Pearls On, Gloves Off: The Legal Innovation Podcast

On this episode, Liam Brown, Founder, Chairman and CEO at Elevate, joins Mary to talk about the evolving legal ecosystem, the importance of mentoring, the ways technology continues to help legal department professionals and much more. Liam talks about how his way of thinking about the legal ecosystem has changed over the years. He says the days are gone when business and law were completely separate, and they now work together in many different ways. He makes the argument that having a working understanding of legal issues is enough to solve many business problems and to make decisions without needing the advice of a lawyer. He likens it to having a working knowledge of data issues or technology functions. They talk about the next generation coming up in the legal system. Liam points out that everyone stands on the shoulders of the ones who come before them, and they should do everything they can to help the new generation thrive. They take a deep dive into technology and how it can help professionals in the legal department with their day-to-day operations. They also talk about the importance of collaboration and working together through good and bad times. Liam Brown - https://www.linkedin.com/in/liamjmbrown/ Elevate - https://www.linkedin.com/company/elevate-services/ If you enjoyed today's show, please leave a 5-star review. You can find more information, as well as the resources mentioned in this episode, at ironcladapp.com. #LegalOps #LegalCareer

On this episode, Cai GoGwilt, Co-Founder and Chief Architect at Ironclad, and Alex Su, Head of Community Development at Ironclad, join Mary to talk about generative AI and its effect on the legal industry. ChatGPT can change how people work in many different industries, and legal is no exception. Cai sees this as a valuable tool for legal professionals, but he says there are a lot of shortcomings with the platform as it is today. One problem people are finding is that ChatGPT can generate very authoritative but completely wrong answers to questions fed into it. He explains the difference between that and Ironclad AI, which is mostly context. Ironclad AI has years of real-world business intelligence to draw from to answer questions and perform tasks that are accurate based on that information. The group sees new AI tools as being a timesaver for legal professionals, especially those who work in corporate law. Cai sees corporate attorneys as having a leg up on using AI, in part because they know how to translate legalese into plain language. All three participants agree that this technology is here to stay, and it's okay to stay on the sidelines for a while, but it is coming at us faster than we think. Cal GoGwilt - https://www.linkedin.com/in/cai-gogwilt-77b18a22/ Alex Su - https://www.linkedin.com/in/alexander-su/ Ironclad - https://www.linkedin.com/company/ironclad-inc-/ If you enjoyed today's show, please leave a 5-star review. You can find more information, as well as the resources mentioned in this episode, at ironcladapp.com. #LegalOps #LegalCareer

On this episode, Terrene Collins, Director of Legal Operations and Chief of Staff to Chief Legal Officer at Panasonic North America, joins Mary to talk about her career path. Like many legal ops professionals, Terrene is seeing massive rate increases from law firms, and she is pushing back, as difficult as that might be. She will look at rates from prior years, and if she sees a budget-busting significant rate increase, sometimes as much as 20% or 25%, she will call the firm out. Terrene has worked in various industries including financial services, pharma and technology. She talks about the differences she has experienced between the industries, which are often based on how long the company has had a legal ops department. She gives valuable insights on how to work with a GC and a CLO, and how to determine what it is they are looking for in order to move the organization forward. Terrene says the hardest part of the job is figuring out organizational priorities. Her focus for this year is to understand ways to drive savings in dealing with their outside counsel and to find ways for her team to add value to the organization. Terrene Collins - https://www.linkedin.com/in/terrene-collins-mba-a6403353/ Panasonic North America - https://www.linkedin.com/company/panasonic-northamerica/ If you enjoyed today's show, please leave a 5-star review. You can find more information, as well as the resources mentioned in this episode, at ironcladapp.com. #LegalOps #LegalCareer

On this episode, Bob Mignanelli, VP/COO Legal at Haleon, joins Mary to talk about the ever-expanding role of the legal ops team, the ways he and his team contribute to strategic and tactical initiatives, and the importance of asking for an expanded role within the company. Bob sees the legal ops role as a crucial partner for many departments within a company but admits that sometimes leaders in those departments don't share that vision. Whether it's tech, finance, procurement, finance or HR, he believes he can contribute while looking at initiatives and strategic decisions through a legal lens. It's important to raise your hand and to let people know that you want to contribute and you want to help. The worst that can happen is they will say no, and you can't take that personally. The timing for getting involved is critical because sometimes a great idea can come when the timing just isn't right. It's important to not get discouraged and to keep moving forward to expand your horizons within the company. Bob Mignanelli - https://www.linkedin.com/in/robertmignanelli/ Haleon - https://www.linkedin.com/company/haleon/ If you enjoyed today's show, please leave a 5-star review. You can find more information, as well as the resources mentioned in this episode, at ironcladapp.com. #LegalOps #LegalCareer

On this episode, Michele Lau, Chief Legal Officer and Corporate Secretary at GoDaddy, joins Mary to talk about her career path, the evolution of the CLO role, and the company's embrace of diversity, equity, inclusion, and belonging. One of the core values at GoDaddy is diversity, something that drew Michele to the company in the first place. The leadership team spends a great deal of time together defining their priorities to make sure they are in alignment with each other on their diversity goals. The GoDaddy legal team consists of around 90 people globally, and they deal with law, internal audit, sustainability, and government and industry affairs. Having team members around the world brings different perspectives and ways of thinking that make the team stronger. Michele relies heavily on the legal ops team in terms of financial stewardship, budget, all-hands communications and developing a roadmap and strategy. They meet monthly to get input from everyone and provide dynamic advice for moving forward as a company. There is a core mission at the company to focus on ESG, environmental, social, and governance, and Michele talks about the depth and breadth of the work they do to support that mission. Michele Lau - https://www.linkedin.com/in/michelelau/ GoDaddy - https://www.linkedin.com/company/godaddy/ If you enjoyed today's show, please leave a 5-star review. You can find more information, as well as the resources mentioned in this episode, at ironcladapp.com. #LegalOps #LegalCareer

