The Derivative

In this episode, we're stepping away from our ordinary world of futures and options to find out why boring old corporate bonds aren't all that boring after all. Join our conversation with Greg Obenshain, Partner and Director of Credit at Verdad Advisers, as he and Jeff discuss just what running a high yield bond investments portfolio is like. Greg shares the complexities of accessing and organizing the needed data to run a quantitative model on bonds (think no central exchange nor shared order book, etc.), how he racks 'em and stacks 'em, and why there should always be a fundamental lens on quant outputs at the end of the day. He gives some real-world examples talking about the bonds of Netflix, Crocs, and Oil& Gas companies; and why there's a sweet spot between BBB and B-rated bonds. Speaking of ratings, we ask Greg how his custom quant model assigns his own ratings, how and why those differ from the ratings agencies, and why multi-billion firms don't model this area of the high yield market similarly (he says it's not sexy enough). We finish the chat touching base on some topical bond/rates areas, such as Evergrande's potential default, the debt ceiling, yield farming, private credit, private equity's big debt appetite, and more. You'll also find some nuggets on duration, stripping out Treasury yields, and what both retail and institutional investors typically get wrong when considering holding bonds in a portfolio. Enjoy the chat! Chapters: 00:00-02:47 = Intro 02:48-07:27 = London Tea, a Midwest Twang, and Dartmouth Green 07:28-20:50 = Becoming a Quant, Finding Verdad, and Racking and Stacking 20:51-41:24 = Finding Growth vs Getting Paid for Default Risk 41:25-56:15 = Cash in and Cash Out, and Record Tight High Yield Spreads 56:16-01:09:10 = High Yield Risk, Private Credit, and what everyone gets wrong about Bonds 01:09:11-01:14:02 =Favorites Follow along with Greg on Twitter @GregObenshain and learn more about Verdad Advisers at verdadcap.com Don't forget to subscribe to The Derivative, and follow us on Twitter at @rcmAlts and our host Jeff at @AttainCap2,  or LinkedIn , and Facebook, and sign-up for our blog digest. And visit our sponsor, the CME Group at www.cmegroup.com to learn more about futures and options. Disclaimer: This podcast is provided for informational purposes only and should not be relied upon as legal, business, or tax advice. All opinions expressed by podcast participants are solely their own opinions and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of RCM Alternatives, their affiliates, or companies featured. Due to industry regulations, participants on this podcast are instructed not to make specific trade recommendations, nor reference past or potential profits. And listeners are reminded that managed futures, commodity trading, and other alternative investments are complex and carry a risk of substantial losses. As such, they are not suitable for all investors. For more information, visit www.rcmalternatives.com/disclaimer

Jeff is “stacking” two guests in this episode, welcoming 1. Corey Hoffstein, CIO and co-founder of Newfound Research, host of Flirting with Models Podcast, and co-conspirator on the Pirates of Finance YouTube channel; and 2. Rodrigo Gordillo, President and Portfolio Manager of Resolve Asset Management and host of the Resolve Riffs Friday live stream. They’re talking about their new research paper: “Return Stacking: Strategies for Overcoming a Low Return Environment,” which takes a novel approach to solving a few problems. Such as: How do you endure the ‘line item risk’ of an alternatives allocation? How do you participate in the upside of an increasingly overvalued stock market? What value do bonds bring as a diversifier at the zero bound? The answer boils down to some new capital-efficient ETFs and mutual funds, which stack asset classes and returns on top of one another at greater than 100% exposure. How does that work exactly? What are the pros and cons? What types of products can investors look at? Listen in to find out more.  