It's not minimizing, it's not how you're perceiving it. That's not what I'm doing. Aaron (25:05):So my way of communicating , my way of talking, my way of sharing, my way of using my words and my tones and my facial expressions in a normal setting can be very passionate, very Jennifer (25:25):I feel like is a positive spin on what you're Aaron (25:28):Well in a general scenario, yeah, it, I think a positive thing. But it has gotten me sometimes into a lot of Jennifer (25:35):Trouble. Sometimes it can sound argumentative or fights me. Aaron (25:40):Sometimes it is argumentative, sometimes it is argue. I used to love the argument. We'll Jennifer (25:47):Say this, you're a very strong communicator. You're a confident communicator. And sometimes it's Aaron (25:52):Just, which should come off. Arrogant Jennifer (25:53):Comes off the wrong way. Aaron (25:55):It Jennifer (25:55):Comes. And then because of all this in situations with me where you're actually stressed, frustrated there's a problem. It sounds, it comes out and it sounds harsh. And that's where I get sensitive. I'll say this, wait a minute. Aaron (26:08):More than one person who were friends of mine told me that when they first met me, they thought I was a big jerk. So it's not like this is a isolated event. This is a thing that has followed me when I'm overwhelmed. So on the extreme negative side of this, when I'm overwhelmed or stressed or frustrated or embarrassed or feel guilty, then it comes out in harshness, in controlling words. And Jennifer (26:39):Not so compassionate. Aaron (26:40):And not compassionate is not on the list of words that describes what I do. And Jennifer, you, it's interesting how God Jennifer (26:50):Pairs us up. Aaron (26:51):Yeah. Pair pairs us up with the people that who is it? Timothy Keller that says this idea that your spouse is a perfect mirror reflecting your son back at you. Jennifer (27:02):Gary. Gary Thomas. Aaron (27:02):Oh, Gary Thomas. Thank you. I was thinking, I was like, it's one of those writers that have written sacred marriage. Yeah. Sacred marriage. And that's exactly what it is. You, you're sensitive to that. Sensitive to that way of communicating the harshness in a big way, I think rightly. And so when it happens, when I walk in that past way of being that baggage, when I allow that to be, when I react rather than respond, it's you shut down and it hurts you and it's really hard for you to open back up to me in that moment. That's something that we've, for 15 years now, it's been a, yeah, Jennifer (27:41):I was going to make an a note cuz when we say past baggage, a lot of times it sounds like something or is associated with something that happens prior to marriage, which a lot of it does childhood and all of that. But I mean we've been married 15 years now, so our past baggage is we're creeping into early marriage and that's our Aaron (28:00):Early marriage baggage is creeped into our present now, our present marriage. Jennifer (28:05):Yeah. I just think that's interesting how even our recent past something can happen or an experience that kind of changes us in a way that if we're not being willing to examine, could follow us and continue a pattern of hurt in our life and in our spouse's Aaron (28:24):Life. And it has in many different ways. But the awesome thing is when we are willing to see it, which is a form of humility. Oh wait, I'm not perfect. Oh wait, I have these issues that need, that God wants to change in me, then it can actually be dealt with. And so I would say, Jennifer, am I perfect at this? Jennifer (28:50):No, but you have grown a lot Aaron (28:52):And I also have gotten better. I think this is the biggest thing I've changed and I've gotten better at receiving when you tell me I'm being harsh. Totally. Where I used to fight and defend and justify. And Jennifer (29:04):I would also say that your level of harsh being harsh has not changed. Where in the beginning it was a lot more. Right. Aaron (29:12):But again, that intense, that baggage from the past goes into how you respond because you remember how it was and you felt it. And all those things still exist in you. And so that's been something that you've had to learn how to grow in is how to receive me as a change. Jennifer (29:29):See, we're complex. Marriage is complex. This is all complex, super Aaron (29:33):Complex. Listen, Jennifer (29:34):We're figuring it out complex. Okay, so are we choosing to hold on to ways of being because of what's happened in the past? Aaron (29:46):I got a question for you. Jennifer (29:47):Well wait, Aaron (29:48):I just asked a question. I know you're sounded rhetorical. No it's not though because we could be choosing it. But I got a question, why would someone choose, can I ask you why have you chosen to hold onto something? Something that came to my mind and maybe you're, hopefully you're okay with me sharing it when I sin against you or when I do something wrong or hurt you. You have a hard time moving past it letting go because you're fearful that I won't get it Jennifer (30:24):Like you. Yeah. Aaron (30:28):Does that make sense? Yeah, yeah. You know what I'm trying to describe it carefully. Jennifer (30:32):No I don't. Don't know exactly. But I think what you're saying is I get afraid that maybe you haven't learned your lesson or understood how you hurt me. And so now I have to teach you how you hurt me. And Aaron (30:44):So I'm not necessarily saying holding you, holding onto that thing, but you holding onto that way of showing your hurt. Jennifer (30:53):Yeah, the closed offness, the shutting off the leave me alone. Aaron (30:56):Yeah. Is it something that you think you choose to hold onto? I literally thought about it when you asked the question just now. I was thinking, oh, why would someone choose that? Choose to hold onto something. Jennifer (31:08):Yeah. I think I feel like almost in a way it validates why I feel the way that I feel because the moment that I let it go, it's like we're back to square one. I don't know. Aaron (31:20):Well so here's something I just thought about. There was parts of me. So I have my ears pierced. I mean I don't even have jewelry in 'em anymore. I used to have these plugs and it's just a big hole. Now, I don't know if you've seen pictures of me but that Steph my beard thi things about my persona I held onto because I believed a certain thing about myself that if I had these earrings, if I had this beard, if I dressed this way or whatever it was, I would fit in or stand out or these things that I held onto from when I was younger for various reasons. Cuz I wanted to be a part of something. It was very hard for me to let those parts of me go or allow them to be changed. So I chose to hold onto those things purely because of the security I felt and how it shaped my identity. (32:20):So that was something for me. And it was, do you remember that? It was a very hard season for, which is so funny cuz all I was doing was taking out these two wood plucks outta my ears. But it was a big deal because I was recognizing how much I was holding onto this picture of who I thought I was. No one else cared in the whole world, but I had this idea. So I think sometimes people can choose to hold on to this baggage because it actually is a part of our identity. Like well that if I let go of that, then I'm, that I cease to be who I am. Which also is not true cuz we're so much more than just the way I communicate my harsh words or if I yell when I'm angry. Those kinds of things that that's just for me. Those are things that can be changing. God wants to change, he wants me to be a better man in those areas. Just Jennifer (33:22):For the record, you don't really yell. Aaron (33:23):No, I'm trying to give examples of I do get loud just what I'm excited or anything. Our whole family's really loud. Jennifer (33:32):Actually no, I That's a lot different than saying yell. You just explained to them that you're harsh and now you just said that. I know. They're Aaron (33:37):Like, Aaron yells. No, no, you're right. I don't really do that but I'm just trying to say is I think that's one reason someone can hold onto it. Do I don't know if there's any other you could think of, but it's a good question to ask. Are we choosing to hold onto this baggage? Jennifer (33:55):Yeah, I think that we end up choosing it when we make that decision of whether or not we're going to handle what's in that backpack, what's in that bag, what's holding us back, what we're holding onto. Aaron (34:08):So it's it, it's not necessarily, it may not be an active, I choose this, but more of a, I refuse to look at it. I don't wanna see this. It's an apathy towards the, Jennifer (34:20):I'm not going to deal with Aaron (34:21):It that thing inside of me. No, you have your stuff and don't Jennifer (34:25):Like, you're not cheerfully walking around the house with a backpack on, but it is sitting right in front of your front entryway. Aaron (34:34):So this next note it kind of leads into that is, or what we're saying kind of leads into this next note I should say sometimes these things can be subconscious that they could be just parts of us. We again we're react reactions but for the believer, eventually God will work these things out to the surface. Yeah, Jennifer (34:55):That's Aaron (34:56):True. When we're in his word, when we're in prayer, when we, we love God and we follow him eventually God, if it's something that is opposed to his will, if it's something that doesn't align with the bride of Christ, it's going to work to the surface Jennifer (35:13):Decades later. Have you ever been like, why am I dealing with this right now Aaron (35:17):Or again, because why am I dealing with this again? Because Jennifer (35:20):God loves us and he cares about Aaron (35:22):Us. That scripture, we know that we're sons because he disciplines us, because he disciplines those he loves. So that part of that discipline is bringing to the surface these things that he desires to remove from us change in us. Jennifer (35:40):Something that is important for us to ask ourselves is do we desire our spouse to grow and change from their past and how it affects them. I know this whole episode we've kind of talked about from our perspective and our point of view, what's in our baggage. But I think another part of the question here is do we care about what's happening to our spouse and do we have eyes to see them and what they're going through? Are we able to sift through their responses and reactions to say, Hey, there's this thing over here that's bothAarong you. Address that. Aaron (36:16):Well I think in a wrong way, this is the easiest thing for us to do. Jennifer (36:26): point the finger. Aaron (36:27):Yeah, . Look at this thing John. That's Jennifer (36:29):Not how I meant that Aaron (36:30):Question. We're good. I know, but when you were reading it I was like, was like, yes Jennifer (36:35):We do do that, Aaron (36:36):But we tend to have an easier time identifying the issues in our spouse or in anyone else. That's true. But what you are saying Jennifer (36:48):It's Als Oh sorry, go ahead. Aaron (36:50):I was just going to say what you are saying is the more I is the what God does desire from us is that we see these things in our spouse for their good, not because we want to be. Right. Right. So I actually care about you, Jennifer (37:09):I wanna work this out with you. Aaron (37:11):But I think that can only happen when we can see ourselves clearly Jennifer (37:16):Right. In a right way. Yeah, that's true. Aaron (37:18):Because if we're refusing to look at ourselves then I think we'll always see wrongly I was, or at least with a wrong heart. Jennifer (37:26):Yeah, I was going to add to what you were just saying and just explain how, and I don't think that I'm alone in this maybe , but it's not only is it easier to see what your spouse is dealing with and how it affects them, but it's easier for me to get passionate or fired up about, you know, need to change that thing cuz it's affecting us and it's affecting our marriage way easier and way more intense than seeing myself clearly and saying, Ooh, that's bad. I need to change that. And being away intense about it. I'm more light with myself as far, I'm a hard critic, but I'm light on the side of I need to change this Aaron (38:09):Again. I think that's also a really common thing. We tend to be very lenient with our own sin but strict Jennifer (38:19):With others. That's what I was trying to say. You simplify things good for Aaron (38:21):Me. Well, but what you said was correct. Yeah. We just had a conversation about something that we were like, yeah that needs to change right now. And then it's like, oh but I have stuff. Can I have that same passion for my own transformation? Jennifer (38:39):We real quick, just earlier we were talking about whether or not we're choosing to keep the baggage and to hold onto it. So obviously the Holy Spirit talks to us Christians and walks us through God's word and holds up that mirror. And so we're constantly confronted with sin whether we'd like to admit it or not. Will you just explain the consequence of resisting the Holy Spirit quenching the Holy Spirit? Yeah. What happens? Aaron (39:11):Do you remember when I would explain to you how heavy I felt when I maybe messed up a little bit in this area and I knew I needed to confess to you, but I didn't want to and I just felt like the spirit of God wouldn't let me move past that. And I believe that's something that we can grow in sensitivity to with Christ is that of our sin gets more and more heavy regardless of how small we think it is. And there's this verse in Psalm 32, I just read to you just the other day that I feel like described exactly what it feels like when we push away the Holy Spirit when he comes to us and says, Hey, I want to change you in this or I want you to confess this or I want you to move in this way. In Psalm 32 it says, for when I kept silent, my bones wasted away through my groaning all day long for day and night. (40:13):Your hand was heavy upon me. My strength was dried up as by the heat of summer. And I feel like that describes what it, and this is David writing this that describes what it feels like and what's actually happening when we push the spirit of God away when he comes to us and he convicts us and we say nah and wants something else, I don't want that conviction. So you asked me to describe it. I think that scripture does, but I think that's something that God wants us to learn is how to become sensitive to listening to his spirit and his conviction and his moving in our lives rather than more dull. And that's actually the warning that the New Testament gives is to not quench the Holy Spirit, is to not blast from the Holy Spirit is to not push him away for in doing so we will harden our hearts and we don't wanna do that. We wanna be sensitive and pliable and moldable and open to God and when he has for us. Jennifer (41:23):That's really good. Sorry to jump back and forth here. So then we were just talking about how it's easier to see what's going on in our spouse's life and easier to become more intense about you need to change this area. And I was just thinking about Matthew seven, one through five about taking the plank out of your own eye. Read it. Aaron (41:42):Yeah, why don't we just read real quick. So starting in verse one Matthew seven, judge, not that you be not judged for we for with what judgment you judge, you'll be judged and with the measure you use, it will be measured back to you. And why do you look at the speck in your brother's eye but do not consider the plank in your own eye Or how can you say to your brother, let me remove the speck from your eye. And look, plank is in your own eye. Hypocrite first, remove the plank from your own eye and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye. Jennifer (42:16):That's kinda like the whole point of this episode today. Aaron (42:19):It kinda is. Jennifer (42:20):Yeah, we want you to see clearly. Aaron (42:23):And the purpose of seeing clearly is for the mutual upbuilding and encouragement of your brother or your wife or your friend in the church. And so we, in removing our plank and allowing the spirit of God to say, Hey there's look at this plank in your eye, then we can see clearly in each in someone else's eyes and we can see, hey, I'm coming to you out of love and compassion. Here's something I see in you and let's work on that. Let's grow. And then I think the Lord wants you to change in that or get rid of it altogether. Jennifer (42:57):Yeah, that's good. So we mentioned last episode that you were headed off to a men's retreat and you had a really great time. Your friend let out a little message time and ask some really good questions. And so I was going to ask if you wanted to share those cuz those are really good questions to kind of prompt those listening can go back with their spouse and ask each other. Aaron (43:25):It was breaking up your life into just different categories, marriage, parenting, friends, church, and then asking a few questions in each of those areas for the sake of growth. One is the first question is what's something that's tripping you up or keeping you from what you want desire in that area? So again, what baggage is holding you back? What's that thing? And then the next question is, what's a goal you do have? So say for your marriage. Jennifer (44:00):So it's a hard and a positive. Aaron (44:02):And then the last one is like, what's one step you could take today to work toward that goal? But those can work in the same with what we're talking about too is evaluating okay, what area of my life do I feel like I've just been holding onto something that's affected me? And then what's your goal with that? And then what's one step you can take toward rid that from your life, cleaning it out, cleaning out those lunch bags so they're ready to be Jennifer (44:32):Used. That's good. So we kind of came up with a couple of actionable steps just to wrap up this episode because we didn't wanna leave you empty handed but tools. Tools. So once you recognize something in you that does need to be cleaned out and transformed, what are those steps? Aaron (44:50):Again, we talked about idea of plank eye or being able to see or acknowledge that you have something starts with humbleness. Yeah, Jennifer (45:00):It's a posture of your heart. Aaron (45:02):It's saying, I know I'm going to need discipline and transformation and there's areas of my life God that I want you to change or that I don't even know need to be changed, but they're there. So just having a humility, homeless to receive to not only hear from your spouse but a friend, but most importantly from the Holy Spirit and his Jennifer (45:22):Word and his word, God's word. Number two would be confess it and acknowledge how it could be tripping you up because this is a really important step because you might think about it, but it could be so brief that you brush it off and you don't wanna confront it, you don't wanna call it what it is. But once you say it out loud it there's almost like this releasing of Aaron (45:45):Good to just, well there's a freedom that comes from it. But it also, once you speak it out loud, it becomes a thing that exa, it's heard and now it exists and it's known. So that confession. But a true confession we talked about in the beginning, something that kept me from changing was minimizing. This is a tool we use, it's defense mechanism. If I can minimize the thing, the sin, the way of being, oh it's not that bad. Oh it's just my personality. Oh it's just my upbringing. Oh it's just my nationality. Oh it's just my whatever you want to call it. And you minimize the bad attitude. You minimize the harsh way of talking, you minimize the sin behavior, then you're not actually confessing. What you're doing is you're shrinking and making it seem small and saying, yeah, it's not that bad. But confession is like, you know what God doesn't want that. I wanna, I don't want it because God doesn't want it. Jennifer (46:41):On a side note, a part of this confessing and acknowledging is also acknowledging the effect it has on your present and on your spouse. Because that part's important too, that we can actually see it for what it is and go, okay, Aaron (46:54):This hurts people, Jennifer (46:55):This hurts people. That's important to be able to acknowledge that. Number three would be pray and ask God to keep sculpting you and transforming you and change you in that area. Aaron (47:06):Yeah, go ahead. Before the father of lights to make us more light, to make us like us on Jesus and that he's the one that does the work in us. He says he's faithful and just to forgive us our sins. And he also is faithful to complete what he began in us. That good work He began in us, he completes it. The fourth one, request accountability. This will most likely, cuz we're talking about marriage with these things, our spouse is going to be our best accountability partner. What Jennifer (47:37):Does that look like in Aaron (47:38):Our marriage? If we let them Jennifer (47:39):, what does that look like in our marriage? So Aaron (47:41):It means that, Jennifer (47:42):Hey, I recognize this thing in me when you see it, will you help me by Aaron (47:48):Saying something? Jennifer (47:49):Saying something, walking me through it. Aaron (47:51):Yeah. The hard part with this is when it's said to us or in our flesh, I do this and you've done this too, Jennifer, is we don't like how it's said. We don't like that they, they're saying something in that way in that time and their tone was off. But the fact that they're saying something's important and so if we can practice receiving, receiving, receiving. So going back to number one, yeah, humbling ourselves. Jennifer (48:16):This is the song Aaron (48:17):Na. And then go back to number two. We can confess it. So we can always go back to our spouse later on and be like, Hey, I really appreciate you reminding me next time will you be do a gentler. Yeah. So I think just receiving that accountability from our spouse but also adding on the more we can have it. So bringing it up to our friends, Hey, I've been this way with my family or with my children or with my wife, or in general if you recognize it, will you just gimme a little nudge and say, Hey man, chill out. Remind me of that thing that I'm trying to grow out of. Jennifer (48:51):And all this is practice walking in practice. And as you do it, yeah, it gets easier and better. Even with the accountability. We're better at how we keep each other accountable now than what we did 15 years ago. Aaron (49:05):And hopefully in 15 years we'll be even better than we are today. Jennifer (49:08):Hopefully we won't have to keep each other accountable at all. Cuz see, Aaron (49:11):We'll we'll be perfect. I think that's the fallacy though, is that we think one day we're going to be past all this stuff. Okay, all right. The reality is we go back to number one, humble ourselves. We need Jesus every day. I like that all day. I like that meme that says, man, I need Jesus to go into Walmart. That's true. We need Jesus literally every day and we need the gospel of Jesus to remind us every day that we need God and that he's transforming us. So I wanted to end with this verse cuz I feel like this kind of culminates this whole idea because at the end of the day it's not just like, Hey, let's just be better people. There's something beautiful that God's doing and it's in second Corinthians three 17 and 18. Now the Lord is the spirit and where the spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom. (50:06):And we all with unveiled faces beholding the glory of the Lord are being transformed in the same image from one degree of glory to another. For this comes from the Lord who is the spirit. This is what Christ wants for us is true eternal freedom. And we get to experience it now in various ways and in little ways and in big ways as God is transforming us into the same image of Christ. And I love that it says, and it for a long time I didn't understand what this means from one degree of glory to another. And there's another scripture that reiterates this from glory to glory. So from one degree of glory to another, the fact is you are currently a new creation and daily being made a new creation. (50:58):Amen. That's the reality. Yeah, we are new. And then on a even larger scale, even before Christ, before you believed in Christ, you were made in his image. In his image He made a male and female were made in God's image and then in Christ we're being made into that same image. So from one degree of glory to another. And so it's a constant just moving on up, changing us every day. So I just wanna encourage you guys listening that it's for freedom, that God's doing this with us and he's transforming us cuz he loves us. So I hope that encourages you. Jennifer (51:42):It does me. All right. Weekly challenge. For those of you who are taken up, our challenges and doing awesome things this week is take each other by surprise. It could be sweet or it could be sneaky. You could do a prank, you can scare each other or be silly Aaron (51:59):. Jennifer likes the sneaky kind Jennifer (52:01):And the silly. I like Aaron (52:03):Anything next. Sneaky and the silly. I like Jennifer (52:04):Anything that's surprising and funny. I just wanna share real quick, A friend of mine surprised your husband over the weekend when he was gone and cleaned out his entire garage and got him a toolbox to organize all of his stuff. Aaron (52:16):I saw Jennifer (52:17):That. I know. It was awesome. Aaron (52:18):That is, that's sweet. Sneaky and sneaky. And depending on the kind of person could be scary. You put my, where Jennifer (52:25):Is everything? Aaron (52:26):Yeah, that's pretty awesome. Jennifer (52:27):That's kind of a big one. But Aaron (52:30):Also that friend surprise whose garage is cleaned out. You love to scare whenever possible. Yes, we do. So Jennifer (52:37):We collectively, Aaron (52:38):We do it. Actually a lot of people at our church love to scare. Jennifer (52:43):Oh, Cody, that's funny. Okay, so do something for your spouse that they haven't had time for. That's just like an easy example. You could clean out the car for them. You could organize a closet or paint a dresser shred those papers that they stack on top of the shredder. Hey, hey, Aaron (53:01):I do do that. Jennifer (53:03):Anyways, these are just silly ideas, but good job. Do you have anything to add, ? Nope. Okay. , Aaron (53:10):Shall we pray? Jennifer (53:11):Yeah. Aaron (53:12):Dear Lord, thank you for the way your truth transforms our lives. Thank you for not giving up on us. Our heart aches over the sin in our lives that cost you everything. We pray we would honor you by acknowledging and confessing our sin. We pray we would not hold onto anything that we shouldn't. If we are hoarding anything from our past that is having a negative effect on us, we pray we would be diligent and courageous to take that step to reconcile with you and restore any parts of our marriage. We broke down because of things we hold onto or ways we believed about ourselves or each other. We pray we would be willing to surrender to you every day. In Jesus name, amen. Jennifer (53:51):Thank you for joining us for another episode of the Marriage After God podcast. Aaron (53:54):If you found today's episode fun and encouraging, please take a moment to share it on social media or in an email to some of your married friends. Jennifer (54:00):Also, would you please take a moment and leave us a review, reviews help to spread the word about our podcast. Aaron (54:05):Be sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode, and you can always check out more of our resources@marriageaftergod.com. Jennifer (54:10):You can follow us on social media for more marriage encouragement on Facebook and Instagram at Marriage after God at Husband Revolution and at Unveiled Wife. Aaron (54:19):We hope you have an incredible week and look forward to sharing more with you next week on The Marriage After God podcast.   Connect With UsInstagram | @marriageaftergodInstagram | @unveiledwifeInstagram | @husbandrevolutionCheck out our marriage resources!SponsorsGet our new book The Marriage Gift - 365 prayers for your marriage!

Speaker 1 (00:10):Hi, and welcome to the Marriage After God podcast. Speaker 2 (00:12):We're your host Aaron and Jennifer Smith. Speaker 1 (00:14):We have been married 15 years and have five sweet children who are growing up way too fast. We Speaker 2 (00:18):Love God and we love Speaker 1 (00:20):Marriage, and we love to be honest about it all. Speaker 2 (00:22):Marriage is not always a walk in the park, but we do believe it has a powerful purpose. Speaker 1 (00:26):So our goal here is to open up the conversation to talk about our faith and our marriage, Speaker 2 (00:30):Especially in light of the gospel. Speaker 1 (00:32):We certainly don't have all the answers, but if you stick around, we may just make you laugh. Speaker 2 (00:36):But our hope is to encourage you to chase boldly after God's purpose for your life together. Speaker 1 (00:40):This is Marriage after God. Speaker 2 (00:49):Hey, welcome back to another episode of The Marriage After God podcast. I'm Aaron Smith. Speaker 1 (00:53):I like you when you go podcast. Speaker 2 (00:55):Podcast Speaker 1 (00:56):. Sorry. Keep Speaker 2 (00:59):Going. And you are Speaker 1 (01:01):. I'm Jennifer. Speaker 2 (01:03):Okay. Speaker 1 (01:03):Some call me Jen. Speaker 2 (01:05):Today. We, Yes. I don't call you Jen though. Speaker 1 (01:08):No, I like that you call me Speaker 2 (01:09):Jennifer. I call you Jennifer exclusively. Wait, does that mean I'm the only one that calls you Jennifer ? What was that? Nothing. Speaker 1 (01:19):Just keep going. Okay. Speaker 2 (01:20):Uh, today we are gonna be having a light and fun, candid conversation with each other Speaker 1 (01:28):Because why not? Speaker 2 (01:29):Because we can and we should Speaker 1 (01:31):And it's Speaker 2 (01:32):Fun. Yeah. And that's what we wanna do. Okay. Before we jump into that conversation, I wanna share with you this week's episode's sponsor. Uh, this episode's sponsored by our 31 prayers for my husband and wife, devotionals. Uh, these are our, some of our best selling books, which is really amazing cuz that means there's th thousands and thousands of marriages out there that desire to grow in their prayer life for their spouse and their marriage specifically, which is awesome. We design these books, uh, to be a catalyst and an inspiration for your prayer life, not a replacement for it. Um, so if you've been blessed by this show and you'd like, we'd, we'd be honored if you'd pick up a copy of our 31 Prayers for Marriage books, and they could be found at shop dot marriage after god.com or@amazon.com. With that being said, um, what is that? What that, Okay. Speaker 1 (02:27):. Okay. Speaker 2 (02:28):How long have you been holding that in your shirt? Speaker 1 (02:29):Just a little while. So, can people hear me over it? I don't know. It's really cute. We got this. It's a, Do you wanna explain what it's Speaker 2 (02:39):? Jennifer's doing Show and tell right now, but it's just Tell . Speaker 1 (02:43):It's one of those Christmas snow globes and it has a bear in it with Christmas trees. Speaker 2 (02:48):It's pretty, It's not a Santa Claus bear either. It's just a regular black bear Speaker 1 (02:52):, Speaker 2 (02:52):Which is much more accurate. Speaker 1 (02:54):. Okay. So the reason that I snuck this into today's podcast and for you, Aaron, is because I wanted everyone to know that I really like the element of surprise. I like shocking people. I like saying, I like doing things that make you go, What are Speaker 2 (03:09):You doing? What's the term you used to use for your mom? Speaker 1 (03:11):What Speaker 2 (03:12):Do you mean when she's being sneaky? I don't know. A ninja. Oh, you like, I don't know. You like being in Ninja Speaker 1 (03:18):. Yeah. I just, I like putting smiles on people's faces and I knew if I snuck this in my shirt and started playing it, you would smile . Speaker 2 (03:26):I am smiling. Speaker 1 (03:27):But what's really funny about this is, um, so we do CC class on Wednesdays and my five year old Wyatt, the first day of class, we all show up and everyone's kind of feeling nervous. I, well, I was, I don't actually know if all the kids were, but I look over and he, he pulls this from his backpack and he goes, Mom, is it okay that I brought this today? . Speaker 2 (03:46):So he did a sneaky move Speaker 1 (03:47):Too. He did a sneaky move. And I think, I mean, just when we're thinking about life in general, like obviously we don't need to walk around with a snow globe in our pocket , but Speaker 2 (03:57):Well, that's what you do. Speaker 1 (03:59):Well, I try and come up with ideas that make people go, What, what? Speaker 2 (04:04): Why are we talking about snow Speaker 1 (04:05):Globes? I hope my friends, I hope you appreciate this about me. Speaker 2 (04:09):I do. Speaker 1 (04:09):Now we have to finish Speaker 2 (04:10):Listening to this. Well, you should go put it like in the far away so we don't keep hearing you in the background. . Speaker 1 (04:15):Okay. Speaker 2 (04:18):So did you get all your snow globe out? Yeah. Speaker 1 (04:20):It's outta my system. Speaker 2 (04:21):It's outta your system. It's outta your shirt. It's put away. It's all right. So what, what is this topic Speaker 1 (04:27):Today? Yeah. So we just thought it would be really cool to do a candid and lighthearted conversation, uh, with each other. And one of the reasons is because, Aaron, you have something really exciting going on this week. So, not that we had a rush through this podcast, or, you know, be quick to record, which we kind of did. Um, do you wanna share a little bit about what Speaker 2 (04:47):You're doing? Yeah. Our church, uh, we try to every year, but it tends to be year and a half, maybe every, Speaker 1 (04:53):Yeah. Speaker 2 (04:53):Um, year and a half. Um, the, the women go on a women's retreat and then the men will go on men's retreat, not always next to each other. That's, that's the, that's the coordination issue we have. Um, we have lots of kids and just life. Speaker 1 (05:06):So I think it's good that they're spread Speaker 2 (05:07):Out. Yeah. And it's okay. But we finally got one coming and we're really excited about it because, uh, we're all, I dunno, all the men are looking forward to getting together. And what do you guys gonna do? Enjoying each other's? Well, mostly eat food. . Speaker 1 (05:20):Okay. Speaker 2 (05:21):That's the majority of the planning we do is like, who's bringing what for food? ? Uh, no, I think we're gonna do some, I don't know. We, we tend to usually do some late nights where there's, there's prayer and encouragement and that sort of thing. Speaker 1 (05:32):Campfire type Speaker 2 (05:33):Campfires. Yeah. Uh, Jordan plays country music, . Um, we love it. Um, so yeah, we're gonna, I don't know, we have a lot of fun things playing. Cool. I'm excited. I'm just excited for it. So I'm jealous that's Speaker 1 (05:44):Coming. I mean, I'm excited too. . Speaker 2 (05:46):Yeah. Speaker 1 (05:47):Why not? I always get a little jealous that you're gonna go have fun and I'll be wishing I was having that kind of fun. Speaker 2 (05:54):Yeah. Well, mainly you'll be wishing I was just still in bed, bed with you at home. Speaker 1 (05:58):I am codependent in that way for sure. But Speaker 2 (06:01):I love that about you, . Uh, so yeah, we're gonna, this is a, it's a light and fun conversation where we're gonna go back and forth answering questions from each other. Uh, but really what we wanted to get out of this episode is to show there's a, there's a few reasons why these light and fun conversations, these candid conversations are so valuable. Um, first they can help you grow, get to know your spouse, grow closer together more intimately. Speaker 1 (06:30):So you're saying if they were to Yeah. Engage in candid conversations, not just listen to ours. , Speaker 2 (06:36):Maybe just listening to ours could do that. Okay. But yes, it do, doing this for yourself has lots of benefits. Um, two, it really is quality time with each other. If you just think about spending that time asking these questions, getting to hear the, an, the unique answers, even how the response comes that, that candid like, Huh. Like if it is, it, is it quick? Mm-hmm. , like it's been on their mind for a while. You're like, Wait a minute. Why are you even thinking about that so much? Mm-hmm. . Um, but it's, it's a, it's truly quality time. Three, it's Speaker 1 (07:05):A, And sorry to interrupt you. Yeah. Speaking of quality time, this even goes for couples who maybe the spouse travels for work or is gone for long periods of time. You can engage in this way via FaceTime or phone and still That is true. Get that quality Speaker 2 (07:19):Time. Yeah. Doesn't have to be in person. Yeah. Um, with technology is amazing these days. Yeah. Uh, another reason is it's just fun and lighthearted. Uh, how much do you just want more lightheartedness? Yeah. In our marriage, sometimes we, in the day to day in the grind in the, all the kids in the homeschool and all the things like you can just kind of, we not you, we, it can, there could just kind of be constant, maybe serious or just what's next on the agenda. Speaker 1 (07:49):You need that pressure relief valve. Speaker 2 (07:50):Yeah. Pressure relief valve . Um, Oh, like the thing you're afraid of on the I'm thought Speaker 1 (07:55):I'm terrified of it. . I still don't know how Speaker 2 (07:57):To use it. Yeah. Uh, slow release, always slow release . Um, and also just who doesn't want more of that in their marriage? Just more lightheartedness. Yeah. Uh, more joy. Um, and also it's just all around fun and creative. I think the, so those, of course, there's probably a bunch of other valuable, we'll see reasons . Yeah. So, um, that's what we wanna do today. And we hope that in the process of this, you enjoy getting to know us a little bit more. Speaker 1 (08:24):And when you say candid, what, what you're saying is, is like, we didn't practice these. We don't know. Speaker 2 (08:30):We actually didn't even write the answers down in the notes. We kind of, we didn't discuss the answers. We Speaker 1 (08:35):Didn't, We kind of went back and forth on the questions and you were writing them down. So you kind of have a framework for like, what the questions are. But Speaker 2 (08:41):We, I also added some in there that you don't know about. Oh, Speaker 1 (08:43):Great. See now I feel like there's more Speaker 2 (08:45):Pressure. So, Speaker 1 (08:46):Cause we're Speaker 2 (08:47):Recording this, this is candid. It really is. Uh, so if you wanna do this with your spouse, actually we wanna encourage you to do it. Uh, not as a challenge necessarily, but try and make some time to just sit down and be like, Hey, let's have a maybe on date night, maybe when the kids go to bed before bed. Um, and you don't have to use our questions. You could if you want, but just come up with some questions yourself and spend some time just Speaker 1 (09:09):Getting to know each other. Speaker 2 (09:10):Yeah. And, but having fun, just having a light conversation with your spouse. Um, and you never know what might come of it really. I think. So we're gonna just jump in and since I've been doing all the talking so far, , Jennifer can ask the first question. Speaker 1 (09:28):Okay. Who is someone in your life right now that you look up to? Speaker 2 (09:33):That's Speaker 1 (09:34):So, because I asked this question, you have to answer first Speaker 2 (09:36):. I didn't remember putting that first. Um, man, this is a, um, hard one. Speaker 1 (09:46):Really. Speaker 2 (09:47):No, you know what? I have a buddy. It came quickly. His name, I'm gonna say his name. . His name is Stan's Love. Speaker 1 (09:55):Aw. Speaker 2 (09:56):Yeah. We call Stan. Speaker 1 (09:57):Stan love Speaker 2 (09:58):. I, I look up to him in the way he loves his wife and his kids. Mm-hmm. . I really do. Speaker 1 (10:03):He's good. Speaker 2 (10:05):He, I just, I don't wanna say envy because it's something I am actually striving for and desire to be like. But he's got such a, a quiet and gentle demeanor with his, he's got three girls and a boy and he's just so gentle with them. Mm-hmm. and patient. And, and so I just, I I think I look up to him. Speaker 1 (10:26):That's cool. Yeah. I see qualities in him, like being very loyal. Um, being a romantic, like he takes his girls on dates, like his little girls on morning dates and bike rides. And Speaker 2 (10:36):That's Stan. Yeah. And also he listens to this podcast. So Hi Stan Speaker 1 (10:41):. Awesome. Well, somebody I look up to is my friend Nicki. And you mentioned Jordan, which they're married Jordan. Mm-hmm. plays guitar. And Nicki is a close friend of mine who I was just thinking about when she goes through hard things, like her faithfulness is just highlighted even more. And her steadfastness in trusting God. And I'm not saying she doesn't have hard days or that she doesn't even, you know, cry about it or, or you know, wrestle with hard thoughts. But the way that she presents herself Yeah. She's got is so strong Speaker 2 (11:15):Humility and a patience about her. Speaker 1 (11:19):Yeah. Yeah. And, and with her kids and the way that she parents. And so I just really value those qualities that I see in her. And it makes me wanna be like her when I grow up.  