MBTI Versus Big Five: Practical Perspective

Check out this episode of the #1 people analytics podcast with special guest, Cole Nussbaumer Knaflic, CEO of Storytelling with Data!

In this wide-ranging and thoughtful conversation, host Cole Napper (CN) sits down with Cole Nussbaumer Knaflic (CNK), one of the most influential voices in data visualization, to reflect on a decade of impact, evolution, and hard-earned lessons from the world of analytics, storytelling, and communication. CNK revisits her seminal book Storytelling with Data on the occasion of its 10th anniversary edition, sharing what has stood the test of time, what she feared breaking by revisiting it, and why simplicity, audience-first thinking, and intentional focus matter even more today amid rapid advances in technology and AI. She explains how her teaching has evolved from basic story frameworks to the richer narrative arc, introducing tension that matters to the audience and resolving it through clear action, a structure that maps naturally to real business problems and decision-making.

The conversation also dives deep into CNK’s newest book, Before and After, a visually striking, case-based guide inspired by real client work that reveals not just the final polished output, but the thinking, tradeoffs, and transformation that occur between a messy starting point and an effective data story. CNK explains why seeing that process is so powerful, how anonymized client examples help people move past “our data is different,” and why makeovers resonate across industries. Along the way, she reflects on the human side of communicating data, emphasizing that charts alone are never enough and that confidence, clarity, and delivery play an equally critical role in whether insights lead to impact.

Listeners also hear CNK’s reflections on her early career as part of Google’s foundational people analytics team, a period she describes as genuinely magical. She shares stories of discovering insights in data no one had ever examined before, blending statistical rigor with HR partners’ contextual knowledge, and learning firsthand that data without context is incomplete. That experience, she explains, shaped her belief in collaboration, data literacy, and the ethical responsibility that comes with influence. The episode explores her entrepreneurial journey, including why she tested demand before leaving Google, how focus and ruthless prioritization helped her grow Storytelling with Data while starting a family, and why saying no was just as important as saying yes.

The discussion touches on her full portfolio of work, from practitioner workbooks and presentation-focused guides to Daphne Draws Data, her children’s book aimed at building early data literacy through curiosity and problem solving. CNK’s passion for helping people think more clearly, ask better questions, and communicate with integrity shines throughout, as does her commitment to using storytelling not to manipulate, but to make data understandable, honest, and actionable. This episode is packed with insights for people analytics professionals, data practitioners, leaders, and anyone who wants their work to land, resonate, and drive real change.

If you like this episode, you’d also love exploring prior episodes—visit colenapper.com for the full archive and show links.