On this episode, Jason Barnwell, General Manager for Digital Transformation of Corporate, External, and Legal Affairs at Microsoft, joins Mary to talk about his title. He describes it as being a professional cheerleader, meaning he is creating the vision for the future of the company. The way Jason sees it, law firms are starting to feel pressure to show value. The problem is value is determined by data and resources are needed to generate that data. They can't show value without the resources. He talks about the difficulty of generating change at a company like Microsoft, and how he has learned to frame the problem from a leadership perspective, not his own perspective. He has learned, over the years, that lawyers are in the feelings business. Decisions are made as much by feeling as by thinking. To get problems solved, you have to humanize the work. Jason Barnwell - https://www.linkedin.com/in/jbarnwell/ If you enjoyed today's show, please leave a 5-star review. You can find more information, as well as the resources mentioned in this episode, at ironcladapp.com. #LegalOps #LegalCareer

On this episode, Mel Scott, Senior Legal Counsel (Global) at Megaport, joins Mary to talk about her career path, which started in private practice and moved quickly to her current in-house role. Mel starts by talking about her podcast: Counsel - A Podcast for In-House Lawyers. One of the reasons Mel started the podcast is to share information and stories that she wished she had access to when she was first starting out in the industry. She spent three years in private practice before taking on an in-house role, and she explains the differences between the two. In her case, she went from a buttoned-up aviation role to the rollercoaster of a tech startup. She discusses the importance of continuously future-proofing your processes in order to increase efficiency and best achieve the vision of the board and executive team. This requires managing what she calls the 'long tail' of legal requests. Mel Scott - https://www.linkedin.com/in/theinhouselawyer/ Megaport - https://www.linkedin.com/company/megaport/ If you enjoyed today's show, please leave a 5-star review. You can find more information, as well as the resources mentioned in this episode, at ironcladapp.com. #LegalOps #LegalCareer

On this episode, Scott Westfahl, Professor of Practice and Faculty Director of Executive Education at Harvard Law School, joins Mary to talk about his career journey since graduating from Harvard Law School in 1988, including his time at McKinsey and then at Goodwin Proctor before returning to Harvard where he occupies his current post. Scott talks about the importance of feedback for growth in the legal world which is something he learned from the consulting world. This can be either in the moment or at the end of a project, but he believes that feedback and extensive coaching are effective ways to create great leaders. Scott takes us behind the scenes at the Executive Education program at Harvard Law which was launched in 2007 as a leadership development program for senior law firm executives. He talks about his definition of adaptive leadership, a critical skill for legal leadership or legal ops professionals. He also dives into the ways law firms should be embracing experimentation and brainstorming. Scott Westfahl - https://www.linkedin.com/in/scottwestfahl/ Harvard Law School - https://www.linkedin.com/school/harvard-law-school/ If you enjoyed today's show, please leave a 5-star review. You can find more information, as well as the resources mentioned in this episode, at ironcladapp.com. #LegalOps #LegalCareer

On this episode, Lesley Garafola, Managing Director, Global Head of Procurement and Vendor Management at Barings, joins Mary to talk about her career history and how it led her to fall in love with procurement, much to her surprise. Lesley began her career at Wells Fargo as a paralegal, with the intention of going to law school. Then she started analyzing data and organically growing the operations side of the legal department and fell into legal ops. Now she heads up procurement, which she finds both fascinating and exciting. The biggest challenge she faced in her transition to procurement was learning how to handle the stakeholders. It takes strategic thinking — an approach she has now instilled in her team. Lesley was personally asked to join procurement. Despite her objections, she finally gave in and is thriving in her field. She takes us through the process and the improvements she and her team have made to the company's systems and processes, building from the ground up. Lesley Garafola - https://www.linkedin.com/in/lesley-e-garafola-22146210/ Barings - https://www.linkedin.com/company/barings/ If you enjoyed today's show, please leave a 5-star review. You can find more information, as well as the resources mentioned in this episode, at ironcladapp.com. #LegalOps #LegalCareer

On this episode, Jill Kelley, VP of Legal Affairs at the New York Jets, joins Mary to talk about the many twists and turns in her career which eventually led to her position with the New York Jets. Something that might surprise people is just how small the legal department is at the Jets. It consists of Jill and a paralegal, so it's a department of two. As Jill says, it is a highly visible and famous organization but, behind the scenes, the legal department is very much a mom-and-pop operation. Jill's day-to-day work focuses on the business aspect of the franchise. This includes revenue-generating activities like sponsorship agreements, suites and season ticket sales. She also works closely with the multimedia team on broadcast agreements and social media content. Jill talks about being a fan of using technology, usually for contract automation, even though it is a small department. As for the future, the league is focusing heavily on online sports betting, which means data privacy issues are becoming more important every year. Jill Kelley - https://www.linkedin.com/in/jill-kelley/ New York Jets - https://www.linkedin.com/company/newyorkjets/ If you enjoyed today's show, please leave a 5-star review. You can find more information, as well as the resources mentioned in this episode, at ironcladapp.com. #LegalOps #LegalCareer