Speaker 2 (11:27):When we Speaker 1 (11:28):Grow up. Thank you Nikki. . Speaker 2 (11:30):Okay. I get next question cuz you did the first one. Of course. What's one article of clothing you could never part with? Speaker 1 (11:40):Mm. Speaker 2 (11:41):Hopefully it's one that doesn't get dirty. Cuz that would be nasty. Speaker 1 (11:44):Like, just wear the dirty thing all the time. . Um, the first thing that came to my mind is like an oversized sweater that's like my go-to when I just wanna feel comfy during the day. But then I also would probably just wanna keep like a piece of clothing from you cuz I get sentimental like that. Like I I love to walk around in your flannel. Speaker 2 (12:02):Can I, can I, can I say something? What you also don't part with any of my shirts. . You have a bucket. a literally a bucket. I forgot about that tub full of my old shirts from like when I was 18. Yeah. 18 years old. Speaker 1 (12:16):But that's because Okay. Aaron used to, and one day Aaron used to shop at like thrift stores and his clothing was very unique and so that was emo. Yeah. And so I saved them so that when our kids got to be in their teens, they would have fun kind of sifting through that stuff. And I think you'll have fun doing it. Speaker 2 (12:34):You said you were keeping it because you're gonna make a quilt. Speaker 1 (12:36):Those are some other pieces of clothing Speaker 2 (12:38):That I get . Oh, Speaker 1 (12:39):I wanna make this family quilt. This is actually a really cool idea. It's just one of those things that it's like when I get time to do it, but I saved, when Speaker 2 (12:47):We retire, all of our kids are grown up and have their own families and Speaker 1 (12:51): over time. I've saved pieces of clothing from everyone, like all the kids and everything. And I do wanna make a family style quilt where there it's like patchwork, but I don't even know how to do that. . Every time we move Aaron's like, so can we toss this? And Speaker 2 (13:04):This is is trash. No, that is valuable. Speaker 1 (13:07):I had to relabel it. Just so you, so Speaker 2 (13:09):Two. So truly the answer is all articles of clothing. Yeah. Speaker 1 (13:12):Everything. Yeah. You Speaker 2 (13:13):Don't get rid of, um, the, the, I think I, so I have a belt I really like mm-hmm. , I've had it for many years. Apparently has a 99 year warranty. That's that's a long time. Yeah. So I don't know why it's not a hundred Speaker 1 (13:25):Year. So you can't, so you can't part Speaker 2 (13:26):With it. I can't par with it. Um, but I really like that leather belt. It's stylish Speaker 1 (13:32):And it holds things up. Speaker 2 (13:34):It holds lots of things up my pants, other things. Uh, so that's, yeah, mine would be a belt. Okay. Speaker 1 (13:42):All right. We have five children currently and um, I believe this is the longest time. Well I am saying this, but you wrote it sounds funny. Of course, of course. I know this this has been the longest time we've gone without being pregnant again, But Speaker 2 (13:59):Do you believe it? Speaker 1 (14:00):Yes. . I believe Speaker 2 (14:01):That. Okay, good. Speaker 1 (14:02):So Ed's two and a half. And so if we even got pregnant right now, like the gap would be our, our Speaker 2 (14:08):Largest gap. This be the largest gap Speaker 1 (14:09):Age-wise. Uh, but people ask us randomly, Well, are you gonna have another? And so Aaron, what are your thoughts on Speaker 2 (14:16):That? They have been asking us that lately. When are you gonna have another baby? Not Speaker 1 (14:19):Lately. Just always . Speaker 2 (14:20):I'll always the question it's, Yeah, it's mostly like a surprise. Like, you're not pregnant yet. Speaker 1 (14:24):Do you ever get bothered when people ask you? Speaker 2 (14:26):Um, no. Speaker 1 (14:27):Me neith. Speaker 2 (14:28):Um, there's certain ways people ask that I might get bothered, but What do you mean? Like, I don't know, like in a derogatory or negative sense. Like are are you gonna have another one? Like, that bothers me. Um, whether we have one, another one or not. Who Speaker 1 (14:43):Would ask you a question like that? Speaker 2 (14:44):Not, not friends of ours, but other people that when they see we have five kids, , they're like, Are you gonna have anymore more? I Speaker 1 (14:51):Don't, I don't think anyone's ever asked me Speaker 2 (14:52):Like that. People have asked me that way. That's sad. So yes, I would be bothered in that sense. Okay. But, um, I don't get bothered when our friends ask us if we're gonna have another, cause I think they genuinely want us to have another baby. Speaker 1 (15:02):What happens if I ask you if you want another? Speaker 2 (15:06):Have you asked me that? Speaker 1 (15:09):Um, yes, actually I have. Yeah, you have. You said you're not ready. Speaker 2 (15:13):I, I didn't say not ready. This is my answer I've been giving people, So if you're gonna ask my thoughts on this, my answer has been I'm currently enjoying where we're at. Speaker 1 (15:24):. Same. So I, that's how I'd answer that. I I'm content where we're at. Speaker 2 (15:28):I don't, I I tend to not be, I'm not able to think in terms of being done or not. Yeah. Because we could be done. I don't know. Like that's, Speaker 1 (15:38):I I've been Speaker 2 (15:38):Savoring it, it's a biological thing in some sense. Speaker 1 (15:40):, I've been savoring my time with Edia as if she was my last just in case. But I'm also, I feel openhanded and openhearted too if we did have Speaker 2 (15:48):More. Right. So I, I'm not, I don't have any negative thought of having any more children, but I am really enjoying that all of our kids are outta diapers. Yeah. That's pretty awesome. Speaker 1 (15:57):Yeah. That's been cool. Speaker 2 (15:59):So that's my thought. I think that's my thoughts on that. Okay. Speaker 1 (16:02):We can move on. Speaker 2 (16:03):Yeah, I just a little add on question. It's not even on this list. Candid Speaker 1 (16:08):. Okay. Speaker 2 (16:09):If we did get pregnant, would you be more excited for a girl or for a boy? Speaker 1 (16:16):I think that either one would be great. Another girl would even out the three boys, three girls Speaker 2 (16:23):And we'd need a bigger bedroom already for them. Speaker 1 (16:25):. I ha I I think I would really enjoy having a boy. I have good pregnancies with boys. That is great. Better ones. So I dunno. Speaker 2 (16:34):I think another girl would be awesome to that whole even out thing. Speaker 1 (16:39):We'll see. Speaker 2 (16:41):Hmm. Everyone like that's Speaker 1 (16:43):Listening is like, No, I'm not pregnant. Speaker 2 (16:45):, everyone's, they're waiting or they're praying like, wait a minute, are they okay, here's a question. What's your happiest memory from childhood? Speaker 1 (16:55):Ooh. Gotta take me way back. If you have one on hand that you can share. And I will think through that. Um, I, Speaker 2 (17:07):My happiest memory, Speaker 1 (17:10):I mean I feel like it probably has to do with an amusement park , just because I grew up, I lived in Southern California and my parents would take us to those. So I feel like that was like a fun Thats very farm. Yeah. Knottsberry farm, Disneyland, that those were fun things. But if you mean like a sentimental, like I remember this one time I was with my mom, I was probably like six, maybe seven. And she sat me down in the front yard and I remember it was sunny and warm and she had the bible open and she was talking about, she was talking to me about praying or something like that. And it felt very like warm and cozy and it was a very vivid memory even still. And I really appreciated that. That's cool time. Speaker 2 (17:51):That's the happiest memory. Yeah. Uh, the first, uh, one that came to my mind, I don't know if it's even like a memory, but I mean I guess it is memory, but it was getting this, this toy Uzi and I remember it was the most awesome toy gun I ever had. And I remember it so vividly because I also, it disappeared one day and I was so sad about that. Oh, sad. So it's also ha a sad memory, but it was the happiest memory. But I just, I tend to wonder if my mom just got rid of that thing or something. . But it was awesome. And back then I don't even think they did the orange tips on the guns. It was just, they were even more cool back then. But I get why they do that now. So that's my happiest memory. Probably have other ones that I can't think of currently, but, Okay. What is one dish, not satellite dish food dish that reminds you of home? Speaker 1 (18:45):I don't think anybody was thinking satellite dish. Speaker 2 (18:47):I'm just making sure. Speaker 1 (18:49):Okay. Um, like home, like childhood, I'm assuming like home, you Speaker 2 (18:54):Name it. I don't know you home when you, you're eating like, oh this is like, this is home for me. this Speaker 1 (19:00):Food. I don't eat it anymore because I'm not the one that made it. My mom made it. Speaker 2 (19:05):Wait, I know what it is. What can I just guess it? Yeah. Is it cream peas over toast? So, Speaker 1 (19:10):Or wait, is that what it's called? Yeah. Well yeah, but I didn't need that because peas Oh yeah, creamed eggs. My mom would make cream creamed peas over toast and it's literally like a cream gravy with peas in it over toast with butter sounds and everybody ate it, but I just couldn't do it. And so my mom would make me a separate pot of creamed eggs over toast and it was so good. I think my brother knows how to make it and he does a really great job. Or maybe it's my sister-in-law. I have never attempted to make it, but when I think of that meal, like I think of home Speaker 2 (19:41):Is so good. I couldn't get down with that, but Speaker 1 (19:43):So creamed eggs is the hard boiled. It's hard boiled egg mixed with this gravy stuff and it's like peppery. Okay. Speaker 2 (19:49):I think I've had it before. It's pretty good. Yeah. But I, I can see why you would see that as a homey thing. Okay. My, I I only have one thing. Do you know what it is? Speaker 1 (20:00):Um, chicken nuggets. . Speaker 2 (20:03):No chicken nuggets. I do love chicken nuggets. . No, you do. What does it make me think of? Ho What's my favorite dish that my mom used to make? Speaker 1 (20:12):Oh, um, Sopa. Well, well what Speaker 2 (20:14):She called. So she's called sopa. I don't think it was actually sopa. Speaker 1 (20:16):It was like, um, Speaker 2 (20:17):Kind of like, it was like mac and cheese. Yeah, it was these little round noodles and cheese and like tomato sauce, cilantro and yeah, it Oh, with tons of cheese on it. Speaker 1 (20:29):I've made that for you a couple of times Speaker 2 (20:31):And I love it. Yeah, it's, yeah. I should have my mom make that . Yeah. For me. Cuz I actually want some right now. That is my Speaker 1 (20:40):Dish. Okay. How would you describe me in three words? I think we did this on the podcast when we did that round, lightning round of questions. Speaker 2 (20:48):Did Speaker 1 (20:48):We? Or did we skip over it? Speaker 2 (20:50):I don't know. Well, I'm gonna try and pick really good ones. . Speaker 1 (20:55):I Speaker 2 (20:56):Need thoughtful number one, you're very thoughtful as in you think about everything. Speaker 1 (21:02):Everything. always . I know this, I'm an overthinker, Speaker 2 (21:06):But with good intentions. Okay. Yeah. Um, You're thoughtful. You are. Um hmm. Passionate. Speaker 1 (21:15):You think I'm Speaker 2 (21:15):Passionate. I do. Cuz I think you, because the, i how do I say this? The things that you so desperately want to be good at you, you chase it and you work at it. And you, it's also the thing that like, you, you cry about. Like, you, you, they make you sad. Like, I, I wanna be better in this area or I wanna be, you know, I wanna homeschool my kids. Well I wanna, I wanna learn guitar . I need to go guitar. Uh, you're passionate. And so that's only two. Oh, I need a third. Really good one. I think you're beautiful. Speaker 1 (21:50):. You're making me blush. Speaker 2 (21:52):. That's not one of the words. Beautiful. Thank you. Not blush. Now I do. I think you're beautiful inside and out. I think your heart for people, your heart for your family, your heart for me and your heart for God is beautiful. Speaker 1 (22:04):Thank you. My three words for you would be, well also passionate. But why I was thinking you can't still I know, but I was thinking in different terms of like when you're in a conversation or when you're talking about something that you know well and have an opinion on or you know, just, um, hobbies or things that you like to do. You get so passionate and involved and every ounce of your being is like love Speaker 2 (22:31):Stewart. It sounds like I'm arguing . Yeah. I promise I'm not arguing. Speaker 1 (22:35):. Um, another word is confident. I see you as confident in your ability, in your giftings, in your friendships, in your, in our marriage, in finances, in a lot Speaker 2 (22:49):Of things. Well, it's because I live by a motto. Fake until you make it . Okay. So no one actually no one actually knows. Okay. Speaker 1 (22:55):Yeah. I don't know then. Okay. Uh, and then the last one would be, um, Speaker 2 (23:03):You can't say beautiful. Speaker 1 (23:04):I was gonna say interesting. . You're very interesting. Uh, I don't know. I don't know. I don't have a Speaker 2 (23:13):Very unique's better than interesting. Sorry. You're very unique. Speaker 1 (23:16):You're unique and Speaker 2 (23:17):Interesting or, or invaluable or priceless. Speaker 1 (23:20):. Um, I, I'll say this, You're loyal to me. And what I mean by that is like, you are are faithful to me. But then beyond that, it's like you, you wanna please me? You wanna help me do things like around our house or, or write a book or, uh, just anything in life that we team up together on. Mm-hmm. . I feel like a lot of it's just supporting me. Speaker 2 (23:44):. Like what's one of the things I'm doing around the house right now? Speaker 1 (23:47):? Well you're, you're building a chicken coop for the chickens that you didn't want. I know. , which I appreciate having. And we're, we started getting, Speaker 2 (23:55):Well, most people hear chicken coop. Do you think like, um, like a four foot by two foot box with like a cage? Or do you think 40 foot by 10 foot? Massive. Speaker 1 (24:08):Well, you're kind of telling on yourself because you wanted, I didn't give you dimensions. You built that thing as big as it is, but it's gonna make the backyard look really nice. It is gonna look awesome. The chickens are gonna be Speaker 2 (24:17):Happy when I finish it one day. One day. . And it will Was that, I will finish it someday. . Speaker 1 (24:24):It's gotta happen before snow. Yeah. . Oh yeah. All right, you why'd you next Speaker 2 (24:29):One. Okay. Is there anything about our relationship Good deep prayer that feels totally unique to us? Speaker 1 (24:39):Hmm. Speaker 2 (24:39):I, this is actually kind of difficult because I can say there's certain things I can say. I'm like, but I know this couple that does that and I know this couple that does Speaker 1 (24:45):That. Oh, Speaker 2 (24:46):I see what you're saying. Like, totally unique to us. Speaker 1 (24:49):I think like Speaker 2 (24:50):You could say author, we know a lot of authors . It's not unique to us. Speaker 1 (24:55):Yeah. But we're unique. I think what makes us unique is that we've dipped into, um, like traditional publishing, self-publishing, podcasting. We did videos for a while, blogging, like we've touched all, Speaker 2 (25:10):Tried a self-publishing e-course, tried , other things. Building vans. Well, Speaker 1 (25:15):I think we're really good at taking a dream and putting it into action Speaker 2 (25:19):And seeing if it sticks to the wall Speaker 1 (25:21):Yeah. And we're okay when it doesn't . Speaker 2 (25:26):Yeah. I'd say that's probably a, like if you just like, were to take tear down those like onion layers, like that, uh, flexibility. Speaker 1 (25:34):Like we're willing to say yes Speaker 2 (25:36):To a lot of things.  Speaker 1 (25:38):Extraordinary Speaker 2 (25:39):Things we said. Yeah. We said yes to a lot of things and not all those things like worked out and we were okay with that. So that flexibility, that ability to Yeah, that's a good one. Unique to us. I was thinking, gosh, I think our, what makes us unique or something that's unique to us, which I guess would be the same thing. Speaker 1 (26:00):Just answer the questionnaire. I Speaker 2 (26:01):Think our, I think our outlook on life and my, my what I mean by that is I feel like most people, many people and I, and if you're not this way, don't think I'm generalizing you into this category, but Speaker 1 (26:17):You're just trying to find Yeah. A unique of Speaker 2 (26:20):Us. Most people have this like, career idea or end result or they have this, this specific goal in mind for their life. But I feel like we've looked at our life more of a, Speaker 1 (26:36):We're gonna throw a clump here, we're gonna throw a clump here and like Yeah. Well, what's, wait for the picture to come up. Speaker 2 (26:40):Yeah. But, but not for the sake of the end result, but for the sake of the journey itself. Mm. And I feel like we've always been that way. Yeah. That yes, there's been like, we're looking forward to this thing or we're looking for that thing. But like, I don't, when I try and think about our future, I think like, well, what do we have now? And, and are we enjoying what we have now? And, and we, we do, we try, we tend to try and enjoy and live currently. Yeah. I don't know, maybe that's not even unique to us, but that's Speaker 1 (27:08):Good. Speaker 2 (27:08):I like it. It feels like it is to us. Did you ask that question by the Speaker 1 (27:12):Way? I don't remember. Speaker 2 (27:13):I think, I think I did. When of your ex and ex x The next one. It, Speaker 1 (27:18):When we are apart, what do you miss most about me? Speaker 2 (27:24):Hmm. Are we doing PG Speaker 1 (27:27):Aaron? Stop Speaker 2 (27:29):. I, to be honest, I I just like being around you. Mm-hmm. . And usually I'm like, Oh, if I'm gonna go do this a trip, um, sometimes I have to drive to Portland and I think, Oh, that's gonna be nice time alone. And very quickly into the trip. I just wish you were with me. Mm-hmm. and like this men's retreat last time I remember all of us were like, day one, we're like, Yeah, this is great. It feels so good. It's, And then like the next day everyone's like calling their wives and their kids. That's Speaker 1 (27:58):Cuz we're so Speaker 2 (27:59):Fun and all and the whole time I'm thinking like, this would be so much fun with our wives. . Yeah. Doing like a couples retreat. I think just having you with me when I, whatever I'm doing, I, It's usually better with Speaker 1 (28:09):You. Yeah. And because I know this about you and how you feel towards me, every time you leave the house, whether it's just to the store or to the bathroom, you wanna go with me? I call you and I'm like, Where are you? What are you doing? What's true? Speaker 2 (28:21):You do do Speaker 1 (28:22):That. You, you've been joking lately. Speaker 2 (28:24):Like you could be in the other room and you call me. I'm like, What? Why are you calling me? I'm literally in the other Speaker 1 (28:28):Room. . I know. I just, you always ask Speaker 2 (28:31):Me like, Yeah, where are you at? Speaker 1 (28:32):I can't go five minutes without you. It's true. And I, I am codependent in that way of like, not only do I like you and I like your company, but I actually need your help. Like, I need you to just hang something up for me or build a chicken coop, Speaker 2 (28:45):. And I always think, what does she do when I'm gone? , Who does she call to help her if she needs me Speaker 1 (28:50):This way? No, I call you. Speaker 2 (28:51):Yeah. Can you please come home? I'm in Portland, . No, that's true. So what do you miss most about me? Is it just also me? Speaker 1 (29:00):No, I just, I miss your presence. Yeah. And don't like being alone. Yeah. Having kids of help. Speaker 2 (29:05):It helps you fall asleep too when I'm home. Yeah. Like you don't, you have a hard, You know what's funny is I actually have a hard time falling asleep when I'm alone. Really? Oh yeah. It's weird. Hmm. It's like I, I'm like, Oh, I, I can be on my computer and, and then I'm like, hours go by. I'm like, why am I not gonna to bed? like, Yeah. It's hard to go to sleep without you. Speaker 1 (29:23):I didn't know that. It's 15 years of marriage. I didn't know Speaker 2 (29:26):That. It's hard to go to sleep without you. Did you? I know. I actually can't remember what it was like before we were married. Yeah. Sleeping alone. Isn't that weird? Speaker 1 (29:36):Hmm, hmm Speaker 2 (29:38):Hmm. Yeah. We'll we're almost, we're almost married longer than we were alive. Single. Speaker 1 (29:45):Oh, . I don't know why I said this. Speaker 2 (29:46):It's not true. No. Alive, right? Like if we're, Speaker 1 (29:50):Well like we got married Speaker 2 (29:51):15 years, Speaker 1 (29:52):We got married so young Speaker 2 (29:53):And I'm 38. Like we're only a few years away from like cresting that like being married longer than we were a single . That's exciting. Okay. If you could relive one year of your life, just one, which year would it be? Speaker 1 (30:08):Oh, that's a good question. Speaker 2 (30:10):I know some of these You didn't see me put on this. I was Speaker 1 (30:12):Sneaking there. See if you could relive one year of your life. Well it depends on why you would wanna relive it. Cuz I could say this last year so that I can relive it with a better perspective and Speaker 2 (30:22):Attitude. do everything different, Speaker 1 (30:23):Do everything better. Um, or if it's just one that you just really enjoyed and you wanna do again Uh hmm. I would probably say, or like, could I change things in that year? You know what I mean? Like what are the boundaries here? Speaker 2 (30:43):Well if you could relive it, that means you're living it again with Yeah. New understanding. Speaker 1 (30:49):Okay. Um, Speaker 2 (30:52):Can we do it together? Speaker 1 (30:53):What Speaker 2 (30:54):Do you mean? Well, would you relive our first year of marriage? Speaker 1 (30:57):I was gonna say second because first was Well that, that yeah, that would be fine. First year of Speaker 2 (31:03):Marriage. First year or second year. I would be, I would do that. Speaker 1 (31:05):Yeah. First or second year of Speaker 2 (31:06):Marriage with renewed with the perspectives. Yes. We have now. Yes. And all the stock picks we have now and all. I'm just kidding. Yes. No, but all the, yeah, all the, the ways we know. Cuz I, I look back on those times and I, I grieve them cuz we didn't know things. Yeah. We were like naive and, Speaker 1 (31:23):And yet it was an Speaker 2 (31:24):Adventure. Selfish. And, but when we look back we're like, that could have been probably better. Way better. Speaker 1 (31:29):But it was fun. It was, it was good. Okay. Is it my turn? Nailed it. Okay. How could we make our marriage more exciting? Speaker 2 (31:37):Go back to year one. Right. And Speaker 1 (31:40):Today, Aaron Oh, before you leave for men's retreat Speaker 2 (31:44):, I, I want you to answer this first cuz I actually don't know Speaker 1 (31:47):I'm thinking about about it. How could we make, I know for me personally, , I think that our marriage would be more exciting if you can tap into that romantic side of yourself and be more advantageous in your, um, in your Speaker 2 (32:06):This was how can we Speaker 1 (32:08):? Sorry. How Speaker 2 (32:09):Can we, Speaker 1 (32:11):I don't even know how to say what I'm saying. Like I want Okay. That surprise element of like me pulling out the, the snow globe. You Speaker 2 (32:17):Want, you want me to surprise you with Speaker 1 (32:20):Things and Speaker 2 (32:22):Surprise experience, Speaker 1 (32:24):Surprise attacks. Sure. If that's how it helped you have Speaker 2 (32:26):Jujitsu moves. Speaker 1 (32:27):Sure. No Speaker 2 (32:28):Chuck holds and no. Oh, that's what you did to me today. I know. Or yesterday. Speaker 1 (32:32):Okay. And I won. Speaker 2 (32:34):So more exciting. So you're you, we Speaker 1 (32:37):I wanna be caught off guard in a good, good way. Speaker 2 (32:39):Oh, you want like a, like a surprise Heart. Speaker 1 (32:45):Heart Speaker 2 (32:45):Attack attack. . Speaker 1 (32:47):Yes. Speaker 2 (32:48):That would be more exciting for you. Speaker 1 (32:51):Uh, I think it would, it would help us to have more fun too. I don't know. Speaker 2 (32:55):Like this? Speaker 1 (32:55):Yeah. What do you think? Speaker 2 (32:58):Um, more exciting. Mm. Speaker 1 (33:03):I mean we could take more vacations but that costs money. Speaker 2 (33:06):? No. Yeah. I'm thinking uh, more random outings that are not common to us. Like we Speaker 1 (33:15):Tried, Speaker 2 (33:16):Like experiences. So do you remember when we went on that date and we went fishing and didn't catch anything but we just tried to, we found a fishing hole and Yeah. Like thing, things like that that we didn't grow up doing necessarily, but we could. And maybe you did. I didn't really grow up fishing, but yeah. Uh, let's do it. Going. Finding interesting hikes. Trying to find a, a lake that we've never been to before. Uh, but being, doing stuff. Speaker 1 (33:39):We talked about having more like active date nights, but our dates have been kind of wonky lately. . Yeah. Again, we always go in and out of seasons of like really good date days and then Speaker 2 (33:51):Very, But again, we're okay with it because we're, Yeah. Flexible. Flexible . Speaker 1 (33:56):Okay. What's something you'd like us to prioritize? Speaker 2 (34:01):Prioritize Speaker 1 (34:02):In marriage or family or anything in life? Speaker 2 (34:05):Yeah. Um, I'd like to see us prioritize more Bible reading and book reading. Speaker 1 (34:14):Just overall everybody. Speaker 2 (34:16):Yeah. And like, but downplay some of the extracurricular things, social media movies. Which again, we don't do tons of that, but I think we could lessen one and increase the other. Speaker 1 (34:30):Okay. What's something I would like to prioritize? Um, well I think it goes back to us moving into this house and settling in. And I know we've done a lot of like projects and trying to get things done, but there's some spots inside the house that frustrate me. It's mostly me. Like the, it's living closet. It's not your fault, it's my fault. I need to like, there's stacks of paper and books and I Speaker 2 (34:55):Know you do not wanna see our table that we're at right now. Speaker 1 (34:57):It's like, it's frustrating to look at but at the same time it's like, I don't have time for you today . I Speaker 2 (35:02):Actually thought about this so I changed my answer to Yeah. To agree. I think we should prioritize. Speaker 1 (35:07):I wanna finish moving Speaker 2 (35:08):In the house better. Speaker 1 (35:08):Yeah. Yeah. And I keep telling myself, well when winter gets here and we can't do any work outside, then I'll be forced to face Speaker 2 (35:14):It. Which there's nothing wrong with that cuz I think that's a very good plan cuz we have other outside things that we need to get done. Cool. Speaker 1 (35:19):Sounds like we're on the same page. Let's do it. Speaker 2 (35:23):What's your most irrational fear? Speaker 1 (35:27):I have a lot of 'em. . There's one that kind of haunts Speaker 2 (35:32):Me in frogs and boots. Speaker 1 (35:33):Just thought Jennifer. I um, there's one that often happens when, like out of my peripheral vision, if there's like an odd shape or shadow or something, I think something is just there or someone and I turn around really fast and it's like a laundry basket or a towel hanging up. I'm like, why am I so easy to get Speaker 2 (35:55):Myself? I think a lot of us, I tend to feel that way if it's dark and I, I stop, I'll, I'll sometimes we'll stop for an extra long period of time to see if that Speaker 1 (36:04):Shadow Speaker 2 (36:04):Moves, moves and then I keep going like, it's nothing. I thought that I knew that it's not moving. So I don't think that's too irrational. Okay. I do think you have a slightly irrational fear of spiders. Speaker 1 (36:16):I hate spiders. Speaker 2 (36:17):I everyone hates spiders. But when it's like the teenies spider and you all, you have to do a step on it and you scream and I hold, I have to come kill it for you. Speaker 1 (36:26):And Okay. I mentioned my friend Nikki. We, we were working out in the garage the other day and I look over and this thing is massive big black in the corner spider. And I was like, Nikki, I I need you to go over there and I should take care of that for me cuz Aaron's still asleep and, and uh, and she was so brave. She just walked around over was Speaker 2 (36:46):It really big and massive. Speaker 1 (36:47):Like I would've grabbed like a broom or something long to like kill it. But she just grabbed like a piece of paper towel and just smooshed it. I heard it crack under her. Speaker 2 (36:54):How big was it? It was huge. Speaker 1 (36:56):Like bigger than a petty? No. Quarter Speaker 2 (36:58):Bigger. Okay. The body or the whole thing? Yeah, The Speaker 1 (37:01):Body was, well I don't know, Speaker 2 (37:03):. Speaker 1 (37:04):I Speaker 2 (37:04):Dunno. That's what irrational fears do. . Speaker 1 (37:07):Just kidding. It Speaker 2 (37:08):Could have bit me. I have a ex, I don't know if this is irrational by the way, but I will not use public toilets. to go number two. . That's a serious one. Speaker 1 (37:22):. I mean Speaker 2 (37:25):I only break that rule under extreme duress. Like Speaker 1 (37:28):What's the fear? Speaker 2 (37:28):I have no idea. Speaker 1 (37:30):But people like, you don't want someone Speaker 2 (37:31):To hear you. I don't want someone hear me. You Speaker 1 (37:33):Know. Everybody poops there. Speaker 2 (37:35):How dare you. How dare you. Okay, before I get the sweats, we should move on . Gosh. Speaker 1 (37:43):Not that you're gonna say something else. Speaker 2 (37:45):. We should move on to Speaker 1 (37:47):Another question. I think I asked that one. Which one? Man, I keep getting lost. I don't know. Where are we at? Let me just ask it. What one household chore do you wish you never had to do again? Speaker 2 (37:57):Why do you think you've asked this question before? Speaker 1 (37:59):No, I, I thought I asked. No, I thought I asked the last question. Oh. But I guess it doesn't matter. It Speaker 2 (38:04):Doesn't matter. Speaker 1 (38:05):All of the above d all of the above.  Speaker 2 (38:08):Household chores, Check , the household chore. Um, Speaker 1 (38:12):I can tell you the chores that I don't do that I wish I did but can't cause don't I don't prioritize them Speaker 2 (38:18):Because you're rational fear of taking the trash out. or . Speaker 1 (38:26):Okay, moving on. Uh, no I don't, I don't ever get to the baseboards. Speaker 2 (38:31):The baseboards? Speaker 1 (38:32):Yeah. But it bothers me cuz I walk by them and I see them them and I think to myself, Oh I should, I should attack you . And then I don't Speaker 2 (38:39):Uh, What's a household chore? Uh, I'm trying to like, I don't know if there's any, Speaker 1 (38:47):I'll say this. Can I say math? If toilets could self clean themselves, I would never clean a toilet again. Speaker 2 (38:53):That I actually appreciate that you clean the toilets. Speaker 1 (38:56):. Yeah. I think the hardest one is the toilet of the kids' bathroom. Cuz you know, you know Speaker 2 (39:01):It's Speaker 1 (39:02):A it's a big job. Kids' toilet Speaker 2 (39:04):. Yep. I'm, I'm just gonna say I, I can't think of one actually. Speaker 1 (39:11):I think you need to do more chores then. Well Speaker 2 (39:13):Maybe that's true Jennifer. Okay, we'll move on. Which family traditions from your childhood would you like us to continue? Speaker 1 (39:24):Uh, I really enjoy Christmas Eve services. It's something that my parents always highlighted for us that we would go to dinner with family and then go to like a candlelight service at church. And it would if to me it always felt rich and everyone dressed up and there was dark and moody colors and the candles and the music and there was always like a violinist or something special. Mm-hmm. . And we did that last year with the kids. We went, I feel like we've done it Speaker 2 (39:49):Maybe not every year, but we've done it quite a few times. I Speaker 1 (39:51):Love it Speaker 2 (39:52):Since having Speaker 1 (39:52):Kids. And I really like Christmas probably cuz it's a week for my birthday, but mm-hmm. . I like that whole time in season. Speaker 2 (40:00):Uh, that's funny because Christmas was what I thought too, but it says traditions. But Christmas, all I can think of. , uh, we opened stockings on like in the Christmas morning. Yeah. That was always the first thing we opened. It was like stockings and then we had to wait for breakfast and then we did presents way, way. It always felt like it was like the afternoon by the time we opened presents, but it wasn't, it was like Speaker 1 (40:21):10. What was some of your favorite things in the, Speaker 2 (40:23):In the space stockings? We would be, without a doubt always get this life savers multi-pack. Speaker 1 (40:29):Oh my gram used to gimme Speaker 2 (40:30):Those and it would come with like the um, the mixed flavor and then it would come with the butter scotch that Speaker 1 (40:37):Was favorite Speaker 2 (40:37):Like mint ones. And it would come with the, and I don't know why I liked those one. It was just candy. We didn't get that much candy. I Speaker 1 (40:42):Think it was the nineties thing. Speaker 2 (40:44):It was a nineties thing. Yeah. Nineties kids. Everyone that's born in the nineties are like Yeah. Speaker 1 (40:47):Yeah. We all are creating life saves Speaker 2 (40:49):Multi pack. Uh, and then there would always be like some, I, I actually tended to felt, I felt like some of the best gifts I got were also in the stocking. It was like a little pcca knife or a little laser pen or it was a little and those things I thought were awesome for some reason I Speaker 1 (41:06):Feel like I got silly putty every year. Like Speaker 2 (41:08):I did also get silly putty, but I love silly put so Speaker 1 (41:11):Yeah. Who doesn't love silly? Speaker 2 (41:12):It was like the target, like nails this now this is, they're one their dollar section. This is all the stocking stuffers that we used to get was kids. It's like turned into like adulthood normal normalcy cuz we all grew up with it. Okay. What makes you laugh? Speaker 1 (41:28):You babe? No, on a serious note. Um, Insta story Speaker 2 (41:33):Reel. Serious note. What makes me laugh? It is true. Memes. We, this is actually one of the past times that Jennifer and I indulge in every once in a while is we'll sit and I just, I look over her shoulder. She, Speaker 1 (41:43):I'm slapping at myself, Goes Speaker 2 (41:44):Through Instagram reels. Um, esp. Okay. I was just thinking about this when we're talking about trash, taking out the trash when we come across those marriage ones, they're so accurate. Yeah, they're so, so funny. I'm like, wait a minute. So is this like, just the majority of marriages deal with this exact thing? Like, oh it's so funny. Speaker 1 (42:04):I'll also say that I like, again going back to this whole like surprise attack thing, like being uh, randomly tickled or like physical touch stuff makes me laugh. Um, and then being with friends and I have some really silly girlfriends and we like to do pranks. We like to try and do challenges like, um, what's it called when you do TikTok? Challenges? I don't know. I know it's silly. Oh. Speaker 2 (42:28):Cause Speaker 1 (42:29):We're in our thirties, but talk challenges. Yeah. But the kind where it's like partner partner. Like you're supposed be be doing something right and taking front on that random, but it'll be late at night. Speaker 2 (42:38):The tortilla Speaker 1 (42:39):Slap. Oh the tortilla slap was so funny. So I like that we have friends that are willing to engage in silliness and that makes me laugh. Thank you friends. Speaker 2 (42:47):Ditto. . I do think that's funny. All of that. Do Speaker 1 (42:51):I ever make you laugh? Yes. I'm kind of funny. Speaker 2 (42:54):I'm always laughing at you. Speaker 1 (42:56):So Aaron, if you guys wanna know something about Aaron, cuz I'm a, I'm a jokester and I like to tell jokes, but I'm, uh, insecure. So I say I'm under my breath to where only he hears them. But when he thinks they're funny, he repeats them louder as if they were his genius. And then everybody laughs and I just look at him like, Right. Fine. Speaker 2 (43:15):Needless to say, everyone thinks I'm hilarious. . So. Speaker 1 (43:18):All right, next one. What was your reaction when you found out we were going to be parents for the first time? Do you remember that? Speaker 2 (43:26):I do. I'm I You don't mean my memory. Okay. Speaker 1 (43:31):I'll say I, I feel like it bad with my, I feel like it was mixed emotions of this like expectation. Like we felt like it was going to happen sometime soon and so we weren't like super surprised by it. But then there was this just cherishing of the moment of this is the last of just us. Like we know that this person's gonna come and change our world. And we were excited. We were really excited Speaker 2 (43:58):And hopeful. Yeah. I think heart palpitations, is that the word? ? Like, uh, just like a level of weight. Cuz becoming a dad for the first time, there's that, Oh my goodness, I'm not allowed to be selfish anymore. . Or like Yeah, like this. I felt like there was a weight, not a, not a bad one, but like a heavy like, oh this is, this is real and I can't stop it. Like, what's happening? This is crazy. But on the outside you would've known that because that word confidence used . Take it till you make it. It. Okay. I was letting everyone know that. Like, this is normal. This is great. People have babies. We're having a baby . Yeah. I was excited and scared outta my mind. Okay. You've been, uh, oh wait. No, I'm, I'm gonna go, uh, you do this question cuz I have to go to, I have to do the next Speaker 1 (44:50):Question. Okay. What are some little things I do for you that you appreciate? Well that's really good. Go ahead and take your time. And there's, you don't have to say just one thing. You could just list them. Just keep them Speaker 2 (44:59):Going. Yeah. Um, Jennifer, all the things that I love about you. Speaker 1 (45:03):No. All the things that you appreciate that I do for you. Speaker 2 (45:05):You do a lot. I one of them toilets, we just talked about it. You clean toilets and I actually really appreciate that. You're welcome. Um, you're also a, a laundry champ. Yeah. And I don't wanna say all these just household things, but they actually are huge deals because we have a lot of kids. Yeah. And they're big deals and I don't wanna make it sound like a small thing. It's a feat. And I just, I really appreciate it that I always have underwear. . Cool. That's a pretty awesome thing. Um, but you also, you can tell when I need rest mm-hmm. . And so you'll let me sleep in sometimes and you'll just, you'll take the kids out and I appreciate that. Um, and I love that you, you know, that I have a need for relationships and, and quality time with friends and, and so you'll, Speaker 1 (45:52):So even though I was born an introvert and, and born Speaker 2 (45:54):Out, you'd rather be by codependent Speaker 1 (45:56):Just ourselves Speaker 2 (45:57):Lover. Speaker 1 (45:58):I let people in. Speaker 2 (45:59):Yeah. You, Well, not just let people in, but you also, like, you'll, you'll make time and you'll, you'll say, Hey Aaron, go, Speaker 1 (46:04):Go hang out with your friends. Yeah. Yeah. Go to that men's retreat. Speaker 2 (46:07):So the, those are a few things. There's a lot more. But that I just, I really appreciate those things about you that you, you see those things and you care about 'em. Mm-hmm. . So cool. You have to answer that for me though. Speaker 1 (46:16):Oh, oh yeah. . Mm-hmm. . Well, uh, I appreciate that on a whim when I, not every time but the mo majority of the time if I'm like, Hey, I know you're already doing this thing over here, but will you just come hang this picture for me really quick or come use this power tool that I can't figure out and you're very quick to help me. And I, I appreciate that because usually I don't know what I'm doing. Speaker 2 (46:38):That's funny cuz today you asked me and I told you no Speaker 1 (46:41):. I know that is funny that the timing, Speaker 2 (46:43):But I, I usually do. Speaker 1 (46:45):But I hope that me sharing my appreciation for you encourages you that that things that, Speaker 2 (46:49):That I should go do it. What I actually, I almost did it tonight when we got in, but I, I was like, Oh, we gotta record. So I actually's Okay. I walked price right Speaker 1 (46:57):Past. It's, it's a bookshelf that he's gonna Speaker 2 (46:59):I was gonna, I was gonna go and hang that up for you. It's Speaker 1 (47:02):Okay. So, Speaker 2 (47:03):And just everyone knows, the only reason I told her no today is cuz I had chicken cooped work. Speaker 1 (47:07):I know. I know. Um, what else do I appreciate about you? Uh, I I love that you lead our family and our church in using your giftings of teaching. Teaching the word and your knowledge and, and just the, the way that you, um, share it, it mm-hmm. is you put it in a way that's understanding and comforting and yet firm. And I just, I really love that. I love that you, I appreciate that you push me outside of my comfort zone. Um, like podcasting or , any of the number of things that we've chosen to do, uh, be missionaries and trouble. Like, just things that I don't think in my nature and who I am, or at least who I am in that moment would choose to do without you. Does that make sense? Speaker 2 (47:58):Yeah. But if you were called podcasting was your idea, was it? Mm-hmm. ? Speaker 1 (48:03):I don't remember. Speaker 2 (48:04):Yeah. But I do push you to continue doing it. . So I have a question for you. What, you've been learning guitar, haven't you? Speaker 1 (48:13):Um, I don't, Learning sounds like it's an active progression of, um, Were you Speaker 2 (48:19):Learning, like were you practicing last night? Yeah. Watching YouTube videos, trying, getting your strum on. So if today you were as good as you wanted to be, what would you do with that talent? Why Speaker 1 (48:31):Are you asking me that Speaker 2 (48:33):You really wanna know? Speaker 1 (48:35):So this is like basically what's my motivation for learning it? Speaker 2 (48:38):No, I I I'm sure you have a lot of motivations just, just to have a skill like you wanna music, but if you were as good as you wanted to be today, Okay. What would you do with that talent? Speaker 1 (48:50):The first thing I would do is use it as a tool to engage with my kids in a fun way. So like learning, you know, I may never Martin the infantry, like songs that we sing Sunday School songs mm-hmm. or, um, Speaker 2 (49:07):Even other, they're CC songs, Speaker 1 (49:08):Their CC songs or any, anything that I could put to attune. Cause I actually have been doing this for years and the kids, I, I think that they love it, but I randomly make up songs and they think I'm actually really good at it, but they're like silly songs and I try to teach them about rhyming. Like, you just, Speaker 2 (49:22):You are actually really good Speaker 1 (49:23):At it. So like at night, um, and when I'm putting them to bed, they want, they kind of want me to entertain them a little bit and I'll be like, well, gimme a word. And so they gimme a word and then I'll make up a song about it. And they're like, How do you do that? And so if I could learn guitar and seeing my silly songs, I feel like I would just master motherhood in that fun Mm. Kind of way. Cool. Speaker 2 (49:43):That's awesome. And that would be a totally valid use of that talent.  Speaker 1 (49:48):Maybe. I don't need the guitar for that, but Speaker 2 (49:51):No, that would be awesome. And then you'd probably end up teaching 'em. Speaker 1 (49:55):I want to teach them. Yeah. I wish I I wish I could pass that down to Speaker 2 (49:58):Them. I wish you could. You will. Speaker 1 (50:00):I will. Yeah. If anything my desire for learning music, I hope we'll get pass down to them. Like to try. Speaker 2 (50:10):Yeah. Yeah. Speaker 1 (50:14):All right. Uh, what, Oh, I see. Would you ever consider an entirely different career path to the one you're currently on? Speaker 2 (50:23):Yes. And I don't say that in a negative way. I just How dare you. We've always considered it. Um, if one day, Well Speaker 1 (50:31):First you have to explain what we're currently on, right? Just so that we, we don't Speaker 2 (50:34):Know. Um, just marriage after God. Uh, our, our books and our resources and our podcasts and all these things that we've been doing for years now over 10 years now, uh, is, is, is our quote unquote career. And it's also a ministry to that we, that we get to par participate in, in blessing the community and, and grow helping marriages grow closer to God and to their spouse. Um, not that I wanna stop doing this, but if one day we were forced to stop doing it, if, I mean all the podcast platforms could totally ban our type of content, uh, Amazon could not allow our books to be sold. Those things are we, that's, that, that can happen. And so we're, we've always thought we have like dreams of owning a donut store one day, like in the future. So, like I said, we don't, we don't have this vision of like, oh, we have this perfect ideal for our business and everything more so we see, um, ba basically what what I asked you to marry me with was whatever we're gonna do, I wanna do for God and I wanna do with you. (51:39):Mm-hmm. . So that could look a lot of different ways. Yeah. Doesn't mean I want to go a different career path, but I could see an entirely different group out if we needed to. Speaker 1 (51:50):Cool. Um, I, I agree that I think we both have flexibility in where we're headed and what we're doing and, uh, I'm really grateful for the experience and the, the opportunity that God's given us with all of these things. Sometimes I get nervous being so, um, known or, or like, you know, are faces out there. Some Yeah. Level public. Yeah. Social media and feeling like I can't turn that part off. Uh, and so if we ever got the opportunity, not right now, but like later in life to just kind of tone down a little bit what we're doing, I think I would enjoy that. But I Speaker 2 (52:31):Was like, why you tell them what you wanna, you wanna do? What don't you have that you have an idea of? If you could just settle down and do one thing, it has to do with flowers and, Speaker 1 (52:41):Oh gosh, Aaron, now I feel like you're just making fun of me. Speaker 2 (52:43):I'm not making fun of you at Speaker 1 (52:44):All. I told Aaron that I wanna like, or , sometimes when I'm talking to him, my thoughts are kind of jumbled and so it's a lot of different things, but essentially it's a garden or like a botanical garden or something, or museum or something that someone can come and enjoy or like a nursery, like some something to do with plants where I'm just out there in nature and watering things. Speaker 2 (53:10):. That that's, there's nothing wrong with that. Okay. Speaker 1 (53:13):Anyway, Speaker 2 (53:14):It's, I totally did agree Mav Speaker 1 (53:16):, but what I was gonna say to this question is, a large part of my current career path cannot be, um, changed or given up because we've chosen to homeschool our kids. And I feel like that is my right career right now, is just making sure that I'm on it and teaching well, and I'm gonna be doing it for a while, . Speaker 2 (53:38):So that's a good answer. And one day you might have a botanical garden, maybe. No, I'm just saying. Speaker 1 (53:44):That'd awesome. Speaker 2 (53:45):Last question. What do you feel is your purpose in life? Speaker 1 (53:50):Hmm. My purpose in life is to be a light. I tell the kids this all the time, like no matter where we are, no matter where we're, no matter what we're doing, we are a light in this world. Um, and we shine that light by the things that we say and the things that we do. And I feel a large portion of our purpose is to, uh, be a light for God and for his message and to shine in this dark world. And that can be done in a lot of different ways. And so that's like the, that's like the general picture of what my purpose is. And then if you were to like, like the umbrella, and then if you go down from there, I have a couple of other purposes that I feel very strongly about, like motherhood and, um, being a good Speaker 2 (54:35):Wife, but that first purpose permeates all of them. Totally. Speaker 1 (54:39):And then, um, sub, sub sub is like just bringing that surprise to life. Mm-hmm. , you know, Speaker 2 (54:46):Um, this word purpose, it has a, a lot of meaning for me. Um, it's pretty much how I got saved was the Lord calling out on me purpose and just showing me or reminding me, telling me, calling me, and, and letting me know that if I wanted purpose, then I needed to follow him. And so I, I feel like my purpose is, has been following God. Mm-hmm. . And so that gets played out and every as aspect of my life, it's not like a Christianity is this thing over here in the corner, and then my, then I have my job, and then I have my family, and then I have, Speaker 1 (55:27):Yeah, it's all Speaker 2 (55:28):Intertwined. My, my purpose is following Christ. And I feel like that's been a my, that is my only purpose and everyone else in my life gets to, I get to benefit from it. Everyone gets to benefit from it. Just like that good fruit on the tree is eaten by those who pass by it. Um, so Speaker 1 (55:48):What, what would you say to people listening right now who maybe they're wondering, Well, what's my purpose? Or maybe they've never thought about it before or maybe they've never had the answer to it before. Like what mm-hmm. what would you say to encourage them? Speaker 2 (56:01):I would say that, um, I'm gonna tell 'em the same thing that God told me is that if they wanna find purpose, they're gonna follow Christ. He's the one that gives true purpose because as the creator, as the designer, as the one who put his image in, in us and on us, and he's also the one that calls us, there's no, there is no other purpose found anywhere else, but in the one who creates the purpose. And so I would just tell them to turn their, their eyes to, to heaven and say, Lord, here I am . Speaker 1 (56:39):It's good. Well, we hope you guys feel encouraged today just by, uh, learning a little bit more about Aaron and I, but also just being inspired to have candid conversations with your spouse and to remember that being lighthearted and fun and, um, getting to know each other is just, just as important as all the other aspects of marriage. Mm-hmm. . And, um, Aaron, why don't you share the weekly challenge, Speaker 2 (57:04):Uh, explore a new area together or with your family? It could be a trail, a special spot to watch the sunset. A park by a river we like, we like water. Mm-hmm. , sometimes we find spots by rivers, uh, a waterfall, which are always fun downtown areas. Um, and so just go explore a new area together. That's your weekly challenge. Last week's challenge was, what was it again? It was do a, it was do a surpr, um, Speaker 1 (57:30):Oh, random act. Speaker 2 (57:31):Citis random. Yeah. Random act. Ditis. Uh, what was, what was yours? You did one this week. Speaker 1 (57:35):Yes, I did it on behalf of both of us. Um, but we door dashed, uh, friends of ours again, Jordan nicu, they keep coming up, um, that Nicki got hurt last week and so just, uh, door dashing them some breakfast burritos Speaker 2 (57:50):And who doesn't love a breakfast burrito? Right. These are good breakfast burritos too. . I actually got the benefit from that random, random active friends. I Speaker 1 (57:59):Brought some home for us too. . Speaker 2 (58:00):Yeah. And by the way, we never figured out what risk. I could not figure that out the acronym. Anyways, so we're just gonna end in prayer guys. Dear Lord, thank you so much for the creative ways we can come together and learn about each other. Thank you for how unique you have made us and how those unique qualities and ways of thinking can bring us together in such a special way. Lord, we love you and ask that you would bring more joy and light into our marriage and the marriages of those who are listening give us a deep and lasting desire to always pursue our spouse in creative ways that we would never grow tired of learning who they are and how you have a uniquely designed in Jesus name. Amen. Speaker 1 (58:40):Thank you for joining us for another episode of the Marriage After God podcast. Speaker 2 (58:43):If you found today's episode fun and encouraging, please take a moment to share it on social media or in an email to some of your married friends. Speaker 1 (58:49):Also, would you please take a moment and leave us a review, reviews, help to spread the word about our podcast? Speaker 2 (58:54):Be sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode, and you can always check out more of our resources@marriageaftergod.com. Speaker 1 (59:00):You can follow us on social media for more marriage encouragement on Facebook and Instagram at marriage after God at Husband Revolution, and at Unveiled Speaker 2 (59:08):Wife. We hope you have an incredible week and look forward to sharing more with you next week on The Marriage After God podcast, Speaker 3 (59:13):La la, la la.   Connect With UsInstagram | @marriageaftergodInstagram | @unveiledwifeInstagram | @husbandrevolutionCheck out our marriage resources!SponsorsGet our new book The Marriage Gift - 365 prayers for your marriage!