Chapters:  00:00-02:36=Intro  02:37-10:30=It’s the Cayman Islands…not Caymans  10:31-29:55=Return Stacking: The Paper, the Problem & the Solution  29:56-38:33= Leverage and Capital Efficiency  38:34-01:04:14= Managed Futures, Macro, and Convexity as Diversifiers  01:04:15-01:12:09= Are you just Stacking Fees?  01:12:10-01:26:16= I’m Scared to Buy at All-Time Highs (and to Own Bonds)  01:26:17-01:30:24=Favorites  From the episode:  Download the whitepaper here: https://info.rcmalternatives.com/return-stacking  Podcast: Noodling on Ensembles, Trend, & Convexity with Newfound’s Corey Hoffstein: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/noodling-on-ensembles-trend-convexity-newfounds-corey/id1497570451?i=1000478501833  Podcast: Asset Allocation, AI, and the Alpha Process with Resolve Asset Management: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/asset-allocation-ai-alpha-process-resolve-asset-management/id1497570451?i=1000467460922  Flirting with models podcast: https://blog.thinknewfound.com/podcast/ ReSolve's Riffs: https://investresolve.com/single/resolve-riffs/ The picture from space that shows why commodities are non-correlated: https://www.rcmalternatives.com/2013/10/the-picture-from-space-that-shows-why-commodities-are-non-correlated-to-the-stock-market/ Follow along with Corey & Rodrigo on Twitter @choffstein https://twitter.com/choffstein and @RodGordilloP https://twitter.com/RodGordilloP?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor Don't forget to subscribe to The Derivative (https://www.rcmalternatives.com/the-derivative-podcast/), and follow us on Twitter at @rcmAlts (https://twitter.com/rcmAlts), and our host Jeff at @AttainCap2 (https://twitter.com/AttainCap2), or LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/rcm-asset-management/), and Facebook (https://www.facebook.com/RCMAlternatives/), and sign-up for our blog digest (https://info.rcmalternatives.com/get-our-blog-alternatives). And visit our sponsor, the CME Group at www.cmegroup.com to learn more about futures and options. Disclaimer: This podcast is provided for informational purposes only and should not be relied upon as legal, business, or tax advice. All opinions expressed by podcast participants are solely their own opinions and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of RCM Alternatives, their affiliates, or companies featured. Due to industry regulations, participants on this podcast are instructed not to make specific trade recommendations, nor reference past or potential profits. And listeners are reminded that managed futures, commodity trading, and other alternative investments are complex and carry a risk of substantial losses. As such, they are not suitable for all investors. For more information, visit www.rcmalternatives.com/disclaimer

How is the ETF sausage made? Who creates the filling? The casing? Who buys it at the store? What other meat is it replacing?  We dig into all these tasty morsels and more with this episode’s guest – the ETF expert Dave Nadig, who has spent his career analyzing ETFs, their asset managers, and how investors fit them into portfolios. We’re talking with Dave about why nobody in Springfield, MA likes Tom Brady, how ETFs went from nothing to a Trillion to $7 Trillion (with a ‘T’), and why exactly they get that super beneficial tax treatment. He covers whether they spell the end for mutual funds, whether they brought on the boom in RIAs, if they’re actually tied to indices anymore?, and how to square passive investment with active allocations to ETFs. Then onto how the SEC punted to Gensler at the CFTC re: Crytpo ETFs (and now he’s at the SEC…wtf), why the future could be ETFs by voting style, and the obligatory Cathie Wood/ARK questions on a pod talking ETFs. Finally, we’re talking what it takes to launch an ETF, who you need on your side in terms of market makers and distributors, and how the ticker has become all important. Don’t miss this informative chat with an insider in the huge world of ETFs. Enjoy. Chapters: 00:00-04:42=Intro 4:43-15:47=Wells Fargo, RIAs vs FAs, and Voltron 15:48-24:45=A Brief History of the ETF: the First Trillion is the Hardest 24:46-40:57=The obligatory ARK/ Cathie Wood questions 40:58-51:11=When do we get Crypto ETFs? Did the Sec Punt? 51:12-01:05:11=How do you do Futures, Leverage, and Taxes in an ETF? 01:05:12-01:16:01=Are there limits on ETF innovation? All Hail the creative Ticker! 