For The Love With Jen Hatmaker Podcast

In this special SXSW2025 edition of For the Love, Jen Hatmaker sits down with Dr. Stacey Ludwig Johnson, the Senior VP and Executive Dean at Western Governors University (WGU) School of Education. As a lifelong advocate for educators, Dr. Johnson is at the forefront of reimagining how we train, support, and sustain teachers in today’s challenging educational landscape.Jen, a former teacher herself, brings her deep passion for education into this conversation, unpacking the real issues educators face today—from teacher shortages to burnout—and discussing how innovative models like WGU’s competency-based education are transforming access to learning.What You’ll Learn in This EpisodeDr. Johnson’s Path to Leadership: How she transitioned from working in corrections to becoming a pioneer in online education.Competency-Based Education: What it is, how it differs from traditional models, and why it’s a game-changer for adult learners.Educator Burnout & Retention: The state of teacher well-being and what’s being done to ensure teachers not only enter the profession but thrive in it.School & Community Support for Teachers: How schools, administrators, and parents can create environments where teachers feel valued.Future Trends in Education: How AI, technology, and apprenticeship programs are shaping the next generation of educators.Thought-provoking Quotes:“We don’t believe in courses just for the sake of courses. Everything at WGU is designed to build skills that translate directly into a career.” - Stacey Ludwig Johnson“Retention is just as critical as recruitment—if we don’t take care of our teachers, we will never solve the teacher shortage crisis.” - Stacey Ludwig Johnson“Teachers are literally helping us raise the next generation. Every second of what they do matters.“ - Jen Hatmaker“The future of education must include personalization, technology integration, and real-world experience to prepare students for success.” - Stacey Ludwig JohnsonResources Mentioned in This Episode: Learn more about WGU: wgu.edu Guest’s Links: Interested in becoming a teacher or continuing your education? WGU offers flexible, affordable degree programs designed for working adults.Website - https://www.wgu.edu/Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/westerngovernorsu/Twitter - https://x.com/wguFacebook - https://www.facebook.com/wgu.edu/Youtube - https://www.youtube.com/user/WesternGovernorsUnivTikTok - https://www.tiktok.com/@wguStacey Ludwig Johnson’s Website - https://www.wgu.edu/blog/authors/stacey-ludwig-johnson.htmlStacey Ludwig Johnson’s LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/stacey-ludwig-johnson-0bba1715/Connect with Jen!Jen’s Website - https://jenhatmaker.com/Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmakerJen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmakerJen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmakerThe For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy.  To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Description:In the spirit of Spring Break, which it is for us here in Texas, we’re taking a quick break from our regular podcast lineup to do something fun. Recent listeners of the podcast will know that we’ve added a voicemail feature to the podcast and, for a few weeks, we’ve been asking you to leave us messages with your thoughts on recent episodes and questions for us. And boy you have! The messages we’ve received run the gamut from candid and vulnerable to gutsy and inspirational and some were just hilarious (though not all of them were appropriate for the airwaves but we still love them so KEEP THEM COMING).Today, we’re responding to a few of our favorite messages from women in our listening community who shared messages that we think will resonate with you on multiple levels. Our thanks to Naomi, Mollie, Jamie, Laura, and one special anonymous caller for sharing their thoughts for all of us to enjoy.Thought-provoking Quotes: "We need to wear what we feel comfortable in, what we feel pretty in. There are no rules!" – Listener Voicemail “I broke up with my effort last week. I literally sat myself down and said, ‘I am not responsible for making this person happy.’” – Jen Hatmaker "Loud quitting is about being clear, setting boundaries, and walking away from what no longer serves you—without apology." – Amy Hardin "Once we stop our frantic interventions to manage someone else’s life, it turns out, that’s when they start to do their own work—even our kids." – Jen Hatmaker “There is no such thing as ‘too late.’ We are only getting more time and space to dream new dreams.” – Amy Hardin Resources Mentioned in This Episode: The Devil Wears Prada film (2006) - https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0458352/ Warning poem by Jenny Joseph - https://www.scottishpoetrylibrary.org.uk/poem/warning/ Freedom From Codependency with Melody Beattie - https://jenhatmaker.com/podcasts/series-56/freedom-from-codependency-with-melody-beattie/ Finding Freedom with Mel Robbins and Two Little Words: Let Them - https://jenhatmaker.com/podcasts/series-64/finding-freedom-with-mel-robbins-and-two-little-words-let-them/ Atlas of the Heart by Brené Brown - https://amzn.to/4hkHNb7 Awaken to Your Next Chapter: Artist and Activist Lisa Congdon on Imagining a More Beautiful Life - https://jenhatmaker.com/podcasts/series-64/awaken-to-your-next-chapter-artist-and-activist-lisa-congdon-on-imagining-a-more-beautiful-life/ Sacred Reimagination: When Faith Evolves with You: Erin Hicks Moon - https://jenhatmaker.com/podcasts/series-64/sacred-reimagination-when-faith-evolves-with-you-erin-hicks-moon/ Jane Fonda - https://www.janefonda.com/ Saturday Night Live 50th Anniversary Special - https://www.nbcnews.com/pop-culture/snl-50-anniversary-special-how-watch-time-cast-rcna191588 Stuart Smalley - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stuart_Smalley Jen is going to be a grandma! - https://www.instagram.com/reel/DHBp8olOTOi/ Connect with Jen!Jen’s Website - https://jenhatmaker.com/Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmakerJen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmakerJen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmakerThe For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Title: Fixing the Broken Pieces with Ian Morgan Cron Description:Everyone is an addict. Mr. Rogers…The Dali Lama… Michelle Obama! Mull that idea over for a minute and when you’re done being outraged like we were, join us for this enthralling conversation with one of our favorite repeat guests on For the Love – author, psychotherapist, and Episcopal priest, Ian Morgan Cron. Today, we’re talking to him about his new book, The Fix: How the Twelve Steps Offer a Surprising Path of Transformation for the Well-Adjusted, the Down-and-Out, and Everyone In Between.People pleasing, the need to be right, being a compulsive helper, workaholism, being a knowledge junkie, perfectionism, holding on to our past suffering – these are all forms of addiction. The simple truth is, we each resort to our own methods of dealing with the harder aspects of life. For some, that solution means turning to a substance to numb our pain, which is how we traditionally think of addiction. For others, there are behaviors we employ to manipulate what we are feeling. And that’s where the rest of us fall into the sticky trap.Ian, who also hosts the wildly popular Typology podcast exploring the mystery of the human personality, teaches us how the Twelve Steps are a trusted tool for anyone seeking to move beyond self-help to a more profound sense of awakening. And, in a new segment called “To My Younger Self”, Jen and Amy share some deeply personal experiences that, for Amy, helped change her relationships and, for Jen, helped change how she viewed herself.  Thought-provoking Quotes:“People don’t have one addiction; people are poly-addicted. They’re seething cauldrons of addiction.” – Ian Morgan Cron“All human beings have a natural and innate hunger for union with the divine. The problem is when we go in search of counterfeit experiences of the divine that lead to disappointment, disillusionment and disaster.” – Ian Morgan Cron“Most Twelve Steps meetings happen in church or synagogue basements, after hours. And I wondered, does anyone upstairs know about the miracles that are going on downstairs? And why can’t we release what’s happening down here so that people up there can take advantage of it?” – Ian Morgan Cron“When you can admit powerlessness, it’s a relief that it’s not on you anymore.” – Ian Morgan Cron“When you frame an addiction as a solution to a problem, albeit an inadequate one, what follows is compassion, not judgment or condemnation.” – Ian Morgan CronResources Mentioned in This Episode:Five Calls app – https://5calls.org/I Poop on Fascists Sticker - https://bit.ly/4gWiFHxThe Fix: How the Twelve Steps Offer a Surprising Path of Transformation for the Well-Adjusted, the Down-and-Out, and Everyone In Between by Ian Morgan Cron - https://amzn.to/3Xgx6PKThe Fix Workbook: How the Twelve Steps Offer a Surprising Path of Transformation for the Well-Adjusted, the Down-and-Out, and Everyone in Between by Ian Morgan Cron - https://amzn.to/3DiTReVHow to Mitigate Stress Based on Your Personality – FREE DOWNLOAD - https://typologyinstitute.com/stress The Typology Institute Enneagram Assessment by Ian Morgan Cron - https://typologyinstitute.com/assessmentTypology Podcast - https://www.typologypodcast.com/The Road Back to You: An Enneagram Journey to Self-Discovery by Ian Morgan Cron - https://amzn.to/3QCG1qIGuest’s Links:Ian’s website - https://ianmorgancron.com/Ian’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/ianmorgancronIan’s Twitter - https://x.com/ianmorgancronIan’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/IanMorganCron/Ian’s Youtube - https://www.youtube.com/@imcronIan’s Podcast - https://www.typologypodcast.com/Connect with Jen!Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmakerJen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmakerJen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmakerThe For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy.  