This week's episode is brought to you by our newest book "Marriage After God: Chasing Boldly After God’s Purpose for Your Life Together." One of our motivations for writing Marriage After God was to help inspire couples to consider how they can use what they have to serve God together. Sometimes we need that “out of the box” thinking to get us to see the bigger picture or possibilities that lay right in front of us. Instead of seeing ministry as a Sunday service practice, we encourage couples to see their marriage as a ministry, a reflection of God’s love in this world. Grab Your Copy of marriage after God today! Amazon.com Speaker 1 (00:10):Hi, and welcome to the Marriage After God podcast. Speaker 2 (00:12):We're your host Aaron and Jennifer Smith. Speaker 1 (00:14):We have been married 15 years and have five sweet children who are growing up way too fast. We Speaker 2 (00:18):Love God and we love marriage, Speaker 1 (00:20):And we love to be honest about it all. Speaker 2 (00:22):Marriage is not always a walk in the park, but we do believe it has a powerful purpose. Speaker 1 (00:26):So our goal here is to open up the conversation to talk about our faith and our Speaker 2 (00:30):Marriage, especially in light of the gospel. Speaker 1 (00:32):We certainly don't have all the answers, but if you stick around, we may just make you laugh. Speaker 2 (00:36):But our hope is to encourage you to chase boldly after God's purpose for your life together. Speaker 1 (00:40):This is Marriage after God. Speaker 2 (00:50):Welcome back to another episode of The Marriage After God podcast. I'm Aaron. Speaker 1 (00:55):I'm Jen Speaker 2 (00:56):. We're happy to be here today. We're gonna be talking about marriage in light of God's plan versus our own plan, which sometimes seems like they conflict . So we're just gonna be talking about our heart postures towards that and how we should respond to that, um, as believers as as a couple, um, because we all experience that Speaker 1 (01:18):Today's episode is brought to you by our book Marriage After God. One of our motivations for writing this book was to inspire couples to consider how they can use what they have to serve God together. Sometimes we need that extra out of the box thinking to get us to see the bigger picture or possibilities that lay right in front of us. So our hope is that you guys would be inspired by this book that we wrote for you. You can get a copy@amazon.com or shop dot marriage after god.com. Speaker 2 (01:46):Awesome. So, uh, you know, it's interesting is this book Marriage After God talks about a lot of the things, um, that we experience in our life also about, um, missed expectations and how God used them, um, uh, directions that we thought we were going on, but how God was redirecting us and giving us different paths for our lives, different visions for our lives, essentially where we're at today is not something that we planned on being, you know, authors and what we're doing today with our podcast. It was never an idea in our minds when we first got married. Mm-hmm. . But look where we're at. Yep. So, Speaker 1 (02:22):Yeah, the style of podcasting we do, the books that we write, everything comes from our experiences and what, So even just doing this season here and we've pretty much covered a lot of what we went through last year, right? Yeah. So today's episode is just a piece of that . Speaker 2 (02:39):Yeah. Just talking about the, because to be honest, that's all we have to share with everyone is what we Yeah. What we experience. Yeah. Um, it's, it's how God teaches us is how God grows us. And, you know, as we move through this life, we're, we're learning. Yeah. Speaker 1 (02:54):Hopefully it's relatable. I mean, who doesn't have plans that don't come to pass or, uh, who doesn't get frustrated when there's obstacles , Speaker 2 (03:01):Or who doesn't feel those strong emotions and feelings when uh, you feel like you're moving it direction and then God changes that. Like kind of what we were just talking about. It's, it sometimes feels really heavy. Yeah. Speaker 1 (03:13):Um, before we jump into Heavy, cuz it's not always fun to start out a podcast heavy, uh, I have a funny story. Well, it's actually your story. I just Speaker 2 (03:22):Can share it. . I had really good intentions. Speaker 1 (03:25):I helped make a return today. I went to Costco with a big box from an, it's an iRobot vacuum. Kind of like the Roomba or these other versions. Yeah. And we took it back because Aaron had good intentions to get me something Speaker 2 (03:41):That I thought, I was like, Hey, everyone has these and we have like all this floor and maybe it'll help, like, help maintain so that we don't have to like, do so much cleaning. This thing was loud, Speaker 1 (03:52):Like jet engine loud. Speaker 2 (03:53):And I, I also thought, I was like, you know what, I'll have it running like in the, in the middle of the night while we're sleeping. That makes the most sense. Speaker 1 (04:00):Or like, while the kids are to bed Speaker 2 (04:02):And we 10 o'clock rolls around and, and it's making all these noises. I don't even think you could turn the noises off, but then without all those sounds, I was Speaker 1 (04:14):Like, go, go dock it. Go put it back to bed or whatever you do. And remember you did it and then it like cleaned Speaker 2 (04:20):Itself out. Yeah, it has, It's like it cleans itself out into a bag, Speaker 1 (04:22):But it got like 10 notches Speaker 2 (04:24):Even higher. It sounds like a jet engine. So crazy vacuuming out this, this robot. Anyways, all that to say, we put it back in the box and we took it back. , it's terrible. Super impractical. Um, the idea was it would help us clean in reality it's way, it was way too loud and it was not, it's not ideal. Five kids running around the house trying to st to climb on it the whole time there. It's rolling around like cats Speaker 1 (04:49):All to say plans change. It could be the simplest of things like some purchase that you make or it could be some life altering thing where you get stopped in your tracks. And so we're just gonna kind of cover it all today. Speaker 2 (05:03):, maybe not even all of it. Okay. We're just gonna, we're just gonna talk about some of these, the concepts that, that, that come up with this, this topic and how we can, what, what should our perspective be? How can we deal with these? Because when we get hit, it's in these situations when we really struggled to be like, Okay, now what am I supposed to do? Or how am I supposed to feel? Mm-hmm. . Cause often we feel justified in our anger or frustration because well, we didn't get what we wanted. Speaker 1 (05:27):Yeah. I have definitely experienced those times. I don't even know if I'm like sitting there thinking, Oh, I'm so justified in all these emotions that I'm dealing with right now, but they are my fir like initial responses. It exist to the things that I'm walking through. And you know, just thinking about this last year, expecting or thinking that our move was gonna be a brief thing, you know, and we were gonna move in in a couple months. Speaker 2 (05:53):Are you talking about us leaving our last house? Speaker 1 (05:55):Leaving our last house going to the new house? Yeah. I thought it was gonna be a couple of months and it turned it out to be a lot longer. Speaker 2 (06:01):What was it like 10 Speaker 1 (06:02):Months? Yeah, it was like 10 months. But all good things happen throughout that time. And so it's weird that you can have so many intense emotions and think so negatively about something happening where you're like, cuz because of expectations where you're like, I, no, it's supposed to be this way because of this, this and this. But there were so many times when I was feeling that and you would come in and be like, But, but God like mm-hmm. , what has God had for us in this? I shared this in another episode. A friend of mine asked, you know, what does God have for you in this? Like, what is he trying to teach you? What is he trying to show you? And it's so good to, if we can stop and be reflective to consider, well is this God changing our plans and is he allowed to, Is that okay? Are you gonna embrace it? You know? Speaker 2 (06:46):Yeah. I think we, if we were all to think about it, we could probably look back on many things in our lives that we're like, we wanted, we wanted something one way. We wanted this, that new job or we wanted to, you name it, the, the something that we were hoping happened, expected had, but planned on happening and it doesn't. And in the moment we were angry, we were sad, we were confused. But then years later we look back, we could probably say like, Well I'm really glad I didn't get what I wanted in that situation. Or Speaker 1 (07:15):We can literally see the hand of God going, That was him. That was him. That Speaker 2 (07:18):Was him. Yeah. The hi, that hindsight is 2020 thing where, let's Speaker 1 (07:22):Talk about that hindsight real quick. Let's just give them some examples of what we thought versus what came to be. Speaker 2 (07:28):I tend to always, when I think about our life plans, , I always go back to the beginning. uh, do you remember when we first got married and how I took it to Africa with me ? Speaker 1 (07:38):Yeah, Speaker 2 (07:38):I remember that. Uh, well first of all, that probably wasn't on your agenda for your plan for your life, Right? Speaker 1 (07:43):I didn't consider it until we were engaged. Yeah. Speaker 2 (07:46):Yeah. And did, this isn't on the notes, but do you remember what you were planning on doing before we went to Africa? Like you had this life plan of Speaker 1 (07:55):I thought I was gonna finish school. I thought I was gonna get a degree and become a teacher and I don't know, I don't Speaker 2 (08:04):Remember that. Well, that was your tr tra trajectory. How you say that word? Yeah, I remember that because it was a, it was a conversation that we had pretty regularly. Your mom had that conversation like, wait a minute, what are you doing? Were you taking my daughter ? So that was one thing, like we had this, you had this plan for your life. One of it was getting, one of a part of it was getting married. Speaker 1 (08:22):That's an interesting season though, where like you're independent and then going into marriage and like a lot of things change in that time period. Speaker 2 (08:30):But we go to African instead and we, we gotta be missionaries. And, and in my mind back then I'm thinking like, Oh, this is what I wanna do for, you know, however long. I, I had no idea how long, but I was like, this is what I wanna do. Um, but that didn't last as long as we thought. Speaker 1 (08:45):Yeah. Once we jumped into it, which was really awesome. Um, I thought we were going to keep going that way for years. I thought, I thought being, yeah, we were traveling missionaries was gonna be like what we do. And it was a couple of years and then Speaker 2 (08:58):It was very, it wasn't even really, it was, it was less than a couple years, but quickly he pointed out something else to us. And we talked about that in marriage after God about desiring to get outta debt so that we could continue to do ministry for God. And also Speaker 1 (09:12):About that in that time tending to our marriage, which we didn't realize, which is a big deal. Yeah. I can look back now and see if we had just continued on and, and done ministry work without the intentional focus. We did pour into our marriage during that time. I mean, that would have not gone over well. Speaker 2 (09:28):. No. And, and you know, those are things that we didn't see back then in the midst of our pursuits. Yeah. In the midst of like, we're missionaries. We're doing this thing for God, it's awesome. And it was awesome, but there was also things going on that God wanted to deal with in us. Yeah. And man, praise God that he stopped us. Mm-hmm. redirected us. Um, and so we, that was one thing. We, we, you thought you were gonna be a school teacher and finished school. We thought we were gonna do missionaries longer. And then along the way there's this like weaving Yeah. Of this story that God's mm-hmm. writing in our life mm-hmm. of what he has for us. And what's awesome, just real quick, I was thinking, we, you were talking and I was thinking, man, all the way from that moment to now we're missionaries now in a different sense. Yeah. . Um, we, we, we support ourselves though now. Yeah. Which was a part of the reason of getting outta debt is we wanted to be able to be easy, have an easier time doing ministry for God and not have this burden. And we're kind of doing that now Speaker 1 (10:25):Or we're not traveling, Speaker 2 (10:26):But we're not, Well we do travel, but not necessarily Yeah. As missionaries. But it's just a different, it's a different version of it. I think that was something I was thinking about. So, uh, what was another aspect of our life? This is actually kind of ties into the next phase of our life that we had one perspective, one idea, but it ended up being something totally different. Speaker 1 (10:46): totally different. Yeah. We, well I know for me, I knew that I wanted to get married young, but having children just wasn't a super strong desire of mine. And so when we did find out we were pregnant, that was like, kind of like a shock to both of us. And it was really awesome. And I think that, uh, we were, we were ready in the sense that we had been married for five years and we were looking forward to that change coming into our lives. But then after I had Elliot, I remember thinking like, I can only have the one. Like, this is really hard. Yeah. This Speaker 2 (11:22):Is too much. How do people do one? Yeah. Speaker 1 (11:25):Yeah. But I actually found a place of contentment in just having the one. And I thought that that's just, that was gonna be our family. And then two and a half years later we ended up having another and then another and another. Now we have five. I just can't believe it. When I look at our family and just the growth that we've experienced and the size of our family, I'm just like, in awe. Like, whoa. Like I did not expect that. Speaker 2 (11:48):Yeah. And it, it was for both of us, we both had a similar perspectives of like, of, you know, we're not ready, we don't want 'em yet. That sort of thing. Mm-hmm. . Um, but God had other ideas and totally worked on our hearts in various ways and through different channels. And now we have five kids. We have a family of seven Wild And people still ask us, when are we gonna have the next, How are Speaker 1 (12:09):You gonna have more? We're like, we're not to . Uh, you mentioned earlier that I really wanted to be a school teacher and I was just thinking how I, I did wanna be a school teacher, but then I Oh, that's funny. Didn't, And I didn't. That that I am, cuz we homeschool. This is a different setting. . Speaker 2 (12:26):So the versions of our plans that we had, these are, this is like the better versions of our plans. , which is actually how God works sometimes. Another one that I, I feel like we've had these plans periodically over the last eight years of moving out of the west, out of the moving, moving out of Oregon to somewhere else. Well, Speaker 1 (12:49):Especially over the last couple of years. And I think everyone, you know, has had these notions of this like, itch, Are we supposed to go somewhere? Yeah. But we don't feel like God has told us to go anywhere. And so here we are in Oregon. Speaker 2 (13:02):We're still here in Oregon. Yep. Until he moves us. We don't know. Speaker 1 (13:07):Another one we were thinking about when we were, uh, kind of discussing about this podcast episode is how we both, uh, intended and hoped to get married young, which we did. And we thought we were gonna enjoy sex and then we didn't  Speaker 2 (13:23):And that, and then we thought that would only last a couple weeks and it didn't. And then we thought it was gonna last only a few months and it didn't. But Yeah. Um, when Jennifer was asking me, she's like, What, what things in of our li in our life did we have one expectation, but, you know, got another. And I feel like this was a big one. Speaker 1 (13:40):That was a huge Speaker 2 (13:40):One. Um, and this affected us on monumental tons of ways. Um, and God used it also in, in immense ways in our lives to really chip away at our, those areas of our life that we were not willing to lose control of, um, to let go of, to surrender in. Um, and so that was a, that was a big one. Speaker 1 (14:02):I think everyone listening right now, like they can probably pinpoint those smaller areas where they maybe had a plan in their heart and it was changed, or God had something else in mind. Or the big, like monumental things. Speaker 2 (14:14):There's like those cornerstone Yeah. Like events in your life. Yeah. Yeah. But they do, they shape us. Um, and if we don't let God do the shaping, then often we'll let the circumstances in our heart, in our flesh and our emotions shape us. Mm-hmm. . And that's when we get bitterness and we get anger and we get, you know, pent up frustrations and all sorts of dirty things that come out in bad ways. Mm-hmm. , I think Speaker 1 (14:42):I remember someone, uh, giving an analogy of like being in an oil press. Like when that, when you're under pressure or under stress or under circumstances that, uh, push on upon you, what comes out of you? . Speaker 2 (14:56):Yeah. Is it like good oil or is it like nastiness, Speaker 1 (15:00):? Like is it scripture? Like are you reciting the truth or Yeah. Are you just being nasty? Like Aaron said . Hmm. It was a good, it was a good picture for me. I like to think in pictures. Speaker 2 (15:13):How does it make you feel, Jennifer, when life doesn't go the way you expect? Or let's make even simpler each day. every day. How does it feel when the day doesn't go the way you expect? Speaker 1 (15:25):I feel like you just listed a lot of emotions that I have experienced. Um, but I think for me, I, I, I don't know if I'm gonna answer your question. I probably won't. Sorry, , but I will say that I just skip it. No, I try to avoid being disappointed or I try to avoid all those feelings by setting us and our family up for success by communicating. And I try really hard and even still I get interrupted or, Speaker 2 (15:52):You know, didn't happen tonight actually. Speaker 1 (15:54):It doesn't unfold the way tonight. Speaker 2 (15:55):Yeah. Wasn't there like these plans you had for tomorrow? Oh, for tomorrow? I just, Speaker 1 (15:59):Yeah, there was a conversation we had about that actually. , Speaker 2 (16:01):I threw a rich in it. Speaker 1 (16:03):Thanks Aaron. Speaker 2 (16:04):And you responded so gracefully and so patiently. Speaker 1 (16:08):Okay. Yes. I get frustrated when things don't go my way. I do have a hard time with change, which I always thought that I was more flexible than I actually am. Speaker 2 (16:16):I think. Do you have a hard time with change when it goes against what you have said in motion? Speaker 1 (16:20):Well, I think, I think because like what I was trying to say is I, I try and avoid all of those feelings by setting us up, by communicating like, this is the plan. Like this is what we're gonna do and this is the most efficient, effective way to be. And I usually think that I'm pretty right on this . So when things don't go that way, the truth comes outta here. Or when other people I know, but when other people don't see what I'm doing, Which Speaker 2 (16:48):Friend are you talking about? ? Are you talk, Who are you talking about? You. Oh Speaker 1 (16:55):Wow. When you get in my way. No, I'm just kidding. Um, Speaker 2 (16:58):Well just say it how it is. Speaker 1 (17:00):No. Speaker 2 (17:01):Cause it's not just you when I get in, it's Speaker 1 (17:02):God Speaker 2 (17:02):Too. When anyone gets in your way like, God, don't you know the plans that I have for you Lord. Yeah. Like my plans are, these are the best ones. You can Speaker 1 (17:13):We move on? ? I suck. I Speaker 2 (17:15):Know that. No, this is good because this is how most people think it is, is my plans are the best plans. , it's uh, Speaker 1 (17:22):You're wrong. No, Speaker 2 (17:24):It's reality. It's like you'll fail one of these days. You'll you'll just understand to listen to me and do . I have it all. Right. That's how we all think. I it's on some level in some way. We all think that way. So I that's that. Speaker 1 (17:37):So what's the truth? What, what do we need to walk away from this podcast hearing you . Please tell Speaker 2 (17:43):. There's a reason God puts stumbling blocks in our way or he puts, he puts uh, d detours on our paths because he wants his plan. He wants his will done, not our will. Um, and I think sometimes our plans line up with his, I think that's the goal, right? We want to pray and we wanna seek the Lord and ask that our life. But that, that's hard because just in the day to day, like what are we gonna have for breakfast? What are we gonna, you know, when we, you know, are gonna go do this thing or, So I think I think what's hard is on a micro level, it's more about how are we being when our plan, when when we don't get what we want. Yeah. How are we responding? Because that's that the Bible even tells us that the will of God is our sanctification. Mm. That's his will. So throughout the day God wants to sanctify you, He wants to sanctify me. So when we have these, this perfect order of things and one little thing just makes us fall on our face, we stub our toe, we bump our head and you know, emotionally, spiritually, Speaker 1 (18:55):Oh gosh. So just, sorry, you just said stub your toe. Yeah. So today I got back from Costco and I was having all the kids come out and help me get stuff out of the car. And Truitt came running out and I, I even gave him the, the freedom and the privilege to not help because there was some pretty big boxes out there. And I said, It's okay tr just stay inside. And he goes, No, I wanna help. So he runs past me barefoot and stubs his toe coming off the concrete pad patio. Yeah. Asphalt. It was so bloody. You guys gross. So you said stubb toe and I got that image Speaker 2 (19:28):And I was just, But that's a good exam. That's a good example is like you're running out to like, you got a smile on your face. I'm gonna go help. Everything's perfect. Everything's Speaker 1 (19:35):Great, everything is awesome. No, Speaker 2 (19:37):And then you bloody your toe . That's for our sanctification. It's for our tra it's our growing. So even if there's not like this big, you know, heavenly ministry or thing that's gonna about to happen in the next five minutes, what God does want to happen in the next five minutes is our sanctification. Mm-hmm. . And sometimes our, our plans don't go the way we want. And God's like, Okay, are you, you just asked me this actually, Aaron, are you walking in the spirit right now? And I'm like, well, no, I'm not. I'm walking in my flesh . And so I think that's what God's trying to teach us in all these, these things, these detours, these hours versus his plans. Yeah. As far as sanctification, Speaker 1 (20:20):Whenever I think of plans, you know, and making plans or even encouraging other people to like, hey, go dream together, which was last week's challenge. Uh, I always think of Proverbs 69, the heart of a man plans his way, but the Lord establishes his steps. Mm-hmm. , I love that verse. Speaker 2 (20:34):Yeah. And, and it's a such a simple thing, but it's so powerful is we have, there's another one that says many are the plans in a man's heart mm-hmm. , right? But we have all these ideas, plans, we like few we're tr we talked about it in a few, few episodes ago, like always looking ahead, like, oh, you know, there's this and there's that and we're gonna plan for this vacation, we're gonna plan for this ministry, we're gonna plan for this business and we have no control over tomorrow. All we have is like right now mm-hmm. and God's like, who are you right now with me? How are you gonna be right now with me? How are you gonna respond in this situation with me? And that's so that him establishing our steps is him placing before us these things and saying, How are you going to, how are we walking together? Are you gonna let me lead you? Um, a good, a good example of that. So business wise, I brought that up a second ago. Um, we've had a lot of things change over the last couple years with our business financially, and it's stuff that we have to deal with. And Speaker 1 (21:36):I feel like every year too, sometimes three, like there's this really big change Yeah. Just with what we're doing and how we're doing it. Speaker 2 (21:42):And this is something that God's been using to sanctify me because I, I tend to focus a lot, um, on the finances of the business, the marketing, the business, all the, all the ins and outs. Um, but it's something that God's using to, again, sanctify me. I have these ideas and, and aspirations and visions of what, what our business does and how it works and things change. And I have zero that is zero control over that change. One of those things that happened Speaker 1 (22:12):Good and bad because this what you're about to share was something you were not planning for. Speaker 2 (22:17):I wasn't planning for. Yeah. Um, so we have this account. So we we That's Speaker 1 (22:22):What I'm talking about that, that actually getting the account Speaker 2 (22:25):Oh, that, that originally I didn't, Yeah. I couldn't have controlled that. So Hobby Lobby, I don't know if you are listening and if you know this, but if you are a frequent hobby Lobby , um, our books are there, some of them. And for many years now, uh, they've been buying four books from us, Four or five different books from us, which has been awesome because they came on board out of nowhere, They reached out to us, they reached out to us out of nowhere at a time when financially things were just like taking, We needed it, we needed it. I was like, man, if I don't know what we're gonna do. And then I got this, this email from their buyer and I was like, Okay, that's interesting. You wanna buy some books for one of the stores? Great. But it wasn't that they bought all, they bought books for all the stores and I blew, It was like, it was a blessing that we had no idea. Couldn't have controlled. So again, that was something that I didn't so cool. I didn't plan for. And so Hobby Lobby's been awesome for us, but I, we got comfortable because Hobby Lobby was so awesome. Speaker 1 (23:24):Making those regular orders Speaker 2 (23:25):Yeah. Making those regular monthly orders from us. And then they stopped, Not, not all together, but like they, the order, the order sizes just totally changed. And they stopped ordering a few of our books, which they're allowed to do. And they're a totally autonomous company and we don't have any control over their buying. Uh, but that's something that happened this last year. And, and I get to deal, we get to deal with it, We get to walk through and, and we still get to thank God that they, that they came along when they did, even if they stopped all together. Praise God. They don't, They, they're still purchasing two of our books. So if you want to go to your local Hobby lobby, you could pick up a couple of our books. Um, Speaker 1 (24:01):They're the cheapest two. Right. Speaker 2 (24:03):They, they actually are the cheapest place to buy our books cuz they discounted 40% . So, so that's another thing. Like what we have these ideas that we look forward to that we try and control and coordinate and, and to harness. But I don't really, I don't have control over anything. Like, I don't, Amazon can lead our books tomorrow. Hobby Lobby can stop buying our books. Like all these places that we took currently are blessed by making sales through. I don't control any of them. And so it's, it's a really hard thing to try and have an open hand with that. Mm-hmm. Speaker 1 (24:39):. But you said sometimes these things can, um, lend to sanctification. So using this example of like, obviously you would love for Hobby Lobby to carry all 12 of our books. 11 of our books. That'd be awesome, right? and for success and growth and all of that. Yeah. But that's not what happened. So with changing gears with that, like where does it, what does the sanctification look like in, Well, Speaker 2 (25:04):I'll say Speaker 1 (25:04):This How you respond, or, Speaker 2 (25:06):The first thing I felt when I got the email confirming my fears was just this, like this, um, it's probably, it was probably anxiety. My heart was pounding in my chest and I was like, I don't know what to do. What are we gonna do? Like, just started freaking out. I was in the car by myself and I hadn't told you yet mm-hmm. . And I'm just like, okay. And then to be, and then, you know what the, so the first thing I I experienced was all that going on in my mind and heart that like tension made me feel a little sick, actually. Biological response. Yeah. . But then the, the next thing I did as I, I I remember saying, Okay, Lord, if, if this is your will that you wanna take this then Okay. Hmm. And it, it immediately made me realize how much security I found I placed in Hobby Lobby and then buying our books, how much security I found I've, I've placed in the book sales in general. (26:03):Mm-hmm. , you know, how we make money. And I just had to release it and say God at some level. Like I just got, I mean, at every level I just have to be able to say, okay. Mm-hmm. , like, if, if this is what you want to do and are going to do, I need to receive that. And it was super hard, but it actually brought me peace because what's awesome is, um, he's trustworthy. Yeah. Which goes into a couple of things that we wanted to bring up. Some tips for finding joy and peace when God's plans are not our plans. Like this situation in my car, mm-hmm. . Cause that was, that was exactly that, that moment of, Oh no. Mm-hmm. , I don't have control over this. Oh no. And so the, the, when you read the first one, Speaker 1 (26:52):The first one's trust him. And it's one of my favorite verses Proverbs three, five through six, Trust in the Lord with all your heart. Do not lean on your own understanding in all your ways. Acknowledge him and he will make your, he will make straight your paths. I love this verse because it reminds me that even in my good well intentioned thinking, I don't know all the answers, I don't have all of the perspective. I'm not all powerful or in control. And I need to trust him. Yeah. . But I need to trust him. Yeah. Because even when I am doing all the right things, or I do have a good perspective of how things should go, even still, he wants me to trust in him. And so I just Yeah. I Speaker 2 (27:38):Love that. Well, and at a base level, when we, when we let our flesh get to us with like, when like this hobby and everything or you, you name the situation in your own life where like, it wasn't supposed to be this way, This is not what I want. This is not how I, like, I wanted to to to go it at that base level, the core issue is, God, you're doing it wrong. This isn't what you're supposed to be doing. I don't trust like, telling him what to do. Yeah. Um, and we may not be using those words, but that's what we're saying. Like, No, I don't like what's happening right now. This isn't right, this is wrong. Cuz it doesn't feel good and it's scary. So trusting him is a, is an antidote to that. It's saying, you know, in this one situation with Hobby lobby, it's not, it's not like I do that in every situation. (28:27):I have to wrestle with things usually more. But in this moment I was like, man, I, I could freak out and, you know, start crying or I could trust you and know that you're a good God and you've always taken care of us. Even in the, the bleakest of moments, you've taken care of us. Mm-hmm. . And so th this should be no different. Mm-hmm. . And so trusting him, is that an, the second one, um, is humble yourselves first Peter five, six, humble yourselves, therefore under the mighty hand of God so that the proper time, he may exalt you Speaker 1 (29:02):His time. Yeah. Speaker 2 (29:04):And, and exalting this term can mean many things, but in reality it's, it's just being raised up. It's like when he's ready to put you where he wants you, letting and letting that be the case. But that it starts with humbleness. Instead of putting myself know, I deserve this. I deserve that job. I deserve that raise. Yeah. That's, I deserve that. Speaker 1 (29:28):That's a dangerous place to be emotionally. Mm-hmm. , because if you think that you deserve anything Speaker 2 (29:35):Yeah, that's a good Speaker 1 (29:37):Point. You're gonna be discouraged. . Speaker 2 (29:38):Yeah. It, to be honest, this is actually something during the, the months that Jennifer and I had our issues of like, you know, when are we gonna be in and, and just the emotional stuff Yeah. The emotional stuff that came out of that I remember quite a few times saying, Hey, this is a pretty awesome thing that we get and we don't deserve it. mm-hmm. , even though we're having to wait for it, even though this is difficult, like this, just remembering like what we actually deserve, which is judgment. And we haven't been given that mm-hmm. , we've been given grace and mercy. Humility is a, should be the starting point where every Christian mm-hmm. . So Speaker 1 (30:17):The last one is be still Psalm 46, 10 says, Be still and know that I am God, I will be exalted among the nations. I will be exalted in the earth. I also wanted to share, this isn't in the notes, Aaron, but you shared on Sunday a really cool picture of being silent before God. You're teaching through revelation right now. And just the importance of being, still being quiet, uh, and, and finding a secure place in your relationship with God where you can have peace mm-hmm. in that stillness and not freaking out, not worrying, not complaining, not being discontent, but just still. Speaker 2 (30:57):Yeah. And it, it, so Revelation chapter eight, verse one and two, I think it says that when the seven seal was open, So when, when Jesus the Lamb opens the seven seal of this scroll, it says that all of heaven was silent for about a half hour. Which is, I think, I always think it's funny that it throws in like for 30 minutes. It was quiet. Um, but the power of that was the, we don't, it doesn't say why they were silent, but I was imagining that they were waiting for God. They were waiting for, because that's, I mean, this, this scrolls open and, and that's what being still and being silent does. There's ano there was another verse I was gonna bring in here. When Moses goes and tells the Israelites, he says, God's going to save you. All you have to do is be silent and just watch mm-hmm. , the Red Sea was on one side, the Egyptians soldiers were on the other side. They had no way out. There was no, they had, their plans were just, we were gonna die. That was their plan. We're dead. And God's plan was, No, I'm gonna do, I'm gonna, I'm gonna save you mm-hmm. , and here's how I'm gonna do it. And Moses just says, Hey, you just gotta be quiet. Mm-hmm. and wait, and God's gonna do it. Speaker 1 (32:17):Yeah. For a lot of people listening right now, they might be literally right now in situations where they may not feel like they're gonna die, but maybe they feel like they're facing the impossible they're facing mm-hmm. things that are so hard and they can't even wrap their head around like, how am I gonna get out of this? How, how am I gonna get my family to a better place? Or how am am I gonna respond to these circumstances around me changing when it wasn't part of the plan? Speaker 2 (32:45):Yep. Speaker 1 (32:46):And even still, we can be quiet, silent, calm still, and at peace before the Lord. Speaker 2 (32:56):I just was thinking how f how interesting and funny it is. None of us plan hardship. None of us plan detours. None of us plan. Like, if, if it was all my plan, like there would only ever be success and comfort, and I would never, I would never put into the, to the itinerary a flat tire. Speaker 1 (33:18):No way. Speaker 2 (33:19):I would never put into the itinerary a broken arm or, uh, you know, you, you name the, the, the hardship. We would only ever plan good things and, and comfortable things and easy things and successful things, which would sanctify nothing. We would only ever get what we want. And so I, I just, I was just thinking when I was thinking about plans, like our plans would only ever benefit us and, but God is so much bigger than our plan, our plans mm-hmm. because he has other things in mind, like our character and also the character of those around us. You know, my, my, uh, my being fired from a job could be a blessing for someone who's been praying for a job. I would never plan that, but then my plan would disregard this other person that God cares about and loves also. Speaker 1 (34:10):Are you saying we should start planning hardship? Speaker 2 (34:12):No, I'm just like, I'm just saying we would never would . So, Speaker 1 (34:15):Uh, when we were filling out the notes for today's episode, and, uh, I saw that you had these three points. I wanted to add one in here, but it made me think of, um, , this meme that keeps going around from friends where it's Ross carrying the couch and it says pivot, pivot, pivot, pivot . And, um, I was just thinking how important it is for us to be, I used the word flexible earlier, but to embrace change and to have margin for God to step in and say, Nope, I'm gonna redirect you. . Speaker 2 (34:50):Yeah. It's the difference of like gripping so hard on your life. Like I'm not, I don't want it to move out of, you know, where it's at. You stay like this and being loose and free, Speaker 1 (35:02):Open-handed. Yeah. Yeah. Because we're not in control. Speaker 2 (35:07):You might think you are . Do, do you think you're Speaker 1 (35:09):In control? I, I want to be sometimes. Um, sometimes I like control . There was another meme myself. Sorry. I'm always, I feel like I talk in memes these days. Speaker 2 (35:21):Well, we're the generation of memes. Okay. We learn everything through memes. So Speaker 1 (35:24):This is a good one. It's, it was very like just pencil line drawings and it said, uh, my plan and it was a straight line from A to B. And then it said, but what God's plan looks like. And it was like all these scribbling like Speaker 2 (35:37):Scribbles circles and spirals Speaker 1 (35:38):And uh Yeah. Look like a little obstacle course Speaker 2 (35:41):As people, which is so much truer because we are such simple people, simple creatures. Like all we can imagine is like, no, it's just straight to the let's just here to here. Yeah. And we win Yay and God's like, Man, I have so much more that he's, he contemplates all things. Speaker 1 (35:58):When you put it in terms like that, it makes me think that when I'm like, Hey Aaron, will you build me a chicken coop? And then like two weeks later and a few mistakes and frustrated attitudes and not enough wood and all Speaker 2 (36:11):Those things, you should post a picture of it. The coop. Speaker 1 (36:14):We're getting closer every day. Speaker 2 (36:16):It's like close to halfway done. Speaker 1 (36:18):I'm proud of you . Okay, I have a question. Um, how do you know, how do you, okay, when you're going about your life and you've made these plans and things are going and then things change, the circumstance change. How do you know that it's God's plan versus your plan? Or that it's not just happenstance? How do, like when you're sitting in the car and you've got that message from Hobby Lobby, how do you not, how, how do you not respond and go, uh, , Speaker 2 (36:51):I did do that. Uh, Speaker 1 (36:53):But how do, but how do you then so quickly say, God, I trust you. Okay. If this is what it's gonna be, How do you give him the credit and say, Well this is your plan. I think are, you get in that mindset. Speaker 2 (37:05):I might ruffle some feathers with this concept, but there's, I feel like there's some misconceptions about God's will or not will or God's plan or not his plan. Um, so because there, there's ways we evaluate it. Okay. Sometimes we, we do it this way. Like if God opens a door, Speaker 1 (37:25):Right? Okay. He's open and shut a door. Speaker 2 (37:27):Yeah. Yeah. He shut this door and he opened that door. Yeah. Okay. I'm not saying that he doesn't ever do that, that he doesn't work that way. But if that's our way of evaluating, there's been times in our lives that there's been many doors open. Yeah. Then how do you know? Speaker 1 (37:42):Well, we came to the conclusion that he would let us walk through anyone Speaker 2 (37:45):That was Yeah. That was one of 'em. But what if all the doors had closed, then are you saying, Well then he just hasn't yet shown me his, Well what if his will is not that direction at all? Like, if, if we simplify how we know God's will or way, um, there, there's these, I think we've oversimplified trying to navigate what is God's point for it. Yeah. Deciphering it. But when I, and I, I think there are sometimes that he makes things very clear, but I think God's given us more instruction in his word, on how we're just to be and respond in life. Speaker 1 (38:27):So without labeling, this is from God, this isn't, or this is my plan, this is his. You're just saying how we respond to any situation matters. Speaker 2 (38:35):Yeah. Because, uh, you just talked about, you know, how we respond or, uh, this is from God and this isn't often, you know, just how I, we would never plan hardship. Mm-hmm. often when something good happens that's from God, Oh, this good thing, this blessing, this is from God. But you know what, you know, also gives good things the devil. Yeah. The devil offered so many good things to Jesus. That's Speaker 1 (38:56):True. Speaker 2 (38:57):Tempted him is what it was called. And Jesus said, Yeah, that may be true, but this is also true. And use scripture right back at the devil to, to get to God's actual will, not his, um, out of context will. And so I think there's this, there's dangers in oversimplifying, like, well, this door opened, like, okay, well lots of doors could open. We could pursue something hard enough and get what we want. This happens all the time. The Bible actually even talks about this and how we can pursue something long enough. Eventually God's gonna just give it to us. He's like, Okay, I don't want you to have it, but you haven't stopped going for that thing. So here now it's yours. Let's see how that works out. Now I'm the way I'm talking, I don't know if God talks that way. So don't I'm not, I don't wanna characterize God that way, but, but we should be careful because we could want something bad enough and then get that thing and then attribute it to God and say, See, God wanted me to have this also. Mm-hmm. , but that's may not be the case. God's a gentleman and he's not gonna just impose himself on us. Again, I'm probably gonna ruffle some for feathers, but I just, I just think sometimes we've, we're, we're, we're looking for something clearer when God's just looking for obedience. Speaker 1 (40:16):Mm. That's really Speaker 2 (40:17):Good. We're like, God, which way? Like, well, how are you gonna, what's your attitude? Speaker 1 (40:20):Yeah. Right now, everything he talks about with attitude, the, the posture of your heart, uh, character, Speaker 2 (40:25):How we treat Speaker 1 (40:26):People, how we treat people, like everything's in his word. That we need to be equipped to handle any circumstance or any situation. And Speaker 2 (40:33):That's what the Bible even teaches us, is that the, the word of God is sufficient Yeah. For those things. So even though you may think, well, the word of God doesn't tell me which job to take. You're right. It doesn't, Speaker 1 (40:44):But it tells you how to be a good steward of your job. Speaker 2 (40:48):Yeah. Well, and also how to, to pursue. And it talks about the, the, the, the needfulness of work and that we should all, like, men should be working and working Speaker 1 (40:57):To the Speaker 2 (40:57):Lord, do all things into the Lord. So when we say like, Well, how do you know something's from the Lord? Well, well, God's going to use all of our circumstances to, for our own Speaker 1 (41:10):Good us Yeah. And to glorify Him. Speaker 2 (41:12):So Right. I, I i it almost as futile to say, Oh, that car accident was from the devil, but you don't know. God wants to use it for his glory and for your good, whatever the circumstance. And so I, I don't, again, I I could be wrong, there's probably people disagreeing there right now, but I don't know if the point should be finding out like, is this in God's plan or my plan versus am I walking in the spirit with God? Speaker 1 (41:45):Can we just say this? Can we say, I am God's plan? Like I know that he planned for me to exist and Speaker 2 (41:52):Yeah. You are a part of his plan. That's a good point. Mm. Yeah. But it's, I think at the end of our time, he wants to know, did we trust him? Did we walk with him? Did we abide in him and his word. Mm-hmm. , that's what he wants. Yeah. So Speaker 1 (42:09):That's good. Another proverbs, you uh, kind of mentioned the first half of it earlier. Proverbs 1921 says, Many are the plans in the mind of a man, but it is the purpose of the Lord that will stand Speaker 2 (42:22):So . It says right there, the purpose of the Lord will stand. So that that could be lots of things. So something to think about right there, , Speaker 1 (42:33):I put a little note on here that God is merciful and kind and he uses thing all things for good and for his glory. Speaker 2 (42:41):Yeah. Speaker 1 (42:42):And you kind of already mentioned that, Speaker 2 (42:46):And I, I don't get this out of nowhere. It's from things I've read in the word. So like if you go back to Rejo, which the story of Job is intentional actually the the oldest known manuscript. So it's technically the oldest chap, uh, story in the Bible. Um, and God's or Job says, I might A, receive only the good from God and not also the evil. And that, that term evil just means like the good and the bad. And like I Speaker 1 (43:13):Already had a really good conversation about this cuz I was reading Joe another time separate from you. And I came to that and I was like, Aaron, what does this mean? Why does it say ? Speaker 2 (43:22):Well, and it's, it's true like that. Like you, you can name any story like you think No, God doesn't ever do that, but like God crushed Jesus. Yeah. And it, and the Bible says that it pleased to do that because it means our salvation, Speaker 1 (43:37):His purpose. Speaker 2 (43:38):Yeah. So we can't just look at our life and say all these bad things that happen are not from God. Mm-hmm. and all the good things that happen are from God because they're very well may be things, some things that are good, that seem good in our life mm-hmm. that are actually, they end up being bondage to us. They end up being things that distract us from the truth or from the Bible calls sin and wealth and a few other things. Deceitful, they, they trick us. So those things may seem good, but I think what God wants is us to discern all things mm-hmm. and to seek him and test. Yeah. Yeah. Speaker 1 (44:15):Something I really love is, is hearing other people's stories of how they've had plans for one thing, but got something completely different. But in their testimony, they're praising God for it. Like they, they recognize and they see his hand at work mm-hmm. and they know that they can trust him. And when you hear these stories and people sharing them, I don't know about you, but I just, I get so fired up. I love it. Um, and so I wrote a couple of just examples here, like people getting pregnant later in life Speaker 2 (44:43):Yeah. When they totally were not planning to get pregnant later in life, Speaker 1 (44:46):But Yeah. Or maybe they were wanting to get pregnant for a really long time and couldn't and then got pregnant. I just think those are awesome. Uh, a business venture becoming very successful. Or on the other hand, a business venture completely failing. But we had Speaker 2 (45:01):A few of those. Speaker 1 (45:01):But there's good. Yeah. But they see the good in it. Uh, job changes or having to move mm-hmm. Speaker 2 (45:08):, we, we've, we've experienced a lot of these either personally in our own life, but we've also had a lot of friends that, the power that I see, the testimony I see of Jesus is when I see someone going through something that you would not have wished on anyone they did not ask for, and you just think, Wow, how did you go through that? Mm-hmm. . And they come on on the other side saying, Well, God's good. Mm-hmm. , and look what he did in this mm-hmm. . And all I think is like, you're making me wanna just praise God. That's what God wants. Mm-hmm. . So if you were to just kind of like switch all that around and look at him and be like, Well you must have did something wrong or God, you know, that must have not have been from God, This is from this other, like, you're just taking away from what God is actually trying to do, which is get, get glory for himself. (45:59):. Cuz God is a jealous guy. He wants to share his glory with no one else. And he wants to do it in his people. He wants us to love him and trust him and follow him. And, and all you gotta do is read the Bible for a little bit of time to find out that not every story is an easy one. Mm-hmm. is like this straight path to the throne. Mm-hmm. , you know, you think of, uh, is it Joseph the code of many colors? Yeah. Just read that entire story. You're like, man, he he was on the throne, you know, second only to Pharaoh saved his family and all the people after decades Yeah. Of being enslaved and imprisoned and sold and pain. Like something you would not ever want. J this is the, this is how life is, is we think one way. And, and God's got a big picture. He's developing and doing something through. Speaker 1 (46:54):That's good. Um, I have another verse that I wanna share, but I have a question about it. So it was a verse that I saw a lot growing up on, You know, we had this bookstore called Brands and I mean, it was plastered on every sort of product you could consume or give. It's probably the Speaker 2 (47:11):Most second most well known verse. Yeah. Speaker 1 (47:13):So well known. But then there was a season more recently where people were like, You gotta stop using that verse because it's not about us, it's about them, the Israelites. And so I'm, I'm just asking for your, for you to share about it  Speaker 2 (47:28):Jeremiah 29 11 before I know the plans I have for you, declares the Lord, plans for welfare and not for evil to give you a future and hope. So yes, this is a promise that God gives to the Israelites, but it is also a promise he gives to his people to church because it shows up in other places, in other ways. He does have plans for us to give us a hope and a future. And that plan was Jesus . So his plans for welfare and not evil is salvation. Mm-hmm. is, uh, the, the wrath that's coming on the world because of wickedness, because of sin has been a tone for in Jesus Christ. So I think it is foolish to take this verse and say this, this is one of the verses that brings that, that preconception of good things. Um, when good things happen, they must be from the Lord. (48:19):Mm-hmm. . And the other verse would be, all good gifts come from the father of lights come from from heaven. We take those verses and we use 'em to say like, Oh, all this stuff, this is all God and all this stuff is all not God. But what this is saying is that the, the plans that God has declared are plans of salvation. And so we can use this verse and say, No, His, his plan isn't for your destruction. He wishes that none should perish, but all should come to the knowledge of Jesus Christ. Mm-hmm. , that's his plan. Yeah. It's welfare. It's that you would be with him forever. Speaker 1 (48:53):Yeah. I think what I came to terms with in accepting this versus and receiving it myself is just that it reveals God's heart. Like it reveals his mm-hmm. character and his, uh, his love. Speaker 2 (49:06):And it does. Yeah. And what's sad is they kept turning the hearts from him over and Speaker 1 (49:11):Over again. I know. As do we send. So, Okay. So, uh, we also have on here Ephesians two 10, which says, for we are his workmanship created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them. So this is an encouragement, again, just we've shared it so many times, but just to, uh, to be, to, to walk in the works that he's already prepared for us. Like he's already known what he has Speaker 2 (49:41):For us. And so whether that, you know, is how you respond to the gas station when you see the gas prices or, um, it's not funny. Speaker 1 (49:49):You should not be laughing about that. Speaker 2 (49:51):Or, or how you treat a waitress at a restaurant. Like, so when we, when we try and think like, well what's the, what's God's plans for my life? His plan is that you walk in the good works that he's prepared beforehand Yeah. For you to walk in. Speaker 1 (50:04):That's what I was trying to say. Yeah. Speaker 2 (50:06):, you said it perfect. Speaker 1 (50:07):No, . No, I didn't. Uh, you're funny. You, Okay. And then the other one is Philippians one six, and I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ. Speaker 2 (50:20):Hmm. Yeah. So he, we just, our goal should just be to, we want to keep putting one foot in front of the other for Christ. We say, Okay, Lord, like I may not be able to see far enough ahead, but I I could definitely see the foot in front of me, and so will you help me put that foot in front of the other? Will you help me? Uh, and when we trip, we, we let him pick us back up and we do it again. Mm-hmm. , we keep going. Uh, we put this last note, um, and it, it's something just to encourage us because we have all these ideas in our, our hearts. We have all these plans. We, we, we wanna do this, we wanna do that. Uh, first, I I I, I pray that everyone that's listening has a heart that whatever they're doing, that they would do it for the Lord. Mm-hmm. . Whether that's working at the bank or working at McDonald's, Speaker 1 (51:12):Or how you operate in your Speaker 2 (51:13):Marriage, or how you operate in your marriage, or how you raise your children or how you talk to your neighbors, that we would do it for the Lord. But the second thing I wanted to just encourage you with is that though we have all these plans and we have this way that like, we're trying to like orchestrate our life to some extent. That's what everyone's trying to do, is realizing that there are plans that God has that we don't know about. Plans for us, plans for our character and our growth and our sanctification. Plans for our children. Plans for your neighbors. Plans for your friends. That he's, he's working out just like we write in Philippians one, six. He's working it out. That's Speaker 1 (51:52):Exciting. Speaker 2 (51:53):Well, and it should, There's Speaker 1 (51:54):Thrill in Speaker 2 (51:55):That. And there's also a, a mystery to be found. Mm-hmm. like, Okay, Lord, what, what is it that you want for me today? And not to convolute it, Like I was just talking about what those like, Well, what doors are opening and closing. Like that could be a way God does this, but I think it's simpler. God, what, How do you want me to walk today with my words, with my actions, with my attitude, with my resources, with my time, with my energy. And I think that usually when you are walking in, that you begin to start you, you begin to walk in his steps. Mm-hmm. . Like I ju if I'm just thinking about my kids when I do that, I'm more like Jesus to my kids. , which is God's will for my life. That's what he wants me to be that way. (52:44):Uh, when I'm not that way, I'm not walking in his plan. Uh, the last verse, I I, I think about it is, um, in First John, it tells us if we're going to walk in the spirit, then we must also keep in step with the Spirit. And so if we're gonna walk in the spirit, then we must also keep in step with the spirit. What that means is that we're not directing the spirit of God. The Spirit of God directs us. And so if we're gonna walk in the spirit of God, then we gotta follow the spirit of God. Where is he going? What's he doing and why? Speaker 1 (53:21):That's good. That's really good. . I'm encouraged. Speaker 2 (53:26):Cool. Why don't you give 'em our weekly challenge and then pray. Speaker 1 (53:30):So when we were in youth group and we served as youth leaders, we would do these random acts of kindness for our community with the kids. Speaker 2 (53:38):What were they called? Speaker 1 (53:40):Wasn't it random acts of kindness? Speaker 2 (53:41):Yeah, but wasn't there a acronym for it? It wasn't Rogue Speaker 1 (53:47):. . It was risk. Speaker 2 (53:50):Risk, Yes. But random. We called it Random Acts of Senseless Kindness, which I don't, that's Speaker 1 (53:56):Not, that's still not that's R is random. Is it incidences? ? It's random. Speaker 2 (54:02):We called it risk. Speaker 1 (54:03):Yeah, we did. That Speaker 2 (54:04):Doesn't make any sense. . We'll figure it out after we get done with the podcast, probably. Speaker 1 (54:09):Anyways, Speaker 2 (54:09):Random incidences of senseless kindness, maybe Speaker 1 (54:14):Instances. Speaker 2 (54:15):No, no. I'm gonna have to, we're gonna have to call up our old youth Pastor , find out with, we call it anyways. Speaker 1 (54:21):We call it risk, but it, anyways, Random acts of kindness, uh, for the community. So this week, our challenge for you is to outdo your spouse with kindness. So random acts of kindness. You, here are some ideas. Okay. You can make them coffee in the morning. You can race to clean the kitchen after dinner. Speaker 2 (54:40):Some people make their spouse coffee every morning. I know. I'm thinking of someone specifically, and if he's listening, Speaker 1 (54:46):You're a winner. Speaker 2 (54:47):I got Speaker 1 (54:48):You. You're special . Uh, you can clean out your spouse's car or all the cars that you have. Um, what else, Aaron? Speaker 2 (54:57):Well, this is what's awesome is they get to be Speaker 1 (54:59):Creative. Oh, they get to be creative. Yeah. Speaker 2 (55:00):Okay. Um, I'm gonna add a layer two to this challenge. Oh no. Is that they as a couple would do a random act of kindness for someone else. One of their neighbors maybe. Or anyone. Or friends. Yeah. Friend. Speaker 1 (55:11):That's good. So, so outdo each other with some random act of kindness and then together do a random act of kindness. Speaker 2 (55:20):Yeah, Go for it. Challenge Speaker 1 (55:22):Accepted. Yeah. For me anyways. gonna do it. Okay. I'm gonna pray for us. Dear Lord, Thank you for leading us so well. Thank you for looking after us and using our experiences and circumstances to mature us. We pray we would embrace your plans for our marriage and be more flexible to your will. We pray we would not get hung up or disappointed when our ideal plans do not happen in our timing. Please help our hearts to trust in you. Please comfort our hearts and give us peace to our minds when we start to worry. We pray. We would submit our plans to you and allow you room to change them no matter what. We pray we would be on the same page in marriage, eager to serve you and fulfill your will together we pray You would give us a vision that would help us understand where you are taking us on this journey of life. And help us to discard the plans in our hearts that will never come to be. We pray we would be okay with letting go and trusting you in every detail. We praise you and we thank you for having plans for us, and we pray we would please you as we choose to honor you and chase after your purpose for our life together. In Jesus name, amen. (56:28):Thank you for joining us for another episode of the Marriage After God podcast. Speaker 2 (56:32):If you found today's episode fun and encouraging, please take a moment to share it on social media or in an email to some of your married friends. Speaker 1 (56:37):Also, would you please take a moment and leave us a review, reviews help to spread the word about our podcast. Speaker 2 (56:43):Be sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode, and you can always check out more of our resources@marriageaftergod.com. Speaker 1 (56:48):You can follow us on social media from more marriage encouragement on Facebook and Instagram at marriage after God at Husband Revolution, and at Unveiled Wife. Speaker 2 (56:57):We hope you have an incredible week and look forward to sharing more with you next week on The Marriage After God podcast, Speaker 3 (57:02):La la la.   Connect With UsInstagram | @marriageaftergodInstagram | @unveiledwifeInstagram | @husbandrevolutionCheck out our marriage resources!SponsorsGet our new book The Marriage Gift - 365 prayers for your marriage!