01:16:02-01:21:53=The Game Stop Moment 01:21:54-01:26:50=Favorites From the episode: Luke's Entrance but with the Force Theme Follow along with Dave on Twitter @DaveNadig and visit www.etftrends.com for more information Don't forget to subscribe to The Derivative, and follow us on Twitter at @rcmAlts and our host Jeff at @AttainCap2,  or LinkedIn , and Facebook, and sign-up for our blog digest. And visit our sponsor, the CME Group at www.cmegroup.com to learn more about futures and options. Disclaimer: This podcast is provided for informational purposes only and should not be relied upon as legal, business, or tax advice. All opinions expressed by podcast participants are solely their own opinions and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of RCM Alternatives, their affiliates, or companies featured. Due to industry regulations, participants on this podcast are instructed not to make specific trade recommendations, nor reference past or potential profits. And listeners are reminded that managed futures, commodity trading, and other alternative investments are complex and carry a risk of substantial losses. As such, they are not suitable for all investors. For more information, visit www.rcmalternatives.com/disclaimer

We jump back into some VIX and Volatility discussion with this week’s episode but also get to talk about trend following’s rise and fall (and rise again?) over the past decade. We’ve got Scot Billington, the co-founder and managing partner of Covenant Capital Mgmt., talking through his unique journey from futures broker to floor trader of OEX options, to trend following hedge fund manager, to VIX trader and volatility focused funds. We talk with Scot about his indoor, Kentucky basketball themed half court basketball gym above his garage in the Chicago suburbs, what it was like being a floor trader back in the hay day of the CBOE options pits, having a side gig when trying to start a hedge fund, when customers cry uncle in a drawdown, turning the switch from trend to vol, why the VIX is different than options, how one can be both long vol and short vol at the same time, why Goldman Sachs doesn’t care about your VIX trading, why the short vol blowups annoy him, and why it isn’t all that crazy to look at adding short vol to the mix. Enjoy! Chapters: 00:00-02:35=Intro 02:36-26:12 =JC Bradford, Options Sheets & the Trading Floor 26:13-44:16 = Trend Following Was GREAT, then it became Commoditized 44:17-01:08:47 = Turning the switch from Trend Following to VIX 01:08:48-01:24:35 =Selling Premium Retail, Buying Reinsurance Wholesale 01:24:36-01:30:03 =Favorites From the episode: LJM – THE AUTOPSY Don't forget to subscribe to The Derivative, and follow us on Twitter at @rcmAlts and our host Jeff at @AttainCap2,  or LinkedIn , and Facebook, and sign-up for our blog digest. And visit our sponsor, the CME Group at www.cmegroup.com to learn more about futures and options. Disclaimer: This podcast is provided for informational purposes only and should not be relied upon as legal, business, or tax advice. All opinions expressed by podcast participants are solely their own opinions and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of RCM Alternatives, their affiliates, or companies featured. Due to industry regulations, participants on this podcast are instructed not to make specific trade recommendations, nor reference past or potential profits. And listeners are reminded that managed futures, commodity trading, and other alternative investments are complex and carry a risk of substantial losses. As such, they are not suitable for all investors. For more information, visit www.rcmalternatives.com/disclaimer

Our guest this episode is surely not a stranger to our listeners, with his voice reaching far and wide via StockTwits, the Panic with Friends podcast, his ever-changing Twitter handle (currently Metaverse Lindzon) and his eponymous blog where he dishes on everything from stock picks to software to NFTs.  Oh, and in his spare time, he’s invested in some big names like Robinhood, eToro, Koyfin, and Rally Road. We sit down with Howard for a quick chat on exactly what he means by ‘trend following’, why that’s not the same thing the managed futures industry sees it, why sometimes it really is that easy, golfing with your son, whether it’s early or late in crypto, carb-loading your legs, ‘drafting’ behind pros for big trends, living in a rare asset world, investing in a bubble, how not to get scared off putting money to work amidst the Fed/inflation/etc, finding a career that suits your lifestyle, NFTs, Tesla, HOOD, whether RIAs are the next travel agents, or if they’re the travel agents that survived, and whether it’s a good idea to have 50%+ of your liquid net worth in crypto. Take a listen: Chapters: 00:00-02:09=Intro 02:10-11:35 =  Playing Golf, Peloton & Pushing Tesla’s Range 11:36-33:59 = Go West Young Man (into Crypto) & Not Being the Last