Respecting Religion

There is a novel – and concerning – development in public education and the relationship between the institutions of church and state: Oklahoma and Guam have proposed religious charter schools. Litigation has already started. But, what is a religious charter school, and why is the idea such a problem? Amanda Tyler and Holly Hollman say they are illegal and that they challenge some basic assumptions. Segment 1 (starting at 00:38): What are religious charter schools, and what's the problem? Holly and Amanda discussed the trouble with school vouchers in episode 8 and episode 9 of this season. In an order on his way out the door, former Oklahoma Attorney General John O'Connor issued an opinion that said religious charter schools were ok, but then new Oklahoma Attorney General Gentner Drummond reversed that guidance. Read Don Byrd's article for BJC's website about the Oklahoma and Guam charter schools: Guam joins Oklahoma in approving government-funded religious charter schools after legislature overrides governor's veto Segment 2 (starting at 12:39): The lawsuits in Oklahoma trying to stop this action You can download the petition for the lawsuit by Oklahoma Attorney General Genter Drummond in the Oklahoma Supreme Court at this link on the website of the Oklahoma State Courts Network. The lawsuit brought by the ACLU, Americans United for Separation of Church and State, and others is called OKPLAC, Inc. v. Statewide Virtual Charter School Board. Read the Complaint and learn more on the websites of the ACLU and of Americans United. OKPLAC is the "Oklahoma Parent Legislative Advocacy Coalition." Segment 3 (starting at 18:43): State and constitutional questions about charter schools Visit this resource from the U.S. Department of Education to learn more about charter schools. The trinity of recent Supreme Court cases mentioned were: Trinity Lutheran v. Comer (2017) Espinoza v. Montana Dept. of Revenue (2020) Carson v. Makin (2022) Respecting Religion is made possible by BJC's generous donors. You can support these conversations with a gift to BJC.

Much is said and assumed about the religious landscape of Black America, but it's more diverse than the common narratives. Holly Hollman speaks with Dr. Sabrina E. Dent and Dr. Anthony Pinn about misconceptions and how they brought together Black Church leaders and Black nontheists for key conversations. Tune in for this open and honest conversation about how we can work across racial and religious lines to help all communities thrive. SHOW NOTES Segment 1 (starting at 00:35): Misconceptions about the religious landscape of Black America Dr. Anthony Pinn is the Agnes Cullen Arnold Professor of Humanities at Rice University, and he's also the Founding Director of Rice's Center for Engaged Research and Collaborative Learning. He is the author/editor of more than 35 books, and he is also director of research for the Institute for Humanist Studies. Read Dr. Pinn's full biography here. Dr. Sabrina E. Dent is the director of the BJC Center for Faith, Justice and Reconciliation, which is the home of our project on Race and Religious Freedom. Learn more about the Center on our website and in this video. She is the editor and contributing author of the book African Americans and Religious Freedom: New Perspectives for Congregations and Communities. Read Dr. Dent's full biography here. "(Dis)belief: Reimagining the Religious Landscape of Black America" was the topic for the 2023 Religious Freedom Mobile Institute. Click here to read about it in a piece by Jaziah Masters, Research Fellow for the BJC Center for Faith, Justice and Reconciliation. Segment 2 (starting at 20:13): The connections between religious freedom and racial justice BJC's "Religious Freedom Has Been White Too Long: Voices of Black Scholars" was BJC's 2021 lecture featuring Dr. Anthony Pinn, Dr. Nicole Myers Turner, Dr. Teresa L. Smallwood, and Dr. David Goatley. Watch the event at this link and read a recap on our website. James Baldwin wrote in The New York Times on Feb. 2, 1969, that the bulk of the country's white population is beyond hope of moral rehabilitation. "They have been white, if I may so put it, too long." Segment 3 (starting at 30:23): Key moments from the conference As mentioned, Dr. Dent and Dr. Pinn will be co-editors of a forthcoming book of essays from the participants in the conference. Keep up with BJC and the BJC Center for Faith, Justice and Reconciliation for the latest! Respecting Religion is made possible by BJC's generous donors. You can support these conversations with a gift to BJC.