TAKE THE FREE MARRIAGE PRAYER CHALLENGEmarriageprayerchallenge.com Jennifer (00:10):Hi, and welcome to the Marriage After God podcast. Aaron (00:12):We're your host Aaron and Jennifer Smith. Jennifer (00:14):We have been married 15 years and have five sweet children who are growing up way too fast. Aaron (00:18):We love God and we love marriage, Jennifer (00:20):And we love to be honest about it all. Aaron (00:22):Marriage is not always a walk in the park, but we do believe it has a powerful purpose. Jennifer (00:26):So our goal here is to open up the conversation to talk about our faith and our marriage, Aaron (00:30):Especially in light of the gospel. Jennifer (00:32):We certainly don't have all the answers, but if you stick around, we may just make you laugh. Aaron (00:36):But our hope is to encourage you to chase boldly after God's purpose for your life together. Jennifer (00:40):This is Marriage after God. Speaker 3 (00:45):Hey Aaron (00:46):Everybody. Welcome back to another episode of The Marriage After God podcast. We're your hosts back at it. Jennifer (00:52):Be at Aaron (00:53):It. Be bag at it. Bag. Got it. . B bag. Get it. Jennifer (00:56):Oh, back at it. Back Aaron (00:57):At it. Here we go. Uh, . Today we're gonna be talking about discussing friendships. That Jennifer (01:05):Was kind of redundant. Aaron (01:05):I know talking about and discussing are both similar things, but we are, we're gonna talk about that, you know, cultivating deep friendships, the necessity of friendships. Also how it can be difficult in our relationships with our friends, um, but how it's all part of the process. And so that's what we're talking about today. Jennifer (01:22):This episode is brought to you by our free 30 day Marriage Prayer Challenge. Simply go to marriage prayer challenge.com to sign up and it's completely free. Over 130,000 husbands and wives have already taken this challenge. Join now and every day you'll receive an email with some scripture and a prompt free for a specific area to pray for your spouse. Just go to marriage prayer challenge.com and sign up today. Aaron (01:46):So we're, um, talking about friends. Jennifer (01:50):We love friends. Aaron (01:52):We have friends. Jennifer (01:53):We've had a lot of different friends over the years, just thinking about all the many places in the world we've been, We Aaron (01:59):Have friends in several countries, and, uh, of course we, we don't see all of them all the time, , but, uh, we have friends in a lot of states too. Jennifer (02:09):Yeah, I feel like I'm really grateful for all the opportunities we've had to cultivate friendships at different times throughout our marriage. And it just kind of blows my mind, Aaron. It's like no matter where we've been, no matter how long, like how long or how short of a time we've been in that place mm-hmm. , God has provided real friendships, deep friendships, but it was up to us to make the choice to invest into those relationships and what they would be like. Aaron (02:36):Yeah, I agree. I we've had many re relationships that we've had to invest in. Uh, but I also feel like that God's used all of those relationships, probably the, the most in our life to, to grow us, to mature us, to point out areas that God wanted us to change in. Um, so not only did we have the benefit of those friends for our joy and that closeness and connection, but also for our spiritual growth and maturity. Jennifer (03:01):Yeah, I totally agree with you. And I think that that happened because of the time we chose to invest into those relationships. And, um, you know, even when hard times came or challenges came, we, we used those opportunities to press on in love and to do our best to cultivate those relationships. And we weren't perfect at it. We, I feel like we're , we're kind say that a lot in every aspect of our life, but it's true. There were mistakes that we made at times. There were things we probably could have done to make friendships easier, you know? Yeah. Aaron (03:35):Or just being better friends in general. Jennifer (03:38):, just like in marriage when when you're in close proximity to another person, and there's sometimes that friction, you know, when our flesh just gets kind of like agitated. That's stickiness. Yeah. Uh, so anyways, that happens. But I feel like nostalgic, just thinking about our friendships over the years and all the laughs, the cries, the pranks we've done together, the catch phrases we've had, the adventures, the games, the games, Aaron (04:04):The staying up late, Jennifer (04:05):The hot tubs, the jacuzzi times discussions we've had. I mean, I'm just, I'm feeling very grateful for all of the different relationships that we've had. Aaron (04:15):Yeah. This topic actually, uh, came up from one of our friends. Mm-hmm. I was at, I went to Portland with a friend to go pick up a part for his tractor or something like that. And I was like, Hey, we need an idea for a topic. And he is like, Huh? He's like, Why don't you talk about like, relationships and friendships and like, how, how awesome they are, but how hard they are and how, And then we just started writing out, I was writing out all these notes and texting him to Jennifer while we were driving Jennifer (04:38):. So thank you, Cody. I know you're listening. Uh, Cody and his wife Stacy and all of their children, we have been good friends with them for almost nine years now. And it's one of those, like, it feels like family. Aaron (04:49):All of our kids have been like friends with their born together almost, and then have been growing up together. Jennifer (04:54):And our goal is to like grow together and live next door. So we're working on that.  Aaron (05:00):Isn't that everyone's goal? They just want to have like this, like small community with all their friends living of, of course, every, you know, down the street. Jennifer (05:06):I don't know if everyone feels like that, but it's a good goal. Aaron (05:09):Yeah. All those introverts out there, like Yeah. Right. . Jennifer (05:12):Well, we thought we would just kind of ask each other a couple of questions about friendship and get the, the conversation started. And Aaron (05:20):I like, I actually like this format because when I've been, I was praying about this episode today and I was thinking, Man, I don't feel like I've gotta handle a grasp on this idea of like being a good friend. It's something that I'm constantly learning. And Fri friendships are hard at times, especially when you, you allow yourself to be so close. So I like that we're gonna be asking these questions, and I just want everyone that's listening to know our heart is to, again, we always to encourage you and to remind you that you're not alone. That God has plans for us and that he desires us to grow in, in oneness and unity with his body of the church. And so, hopefully just us going back and forth answering some questions, you glean something out of it. Jennifer (06:00):And my encouragement to you guys listening would be if you, uh, already have strong friendships in your life, our hope would be that this episode just inspires you with some creative ways to, uh, engage in your friendships and, and cultivate them in deep ways. And if you're listening and you already are thinking like, Man, I really want that. I want a deep friendship. I want, uh, friendship, like friendships of married couples where, you know, you and your spouse are friends with another couple, um, our heart and prayer is just that, that God would provide that for you and that you would be willing to invest in mm-hmm. those friendships and so all around. Yeah. We just hope that this is a good episode that encourages you. Aaron (06:42):All right. So let's get, we have some questions here, and then we'll just go back and forth. All right. Let's do it. So the, here I'll ask you the first question. Okay. What did friendship look like for you growing up? Jennifer (06:53):Well, I come from a big family and like my family's families were even bigger. And so I had a lot of aunts and uncles, a lot of cousins. Friendship for our family was our family. Like, there wasn't a lot of outside friendship. We were all friends with each other. And so as I grew up and I was going to school, like I started building friendships a little bit later mm-hmm. , like junior high, high school. Um, but yeah, that's kind of what it like most like hangout time or events, Everything was surrounded around our big family Aaron (07:25):. But you had a, you had a few core friends growing up. Yeah. Yep. Jennifer (07:30):Yeah. Like two, three girlfriends that I was close to. Yeah. I think maybe a few more than that. Aaron (07:34):I think it was, um, very similar for me. I had, um, not in the fr the family or actually opposite, um, we saw Yeah. Jennifer (07:42):Your family was, had a lot of friends. Aaron (07:44):Yeah. Our family had a lot of friends, and we saw our direct family periodically throughout the year. And so I saw a different example mm-hmm. . Um, but I had a, I feel like I had, I had two really good friends growing up. Um, and I'm no longer like that close with them anymore. We just, we've moved on. But that was my kind of experience was I just had a couple that we did everything Jennifer (08:08):, and really quickly I'll share, and I think I speak for both of us. We both had a desire when we were, you know, 18, 19, 20 to marry our best friend. And so when we met and started building our friendship, Aaron, we, we cultivated it knowing that we were moving towards marriage and there was this really beautiful aspect to our friendship, knowing that we were gonna be friends in marriage and I don't know about you. Yeah. I love that. Yeah. Even now, I feel like you're Aaron (08:34):My best friend friends first. Yeah. And it never changed. I feel like you are my best friend. Yeah. Jennifer (08:38):Good . Awesome. All right. Well, the next question is, what was your desire for friendship? So going back to childhood or growing up times. Like what, what did you seek in a friendship? What did you want? Aaron (08:52):Uh, I think that, so friendship was one of those things where I just could, could go be me and hang out with that person that I enjoyed being around. Mm-hmm. . And it was like a, it was a get outta my house, go to their house, whole new environment. Yeah. And Jennifer (09:05):Eat their snacks and their Aaron (09:06):Cap. They always had. Oh, that's like, they, they always had snacks. Jennifer (09:09):My friends always had better snacks than like, That's true. More Aaron (09:12):Like moon pies, Jennifer (09:13):. What? That's, that's them good. Sorry. I loved them. Aaron (09:16):No, I didn't have moon pies in my house. No. Uh, so my desire for friendship I think was more of like, just kind of escape, having my own my own zone. And my friends were that zone. Jennifer (09:27):I can't stop thinking about how gross moon pies are, but you know, it's good. oatmeal pies. It's Aaron (09:31):Gram crackers, chocolate and marshmallows. Jennifer (09:33):What's that gonna, I don't know. There's something about it, but oatmeal pies are really good. Okay. See's good to have differences in friendships. See, Yeah. so that only one person is eating all the moon pies. . Aaron (09:44):What was your desire for friendship? What did, was there something there? Oh, Jennifer (09:47):I'm serious again. Yeah, I'm getting back to it. Um, I really desired to have, uh, a closeness in relationship where you can share deep thoughts or, uh, experiences together. You know, go do things together, which I often did with my girlfriends, so I appreciated that. Yeah. Aaron (10:04):So some of these questions will, those are, these are kind of like, been past like, ways of viewing friendship, but the friendship we're talking about now goes beyond what we kind of used to experience it like in junior high, high school, like grade school. But we're talking about deep relationship mm-hmm. , friendship. Mm-hmm. , you know, with other believers. Uh, so what has been the greatest thing about those kinds of friendships? Jennifer (10:28):Can you answer that first ? Sure. Aaron (10:30):Uh, I, I would say I, I love, I love having friends who know me, who love me. Um, and that, that means they, they share with me things that they see weak, like weaknesses they see in me. Mm-hmm. , but also they, they just enjoy me mm-hmm. and want to be around me. And, um, and I, those are, those are really cool things. Yeah. Jennifer (10:55):So there's two things that come to mind for me. The first thing is when you're known by a friend, special things happen. So they get you your favorite drink at random times or they'll, you know, they just, they know you so well that they tune in to who you are and what you like. And that makes you feel loved and special and like, thought of, which I really appreciate in friendship. Yeah. And the other thing is spontaneity. So, you know, just the random, Hey, what are you doing for dinner? Come over and not really even needing to make a plan. That makes me feel like our, our friendship is so close because there's the reliance upon each other and like a camaraderie of let's do this thing together. Even if it's short notice. I don't know why. I just love that. Aaron (11:37):Okay. So we talked about the greatest thing and there's lot, probably lots of things we could talk about, like how great it's to have a good friend. But what's a hard thing about these kinds of friendships? Jennifer (11:48):The absolute hardest thing about friendship for me is conflict. And when I know that, that I've hurt someone or said the wrong thing, or wasn't very clear in a text message and I've made someone feel a certain way, negatively sense, Yeah. Sensitive sensitivity is that I really struggle with. Cuz I don't, I'm a, I, I want peace and I want love and I want joy and I don't want the hard stuff. And so when I'm confronted with the hard stuff and there needs to be a conversation or, you know, let's flesh this thing out, Even those, those things, even though those things are really good and God has his special way of working through us in those things. Mm-hmm. , it's really hard. Aaron (12:29):That's true. Um, I would agree. A an additional layer to it. Um, cuz I, I just, I don't, like, no one likes conflict. I know there's, Jennifer (12:37):Do you feel like you're okay with it? Like, uh, Aaron (12:40):I used to be a lot more like, Yeah, lets, let's argue and let's figure this stuff out. I don't like it at as much anymore. Um, uh, I think though there's a, there's a part of me cuz I, I have multiple friends and I don't like when there's conflict between my other friends and I have these friends and I'm like, do I, like, where do I lay in the middle of this? Oh, got. So I don't like that feeling. And so, but which is a, it's a good thing cuz then it caused me like, how can I participate in helping these friends mm-hmm. , which got you in that. That's good. Yeah. So, but I, I hate that. Yeah. It's just, it, I don't know if anyone is like, yay. You know, hard, hard times friends. Um, Jennifer (13:18):There's hard things about friendships. Yeah. All right. Uh, what is your initial reaction to conflict in friendship? Aaron (13:26):Uh, before I answer that, I feel like everyone's listening, these are probably what everyone is gonna relate to the most is these hard ones, which is kind of like, interesting to think about. Maybe I'm wrong, but, um, initial reaction to conflict. Uh, depending on the level of conflict. Cuz there's totally different gams. What's that? It's not even a word. I don't think. Uh, different like levels of conflict. Um, but when they're like hard conflicts, things that need to be dealt with, things that need to be flushed out and talked about. I think my first response is like, run away. Runaway. Maybe . Like, like I don't get that sense from you. I know, but I do, I feel like in this flesh it's like, I don't want to be here right now. I don't wanna have to deal with this. Why is this even here? Can Jennifer (14:12):I tell you what I think your initial response is? Sure. I feel like it's, Well, what does the Bible say? Well, what is God saying? Well, what, And you always Aaron (14:19):Bring it back. That's what I say out loud. inside though. I'm like trying to retreat into myself. But yes, Jennifer (14:25):I, the word that I thought for myself, initial reaction to conflict is escape. Like you said, runaway. Just this is too hard. Yeah. Which I think is normal. Aaron (14:35):It is. Cuz we, Jennifer (14:36):But not that we should do it, Aaron (14:37):It's, we want what, because really, we talked about this in a few episodes, a few episodes ago about living either in the past or constantly looking far ahead into the future mm-hmm. . And I feel like that retreat is, is less of a, I just want to escape the relationship, but more, more of a, I wanna run away to a time when this conflict didn't exist. Jennifer (14:55):Yeah. Like, can I have a time machine and go back? Aaron (14:57):Yeah. Can we, can we just like, just skip over this or go go back to where when it was like nice and comfortable and, and not hard. So I think, I think that's what the, that running feeling is. Yeah. That's my only, that's a guess. Okay. But, Jennifer (15:12):So why are friends important to you? Why do you keep 'em around? Aaron (15:15):Well, specifically speaking of this idea of friendships within the church, like walking in fellowship with other believers, um, it's, it's absolutely necessary. First of all, um, we can't, we can't be autonomous islands floating around. That's not what god, that's not what Jesus came to do is create a bunch of independent islands that float and he came to, to make a body, you know, and a bride. And so these friendships and the necessity of them and cultivating them and digging in and being transparent and working through the hard things mm-hmm. and, uh, it, they're just absolutely necessary in my opinion, to the body of Christ to us as individual believers. Jennifer (15:59):So you keep mentioning, you know, having friends within the fellowship and within, uh, you know, church settings. But we're also like, this also ties into having that friend that you, that like your best friend, like someone who's very close to you or another couple who you guys walk to together with like, Right. Like you're, It's all encompassing. Aaron (16:23):Yeah. There's, there's always gonna be, I feel like there's always gonna be like these, these circles and they, they kind of go out overlap. Yeah. And they overlap and, um, I feel like there's always gonna be probably that, that one or two friends that you feel the most comfortable going to, but often those are also the ones that end up having the hardest situations, I think cuz you're so close mm-hmm. and so intertwined. Um, but I think as a, as believers not just being, not, not just being satisfied, but not just saying that, Oh, I have my one friend and I don't need anyone else, Really, We need each, all everyone. And so learning to not just always lay the burden on that one friend or couple, but do doing that, making things known, but also knowing that we can go to others in the body Yeah. And, and use each other in a good way. Not a bad use, but, Jennifer (17:16):Well, the question is, why are friends important to you? And that's what I was gonna say is, uh, what did you just say before? You said use, I got thrown off of that. Go to going to each other and you know, just having that friend that you can text and say, Hey, I'm having a down day. I need prayer for this, this, and this. And so I think friendship is important because it's, uh, supporting one another through life. It's experiencing life together. And I think God created us to walk in a place of unity in those types of relationships. Mm-hmm. . And so, I don't know. I get really encouraged by having friends in my life that are close to me so that I can reach out to them and talk with them and be encouraged Yeah. By them and encourage them. Yeah. It's like a back and forth. Aaron (18:03):Well, and it's a, it's also important because it's one of the main ways that we practice being the church is to each other. Mm-hmm. , um, Jesus makes it very clear. And the, and the Bible itself makes it very clear that our unity, our oneness as a church, um, as a bride, as a body is a message to the world that says God sent Jesus and that Jesus rose from the dead. Mm-hmm. that like, that's what the Bible teachers. And so that, you know, our friend's important. Yes. It's not just that we have this, you know, surface level friend, we have deep real fellowship relationships mm-hmm. in the body of Christ to practice being Christ's body with. Jennifer (18:43):Okay. So what do you think makes you a really good friend? Aaron (18:47):Well, me personally, I am always a really good friend and, uh, actually contradicts exactly what I said in the beginning. That's why I'm learning how to be a good friend. . Um, what makes, Jennifer (18:56):Like, what, what's unique about Aaron? If I was gonna have a friendship with Aaron, what? Aaron (19:01):Oh, you literally wanna know what makes uniquely me a good friend. Yeah. Okay. Um, I think there's, I I have, if you were to ask the same question about like, the opposite of what makes me the bad Jennifer (19:13):Friend, that's the next question is, what makes you a difficult friend? , do you answer that? Didn't notice that. Do you wanna answer that one first? Aaron (19:19): Well, I was gonna say that I tie together, I have strengths and weaknesses. Okay. And some of my strengths when not used appropriately are my greatest weaknesses. And so I can be very strong and forward and, and, um, uh, what's the word? Uh, confident in my way of thinking. Mm-hmm. . But if I'm not careful, that comes off as arrogant and rude and I, and as if I'm not listening. I'm Jennifer, you've never experienced that in our marriage, have you? Mm-hmm. for me. Mm-hmm. . Yeah. Probably not. Mm-hmm. , um, . But I, it comes off as as that. Um, but on the sa at the same time, that could, that's a, I think a, a good thing when I'm using it well Yeah. To exhort and to encourage and to remind my friends of the truth. Um, and I, Jennifer (20:08):I think that's accurate. Yeah. Aaron (20:10):There's another word, um, that I've always used is benefit of the doubt. Mm-hmm. is it, I've had seasons where I'm not that great at it, but giving the benefit of the doubt, trying to overlook offenses, trying to overlook, which has also gotten me in trouble. But that is something, like I said, greatest weakness, greatest strengths. Okay. I don't know, does that make sense? Is everyone listening? Like, Jennifer (20:30):Yeah, I get that. If I was gonna answer this, when you're kind, kind of tying those two things together. Greatest weakness and struggle. Mm-hmm. , what came to my mind is I feel like I'm a really thoughtful friend. Like I have all these thoughts of like, Oh, that this thing would make a really good gift. You are for my friend. Or Okay. But my weakness is sometimes those thoughts stay thoughts and I'm not very good. Aaron (20:52):They never come Jennifer (20:53):Out of you. Well, I'm not, I'm not so great at the execution of my thoughts and my intentions. And so sometimes maybe I think I'm sticking up. Aaron (21:02):You take the, it's the thought that counts to a whole new level. All I'm having is the thought . I'm Jennifer (21:07):Just kidding. There are times that I do follow through and those are really great times. And if I could do it more, I think that's, that would be a good thing. Uh, but yeah, that's mm-hmm. , I don't know. Yeah. Okay. Aaron (21:19):Yeah. And then there's times that you overthink, Jennifer (21:22):Oh wait, something overthink. Yeah. I should, Yeah. . That's so true. Okay, moving on. Do you like the one on one time or group time? So this would be like, Hey, I'm gonna go have coffee with my best friend. Or us as a couple are gonna go hang out with this couple, or this family's gonna hang out with our family. What do you like All the Aaron (21:41):Above? Jennifer (21:41):Yeah, I know you do. Aaron (21:42):So I can You love your friends. I like all of it. I like the one on one time. Like I said, I just got to go on a, a quick trip round trip with my friend Cody. And those are always really awesome times cuz we just get to talk and kind of download and vent and share and encourage and, and just remind each other of things that we've may have forgotten about, um, and in our lives. And um, so that's really good. Helps me. It's, that's, I feel like that's an easier, uh, thing to do. Mm-hmm. . Cause it's only engaging with one person. But I also just love group time and group conversations cause I'm there. Um, I usually get into trouble in the group times cause of the way I communicate. That's, Jennifer (22:22):I like all of it too. All the above. That's an easy answer. Aaron (22:24):You like the um, the one time when you get just me, just you  Jennifer (22:30):Two. I am my best friend. Yeah. No. Um, okay. What is your favorite thing to do together with friends? Aaron (22:37):Um, go to dinner. . I like eating good food with my friends. Jennifer (22:43):That's fun. Aaron (22:44):That's a real thing. I do Jennifer (22:45):. I like it when our friends come over for dinner cuz then all the kids just play and it's easy. Aaron (22:50):That's true. and I love it. And Jennifer (22:53):Also like, camping with friends. Aaron (22:54):You know what we, I remember we used to not like, we were so apprehensive about camping in the beginning , but we have, we've fallen in love with camping and it's so much fun with friends. Yeah. Jennifer (23:03):Because our kids are getting older too. Like our kids make it really fun. Aaron (23:05):Yeah. Cuz they go do fun things and get dirty and it's awesome. Yeah. So I just, I wanna get into this idea of like, do we even need these deep relational friendships that, that like this fellowship with one another, This idea of like, do we need that or is it okay to just have surface level relationships? Jennifer (23:24):Well, I'm gonna start with a verse Proverbs 1824 says, A man of many companions may come to ruin, but there's a friend who sticks closer than a brother. Aaron (23:33):Um, so you actually removed my other verse that was on here. I had two versions of this. Yeah. There was a, Jennifer (23:39):Maybe I left it down here. Aaron (23:41):Did you? Cuz I wanna read both of them Jennifer (23:43):Right here. Aaron (23:44):So this is the new, the new King James version of that same verse says, and I, I'm just surprised at how different they're, But there's a reason a man who has friends must himself be friendly, but there is a friend who sticks closer than a brother. Jennifer (23:59):Okay. That is way different. And I was, I was looking at this verse thinking, Okay, if I have too many friends then I'm gonna ruin everything. But if I have just like one or two close friends, then that'd be really good. So I was maybe reading into Aaron (24:13):This is, no, this is exactly why I wanted to share both versions of it. Cuz I was, I was trying to distinguish and understand why they're both there. Cuz they do sound so different. But they're not comp they're not contradictory. Yeah. What it's saying is that if a man of many companions may come to ruin this idea of you have a lot of people in your life, but no depth, you're, you're gonna come to ruin. And then the other version says, if you have friends, you must be friendly. The idea is like, how are you investing in these, not just companions, not just people that walk next to you, like you're, you know, let's go for a walk. But like people that you actually engage with. Um, and so I think both have a, it's, it's why it's a good reason to, to look into multiple versions of script of the Bible. It helps you get a bit more round idea of the, the topics. But they both essentially mean the same thing. You can't just have a bunch of people in your life that you have no relationship with. Those are just companions and you're, you actually are alone being deceived thinking you have friends, Jennifer (25:16):But, but the word friend, like that means something. It's special. Yeah. It's not just a neighbor, it's just, it's not just someone you know that you see every once in a while. Mm-hmm. Aaron (25:26):. Well, Jesus calls us his friends, he says, You're no longer servants, you're my friends. Mm-hmm. . And if you were servants, I wouldn't tell you, you know what I am discussing with my father, but since you're my friends, I share freely with you. Mm-hmm. , Jesus even displays this idea. Like when you, you're not just having this service level relationship, you're known, you're, you're opening up and being known and sharing mm-hmm. with one another. And so I would say we absolutely need deep friendships. Jennifer and I were kind of having a little back and forth on this in the beginning of like, our friendships actually necessary. And I, I think it's an absolute, like, I don't think you can do without it. Jennifer (26:09):And I was say in the church, I wasn't disagreeing with you, I was saying for the sake of our listeners, if there are people who for whatever reason, don't have deep friendships, I didn't want anyone to feel like, What do you mean they're necessary? You know, like I, I want, I want there to be understanding and love and peace and Well, Aaron (26:25):And I do understand that. And my heart would be that those people would long for that. Yeah. And find that and find that connection and, and be plugged in. Yeah. That's like a term that a lot of churches use. Be plugged in. What, what does that mean? Plugged into what? The body, the body of Christ. Um, First John, the, the majority of that, the first couple chapters of that is about how we love each other. And if we walk in the light, then we have fellowship with one another. And if we don't, then we're deceiving ourselves and we're liars. And the truth is not in us. Um, Jesus even he prays specifically for his, for the, for the disciples and for those who believe in his name, because of the disciples that we would be one just as Jesus and the Father are one. So you can't be one with the body and not have and, and not be friends with the body. (27:12):Mm-hmm. . You can't be one with the body and be a floating island that has no, no depth of relationship. No one knows you, no one gets to dig into your life and you dig into their life. That's, that's not, that's not reality. That's called a free radical. Like if we're thinking body, like when you have a cell that's just kind of moving around and not doing what it's supposed to do. Mm-hmm. . So I, I would say fr deep, deep friendships and relationships and fellowship in the body are absolutely, uh, and necessity. I'm sure there can, people can disagree with me, but that's my, my my feeling on this . Jennifer (27:46):Okay. Um, okay. Well, cultivating deep friendship is not an easy, uh, task. It's not, it's not, it doesn't come natural for all. So, you know, how do people do this? How do they cultivate a deep relationship? A friendship, Especially when, you know, it's not easy to relate to each other or there's differences. Aaron (28:10):Yeah. I, It's hard. . I think, uh, I think the first thing we need to recognize is that if we're going into frien, if we're looking for friendships for merely what I'm going to get out of it. Jennifer (28:23):Yeah. Like, is this person gonna benefit me? Bless me, serve me, love Aaron (28:27):Me. Yeah. They, they match my personality. They're in my same life stage, which those are good things and those help create friendships. But if all you're looking for is they make me feel comfortable. They, they bless me when I'm around them. I feel good. Which I'm not saying those are bad things, but if that's all we're looking for, the moment that changes what happens mm-hmm. , you're gonna assume, well, this is no longer for Jennifer (28:49):Me. Or if you meet someone that has the potential to be a close friend, but you put up a wall because it's immediately difficult or there's differences or, Aaron (28:58):Or you're afraid of difficulty or different, like you're defen, you're defensive against them, then you'll never, I don't wanna be hurt. Jennifer (29:04):Yeah. Then you'll never know or invest in that potential relationship. Aaron (29:09):Yeah. I think about Jesus and he invited 12 men to follow him for three years. They eight, slept, laughed, worked, traveled, fought . Yeah. Uh, ran from mobs, prayed over. People saw miracles. One of those men was Judas. Jesus invited Judas knowing full well who he was and what was gonna take place in his heart. And I think sometimes we, if all we have is a selfish motivation of our friendships, then there's always gonna be be this, this protection of only as long as I don't get hurt. Hmm. But what that's saying is, is don't ever do anything to hurt me otherwise. Jennifer (29:51):Yeah. We kind of have that perspective in marriage sometimes we have that wall of absolutely like, Don't hurt me, don't touch me. Don't do that or else, you know. Yeah. Aaron (30:01):And I, and it's okay to not wanna be hurt. No one likes being hurt. Jesus wasn't excited about being hurt, but he did it out of obedience to cr to God. He did it for his bride. And so that, that's where the sacrificial love mm-hmm. comes in and I, I wrote up here, how do we move past the honeymoon stage? Mm-hmm. of friendships and he brought up marriage. There's a honeymoon phase of like, everything's fun and beautiful and, and lights and easy and exciting and new. And then you, you that slowly fades away when reality had said, people don't have time to for you like you want them to. Well Jennifer (30:38):There's that friction Aaron (30:38):Or they forget about you because of things going on in their life. Or like the, these are real things or there's an actual offense. Yeah. You did something, said something, they did something, said something. And that honeymoon phase is it just dissipates. And then you actually are stuck with like, am I going to still love this person? Am I going to pumble myself and ask for forgiveness? Jennifer (31:04):What have we experienced when we've moved past that honeymoon stage in our friendships with others and have overcome the conflict or the hardship or the challenges? Well, I think, what Aaron (31:15):Do you experience? I think just like marriage, like the longer you're in it, the more, the more we overcome these difficulties, these hardships, you look back and you have a more vibrant, more strong, more trusting, more powerful marriage. I think that's the same with, with our relationships in the church, with, with other believers, with friend, with our friends is you, you become stronger for it. You, you there. There's a, I think if, if you, if we can get past these hard things in love and forgive and not just kind of pretend and hide mm-hmm. , but like actually like address and actually deal with and actually reconcile, there's, I think those friendships become stronger. Mm-hmm. , that's, I think that's the ideal perspective. Jennifer (32:00):So, so in marriage when you know there's conflict or you know, difficulties, you kind of have that whole covenant thing to hold you together and be like, well, we're married. So a good point. We got to do this. Where in friendships sometimes, and maybe I'm the only one here, I doubt it. You get tempted to think, well I can let this go. Well I don't have to because I'm not in a covenant. So how do you take those things that come up and you know, your flesh tries to justify, like, is this a sign that we shouldn't be hanging out together or is this some sort of, you know, warning or, you know, does God really want me to fill in the blank? Yeah. Aaron (32:41):Can you answer that? Well, I think there's uh, there's definitely not the same covenantal relationship that a husband and wife has where you, you don't have that. Same thing with friends. We do have a level of obligation as Christians. It says, you know, oh no and no and oh no. And anything except the outstanding debt of love to one another. So we do out of o obligation in the body of Christ that we are to love one each one another. Um, Jennifer (33:05):But with that you're saying don't give up easily, Aaron (33:07):Don't you? I would, yeah. I would say our, our, our, I would say currently in general, the disposition is yeah, easily give up. Like, I'm gonna move on. I'm not, and this probably people in here that are like, no, I, I fight. And so I, I I think there are that, those people in the church. But I would say it's definitely easier in our flesh to wanna avoid, wanna move on, wanna not have to deal with the messiness. Especially with everything else in our life that we have to deal with. So not making it easy because we love that other person mm-hmm. , right? So we don't just first offense like, oh, I'm outta here, but like, we like, hey, I wanna actually walk with this person cause I love them cuz maybe they didn't recognize it, maybe they didn't know. But I also wanna say there are times when we do get to walk, we should walk away from certain relationships. We can still love them in Christ. We can still want the best for them. We can still pray for them. But like having a but at a distance, Jennifer (33:58):Like having a healthy boundary, knowing that for whatever reason that specific relationship is, is toxic in a way or is, is not healthy. Aaron (34:07):Well, but only after trying Jennifer (34:09):To testing it. Aaron (34:10):Cause it tells the word also says do everything you can that within your power to be at peace Right. With all men. So if you, that doesn't mean you can't, or that doesn't mean you can what the everyone mm-hmm. . Yeah. So if you've tried, if you've, if you've attempted, if you've prayed through it, if you've, if you've walked through it and you, and you're like, you know what, this is nothing's changing, then I would, I I would say absolutely. Like there's, there's good, good cause to separate Yeah. From a relationship. Like there's no covenantal obligation. But I think as believers that we, we shouldn't make it easy to do Jennifer (34:43):That. Can I throw you a curve ball? Aaron (34:44):Absolutely. Jennifer (34:45):Maybe I'm the only one thinking this. Maybe not. So what happens if, let's say you and I have a friendship with another couple or family and I'm finding it difficult and I'm pulling away saying, I really don't think that we should, you know, continue on in this relationship, but you are really, um, excited to carry on the relationship and build that friendship. And so it becomes a thing between us and the marriage. You know, when, when there's one spouse for it and one spouse that's not for it. How do you navigate that? Aaron (35:17):That's a hard one. Um, I, I, I, I, I'm first and foremost, there should be prior to given to your spouse. And so there should be lots of discussion and prayer about those relationships and what that means. Yeah. So I don't have a cut and dry answer of like, That's good. I just want bring another Yeah. Jennifer (35:34):Prayer, discernment. Yep. Aaron (35:36):Sometimes fasting, and just lots of prayer, uh, to make things work sometimes. Jennifer (35:42):Okay. Since I'm really good at asking questions. Here's the next one. , Can we get too comfortable in our friendships? What does that mean? , you're just going through the motions of like Aaron (35:53):Well, I think the comfort, um, I, I think there could be a level of forgetfulness. Yeah. Like we just assume like, Oh, they're great, We're great, Everything's great. They're busy. I'm busy. Okay, Jennifer (36:05):Cool. What's really hard about that is come to find out for months they've been suffering or struggling or, and there wasn't open communication and why was that happening? Uh, but one thing that we really wanted to share with you guys today is an encouragement, uh, to ask deep questions in your friendships. Be willing to ask how are you really doing? And pressing into that. Mm-hmm. , how is your marriage doing? How's parenting going? Aaron (36:29):Yeah. I had, I had lunch with the friends today and the first thing, How's your marriage ? That was the first thing he said to me. Jennifer (36:34):. And, and then being honest to respond. You know, Um, how is your relationship with God? Is there any sin in your life that you're struggling with? How can I be praying for you? Yeah. Like, these are questions that you can't just say yes or no to. They have to be explained. And I think what makes asking these questions hard to do is if you're not willing to share on the other end to be asked in reciprocation. So think about these before you ask them, but be willing to ask them, which means you're willing to answer them. Aaron (37:03):. Yeah. And I think we can also get too comfortable in a way, not just necessarily asking important questions, but I think we can also at times speak to our friends maybe in a inconsiderate way, maybe cuz we're so comfortable. We're kind of just like, we just, we're speaking, we're, we're venting. We're, we've had that forgetting that they're, they're people mm-hmm. that here are the things that we're saying and receive them. And I think that could happen. I, again, I, that's one of my weaknesses is my, the, my tongue, the way I, the way I speak sometimes. Mm-hmm. can hurt people. So this next one, um, I'm gonna ask and, and also give an answer to it. Um, because I, I think it's, in the church it can be easy and in actually in real life, in any part of life, to connect the quickest and the closest and the, and the most intimate with people similar to us, they think like us, they're in similar life stages. Kinda makes it easy. It it's very easy. Um, but what, how do we as the church, recognize that we can also pursue relationships and friendships in the church with people who love God, who aren't exactly like us Jennifer (38:19):Mm-hmm. and enjoy those friendships Aaron (38:21):And enjoy them. Yeah. Um, and I'm, I'm thinking like maybe they have a slightly different worldview. Uh, maybe they have slightly different perspectives on and biblical beliefs. Mm-hmm. because that, this is just the reality in the church. There's so many different Yeah. Like caveats Yeah. That people have. Um, and I'm not saying on the main things, but I'm saying like the little details, um, can we have deep friendships with those people? Should we be having our minds on those people and thinking, I'm gonna go out of my way cuz I want to get to know this brother for the same purposes. I'd get to know any other person mm-hmm. in the church. I Jennifer (38:57):Think everyone's shaking their head in agreement, but also thinking, Wow, that's hard. , you know, that's Yeah. Extra. Aaron (39:04):Yeah. There's a, there's a few verses I wanted to read cuz I, I do think we should, I think, I think we should at times and often go out of our way, out of our comfort zones mm-hmm. to befriend and to walk with and have fellowship with oth all in the church as much as we can. We may not be able to have deep, intimate relationships with everyone, but we should at least try. Mm-hmm. , we should at least reach out, see how people are doing, connect, be friends with. Jennifer (39:29):That was the example that Jesus gave to us. Like he didn't do his ministry by himself. He invited others to, to come alongside him. Aaron (39:37):Oh mean, Yeah. Even even duns of the little children. Yeah. The, the disciples like, get these children out here. He's like, whoa, whoa, whoa. Let the little ones come to me. . Uh, so second Corinthians 13, 11. Finally, brothers rejoice aim for restoration, comfort one another. Um, and in the new King James version that says, um, strive for harmony instead of aim for restoration, but strive for harmony, comfort one another, agree with one another, live in peace and the God of love and peace will be with you. And then in Philippians 1 27, only let your manner of life be worthy of the gospel of Christ. So that whether I come and see you, or I am absent, I may hear of you that you are standing firm in one spirit with one mind striving side by side for the faith of the gospel. I think that this is should be the, the baseline disposition for us as Christians in the church. (40:31):That we don't just, Well I have my, my handful of close friends because we're all in the same life stage. It's this very, this is easy. That's good to have that. But that we, we see the others in the church that aren't like us. We see the others in the church that are in different life stages than us. We see that people in the church that are different age ages as us and we say, I wanna be with one spirit with them. Mm-hmm. and I wanna strive side by side with them for the faith of the gospel. Mm-hmm. Jennifer (40:58):, the verse that comes to my mind when you are saying this is um, like iron sharpens iron mm-hmm. and how the coming together of friendships really stirs one another up to understand more about life and about God's word and about what's happening. And I'm just always encouraged by what it means when friends come together and experience that. Yeah. Aaron (41:23):In faith, and I know we talk about this in a way that like, almost like we've figured it out. I promise you we have not. It's something that God is constantly teaching us things and constantly, even today we're talking about our relationships and saying, Lord, how, how do we cultivate these better? Mm-hmm. . And so, um, my friend Cody also mentioned a, a idea for this topic is what kind of example are we showing to our children? Yeah. On how to be good friends mm-hmm. . And so we just wanted to, this is for all of us. It's not just to our children, but these are some things that we can be practicing in front of our kids with our, our friends. Mm-hmm. , um, things like learn to apologize quickly, which, which in turn means that we recognize that we need to apologize. Not just being oblivious to our, our ways of being and Jennifer (42:15):Forgive. Yeah. Aaron (42:16):Forgiving. Yeah. Cuz we tell our, our kids all the time, Forgive your brother, apologize to your brother , um, being patient, are we patient with our friends or are we short and like, oh, you don't mess up again or else, or, or I can't believe you did that, but are we patient? Like, oh, maybe they just had a hard day. Oh maybe they didn't mean that. Mm-hmm. , like that benefit the doubt Jennifer (42:36):Thing. I would also add showing them, um, how to invest and make time for friends. Like having them over for dinner or helping them in an emergency. You know, like those types of experiences always make me feel closer to another friend when we can rely on each other or make plans together. Um, hearing randomly from each other and, and when you can just be in each other's presence without that obligation of feeling like you have to entertain or host mm-hmm. , you can be yourself and be loved. Like the, the kids are paying attention to all of Aaron (43:05):That. And speaking of example to our children, um, the example that we could be giving to our friends is when we, when we walk in these things, we're being an example of how we would want them to be a friend to us. Mm-hmm. , that whole golden rule thing. Yeah. Love your neighbor as yourself. Do unto others as you would have them do unto, unto you. If you would want them to recognize quickly that they need to apologize, then do that. If you would want them to be patient with you, then be patient with them. If you would want them to reach out to you and check on you, reach out to them and check on them. Reach out and say how, what's going on? How are you doing? Can we catch up? Can we get lunch? Can I bring you a coffee? If you would want someone to bring you a treat and just remind you that they love you, do that. (43:48):Mm-hmm. . Um, and then the last piece I wanna add to this is we've dealt with this. When we go through hard things, when we are struggling with a sin, when we're struggling with, uh, frustrations, angers, anxieties, all these things, it's easy to to, to retreat into ourselves. Isolate, isolate. But the, we should do the very opposite. We should because we always think like you're going through something, why didn't you tell me? But, and then we have a hard time doing it. We can be an example in reaching out and saying, I'm struggling today. I'm mad at my husband, I'm frustrated with my wife. I need prayer in this area. And I'm not saying do it to gossip cuz that some people are probably listening saying, Wait a minute. I'm saying, if you have those close friends that you trust and, and that we would reach out and say, I'm not okay right now, Please pray for me, or please come over, or can I come over? And that shows an example of what we would love for them to do because we would, if you, if you truly love someone, you want them to let you know when they're having a hard day, when they're struggling. So you can be like, Hey, how can I help? So I just wanted to end with that little bit. Jennifer (44:57):That's good. Um, if I was gonna end with something I was gonna say, and, and obviously our kids are still young, so I don't have the fruit of this to prove to you guys or anything like that, but something that I really care about is that my friend, my kids feel like they have friendships within, uh, the each of their re relationships with each other. And so if you're a parent of multiples, um, knowing that you have an opportunity every day to set the vision for your kids of what friendship can look like when they're older. And that can be as simple as saying things like, you know, when you're older, you're gonna call up your brother and ask 'em to go to lunch with you. And just giving them like this anticipation for what friendship will be like when they're older and, and encouraging them to start now by how they communicate and how they interact with each other. And I've been trying to do that in our kids' relationship. So again, I don't know what will come of it, but I think we're all pretty friendly in our family. We're Aaron (45:54):Trying. Yeah. Jennifer (45:55):So Aaron (45:56):We, we have our days, so we hope that encourage you guys. It was just a quick conversation about friendships, um, quick. It's like 40 minutes or something like that. . Jennifer (46:05):But it has been a message that has been a core value of ours and a message that we've promoted over the years, just amongst friends that yeah, we should be cultivating these relationships. It's a, it's important thing to us. Yeah. Aaron (46:19):So why don't we transition into the challenge and then we'll pray for you guys. All Jennifer (46:22):Right. Well, um, it's called a weekly challenge because it is challenging. So , if you didn't make it through last week's challenge, that's okay. No one's gonna judge you. , we Aaron (46:31):Forgive Jennifer (46:32):You. We also did not make it through last week's challenge, but that's okay. So, um, we just wanna encourage you to take up this week's challenge and see what comes of it. Aaron (46:42):Maybe add on last week's challenge too, and just keep it going. There Jennifer (46:46):You go. We don't wanna burden you guys. , take from it what you can. Uh, this week's challenge can be done with your spouse or you can do it together with some of your friends. But it's just initiate a deep conversation, share about fears or doubts, share about your dreams for your marriage or your family. Um, share about what God's been teaching you or showing you through his word. Aaron (47:07):Love it. It's a good challenge. It's good. Jennifer (47:09):It's it. Aaron (47:10):So babe, why don't you pray, press Okay. Jennifer (47:13):Dear Lord, Thank you for the gift of friendship. We pray we would grow in our ability and willingness to invest in our friendships. We pray we would cultivate our friendships as we care for others and share our lives together. We pray we would be a light to our friends and seek to be a blessing as we choose to serve them. Lord, please show us how we can be praying for our friends. Please show us how we can be encouraging our friends when conflict or uncomfortable discussions arise. We pray our Holy Spirit would help us navigate these situations with grace and love. We pray we will always communicate in love with our friends. We pray for good friends who we can rely on and we pray that we would be reliable Friends when we feel insecure in our friendships, please lead us in finding peace in those relationships. We pray your will would be done in us and through us. In Jesus name, Amen. Thank you for joining us for another episode of the Marriage After God podcast. Aaron (48:01):If you found today's episode fun and encouraging, please take a moment to share it on social media or in an email to some of your married friends. Jennifer (48:07):Also, would you please take a moment and leave us a review, reviews help to spread the word about our podcast. Aaron (48:12):Be sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode and you can always check out more of our resources@marriageaftergod.com. Jennifer (48:18):You can follow us on social media for more marriage encouragement on Facebook and Instagram at marriage after God at Husband Revolution and at Unveiled Wife. Aaron (48:26):We hope you have an incredible week and look forward to sharing more with you next week on the Marriage After God podcast.    Connect With UsInstagram | @marriageaftergodInstagram | @unveiledwifeInstagram | @husbandrevolutionCheck out our marriage resources!SponsorsGet our new book The Marriage Gift - 365 prayers for your marriage!

Pornography is all too common these days and sadly it is common even among believers. In this episode, we share How Aaron has been able to walk in freedom from this addiction for more than 6 years now and how you can too. We also talk about how you can help prepare and protect your children from this destructive sin. READ TRANSCRIPTjennifer:Hi, and welcome to the Marriage After God podcast. Aaron:We're your hosts, Aaron and Jennifer Smith. jennifer:We have been married 15 years and have five sweet children who are growing up way too fast. Aaron:We love God and we love marriage. jennifer:And we love to be honest about it all. Aaron:Marriage is not always a walk in the park, but we do believe it has a powerful purpose. jennifer:So, our goal here is to open up the conversation to talk about our faith and our marriage. Aaron:Especially in light of the gospel. jennifer:We certainly don't have all the answers, but if you stick around we may just make you laugh. Aaron:But our hope is to encourage you to chase boldly after God's purpose for your life together. jennifer:This is Marriage After God.Welcome back to another episode of the Marriage After God [inaudible 00:00:52]. Aaron:Podcast. We're Aaron and Jennifer Smith, and we're glad you're here. jennifer:Okay. But can I just say, in all realness, this was a hard episode to start, to hit that record button on, because- Aaron:Not just because of the topic, of course. jennifer:... Aaron and I, we're having a hard moment in our flesh just now. And he even said, "Maybe we should postpone this. Let's just wait." And I said, "No, this is exactly why we started a marriage ministry is because marriage is hard and we're not exempt from that." And- Aaron:Well, I want to be exempt from it, but- jennifer:But marriage wasn't hard back then in our early years. Marriage is hard even now. You go through these rhythms and motions where some days you're really great, and then there's times where it's not so easy. Aaron:This was one of them, but we're starting and we're doing this episode whether we like it or not. And I like it. I'm glad we're moving forward. jennifer:Well, I guess I just wanted to share all that because I want you guys to know that we said this before, but we don't know it all and we're not perfect at marriage. But the reason that we do this is because we're just like you guys and we know that there are hard days mixed in with a lot of good. And it's those little bits of encouragement that you get hopefully through our podcast that remind you to just press in and keep going and keep- Aaron:Continue on? jennifer:Yeah. Just going. So, here we are. Aaron:Well, we're going to do it in today's episode. We're going to be chatting about also a hard topic for us, but we're going to be talking about victory from pornography. Which, the victory's not hard. That's awesome. But just the topic of pornography is sensitive. So, thanks for bearing with us today. We're going to try our best. We love you guys and we're excited to be here. But before we get into the sponsor for this episode, I just wanted say that we're so honored that we're currently getting over 12,000 downloads per episode for this season, which is crazy because that's actually double, if not more than double what we were getting last season per episode. jennifer:Nice. Aaron:Which is crazy. I have no idea why, but it's awesome and it's happening. jennifer:So, I just told a lot more people that we have hard times? Aaron:Yeah. Double the amount of people, actually. So, that being said, we'd love to see what we can do with this podcast and the community and what it's capable of. Would you commit to inviting one other couple or person to check out this show this week? The most powerful way for anything to grow is by the community itself and word of mouth. So, I just wanted to encourage you, this week invite someone to listen to this podcast. jennifer:So, this podcast, or this specific episode, is brought to you by our 31 day marriage devotionals for couples, Husband After God and Wife After God. We wrote these devotionals to encourage husbands and wives around the world to draw closer to God and closer to each other. These devotionals can be done by yourself, so you could just pick up your own copy, or you could do it together with your spouse, which is really awesome because the topics kind of coincide. There's a couple different ones. But you guys can talk about the topics together, which is really cool. Some of the topics that we cover are God's purpose for your marriage, the ministry of reconciliation, the parts of marriage, and many more. It also includes a daily prayer, which is really cool. Every day's topic comes with scripture to read, a prayer, a thought and questions for you to answer, and even journal together if you want. Aaron:Yeah. So, we want to invite you. It's Husband and Wife After God devotionals. You can get them on amazon.com or at marriageaftergod.com. jennifer:Okay. So, you already mentioned that this topic of pornography, even though it's victory from pornography, is a hard- Aaron:It's still a big portion of my story overall, is this journey from pornography. jennifer:But you mentioned that it's hard to talk about. Why? Aaron:It's ugly. It's embarrassing. It's a part of my life that I'm not happy was ever there because of how destructive it was. So, it's a hard subject. But the reason I talk about it and we've talked about it in several episodes in the past, and I share it with anyone I talk to, is because I believe that the more I share it, the more open I am about it, the more light I shine in that darkness, the less dark it is and the less hold it has in my life and the less hold it has in other people's lives. jennifer:Yeah, I also think about how it's so weird, but words like sex or pornography, our culture exposes so much of it and just puts it all out there and yet there's- Aaron:Yeah. It's commonplace. Yeah. jennifer:Yeah. It's common and almost normal. But then there's this element of, you can't really talk about it without feeling guilt or shame or icky. Aaron:That should tell you something about it. jennifer:Yeah, that's weird. Okay. Aaron:That's an interesting thought that they make it seem so common and yet you can't have healthy conversations around it, which is interesting. So, hopefully we have a healthy conversation around it today. I mean, like we were just talking about, pornography has become so common in many homes. jennifer:Definitely accessible. Aaron:Well, it's way more accessible than it ever has been, but it's so common. And it's common now even amongst both men and women more so than it ever has been. You can look up the stance yourself at a later time. And although it shouldn't be, it's super common in the church. The bride of Christ. jennifer:Yeah. The body of... Aaron:Yeah. So, it's not enough to talk about it one time in one past episode. It's something that we need to keep bringing up, especially because we have double the people listening now. Hopefully there's someone that listens today and walks away from this really encouraged, really reminded of the truth of who they are in Christ, and also freedom from pornography. jennifer:Yeah. Pornography was something that plagued our marriage in a lot of the early years, and it was really hard to walk through that with you. And it was really painful in a lot of ways. It caused a lot of hurt and harm to our marriage. Aaron:Well, and it was one of those things, like I've talked about in the past, is it plagued my life even before we were married. And I was really hoping that marriage would've somehow fixed it, which of course is a lie. jennifer:It was a habit you had built of- Aaron:Yeah. It was a habit, an addiction, jennifer:... coping and going to that- Aaron:That ugly place. Yeah. jennifer:... place. Yeah. Aaron:But God was patient and He was gracious and He helped me, which I love. Because if you think about it, God's righteous and He didn't need to be patient with me. But because He is patient and loving, He was. Which is, I just praise God for that. He was. And He's patient with you listening too. He's patient with us, but He wants us to know the truth and that's hopefully what I'm going to get to today. What we're going to just shine a light on today is that we believe lies which keeps us in our pornography addictions, but there's truth that sets us free. jennifer:And there's hope for you today- Aaron:There's hope, yeah. Absolutely. jennifer:... listening- Aaron:100%. jennifer:... if you are struggling with addiction, to be at a place of freedom and to walk in victory. Aaron, how long has it been now for you? Aaron:I was trying to calculate this when I was looking through these notes and I believe it was around 2016. jennifer:Which was six years ago. Aaron:Six-ish years ago. It could have been earlier or maybe a little later. I was really trying to pinpoint exactly when this conversation that happened with me. But it's been about six years. I think that's about right. It feels like it's been that long because I was actually just walking around today thinking about this episode. And I was thinking about how amazing it is that I don't have that guilt and shame anymore. Because it used to be so prevalent in my life. It was like every day or every other day or every other other day, but it was constant. And that's hard for me, but I look back and I'm like, "Man, that's pretty amazing that it's not a part of my life anymore." jennifer:It's like a weight lifted off your shoulders. Aaron:Yeah. And I wanted to just mention that it's not that it's not a daily struggle, a battle. I can feel that- jennifer:Temptation. Aaron:... temptation. I could feel that urge and I constantly am being reminded from the enemy or just my flesh of that part of my life. But I'm constantly having to submit those thoughts to Christ and pray over them and remind myself that that's not who I am, that those are not my thoughts, that I don't want those thoughts, that I want to be pure and holy and healed. But it's pretty amazing that it's been so long. jennifer:That's awesome. I think for some people listening, they might think, "Well, I could never go that long." Or- Aaron:I remember thinking that a lot. jennifer:Did you? Aaron:I do. I remember thinking when I was in the midst of it, that there was... I think the longest I ever went was a month, but it never dawned on me that it would actually be permanent. That was never an idea I had in my mind. I just always felt like, "Maybe I can go longer this time. Maybe I can go longer next time." So, if you're listening and you think this, that you don't think you can go that long, then you won't. If you don't think you can, you won't. And that's a big mind shift, is actually believing you can be free, and even bigger than that, are already free from pornography, which I think we'll get into a little bit more soon. jennifer:So, what was it for you, that point of recognition or that moment where you gave it up and you started to believe what was true? Aaron:And walk in that freedom? jennifer:Yeah. Aaron:This is the crux of pretty much everything. Any addiction, anything we walk in, any lies we believe, any of these strongholds in our lives, this is the crux of what changes that. What we believe is how we are going to act. So, if I believe I'm still a slave to pornography, which I did, and I believe that it had a hold on me, I believe it had a power over me, then I'm going to remain a slave to it even if that's not true. So, even if I have enough willpower to avoid it for a while, eventually I'm going to be right back to it. Because what I believe is why I'm there in the first place. I believe it has the power over me. I believe it controls what I do. I believe that it is happening to me.So, even if I try and go a month, a week, a day, it doesn't matter how long I think I can go. I don't believe I can continue on, like I just mentioned a little bit earlier. What I believe dictates what I do. So, what changed was a brother in Christ telling me that I was believing lies, revealing to me the lies that I was believing. Because I would say, "I want to be free." But the lie is that I wanted to be free. The truth is I wanted that pornography. I wanted that feeling. I wanted that experience. So, I had to recognize the truth about it. But the even deeper truth that set me free is that I was already free, that I'm actually not a slave to pornography. As a believer in Christ, as someone who saved by the blood of the lamb, as someone who has put his faith in the only name that is above every name, I'm actually already free.There are no chains. The bonds of sin and death and the fear of death are gone. They're gone in Christ. But if I think I'm still in bondage, if I think I'm still enslaved to this thing, then I'm going to act like I'm still enslaved to it. And so that was actually a huge moment for me. The Bible tells us that we're transformed by the renewing of our minds. That was a renewing moment of my mind that I was able to realize in my spirit that, "Oh, wait a minute. I'm not slave to this and I don't have to do this." That doesn't mean it didn't feel any less strong. But what it did was when those temptations came, I actually knew the truth about it, that I wasn't a slave to it, that I didn't need it, that that's not who I am and I can actually start hearing those things.It almost made me more sensitive to what the spirit was already trying to say to me in the conviction about the pornography. So, just a recap, what changed me was I began to believe the truth. And I know that sounds maybe oversimplified, but that's the reality with all these things. If we believe the truth. Jesus came to set us free. It's for freedom that Christ has come. That's what He's giving to us, is freedom from sin and death. And so I'm not a slave to pornography. If you're listening to this and you're a believer and you are addicted to pornography, I want you to know something. You are not a slave to pornography. Pornography is not something happening to you. You're free from it. You're completely free in Christ Jesus. Once you realize that, then you recognize then what you're doing is you're choosing this sin. That's what I was doing. That's what Christians do, is we choose the sin rather than the sin doing something to us or controlling us. Because it does not have the control. jennifer:So, that's really good. And I really appreciate you sharing that. I just want everyone to know this is really a hard topic for me to go back to and talk about, especially experiences in our past. Because as a wife, it emotionally brings me back to these places that I was like, "Oh, that really hurt," or, "That was really hard." And so earlier I mentioned that it hurt our marriage. Do you want to share a little bit about how, like what are the different ways? Because I think it's important that people hear. Maybe people who are listening who may be doing something like this, they're not realizing the pain that it could cause. So, maybe hearing our story, maybe hearing how it has hurt our marriage will shed some light. Aaron:Well, you mentioned how it's a hard subject for you because of what it brings up for you, those emotions that hurt. Can I just ask you, how did it affect you? jennifer:It made me feel really insecure. It made me feel like I wasn't good enough or I couldn't measure up to what it was that you really wanted. And it made me angry. Aaron:Oh, yeah. You were angry. jennifer:It made me sad. It was a lot. Heavy. Aaron:It was a lot. And it was very spiritually destructive between our relationship. That unity that we had, it was always something chipping away at our unity, if not taking huge chunks out of it. It spiritually hurt us. I didn't have much respect for myself. I didn't see myself as someone respectable because I knew what was in my heart. I knew what I was doing. So, it made me weak. jennifer:Which actually showed physically. Thinking back on just our journey together, your countenance, the way you carried yourself, everything about you was less confident, less assured- Aaron:That's true. jennifer:... than what you've been walking the last six years. Aaron:That's true. jennifer:Drastically different. Aaron:Yeah. It's been a- jennifer:Huge shift. Aaron:... huge transformation. Yeah. It kept me from feeling confident in my relationship with God. I always felt insecure with God, which is crazy because He's the most secure relationship