Guy Out 34:00-56:02 = The Golden Age of Investing, Gamification & Community 56:03-01:06:04 = RIAs as the Last Travel Agents & Investing in a Bubble 01:06:05-01:10:49 = Favorites Follow along with Howard on Twitter @howardlindzon and visit his website at howardlindzon.com. Don't forget to subscribe to The Derivative, and follow us on Twitter at @rcmAlts and our host Jeff at @AttainCap2,  or LinkedIn , and Facebook, and sign-up for our blog digest. And visit our sponsor, the CME Group at www.cmegroup.com to learn more about futures and options. Disclaimer: This podcast is provided for informational purposes only and should not be relied upon as legal, business, or tax advice. All opinions expressed by podcast participants are solely their own opinions and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of RCM Alternatives, their affiliates, or companies featured. Due to industry regulations, participants on this podcast are instructed not to make specific trade recommendations, nor reference past or potential profits. And listeners are reminded that managed futures, commodity trading, and other alternative investments are complex and carry a risk of substantial losses. As such, they are not suitable for all investors. For more information, visit www.rcmalternatives.com/disclaimer

What do you do when trends stop appearing for the quarter of a billion dollars you manage? Where do you go to find markets like the ‘good old days’ for trend following? Our guest for this episode, Abingdon Global’s Fred Schutzman is in a unique position to answer those questions – and much more! Listen to Fred share his background being a Chartist, working at CRB, why technical analysts have holes in their shoes, how easy it seemed to find successful trend models 20 years ago, the rise and fall of Briarwood, sleepless nights with a quarter of a billion on the line, why 10,000 trades are better than 1000, why 3 models are better than 1, and thoughts on Queens, Acid, Coke, Iron Ore, gaining exposure to China, to inflation, to dollar weakness, the perfect NY slice, and eating his own (Chinese) cooking. Chapters: 00:00-02:29=Intro 02:30-29:37= Technical Analysis = Holes in Your Shoes 29:38-39:29= Trend Following Tigers Changing their Stripes 39:30-59:06= Deep Chinese Markets, Acid, & 10,000 Trades 59:07-01:31:31= The Model, Magic Darts, and Eating your own Cooking From this Episode: Listen to the previous podcast with Fred Schutzman here: Trading Chinese Futures Markets with Abingdon Global Listen or Watch Modeling Markets and Accessing AI with Robert Rotella and Jag Prakasam Listen or Watch Asian Markets, American Investments, & Accessing (Chinese) Futures with Alvin Fan of OPIM For more information on accessing China markets, contact Matt Bradbard at RCM (312.870.1653) Don't forget to subscribe to The Derivative, and follow us on Twitter at @rcmAlts and our host Jeff at @AttainCap2,  or LinkedIn , and Facebook, and sign-up for our blog digest. And visit our sponsor, the CME Group at www.cmegroup.com to learn more about futures and options. Disclaimer: This podcast is provided for informational purposes only and should not be relied upon as legal, business, or tax advice. All opinions expressed by podcast participants are solely their own opinions and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of RCM Alternatives, their affiliates, or companies featured. Due to industry regulations, participants on this podcast are instructed not to make specific trade recommendations, nor reference past or potential profits. And listeners are reminded that managed futures, commodity trading, and other alternative investments are complex and carry a risk of substantial losses. As such, they are not suitable for all investors. For more information, visit www.rcmalternatives.com/disclaimer