What is the role of churches and other houses of worship in protecting democracy? This topic usually comes up because of bad actors that overstep into partisanship, but today's show looks at how faith communities can help our elections run smoothly. Holly Hollman speaks with Chris Crawford of Protect Democracy – a nonprofit, cross-ideological organization that has a new playbook to help faith communities ensure "all eligible voters can access a ballot and every valid vote is counted." Learn more about how people of faith can love their neighbors and take active roles in protecting our system of government. SHOW NOTES: Segment 1 (starting at 00:45): Working across differences without papering over them Read more about Chris Crawford at this link. Protect Democracy and Interfaith America partnered to help faith communities to serve their communities during the 2024 election. Click here to access the Faith in Elections Playbook, and learn more about Protect Democracy at this link. Protect Democracy's guide for recognizing authoritarianism is available at this link. Segment 2 (starting at 11:49): The Faith in Elections Playbook Chris Crawford mentioned A More Perfect Union: The Jewish Partnership for Democracy. Learn more about their work on their website. Chris Crawford mentioned PowerThePolls.org as a resource to learn more about being a poll worker. Segment 3 (starting at 31:03): Religious freedom and protecting our democracy Respecting Religion is made possible by BJC's generous donors. You can support these conversations with a gift to BJC.

Now that the first votes have been cast in the presidential primaries, Amanda Tyler and Holly Hollman look at some of the troubling statements and activities on the campaign trail concerning the role of religion and religious freedom – from both Democrats and Republicans. While candidates are – and should be – free to talk about the ways their faith inspires them, there are some red lines when it comes to politicking in houses of worship with tax-exempt resources or using political power as a way to impose religion on others. SHOW NOTES Segment 1 (starting at 00:38): What makes someone "religious" according to voters? Amanda and Holly mentioned the following articles: Trump's biggest Iowa gains are in evangelical areas, smallest wins in cities by By Dan Keating, Adrian Blanco and Clara Ence Morse for The Washington Post Trump Is connecting with a different type of evangelical voter By Ruth Graham and Charles Homans for The New York Times Most Republicans think Donald Trump is a person of faith. We asked why by Samuel Benson for Deseret News There's a seed of truth in the 'God Made Trump' ad. But his acolytes don't see it. by Guthrie Graves-Fitzsimmons for MSNBC.com. It includes a link to the "God Made Trump" campaign video Amanda and Holly discussed the "God Made a Fighter" video for the 2022 gubernatorial campaign of Ron DeSantis in episode 6 of season 4: Evaluating Christian nationalism as a campaign strategy. Amanda and Holly discussed the ReAwaken America tour in episode 22 of season 4. Read more about Speaker Mike Johnson and Steve Bannon debating "God's will" in this article by Mark Wingfield for Baptist News Global: Mike Johnson and Steve Bannon spar over whether it is 'God's will' that Joe Biden is president Segment 2 (starting at 23:05): A war on Christians? Trump's promises if he returns to office Holly mentioned this piece by Meryl Kornfield, Colby Itkowitz, Hannah Knowles and Marianne LeVine for The Washington Post: Ordained by God: Trump's legal problems galvanize Iowa evangelicals Read more about former President Donald Trump's promises if he returns to office in this pice by Sarah Posner for MSNBC.com: Trump just promised an authoritarian 'task force' to impose Christian ideology Segment 3 (starting at 31:47): President Biden at Mother Emanuel Church Amanda mentioned this piece by Ken Macon for MSNBC.com on President Biden's appearance at Mother Emanuel AME Church: It's protesters, not politicians, who keep the history of Mother Emanuel AME alive BJC has a one-page explainer of how houses of worship and other religious nonprofits can how to use their prophetic voice in the political process while maintaining their 501(c)(3) tax status. Click here to access the PDF, called "Advocates, not partisans." Respecting Religion is made possible by BJC's generous donors. You can support these conversations with a gift to BJC.

What is the cost of speaking out against Christian nationalism? In this episode, Amanda Tyler talks with Rob Reiner and Dan Partland, two people behind a new film that discusses the dangers of Christian nationalism to the country, to the faith, and to pluralism. They share candidly about what they learned while making "God & Country," the cost for Christians who are speaking out against the political ideology, and what new conversations they are hoping to create with this film. SHOW NOTESSegment 1 (starting at 00:35): Rob Reiner and Dan Partland on Christian nationalism "God & Country" will be in theaters on February 16. Learn more at GodAndCountryTheMovie.com. The phrase "separation of church and state" is not in the U.S. Constitution, but the concept is laid out several times, including Article VI's prohibition on any religious test for office, the First Amendment's prohibition of a government establishment of religion, and the First Amendment's guarantee of the free exercise of religion. Read more in Brent Walker's "Top 5 Myths of the Separation of Church and State." Learn more about the Christians Against Christian Nationalism campaign – a project BJC began in 2019 – by visiting ChristiansAgainstChristianNationalism.org. Segment 2 (starting at 20:58): Post-screening Q&A with Partland and Reiner BJC and the Freedom From Religion Foundation released a comprehensive report on the role of Christian nationalism in the January 6 attack on the Capitol. You can access it here. Dan Partland mentioned The Power Worshippers, a book by Katherine Stewart on the rise of religious nationalism. It serves as a basis for the movie. Segment 3 (starting at 41:18): Closing Michelle Boorstein covered the screening for The Washington Post in this article: 'God & Country' film spotlights Christian nationalism's threat to democracy Respecting Religion is made possible by BJC's generous donors. You can support these conversations with a gift to BJC.