that I have. But I felt distant from Him. It's not like He changed. He didn't move. But I felt wishy-washy with Him and tossed to and fro, and that was not good. jennifer:I remember the feeling of broken trust and struggling to know whether I could believe the things that you were saying or if you were telling the truth in a lot of different areas of life because of that one area. Aaron:Yeah. And it was true. Because going back to talking about what I believed and how that drives what we do, because I believed one way, even when I was repenting to you or apologizing to you, I couldn't actually do it because what I was repenting of was how I felt about my sin. What I was repenting of is what it did to you. I was repenting of these things, the fruit of my sin that I didn't like, but I wasn't actually repenting of my sin, of my love of it, of my desire for it. The repentance was skewed because my belief was off. What I was believing was false.And that's why belief is so powerful. Just to go back to this again, I just want to reiterate that this is what brings us freedom is when we believe the truth. It's the truth that sets us free. That what we believe drives what we do. It's why we're told to believe in Jesus. I want to make sure I say this carefully. Jesus is our salvation. But what He calls us to do is believe in Him. That's what He calls us to do is believe in Him. And when we truly believe in Jesus, our lives reflect that. We begin to follow Him. We begin to listen to His word. jennifer:Things change in our life. Aaron:Things change. So, that's what faith is. Faith is the proof of what we believe. And it's the actions that grow out of what we believe. So, going back to pornography, if I believe pornography has this control over me, then I'm giving it that control. If I believe I'm a slave to it, then I'm going to act like a slave to it. I'm going to give in every time that temptation shows up, even if I can have enough willpower against it for a time or two. jennifer:Just to interrupt you real quick. Because people are funny. We're funny. What hinders us from believing what's true? Aaron:We talked about this for a little bit. This weird idea that I was thinking about is because we have a lot of biology that dictates a lot of things, like what we- jennifer:Like hormones. Aaron:... crave and hormones, and when we get angry or sad or happy and what things we love in life and things we want to do. A lot of that's just biology, but we're not only biology. We're a multifaceted creature. We're a soul and we have a spirit and we have God's spirit in us. So, we have all these aspects to us that... So, I was just wondering, where does belief exist? It can't be in the biology of us. Belief is not just synapses firing and hormones flowing and these chemical responses in my brain saying, "Oh, now I agree with this idea." Belief has got to be something outside of us.It's a spiritual thing. It's a spiritual thing that affects our biology. It affects what we do and how we act and what we eat and where we go and things we say and how we respond. And so what keeps us from believing, I think sometimes, can maybe be biology, but I don't think so. I think what keeps us from believing is what we already believe. Because we all believe something. So, it's not that we don't believe something. We already believe something. And either that thing we believe is the truth or it's a lie. And so I think what keeps us maybe from believing the truth are the lies that we hold so strongly to already. I could be wrong, but that's what kept me for so long. And I think another thing is- jennifer:Real quick before you move on. Aaron:Yeah, go ahead. jennifer:When you were talking about the lies that we are clinging on to, I got this image, because I think in pictures, of like, "Okay, well then as I'm walking through this process, in order to believe something new we got to rip up the old thing." And then I got this picture of renovating a house and finding that old 1970s tile on the floor that's stuck so hard and you're trying to chisel at it and it won't get up. Aaron:So you could put down a new floor. jennifer:Yeah. But what an awful process. Aaron:It is. Well, and it's hard. But I think a part of that chiseling up is it being presented to us in the first place, being told that that tile is ugly. jennifer:Like the confrontation. Aaron:Yeah. And so I think a reason maybe we don't believe the truth is not that we haven't heard the truth. Because I think there was so many times growing up in this addiction to pornography that I read scriptures and I looked at them and I said, "There's no way this is true because it doesn't work for me," which is so backwards. The fact is it was already true. I just didn't believe it. I didn't believe what it said. And so I think being presented with it maybe in this way on this podcast or another person in your life like what happened to me, someone sitting down, and it's that moment, it's a culmination of the Holy Spirit conviction, a moment of just providence with another Christian believer. Maybe even not a believer, just some instance where there's a culmination of all of these things coming together where you're like, "Oh man, I've been believing a lie."And I mean, the idea of when you say you believe something, it's essentially saying, "I agree with this." And so we got to ask ourselves, "What do we agree with?" So, when you read scriptures like I was, like this one in Romans 12:2, "Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect." If I don't believe that God's word can actually transform my mind or renew my mind, then it won't. I don't believe it can. Like, "Oh, that sounds great. But it's not for me." Or if I read other scriptures like this one, First Corinthians 10:13, this is a huge one, and I brought this up in other podcasts and I'm just going to keep reiterating because it's so true, "No temptation is overtaking you that is not common to man. God is faithful and He will not let you be tempted beyond your ability. But with the temptation, He will also provide the way of escape that you may be able to endure it." jennifer:Praise God, that He does this for us. Aaron:I would read this and I would say, "Well, not for me. That's true, I guess, for someone but not for me." So, who's true? Is what He says true or what I'm saying true? jennifer:He's always true. Aaron:Yeah. So, just essentially it's either we believe in the lies or we believe in the truth and I started believing the truth. I started believing what God says in His word and it's huge. And First Corinthians 10:13 is true as it gets. jennifer:Thank God. Aaron:Yeah. It's true. jennifer:So, what has it been like now that you've been walking in victory and freedom and purity? How's life? How's our marriage? Aaron:Easier in major ways. Our intimacy with each other has just... I feel like we've been growing over the last six years exponentially. jennifer:Enjoying each other. Aaron:Enjoying each other. There's so much less conflict. I mean, we still have had conflicts, but not around this, not around broken trust, not around the spiritual infidelity. It's just been building trust. And I would say, have you felt more confident with us? jennifer:I have. And just to, hopefully as an encouragement to those listening, trust didn't take that long to rebuild. And I think with things like this, sometimes it can feel like, "Will it ever be restored?" or, "Will we ever be at a place that I truly desire?" And I've been really thankful that trust was something that was rebuilt and rebuilt. It did take time, but not as long as I thought it would take. And I really appreciate that, that that was the case. Aaron:Yeah. And I think it helps when you see actual, real quantifiable change in me instead of this constant... I do want to be honest. There were times that I fell short. And this doesn't mean that I fell back in the same way I did in the past. What God was doing was showing me, because my eyes were taken off of this main, big thing, this porn addiction, He started showing me other areas of my life where I had issues. Lust, bad decision processes in my life. And so again, it wasn't the same kind of messing up that I did in the past. But what happened was is I was able to come to you quicker, repent to you and say, "Hey, I clicked on this thing and I just wanted to tell you I'm sorry. I chose to do it. It's not who I am. It's not going to happen again." And that happened less and less frequently and it's something that- jennifer:It was like God was correcting and retraining your mind- Aaron:That's exactly what He was doing. jennifer:... even down to the simplest, most- Aaron:Things that most people probably wouldn't even think are an issue. jennifer:Yeah. Yeah. But showing you- Aaron:But it convicted me. jennifer:... that this is where it started or this is a root. Yeah. Aaron:And it's that idea that God doesn't even want a hint of it in His church, that He wants his bride to be pure. So, I feel like that's what God was doing. I was getting more and more and more sensitive to this stuff, which is also awesome because then it helped build trust with Jennifer, that even in those, quote-unquote, "little things," which didn't feel little to me, they felt painful and shameful, you saw me growing and changing and being more and more honest and less and less sneaky because I wasn't practicing that thing anymore. jennifer:Well, when you are operating in the spirit and you have a relationship with God, there is this level of discernment, I think, in marriage where you sense when your spouse is struggling with something. You can sense when there's emotional. You can sense when they're sinning. And you may not always know exactly- Aaron:Which you did. jennifer:... what it is or what they're going through, but you definitely sense things. And oftentimes that sensing I would get would prompt me to ask, "Hey, how you doing?" And so- Aaron:Which is really helpful. jennifer:Yeah. And I'm just grateful that those promptings that I would get, those discernments, they feel a lot different now. They're about different things. Aaron:Which is good. And I think that's a cool thing, that once you get over, I would say this, that was a big hurdle, it's almost like you can see clearer and it's like the scales fall off my eyes and I can start seeing more and more things that God's trying to grow in me and work in me and areas of my life that I needed to surrender to Him, that I was holding onto that I would've never saw before because I was so blinded by this other stuff that was going on. jennifer:Do you feel like the gains you made and being able to have victory over this made- Aaron:Like the gym gains? jennifer:No. It made you more confident though in other areas that you were like, "Oh, this thing over here? I can..." You know? Aaron:Yes. Again, going back to the self-discipline stuff, all those things that I did get tons of gains in, there's still harder times and we go through seasons, but it feels good knowing that what God says is true and that I am truly free. And I can actually honestly tell that to others and this- jennifer:I was going to say, you feel different. Aaron:I feel different, but I feel like I can genuinely tell other people the same thing, that I don't feel like I'm lying when I say, "You're free." That you actually don't have to do that anymore. And you don't have to believe that. So, some encouragements we wanted to give to you guys as the bride of Christ and women, men, whoever's struggling with this, whoever's dealing with this, whoever's continuing to walk in this and choose this sin, and like I said, doesn't believe they can walk in freedom from it, we want to give you some encouragement for that. So, here's some scriptures and some... We want to help you. jennifer:We want to fill up your cup today. Aaron:Yeah. Why don't you read that first one? jennifer:Okay. It's Titus 3:4-7. "But when the goodness and loving kindness of God our savior appeared, He saved us. Not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to His own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit whom He poured out on us richly through Jesus Christ our savior, so that being justified by His grace, we might become heirs according to the hope of eternal life." Aaron:So, we wanted to start with this verse because this is where everything comes from in us. The desire to walk in freedom, the desire to walk in holiness. It's by what He has done, not by works that we've done. Because it's- jennifer:Because thinking that it's you and that, "Okay, I'm not going to do this thing today," only get you so far. You're like- Aaron:Yeah, not far at all, actually. jennifer:Yeah. Not far at all. Because eventually we are in our flesh. We fail. Aaron:Yeah. So- jennifer:Which is why we need Jesus. Aaron:Since this is true, since this is by God's goodness and loving kindness that the savior has saved us and washing us and regenerating us and renewing us in his Holy Spirit that He's poured out on us, here's some things I want to tell you. Lay it aside. Lay it aside. Get rid of it. It no longer needs to be in our lives. Let's get rid of this. Hebrews 12:1. "Therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses," again, the witnesses of the faithful, of the ones who had faith in God in the Old Testament, "let us lay aside every weight and sin which clings so closely," pornography was one of those things that clung so closely to me, "and let us run with endurance the race that is set before us." jennifer:You just shouted out pornography, but anything, any sin, any addiction, anything that you're- Aaron:Weighs us down. jennifer:If you're listening to this right now and the Lord is like, "This is the thing that I want you to hear." Aaron:Which God does that. Listen to it. He's telling you right now. jennifer:Psst. Aaron:Yes, you. [inaudible 00:31:29]. jennifer:Okay. Reread that last. Aaron:Okay. Hebrews 12:1. "Therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight and sin which clings so closely and let us run with endurance the race that is set before us." jennifer:Okay. The next one is, "Flee from it. Flee from sexual..." Oh sorry. First Corinthians 6:18. "Flee from sexual immorality. Every other sin a person commits is outside the body, but the sexually immoral person sins against his own body." Aaron:Yeah. I was bringing this up today in my men's group. Yes, this is a sin against your own flesh. But again, your wife, your husband- jennifer:You're one. Aaron:... you're one with that person. jennifer:You are one. Aaron:So, it's a sin against them. And then if you take own body as in body of Christ or the body as the church, you're sinning against the body of Christ. There's another scripture that talks about that. It's like taking Christ and putting Him with a prostitute, and we should never do that. And so flee from it. The next one is we want to say, "Kill it dead and gone once and for all." Romans 8:13. "For if you live according to the flesh, you will die. But if by the spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live." This is an important thing, that we recognize that thing as something that needs to be dead and gone. Gone, once and for all. jennifer:I also just want to add some encouragement in light of marriage. When you walk in the flesh and when you choose sin, you are choosing destruction- Aaron:In your marriage. jennifer:... on your marriage. Aaron:Yeah. And your own life. jennifer:And in your life. But if you walk according to the spirit, you will live. Your marriage will- Aaron:Have life. jennifer:... have life. And that's what we've experienced, which is why we are sharing this with you guys today. Okay. The next one is, "Draw near to God and believe the truth." James 4:8 says, "Draw near to God and He will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners, and purify your hearts, you double-minded." Aaron:So, that word double-minded is what I believe, believe, there's that word, is who I was before. jennifer:Going back and forth. Aaron:Yeah. I would think and say, "Yeah, I want to be holy. Yeah, I love God. Yeah, I believe what He says is the word." But then I acted totally different. I was double-minded. And so this says, "Draw near to God and He will draw near to you." Period. Draw near to God and believe what He says, which is how we cleanse our hands. We believe His word. We walk in His ways. That's how we cleanse it ourselves. jennifer:It's also His word that will confront the sin in our life. And remember we talked about- Aaron:Purify us. Yeah. jennifer:... the confrontation is what we need to be able to- Aaron:Jesus says this to his disciples in the [inaudible 00:34:13]. I just was remembering this. He says, "You're already clean because of the words I have spoken to you." Think about that. He cleans us and purifies us by His word. So, let's stop being double-minded. So, here's the second to last one. "Not even a hint of it," Ephesians 5:1-5, "therefore be imitators of God as beloved children." That's who you are by the way. Listen to us. You are beloved children of God."And walk in love as Christ loved us and gave Himself up for us, a fragrant offering and sacrifice to God. But sexual immorality and all impurity or covetousness must not even be named among you as is proper among saints." When I said it's common in the church, I started that with, "It should not be, but it is." It should not be commonplace. It shouldn't even be named among us as God's bride. Just as much as you would not want any infidelity from your wife or some other man in your bed or other woman in your bed, there should be none of it. Not even close. Not even a hint. That's what God wants from his bride, is not even a hint. jennifer:And then there's confess and repent and pray together. So, James 5:16 says, "Therefore, confess your sins to one another and pray for one another that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous person has great power as it is working." Aaron:This is probably one of the most important ones I would say. I mean, they're all important, but confession is one of the gifts that God's given us, one of the tools he's given us to help us put our flesh to death. Because there's nothing more, I think, our flesh hates than admitting it's wrong- jennifer:Well, it's humbling. Aaron:... or confessing its own failures and sins. But that confession to one another, the confession to my wife, that was a practice of killing my flesh, of saying, "I did this thing. I made this choice and it's going to hurt my wife when I tell her the truth and it's going to hurt our marriage when I tell her the truth." But in reality, that is exactly what I did before I said anything. So, right now I'm going to say it and tell it and repent of it because I want it to die. I want the pain to be seen. I want it to be felt. I want it to be known. I'm making it harder to do it in the future. Because when I get in this habit and practice of confession to my wife when I fail in this way, it makes it that much harder to do it next time because I think, "If I make this choice right now, I'm going to have to confess it." jennifer:Now I do want to note that in our marriage and in our experience, when there was confession there was a lot of emotion that erupted from- Aaron:From you? jennifer:... hearing it and being impacted by the weight of that knowledge. And so I guess my encouragement is that with the choice to confess, leave room and a place for a response and be okay with whatever response is shared. And for those listening where someone's confessing, be respectful in your response. We know that sin hurts and that these things are really uncomfortable to walk through. But if both parties can walk through it with grace and respect and love, a love for God, like, "I love God so much that I'm going to love you, Aaron, through this," if we can do that with faith, then we can get through the confession part and the reconciliation part. I don't know if I explained that very well. It's- Aaron:What you're saying is- jennifer:There's a sensitivity that we've got to have in recognizing that our sin hurts people, our spouse. Aaron:Well, and that's a part of the process, is it being revealed because then it's known and made known, and then the actual hurt that happened is actually happening rather than- jennifer:You see it. Aaron:... letting it fester underneath the surface. jennifer:Or avoiding it by hiding it. Yeah. Aaron:So, I've known many men that, they don't want to confess because they don't want to hurt their wife like that. And I think, "Well, you're already hurting them." jennifer:And it doesn't- Aaron:Worse, actually, by not saying anything. jennifer:And by doing it and by choosing it and it just gives the enemy a stronghold in your life when you don't expose it and drag it into the light. Aaron:And that's what we're going to do. Let's briefly talk about, before we get to a close, about protecting our children. Because this was a big part. We haven't talked about this at all. But when husband, wife, whoever is inviting this in the home, or both, God forbid, but that might be the case in some of these scenarios, when we bring it into the home it doesn't just affect us. It's actually going to affect our children. jennifer:And just to add on to this, we also wanted to bring up talking about protecting our children because earlier we mentioned how accessible pornography is and how we see it in today's culture everywhere, plastered everywhere. So, even if you're not bringing it into the home, even if you're not addicted to pornography, children- Aaron:There could be access. jennifer:Well, children are going to be exposed at some point. I think it's important to be on the same page with each other in how are we going to address this with our children? Aaron:Yeah. And I would just say first and foremost, we shouldn't be the ones bringing it into the home. We should not be the... Like I said, everything we just talked about before, we need to rid it from our lives. jennifer:Walk in purity. Aaron:Walk in purity. Walk in freedom. Which, by the way, will give us authority to be able to confidently speak to our children about this instead of being weak in our thoughts and ways of communicating about it. So, here's some ideas. Here's some things to consider with your kids. The first one is, talk to them about how to protect their bodies. jennifer:First, just that God created our bodies and that we have certain parts of our bodies that- Aaron:That are special. jennifer:... are special. Yeah. Aaron:That's kind of how at most ages you can say, "Hey, those are special. We don't talk about that. We don't do that." Teaching them about that, about their body parts and how to protect them. The second one is, teach them how to protect their eyes. And this is a thing that I'm constantly having to battle every day. It's something that I was never really taught. But we go everywhere and everyone's got a device. There's a TV. There's something on the radio. Constantly, nonstop. There's a commercial on YouTube. I mean, you name it. How do we teach our children- jennifer:How to have self-control. Aaron:Yeah. If you see something that makes you feel uncomfortable, then you should say something about it. Come talk to us. Or turn and look away, and you don't have to look at that thing. That's a big thing. I think a lot of people, they don't realize that they don't have to look. That's a big thing. jennifer:Another one is just being aware of their device time and not leaving them unattended. Knowing exactly what they've got access to, and just being really mindful of that. Aaron:Yeah. This world is wicked and we've just heard too many stories of a totally seemingly innocent show and something's in the middle of it and it's just not worth it. jennifer:On that note, when you go to friend's houses or family's houses, talking to your children about boundaries with other people's devices, so- Aaron:Even our devices. jennifer:... not looking over shoulders and not being quick to look at other people's devices. Aaron:Yeah. And that can be an awkward one because our kids are getting older and they have friends and, "Hey, look at this game I got. Hey." And totally innocent that we know of. But teaching our kids, "Hey- jennifer:Ask for permission. Aaron:... ask for permission. Don't just look at people's things." We even practice it at home. If I'm on my phone and my son comes up and looks over my shoulder, I put my phone down and I said, "Please don't look at my phone over my shoulder." Teaching them that it's not appropriate to just glance. You never know what someone's got on their device. And so we're just teaching them, "Don't just pick up someone's phone and use it. Don't just look at people's phones. Let's be careful." Another one is when the time is right, again, this is something you got to discern with your kids' maturity level- jennifer:Age appropriate. Aaron:Yeah. Age appropriate. Tell them about pornography. jennifer:And give them a way to handle it if they're ever exposed to it. So, what are those steps they're supposed to take? Are they supposed to come straight to you and tell you? Aaron:Yep. And then the last thing. Again, this is not an extensive list, but teach them about God's design for sexuality. jennifer:Put it in terms of a good, good gift. God has given us a beautiful gift for marriage and sex is a good thing. And- Aaron:Yeah. Growing up, we were under the impression that sex was a bad thing. jennifer:Yeah. "No, no, no. And we don't talk about it either." Aaron:But it's actually a good thing and it should be, in a healthy context and in a safe way, talked about. And we can just show them, "Hey, God designed this and it's a good thing, and it's meant for this purpose," and just get them excited about that aspect of their sexuality. So, those are some ideas we just wanted to share with you of how to help protect our kids from maybe things that we weren't protected from. Maybe not intentionally. I don't think I was ever intentionally exposed to anything. I found it. jennifer:Well, I mean, I think that we all know that there is an enemy out there and he knows that if he can get a stronghold in someone's life at an early age- Aaron:Early on. jennifer:... he's going to win. Aaron:He's one of the best marketers out there, for sure. jennifer:Yeah. So, hopefully that just encourages you guys today to be able to talk to your children about this topic and to make it at least more comfortable for them as they grow up to know that there's an open conversation with you as their parents to share about these types of things. I think that's really important. Aaron:To teach. jennifer:I hope we have that with our children. Aaron:Yeah. So, before we move on to the weekly challenge, which by the way, we'll probably have to give an update on last week's weekly challenge, I want to strongly encourage you listeners to ask God to search your heart, seek inside of you and see if there's any strongholds that you've allowed, any lies you have been believing. Man, I just want you to be free. I want you to walk in the freedom that I've been able to experience, that many believers for generations have been able to experience, knowing that Christ has truly set us free. Ask Him to show you where you have allowed yourself to remain in false bondage. jennifer:And I'm going to add to that and just encourage you guys that if you have been someone who has chosen sin in your marriage, I want to personally just urge you and encourage you to take part in the ministry of reconciliation with your spouse, recognize the hurt that has been caused, and search and ask God how you can repair that part of your marriage. Because it's so vital, you guys. The enemy wants nothing more than to destroy our marriages and it's our responsibility to walk righteously and love one another in marriage. And so I just want to encourage you with that. Aaron:Amen. Why don't you share the weekly challenge? jennifer:So- Aaron:Wait. How did we do with last week's weekly challenge? jennifer:Last week's challenge was great. We were supposed to dream together. And so we went on a date and we shared just- Aaron:We dreamed about potential, maybe future- jennifer:Business ideas. Aaron:... business ideas. jennifer:Which we're really good at throwing on the table. Aaron:Investment ideas. jennifer:We're really good at just, "Hey, what about this?" Aaron:The last episode was, we talked about money and investing and so we were talking about future- jennifer:It was on our minds. Aaron:... money investing. Yeah. jennifer:Yeah. It was really great though. It was good. We also talked about habits because Aaron got me onto a new book that I'm reading. Aaron:I like it. Yeah. Maybe we'll talk about it eventually. One day. jennifer:I think you mentioned it already. Aaron:Did I? jennifer:I Think so. Aaron:Oh, I might have. jennifer:What is it called? Aaron:It's just called Atomic Habits. jennifer:Atomic Habits. That's right. Okay. So, this week's challenge is, be intimate with each other every night for one week, even if you don't feel like it. It only takes a few minutes, maybe. Maybe a little bit more. Aaron:I'll just say what I was writing there is that it only takes a few minutes usually to get interested into it. jennifer:Oh. Well then. And I just want to add, intimate can be many different things. It could be an intimate conversation. It could be physical. It could be- Aaron:It means one thing for one person and it means another thing for another. I could tell you that much. But you- jennifer:We want to encourage you guys to just remember that intimacy in marriage is so vital, especially in light of what we're talking about today. So, be there. Initiate. Aaron:All right. jennifer:Have fun. Aaron:Let's end this in a prayer. Dear Lord, thank you for giving us freedom in Christ. Thank you for breaking the bonds of sin and death and for making it possible for us to walk with Jesus and be reconciled to you. You are so patient and kind to us. And it is that kindness that leads us to repentance. Lord, help us to walk in purity every day and to grow more and more sensitive to the wicked things of this world. Lord, we pray every husband and wife who may still feel enslaved to pornography and have believed the lie that they are, I pray that they would believe the truth and they are already free, that they can choose to walk in the freedom and purity you died to give them.Open their eyes to the truth. Convince them that your sacrifice, your spirit and your word are sufficient for us, and that we are transformed by the renewing of our minds. Renew us, transform us and make us more like your son, Jesus. Lord, tear down the stronghold that the enemy has over the porn industry, bring freedom and salvation to all those involved, and dissolve the influence it has in the church. Convict the hearts of those who continue to choose this sin and bring them to their knees before your throne. Lord, purify your church. In Jesus' name. Amen. jennifer:Thank you for joining us for another episode of the Marriage After God podcast. Aaron:If you found today's episode fun and encouraging, please take a moment to share it on social media or in an email to some of your married friends. jennifer:Also, would you please take a moment and leave us a review? Reviews help to spread the word about our podcast. Aaron:Be sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode. And you can always check out more of our resources at marriageaftergod.com. jennifer:You can follow us on social media for more marriage encouragement on Facebook and Instagram @marriageaftergod, @husband revolution and @unveiledwife. Aaron:We hope you have an incredible week and look forward to sharing more with you next week on the Marriage After God podcast.   Connect With UsInstagram | @marriageaftergodInstagram | @unveiledwifeInstagram | @husbandrevolutionCheck out our marriage resources!SponsorsGet our new book The Marriage Gift - 365 prayers for your marriage!

This episode is sponsored by our book  Marriage After GodThis is a great marriage resource for anyone or any couple that is looking for something meaty that will inspire and challenge a little. It is a book we wrote together that dips into our story but also gets the reader to search out “what is God doing in my marriage” This book also spends quite a bit of time on finances and marriage, so if you want to dive deeper into today's topic we strongly encourage you to pick up a copy if you have not already! Marriage After God will put you on the path to exploring what God’s purpose for your marriage is.Find it at amazon.com or shop.marriageaftergod.com READ TRANSCRIPT- Hi, and welcome to the "Marriage After God" podcast. - We're your hosts, Aaron and Jennifer Smith. - We have been married 15 years and have five sweet children who are growing up way too fast. - We love God and we love marriage. - And we love to be honest about it all. - Marriage is not always a walk in the park, but we do believe it has a powerful purpose. - So our goal here is to open up the conversation to talk about our faith and our marriage. - Especially in light of the gospel. - We certainly don't have all the answers, but if you stick around we may just make you laugh. - But our hope is to encourage you to chase boldly after God's purpose for your life together. - This is "Marriage After God". Welcome back to another episode of the "Marriage After God" podcast. I promise I don't have the giggles this time. So, if any of you were with us last week, I couldn't keep myself together, but here I am, feeling mostly composed. It's good because in today's episode we're gonna be talking about, breezing over a little bit. - Hitting a nerve, maybe? - Maybe striking a match and igniting a fire on a conversation with money investing in marriage. - So it's something serious, is what you're saying? - Hmm, a little more. It feels serious these days. - All right, well, today's episode is sponsored by our book "Marriage After God". This is a great resource for anyone or any couple that is looking for something meaty that will inspire and challenge a bit. It's a book that we wrote together, it dips into our story, but it also gets the reader to search out what is God doing in my marriage? This book spends quite a bit of time talking about finances and marriage, so if you wanna dive deeper into today's topic, we strongly encourage you to pick up a copy of our book, "Marriage After God". And you can get that at amazon.com, or shop.marriageaftergod.com. - So, in light of this topic of money, what was the inspiration? Why'd you wanna talk about this today? - Well, number one, I mean, money's like top of the list for when you're thinking about marriage, relational things. - The things that- - Stressors. - Cause strife in marriage. - Yeah. - Money's one of them. - Yeah, money's definitely one of them. Now you take that and put it in context to today's current situation. - Issues of- - Like what are we- - Money. - Experiencing. And I think it makes it very relevant. - Do you think that we have, like, some sort of special, like, training in this or? Nope. - It's not really our genre necessarily. We have talked about money a lot in the past because God's used it in our life, but I don't know, it seemed like a good idea to bring up because it's kind of on everyone's minds, it's right in front of us, kind of at every turn. Stuff that's going on the world. - I'll say this, if you're hoping to get some financial advice from today's episode, that's not what you're gonna find here. You'll find encouragement, you'll find maybe, hopefully, some inspiration, some spiritual inspiration to get you and your spouse talking about finances in marriage. But if you want something more, go check out Dave Ramsey or other resources, other podcasts that really, really get into the nitty gritty of finances. 'Cause this is more of just like, how does it relate to your marriage. - I mean, on some levels- - Which is important. - Quote unquote "financial advice", as in, encouraging them in the way to be thinking about it and- - Right. - And the usefulness of it. - We're just not giving direct, like, "You should go do this." - Yeah, and I actually, I wanna boldly and with asterisks disclaim that we're not financial advisors. And so, please don't walk away from this episode and go do something and say, "Aaron and Jen told me to do this." We're gonna share with you few things that we think about and things that we've walked through and things that we care about, and maybe you can learn something, but we're definitely not financial advisors. - Okay, not to take a total tangent here, but you said the word asterisk? - Asterisk, asterisk. - Okay, I had to look it up because my whole life, I said "astrik", like "astrik", I don't know why. When I see that little star, that's how I hear it, "astrik". But lately when I'm working with Elliot, like, on spelling and language arts, I'm constantly looking up words and I'm realizing, I'm saying things wrong. And so one of my words this week, Elliot turns to me, he goes, "Mom, why have you been saying "interragative"? It's "interrogative". I was like, hold on, let me Google it. - Interragative, interrogative. - Said that wrong all last year. - Oops. - Oops. - I'm sure there's a lot of words we've said wrong and continue to say wrong, but that's really funny. Okay, back to money. - Okay. - Okay, we're talking about money. So we've been married for 15 years and I feel like we've gone through quite a few different seasons of life, specifically when it comes to money. Like, just how our relationship to it, how much we've had, how little we've had. - Depending on our jobs or what we were doing. - Yeah, we've gone through and we- It's only been 15 years and I feel like we're now in a new season financially and it's just gonna keep doing this rollercoaster for the rest of our lives. - I think 'cause there's so many variables, there's so many things that affect finances and then there's us, who affect our finances. - Decisions we make. - How we decide to spend it and save it and all of that. - Our relationship to it. Which is kind of like what we kind of wanna talk about today, is a little bit of that relationship aspect with money. - Yeah. - And also talk about some stuff that we've been learning and doing and experiencing ourselves. So, we've been in seasons of debt. We've been in seasons of making very little, to no money at all. I'm immediately thinking about stories in our life of just sitting in my car and we have no money in our account. - Crisis, crisis. - To seasons of abundance where God's just allowed us to have access to more than we ever thought we could have. - Yeah. - And back and forth and everything between. But I feel like along the way, when I read this scripture in Philippians, when Paul talks about how God has taught him contentment in all circumstances. You know that verse that we all like to use that says, "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." The context of it is around how to be content when you have nothing or how to be content when you have a lot. And so the point of that scripture is that He gives us the strength to handle every circumstance we come into in our life, whether poor or rich, whether having a little or a lot. And that's what God's been teaching us is this idea of contentment in kind of every season. And they're hard in their own aspect in different ways, depending on what side you're on. - Well, this idea for this episode that we had in talking about finances in relation to marriage, I thought it would be cool if we just talked about a little bit of our foundation of how we think and view of money, how we've kind of built our foundation and marriage. Do you wanna share a little bit about like- - Yeah- - Where we've landed. - Maybe how we learned certain things. - Yeah. - Because we're, again, we're not experts, but we've been learning a lot of our life, but we also have a disposition, necessarily, to money. How we think about it. - Yeah, yeah. - Because of the way we're raised. I think our parents- - Yeah, for sure. - Did teach us on some level about money. Either they taught us directly about money by things they told us and showed us. But I think we learned a lot of our thoughts of money, probably what we saw in our parents. - And our own experience as we got older. Okay, money coming in, money going out, uh-oh more money's going out, wait a minute. So just basic- - Or dealing with credit. - Basic experience of money. But a lot of, like, the dialogue we've had about money in our marriage has been based on the Bible and, like, going to the Bible and saying, "Well, what wisdom is there in the Word that we can draw from?" I was thinking about this the other day when we were getting ready to do this episode, and just how thinking about our homeschool with the kids and what we want them to learn, 'cause we're always thinking ahead. And it's like, we really want them to understand money. And I wish we were taught this more in school. I wish there was a whole...maybe there was and I just missed it. - Well, we did have a- I had an economics class for just my senior year, is the only thing like- - But one year when you're on your way out. - Yeah, it was one year, but I can't remember there being anything about investing, anything about spending. - I mean, taxes, just think about taxes. There's should be- - Just that alone. - There should be a serious talk about that. But we were thinking about for our homeschool, like how can we incorporate these really important principles to teach our kids and give them a really strong foundation for then propelling them into adulthood for finances. - Well, and it would be valuable, 'cause I feel like we're learning stuff now that if we would've known it 20 years ago, we would've made probably significantly different decisions. But, it- - Here we are. - Yeah, we're here where we're at, we're learning, and I think everyone listening is in the same place. They look back over their lives, the decisions they've made financially, they can always pinpoint those, like, I shouldn't have spent that money or wish I would've saved here or I'm glad we saved, or did this, made this decision. So we're all in the same boat. - Well going back to, you know, the Bible's wisdom over money, we wanted to share a couple of those anchor verses that we kind of lean onto when we're making financial decisions. But I wanted to share with you guys a cool resource that we use when we're looking up stuff in the Bible, it's called openbible.info, and it literally says, "What does the Bible say about" and then it has a search bar for you to just fill in and it gives you all the verses in that topic and you can even search by Bible- - Translation. - Version, yeah. So it's pretty cool. - Yeah, and these scriptures, like we said, a lot of the way we think about money, we try and go back to the Bible and say, okay, "What does God say about money?" And having God's perspective on it, 'cause it does help us. It doesn't mean we've made all the right decisions, but even when we make wrong decisions, we can easily look back and be like, "Well, that's probably 'cause we were unwise in this way, or that's probably 'cause we didn't follow this principle." So one of them is 1 Timothy 6:10. It says, "For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil. It is through the craving that some have wandered away from the faith and pierced themselves with many pangs." So when I was reading through this scripture for this episode, the first thing I wanted to point out is I feel like this is probably one of the most misquoted scriptures. Often people say money is evil specifically, or money is the root of evil, but that's not what this is saying. - Because money's just like a- It's a piece of paper, it's like nothing, right? - Yeah, money is an in inanimate object, it cannot be sinful or good or bad, it's just a thing. - It's not the money that's doing it, it's what is inside of us. - It says, "For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil." So this isn't even the main root, this is just one of the roots that could be a root of all kinds of evil is when we have love for money. - Well, a root supports, like, a stem of a plant that grows bigger and so if you think about it, it's like when you have the love of money and you're thirst for it and your greed- - Some bad things are gonna grow out of that. - Oh many, not just one serious thing, but like you're gonna have- - Yeah. Well, and the Bible talks a lot about fruit, good or bad fruit, so talking about- If we love money, if we have a love for money, it becomes that root and then the fruit that's gonna come out of that is gonna be bad fruit. And so I just wanted to point that out, as this is saying the love of money, this is something that's happening inside of our hearts, our disposition toward money. Do we see money as our God? Do we see money as our savior? - Our reliance. - Do we see money as our protection? - Yeah, security, all of those things. - And then I love that it says, "It is through this craving that some have wandered away from the faith and pierced themselves with many pangs." One of the things that Jennifer and I have learned is anytime we've overstretched ourselves to try and do something, to get more money, we try and start businesses, we try- We end up having more pangs. We're like, "Man, I wish we just would've been fine where we were at." And that's something that we've had to feel that pain several times in our lives for different little things. But that's a true thing, if we have a love for money it's gonna have us wander away from the most important thing in our life, which is our faith, which is our trust and reliance on Christ, to who-knows-what? I mean, you fill the blank. - At minimum it distracts us, for sure. - At minimum, yes. - All right, another one is Matthew 6:24. "No one can serve two masters, for either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and money." - Yeah. - Every time I've read this in my past, especially growing up, I always just thought, it's so interesting that it's talking about two masters, and then at the very end it says, "You cannot serve God and money." Like, he was talking about money the whole time, what? - Yeah, the two masters, one is God and one's money. - Interesting. - And actually the word money there, it's a Greek word "mammon", which is like a god. It was like a god of wealth, a god of riches. And so Matthew's pointing out, you know, from the words of Jesus, like, we can't serve God and serve- Like, going back to 1 Timothy, that love of money. That pursuit of, "I just need more, I need more, I need more," at that point where we're not serving God anymore. - Well, if you think about all the things that start to change when you go in a certain direction or when you serve a master, your intentions change, your motivations change, your goals change. - Well, and I've felt seasons of this where I can feel myself, like, all I can focus on is making sure we have enough money and I have to, like- I'm constantly brought to my knees and saying, "God, this is so much on my mind. This is such a draw for me, it takes so much energy to do this." And there's also that thought, like, I wish I didn't have to worry about that. And we just do this over here, but we also need money. So it's a part of life. - I know this isn't like a part of our notes, but as you're just mentioning that, how do you also carry that weight of responsibility for your family? Because you're saying in one hand, like, you don't wanna be consumed and chase after that need to have to, like, provide, but then there's this responsibility aspect where it's necessary, and so what's the balance? - I'm gonna be honest, it stresses me out sometimes. - I'm sure you're not the only one. - I'm sure there's a lot of husbands listening that feel the same way that there's this constant, like, "Well, I can't just go be a missionary. I gotta pay my bills, I gotta take care of my family." You know what, that is a ministry. We talk about this in our book, this idea of money as a tool rather than, you know, our pursuit. Like the thing that we're trying to obtain. Because yeah, that's a really good question and it's a- - There's tension. - Absolutely requires me to seek God and ask for help a lot because I feel like I go in this ebb and flow where I feel like I'm pushing too hard to make sure finances are right or growing or being invested well, and then I could feel like I don't push hard enough and I'm like, "Man, I should have been working harder." So that's a good question and I think it's one that all the men listening are shaking their heads here right now, like, I am. - I'm sure they appreciate that. Okay, so the next one is Romans 13:8. "Owe no one anything, except to love each other, for the one who loves another has fulfilled the law." - I love this one because it- - We share this one a lot. - We have shared this one a lot, especially on this idea of getting out of debt. Because I do believe that believers should have a mentality and a posture towards money that we don't love debt, that we don't keep debt, that our lifestyle isn't like, "Hey, I'm just going to spend and consume," but that we conserve and we are content and we use less. And so we use this verse in that sense of, "Owe no one anything," the only thing we should owe people is our love to each other in the church and in the world. But there's debt sometimes, and we're gonna talk about it a little bit, if we have a debt-free mentality, even though we may have debt, it does change a lot of things in the way we operate in this world. So I do believe our goal should be to be debt-free as much as we can, and to definitely avoid consumer debt. But I think the main focus of this verse is that we owe love to each other. And so that is the main focus of this verse is what we owe to each other is our love for each other. - Cool. Just digging in a little bit more into this idea of living a debt-free lifestyle, and just personally, Aaron, I feel like when we got into our marriage, you came with this foundation of no debt, like, debt's not good. And you had this understanding of it. Was there something that inspired that in you other than the Word or? - Well, I believe- If you remember, like, we talked about this. I had a lot of debt, you had some debt before we got married, but you paid it off before we even got married. - Yeah, it was like a couple hundred dollars, I think. - Yeah, but when we're young, that feels like a lot. - Yeah, it was a lot. - And I had, you know, tens of thousands of dollars in- - School loans. - School loans, which felt like a lot. And what happened was, we were trying to be missionaries and we were living on almost no income, you know, volunteering for this organization. - And when we were doing that, your loans were deferred, so we didn't have the responsibility to pay them yet until one day it was like, oh. - I'm gonna have to pay these now. - Wow, this is reality, yeah. - Yeah, so from being able to live off of almost nothing to all of a sudden, I have to pay this pretty large bill, to us back then, it was huge, it was like couple hundred bucks a month, which would've been a big deal from us living off of very little to nothing. And we realized like, man, we should probably go home and just get rid of this debt. Let's just go get jobs, let's go work, and let's work hard and let's do everything we can. - We worked really hard to get out of that debt. It's not an easy thing, like, when we encourage you guys and you hear us say, "Live a debt-free lifestyle," we know it's hard, we know it's easier said than done, we know we know what it takes, and I just- - It was painful. - Wanted you to hear that. It's a painful experience. - So I would say that's where we came from. There was this, I believe, a Godly motivation to get free from the debt so that we can be free to do more of what God has for us. I believe that's what we were feeling. And so we did that, and because of that, I don't know if everyone knows this, but this ministry that we have now all was invented in that same season of getting out of debt, almost like right at the end of paying off our debt, this ministry was born. And I feel like we didn't have that plan, we had no idea that this ministry was gonna be a thing when we started getting out of debt, we just knew that God wanted to use us. And we knew that the debt was something that could hold us back. And so we're like, okay, "Let's just get rid of this while we can," it was really hard. I remember us having lots of arguments, conversations, tears, around like- - Lots of tears. - Not being able to do what other couples our age were doing, not being able to have pots and pans, not being able to have- Like, I remember these conversations, but in reality, it was a very short season, it was a couple years I think. - It's way gone now. - It's way in the past and man, we look back on that and we're like, we're so thankful that we took that initiative. And it may not be everyone's story, but some of the things that we've learned along the way, and that we share with people, is this way of thinking about debt, not getting into more of it, not spending more than you have, all those things are very important, Dave Ramsey talks about it and the Bible talks about how we should be with our money. So I would say it wasn't our idea, but it was a cool journey that we got to go through in the early part of our marriage. - Yeah. - Together. - Cool. Well, I'm gonna turn the dial on this conversation slightly. I guess it still kind of has to do with debt, but more so- - It's more so our country's debt. - Our country's debt. Yeah. - We're gonna talk a little bit about inflation because it is affecting everyone right now. And I mean, if I could just come right out and say, I'm so sorry, I'm so sorry everyone. It's hard, it's hard to go through marriage when the world kind of seems unstable and- - Yeah. - Challenging. - Jennifer asked me, you asked me at the beginning of this episode before we started, you said, "What do you want to get out of this episode?" - Yeah. - 'Cause we always ask ourselves, what do we want for you, the listener. And I was like, I just want them to know it's okay, that we're all in the same boat, and that these things are gonna happen in the world and that our money and our finances and our wealth are not our security, they're just not. And so we're talking about these things to just remind us that our security is in Christ alone, that this is not our home and that we can trust Him and rely on Him, and we can know that, let's just try and do the next right thing, let's try and walk in His wisdom, let's make changes. So that's kind of what I wanna get out of this episode and that's one of the reasons we're talking about inflation is because it's a real thing and it does affect everyone pretty much equally across the board. So just a quick overview, what's happening in the world right now, at least in the United States, but it's kind of happening in the whole world, but I'm just gonna talk about some of the stats that we have here in the US. Inflation essentially is the depreciation of the dollar. So we have a $1 bill and we think it's worth a dollar, but in reality it's not worth a dollar because what that dollar could buy 20 years ago and what that dollar can buy today, not the same things. So here's some quick stats for you based off of the inflation percentages over the last several years. From 2012 to 2020, the average is probably about 2.3, 2.1. You know, we have a 1.7% increase, 1.5, a 2.1. But in 2021, you can- I have a graph on this page, babe, do you see that? - Yeah, I see it. - So from 2020- - Shoots straight up. - It's 1.4%, 1.4% inflation, 2021, 7%. - Crazy. - 2022, 8.3%. Those are huge numbers. And these are average numbers, these aren't, like, to take into account, you know, the cost of milk, or the cost of gas or the- We're all thinking about the thing that costs more to us now and we're like, "Oh my goodness." According to the US Bureau of Labor Statistics, $100 in 2016, okay, could buy you what now costs $123. That's a 23% increase, on average, on goods and services. That's huge. In what? Five years, six years, barely. That's a big jump and that affects us. Like, we don't think about this, but that actually affects us. - Because it's accounted for over everything, it's not just one thing, right? - Oh yeah. - It's also- I mean, think about gas. - Oh. Gas prices. - Since just the last year or two, it's been- - Well for us, like, we don't have the best economic vehicle for gas, we never had to usually think about it 'cause gas prices for a long time were pretty decent. The average price in 2020 was 2.25, but even at one point it was a $1.90, like, that was so low back in the day. And that was only in 2020. - Back in the day. Yeah. I was looking this up and it says today's average gas price across the nation is 3.70. I just don't believe that, we're paying 4.80 here in Bend and I just- Other places are higher, but 3.70 is the national average. - Okay. - But that's still more than a dollar and a half- That's a dollar and a half more in two years. - That's a lot of fuel, or a lot of- - That's a lot of money. - Money. For fuel. So is this because of the last two years in COVID and everything? - Those things are part of it, I'm not gonna, again, I'm not a economist, I should say. - Okay. - But things like COVID, it did have an effect on this because of how we printed money. If you don't understand this, how this works, the government can print money, and so we print our dollars, we print our tens, our twenties, our hundreds. They can also create money in other ways. And a lot of the inflation that we have now is because- This is kind of crazy, and this is according to nasdaq.com, over 80% of all available money that's been printed or created, has happened in the last two years. That's not a joke. - I don't even understand what you're saying right now. - It's crazy, I'm looking at another graph, and we can see from 1950 all the way to 2020 and there's this steady incline and in 2010, there was a pretty steep incline. But then from 2020 to 2022, it just looks like a knife going straight up out of the ground and the amount of money that we've created. So we think about the COVID Relief Bill and they printed just trillions of dollars to give out to people. And that was great for people that needed it, but now that money's gone and everything costs more. So because we got that little bit of relief then, it's actually hurting us now in a big way and it's actually gonna hurt our kids and our grandkids. A lot of this inflation's caused by, the simplest way to put it, too much money chasing too little resources. So that's just what happens when there's a lot of money and there's very little stuff to buy. All those things that we buy on a normal basis become way more expensive. I know I'm being very basic and there's probably people that are way smarter than me thinking, "Oh, he doesn't even know the half of it," but all I know is inflation's here and I don't know how long it's gonna last and it affects us all. - I'm sure we surprised our listeners today 'cause we don't usually draw in statistics or graphs. - Sometimes, yeah. But we think about a lot of these things. There's a lot of things that we discuss with our friends and in our personal life that we don't always bring up, but we care about and we think about, and we consider and it- Yeah, I wanna bring up another little story. We built this house. But we actually planned on building this house in 2020 and we were really close to closing on a piece of property to build this house and we backed out of it because of everything happening in the markets. And we thought, you know, we have no idea what's going on. We don't know what's gonna happen with all the prices of goods. - We were about to have our baby, Edith. - We were about to have a baby and we just canceled it. And we're like, we'll wait. Now, in hindsight it would've been better to do it then than it was to do it now because all the things that we feared happening then were affecting us now. - All the resources, all the material. - The cost of materials skyrocketed for us, which they wouldn't have back then. - Yeah, that was hard. - But again, it's all hindsight. Can't see the future. - Yeah. - So we just tried to do the wisest thing we could do in that moment and that's what we did. And I don't regret it, but at the same time I look back and say, "Oh, well the things we were worried about, we were a little early on." Yeah. Okay, so with all of this information you just shared about inflation, what can the couples listening do to talk about it? How does one talk about finances in light of world stage stuff? Like, what do we do? - Yeah, what have we done? I was gonna ask you- - What do I do? - What do we do? - We talk about it. Even when we don't really understand everything, every aspect, we try to, we try and dig in and, you know, look at the news and talk to friends, like you said. - There's been a lot of prayer. - A lot of prayer. - Because, how many times I just pray, "God, I have no idea what to do, please help me. We can't fix this." - Something that's really encouraged me is we reassure one another to trust in the Lord. And that's always helpful for me, 'cause I tend to be more of a fearful- Or, you know, I get anxious thoughts and stuff, and so reminding each other to rely on the Lord is really important. - Yeah, and it's something that is gonna remind us. I think we talked about, in episode one of this season, about how sometimes we can look in hindsight and just see so clearly all the decisions we made and think, "Why did we make those decisions? Why didn't we make this decision?" - Right. - And we kind of like judge ourselves on like, "Oh, we failed," or "We did all this bad stu-" or, "We didn't make any good decisions." Reminding each other that we did try with the knowledge we had in the situations we were in. - Right. - To make wise decisions. - Yeah. - We did try. - Yeah. - And also, hey, sometimes there was decisions we made and let's learn from it rather than just keep kicking ourselves down. - Right. Yeah, that's good. And then there's things that we can do. So in the talking about it, like, "Hey, what is happening in our finances?" There's also the talking about what can change or what can be done to help relieve some of those pain points- - I drive way more, because- - No. - Oh wait, I mean- - Drive way less. - Drive way less, because gas prices. - This is a serious conversation, and I know it's hard, but, like, what sacrifices can be made? What things can be done that you weren't doing that could help the situation of finances? You know, maybe it's taking a break from some extracurricular thing or putting things on pause for a little bit that maybe you'd like to do, but now's not a good time. - Yeah, we talked about, a few seasons ago, date night ideas because we were big advocates on regular date nights, but with money being tight, regular date nights in the way we may usually do it, going to dinner or doing something like that, may not be appropriate. - We actually took a break for a good chunk of months. - I feel like we- - For a while. - For like a year. It wasn't a year. - No, but it felt like it. - It was for a while. - Yeah, taking breaks from maybe dates that cost money. - Swapping babysitters with friends. - Yeah, swapping baby- That that's another thing, babysitters cost money. And so swapping with friends, but just getting creative with our lifestyle is a big deal to address the issue of not having enough money in a certain season. - Yeah. - So a verse that we can remember, it's a verse in 1 Timothy where Paul's talking to Timothy about how he addresses certain people in the church, but there's a principle here that we can glean from. It's in 1 Timothy 6:17, it says, "As for the rich, in this present age, charge them not to be haughty, nor to set their hopes on the uncertainty of riches, but on God who richly provides us with everything to enjoy." And so he's talking to Timothy about like, "Hey, there's wealthy people in the church, encourage them with this." But I wanna put this out there that if we live in America, now I know that everyone's on varying levels of wealth or income, but we're very fortunate to live in a country that has free commerce and we can start businesses and we can invest and we're still currently fairly free people and we're wealthy in many other ways than just money. And I wanna remind us of that, and especially as believers, guys, we are rich in Christ. We are rich in God and we need to remember that. And we're not to put our hope in the uncertainty of riches, of money, of gaining more and more and more. It is not our strong tower. In the proverbs that says that a fool sees his riches as his strong tower. They're not. Having a little or a lot of money is not what keeps us, it's Christ that keeps us. And that's what his encouragement here is, is that let's put our hope on God who richly provides us with everything to enjoy. - So when we say things like, "Put our hope in God," or, "Put our trust in God," that's not, like, something that we just wake up every day and say, "Okay, my hope's in God," and then carry on with the things we like to do for entertainment or go have fun. - Yeah, just keep going and not changing at all. - So like there is that tension of saying my hope and trust is in the Lord, but I still have all these responsibilities and job. - Yeah. - And, you know, gotta work hard to do and provide. - Well, I put that in the category of testing God. We're told never to test the Lord, not to put Him to the test. So it's like, "I trust God, therefore I'm just gonna rack up my credit card and not worry about it, and He'll figure it out." No, it's, "I'm gonna walk in wisdom because my hope's in God. These things that I crave and desire, I'm gonna say no to because I can't afford them and I don't need them 'cause my hope's in God, I can make these changes that feel really hard and painful and scary, but my hope and trust is in God," I think that's more what it's talking about. - Yeah, yeah, okay, just clarifying. So were you on Mark 4:19? - Yeah, there's another verse in the parables of the seed in the soil. The Sower and the Seed, in Mark 4:19. Verses 18 and 19, actually. It says, "And others are the ones sown among the thorns. They are those who hear the Word, but the cares of the world and the deceitfulness of riches and the desires of other things enter in and choke the Word and it proves unfruitful." This is another danger and a principle on when it comes to money and the cares of the world, is that when we focus on that only, we're being deceived because riches are deceitful, they come and they go, the proverbs say. As fast as it's here is as fast as it's gone. So if we're looking forward to that next, like, "Oh, all we need is this," then we've forgotten that we're to rely on every word that comes out at the mouth of God for our sustenance, for our security, for everything we need. And so that Word that's trying to work in us, God's Word that's trying to work in us, it can be choked out by us just having our eyes on our cares, on our worries, on seeking after money and the desires of all the things that we crave in this life, and it chokes it, it chokes it out. And then that Word can't produce fruit in our lives. So if all we're focusing on is the inflation, oh my goodness, the gas prices, oh my goodness. If those are the only thing that we're worried or caring about, then we're gonna forget what God might be trying to do inside of us right now through this season. - All right, so this next question is for our listeners. How do we keep marriage thriving under financial burden or strain? So when there is that weight of expectation and responsibility and just, ugh. - Tightness of things? - Yeah, how does a marriage keep going? What do we do? - I think on a very simple level, we ask each other questions. - Yeah. - So we meet each other face-to-face, we talk. We kind of already touched on that earlier, but, like, we ask even just, "How are you doing?" and giving each other the room to comfort each other, to encourage one another. We ask, "What can we do about it?" What can we do about this thing that we're under the weight of? - Yeah, the what can we do about it, I know the men, we like to jump on- - Solutions. - Hey, let's do the solutions- - Let's fix it. - But as a man, jumping off your last question to me about how do I deal with trying to not overdo it pursuing finances, and then trusting God and pursuing Him. - Yeah. - I really appreciate it when you ask me how I'm doing with these things. When you recognize that, that is a heavy weight. And I know that there're probably some of you listening that the wives also bring in money and that's very common these days, and to be honest, me and you, we work together, so the money comes from both of us, but the burden of managing it is on my shoulders. - Yeah. - And when you recognize that, when you know that I'm constantly thinking about that and, like, trying to figure out what we're gonna be doing and how we're gonna take care of it and manage all these things, I do appreciate that. - Cool. - So I think that's a good question to ask your spouse, whoever you know might have that burden on their shoulders. - Cool. - Yeah. - I think a follow up to that is, what else can I do that would help alleviate stress in another area, because I might not be able to take this huge weight off your shoulders right now. - Right. - But is there another area of your life- Like, can I go clean and organize your garage for you? Or can I- - You can absolutely go clean and organize my garage. - I'm just saying, like, let's put eyes and hearts on what can we do to minimize some of the other stress points in life, because when it's hard enough to handle one thing, all the other things do the compound