Over 100,000 investors in 180 countries listen to Ben Hunt, founder of Second Foundation Partners and the Epsilon Theory blog, debunk the latest narrative machines in each of his opus-like post. So with Covid cases climbing and inflation expectations rising, it seemed like as good a time as ever to bring Ben back on the pod to talk through all that is going on, and all that they are trying to tell us is going on. Listen in to Ben get animated about our current auto-tuning society, the Grand Canyon-sized chasm between market world and the real world, llamas, the Delta variant and why Covid has become so politicized, building fences (literal fences), Bill Gross’ staple obsession, finding a pack to carry on meaningful conversation, getting your Robinhood calls on today!, why even a war with China won’t derail risk assets, inflation, inflation, inflation, narrative missionaries, wage growth, Robinhood, the housing market, wage growth, burning it the F down, Jamie Dimon is just a bank manager, the video game of life, taking the red pill, waiting for narratives to shift before piling into Trend Following, and how jazz hands work in Bitcoin world. Have fun! Chapters: 00:00-3:00=Intro 03:01-08:26=Finding your Pack 08:27-24:09=Politicized Covid in an “Auto-tuned” Society 24:10-42:29=There is NO Deflationary Shock that can Derail Risk Assets, but Inflation…. 42:30-56:26=In the poker game of [stock buybacks], Corp. MGMT. is the Rake 56:27-01:04:40=Trend Following, Bitcoin, and Jazz Hands Listen or Watch our previous episode with Ben Hunt, follow Ben on Twitter @EpsilonTheory, and visit the Epsilon Theory website. Don't forget to subscribe to The Derivative, and follow us on Twitter at @rcmAlts and our host Jeff at @AttainCap2,  or LinkedIn , and Facebook, and sign-up for our blog digest. And visit our sponsor, the CME Group at www.cmegroup.com to learn more about futures and options. Disclaimer: This podcast is provided for informational purposes only and should not be relied upon as legal, business, or tax advice. All opinions expressed by podcast participants are solely their own opinions and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of RCM Alternatives, their affiliates, or companies featured. Due to industry regulations, participants on this podcast are instructed not to make specific trade recommendations, nor reference past or potential profits. And listeners are reminded that managed futures, commodity trading, and other alternative investments are complex and carry a risk of substantial losses. As such, they are not suitable for all investors. For more information, visit www.rcmalternatives.com/disclaimer

Who hasn’t been pitched a buffered note at this point? Participate in the upside and get credited back the first 10% in losses. What could go wrong?  There are billions of dollars of these things out there, and they’re even creeping into the ETF and mutual fund space. How exactly do they work? Which options are being bought and sold? Is there hidden risk? What about exotics and knock ins and all the rest…. Do they cause extra liquidity issues for the market as a whole? We sat down with Exceed Investments Joe Halpern in the lively chat to find out just how these buffered notes work, and what investors need to be careful of. Listen to Joe talk about finding the right call to sell to cover the spend, why tail risk is much more important than a 10% buffer, field hospitals in Central Park, what it was like unwinding Lehman Brothers structured products, crafting exotic derivatives at ING, Stevie Cohen as the Mets owner, why duration matters, and how the risk/reward profile of a buffered note changes as the market moves. Enjoy! Chapters: 00:00-02:25=Intro 02:26-09:32=Mets, Cohen, Bobby Bonilla Day & Madoff 09:33-27:47=Custom Structured Notes & In the Trenches at Lehman 27:48-49:28=Behind the Scenes on a Buffered Note 49:29-01:08:00=Exceed = A Floor instead of a Buffer 01:08:01-01:16:27=Favorites From the episode: Webinar: Buffered Strategies: What They Are, How They Work, & When to Use Them - 1 CE Credit Catalyst Buffered Shield Fund Follow along with Joe on twitter @halpjoe, and visit Exceedinvestments.com for more information. Don't forget to subscribe to The Derivative, and follow us on Twitter at @rcmAlts and our host Jeff at @AttainCap2,  or LinkedIn , and Facebook, and sign-up for our blog digest. And visit our sponsor, the CME Group at www.cmegroup.com to learn more about futures and options. Disclaimer: This podcast is provided for informational purposes only and should not be relied upon as legal, business, or tax advice. All opinions expressed by podcast participants are solely their own opinions and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of RCM Alternatives, their affiliates, or companies featured. Due to industry regulations, participants on this podcast are instructed not to make specific trade recommendations, nor reference past or potential profits. And listeners are reminded that managed futures, commodity trading, and other alternative investments are complex and carry a risk of substantial losses. As such, they are not suitable for all investors. For more information, visit www.rcmalternatives.com/disclaimer