In honor of Martin Luther King Jr. Day, we look back at the history of the holiday and the international context at the time of its first official celebration. On today's podcast, hear from Coretta Scott King, speaking just months after the country's first commemoration of the holiday in 1986. After Dr. King's assassination in 1968, she led the charge to establish her husband's birthday as a national holiday. In this presentation, Mrs. King talks about the first celebration, plans for future celebrations, and some of her work promoting peace and freedom around the world. Segment 1 (starting at 00:36): The first and second celebration of Martin Luther King Jr. Day Mrs. Coretta Scott King's speech is from BJC's 20th National Religious Liberty Conference, held in October 1986. Read the biography of Coretta Scott King on the website of the King Center at this link. The theme for the 2024 King Holiday Observance is 'Shifting the Cultural Climate through the Study and Practice of Kingian Nonviolence.' Visit the website of the King Center to learn more, including a list of different ways you can honor the day. The Progressive National Baptist Convention was the denominational home of the Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. Read more about their history at this link on their website. "The King Center" is the name commonly used for the Martin Luther King, Jr. Center for Nonviolent Social Change, which was established by Mrs. King in 1968. Segment 2 (starting at 06:18): International work for nonviolence Segment 3 (starting at 18:09): Hopes and plans for future celebrations Segment 4 (starting at 23:26): Closing Click here to listen to a presentation from former Rep. Barbara Jordan during this same 1986 event, which we presented in episode 7 of this season. Respecting Religion is made possible by BJC's generous donors. You can support these conversations with a gift to BJC.

Justice Sandra Day O'Connor showed a thoughtful approach toward religious liberty issues during her time on the bench, upholding both the Free Exercise Clause and the Establishment Clause. Paying tribute to her soon after her passing on December 1, Amanda Tyler and Holly Hollman remember Justice O'Connor's contributions and talk about her legacy, sharing personal reflections as well as wisdom from Justice O'Connor that holds true today. They also look at her controversial endorsement test and how the Supreme Court has shifted – both the law and in terms of public opinion – after her retirement. Amanda and Holly also take a moment to share what we learned about you, our listeners, from this year's Spotify Wrapped. SHOW NOTES: Segment 1 (starting at 00:38): The life of Justice Sandra Day O'Connor Here are a few remembrances of Justice Sandra Day O'Connor: Justice Sandra Day O'Connor, lauded as "a human being, extraordinary," lies in repose at the court by Mark Walsh for SCOTUSblog Click here for the entire "In Memoriam" section on SCOTUSblog Sandra Day O'Connor, First Woman on the Supreme Court, Is Dead at 93 – The New York Times' obituary by Linda Greenhouse Justice O'Connor's official Supreme Court bio Click here to see the online version of the Supreme Court exhibit on Justice O'Connor's life Justice O'Connor's funeral was a private event at the Washington National Cathedral, but it is available for the public to view on the Cathedral's YouTube page. Segment 2 (starting at 15:41): Justice O'Connor on church-state cases Supreme Court Justice Sandra Day O'Connor leaves legacy of civic-minded church-state jurisprudence by Don Byrd for BJC's website Amanda and Holly mentioned the following cases: Board of Education v. Mergens (1990) Lynch v. Donnelly (1984) McCreary County, Ky., v. ACLU (2005) was the Ten Commandments case with Justice O'Connor's famous concurrence. Click here to learn more about the two Ten Commandments cases and decisions from a column Holly wrote in 2005. Segment 3 (starting at 26:49): The ongoing impact of Justice O'Connor Amanda and Holly mentioned that Justice O'Connor was one of the authors of the plurality opinion in Planned Parenthood v. Casey (1992) Amanda and Holly discuss this article from Linda Greenhouse for The New York Times: "What Sandra Day O'Connor got wrong" Segment 4 (starting at 35:31): Who are your fellow listeners? See our Spotify Wrapped on Instagram at this link. Our most popular podcast on Spotify in 2023 was Episode 22 of Season 4, discussing the ReAwaken America tour. Our most shared one was Episode 23 of Season 4 on the myth of American "chosenness." Respecting Religion is made possible by BJC's generous donors. Use this special link to support these conversations, and thank you for listening!