effect and that's hard. - I think, and I don't know if this goes for everyone, but for our situation, for our relationship, I know that there are things that are on your mind. We were just talking about it tonight, about all the things in our life that we need done. - Yeah. - And not that you can't bring them up and remind me and say, "Hey, we have things to do. We got a list, let's, you know, figure out a way to chip at it," like we talked about in the last episode, pace, about slowly, you know, chipping away at stuff. Recognizing that there might be a heavier load that I need to bear and not, like, heaping stuff on top of it. - Ah. - And I'm not trying to beat around the bush, I'm just saying, I think other husbands might feel that way of, like, because there's all these other things sometimes the way we might respond is, I'm anxious and I'm overwhelmed so I'm gonna dump all this stuff I'm overwhelmed with on my spouse, because I want them to help me figure it out or I need help. And then forgetting that they also have a bunch of things that they're stressed and overwhelmed about that they may not be saying anything. So just being aware of that and- - I think that's really good. - Communicating well. - I think it's good for me to hear that. - Evaluating what's necessary. - Yeah. - And saying, "Hey, how can I make the load-" Like you said, "How can I make the load less?" - Yeah. That's really good. Cool, well, I think another important aspect to all of this is just understanding that we both make mistakes, especially when it comes to money. And when both people, you know- - You mean like the paintball gun I bought once 'cause I just really- - Okay, that was a long time ago, I'm not holding that against you. But yes, he did do that once when we had no money. - Not that buying paintball gun's bad, but I shouldn't have bought it then. - It was bad timing. When we have access to funds, like, there's times that we make mistakes or we make a purchase that maybe we shouldn't have, and I just wanna encourage us to be people of humility and recognizing that none of us are perfect and it's something that we can all walk through with grace. - Yeah. - And say, "Okay, well we shouldn't have done that, but let's move on." What do you always say? Do the next right thing? - Yeah, let's do the next right thing. - How do we reconcile this? - Yeah. That's a good point. And we've been talking about this a lot, and again, instead of kicking ourselves for past mistakes, let's practice learning from them and say, "Okay, we did make that mistake. We're gonna admit it, but we're gonna let it teach us." - Yeah. - Because that's so much better than just self-loathing or self-defeat. - Yeah. - Learning from our mistakes is what, I believe, God would want for us, is to grow. - Yeah. - I'd say there's one more powerful aspect to marriage that I wanna bring up that can really help carry you guys through a stressful time with finances, and that's understanding the power of your unity in marriage because when you start to blame each other or pinpoint, "Oh, this debt is your fault," or, "This problem is your fault." - Yeah, teamwork. - Or, "This decision is your fault," it just starts to crumble from there, and I know that from experience, 'cause I did this to Aaron back in the early days of our marriage and I blamed him for a lot of the burden, the financial burden, that was on us. But what I realized is when we can team up and work together, no matter who's at fault, 'cause that part doesn't matter. the part that matters now is that you're one and that you're working together to get out from under it. That's what works, there's power in that. - Well, and isn't that the verse in Ecclesiastes? - Yes, yes, go read chapter four. - Two are more profitable. - Yep. - Jennifer brought up that we're gonna talk about cryptocurrency- - Sorry, we ran out of time. - Yeah, no, we're gonna talk about it real quick. And here's why I'm bringing it up. So, cryptocurrency or stocks or investing, real estate. I just wanna mention, I know not everyone's in a place that they might be in to be able to invest. You maybe don't have a lot of extra cash, liquid cash. I just want y'all to know that to have a mindset of investing long term, whatever that looks like, is a very good thing, I think. - You're not saying it has to be crypto, you're just saying- - No. - In general, long term investing. - And this is why I say this. - What can be done? Yeah. - There are things that we have invested in over the years, little bit here, or a lot, you know, whenever we could, that I'm looking at now that are very helpful. - Yeah. - In this season where things are tighter. Not that I wanna just go liquidate things, but I could if I needed to. - Yeah. - So I'm just putting that wisdom out there that having that mindset of putting a little bit somewhere, not just in a savings account that's yielding you 0.0001% - It's like that legacy living. - Yeah, it's thinking longer term than just tomorrow. - Yeah. - Which is not, again, I did not get taught this necessarily growing up, I didn't get taught this in school. That's why we're bringing it up, cryptocurrency. - Okay, but cryptocurrency, 'cause you were saying that in general, but cryptocurrency, some people, this is their first or second time hearing this word and they're like, "What are you talking about? What does this have to do with marriage?" - Well, they're gonna hear about it more and more over the years. They just are, it's gonna become more and more mainstream. I learned about cryptocurrency for the first time back in 2015, 2016, I was- - You'd come home all excited, I'm like, I don't know what you're talking about. - I was consulting with some dudes, they were really cool guys, and they had a Bitcoin mining machine, okay. I still don't actually know what they do, but I heard about it back in 2015. If I would've invested back in 2015- - That's a whole other story. - But that's- - Shoulda, woulda, coulda. - Shoulda, woulda, couldas. But I learned about it then, but it wasn't until 2020 that I really- - Yeah, 'cause there was this huge crash in the markets. - Yeah. - And then you started kind of- - I'll get there in a second. I'll get there in a second. - Hold on, I gotta explain. Aaron's got this very research nature about him and when he gets excited about something he dives all in and he can't stop or shut off his brain until he understands that thing and say, okay- - Only a few things. - Okay, things you really care about. - So real quick, cryptocurrency, it's a digital currency in which transactions are verified and records maintained by a decentralized system using cryptography. Again, stuff that I don't really know about. Rather than being a centralized authority. So our currency that we have, the US Dollar, is managed by the United States, a centralized authority. Cryptocurrency is managed by lots of people- - All over the world. - Lots of computers, all over the world. So it's decentralized. And that's essentially the idea of what cryptocurrency is. And cryptocurrency is built on this idea of a thing called blockchain. Blockchain is a system in which a record of transactions made in Bitcoin, or another cryptocurrency, are maintained across several computers that are linked in peer-to-peer network. - Simplify. - Essentially, again, I'm learning all this this stuff as I go, it's a ledger. It's like this, if you think about, like a spreadsheet. Just with line items, columns. But it lasts forever. - Okay. - And so imagine- - It's a record. - It's a record. So imagine this, I give you $1 bill. It's a freshly printed dollar bill. Now imagine if you can keep a precise record of every hand that dollar bill passes through. - So you give that dollar to me for something- - And it remembers me and it remembers you. - And then I pass it off to someone else and it keeps going. - But it also keeps track of what it was spent on, when it was spent on, where it was spent on, And so on, forever. - Hold on, doesn't that scare you a little bit? - It's terrifying. But this is the future of money. This is where money is going. Almost every government in the world is planning on doing some form of digital currency. The United States is already working on a digital dollar and there's already 10,000 or so cryptocurrencies in the world being traded currently. So, the reason we're sharing all this with you is because it's something that I've been passionate about for the last few years. Again, I'm not telling you what to do, don't say, "Aaron told me to go buy cryptocurrency," but I do think you should be considering investing a little bit, if you can, somewhere. That's something you should think about and pray about. - I'll say this as a wife, like, we've had some really interesting conversations about cryptocurrency. - Yes, we have very. - Very interesting. - But it's been something that we've been having fun learning about together. - Yeah. - But some processes I wanna put in your plate when it comes to this idea of investing. Before we decide to put money anywhere, let alone crypto, what have we done? - We talk about it for a long time. - Together. - We talk about it. - Yeah. - We go through all the pros, cons. - Yep. - This, that, I don't understand, wait a minute. - And then we agreed about it, we agreed on something. We said, "We're going to do X." - Yeah. - "We're going to invest this." Thirdly, we made sure to use expendable funds. - So this was stuff that if all went haywire and we lost, it wouldn't put us in a position that put our family at risk of financial ruin. - I didn't take all of our paychecks and dump it into this and like, "Oh, we can't buy food." So, those are some principles to consider when thinking about investing in anything. Are you talking about it? Have you made a plan? Do you have available funds that you are willing, this is the keyword, are willing to lose? - Yeah. And do research, like just- - Yeah. - You gotta, you can't just rely on someone else's word, but, like, really dig in and see what everybody's word is on it. - This is a famous term- - Do what you can. - All the articles I read on trading, it always says do your own research. - Yeah. - 'Cause no one wants be liable. for your trade and you lose money, I don't wanna be liable for that either. So do your own research. Just some things to know about cryptocurrency, specifically. - More stats? - It's extremely volatile. - Oh. - So it's like, it's not like the stock market where you're dropping like 10%, 5%, and then you're going up 10%, 5%, 2%. This is like, you can go up 10000% or you could drop 100%. And it's like that, it's crazy, it's like the Wild West. So just know that, do your research. Also, if you are gonna get into cryptocurrency, get in to it for the technology rather than the means to get rich. So understand, whatever that currency you're looking at, what its purpose is, what does it do? - What Aaron's saying, these blockchains that they're built upon- - They're technologies. - They're technology and they're actually used for- - Well, some of them, not all of them. - Some of them are used for other things. - But some of them are very useful, very smart. Here's some quick stats for you, just because you're probably thinking like, "Okay, what's this deal with cryptocurrency?" - More so, they're like, "How long is this episode?" - In 2016, there were 5 million people worldwide who owned crypto, this year there's now more than 320 million. - That's crazy. - People, worldwide who own cryptocurrency. That's a 6300% increase. From 2016 to today. 13% of the US owns crypto, that's a pretty big chunk, it's over 10%. - I was thinking that there's still a lot of people that aren't in it. - Well, there is, there's still, you know, 87%. So, here's some stats on the owners of cryptocurrency, 63% are male, 37% female, 72% aged under 34. So again, we should always take note of like, what are the young generation, what are they investing in, engaging in? - What are they interested in? - What are they interested in? 71% have a bachelor's degree or higher. - Okay. - How crazy is that? - Yeah. - I didn't know that. The average crypto owner earns about 25,000 per year. Also crazy. So these are just some average stats across the whole board. Again, not everyone earns money. But so, we just wanted to bring that up because that's something that we've been interested in. It has been on some levels a blessing to us and it's been fun to learn, and it's a pretty awesome thing to be learning about. - But more than that- - Researching. - You really believe that the future has crypto in its, like- - Yes, I do. - Within reach, it's like- - Especially if you read the Bible. I look at it and say, okay, this plays into all the things that I consider- - Interesting. - When it comes to world events. - Is that another episode that we need to flesh out? - I feel like we did an episode last season I think, on end times stuff. So again, we know that not everyone has a lot of money to invest, but there are ways to invest, maybe not in crypto, maybe not in real estate, but, you know, you could put $100 here, or $10 there into something that's going to grow. Maybe that's a friend's business. Maybe you have a friend that wants to start a candle business or a soap making business, or, who knows, a crocheting business. Maybe say, "Hey, can I help you a little bit?" And, you know, work out something with them. Another good way to invest is in yourself. This is a note that you put down I thought was really good about getting out of debt. - Living a debt-free lifestyle, yeah. - Yeah, living- - That's a huge investment. - It is, 'cause imagine if you, so you have this, let's say you have a $100 payment on a credit card. You get rid of that credit card, now you have $100 more dollars in your bank account. That's a pretty good investment in my opinion. So, investing in your family and yourself in that way is a pretty awesome thing to chip away at debt. - All right, well, I think we've spent a long in-depth time on this topic and I'm really grateful for it. We've had a lot of good conversation in our own marriage about finances and it's helped me grow to understand more about the world of money, and so we just wanna be an encouragement to you guys listening to go home and talk about it with your spouse. Maybe if you need to re-listen to this episode with them, alongside them, it would be a really great way to, like we said in the beginning, ignite that fire of conversation and just see where each other's at, see where each other are at, and evaluate your finances. Be willing to talk about the hard things, ask each other, "How are you doing?" Or, "How can I help alleviate this stress that you've been experiencing?" Even if it's in another area of marriage, because all these things matter. - And then be asking yourself, which is why we brought up cryptocurrency is, as a family, how can we be thinking for the future? How can we be preparing so that our kids- - Yeah. - May be better off than we are and leaving that legacy of understanding of finances and how to use it. - Well, when we understand finances and we use wisdom, we become a light in this world and people take notice and they wanna know how are you doing that thing? Or why are you doing it like that? And our answer is God. And therefore we become a light in this world and we become good stewards of what He's entrusted to us. So, all good things. - Last note. - We can't keep going. - Have to. That's why we care about money, not because we love money, but because we know how God can use it. - Yep. - And, like we say in our book, it's a tool to be used for God's glory. - Amen. - So. - Very good. - Challenge. - Okay, moving on. Weekly challenge. First of all, I just wanna let everyone know, 'cause it's a cliff hanger. We did the challenge from the last two weeks and so we didn't get to go do a pickle ball because we got hit with some major fires here in Central Oregon. - And there's tons of smoke. - And it's just really bad outside. I've even had a headache from it, but we did do a game, we played Boggle. - Boggle. I've never played it before. - Yeah, and we'll never say who won. Moving right along, Aaron won. We played a couple of rounds of that. - It took us a couple rounds to figure out how to play it. We're like, "This game doesn't make any sense." - It's a good two player game, it was fun. - It was. - And then we worked out together. We did some lifting. - Little 20 minute, little quick, little workout. - Some rowing, it was great. - So we did it. So this week's challenge is dream together about something you both love and enjoy, or about future business ideas or whatever it is that you guys just- What's a dream you have together that you guys can be discussing and figuring out? - Yeah, a simple question to answer is, what is something that excites you about next year? - Oh, that's a good point. - Yeah. - Yeah, the prospect of cheaper gas, hopefully. - So this can be setting a goal or dreaming, it doesn't really mean it has to happen, it's just being creative with one another. Aaron and I like to do this from time to time, we dream about our retirement plan, which- - Which is not really a retirement plan. - We don't know if it'll ever happen, but it does involve donuts. - It does actually. You just gave our secret away. - I know, because why not? - Yes, our retirement plan does involve donuts. - Okay, also, if you have the "Marriage After God" book, or your planning on getting it, you can read through or skim chapter 13 together if you want, because it's all about dreaming together. - All about dreaming together. We're gonna end with a prayer. Dear Lord, thank You for all of the ways You have provided for us. Thank You for our finances, our jobs, and helping us provide for our families. Thank You for the times other people have helped us, encouraged us, advised us, and supported us through hard times. We pray we would be people who would be eager and ready to be used by You to help others who are in need. We pray You would give us wisdom in handling and managing our finances. Please teach us the best ways to save and spend what we have. We pray we would learn to invest in ways that work out for our family. We pray we would be able to build up all that we have to bless generations of families that come after us. When the world experiences crisis and it interrupts our finances, when inflation causes tension, when hard times create a burden of stress, we pray we would remain humble and steadfast. We pray we would trust in You. Please help us to encourage one another in the areas of finance. We pray we would trust each other in marriage with money and protect our hearts from greed. Lord, we pray for wisdom and continual growth, in Jesus' name, amen. - Thank you for joining us for another episode of the "Marriage After God" podcast. - If you found today's episode fun and encouraging, please take a moment to share it on social media or in an email to some of your married friends. - Also, would you please take a moment and leave us a review? Reviews help to spread the word about our podcast. - Be sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode and you can always check out more of our resources at marriageaftergod.com. - You can follow us on social media for more marriage encouragement on Facebook and Instagram @MarriageAfterGod, @HusbandRevolution and @Unveiledwife. - We hope you have an incredible week and look forward to sharing more with you next week on the "Marriage After God" podcast.   Connect With UsInstagram | @marriageaftergodInstagram | @unveiledwifeInstagram | @husbandrevolutionCheck out our marriage resources!SponsorsGet our new book The Marriage Gift - 365 prayers for your marriage!

If you have been blessed by our podcast, please consider supporting it by grabbing a copy of our 30-Day marriage devotionals.https://shop.marriageaftergod.com/collections/frontpage/products/husband-and-wife-after-god-devotional-bundle How to pace: Don't start out full force - reserve your energy for longevityMake a priority list - to set up for success - cut off outliersInclude rest - or else burnout Be patient - allows for disruptionDon't compare - it steals joy Check expectation - avoid disappointmentREAD TRANSCRIPT- Hi, and welcome to the "Marriage After God" podcast. - We're your hosts, Aaron and Jennifer Smith. - We have been married 15 years and have five sweet children, who are growing up way too fast. - We love God and we love marriage. - And we love to be honest about it all. - Marriage is not always a walk in the park, but we do believe it has a powerful purpose. - So our goal here is to open up the conversation to talk about our faith and our marriage. - Especially in light of the gospel. - We certainly don't have all the answers, But if you stick around, we may just make you laugh. - But our hope is to encourage you to chase boldly after God's purpose for your life together. - This is "Marriage After God". - Hey, welcome back to another episode of the "Marriage After God" podcast. We're glad you're here, Jennifer's laughing. 'Cause she gets nervous when we're starting these things. Every time. She's like, "This isn't in my notes. What do I do? What do I do?" You just talk to them. Play "Little Diddy". - I was hiding that from you for a long time. - Or you were waiting to pull that out of me? Well, - You're welcome. - Yeah. All right. So today we're gonna be chatting about this little idea of the importance of pacing ourselves. - For the purpose of peace. Peace in our lives. - Pace and peace, is that intentional? You think God was like, "I want those words to be real close together"? So that's what we're gonna be talking about today is peace and pace, or pace to get peace. That's really what it is. - It's not a funny episode, but I feel like I got the giggles. - You got the giggles? - Yeah. - You've been looking at a computer screen for quite a while, so you're like- - I'm delirious. - A little bit delirious, I think that's okay. So you take it from here. - Well, before we get started, I just wanted to let you guys know that one of the, - You got this. All you gotta do is read it. - I don't know why this is so hard for me right now. - Okay. - Sorry, guys. - But you just do it, you got this. - Okay, redo. - Take a breath. - Can we cut that? - Pace yourself? This is gonna work. You guys, she's laughing hard right now. - What's in those gummy bears? - They're all natural, so, all right. I'll do it, it's okay. So we just wanna let you all know that one of the ways that we support this podcast, is by you all picking up copies of our books. We've written quite a few books and we wrote them to bless and benefit marriages around the world. And so we wanna invite you, two of the books that we have that actually helps with pace, is our devotionals, "Wife After God" and "Husband After God." They are 30-day marriage devotionals with daily topics to focus on based off specific scriptures. And there's also an included daily prayer. They're brief, but they're doable, and you can do them alone, or you can do them with your spouse. We've been selling 'em for years, people have loved them. Why don't you read some of these reviews real quick? - Yeah, since I got myself together over here. - You got yourself, yeah, you got it. - So this first one is from Travis, he said, "Wonderful materials, very helpful to my marriage. God used these books to really help us out of a dark place. Biblically based and true to God's word and character." And then Heather said, "We have been using the books together each night since we received them. After nearly 25 years of marriage, we are looking at God's design with fresh eyes and reaping the benefits of seeing our marriage as a reflection of his love story." - Well those are awesome, and that's our hearts for these, is that we would draw people back to God's Word, that we would help people see God's vision for their marriage like God's shown us. We're not marriage experts, but we do love leading people to Christ and pointing them back to the thing that changes us, which is the Word of God. So this show is supported by people like you purchasing our books. If you wanna go pick up a copy of our books today, our devotionals, you can go to shop.marriageaftergod.com. - So today's topic was actually my idea. I was inspired by it from an experience that I had that I'll go into in just a little bit. And it's probably something that we all should revisit every year. Maybe multiple times throughout the year. Just this idea of evaluating our pace and how fast or slow we're going in life, what's pressuring us to do that? And really after last week's episode on life transitions, I feel like this is a really good follow-up. - It's a great follow-up actually. - Yeah. - And I think it's super necessary in this day and age. I was literally in the car just talking to the kids and I was saying, "You know why we have you guys do work with me and we work out?" I was like, "If it was 200 years ago, guys, you'd be out working in the fields all day, and all of you'd be washing clothes out of a bin with a wash board." She's like, "A what?" And I'm like, "Well, that's how they used to wash clothes, it was with their hands." Life forced pace generations ago. But nowadays, we have so many things that help us with things, that we can fill our lives with a lot of things. - Yeah, so I was also thinking about everybody like me, who are preparing their kids for going back to school, maybe a lot of you already started, but just- - Yeah, 'cause that's coming up. - Yeah, and trying to figure out what your pace going into the new school year. And so I hope that you specifically find gems in today. I hope that it really blesses you with that idea of going back to school. Something that I love to do in our homeschool and getting back to school with the kids, is an all about me time. Sometimes we take one, two, three days, just- - All about you, Jennifer? - No, not all about me, no, all about- - 'Cause that would be very nice. - All about me in quotations, where we talk about their likes, their dislikes, how old they are, what grade they're in, you get this little sheet and you fill it out, and then we usually do like a painted self portrait, which is really fun. That's my favorite part because the kids always express themselves very- - Differently. - Uniquely. So I thought today would be fun with a lightning round of all about me for you and I, for our listeners. - Oh, that's funny, I didn't realize that that was what this was, but okay, cool. - I mean, why not? So we could just take turns going back and forth, asking a question and say what's on the top of your mind. Fine? - Okay, so- - You willing? - Are we gonna go through these questions real? Those are good. Okay, I'm gonna ask you first, what's your age? - 36, although I keep telling everyone 37, I just keep forgetting, I don't know. I don't know. - I'm 38 and some change. - Getting old. - Yeah, I'm getting old. - Okay, how tall are you? - Pretty sure I'm 6'1". - We'll, at least used to be. - I think you start growing shorter after a certain age. At 40? Is that what happens? - I'm five five five. - Five, five, five? - 5'5" and a half. - 5'5" and a half, okay. What was your favorite subject in school? Was it all your AP classes? - No, but I really love history. - Oh man. - It incorporates art and writing. - I wish I had a better history experience in school because growing up, or being older now I wish I liked history more, but that was my least favorite subject. And to be honest- - Hold on, I don't think the next question was, why don't you like your sciences school subject? Just say what's your favorite. - My favorite subject in school was probably my psychology class I took. - Alrighty then. What's your favorite color? - I always say green, but that's just because it's always been green. - Is it really pink? - It's probably, yeah. So actually it's green, but I don't know if- - You're really confusing on these questions. - sorry, I'm a complicated person. - You're that kid when we're doing all about me, we had to keep crossing out the answer and putting another one? Okay, and I'm getting stuck on answering all these questions, but my favorite color is blue. You ask the next one. - What's your favorite food or meal? - Dessert. - It counts? Just all desserts? - I like burritos. - Burrito desserts? Okay. - Don't give me a reason to laugh. My favorite food is pizza probably. - Yeah. - Easily. I can eat that almost anytime. - I concur. What's your favorite hobby, interest, liking up to doing? - I like to keep those secret. - What? - I like just to spend time with my friends, like going on. - Me? - Yes, you of course. You're my favorite hobby, babe. - You like to go to the movies? - I used to a lot more, not so much anymore. But yes, spending time with a good friend. - Okay, my favorite hobby is doing something crafty, artsy, painting, something like that. - And you know what? I'm just gonna say this- - Or excursions. - You haven't done that in a long time and I think you should just go do something artsy one of these days. - Thank you, I appreciate that. - I'm just gonna give you- - Permission? - An hour, to go and you're just gonna... - You're wonderful. Okay, what's your favorite game to play with me? - Favorite game to play with you, it's definitely not Phase 10, or- - We've fought about that way too many times. - Or Catan, or, I'm just kidding. I'm supposed to say what my favorite game is. Actually, what is it? - Tag? - Tag, I don't know. - So obviously you need to play more games with me. - How many games do we play just us? I'm trying to think, I don't why I'm thinking- - Well, I don't wanna tell on us, but our last week's challenge was we were supposed to play a game together. - Oh no! - We didn't do it, we failed. - No we didn't. - So now we gotta do- - We didn't do our own challenge? - Sorry, everyone gets a pass for the first week challenge. - So technically we're recording this within this, we still have time. - Okay, we're gonna play a game this week and figure out what's our favorite game to play. - Yeah. - All right, mine lately has been pickelball, which is a little bit more active. - Oh, okay. I'm not even thinking like outdoor games. - It's okay, it's not your fault. - Pickleball is actually a lot of fun. I would say that one. - Okay. - Okay, I'm gonna say it's that one. - Let's go do that this week. - Okay. What are three words that describe you? That's an easy one I think. - To describe me or you? - I'm being facetious, because it's a lot of words to have to pick. - We can skip this question. - Okay, what do you want to do when you grow up? - I wanna be like you. - What? - No, I don't. I mean, I do, I feel like I stuck my foot in my mouth. - You wanna be like, that's cool. If you wanna be like me. - I just wanna have fun. - What do you wanna be when you grow up? You wanna have fun, okay. - I wanna be a, I'm gonna say the good thing, I wanna be a better father when I grow up. - Oh, that's really sweet. I'd love to be a guitar player, right now I'm in- - That is what you wanna be, you wanna play some instrument when you get older. - So can I just explain really quick? I was practicing the piano last year and then we packed it up and put it away when we moved. And so I told Aaron, I really wanna play an instrument, maybe I should get a guitar. And so him and Elliot really kindly bought me this guitar and I started trying to practice, but Aaron said that all my years of fake strumming and air strumming have messed me up. - It's just, okay. - I'm really stuck on strumming. - I did say that, but in context, she was asking me why she couldn't strum good, so I was just trying to let her know. - Okay, that's what I wanna be when I grow up. - Oh man, you are getting good. We should intro one of these with you playing a song for them. - No. - I'll put my microphone on the guitar. - No. - Your microphone to your mouth. She's getting good. Okay, well let's move on. Let's do this, we're gonna go onto the real topic for today. - Hopefully our listeners liked hearing about us. - I think so. It's funny, but I liked it. - Go play all about me with your spouse. - It's actually good to do it periodically because we get so in life that we forget to just say, "Hey, who are you? Has things changed in your personal life?" - Are your still your favorites? - Yeah, are your favorites still your favorites? 'Cause actually some of these favorites I don't know if they're my favorites. I have to go back and I have to totally self-evaluate my whole life. - Yeah. - Green, I don't know. I just don't know. - That's a good one. - All right, so why are you encouraged to talk about this topic, babe? - Well, in all honesty, our life this past probably five, six months have just felt a little chaotic, which we did talk about in last episode of life transitions, and I think a big portion of that was just losing grips on our rhythms and routines and things that had maintained for so long. And so we're just in this space right now of relearning and relearning what our pace looks like in a new home, and even new homeschool year, 'cause I- - Things are changing? - I decided, Aaron decided, we decided that we're gonna be utilizing CC, Classical Conversations Community, which is just different for me but I'm really excited about. - So is that CCC? - CCC. So this episode, I'm probably gonna be sharing a little bit extra on what I've been learning while working out with a trainer. But that's probably the only episode. I tried looking ahead, I don't think it comes in that much more often, so all my examples and things that I'm sharing, they have been inspired. - Well, I'd say it's a big deal because you've been really consistent with this and you are learning a lot. - Yeah. So today's episode, I thought about when I was working on the rower and my coach was telling me, "Hey, you need to slow down. You have way more intervals to do, and if you start out at a 10, you're quickly gonna be at a two. Whereas if you don't start so quickly and you say start at an eight, you'll slowly go down to a two over time and you'll just have more energy." - Well, we call that CrossFit as coming out hot. - Okay, okay. - When you come out hot, you're gonna fizzle out. - Didn't know that, but that's what I was doing and I was exhausting myself. And so he was trying to tell me to slow down, to reserve my energy and be able to go longer over time. And so as he's talking me through this and I'm watching my pace come down and maintain itself better, I realized how profitable that kind of mentality would be in homeschool, in family life, in other routines that I have. In fact, I was thinking back on my homeschool journey and I remember year after year, I would start really strong in September and do all the things that I wanna be doing, and then come spring, I'm burnt out, or the kids are burnt out, or we just feel like we wanna hurry up, wanna rush through everything just so we can have a break. And then I remember somebody posting on, I think it was Instagram, a book that she was reading, "Teaching from Rest" by Sarah Mackenzie. And it's so brief, but it's so packed with rich goodness about your pace. It was so encouraging for me to hear it, and that one specifically about homeschool and teaching from rest to try and find a rhythm that makes things peaceful for your family. And so applying those things that I learned really helped me in incorporating rest throughout our homeschool year, and like you said, not coming in hot, or what did you say? - Yeah, coming in hot? - Yeah. So anyways, that's kind of what inspired this whole thing. 'Cause I know I'm not the only one who struggles with pacing themselves with all different areas of life. - Yeah, tries to accomplish everything in the first month and then- - Fizzles out. - Fizzles out real quick. - Gets burnt out. So I guess the practical here, the thing that I hope would stick with you guys would be to start off slow. No matter what you aim to do, whether it's your marriage and trying to prioritize date night or the laundry. - Pretty much anything. So you're talking about homeschool and working out and those things, but it's in any sense. I've mentioned this a lot in the past, we had a whole episode on this, about what we're capable of, that we're limited, but we don't realize that we're limited. So we always try think we can do more, we can, as my mom always said, when you wanted to eat too much, like I fill my plate with too much food, it'd be like your eyes are bigger than your stomach. Meaning like, "Oh, look how much I could put on my plate." And then I'm halfway through it and I can't finish it. - Yeah, and if we do this in life or in marriage, we're gonna run ourselves into the ground. - We're gonna be miserable. - Yeah, everything. And the beauty about learning to pace ourselves is that we end up having more peace and actually more success. So going back to your analogy, just to give an example for this of the rower, if you come out hot, and I've done this in so many workouts, and I'm like, "Yeah," and I'm ahead of everyone, it feels awesome. - For about a minute- - Yeah, for like 30 seconds, I have all this energy and it's gone. And then I can't even keep up with everyone because I've already depleted everything in myself. And so actually, if you have a good pace, those are the people that have more success. - More progress. - They don't try and bite off more than they can chew, don't try all these, you named the analogy, we've all heard it. Not coming out hot off the gate. And so it affects every aspect of our life if we can just look at anything, the way we are in our marriage, the way with our kids, our jobs, our businesses that maybe that we're starting, finding a healthy peaceful pace and not trying to overdo it. So learning to have a pace is really about learning to make small steps of consistency and routines rather than large jumps of change. - That's good. - Which is funny, 'cause in our flesh, the large jumps of change always sounds more appealing. It's like, "Oh I just wanna get to X." You're like, "Well, no, you gotta get to B first," before we can get to C and then D. - Well, and usually when you try and do those large jumps of change, you wanna see change rapidly, and you get disappointed when things aren't changing quick enough, whereas if you study yourself and you make small, consistent steps towards your goals and be patient, we're gonna get in all these in a little bit. But it all kinda ties in really, really good stuff. Okay, so in talking about pace lately, Aaron, what areas have you been thinking about when it comes to pacing yourself, or what are you recognizing you need to pace yourself in? - I have a funny story that I'm gonna bring up, but lately I've been seeing myself trying to do too many things at once. And I think that's a product of me not having a good routine or pace. - Well, and then we move into this new house and there's boxes everywhere, there's things to unpack. There's always a project. - Well, there's tons of things. So many things, and they're all little things. And if I was to look at them all, a lot of them don't have to be done right away, but because of me maybe not doing enough, like being consistent and do chipping away and I did this little thing here, and that I took a Saturday morning and I did that, and I did this little thing, I don't do anything 'cause I'm little overwhelmed by all. And then I get this little boost of energy I'm like, "Oh, I'm gonna do all this stuff," and I don't finish any of it, which makes more of a mess I think. Here's an example of what I mean, by the way, this actually literally happened today. So I'm hanging out with the kids today, Jennifer's been working on a project that we're working on, we kind of mentioned a little bit last week, but I don't know if you're ready to share what it is. - Not yet. - Okay, we'll keep you- - Someone asked, is it a devotion? Yes, it's a marriage devotion. - So she's working on it, and so I'm like, "Okay, I'm gonna be with the kids," and I'm letting her work away in the bedroom. And I'm trying to get all the kids to, we're working as a family of picking up after ourselves, and this is every one of us actually. Remember Jennifer was just talking about us kind of relearning how to be. And so we have this house and all of our kids and we went from a trailer to now this big space and everything gets left everywhere all the time. And so I'm trying to work with the kids. I'm just saying, if you walk into our house right now, you'd see. So I'm in their bedroom and I'm like, "Okay guys, you're all gonna get in here, all of you're gonna help get Olive's bedroom cleaned." And they're trying to work on it, I'm like, "Okay, cool. I have a few minutes while they're kind of busy." And a part came in that I've been waiting for, for a hot water heater. It just got dropped off and I'm like, "Sweet, I've been waiting for this." So I go grab that and I'm opening up in the counter and then I walk into the bedroom and I go, "Okay, make sure you get this stuff." And I'm like, "You guys need to stop playing around and get back to work," 'cause they forget that they're supposed to be cleaning. - They don't forget, they know you're not watching. - Exactly. And then I walk out and I get the part and I'm like, "Okay, cool, this doesn't look so hard," and I walk into the garage and I peek at the machine and I take the panel off and I put the part down and I go back inside and I'm like, "Okay guys, now we're gonna move to Elliott's room." And we move into Elliott's room and then the moment they walk in, I walk out to the garage, and scanning the machine I'm like, "oh, here it is, here's the part." And there's like this little clippy and I'm like, "Oh, it looks like all the pipes are just held together by these little clips. That's super easy, there's no screws or nothing." And so I just pull the clip right off, nine gallons a minute of water just start flooding my garage. And I'm freaking out, I'm trying to push the hose back in, and the clip won't go back on and I don't know what to do, and then finally I notice right under my nose is this big old red handle for the water shut off. And I just shut it off, praise God, it stops flowing, 'cause there was three red handles, I pulled the right one, and I'm just sitting there soaking wet and I'm like, would that work? And so finally I'm getting towels and drying up the floor, and I go inside the house and the kids are playing and not even cleaning, and I'm like, "Ah." And all my water's off. So anyways, just a perfect little example of trying to do too many things at once, when I could have just been focusing and doing a really good job on the one thing, I'm doing a pretty terrible job at all of the things. I don't know if that gives you a good example, but I'm not very paced currently. - We're working on it, that's how we're doing this. We needed this for us. - Yeah, I'm slowly trying to get back to this. And again, that's just a comical and kind of frustrating example of the choices I've been making and the way I'm kind of organizing my mind and my life and my heart with my family. - So I have a question for you. - Go. - Okay, so is there anything that you did this week that you were trying to change your pace or work on your routine or do, that was successful? - Well, yeah, I was gonna get at that is, I've been trying to get back into a morning routine, I'm trying to get up. 'Cause then I could get in the word, I can exercise, I have that few hours in the morning, and I did it like once, and so that's a success. I did it once. So I'm trying to have a better pace. And at the end of the day, like I said, if I am trying to do too many things, then I'm not doing all the things well. When I could have just focused on being with the kids, which is what I should have done. - So I think the practical here, 'cause mine was start off slow, yours would be, make a priority list. Make a list where you can really focus on what's right in front of you. - I like your workout list, you have like, you have to do this and then you have to do this, and then you have to do this. - I think those things are important. But part of pacing yourself is actually waiting to do those extra things that don't require your attention right now, or putting things off that would hinder what you're trying to work on right now. Does that make sense? - Right, so I'm trying to do too many things at once, which is not a good pace, that's trying to go too fast now. Now, I actually got the part in, but we still don't have hot water now. And that's the thing is, we essentially gotta keep the main thing the main thing. So today the main thing should have been me just hanging out with the kids, helping 'em clean their rooms, helping 'em figure out their own patterns and pace. And I was talking to them, I'm like, "We gotta learn as a family to be better at picking up after ourselves." That's a pace thing. That's thinking about- - Yes, for sure. - 'Cause that slows us down when we don't do that, 'cause now there's just the sinks full of dishes, which has kind of been our thing for our whole marriage, but we're working on that too. But yeah, keeping the main thing the main thing- - I like that. - Is a way of prioritizing and not trying to jam too much stuff into our momentum. - Cool, I like that. And there's a verse that came to my mind when we were thinking about pace, and the word endurance came to my mind. I thought about Hebrews 12:1-2, it says, "Therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us also lay aside every weight and sin which clings so closely and let us run with endurance the race that is set before us looking at Jesus, the founder and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy that was set before Him, endured the cross, despising the shame, and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God." And so I love that picture of endurance and running the race that's set before us, getting rid of the things that are hindering us, and keeping our eyes on the prize. - So I look at this as that race, that pace of inner faith, because everything we're talking about can play out in our faith as well. Like I want to be in the Word more so then we make this crazy plan of, "I'm gonna read six chapters a day," and then we burn ourselves out and we're like, "Oh, I failed." - Yeah, because I can't do what I sought out to do, so therefore I can't do it on any of it. - Or I wanna pray more, so I go and set three hours aside, and I can't get myself to be that calm and quiet for that long, instead of just taking little steps to do it. - That's good. - I'm gonna just try and I'm gonna get in Proverbs every day and I'm gonna try and pray at that same time, and I'm gonna, adding these things in to pace myself in my walk with Christ so that I don't feel like I'm burdened in working for my salvation rather than enjoying my savior. - Yeah. Well speaking of enjoying our savior, the next practical point on pacing yourself for peace is, we need to include rest. We need to be intentional about creating rest within our work week. And so often we feel like we're just spinning a bunch of plates. I don't know if you guys guys feel like that, but I feel like that often where if I'm not being intentional and pacing ourselves, we're just spinning a bunch of plates. I like that analogy earlier of you saying- - Not really going anywhere, but doing lots of things. - And also that we can't take our eyes off of what we're focusing on doing. We believe we can't stop or take a break between sets when you're working out, because we feel like if we do that, we're gonna lose our pace. And so we're constantly just going, I feel this way with social media, especially as being someone who provides content online, I feel like I can't keep up with the constant changing of the trend, and so I get overwhelmed so I shut down and I don't do anything. And so anyways, it's feeling like we're constantly just spinning a bunch of plates and can't stop, but that's a lie. We actually need rest. The Lord actually created and designed our bodies for rest. - Well, if you just think about sleep, sleep is not the same thing as rest, it's a part of it. We would die if we don't sleep. Literally our bodies would shut down if we weren't getting enough sleep. But you're right, God designed us also spiritually and emotionally and mentally for rest. That we need it. Jesus now is our actual rest from the labors of walking in sin and death. Jesus is our actual arrest. - And He tells us to come to Him for rest. - And He tells us to come to Him and give Him our burdens and our weights. - Our anxieties. - Yeah, and that He gives us rest. So in Mark 2:27, it says, "And he said to them, 'the Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath.'" God made the Sabbath, this idea of rest for men, for people, because we need rest. And I think we as humans and especially in the social media world we live in, rest can be a bad word actually. I feel like there's this idea of that slowing down is looked down upon. - Yeah, hustle is the golden word, right? - Yeah, that's the word I was looking for. I was writing this note down, I said that crush it sort of attitude, and I was like, "There's another word that people use, hustle." It's glorified. No, no, you work 24/7. You wanna be successful. You can't take rest, resting is lazy, resting is not gonna get you to your goal. - Now the problem with that is as humans, we get weak emotionally and physically and mentally, we get tired. - Not when you're hustling. - We get exhausted. And when that happens spiritually, what happens? Temptation comes our way, boom. - Yeah, usually we fall in the sin, we get anger or we try and cope in negative ways. - We're easily frustrated or we're snappy with each other. - Yeah, never get that way. - 'Cause we lose sight of what's right, what we should be doing. - And so that's something that we gotta fight against is, rest is okay. We took a pretty significant break from posting on social media because it was exhausting. And what was hard is, we had to fight that temptation to believe that we were failing what we were doing, or that we were gonna lose it all or ruin it if we didn't do that. Which means that we're now not even in control of what we're doing anyway, we're in this feedback loop of, if we don't do it, we're failing. Rather than we're doing it because we want to. Rather we're doing it because it's a blessing. - Yeah, that's good. After Jesus sends out his disciples two by two, this happens in Mark 6:30-32, "The apostles returned to Jesus and told him all that they had done and taught. And he said to them, 'Come away by yourselves to a desolate place and rest a while,' for many were coming and going and they had no leisure even to eat. And they went away in the boat to a desolate place by themselves." Jesus knew the importance of rest. - Yeah, well I read this and I don't feel like I've ever even heard this before. - Really? - Yeah, or I've just- - Your eyes are opened. - Yeah, it's really cool that was His encouragement. He's like, "Good job, go take a break. Go rest for yourself." - But how often do we allow ourselves to rest? - Yeah, I think we do. I think maybe we're like, "Oh, I just need to get a little more sleep." - Maybe some of us, but I don't think everybody makes that happen. Speaking of going to bed, Psalm 127:2 says, "It is vain that you rise up early and go late to rest, eating the bread of anxious toil for He gives to his beloved sleep." When I read that I was saying, I really do better when I've slept well. - Well, there's quite a few success and hustle Instagrams that I follow, just 'cause I like to get some motivations and stuff like that. And a lot of times they say, some people believe that the most successful people sleep less, but they actually sleep more. - Like they program their sleep. - Yeah, and that's something that I struggle with is, and I was gonna bring it up in a little bit, but my mornings are predicated by my evenings. So speaking of sleep, I think, like I said this a second ago, rest is much more than sleep though. Yes, we need good sleep, but that doesn't always happen. Especially if you have new babies, or like us, our kids come in, we've been talking to 'em about this- - If it's not one, it's the other. - Yeah, they come in and, yeah, all five of 'em, just like a train. They're trying to get in our bed to sleep with us and snuggle. But rest is much more than sleep. A friend of mine once said, rest is doing something that recharges you. And he would give an example of, it wasn't that he got more sleep, he would wake up even earlier sometimes, And he'd go to do a hike that he hasn't done in a long time. And he'd come back rested like. - Rejuvenated. - Yeah, because he got away from the things that were stressing him, or he got to breathe fresh air and be out using his legs and muscles. So he may be more tired, but he's rested. - So I feel like a lot of these points that we're making today, come back to, you have to kinda know yourself. You have to know your limits, - Know myself. You have to know what rejuvenates you, you have to know- - Yeah, there's a term we've used, it's something that I think we've been decent at. We could be better at always, but this idea of self-awareness, having an understanding of self. Not selfishness, not like everything needs to be geared to me, but understanding at least, "Oh, I'm being a jerk right now." Or, "Oh, I'm overwhelmed." Or, "I'm irritable." Having these self-awareness instead of, I'm just doing things and reacting and I'm like, "Oh no, that's not what's going on." Having an awareness of ourselves is a huge thing. - So moving on to the next note that we have here for pacing yourself would be to be patient. Be patient with the process, be patient with yourself, be patient with your family. - Be patient and wait to put the part in for when I can have my attention on it. - Yes, exactly. This world lies to us and says that we have to keep running, keep going, keep buying, keep serving, keep doing. Does it sound familiar? Does anyone else feel it the way I feel like? - Yeah, don't stop. - Don't stop. I pulled out this quote from Ralph, - Ralph. - I pulled out this quote from Ralph Waldo Emerson and it says, "Adopt the pace of nature, her secret is patience." - That's good because nature is patient. - It's so patient. You almost don't see it in it's working, but you know that it is because, look at the landscape of nature and life around you and it's beautiful. And it looks like it's really enjoying itself. I wanna be like that. Well, Jesus even brings it up several times, just about nature and how it doesn't toil and it doesn't worry about certain things because He takes care of them. And they just kind of do what they're made to do. And so patience, it's not just patience in the results, it's more so patients with ourselves, patience with the amount of time it takes to get to that result. - Preparing yourself for it. I have a story I wanted to share, actually about that. - Yeah, go ahead. - So I typically am not good at pacing myself, especially if we have some sort of appointment or something to do outside of the home, and getting five kids in the car, make sure everyone went to the bathroom and has their shoes and jackets and water bottles and all these things, it's like, "Come on, we gotta go." So I'm constantly rushing them. I use the word hurry a lot which, I was just thinking back to one of the episodes we shared in the past season, how I challenge myself not to use that word with them, and I'm gonna go back to that, 'cause I found myself using it a lot. - We've relapsed a bit. - Yeah. But I was taking the kids to jujitsu and I noticed that time and time again, I'd show up and this other dad would drop off his kid, but he'd always be there 15 minutes early. I knew this 'cause they were in the next class. He would come 15 minutes early, and they would kind of sit in the car and talk for a little bit, him and his son, and then his son would check up there and then he would go, and he walked so slowly, and there's nothing wrong with him, and he just kinda looks around like he's just got this leisure- - Not in a hurry. - About him, and he's not in a hurry. And I thought to myself, "I wanna be like him. That's who I wanna be when I grow up." - Somebody's not in hurry. - It was really encouraging, I don't know why over here. I want to not rush my kids, I want to not hurry, I wanna pace myself and my family in a way where I'm not pushing them so hard, and can enjoy that 10 minutes in the car before we actually go into a place. And that teaches them how to arrive early and how to be prompt and all these things, and so kudos to that dad, I'm learning. - That's a good example. - Oh, real quick before we move on, just about being patient is when we slow down and we're patient with ourselves and with our family and with the pace of life that we've chosen. We are more flexible, which means we can be disrupted by our kids or by circumstances without being bothered. We can have spontaneous invitations or events come up, and things that the Lord plans for us to deal with, and we don't get frustrated or flustered or anything because we've made time. - Margin. - Margin for that. - That's really good. It's convicting too. - I know. Let's do it. - Another tip is, and this is something that we all, it comes up all the time. - Our flesh does it. - Don't compare. Something we should not do is look to left or to the right, at that friend or that couple or the social media influencer or the friend at work and compare ourselves and say, "See, look how they do it." And I do this all the time, I see other children that are doing X, Y, Z, and I'm like, "Well, should I be doing that?" Or, "Why aren't my kids in that thing over there?" Or a person I see on social media, another dad, another husband, and I'm like, "Wow, look at that, what they're doing." And it puts this burden in my heart of like, "I'm not doing enough." Or, "I'm failing over here in that." Which it could be something that's good for me to be encouraged in trying to do, but the comparison is the unhealthy way of approaching that, of saying, "Look at them and look at me." - Yeah, there's a difference between looking at someone's life and being encouraged by it and saying, "Oh, I wanna adapt that goal." Or, "I wanna try that thing." - Like that gentleman that's going slow and enjoying his moment with his son. - I'll be honest, something I've caught myself doing, especially with homeschool is I look at five to 10 people at the same time and go, "Oh, look at what everyone's doing, I wanna do all of it." And then it's like- - You put it in one little bucket- - Very unrealistic. - Look at all these moms and how they do that. - And then I wonder why my life doesn't look like everybody's. Because it can't. We are all unique families and we all have a unique purpose that God has given us, and so we need to adapt to that first and foremost. But we just wanted to encourage you guys not to compare yourselves because then we get in this trap of feeling like we're missing out or we're failing. - Well, I think the actual act of comparison is like a scale. You are on the low end, they're on the high end. Or you're doing the opposite. You're prideful and you're putting yourself up above, putting someone low. Which is much different than looking at someone and aspiring and saying, "Wow, I want some of that in my life because that looks beneficial to me." Rather than, "Oh, look what they've done and look what I have not done." That's the difference. So Jennifer, why don't you share the last point that we have? - So the last one is, to check your expectations or set your expectations, I should say. Make it realistic and communicate with your spouse about what you desire for your family. What are some goals you can set to achieve, or things when you're considering your pace of life, what do you envision, what do you want to see happen? I like to do this in our marriage, especially if I know that we're gonna be in a season of heavy lifting, I like to sit down with you Aaron and go, "Okay, so this is what we have to do, and this is what we need to do in order to get there." So how do you wanna do this?" - Here's the sacrifices that might have to happen? - Exactly. - Me spending more time than I'm used to, watching the kids, being with the family, which is a good thing, but could be a hard thing 'cause I'm not used to it, but that's an expectation. It's like, "Oh we have to"- - Yeah, you kinda mentioned this earlier, but when I go to do my workout, there's a whiteboard and it's listed right on there, what I'm supposed to be doing, and I know start to finish, what my expectation is. And you when you were doing CrossFit, kinda had the same thing you could check in the night before and see. Which always drove me crazy, I don't know how you could sleep on that. I would not check it. - Know what that's gonna be? - I would not do that. - For a while I wasn't doing it, but yeah, I liked finding out what it was gonna be. - It's fun. - Help me know if I needed to bring the right shoes. - Okay. Well speaking of different shoes, there's different seasons and different needs for different paces when it comes to our families. And so we need to just take all this into account, Like for us, having a newborn looks a lot different than going on a seven-week road trip across the country. And our pace of life felt a lot different in both of those circumstances, won't you say? - Some people go on seven-week trips and then have a newborn. - That's true. Some people are amazing like that. For our family, that would be very difficult, and I know- - Or in the middle of it. But it's a good point though, 'cause it's one thing to set an expectation, it's another thing that if that expectation is totally unrealistic. - And it's another thing if we don't communicate our expectations, that gets messy. - Jennifer, do you ever do that? Do you ever have a list of expectations that you don't tell me? - Sometimes. Yes, I'm guilty. - So communicating 'em, and setting realistic ones that you can actually take actionable steps toward accomplishing. - Yeah. - It slows you down because the expectations will drop to a manageable size. - Which is great, 'cause that's the first tip on our episode today, slowing down. So see it all working together here symbiotically? Okay, I threw this little note in here 'cause I thought it was interesting when we talk about expectations. But one of the reasons for setting expectations is to avoid disappointment because we know what we're setting ourselves up for. And I was thinking about this last year, and just my own heart toward my beliefs and understanding scripture on end times prophecy, and a lot of people have been talking about it in social media lately, which is interesting, but just that heart of craving and yearning and desiring for Jesus and to be with Him one day, and knowing that that is coming. And so I pulled out James 5:8 and it says, "You also be patient, establish your hearts for the coming of the Lord is at hand." And I really like that verse, and I wanted to share it with you today. - Well, what I love about it is, this yearning and craving for the Lord's return is a good thing, something to look for. And the Bible even tell us to hasten the day, like we desire it to come quickly, but at the same time we are patient for it, knowing that God doesn't wish that any should perish. - So there's this tension of how do we pace ourselves, knowing that that will come but we don't know when? - But what I also love is, God made a way for us to be with Jesus now. So we don't have to wait for His return. We get to be in His word and in prayer, and boldly go before the throne room of God. - That's good. - And we can have him always at hand. - I love that. And he's our endurance. He's our strength, He's the reason that we pace ourselves. - Well, He's the reason we desire to learn and grow. It's not just to be successful, we don't share these things to be like, "Hey, here's how to be better human beings." When we work on these things and we grow and we mature, it's beneficial to our children, to our spouse, to ourselves, makes us more able to be used by the Lord. There are good things all around, but we don't do them to earn anything from God. God already gave us everything in Jesus Christ. And it had nothing to do with how good we are pacing ourselves. But if we can grow in these areas, it's a good thing, for our family, for our ministries. So that's what I just wanna encourage you and do a little caveat through it all. - I like it. Okay, so I just wanted to roll through our practicals for pacing ourselves to try and get that piece in our life. So from start to finish, don't start out full force or hot out the gate. Reserve your energy for a longevity- - Come in hot. - Yeah, reserve your energy for longevity. - Next one is, make a priority list to set up for success. Cut off the outliers, in the priority list, are there things that they're not necessary right now, but you kind of want them to be? - That's good. - Put them in order and try and, as some people say, do the hard thing first. - Include rest or else you'll burn out. - Yeah, and rest in Jesus. Be patient, and be allowing of disruptions. - Yeah, that's good. Don't compare yourself because it steals your joy along the way. - And then check those expectations at the door. - With all that combined, you can have a really steady pace. Okay, Aaron, you said something in the very beginning that I just wanna reiterate because it was really profound and good, and I want them to remember it. You said learning to have a pace is really about learning to make small steps of consistency and routines. And I think these small steps, in these practical ways to pace yourself is how you increase your peace. - And I'm trying to do that. I'm just gonna give a little note real quick, I know it's not on the notes, but I'm gonna say it anyway. A small step I took to help myself get back into a morning routine, even though I have not been crazy successful at it, - Crazy! - Is I set, is that's not crazy? I set a 5:00 AM alarm for every day of the week except for Saturday and Sunday. - So the challenge this week, not kidding. - Well, the challenge is not to hit snooze for an hour and a half. It's to wake up on the first or second snooze. But because I have the alarm, that's one step closer. It's a small step, and I got up once or twice last week. - Good job. - Really. So I'm nailing it. - That's great, high five. Okay, all these little areas will help you overall bring a sense of health and wellness to better your marriage and your atmosphere of your home. So we hope that this inspires you and encourage you to take hold of the conversation with your spouse and do something about it. - Take small steps. - Unless you're really great at pacing yourself, and then you're just awesome. - Some people are. And if you are, you should go encourage someone with this, and help them, 'cause a lot of people need help like us. - Okay, the weekly challenge is, - Well, last week's was, play a game. - Which we're gonna do. - We're gonna do that. Sorry we haven't. We're gonna do it. Okay, so I guess it's do a workout together. - Yep, it could be something fun, it doesn't have to be- - Some sit ups? - CrossFit. - Some squats. - Don't come out the gate hot guys, unless you really want to. - Pickleball is a game and a workout. - Okay, so we're gonna double up. You can double up like we are, if you want. - Double up. - It could also just be a stretch or some small weights, whatever you wanna do. We did P90X once together, do you remember that? - That was like 20 years ago. - That was amazing. - We still have the DVDs. - I know, we should do that again and record it and put on reels or something. - Oh, man! If you guys can find P90X, you should do it. - Have fun. - All right. - Have fun with it. - Let's pray. Dear Lord, thank you for the encouragement to evaluate our lives and how we pace ourselves. We pray we will consider the ways we get burnt out easily and make adjustments to our schedule as needed. We pray we would be better at resting. Please help us to find a rhythm that blesses our family and encourages good growth. When we do feel tired, stretched, or as if we can't continue on, please help us to lean on you and to rely on your strength. We pray we will apply wisdom you give us in your word. We pray we would find ways of recuperating and making them a priority. When it comes to support in marriage, we pray we would have a good balance of pushing each other to press on through the hard things, but also encourage one another to rest well. We pray your will would be done in our marriage and through us, in Jesus name. Amen. We love you and we'll see you next week. - Thank you for joining us for another episode of the "Marriage After God" podcast. - If you found today's episode fun and encouraging, please take a moment to share it on social media or in an email to some of your married friends. - Also, would you please take a moment and leave us a review? Reviews help to spread the word about our podcast. - Be sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode. And you can always check out more of our resources at marriageaftergod.com. - You can follow us on social media for more marriage encouragement on Facebook and Instagram, @marriageaftergod, @husbandrevolution, and @unveiledwife. - We hope you have an incredible week, and look forward to sharing more with you next week on the "Marriage After God" podcast. ♪ La, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la ♪ ♪ La, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la ♪ Connect With UsInstagram | @marriageaftergodInstagram | @unveiledwifeInstagram | @husbandrevolutionCheck out our marriage resources!SponsorsGet our new book The Marriage Gift - 365 prayers for your marriage!