To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Description:Lisa Congdon may be an internationally known fine artist, illustrator and writer but she didn’t achieve momentum in her career until she was nearly 40 years old. Prior to that time, she felt that her life hadn’t mattered much, that she didn’t have anything interesting to say. But, a total career pivot in her mid-thirties awakened a passion in her that had been lying dormant for decades and helped her find her powerful, beautiful voice. Despite taking an untraditional path, Lisa has achieved recognition, not just as an artist, but as a leader in the industry for her work in social justice, mentoring and teaching. Lisa says making art is what changed her relationship to her story.Today, Jen and Amy talk to Lisa Congdon about: What it looks and feels like to awaken to new possibilities in life The power of finding and harnessing your voice, something Lisa covers more in her book, Find Your Artistic Voice: The Essential Guide to Working Your Creative Magic How two really big things (joy and activism) can coexist in artistic expression Lisa’s game-changing practice of “loud quitting” the things that no longer bring joy or something positive into her life ***Segments:Bless & Release: Loud QuittingThought-provoking Quotes:I decided to develop a new narrative for my life and what it could become. I needed to start believing that I was worthy of love. – Lisa CongdonI think I’ve always been an artist and a maker and super-creative but I was operating in self-doubt. I learned to give myself permission to play and explore and change my own life. I was lit on fire because, for so many years, I had no sense of agency. But suddenly, I could do whatever I wanted, CI think my work is the marriage of a passion for social justice with the authentic joy I have for life. – Lisa Congdon I found myself in a place where I was exhausted, miserable and doing things out of obligation. I worked hard at letting go. I got in a systematic process of taking inventory of my life, how I was spending my time. Every time I felt a rush of anxiety about doing something, I would stop and examine it. – Lisa CongdonResources Mentioned in This Episode:Find Your Artistic Voice: The Essential Guide to Working Your Creative Magic by Lisa Congdon - https://amzn.to/4kkYAO1Art, Inc.: The Essential Guide for Building Your Career as an Artist by Lisa Congdon - https://amzn.to/4ij5Ms2The Live Your Values Deck - https://lisacongdon.com/products/values-deckLisa Congdon’s St. Mary’s College Exhibit - https://www.stmarys-ca.edu/museum-art/lisa-congdon-hold-it-lightlyCorita Kent - https://www.corita.org/Guest’s Links:Lisa’s website - https://lisacongdon.com/Lisa’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/lisacongdonLisa’s Twitter - https://x.com/lisacongdonLisa’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/lisacongdonartLisa’s Pinterest - https://www.pinterest.com/lisacongdon/Connect with Jen!Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmakerJen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmakerJen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmakerThe For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy.  To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Description:Cancer is a tough topic—hard to discuss, isolating, and disorienting for those facing it. For Tyler Merritt, a beloved voice in the JHBC community, confronting mortality sparked a fresh perspective on life.Tyler joins Jen to talk about This Changes Everything, his humorous and heartfelt love letter to life after battling cancer. With his signature humor, pop culture nods, and musical theater references (plus a killer playlist), Tyler weaves candid stories of surgery and treatment with playful asides—think a five-page play about his appendix and Taylor Swift-inspired subtitles.Things may go off the rails when Jen and Tyler debate whether words like “lovers” and “making love” are officially outdated—we apologize in advance.***Thought-provoking Quotes:Because of the way your book is written, in real time and with such urgency, I think 100 people out of 100 will go straight to their phones after finishing the book and Google ”is Tyler Merritt still alive?” – Jen HatmakerI found out pretty quickly that I was using a lot of humor to cover my fear. Even in the worst possible scenarios, even though I was sometimes walking with death, it felt like, if I looked around, there was humor. – Tyler MerrittFor people that are in the horrible cancer club, if you have something in your life that has created change in your every day, or something that has made things scary, you’re not alone. You’re blessed to still be here and breathing. – Tyler MerrittResources Mentioned in This Episode:This Changes Everything: A Surprisingly Funny Story About Race, Cancer, Faith, and Other Things We Don’t Talk About by Tyler Merritt - https://amzn.to/3Clgwa2Jen Hatmaker Book Club - https://bit.ly/40KOQ7UI Take My Coffee Black: Reflections on Tupac, Musical Theater, Faith, and Being Black in America by Tyler Merritt - https://amzn.to/4hjiPcCPublisher’s Weekly synopsis - https://www.publishersweekly.com/9781546006961A Door Made for Me by Tyler Merritt - https://amzn.to/4hvCkPnCujo - https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0085382/Annie - https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0083564/?ref_=nv_sr_srsg_8_tt_2_nm_6_in_0_q_annieWhere the Red Fern Grows by Wilson Rawls - https://amzn.to/4gdEbqGTrain - Drops of Jupiter - https://open.spotify.com/track/2hKdd3qO7cWr2Jo0Bcs0MABlackberry Farms - https://www.blackberryfarm.com/This Changes Everything playlist - https://open.spotify.com/playlist/0jFoCxX22lzohvdd2tLfkQSandi Patti - https://www.sandipatty.com/Taylor Swift - https://www.taylorswift.com/Prince - https://www.prince.com/RENT - https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0294870/AUDIOBOOK: This Changes Everything: A Surprisingly Funny Story About Race, Cancer, Faith, and Other Things We Don't Talk About by Tyler Merritt - https://amzn.to/3Cm1YHaBook People (Austin) - https://www.bookpeople.com/Parnassus Books (Nashville) - https://www.parnassusbooks.net/Guest’s Links:Tyler’s website - https://thetylermerrittproject.com/Tyler’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/thetylermerrittproject/Tyler’s Twitter - https://x.com/ttmprojectTyler’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/thetylermerrittprojectTyler’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCPB48_JfK-VMnYQPTYyMX5QConnect with Jen!Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmakerJen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmakerJen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmakerThe For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Description:In this second installment of our special Midlife Renaissance series, the delightful Erin Hicks Moon joins Jen and Amy for a super resonant conversation to discuss what it looks like when the faith that you grew up with bears no resemblance to your current values and what matters to you today. But Erin reassures us that if our faith looked like it did 10, 15, even 20 years ago, we would not be evolving.Erin is the host and resident bible scholar of the Faith Adjacent podcast and author of I’ve Got Questions: The Spiritual Practice of Having It Out with God. She’s a thoughtful guide for processing our questions, curiosity, and doubt.   Women naturally come into midlife with a posture of comfort in things they are sure of and curiosity to explore the things that they aren’t. There are many people searching for answers in the wilderness of faith but, as Erin reminds us, our questions can lead to a more vibrant and joyful faith.***SegmentsMidlife Glowup: Trying new thingsAmy gives an update on her decision to go out on a limb as a newly-minted podcaster and Jen shares what it’s like to date again in your fifties. Thought-provoking Quotes:We do spiritual practices to be connected to God and I think we overcomplicate it with rigid checklists. – Erin Hicks MoonReally working through the grief, and the sadness, and anger of watching your faith be weaponized or coming from a church that has split over something really difficult, or something personal in your life, something on a world stage. I think we have to be honest in that grief. That is a really difficult thing when you’re surrounded by toxic positivity in the church.Sometimes it sucks and we have to be honest about that. – Erin Hick MoonWe can still have a relationship with God, we can still have faith, but it doesn’t have to look the way everyone else says it should look. – Erin Hicks MoonI’m shocked when I have conversations with people who I really did not know grew up in the church and it turns out we have so many of the same beliefs; we’ve been evolving on parallel tracks but they just choose not to identify that way. – Amy HardinI have never met one person who has gone through deconstruction and/or because they wanted to sin more. The overwhelming pattern is that they want to figure this out and at the end of the process, they end up with a faith that is stronger than what they began with. – Erin Hicks MoonResources Mentioned in This Episode:I've Got Questions: The Spiritual Practice of Having It Out with God by Erin Hicks MoonI've Got Questions Guided Journal: Prompts and Practices for Rewilding Your Faith by Erin Hicks Moon Sarah Bessey - https://www.sarahbessey.com/Anne Lamott - https://www.instagram.com/annelamott/Bridgerton - https://www.netflix.com/title/80232398Eugene Peterson - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugene_H._PetersonThe Making of Biblical Womanhood: How the Subjugation of Women Became Gospel Truth by Beth Allison BarrPastor Trey - https://www.instagram.com/pastortrey05/Dallas Willard - https://dwillard.org/Guest’s Links:Erin’s website - https://www.erinhmoon.com/Erin’s Substack - https://erinhmoon.substack.com/Erin’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/erinhmoonErin’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/erin.hicks.moonErin’s Podcast - https://faithadjacent.com/Connect with Jen!Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmakerJen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmakerJen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmakerThe For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy.  