In part two of our conversation on school vouchers, Amanda Tyler and Holly Hollman look at who really wants the troublesome programs, and why. They discuss how court decisions are chipping away at constitutional boundaries and dive into the policy debates and political fights over school vouchers that are pitting communities against each other. Plus, they share the origins of some of the language used in these conversations and why Texas – surprisingly – hasn't passed a voucher program. SHOW NOTES Segment 1 (starting at 00:38): Analyzing Zelman and cases chipping away at constitutional boundaries Listen to part one of this conversion in episode 8 of season 5. Holly and Amanda discuss the ruling in the 2002 case of Zelman v. Simmons-Harris. You can read the opinion and dissent here. They mention a trilogy of cases that came later – click the case name for more information, including podcast episodes: Trinity Lutheran v. Comer (2017) Espinoza v. Montana Dept. of Revenue (2020) Carson v. Makin (2022) Segment 2 (starting at 06:04): Policy debates and political fights Holly and Amanda mentioned the following articles: GOP states are embracing vouchers. Wealthy parents are benefitting. by Andrew Atterbury for Politico 'School choice' developed as a way to protect segregation and abolish public schools by Nancy MacLean for The Washington Post in 2021 Rural resistance to statewide school vouchers by Deven Carlson for Brookings Are school vouchers inevitable? was the headline of the article by Robert T. Garrett on the front page of the Dallas Morning News "Our public school system is our town": Why this rural Republican is voting against school vouchers By Brian Lopez and Patrick Svitek for The Texas Tribune Amanda and Holly discussed Texas Gov. Greg Abbott's push for school vouchers in episode 1 of this season. Learn more about Pastors for Texas Children and their work countering vouchers by visiting their website. Segment 3: (starting at 24:00): Additional resources on vouchers Here are some additional resources from BJC on school vouchers: U.S. House rejects nationwide school voucher amendment 311-113, while states continue to enact voucher programs by Don Byrd (March 2023) Voucher-funded religious education: A threat to religious liberty byJennifer Hawks (February 2020) School vouchers threaten religious autonomy by Jennifer Hawks (March 2015) You can also access additional resources on religion and public schools at this link on our website. Respecting Religion is made possible by BJC's generous donors. You can support these conversations with a gift to BJC.

School voucher programs across the country seek to divert taxpayer money to religious schools, which raises significant concerns for religious freedom advocates. In part one of this two-part episode, Amanda Tyler and Holly Hollman explore the problematic issue of school vouchers. They talk about the various iterations of vouchers and the many issues they can create, including their coercive nature. Plus, they look at the first time the Supreme Court upheld a voucher program and what that ruling actually says. SHOW NOTES: Segment 1 (starting at 00:38): What is the problem with the government funding of religion? Amanda and Holly talked about the Texas chaplain bill in episode 5: An alarming push to put chaplains in public schools Segment 2 (starting at 12:33): What are school vouchers? Segment 3: (starting at 19:37): Exploring Zelman and the chain of causation Holly and Amanda review the ruling in the 2002 case of Zelman v. Simmons-Harris. You can read the opinion and dissent here. Respecting Religion is made possible by BJC's generous donors. You can support these conversations with a gift to BJC.

American trailblazer Barbara Jordan delivered a powerful speech on the role of churches in shaping public policy at a BJC event in 1986. We're bringing you this special presentation because her words resonate for our political climate today. Congresswoman Jordan notes that the institutional separation of church and state must be maintained, but that doesn't mean the two can't interact. She gives a strong case for Christian citizenship and being active in the policy realm. Plus, her wide-ranging Q&A covers nuclear conflicts, the "wall of separation" metaphor, and more. SHOW NOTESSegment 1 (starting at 00:34): Barbara Jordan's 1986 speech on the church and public policy Barbara Jordan's speech is from BJC's 20th National Religious Liberty Conference, held in October 1986. Learn more about Barbara Jordan from the following sources: Biography from the Barbara Jordan Center Biography from the Smithsonian National Museum of African American History and Culture Article about Barabara Jordan written by William Broyles and published by Texas Monthly (1976) Barbara Jordan's obituary in The New York Times, written by Francis X. Clines (1996) During her speech, Congresswoman Jordan mentions the letter from Thomas Jefferson to the Danbury Baptists (1802). You can read it on the website of the Library of Congress. Segment 2 (starting at 23:26): Q&A on nuclear conflict, the "wall of separation," advocacy, and more The audience members who asked questions did not have microphones, so we just shared the host's repetition of questions in this segment. In two instances, Barbara Jordan repeated the question herself (at 32:22 and 33:58). Segment 3 (starting at 40:29): Wrapping up today's show Respecting Religion is made possible by BJC's generous donors. You can support these conversations with a gift to BJC.