In Todays episode we are going to talk about life transitions, unexpected circumstances, and how we can keep our marriage strong during high-stress seasons. This Episode is brought to you by The Unveiled Wife This is our first traditionally published book and in it we share those first four years of our marriage. It was definitely a strenuous and difficult  time of our lives, one of our biggest transitions as we share the details of getting married …and what we faced was definitely unexpected. So in sharing about life transitions in todays episode we also wanted to give a shout out to this book as it dives deep into how we handled it all and how God led our hearts through those tough times. You can get The Unveiled Wife on Amazon.comTranscript:- Hi, and welcome to the "Marriage After God" podcast.- We're your hosts, Aaron and Jennifer Smith.- We have been married 15 years and have five sweet children who are growing up way too fast.- We love God and we love marriage.- And we love to be honest about it all.- Marriage is not always a walk in the park, but we do believe it has a powerful purpose.- So our goal here is to open up the conversation to talk about our faith and our marriage.- Especially in light of the gospel.- We certainly don't have all the answers, but if you stick around, we may just make you laugh.- But our hope is to encourage you to chase boldly after God's purpose for your life together.- This is "Marriage After God."- Well, we are actually doing this.- We're back!- We're recording an episode.- Yeah we are. It's been a long time.- I always think it's funny, the moment we start recording, stuff happens.- The doorbell rings.- And then we have two UPS drivers. I don't know why it took two for dropping off this little tiny package.- Or kids come in, "What are you doing in there?"- It's just funny. 'Cause we're like trying to psych ourselves up to do this after not doing it for so long.- But are you nervous, Aaron?- Oh, yes.- I am.- But, speaking of how long it's taken us to get this new season out, this episode is kind of about that.- Yep. So in today's episode, we're gonna be talking about life transitions, unexpected circumstances, and keeping our marriage strong during those high stress seasons. And speaking of life transitions, we wanted to let you guys know that today's episode is sponsored by my first book, "The Unveiled Wife." This is our first four years of our marriage story. So we're talking about that transition from being single to married and just the difficulty-- And all the hard things that happened.- Yep. Yep, it was a stressful time for us and we, in the book, share how God led us through that.- And what I love about the book is it's got your beautiful face right on the cover.- Thank you.- It's like memorializing you. I love it. Anyways, you should pick up a copy of "The Unveiled Wife." It's available on amazon.com or on our site shop.marriageaftergod.com. So, this week's topic is on life transitions. Everyone has life transitions and we go through them. All throughout our life, there's gonna be all sorts of different seasons in our life where we have to transition from one season to the next.- And I feel like, I mean I could be wrong but I feel like just everybody lately has been in really big life transitions.- Uh yeah.- People we know, people I see on social media. I just keep hearing this kind of same phrase, life transition, over and over again. So we know a little bit about this from this last year and we thought we'd kind of use today's episode to recap where we've been, what we're doing.- Our last episode for the "Marriage After God" podcast was over a year and a half ago.- That's crazy. Like, where does time go?- Which is, way longer than we expected. Because when we took our break, we were like, oh you know, we're gonna come back in the fall or like whatever the next- We were gonna just do another season. And that didn't happen.- But there have been so many times that we thought we were on the cusp of, okay, here we are, we're gonna start up again. And I think we even let people know on social media, "We're coming back" and then something got in the way and we weren't able to.- Yeah, and so the thing is we kind of started something that kind of got in the way of the podcast. Which is okay, 'cause things do happen. Seasons come, transitions happen. And what was that thing that we were doing?- So we decided to build a house, which is a really cool-- And big.- Investment and way to move forward with our family and our life and-- Especially having five kids, now we wanted something a little bit larger, so we were like, hey, why don't we build and let's get out of town? And so we moved south farther away from the city and built something. That's been a big deal for us. It's been over a year of us doing this and we finally just moved in actually. Which is awesome! But that, being between homes, which is why we haven't recorded the episodes for the podcast.- Well, all of our stuff was packed away in boxes and, seriously, the moment that podcast box came out and we started unboxing it, we both got super excited of the potential. Okay, how long is this gonna take? Let's start setting up now.- Yeah, so we kind of got the table set up, we got our spot in the room set up, and we were like, okay, let's start planning. And that's what we've been doing.- So for all of you who have been following along on social media and seeing those couple of times we said, "Hey, we're gonna start," and then it stalled, sorry, we're so sorry. But here we are.- We love you. Thank you for waiting.- We're here, we're so excited about this season. And we've had a lot of fun brainstorming, trying to figure out what can we bring, for your guys' sake to enjoy this podcast and to learn some stuff along the way, learn stuff about us, but also just take what we share and apply it to your marriage or evaluate where you're at in your relationship with your spouse and say, "God, what do you want? What do you want from us?"- Well, and what I'm excited about with this episode is, we kind of wanted everyone listening just to know that things happen. Like we can have all of these expectations for ourselves or these plans, we can kind of want something for ourselves and for others, something that's good. And just sometimes things get in the way and that's okay. It was hard for us 'cause there was many times we were like, man, we were on such a momentum, we were having such a momentum, we were excited about it and just, we couldn't do it. And so now we're excited to do it again. And we hope that you're encouraged by us starting back up and showing that even though you don't do what you want, you can get back up and you can try, try, and try again. Is that a song or something like that? Sorry.- Okay, so in getting them excited about what they might hear along the way, why don't you share what we've brainstormed for them?- We have some topics. We have some topics on money and even cryptocurrency, 'cause that's a thing now and everyone's into it. I'm into it.- You just went straight for that, huh?- I did, yeah.- You just want them to get super excited, okay. So we're gonna talk about money, inflation, all these different things that affect marriage, okay.- Yeah, our journey with pornography or against it, I should say.- Where we were and where we are today.- Yeah, and how to slow down when life feels so fast, which is another thing that we've felt. We have kids just growing up really fast and it feels too fast actually. And then an episode, we actually got this topic from someone from the audience, about past baggage, things from our past and how it affects us. And there's many topics like that.- Just a reminder for all of you listening that we don't come with all this authority in all these areas. This is just things that we've learned along the way that we wanted to kinda just talk about with you guys. And so it's not like a how to do X, Y, Z for a perfect marriage. It's more just like, here's what's going on and here's what we've learned or here's what we're struggling with.- Can I say something funny about that? Whenever someone asks me, "Hey, what do you do for a living?" I'm always like, "Uh, well my wife and I write books and we encourage people in their marriages and their faith." And they're like, "Oh marriage, huh?" And I immediately have to tell them like, "Well, we're not like marriage experts or anything."- Yeah!- We use marriage as a way of encouraging people. We just like to share what God's doing in our life. But what you're saying is true, we're not coming as marriage experts. We're coming to just share what God's doing in our marriage. We believe that God loves marriage and we like to use our marriage as a catalyst to encourage people to grow closer to God and to their spouse.- Definitely.- And get in the Word of God. And so, that's what we do.- Awesome. So I hope you guys can look forward to hanging out with us this next season. We have 12 episodes coming at you. And we also added a cool little feature of a Weekly Challenge. Something that you guys can engage with your spouse with and hopefully we'll have some fun doing it too.- That's gonna be awesome. So this episode, "Keeping marriage strong during life transitions," why does that matter to try and keep your marriage strong during transitions? Is that an opportunity for it to get weaker or to drift apart or for contention to come in?- Well, always. Our flesh is always being tempted and tried, right? When we say transition, we're talking about that process or period of time where life is changing. There's things shifting, there's that space between one another where circumstances come up and we get tried in how we respond to those circumstances.- I also look at it as like, we get seasons of comfort where we kind of we know each other a bit and we have our ways of being, we have our routines, we have our thought processes, and they've just gone parallel with each other. And then in any sort of transition or turmoil, those connections that we have get tested. And it's like, there's this drawing of like, a pulling, a tugging on each other because we get tried in new ways. And so that area of comfort gets totally shaken. And that's where we're trying to encourage in this episode, is what happens in that mix.- So we've been in a huge life transition for the last 10 months and we know that many other people and other families have been through so many different life transitions. Housing moves, across this country moves, job moves, having babies, losing babies through miscarriage, school changes and just so much more.- And some of these shifts may have been like just really small and micro and you don't notice them but over time they build up, and the effects on you and others, and you may be still feeling those effects as well.- Yeah.- And so our heart is to speak into that a little bit, I think.- Also just launching this season, season six of "Marriage After God," we're entering into that transition from summer to fall. So everyone is just feeling that.- Like a seasonal transition?- Yeah.- Episode about transition?- The season of pumpkin spice or bust, right?- I'm not a big fan of pumpkin spice but I know there are people that love it. So if that's your thing, cool. I'm a black coffee guy, so.- I'm like a pumpkin pie or bust.- I could do pumpkin pie. Yeah, and pumpkin spice cake. Okay, so I can do pumpkin spice in some ways but not in my coffee, for sure.- Okay, so our life transition, let's start there. We sold our house last year and moved out in October and had this dream of building a home together, which we thought was going-- Which naively, we thought it was gonna happen way faster.- We thought that that was going to be a lot faster than what happened. And there were some hangups along the way for different reasons. I know one of them was just getting our permit to build took a lot longer than we thought. Lots of hangups from COVID and, you know-- Well then it starts snowing and that just slows everything down. So, it's not like it's anyone's fault. I think there's probably people laughing that are listening that have gone through this process. 'Cause there's always this thing, is like, oh, it's always gonna take longer than you think.- It's always gonna cost more than you thought.- And I'm an idealist and I'm like, no, it's gonna happen faster. And it's gonna be cheaper. Nope. That's exactly what everyone says, longer and more expensive. But, it's fine.- The cool thing about what happened was God just led us through a huge time of being humbled, having to rely on his resources and-- And the church.- The church.- We had friends that invited us in and helped us and were with us along the way.- We also took a little trip with the kids. I say a little but it was like-- It was huge.- Six or seven weeks. And it was really incredible just to have that time together as a family. That was one of the things we planned for and we thought when we were coming back, we'd be coming to a house and that wasn't what happened. And so, having to shift gears in the moment and be okay with that was a big deal to me. I think God taught me a lot about flexibility.- Yeah, so speaking of flexibility, how many houses have we lived in since October?- Yeah, it was over 30. But again, we took that trip and we stayed in Airbnbs, we stayed at parents' houses, we-- Friends' houses, trailer.- Yeah. It's been very interesting, to say the least.- I've actually really enjoyed it. It was long and I did want to be in a house, but it was actually really cool seeing how our kids and how we were able to do it, that flexibility. I think our kids are gonna just look back and be like, oh, we could do anything almost.- I hope so.- I hope they think that. That's not to say it wasn't difficult. That's not to say that we didn't have hard times. That's kind of what we're talking about. But I really enjoyed it, I wouldn't trade it. I wouldn't, I know you would.- No, no, no. I'd maybe trade parts of it.- Parts of it, yeah.- But no, it was good. Okay, so what was the hardest part of that whole transition, kind of living nomadically, displaced, not having a solid home, place to call home?- For sure, for me, the hardest part of that 10 months of just not having a single place with all my things where they go with all that stuff was routine and consistency just disappeared. It was gone. Now I probably could have tried harder in the midst of this stuff and kept something. There was times I tried that, but man, I feel like I lost all forward momentum with like exercise and diet and being in the Word and all these things that were just part of my daily routine. I'm having to fight for that again right now. What about you?- I think for me it was, if I put it in simplest terms, the setup and take down of each place we stayed at, even during traveling, it was like I'd go in and-- Yeah, it was rough.- Bring all of our clothes in or whatever we were using, and sometimes it was just a couple of days between places. And so, I felt really exhausted.- That was rough.- Yeah.- Just to go back, one of the things that I really regret dropping the ball on was not being consistent with our family Bible time. And that's something I've been trying to regain again since we've been in the house and even before that, like just working really hard at getting my family back into being in the Word of God every morning as a family. So I'm sad that that happened, it did, but we're working on it.- Something that I noticed between us personally in our marriage was usually we'd have these kind of routine dates where we'd vision cast or share, like, okay, what's on the agenda, what are we working towards, you know, goals? And I noticed that that kind of got put on the back-burner and neither one of us really brought it up for a while. And I think it was just 'cause we both felt super overwhelmed by our circumstance that, like, how could we think about the future without this other major thing happening and being final?- It was almost like we were waiting to get over this hurdle before we recouped that. But you can also look at it like we were on a 10 month date. This was like a one long amazing date.- I'll say this, God put something very specific on our hearts to pursue together at the beginning of the year that we've been diligent to work through. And I'm really excited about that.- Oh I think I know what you're talking about.- It's like the one thing that we were working towards aside from building a home. And I'm really excited to share that with everybody. But maybe we'll leave them hanging there for a minute. Or shall we just tell them?- That's up to you.- Okay, so just today, we turned in our manuscript for our next traditionally published book that I've been wanting to write for so long. I'm so excited about it.- And it comes out in the fall of next year.- Yep, so you guys can look forward to that. Do we wanna share what it is or we'll leave that part out?- Let's leave that part out.- All right.- You'll have to find out in future episodes.- Stick with us through three more seasons. No, I'm just kidding. We'll let you guys in on it soon.- So we talked about things that were hard during that transition this last 10 months, almost a year for us. But, like we do with our kids, we don't always just let them do their lowlights. What's a highlight? What's something that just stands out to you, like, man, that was awesome?- Real quick, if you don't know what Aaron's talking about, we will sit around the dinner table and just ask the kids, "Okay, what was the highlight from today?" And some of them will share a lowlight, but we always encourage the highlight 'cause that's the fun part, that's the praise. This is what makes it all worth it.- It's a gift. Yeah. So I think God showed me just really how flexible our family can be and especially our children. They really encouraged me in this area because I just saw them going, going, going, and like nothing was really affecting them the way that it was affecting me. And so there's a big encouragement there. And I don't know, like I said, at the end of it, I was pretty worn out. But in the midst of it, seeing our flexibility as a family, it was really cool. The other thing that was a super big highlight was that six, seven week trip we were on. I can't remember exactly how long it was but we went from here in Oregon across all the way to South Dakota. We got to see Mount Rushmore. We came down through Ohio and stayed with family, which was really awesome. We made it all the way to Tennessee, which we both have wanted to explore for a while.- We almost went to Florida.- We almost went to Florida and decided-- This is towards the end of the trip and we're like, let's go home.- Yeah, that would have been a lot of driving, which already was. We went through Arkansas, which Elliot was so excited 'cause in his history book we were reading about Crater of the Diamonds. And so we got to stop off there for the kids and-- And we hunted for diamonds.- For hours.- It was fun.- Digging in the dirt.- If you're ever in Arkansas, you should go do that. That was a lot of fun.- We made a stopover in Waco, which I'm sure everybody knows what I'm talking about, but I've always wanted to go see the silos at Magnolia, and so we got to do that. And I also hit up a couple antique stores while we were there. So we just got to do a lot. I feel like everyone in the family got to do something.- What state did we see that battlefield? Was that in-- That was in South Dakota.- That was in South Dakota? That was so cool. We got to see actual history, the historic sites of where battles took place. I had a lot of fun doing that.- Yeah.- For me, my highlight was seeing how simple we can live. 'Cause we did. Literally, all of our stuff was in these storage pods. So, we didn't have anything with us. And that was pretty cool. We didn't have any place to put anything, so we just had everything we could fit in our car. We had some buckets of clothes for the kids.- I didn't buy extra clothes throughout that time because I didn't have anywhere to put them. I'd only had the buckets.- So we had one small suitcase for us and we just did a lot of laundry whenever we washed.- We're actually gonna share in another episode on this idea of living simple.- Yeah, and so that was a lot of- It was really cool. I almost said it was a lot of fun. It wasn't always a lot of fun.- It was different.- We did have a lot of fun. But living simple, it's a pretty cool thing to see how little you need. We didn't need much. We had our car and our kids and I had my wife and we were like, let's go!- Yeah, don't forget me.- We did.- Do you think our marriage remained strong during this time?- I think you should answer that first and then I'll answer second.- Okay. My answer is yes and no. There were definitely times that I broke down emotionally because I wasn't getting what I wanted. I wanted to be in a home where I could be where I felt purposeful and doing homeschool the way that I envisioned. And I do wanna just say thank you to you, Aaron, because you were a pillar of encouragement throughout that time, reminding me constantly that we chose this, that this was something that we decided together to make an investment for our family in building a home. And so it rattled a lot of different areas of our life, but you reminded me that we are in it together. And that was really encouraging.- And I have always did it super gently.- Perfectly.- And with self-control and not emotional. No. Yes, I did encourage you. But at the same time, I didn't always do it well. But, we did do it and we made it and we survived. Here we are. I also really quickly just wanna shout out and say thank you to a friend of mine who in the midst of the times I would text her that I was having a hard time, where I need prayer, she asked me this question. She said, "What does God have for you in this?" And I love that question because, if I was ever just thinking about myself or what I wanted, that question comes in and kinda hits you in the face. You're like, oh, wait a minute. This is about him. This is about what his will is for us. And what does he have for me in this? It's definitely not to just complain or grumble or wallow in the emotional side of everything, but it's really to consider what's he teaching me. How is he shaping me? How is he using these circumstances to change my life?- Yeah, what's that old adage? He cares more about our character than he does our comfort. And he uses these opportunities in our life to shape us and mold us. So the question is, do you think our marriage remained strong during this transition? I think our marriage did remain strong. I know you said yes and no, but even when there were emotional breakdowns or discouragement or even regrets, I don't believe those things were evidence of our marriage being weak, but rather a test of our marriage's strength. Because those things come. We as individuals can have weak moments, but those weak moments don't define the entirety of our marriage. So when I look at this, I don't see like, oh, because we didn't perfectly have the right attitude the whole time, we must have been weak. Well, we're in the middle of hard things. We have sometimes hard responses. It doesn't mean that it should be that way, but that happens.- I love your perspective. And I wish it was easier for me to see things that way 'cause I do get stuck in that rut, that way of thinking where-- That you failed or something.- That I failed or something that I didn't do it right. Or here I went through four months and didn't pray like I should have, or been consistent in his Word and didn't respond to the circumstances with perfect attitude-- Perfection, yeah.- Like you said and so I get down on myself. But I love that you are saying this as a testimony of our, strength of our marriage, and how we're able to encourage each other throughout it.- Yeah, times will get hard. Emotions will be high. Regrets will creep in. Fears will manifest.- Yeah.- And this is normal and okay. But if they are walked through with Christ and the Spirit, then those moments of weakness become part of the strength that bonds us.- Yes.- And so, was it always great? Was it always perfect? Was it always peaceful and joyful? No. But I don't see that as evidence of our weakness, as in our marriage being weak. I just see those as normal responses to hard things in life. And it's how we chose to walk those out. That is how we practice that strengthening and that strength that we have.- That's good. Well, what do you think helped our marriage stay strong? Like, what's the practical? What did that look like between us?- You brought it up earlier, remembering that this was something that we wanted and actually looked forward to. There's that verse that talks about counting the cost before you build. Like a builder counts the cost. And we did but it's often it's really hard to actually count the emotional and spiritual cost of something, which is actually more important than the actual financial cost of things, which we should calculate all that. But we chose it, we were like, this is good, this is what we want. This is a good investment. It's gonna be good for our family. It's gonna be long but it's gonna be awesome. But it's so hard to anticipate what the 10 months, 12 months is gonna feel like when you're just looking from your moment in time. So I think just remembering, and like me reminding you and reminding myself, like, well, this is a good thing we're doing. This is gonna benefit our family. And yes, this is hard but it's temporary. And we did want this. We have to remember, we want- This was something that we decided as a family to do.- Yep.- I think that helped us.- Something to add to that list there to what you're saying that I think helped our marriage stay strong is prayer and being able to go to God and say, "Hey, we're feeling weak. Hey, we need help. Hey, this"-- I'd say it's a lot of that.- Yeah, there's ton of prayer. But also friends who saw what we were walking through and supported us in that time in different ways, whether it be prayer or encouragement or letting us stay at their house or just come over and use their shower. And I really appreciated that. I also really appreciated talking to you late at night about how I was feeling and you just listening. Not always having an answer, not always having the ability to fix it, but just being there to comfort one another and support each other in that way. Letting me know that crying is okay. That we shouldn't always cry, right? But-- Yeah, sometimes-- But it's gonna come.- Yeah, it's gonna come. Here's a little tip for you, you husbands out there. I've been trying to practice, I'm not good at this very well because I just wanna give the, here's the answer, here's the fix. But trying to practice saying, like, listening to you in the midst of it and then just saying, "Yeah, that's hard." And then you keep going-- It's called validation.- And then I'm like, "Yeah. Yeah, I totally understand." Which is not easy for me 'cause I may not even understand why it seems hard during that moment specifically. Or I wanna give an answer to that why it's so hard or I wanna give a fix, but I've been trying to practice, "Yeah, that's hard. Yeah, I understand."- You say it sincerely.- I do. Like right now, I'm sounding funny but I have been trying to practice that and it actually helps 'cause then you- The next day you're much better.- Yeah, 'cause I just wanna be heard sometimes. I want you to know what I'm going through. All right. We know that you guys are going through life transitions too and so we wanted to share some verses and scripture that would encourage you today through...- Through your transitions.- Through your transitions. So Aaron, you wanna share the first one?- Yeah, Ecclesiastes.- I only pass that off 'cause I hate saying that, Ecclesiastes.- Ecclesiastes 7:8 through 11, "Better is the end of a thing than it's beginning, and the patient in spirit is better than the proud in spirit. Be not quick in your spirit to become angry for anger lodges in the bosom of fools. Say not why were the former days better than these, for it is not from wisdom that you ask this. Wisdom is good with an inheritance, an advantage to those who see the sun.- Okay, when I read this, it was so convicting! It was so convicting 'cause I, well first, just being patient or being proud, it's like in my flesh, I think I know what's right and what needs to happen and how to get it done, but I'm not patient for those things to come about. Yeah, you want the results now rather than waiting for them, knowing that they will come if you continue on.- Yeah, so in my pride, I'm seeing what needs to happen and what I need for my life to be a certain way, and I get angry when it doesn't happen. And I feel really bad about that.- Or if you can't make it happen.- Yeah.- Usually it's like, I can't get this thing to, ugh!- And then being in that place where you think the former days were better and-- That happened quite a few times.- Even our kids say, "I just wanna go back to the old house." There was one time that they said that and-- It breaks our heart because we also missed the old house.- I know, and I almost wonder if they were saying that because they overheard one of us say it.- Maybe.- Yeah, it's just... Do you remember when I encouraged you? For those listening, there was an encouragement I gave to Jennifer during this season, kind of about this idea of always looking backward and always looking forward, but never looking in front of you, like looking right where you're at. Because often we do this in our flesh. We're constantly looking back.- Which in hindsight you can see very clearly.- Yeah, hindsight makes you think that you had all the answers, because it's in the past. And then we're constantly looking forward to the thing that we're anticipating but what that does is, if you're always living in the past and always looking to the future, then you're never experiencing the now. You're never in it now saying, "Okay Lord, I need the strength now. I need patience now, I need your grace now." So that's something that you can be encouraged with is, if you're constantly looking forward or backward, then you're gonna have a really hard time seeing the now.- And being content in that place where God has you in the present.- And in Ecclesiastes, Solomon says, "The only thing you have is today." Not tomorrow, not yesterday. You have today. So let's take advantage of that.- Amen. This next verse is pretty clear. I don't even know if we need to really explain it, but it's Proverbs 3:5, "Trust in the Lord with all your heart and do not lean on your own understanding." So when your pride does flare up and you do think you know what something should be, being able-- Your understanding.- Yeah, being able to lay that down at the foot of Christ and say, "I'm gonna trust you. If this is what you want me to walk through, I'm gonna trust in you."- What I actually think is funny about this is when we don't trust the Lord with all of our hearts, our understanding is usually, I don't understand. Why is it this way? Why is this happening to me? Which is a telltale sign that we're not trusting in the Lord. Okay Lord, you have a reason. What's going on is your will. I wanna trust you.- Sometimes we can look at life transitions and it can be easy to identify what was hard about that because it's what we complained about or what we focused on the most or what we were-- We felt the most.- What we were frustrated about, yeah. A good thing to practice though in hard life transitions is to take what James tells us to heart. James 1:2 through 3 says, "Count it all joy."- All.- Count it all joy.- Well that all really doesn't mean all. What it really means-- Aaron, stop.- "Count it all joy, my brothers, when you meet trials of various kinds for you know that the testing of your faith produces steadfastness." So here's the answer. We go through hard things and the testing of our faith produces steadfastness. We become better.- When we count it all joy. We don't become better when we count it all as suffering or hardship or complaint. But when we counted all joy-- We're able to receive.- Yeah. When we praise God like, okay, thank you for this hard season, teach me what you have for me. Help me in the season. And also what Paul tells us in Philippians 4:8, "Finally, brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there's any excellence, if there's anything worthy of praise, think about these things, having a-- Wait, wait, wait. How can you think about whatever is pure and lovely and commendable when you are stuck in complaining?- Yeah, this isn't lovely. This is not commendable. This is ugly like, yeah.- So is your encouragement that those going through life transitions and it being hard, look for the things that are commendable or-- That's it. Philippians 4:8 tells us that's what we should be thinking about. There might be things that are hard or ugly in the midst of-- Or that we don't understand.- But what in the midst of it is good? What in the midst of it is lovely and pure and excellent and commendable? And so going back to that idea of, hey, we chose this.- Being thankful for it.- Yeah, okay. That's good and commendable, we chose a good thing. These things are also hard.- What happens if you don't choose it and you're going through a hard life transition?- Well, you're gonna be stuck in the, oh, if you didn't choose the hard transition now-- Because you can't rely on saying, "Well, we chose this." It's just something that's happening.- Well that was just one thing in our situation. That was a good and commendable and pure thing to consider, like, oh, this was a choice we made. And that's okay. If it's something that's being done to you, something that you have no control-- Out of your control.- For which, most transitions in life are out of our control.- I know.- In reality. We still think about what's good and commendable and pure. So it's a heart of thanks and thankfulness and looking for the good in God's will and it saves us from so much heartache and frustration. 'Cause the other way, it just leaves us with heartache and frustration.- I recently had re-posted this next verse on my Insta Stories, but I shared a graphic poster that was done by Scripture Type and it's so beautiful. And so I posted it I think on a Friday, Saturday, and that next Sunday, my friend came up to me and was like,- Oh yeah, so pretty.- Hey, I wanted to give you a heads up before I got here, but don't buy that for yourself 'cause I got it for you. And she gave it to me as a gift and I love it so much. So, if you love your friends, stop their stories and then get good gift ideas from that. Okay.- From things they post.- Here it is, Isaiah 48: "The grass withers, the flower fades, but the Word of our God's will stand forever." And this is just that encouragement that our circumstances are constantly changing and shifts will occur and happen. What we have now will not always be, but what is faithful? The Lord's Word. And we can trust him and we need to be in the Word to be encouraged by it.- Yeah, I like that 'cause the grass withering, the flower fades, this in essence is-- Seasonal.- Well it's saying that sometimes the good things and the beautiful things that you hold onto-- Will come to an end.- They will come to an end.- Yeah.- But that's okay. Everything's gonna burn away. But the Word of God doesn't. And we can stand on that. And so in these seasons that are hard, husbands encourage your wives with the Word of God, which does not change. Remind them of the truth. And then wives, encourage your husbands with the Word of God, which does not change. And it's true.- Yeah. I admit that during our transition, I was not very good at pouring time into reading God's Word. Because we kept shifting so much, there was just no consistency. And I was dipping in here and there, but it just wasn't the same as what it had been. And I was in this cycle of staying busy, and then tired, busy and then tired, busy and then tired, just waiting for my circumstances to change. I can't implement another routine until this one thing is done.- I'll be better when this happens.- Yeah. And so looking forward and pushing everything off until that happened. And I'm just sharing that with you guys so that you don't do what I did. So just learn from my mistake and know that the number one way you can remain-- Constant.- Constant and-- And steadfast.- And steadfast in a season of life transitions is to be in God's Word and to be in prayer. And feeding your mind and your heart and your spirit with him.- Hm mm. We can't hope to remain strong if we're not feeding. Like if you're working out and you don't have the protein and the carbs and all the things your body needs, you're gonna have atrophy and you're not gonna be able to do it. You'd be too tired. It's the same in our spirit. God wants us to- We don't read his Word to earn anything from God. We do it to gain what comes from reading his Word, which is strength and power and steadfastness and authority and purity and all these things and transformation.- Yeah. Speaking of transformation, I've been going to the gym. I've been having a coach walk me through.- Jennifer's taken on all the things that I used to do. And I'm not doing them now and she is.- I had to jump in and do something for my body.- Proud of her.- Thank you. But remember that perspective that you were sharing earlier about just not wallowing in failure and being able to do the next right thing? Well, I had a conviction when I was learning a new lift. My coach encouraged me, he goes, "You're gonna be doing this thing. And while you're doing it, I'm gonna walk you through areas you can improve, like micro movements."- You love that when people tell you like how you should be better and-- What Aaron is saying is I don't like being told what to do. Okay, ha! I get it. But for the sake of lifting properly, I'm trying to pay attention to everything he's saying but I love that he came and gave me that encouragement first that, what he said was is, "Don't think about how you're doing it wrong. Just listen to me as you go and try and make adjustments to do the right thing." And as he is talking, I'm immediately thinking about God saying this to me about a conviction that I've had about my prayer life, especially during this life transition and being in his Word. And it's like he was saying to me, "Don't wallow in failure that you didn't"-- Do it right.- Do it right throughout this transition but I want you to do the next right thing. I want you to make adjustments. And so I have been taking those steps and I've been feeling so much better, so much closer to the Lord. And so I just wanted to encourage you guys that if you're in a place where you're like, well, I haven't been doing it right, or I see myself as failing, just pick up right now and do the next right thing. Make those adjustments that you need to do.- Hm mm. Yeah, that's really good. I'll leave it at that.- Okay then.- So even though we've been talking about life transitions and how circumstances can shift our lives and our routines up, other words that define transition are growth, development, progress, transformation. Like what you were talking about. We can look at these seasons of our life as negative things or hard things, like, oh, I hate when change comes or this is too hard, I wish we can go back to our comfort that we had. But that's really what a transition is, is going from, you got comfortable-- And now you're not.- Now you're not!- I was gonna say, when I go through life transitions, I don't feel like there's development or progress or transformation. Like you don't feel those things in the midst of it.- No, but if we don't recognize it, we might, as the Bible says, kick against the goads. We're trying to be led a certain way. The idea by being kicking against the goads is that the oxen would have a goad on their heels so that if they kicked to fight against where they're being led, it would hurt them. And it said, "No, you're gonna go where I want you to go." And so we could kick against the goads and then we won't. We'll just remain in our old way of thinking, our old way of being our old comforts. When I think God wants to use everything in our life to grow us and transform us and mature us.- So what you're saying is we need to remain humble and teachable.- Pliable.- And pliable and-- And joyful and count it all-- Count it all joy.- Count it all joy, yeah.- Philippians 3:12 says, "Not that I have already obtained this or am already perfect but I press on to make it my own because Christ Jesus has made me his own." And this is the why we do what we do as Christians. This is why we counted all joy. We choose to be faithful and rely on God because Christ has made us his.- And it's not that we've already obtained any of it, but we press forward, we press on to what God has for us. So the perspective we hope to leave with you today is seeing how our life transitions move us toward growth, as we choose to do what is right, as we respond to those circumstances. When we change the way we think about them, we change the way we receive them and walk in them, I think we can- I don't think. We will grow and we'll mature and we'll be better for it. Amen?- Amen.- Weekly Challenge, 'cause this is the end of it. We're gonna do a challenge-- Ding, ding, ding, ding!- This is a new thing.- I feel like we need a little insert of chimes or something.- Some noise.- This week's challenge is to play game together. You might have one already that you can use. You could borrow one from a friend or just go buy it. Hit up Amazon.- If you don't have any games, you should go. 'Cause we've known friends that don't like games.- You don't have to like games to play it-- But you should own some.- You should have some. Okay, so here are just a couple that you could play with just two people. Chess, checkers, Scrabble. Card games, like War. But if you wanna be more active, pickleball is one of my favorite right now. I love pickle ball.- Volleyball is fun too but you need a few more people I think.- Yeah, probably. I mean you could volley but just with the ball.- Oh yeah.- You could play Catch.- That's true. So the challenge this week is get out or in and play a game with your spouse.- It'll be fun, I promise.- So Jennifer, we're gonna keep doing this and we always have done this. Will you close us in prayer?- Yes. Dear Lord, thank you for the transitions of life. Thank you for walking us through different seasons and circumstances to show us areas of our lives you want us to grow in. The varying seasons of life help us to learn to be patient. And they also teach us to be content where we are. Lord, we know transitions and changes will always come. Some may be anticipated and some may be unexpected. Some may even be tragic. But in all these things, please teach us to rely on you, to run to you for our hope and to remain in your Word, to sustain us and strengthen us. We pray for the husband and wife listening right now. We pray you would be their shelter and their strong tower. We pray they would walk in thanksgiving and joy during whatever transitions they're currently going through or about to enter into. Lord, you are so good. We love you and we ask that you would help us to keep in step with your Holy Spirit no matter what life brings. In Jesus' name, amen.- Amen. We love you all and we look forward to having you for our next episode next week.- Thank you for joining us for another episode of the "Marriage After God" podcast.- If you found today's episode fun and encouraging, please take a moment to share it on social media or in an email to some of your married friends.- Also, would you please take a moment and leave us a review? Reviews help to spread the word about our podcast.- Be sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode. And you can always check out more of our resources at marriageaftergod.com.- You can follow us on social media for more marriage encouragement on Facebook and Instagram @MarriageAfterGod, @HusbandRevolution and @UnveiledWife.- We hope you have an incredible week and look forward to sharing more with you next week on the "Marriage After God" podcast. ♪ La, la, la, la, la, la ♪ ♪ La, la, la, la, la ♪ ♪ La, la, la, la, la ♪ ♪ La, la, la, la, la, la ♪ ♪ La, la, la, la, la ♪ ♪ La, la, la, la, la ♪Weekly Challenge:Play a game together - you might have it already, you can barrow it from a friend or go buy it! Chess, checkers, scrabble, card games like war, more active pickle ball or horse or catchPrayer:Dear Lord, Thank You for the transitions of life. Thank You for walking us through different seasons and circumstances to show us areas of our lives You want us to grow in. The varying seasons of life help us to learn to be patient and they also teach us to be content where we are. Lord, we know transitions and changes will always come, some may be anticipated and some may be unexpected, some may even be tragic, but in all these things please teach us to rely on You, to run to You for our hope and to remain in Your Word to sustain us and strengthen us. We pray for the husband and wife listening to this right now. We pray You would be their shelter and strong tower. We pray they would walk in thanksgiving and joy during whatever transitions they are currently going through or about to enter into. Lord, You are good. We love You and ask You to help us keep in step with Your Holy Spirit no matter what this life brings.In Jesus’ name AMEN!  Connect With UsInstagram | @marriageaftergodInstagram | @unveiledwifeInstagram | @husbandrevolutionCheck out our marriage resources!SponsorsGet our new book The Marriage Gift - 365 prayers for your marriage!