Dive into this fun chat with the equally irreverent and intelligent Bill Brewster, the self-made value investor in the style of Warren Buffet who dishes on twitter @BillBrewsterSCG hosts the Business Brew podcast in his spare time. We go into Chicago vs Florida real estate and taxes, commercial banking, TastyTrade and options, just how big of a Buffet fan you have to be to name your son Warren, Marvel vs Star Wars, the ultimate recurring revenue game that is cable companies, the brilliance of Disney+, how exactly can some random guy compete with huge investment firms, the dangerously gamified Robinhood, lessons learned from the pros, Cam Newton, not caring about drawdowns, owning poor franchises, the value trap, long term options, the Twitter machine, second order vs no order thinking, and of course, maybe just being some lucky retail idiot. Enjoy Chapters: 00:00-01:52=Intro 01:53-13:38=Options, TastyTrade, Law School and Value Investing 13:39-26-40=Wait til companies get cheap, then buy them 26:41-38:04=Some Lucky Retail Idiot & Disney+ 38:05-47:56=“The Buff Dog” would still Wax All of Us 47:57-01:06:28=The Business Brew Podcast & Platform concerns 01:06:29-01:16:35=Favorites From the episode: The Business Brew podcast, Arnold Vanderburgh Episode, Adam Robinson Episode Ice Man/Maverick blog post Follow along with Bill on twitter @BillBrewsterSCG and visit his podcast page The Business Brew Don't forget to subscribe to The Derivative, and follow us on Twitter at @rcmAlts and our host Jeff at @AttainCap2,  or LinkedIn , and Facebook, and sign-up for our blog digest. And visit our sponsor, the CME Group at www.cmegroup.com to learn more about futures and options. Disclaimer: This podcast is provided for informational purposes only and should not be relied upon as legal, business, or tax advice. All opinions expressed by podcast participants are solely their own opinions and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of RCM Alternatives, their affiliates, or companies featured. Due to industry regulations, participants on this podcast are instructed not to make specific trade recommendations, nor reference past or potential profits. And listeners are reminded that managed futures, commodity trading, and other alternative investments are complex and carry a risk of substantial losses. As such, they are not suitable for all investors. For more information, visit www.rcmalternatives.com/disclaimer

We’re excited to have one of the pioneers of options trading on this episode, Jerry Haworth -  Founder and CIO of renowned option and tail risk firm 36 South. In this wide-ranging talk, we dive into Jerry’s roots in Zimbabwe, trading South African bonds, structuring derivatives, the point in his jazz career where talent and drive diverge, how 36 south got started, canoe marathons, why long term options rule, non-recourse leverage, Victoria Falls, swaptions, asymmetry, Chicago Blues bars, liquidity cascades, slow-moving south sea bubbles, leptokurtic curves, changing correlations and, of course - Teams of Options. Enjoy! Chapters: 00:00-02:19=Intro 02:20-18:31=Zimbabwe to Auckland to London 18:32-44:10=Positive, Neutral Carry & Teams of Options 44:11-56:16=Long-Term Options & Non Recourse Leverage 56:17-01:04:29=What’s changed in 30yrs of Option Trading 01:04:30-01:08:46=Favorites Learn more about 36 South at 36south.com  And last but not least, don't forget to subscribe to The Derivative, and follow us on Twitter, and our host Jeff at @AttainCap2 or LinkedIn, and Facebook, and sign-up for our blog digest. And visit our sponsor, the CME Group at www.cmegroup.com to learn more about futures and options. Disclaimer: This podcast is provided for informational purposes only and should not be relied upon as legal, business, or tax advice. All opinions expressed by podcast participants are solely their own opinions and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of RCM Alternatives, their affiliates, or companies featured. Due to industry regulations, participants on this podcast are instructed not to make specific trade recommendations, nor reference past or potential profits. And listeners are reminded that managed futures, commodity trading, and other alternative investments are complex and carry a risk of substantial losses. As such, they are not suitable for all investors. For more information, visit www.rcmalternatives.com/disclaimer