The Passover feast was established by God to the Israelites in the time of Moses. It was a symbol of the Lord's deliverance of the Israelites from slavery in Egypt. The feast was celebrated each year to remember the Lord's faithfulness and provision. The Passover feast had a number of components, including the sacrificing of a lamb, the eating of unleavened bread, and the drinking of wine. All of these components had great symbolic meaning in the Passover feast. In the New Testament, Jesus Christ is seen as fulfilling each of these components of the Passover feast. Jesus is seen as the ultimate Passover Lamb, whose sacrificial death was the fulfillment of the Old Testament sacrificial system. In the Book of John, Jesus refers to himself as the "bread from heaven" and the "true bread of life." In doing so, he is referring to the unleavened bread that was part of the Passover feast. Jesus was referring to himself as the spiritual sustenance that his followers would need in order to survive in a hostile world. Finally, Jesus refers to himself as the "true vine" in the Book of John. In doing so, he is referring to the wine that was part of the Passover feast. Jesus was referring to himself as the source of spiritual sustenance for his followers, which would give them strength and courage to live for him. Jesus fulfilled the Passover feast in his life, death, and resurrection. In his life, he lived a perfect life of obedience to the Father and set an example for us to follow. In his death, he sacrificed his own life as the ultimate Passover Lamb, fulfilling the old sacrificial system. In his resurrection, he demonstrated victory over death and the promise of eternal life for all who believe in him. The Passover feast was established to remind the Israelites of the Lord's faithfulness and provision. In Jesus, the fullness of the Passover feast is seen and fulfilled. He is the ultimate Passover Lamb, the bread of life, and the true vine. Through him, we can experience the ultimate deliverance from slavery to sin, and have the hope of eternal life. - [Jennifer] Welcome to the Marriage After God podcast. - [Aaron] We're your hosts. I'm Aaron - [Jennifer] And I'm Jennifer. - [Aaron] We've been married for 14 years. - [Jennifer] And we have five young children. - [Aaron] We started blogging over 10 years ago sharing our marriage story in hopes of encouraging other husbands and wives to draw closer to God and closer to each other. - [Jennifer] We have authored over 10 books together including our newest book "Marriage After God," the book that inspired us to start this podcast. - [Aaron] "Marriage After God" has a message to remind all of us that God designed marriage with a purpose. - [Jennifer] to reflect his love. - [Aaron] To be a light in this world. - [Jennifer] To work together as a team. - [Aaron] Using what he has given us. - [Jennifer] To build his kingdom. - [Aaron] Our hope is to encourage you along your marriage journey. - [Jennifer] As you boldly chase after God together. - [Aaron] This is Marriage After God. - [Aaron] Hey, welcome back to the final episode of season five. We're Aaron and Jennifer Smith. - [Jennifer] Your host of Marriage After God. - [Aaron] And we're glad to have you. I hope you've enjoyed this season. All the various episodes we've had. It's been awesome. And I know that even though this is the last episode of the season, we wanna let you know that we will be back. So this isn't the end. We've been trying to do, I mean, we have five kids now we're doing a lot of things on the other side of this microphone and we're just trying to give ourselves breaks between seasons so that yeah we can bring you the best content and we don't get burned out ourselves because it's a lot of work being parents and doing this podcast. - [Jennifer] So you guys can expect us to begin seasons six in the fall, early fall, unless for some reason we're able to do it sooner. And if you wanna know when it will launch be sure to sign up for our daily prayer emails because we use those every once in a while to share information like when a new season's launched and you can sign up for that at https://marriageafterGod.com or you can follow us on social media. - [Aaron] Not or and. And follow us. Yeah. We like to post when we're gonna be doing new episodes. So follow us there. Speaking of seasons, we're just about in spring. - [Jennifer] We're in one of my favorite. Yeah, this is one of my favorite seasons. I love springtime. I love the change of crisp, warm. It's like crisp, cold warm weather. - [Aaron] Well, today when the clouds covered the sun it was cool and then when the sun came out, it was warm. It was awesome. - [Jennifer] Yeah it was awesome. And just the signs of life coming back. My passion for gardening comes back. 'Cause I take a break in the winter. - [Aaron] It begins to bloom. - [Jennifer] Yeah. Super fun. Hopefully you guys are gardening. Get your hands in the dirt a little bit. If you aren't, I just wanna encourage you to do that. It's a great learning tool for your children. Me and the kids like to get out there and we'll just look at stuff, growing and talk about it and pull weeds. - [Aaron] There's nothing better, I think than eating something that you grew. - [Jennifer] Yeah, it is pretty awesome. - [Aaron] When we get the tomatoes, it's like my favorite. - [Jennifer] Pretty cool. So anyway, spring I love it. - [Aaron] We're here. - [Jennifer] I was just thinking for some reason, I don't usually wrap up in a blanket to podcast with you, Aaron but I'm wrapped up in what we call the cuddle blanket. And I was just thinking that we've had this blanket for a really long time. I remember buying it right before we had Elliot and none of our kids have been attached to a blanket, a blankie or whatever. And which is fine. It doesn't matter if they did or not. But I was just thinking how they aren't but I am because this cuddle blanket has been everything to me. And the longer I have it, the more connected I feel like what would happen if I lost this? I dunno. - [Aaron] All the kids like it too. They play with it. This is the blanket they want when they're on the couch with everyone. - [Jennifer] Sometimes every once in a while. - [Aaron] So Jennifer has a blankie. - [Jennifer] Sometimes when I'm tucking the kids one of the kids to bed, they will ask me will you go get it and put it on top of me. - [Aaron] Do they call it the cuddle blanket too? - [Jennifer] Well just started calling it the cuddle blanket go get me the cuddle blanket. True, he likes to sit on the couch with me, but he is always chilly. And so he'll bring me the blanket. Yeah like mom come cuddle me anyway. - [Aaron] It's like their cue or cue like, okay. - [Jennifer] I have it right now. And I was just thinking if anything happened to it I don't know what I would do. It's like not replaceable. Now I feel for all those little kids who had a blanky and in it got tattered and washed to many times. Anyway that was a side tangent. - [Aaron] Yeah. Hey, I just wanted to thank everyone that if you've been one of our share warriors sharing on your social media or with a friend or an email or a text message about our podcast, we just. - [Jennifer] Thank you. - [Aaron] You guys are awesome. We've been seeing so many people posting about it and just sharing their favorite episodes. And if that's one of you and if you're listening right now we just wanna say, thank you. You've really blessed us this season. - [Jennifer] Also at the end of this episode would you guys please take a moment to leave us a star rating review or even a written review. Maybe if you've been following along this whole season, you can mention, what this season has meant to you. The reason that we ask that you guys do this is is just because when it comes to algorithms and people finding the Marriage After God podcast these ratings and reviews helps so much and they also bless us. So I just wanted to also give one final thank you to those of you who have posted a review or send out those rankings. So thank you to those of you who have and to those of you who have yet to do it please do that at the end of this episode. Thank you. - [Aaron] Yeah. Also with the thing, the free thing that we always talk about, we've been promoting it quite a bit this last season is the marriage prayer challenge. Since we're gonna be taking a break and if you haven't done this yet, this is the perfect opportunity for you to do it. It's completely free. And it's an email that we send you every day for 31 days, just reminding you to pray for your spouse. And we also give you a specific topic to pray for and some scripture to go with it. So we wanna bless you with that. It's completely free. We love making these kinda resources that you can access and that just encourage you on a daily basis. It's https://marriageprayerchallenge.com. And also while I'm at it I'll just tell you about parentingprayerchallenge.com for you, moms and dads, to take a challenge to pray for your sons or daughters or both. - [Jennifer] Cool and lastly, just in this beginning part, before we jump into today's topic. - [Aaron] Lastly, lastly, lastly lastly. - [Jennifer] Every once in a while, we'll share a resource, something that's encouraged us or inspired us on our, for so many different things. I was gonna say journey but it's really just life. Specifically for today's topic of Jesus being our Passover. There's two books that I wanna recommend. "A Family Guide to the Biblical Holidays," which at the end also includes some homeschool unit studies, which is pretty cool. So if you homeschool that could be something you guys are interested in and then another one called "Messiah "and the Feasts of Israel." So I know there's a ton more out there and it's good just to share resources. So there you go. - [Aaron] So as we start this topic, which was, this topics coming up because what's coming up. - [Jennifer] I was gonna say, we like Jesus. We like to talk about him. - [Aaron] Yeah we like talking about Jesus. But what's coming up soon? - [Jennifer] Well, we grew up celebrating Easter-- - [Aaron] Or resurrection Sunday. - [Jennifer] Resurrection Sunday and I think a lot of people listening go yeah yeah. And it was a pivotal time in the year that we celebrated specifically Jesus' death and resurrection. And for a lot of other people they would celebrate Passover. - [Aaron] Yeah. Specifically Jewish people. But there's a lot of people also that celebrate that aren't Jewish, but that and what we celebrate on resurrection Sunday have a lot to do with each other. And there's amazing symbolism and imagery in the Passover feast that point to Jesus in so many powerful ways. And so much of the Bible is that way. So much of the old Testament specifically is pointing to Jesus. And so much in the new Testament is pointing back to Jesus this idea of Christ centric that Christ is the substance. And we'll talk about that but that's why I wanna talk about this because that day that holiday's coming up soon and it's so important to know what the Bible says about Jesus and all these different pictures in the Bible. - [Jennifer] Yeah. There's actually seven biblical feasts that are split up in the spring months and the fall months. And each one is not only does it foreshadow Christ and symbolize his testimony in special ways but the first four, he has already fulfilled in their timeline, which I think is amazing and incredible. And I'm just gonna leave that right there for you listeners, go research that if you haven't done that, go research that. So it'll be interesting to see how God and Jesus fulfill the fall ones. - [Aaron] Yeah. And just to give a little insight of what you're talking about. So they have these feasts throughout the old Testament that God gave to the Israelites to commemorate certain things that he did for them. But when Jesus came, he actually fulfilled the purpose of those feasts in his life, death and resurrection. And so that's what you're talking about but fulfilling them. And so, yeah, although keeping the feasts, by the way and the ceremonial laws are not something that Christians are supposed to observe. It's not a part of our salvation. The are things that we could totally choose to do. There's no prohibition of it, but it's not necessary for our salvation. It's not necessary for our walk, but there's definitely something that we can and should look into and understand about these feasts because they tell us and help us understand that the mystery of the gospel - [Jennifer] And also the heritage of our savior. - [Aaron] Oh yeah, 'cause our savior is a Jew. He's Jewish. I think as Christians, we forget that. That Jesus was himself, a Jew celebrated all of these feasts and festivals, adhered to the law of God himself. And that's awesome. And so I just wanna read real quick, Colossians 2:17. It tells us "These are shadows of the things to come "but the substance belongs to Christ." So all of these things that God gave to the Israelites, the feast, the ceremonies, the things that they were to do were shadows. And so the shadow, isn't the thing. So if there's a tree casting, a shadow the shadow is not the tree. The tree is the tree. And so we have these shadows that they point to the substance, the substance is Christ. The thing that cast the shadow is the savior. And so when we see these feasts, we see the shape of the savior and that's what we're gonna see in the Passover. - [Jennifer] Okay. Okay. But this is a marriage podcast, Aaron. So I mean, why are we talking about this? - [Aaron] Well, first of all, we it's called marriage after God. So we like to talk about God and I like to look at it as we're not necessarily a marriage podcast. We are a gospel podcast and we'd like to use our marriage to present the gospel. - [Jennifer] I like that. - [Aaron] I don't know that that's how I look at it. Marriage is something that God's given us and we use it as a tool for him. And what a powerful thing that he's given us, is our marriage that we can grow and learn and be used for each other in our growth. I know that's so, yeah, it's our marriage. Also. I think about how we talk so much in our marriage about God, about things we learned in the Bible about things that we're reading things that we're thinking about, things that we see in the news, things that we hear we're like, Hey, what do you think of this? And we have, so it's actually the most important part of our marriage. It's the largest part of our marriage. And it also helps our marriage be strengthened and grow and we learn each other. So talking about God, talking about these things in your marriage is super important. - [Jennifer] Good, we, okay. So that's really good, really great. I like throwing those questions at you and see what you have to say. You're encouraging. We just wanna let you guys know we hope that this episode encourages you. We hope that it teaches you something maybe you didn't know before stimulate the conversation with your spouse like Aaron said, and just get your heart focused on what God has done and what he's doing. Because like you already mentioned, we're going into this season very soon of Passover and Easter and remembering what Jesus Christ did for us on the cross. It was death and resurrection. - [Aaron] So the name of this episode is Jesus is the Passover. And so the question is, is did we just come up with that? Or does the Bible say that? - [Jennifer] Well, first Corinthians 5:7 says "For Christ our Passover lamb has been sacrificed." - [Aaron] So Paul tells us and shows us that Christ is the Passover lamb. So our savior is our Passover. He's saved us from the wrath of God. That's what this is essentially talking about. - [Jennifer] So today we're gonna just talk about we're using this scripture to kind of set us up but we're gonna be talking about the correlations that we see in this Jewish feast and what Jesus has done. So let's start by taking a little history lesson the Passover, what was it? And why did it happen? - [Aaron] Well, if your note on this timeline is correct. It was about 3,400 years ago, which is a long time. - [Jennifer] A really long time if you think about it in light of family tradition. So I think about things in my childhood or things that I've seen other people do that are family ingrained family tradition. And they've been through the decades. - [Aaron] Have they lasted 3,400 years? - [Jennifer] That's what I'm saying is that's a crazy long time to continue to do something - [Aaron] One it just shows you that this feast this tradition that the Jews today still celebrate pretty much the same way. It's always been celebrated since it happened. And what we're gonna read about in Exodus chapter 12, it shows that it's not founded in anything earthly. It's something that God gave them. And so they still have it, which is a pretty amazing thing. So let's read it. It takes us back to the book of Exodus. I'm starting in chapter 12, verse one. And this is where the Passover feast began. And this is actually where a lot of things began actually. - [Jennifer] I was just gonna set up. So God's people had been in Egypt for like 400 years and became slaves. So, okay now go. - [Aaron] Yeah. And so God comes to Moses and says I want my people to be free. And so he commissions Moses to go talk to Pharaoh and God gives them 10 plagues to help convince Pharaoh to let the people go and to show his glory and his might and his power. And we're about to read about the 10th plague. And so leading up to this, the first nine plagues didn't really as you would say, touch the Hebrews. So everything was affecting the Egyptians but not necessarily them, but this plague, the 10th plague had the ability to touch anyone who didn't follow the ritual that God gives them, the command that God gives them to be saved from this plague. So let's start in verse one of chapter 12. "The Lord said to Moses and Aaron in the land of Egypt "this month shall be for you the beginning of months. "It shall be the first month of the year for you. "Tell all the congregation of Israel that "on the 10th day of this month, every man shall take a lamb "according to their father's houses, a lamb for a household. "And if the household is too small for a lamb "then he and his nearest neighbors shall take according "to the number of persons, according to what each can eat "you shall make your count of the lamb. "Your lamb shall be without blemish, a male, a year old. "You may take it from the sheep or from the goats "and you shall keep it until the 14th day of this month. "When the whole assembly of the congregation of Israel "shall kill their lambs at Twilight. "Then they shall take some of the blood "and put it on the two door posts "and on the lintel of the house, in which they eat it. "They shall eat the flesh that night "roasted on the fire with unleavened bread and bitter herbs. "They shall eat it. "Do not eat any of it raw or boiled in water "but roasted its head with its legs and its inner parts. "And you shall let, none of it remain until morning. "Anything that remains until morning you shall burn. "In this manner you shall eat it with your belts, "fastened your sandals on your feet "and your staff in your hand "And you shall eat it in haste. "It is the Lord's Passover for, I will pass through the land "of Egypt that night, and it will strike all the firstborn "in the land of Egypt, both man and beast "and on all the gods of Egypt, I will execute judgments. "I am the Lord. "The blood shall be a sign for you. "on the houses where you are. "And when I see the blood, I will pass over you "and no plague will be fall you to destroy you "when I strike the land of Egypt." So we have Passover being instituted, right now to save the Hebrews from their firstborn being destroyed. God's gonna go destroy the first born of everyone in Egypt, unless there's blood over their doors. This is the beginning of Passover. And so we see pretty closely or pretty quickly the symbolism and what's happening. Salvation - [Jennifer] Yeah. I mean, overall, there's this picture of people in bondage and a miraculous rescue by God. And we can say there is the same picture in the gospel that we're all familiar with. People in bondage to sin and God providing a miraculous rescue. This is just like the overall big picture theme. - [Aaron] Yeah and there's-- - [Jennifer] Wait there's so more. - [Aaron] There's so much more. A cool note here. God used the first Passover to be a moment that he started the calendar over. He says, this will be the first month for you of years. So he literally gives them a fresh start. Not just that, but it's more than a fresh start. It's a new life. None of us can just go back and be like, Hey I'm just gonna start my life over today. The calendar starts now. - [Jennifer] How many of us have thought let's just start over. Let's just have that time back. - [Aaron] God did that for them. He said, you know what? You've been for bondage for 400 years, but let's just your year starts right now today, new year, new you. You're gonna be, but this is what God does with us when he saves us through Jesus. Behold the old is passed away and all things have become new. There is no more old man. He is dead. There's only the new man, the new creation. This is what we are in Christ. Born again, as Nicodemus would ask Jesus how am I crawl back up into my mom's womb. Yeah. But like, that's what happens. He's like, well, unless you become born again we have this new calendar with Christ. And I just, that was a really cool thing that I noticed is your day start today. - [Jennifer] That's so cool. Okay so the first detail that we're gonna explore here from the Passover is blood, because that was the main thing that God was commanding them to do. And the thing that he gave them to be saved. - [Aaron] Yeah the blood was the thing. It wasn't all of the other things. Of course they had to obey but it was the blood that he would see. That was the sign was the blood over the door. - [Jennifer] I was gonna say, just as a reminder, Exodus, 12:13 says "The blood shall be assigned for you "on the houses where you are. "And when I see the blood, I will pass over you "and no plague will be for you to destroy you "when I strike the land of Egypt." - [Aaron] Yeah. So I wanna give a question that everyone listening has probably never thought of. And it's just boggles my mind, but it is what it is. Why is blood necessary for saving us? Well, Hebrews 9:22 says, "Indeed, under the law "almost everything is purified with blood. "And without the shedding of blood "there is no forgiveness of sins." And I just asked myself, why is blood the thing, okay? But it is. So we see Adam and Eve when they sinned, God said surely in the day that you ate that tree you're going to die, but what happened? Instead of them dying, God sacrificed an animal and covered them with skins of an animal. So there was this substitutionary atonement. That's the theological term for this. Instead of them dying, something else died. In Egypt, it was the Lamb's blood on the door, in the temple it was the blood of the sacrifices that atoned for the sins of the people. And ultimately all of this points to the fact that although blood is required for the forgiveness of sins, we have the will of God that he says it's not God's will that any should perish but that all would come to the knowledge of Christ. So he doesn't want our blood, but the blood is necessary. And in reality, what's the truth about our blood versus Christ blood? - [Jennifer] Well, his was perfect. His was the only one capable of doing this miraculous thing. - [Aaron] Yeah. So no animals, blood, no other human beings blood could cover any one sin let alone the whole sin of the world. But Christ's could the blood that he shed, makes white as snow, the blood that he shed, covers everything, covers every sin. And that's just amazing. I just wanted to point that out that Christ blood is more powerful even than Lamb's blood over the doorpost. - [Jennifer] Yeah. That's awesome. One thing that I did when I was looking into this a while ago is I looked at what's lentil 'cause you hear that word and you're like you assume what it is but just to make sure everyone's listening right now it's so he says to put the blood on the doorposts the two doorposts and the lintel that's just the horizontal beam above the door. And so you get this picture of the two sides and the top covered with blood and Aaron I don't know if you remember this but we did a family Bible time like a year ago or two years ago. And you were teaching the kids and you jumped up and ran to the door to show them where the blood would have been placed. And as you're doing it, you're making the motion and you do it over and over and over again. And the kids finally see, Oh, it's a cross. And I just think that that was so cool that that was all tied together like that visibly. How beautiful, God is so cool that he shows those pictures like that. - [Aaron] It's beautiful. And there's more, there's so many more elements to this that we're gonna see that God's using. Again these are shadows. This is what Hebrews tells us that these are shadows pointing to the substance. - [Jennifer] So let's look at something that we won't find at Passover is that weird to just go there. - [Aaron] Well, we're gonna talk about a bunch of things that you will find but we're starting with something that you won't find. - [Jennifer] Okay. In Exodus 12:8 God tells the people what they must do to save their firstborn from the destroyer. It says "They shall eat the flesh that night "roasted on the fire with unleavened bread." - [Aaron] That's interesting, right? Why unleavened bread? And if you don't know what unleavened bread is, leaven is yeast. You put it in bread and it rises. That's all yeast does. It's the sugars and it makes. - [Jennifer] It makes it all puffy and good. Why we like bread. - [Aaron] We love leavened bread. But God told them to eat unleavened bread. And so leavened here shows us something. So just first and foremost, they need to be ready to go right after eating the Passover which is an amazing thing to think about. God's like, I want you to eat this, but you better eat it in haste 'cause you're getting out of here quickly. So don't linger. Don't take your time. He even tells him to throw the goat or the lamb whole on the fire. Don't take the entrails out. Don't take nothing. He's like cook it. And he's like, then don't take it with you throw it on the fire and let it burn up. It shows you this urgency which is another cool picture. That word urgency. We always bring it up for salvation. But yeast, if you don't have looked back then they didn't have a little packets of yeast. What they would do is they'd put the bread in a bowl cover it in a towel and they'd set out on and the yeast is in the air and it takes time to rise. God's like, no, take it, flatten it out, cook it. - [Jennifer] You'll be fine. - [Aaron] Yeah. But he actually tells them, for seven days. - [Jennifer] To be cleaning it out. - [Aaron] To clean it out of the house, that there'd be no leaven. So on the first day, cleaned it out and then no leaven and they're supposed to eat unleavened bread for seven days. But this is this idea of of urgency quickly that they don't take time. But what other things does leaven represent in the Bible. - [Jennifer] Well it represents sin, pride, unbelief, impurity. - [Aaron] And so God's showing he's like, get it out get all of this out 'cause I'm taking you somewhere new. And I think it also represents this idea of lingering and waiting. Like I was saying, it takes time for bread to rise. And if they would have not done that, they're like, well it's God really, it's almost like an unbelief. It's a waiting rather than doing. I'm not gonna do I'm gonna wait. So I don't know. That was just a little thought I had about leaven 'cause it takes time to get that yeast in the dough. - [Jennifer] So Exodus 12:15 is where it talks about getting the leaven out of your houses. It says "Seven days you shall eat unleavened bread. "On the first day, you shall remove leaven "out of your houses for if anyone eats, "what is leavened from the first day until the seventh day "that person shall be cut off from Israel." So people clean up their homes like Aaron had already mentioned. - [Aaron] They remove everything they sweep it. But this shows us a picture of what Paul tells us in first Corinthians that we too, as believers must clean out the leaven. We gotta let the Lord sweep every corner of our hearts to cleanse us and transform us to remove that leaven from us. I want you to read first Corinthians five seven through eight. - [Jennifer] It says "Cleanse out the old leaven "that you may be a new lump "as you really are unleavened. "For Christ our Passover lamb has been sacrificed. "Let us therefore celebrate the festival "not with the old Leaven, the leaven of malice and evil "but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth." - [Aaron] So he shows us right here, the substance of this thing that God gave the Israelites. He's telling them about bread. We're seeing what he means by it. The unleavened bread of sincerity and truth. Jesus tells us that one day he tells the woman at the well he's like one day my people will worship me in spirit and in truth. And so he's showing us like, hey cleanse out the old leaven that you may be new lump. There's that word new again. But he says, as you really are unleavened. So the reality is is we are unleavened therefore get rid of the leaven. It's like this. And you see this throughout the new Testament a lot. Put the old man to death, continue to kill the old man. You're a new man you've died. So there's this dichotomy of I'm a new creation and I still have an old nature and we're working towards sanctification. But this is something that we get to look at as believers is like, is there any leaven that we're holding on to? That we're not letting the Lord clean out. We're fighting it and saying, well, no I wanna keep that. Paul warns us that a little bit of leaven leaven the whole lump. - [Jennifer] That's so good. We're gonna take this a little bit further. The Hebrew word for what we're talking about, this unleavened bread is called Matzo and it's like a flat bread. I've seen it and used it. It's got holes in it. And it also has like these burned stripes in it which I think is really interesting. It's just from the baking process but Matza is a picture of Christ's body. And so I just wanted to read Isaiah 53:5 It says, "But he was pierced for our transgressions. "He was crushed for our iniquities "upon him was the chastisement that brought us peace. "And with his wounds, we are healed. - [Aaron] And then which, by the way is it-- - [Jennifer] How beautiful. - [Aaron] Is a perfect picture of the gospel right there in Isaiah, thousands thousand years before Jesus give or take I don't know exactly how long it is, but in first Corinthians 11:24, it calls him the bread of life. It says and when he given thanks speaking of Jesus, he broke it and said, this is my body which is for you do, this in remembrance of me. And when he's doing this he's referencing the Passover feast, the last supper. This is referencing him taking the Matza and breaking it. And we're actually gonna learn about the second about what he broke. Why don't you read John 6:35. - [Jennifer] "Jesus said to them, I am the bread of life. "Whoever comes to me shall not hunger. "And whoever believes in me shall never thirst." - [Aaron] This verse is gonna be interesting in a minute about what we're gonna learn next. But this is all pointing to the fact that Jesus is our Matza. He's our bread. He is the bread that they ate on that night was an image of them consuming the bread of life, the savior, which is what we're told to do so - [Jennifer] Real quick. I just, I love you were talking about how, Jesus was at the Passover explaining to his disciples, what it meant. So he is the substance telling them, holding the shadow in his hand, telling them this is me. I just think that's so cool. - [Aaron] Well and the Jews have been doing it for years, decades, generations. And he just told them he was like, this mystery is me. - [Jennifer] The other thing to think about just really quick on it little silly tangent is Jesus grew up doing Passover with his family. And I wonder, I'm not gonna say I wonder how long he knew 'cause he knew, but participating in that way a Passover, knowing what he knew of who he was but not saying anything to anyone until this moment, I don't know. - [Aaron] That's amazing. Who knows if, it blows my mind. So moving on from the Matza, one of the traditions with the Matza during the Passover is a thing called the is it afikoman? - [Jennifer] Afikoman. - [Aaron] Yeah. Why don't you explain what that is 'cause it's a really beautiful thing. - [Jennifer] Yeah. The afikoman is three pieces of Matza that they placed in a special bag. And afikoman is common is actually a Greek word that means that which comes after or people know it as dessert. And in the beginning of the Passover meal they remove the second piece, the middle piece of matza, they break it, they wrap it in white linen, they hide it until the very end and then a child finds it and is rewarded. - [Aaron] If you don't see all the symbols in this, I don't know wat to say. - [Jennifer] I love that it's a child that goes looking for it. - [Aaron] So that was the first thing. When I read about this the first thing I thought of is Matthew 18:3. And Jesus said, "Truly, I say to you "unless you turn and become like children "you will never enter the kingdom of heaven." And up until this point the Jews have been celebrating Passover ever since they left Egypt and the children would find the Matza. The children would look for the bread of life, the broken bread. Think about that. So we just talked about his body being broken and also that three number, God the father, God, the son, God, the Holy spirit. And then you have this picture of them taking the one and breaking it and hiding it for till the end of the meal. And it just makes me think of Jesus being taken from the Godhead because it says he was, separated from the father that he, there was a moment when he the wrath of God was on Jesus for us. And he was broken for our inequities. Okay. And then he was wrapped in linen and hidden for three days. I just. - [Jennifer] I know, I know. And then, so when in my notes when I had put in there that it was a Greek word, Aaron this made you go on a little hunt and this is what you found about the afikomen. - [Aaron] So on Wikipedia, it explains the afikomen this way. It says the Afikomen is a substitute for the Passover sacrifice, which was the last thing eaten at the Passover Seder during the eras of the first and second temples and during the periods of the tabernacle. - [Jennifer] So the last thing during Passover, the last thing that they would eat and consume is. - [Aaron] The Passover sacrifice. - [Jennifer] The sacrifice yeah. - [Aaron] Which ended after the second temple was destroyed of course. So the Talmud States that it is forbidden to have any other food after the Afikomen so that the taste of the Matza that was eaten after the meal remains in the participant's mouth. Since the destruction of the temple and the discontinuation of the Corbin Pesach which is, these are words for the Passover meal Jews eat a piece of Matza now known as the afikomen to finish the Passover Seder meal. So. - [Jennifer] Even in this substitute. - [Aaron] You see this picture yeah. - [Jennifer] Of Jesus being the last thing consumed. - [Aaron] Yeah. And this actually makes me realize I'm wrong. So for generations they weren't doing the Afikomen but they had the Passover lamb that they would eat last which is awesome for a reason. I'm gonna read in a second, but I love this picture of this, the Matza being broken. I love this idea of it being the last thing that they taste 'cause Jesus says about himself in revelation 22:13 He says, I'm the alpha and the Omega the first and the last, the beginning and the end. So they eat the Matza that they're in the meal and then they eat that matza last. And so he's the first and the last he's the beginning and the end. And also once you taste Christ, there is nothing else. There is no more. It's like it is finished as he said on the cross. He said, you'll never hunger again. You'll never thirst again. - [Jennifer] That's a really cool time. You just said, he said it has finished so eating whether it was eating the sacrifice last or eating the Afikomen last it's consuming Christ. And he is blessed. That's wonderful. - [Aaron] It's done essentially. So we talked about the leaven, we talked about the Matza the afikomen. Why don't we move on to the next element that we see in scripture about this? - [Jennifer] So it talks about bitter herbs. Okay. So think like a horseradish. And there's this thing that they do where they dip the matza or the unleavened bread into the bitter herbs to remember, the pain and sorrow and bondage that they once were in. I'll just read Exodus 1:14 "And made their lives bitter "with hard service and mortar and brick. "And in all kinds of work in the field, in all their work "they ruthlessly made them work as slaves." - [Aaron] So this was their life under the Egyptians. - [Jennifer] Yeah. So the bitter herbs serve to remind the Jews that they once were this and their life was bitter. - [Aaron] And this is the picture of the life of a person without Christ. The bitter and hard service and the mortar and brick is building a life in your own building it in your own strength, trying to save yourself and being a slave to sin and death. This is what we are without Christ and it's bitter. And the end of it is bitter as well. The Bible tells us and that our enemy and our flesh and that's this being slave to that sin is as their work was ruthlessly made. It says in all their work, they ruthlessly made them work as slaves. This is what our sin and our flesh and our bondage to it does, which is why Jesus says, my yoke is easy. My burden is light. He gives reference to him being so much better than the slavery that we have without him. - [Jennifer] So in light of this, I wanna remind all of us about a scripture in John and something interesting that I read about. So John 13:22 through 26 says this, "The disciples looked at one, another "uncertain of whom he spoke." So this is them at the Passover meal. "One of his disciples whom Jesus loved "was reclining at the table at Jesus's side. "So Simon Peter motioned to him to ask Jesus "of whom he was speaking. "So that disciple leaning back against Jesus said to him "Lord, who is it? "And Jesus answered it is he to whom "I will give this morsel of bread when I have dipped it. "So when he had dipped the morsel "he gave it to Judas, the son of Simon Iscariot." - [Aaron] They were wondering who was gonna betray him 'cause you said one of you is going to betray me and they were like, who? Who's gonna betray you. What are you talking about? - [Jennifer] Yeah. But this little part here, about Jesus taking the bread and dipping it. - [Aaron] Into the bitter. - [Jennifer] Yeah this is into the bitterness and that's exactly what Judas was. That was the picture of Judas. Was this bitter betrayal of friendship and intimacy and camaraderie to what he chose instead. - [Aaron] Yeah 'cause he chose the wrong path. And so Jesus, this is I just thought this was when you told me this. I was like, that is amazing that he dipped it into the bitter herbs. 'Cause that's what they did. - [Jennifer] And to take it one step further, Jesus says to take, two believers break this bread in remembrance of him and this is my body and drink the wine which we're about to dive into the cups of wine. But he doesn't say anything about the bitter herbs. And so I feel like him conquering death on the cross was put an end to that. - [Aaron] I think that's awesome because he takes the bitterness away. He's cleansed it now it's sweet. Another verse, Romans 6:17-18, it says "But thanks be to God that you who were once slaves "of sin have become obedient from the heart to the standard "of teaching, to which you were committed and having been "set free from sin have become slaves of righteousness." So this idea of the bitter herbs to remind of being once slaves, we know, get the reminder at in communion, which is a picture of this and it's in a sense of, wow, Christ has saved me from all that. He's removed me from that life and put me in this new one. He's taken me from that land and he's putting me in the free land. I'm no longer a slave to sin and death. That is the truth. And so there is no more bitterness. There's joy and peace in the savior - [Jennifer] And hope, lots of hope. I love that. Okay. So I kind of mentioned this already but we're gonna jump into another element of Passover which are four cups of wine that they take in regard to this scripture in Exodus 6:6-7 and I'll read that first and then we'll kind of break it down. "Say therefore to the people of Israel, I am the Lord. "And I will bring you out "from under the burdens of the Egyptians "and I will deliver you from slavery to them. "And I will redeem you "with an outstretched arm and with great acts of judgment. "I will take you to be my people and I will be your God. "And you shall know that I am the Lord, your God "who has brought you out "from under the burdens of the Egyptians." - [Aaron] So we have four cups and the four cups represent the various parts of this verse, these two verses. And so you have the first cup representing the statement I am the Lord, and I will bring you out of, out from under the burdens of the Egyptians and the second cup, I will deliver you from slavery. And the third cup that represents, I will redeem you with an outstretched arm and with great acts of judgment. And then the fourth cup that represents, I will take you to be my people and I will be your God and you shall know that I am the Lord, your God. And so you have these cups that represent these statements. - [Jennifer] Really quick just others may have heard these cups named differently or defined differently just in one word, really simple ways and so I just wanna run through those really quick. The cup of sanctification, the cup of plagues, the cup of redemption and then the fourth cup is I will take you as my people. - [Aaron] Yeah. That's like a longer one, but that's a good one. But what's cool about these cups is we learned some I looked up some scriptures to tie in the imagery that we have as believers in this ceremony of these, four drinks, these four cups. And so the first cup, that represents this statement I am the Lord, and I will bring you out from under the burdens of the Egyptians. So in Colossians 1:13, Paul says, "He has delivered us from the domain of darkness "and transferred us to the kingdom of his beloved son." So this is what the Lord has done through Jesus. He will bring us out from under the burdens and he's done this through Jesus. And then, so just like God transferred them, he's transferred us. And so we're no longer in that world of darkness. We're no longer in Egypt. We're no longer a part of that system. We're a part of his own kingdom of light. And I just, that's a beautiful picture that you have in that cup. - [Jennifer] I love it. - [Aaron] When we get to drink that cup it's like a one-time we have it in Christ. - [Jennifer] That's good. The second one is I will deliver you from slavery. So Romans 6:22 says, "But now that you have been set free "from sin and have become slaves of God, "the fruit you get leads to sanctification "and it's an eternal life." - [Aaron] We've been set free from sin and death. So again, I wanna just tell everyone I try and reiterate this, realizing this truth in the Bible has been the biggest transformative thing for me. Jennifer, could you attest me. This truth never changed. I changed because of it. - [Jennifer] You believed it. - [Aaron] I believed it finally yeah. That I have been delivered from slavery. I am no longer slave to sin and death. I am now a slave of God. And so I'm not owned by that anymore. I don't have to obey those urges and temptations. And that's the same for every believer in Christ that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves of God. So the third cup and by the way, this cup which is represents, I will redeem you with an outstretched arm and with great acts of judgment. This third cup is actually the cup that we take as Christians. This is the cup that Jesus says, take this cup and it remember me when he gives that statement and I'll read it in a second. So in Ephesians 1:7 it says, "In him we have redemption through his blood, "the forgiveness of our trespasses, "according to the riches of his grace." So the cup that we take is this cup of redemption in Galatians 3:13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law, by becoming a curse for us, for it is written, cursed is everyone who is hanged on a tree. So Christ pours out his blood. We learn this in Luke 22:19, when Jesus says, it says "And he took the bread. "And when he had given thanks he broke it "and gave it to them saying, this is my body "which has given for you do this in remembrance of me." And likewise, the cup after they had eaten saying this cup that is poured out for you is the new covenant in my blood. And I actually think this cup, I might be wrong on this. I think there's a feature of this cup where they actually poured and overflow it on purpose. And it shows that this redemption is over flowing from God. And that's what it's saying. This cup has poured out. It's overflowing like my blood is gonna overflow and it's gonna cover all your sins and make you white as snow. And he says, it's the new covenant. So when we take communion, we're actually participating in this third cup that the Jewish people would partake in. But it's the only part of this ceremony that Jesus has asked us to do is eat the bread, take this cup and remember his body and his blood, because it's what redeems us. - [Jennifer] Yep. The last one says I will take you to be my people and I will be your God and you shall know that I am the Lord your God. Titus 2:11-14 says "For the grace of God has appeared bringing salvation "for all people training us to renounce ungodliness "and worldly passions and to live self-controlled upright "and godly lives in the present age. "Waiting for our blessed hope, the appearing "of the glory of our great God and savior Jesus Christ "who gave himself for us to redeem us "from all lawlessness and to purify for himself, a people "for his own possession who are zealous for good works." - [Aaron] So this last cup, this is what God is doing through Jesus. He's purifying for himself, a people for his own possession who are zealous for good works. So this cup, this what they would be drinking is this is being brought into the promised land. This is what we wait for our blessed hope. And there's actually a statement Jesus says, it's not quite in the right order but I think it has something to do with this. He says for, I will not drink of the fruit of the vine until I drink it with you in my kingdom. - [Jennifer] Which makes sense in light of the marriage feast and like. - [Aaron] Waiting for that. - [Jennifer] Yeah. For his people. - [Aaron] That there's gonna come a time that our blessed hope is gonna appear in glory and he's gonna receive us to himself. And so we wait to drink that with him. I'm excited to sit down at a table. It's probably gonna be the best tasting wine. I don't know if it's gonna be actually wining up but sitting with our Lord in his kingdom and his ruling. I'm just so stoked for that. - [Jennifer] So cool. What an emotional thing to have spent, speaking of Jesus like I had already mentioned before, but spending year after year, celebrating the Passover. - [Aaron] And knowing what it means. - [Jennifer] And then getting to this point where it's your last Passover, like with his disciples. - [Aaron] That's a big deal. And he loved them. And so he shared with them who he was and what he was doing and what it means. Not for their sake only but for ours also. That we can know Christ and him crucified which is the gospel. So looking at the pictures in Passover and the symbolism overlay with Christ and what he's done is just incredible. But this is just one of the feasts. So a little side note is like you should dig into some of these, go read them in the Bible and look with the eyes of where is Christ in this? What is he showing me? How is this a shadow of the substance? - [Jennifer] Yeah. Okay. So we've talked about parts of the Passover. Now we're gonna look at that Holy week and the events that took place especially that last week of Christ's life. - [Aaron] Yeah some of these are gonna blow your mind by the way. - [Jennifer] Well, let's see. - [Aaron] Yeah. And we didn't come up with all these like we've done research and we've looked into them. And some of the things that we've read about were like, Oh, when we see the pictures. We don't wanna take credit for everything. We're just gonna present it to you and hopefully you get blessed by it. - [Jennifer] Here we go. Okay. So we've talked about Passover and it being like a family tradition, but what would happen is Aaron when we first started this episode you read Exodus and it said that they should take a lamb for every household. So as a family tradition every household would select a lamb. - [Aaron] Perfect and a year old a male. - [Jennifer] And they would do it at a specific time at the beginning of this week and. - [Aaron] They would live with it. - [Jennifer] Yeah we're gonna get there. I just wanted to point this out. So on that day that they would select the one-year-old lamb was the same time that Jesus entered Jerusalem, greeted with Palm branches and other branches saying Hosanna signifying their desire to make him King. - [Aaron] They wanted to make him King. So what you're saying is they chose their lamb. - [Jennifer] Yes. And this is what we know as Palm Sunday. - [Aaron] Okay so Jesus rides on a donkey. Hosanna, Hosanna in the highest. - [Jennifer] They're cheering for him. - [Aaron] Yep. It's amazing. It's like this big thing, his disciples are like, Oh it's gonna happen. And he's going to be King. They're all thinking this. - [Jennifer] So collectively they've selected their lamb. - [Aaron] And by the way I remember how on was it last episode or two episodes ago about prophecy. - [Jennifer] The last episode yeah. - [Aaron] We were talking about how up to this time they had that they knew that all Jews for the most part had this feeling like, Oh we're in that timeframe. - [Jennifer] Yeah like it made sense. - [Aaron] That the Messiah is coming. So they actually believed that he was the Messiah that was about to be an earthly King for them. - [Jennifer] Which is just crazy how much changed over the course of a few days. - [Aaron] He's coming in and they've selected their lamb. - [Jennifer] Okay. So do you wanna share the next one? - [Aaron] Yeah. So if we're what we're doing is we're doing this parallel of Jesus and the Passover feast. So Jesus comes in and they select him. The Jewish family would select their lamb and bring it into the house, okay? Immediately after he comes into the city which is a really funny thing actually he's like, they're like praising him and their Palm branches and excited and he heads straight to the temple. - [Jennifer] His father's house. - [Aaron] His father's house. - [Jennifer] So the lamb in his father's house yeah. - [Aaron] And what does he do? In one of the gospels that says that he fashions a whip and he goes in and he starts whipping the money collectors, flipping tables. Money's going everywhere. Chickens everywhere, animals everywhere. - [Jennifer] He's cleaning out the leaven. - [Aaron] He's cleaning out the house, right? So he's going in getting rid of the impurities, getting rid of he's cleaning it out, which is I thought you pointed that out to me. And I was like, that's awesome. - [Jennifer] Okay so these little lambs are kept in the homes and they're examined over several days because they can't have any impurities no blemishes, nothing, nothing. And because they are only a year old it just takes that little bit more time to see, I guess I don't know, but it's during this time that, okay, Jesus was selected. He goes into the temple, he clears it out and then he's teaching, but he's also being interrogated. - [Aaron] They're testing him. - [Jennifer] Who? - [Aaron] The Sadducees and the Pharisees, the religious leaders. They're testing Jesus. Seeing if he is who he says he is, if he is perfect. - [Jennifer] Because the lambs must be determined, pure, and perfect in order to continue on with their sacrifice for Passover. - [Aaron] Which leads to the next amazing thing. Thinking about these parallels is that not only does Jesus standing for the religious leaders when they capture him to crucify him he gets grilled by them. But he also gets grilled by the ruling leader. Pontius Pilate. - [Jennifer] Well, he's put on trial and he's scrutinized. - [Aaron] So John 19:4 it says "Pilate went out again and said to them, "see, I am bringing him out to you "that you may know that I find no guilt in him." - [Jennifer] What a declaration. - [Aaron] So yeah, not a decoration of like, I dunno what you guys are talking about. I'm not having nothing to do with this. No. He says I find no guilt in him. And even in Matthew, 26:59, it says now the chief priests and the whole council were seeking false testimony against Jesus, that they might put him to death but they found none. Though many false witnesses came forward. So the religious leaders and the political leaders both found no guilt in him. So if you think about it in the house, the lamb was tested. Was he perfect? Yup. So then Jesus celebrates the Passover meal with his disciples, which I'm not going in order by the way of all these events. - [Jennifer] No, but this does happen where he goes to celebrate the Passover meal together with them. And I just, I can't imagine being one of the disciples experiencing this amazing intimate dinner with my Lord and hearing him talking strangely about breaking the bread and that's his body. And then the wine is somehow his blood, like, okay I'm trying to wrap my head around this, right? But then it actually happening and hearing or seeing and being a part of that whole situation where what Jesus had just said actually happens. Just being one of the disciples, that's crazy. - [Aaron] It didn't, but it almost did. Yeah. I don't even know. We see, we get to look it backwards and see it all in linear but they were experiencing it as it was happening. I couldn't imagine. And so on the fifth day, they would kill the lamb without breaking its bones. This is, what God said kill the lamb without breaking it's bones. Which is by the way exactly how Jesus died. No bone was broken. And the reason that's important is because one of the ways that the Roman soldiers would if they wanted to get through the crucifixions quicker, and you see this, they broke the legs of the thieves on the cross next to Jesus. But when they came to Jesus, he had already died. It says that he gave up the ghost, he gave up his spirit. And so instead of breaking his legs, so that he would suffocate, they just stabbed him in the side with a spear which went through his heart, but he was already dead. So no bone was broken in Jesus's body when he died. Which fulfills again, when we are talking about Jesus fulfilled these feasts. - [Jennifer] This is what we mean. - [Aaron] In his death, he couldn't have controlled necessarily the Romans not breaking his legs other than dying first. So he dies. No bone is broken. He fulfills that ordinance by God in his own body. And so then another note on this, by the way, eating the whole lamb, not leaving anything leftover in John 6:53, Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly I say to you," by the way this is one of the craziest things that Jesus says in the Bible. I think he says, "Truly, truly, I say to you "unless you eat the flesh of the son of man "and drink his blood, you have no life in you." - [Jennifer] Yeah that's kinda weird. - [Aaron] But he says this on purpose and hundreds of his disciples leave him in this moment because of this word. And this is when he looks over at Peter and says are you also not gonna leave? And Peter says, where are we gonna go? You have the words of life, right? But he literally says, unless you eat me and drink my blood and we get it now as Christians, we're like, Oh yeah, communion. We understand it. It's his body and his blood. But he's showing this idea of eating the lamb. - [Jennifer] Which it did the whole lamb and-- - [Aaron] And leave nothing left over. - [Jennifer] Well, what I see is the scripture talks about Jesus is the word. And so we as we believers get to consume God's word and not just parts of it. We get to consume the whole word of God - [Aaron] A side note for everyone listening you should go research the show bread in the temple. - [Jennifer] Yeah talk about pictures. - [Aaron] And learn about the showbread and how it remained fresh and how the priests were supposed to consume all of it and not leave any left. Just a beautiful thing. - [Jennifer] Okay. So that, it's really, really good. - [Aaron] Bring up this part 'cause this part's awesome too. All these parallels they're perfect. - [Jennifer] Okay. So you talked about Jesus being up on the cross. And at that moment, when he was suffering, before he died they reached up, I'll just read it. John 19:29, "A jar full of sour wine stood there. "So they put a sponge full of the sour wine "on a hyssop branch and held it to his mouth." So this was just to try and ease the pain of what he was going through and help them along. But - [Aaron] What's the significance of hyssop. - [Jennifer] The hyssop was used to put the blood over the doorpost in Egypt. That's what they used. And so there's this correlation, this overlap, this picture we see of the hyssop branch being used during Passover. - [Aaron] Interesting. I like all this. So another thing that's amazing. It just blows my mind. Jesus is dying on the cross at the same time as Passover happening. So at 3:00 PM the same time they would have slain the Passover lamb, Jesus was taking his last breath. So they were literally slaying the Passover lamb, Jesus. - [Jennifer] Well, remember they were a busy people that week, because they were there for him when he entered Jerusalem but then they had to select their lambs for Passover. And then there was the whole trial of condemning Jesus. And then he's dying on the cross and they need to get busy preparing for Passover. And so where are they? They're about to go sacrifice their Passover because they don't wanna neglect what God has commanded them to do. - [Aaron] Yeah. If you remember, is it Joseph wanted to take the body of Jesus and they wanted to do it quickly because Passover was about to begin. And they can't bury bodies on Passover. So they had to take him down and they put them in the tomb and you just see all these things happening. You don't realize that what they're doing is they're literally fulfilling the Passover feast in real time with the actual passive relay on the Messiah. - [Jennifer] It's just crazy. I was reading about the Shofar last year and I just came. - [Aaron] Which is the shofar again? What is that? What is a shofar? - [Jennifer] It's the horn that's they blow Yep. For special occasions. And I stumbled upon someone talking about how they blow the shofar during Passover. - [Aaron] Is it to announce it beginning? - [Jennifer] And I remember just sitting there thinking, like if Jesus was on the cross and they were getting ready to start the sacrifice of the Passover lamb and they were blowing the shofar, could he hear it? Or it happening right as he was going, like, there's, it's just, wow. - [Aaron] So Jesus is our Passover lamb. His blood, his sacrifice and resurrection sets us free from bondage of sin. Just like you said, the Jews free from bonds of slavery in Egypt, but better. 'Cause our land that we look forward to is forever. Their land went away. Now they have it again, but it's not permanent. Our land is permanent. We have an imperishable inheritance the Bible tells us. - [Jennifer] John 1:29 says "The next day he saw Jesus coming "toward him and said, behold, the lamb "of God who takes away the sin of the world." I just love that. - [Aaron] Yeah. So John proclaimed him the lamb of God. And he is the lamb. The Bible says who was slain from the foundations of the world. His death is eternal and his resurrection is eternal and his blood is eternal. And the salvation that we received through it is eternal, which is, I don't understand it. So he calls it a mystery but that mystery has been revealed to us. We have the Messiah. His name is Jesus. Yeah. I don't know what else to say about that. - [Jennifer] I wanna say that I recently found a really cool resource at Bible gateway, which shows the Holy week timeline and it uses colored lines running horizontally but then goes up and down in relationship to space and time during that week and each color represents a different person or people group. So like, Jesus will be one line. And then Peter's another line Brown Jesus, Peter's Brown. - [Aaron] Kinda what they were all doing at the time. - [Jennifer] What they were doing and how they intersected at different moments, Judas was black. And it just was a really cool picture. So go to Bible gateway type in Holy week, timeline, visit visualization and you should be able to find it. But it's really cool. - [Aaron] Well, that's what we had to share with you guys about Jesus being our Passover. - [Jennifer] He is our miraculous rescuer and Redeemer. He is he's our savior. - [Aaron] So as we go into this season of Easter or resurrection Sunday, whatever you wanna call it it's to celebrate his death, his resurrection and that he's fulfilled for us the thing that we could not fulfill for ourselves, reconciling us to the father. So to end our last episode of the season would you like to share what you're grateful for? - [Jennifer] I am grateful for you, Aaron You have loved me with the love that I've never doubted. You're steadfast. You're faithful. You're a rock. You have pushed me to great accomplishments to you've cheered me on. You've helped me reach goals that I've had since childhood like big time goals. And you've given me a really beautiful family. And so I'm super grateful. - [Aaron] I'm not, I'm not crying at all. You're crying. I'm not crying. Thank you. - [Jennifer] I'll say this too, every yes with you has been my best. And I look forward to many more. - [Aaron] I love you, babe. - [Jennifer] I love you. - [Aaron] Well, now I'm bummed 'cause. - [Jennifer] I know you can't top that. - [Aaron] I know also I didn't say I'm grateful for you. I am grateful for you, but I'm grateful for, it's funny. You just said all these like awesome things but I'm grateful for the hard things that we've been through as a couple. - [Jennifer] That's really sweet. - [Aaron] I know it's like a little different than yours, but well it just shows that with Christ, we can not only survive through many hard trials, but we can thrive as well. You brought up all these things that we've accomplished or that this thing you accomplishing dreams, but there was so many hard things that we've been through as well but it feels like we've invested a lot into our marriage and we get to see the fruit as we grow older. So I don't regret the hard things. I don't wish they didn't happen. I'm grateful for those things 'cause they've made us God made us who we are today through those things. And so now we're not gonna have any more hard things moving forward. 'Cause today's the first day of the year. The calendar starts now. No more. I'm just kidding. I'm grateful for you though and the things that we've been through - [Jennifer] Well we just wanted to do that this season share things that we're grateful for in hopes of spreading more gratefulness. - [Aaron] Be grateful. - [Jennifer] And so if you guys wanted to take time this week to consider what you're grateful for and share it with someone else, share it with the Lord, share it, your spouse And just have a moment where you just praise God in that thankfulness and gratefulness. - [Aaron] And also just reminder, go dig into the all the feasts and festivals and learn about them. We're not saying you have to do them all but maybe we want to maybe on an try mountain see how they work, but learn who Christ is and all of them. 'Cause there's so much. There's an infinite number of things that we don't even haven't even pulled out of any of this stuff, but you can find it. So as usual, we're gonna end this episode in prayer. Jennifer, would you pray for us? - [Jennifer] Dear Lord, thank you for your son and his sacrifice that we may have eternal life. One incredible gift you have given to us. Thank you for the gospel and the way it has transformed our lives. We pray we would boldly proclaim your gospel, so that others may know your truth and be saved. Thank you for loving us and for forgiving us. We pray for more understanding of your word and more wisdom. Please help us to be a light in this world Lord. May your will be done in us, in our marriages and in this world, we are patiently waiting to be with you and to spend eternity with you. Until then we submit our lives to you and ask that you would move through us to bring about your will on earth. We love you Lord in Jesus name. Amen. - [Aaron] Amen. We love you all. And we look forward to being with you next season of this podcast. Please take some time over our break to go listen to old episodes. And also as always would you be our share warriors and share this episode with someone who would be encouraged by it? We love you all and we'll see you soon. Connect With UsInstagram | @marriageaftergodInstagram | @unveiledwifeInstagram | @husbandrevolutionCheck out our marriage resources!SponsorsGet our new book The Marriage Gift - 365 prayers for your marriage!

Speaking of the end of days we wanted to tell you about a movie that we recently watched that was really exciting and encouraging. It shares about how the return of Christ is like a Galilian wedding. marriageaftergod.com/btwhttps://amzn.to/2Oj4PrB Connect With UsInstagram | @marriageaftergodInstagram | @unveiledwifeInstagram | @husbandrevolutionCheck out our marriage resources!SponsorsGet our new book The Marriage Gift - 365 prayers for your marriage!