To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Description:In this special episode, we welcome Barnard College professor and accomplished author, Jennifer Finney Boylan, back to the show to discuss her latest labor of love, her book Cleavage, which examines the divisions – as well as the common ground – between the genders, and reflects on her experiences, both difficult and joyful, as a transgender American.Jenny discusses the importance that things like nuance,imagination, patience, empathy and understanding hold in our divided world, reflecting on her experiences as a transgender woman and noting that for many, “living your best life is not necessarily a political decision, but a matter of life and death.” The ultimate thing she wants, Jenny says, is just to be left alone, to live her life and to be free.SegmentsBless & Release: Gender stereotypes***Thought-provoking Quotes:Conversations about trans-women in sports are complicated and demand nuance, patience, and imagination. For us to be defined by the most difficult and controversial aspects of our existence is really unfair. – Jennifer Finney BoylanI’m not a woman with an asterisk. At 66 ½ years old, my life has a lot more in common with other women my age than you would think. My life does not revolve around me trying to sneak into your daughter’s soccer game. My life revolves around my family, and reading, and teaching my students, and working in the garden, and things that I hope would seem very familiar to people. – Jennifer Finney BoylanThese are hard times. But we do know that hard times come and hard times go. And, whatever this moment is, is not forever. Although I can’t underestimate exactly how hard it is to be singled out by the President of the United States as a person who specifically is not deserving of love or respect or basic human kindness. – Jennifer Finney BoylanNobody goes from male to female in hopes of getting a better deal. – Jennifer Finney BoylanI hope people will pick up and read Cleavage not because they want to understand more about the trans business but because they want to know what sorts of choices people can make when they feel that the world is against them and there is no room for them. I have found, against all odds, that there is room for me, that I have been loved, and, on a good day, the world is full of joy and humor. – Jennifer Finney BoylanResources Mentioned in This Episode:Cleavage: Men, Women, and the Space Between Us by Jennifer Finney Boylan Mad Honey: A GMA Book Club Pick: A Novel by Jennifer Finney BoylanRoxane GayShe's Not There: A Life in Two Genders by Jennifer Finney BoylanJennifer Finney Boylan’s New York Times articles - https://www.nytimes.com/column/jennifer-finney-boylanI Am Cait (Caitlin Jenner Show) - https://tv.apple.com/us/show/i-am-cait/umc.cmc.38b55qpveo4xdxypnk03xfvmpTorrey Peters - https://www.torreypeters.com/Kate Bornstein - http://katebornstein.com/Trans Bodies Trans Selves: a Resource Guide for the Transgender Community - http://transbodies.com/John Barth - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_BarthBen Hatmaker’s marathon post - https://www.instagram.com/p/DGI6wt2OyBL/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==Cleavage Tour Schedule - https://us.macmillan.com/tours/jennifer-finney-boylan-cleavage/Guest’s Links:Jenny’s website - https://jenniferboylan.net/ Jenny’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/jenniferfinneyboylanJenny’s Twitter - https://x.com/JennyBoylanJenny’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/JenniferFinneyBoylan/Jenny’s Medium - https://medium.com/@jennyboylan_97964 Connect with Jen!Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmakerJen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmakerJen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmakerThe For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Title: Midlife Renaissance: Building Your Belonging Circle with Dr Thema BryantDescription:Today, we’re revisiting a popular topic on this show: Friendships. More specifically, the revival of our friendships and our capacity for friendships in midlife. How many of us have sacrificed a relationship or a piece of ourselves in order to fulfill the implied demands of our role as a wife or mother or woman with a career? Dr. Thema Bryant is a renowned psychologist, author, professor, sacred artist, and minister, who empowers women to connect with themselves and to others by exploring fun and comfortable topics like our control issues and emotional unavailability with practical activation activities and teaching how to shift our mindset and patterns.Today, we’re delving into the impacts of loneliness, the complexities of navigating new and evolving friendships in midlife, and the importance of self-love and “coming home” to ourselves before we can build a community that can support us in the way we need it to.Aha moments from this episode include: Common reasons why midlife can feel isolating to some women The role major life changes (e.g., career shifts, divorce, empty nesting) play in creating a sense of disconnection Signs that a friendship or community is not serving us well, including navigating shifts in those friendships and letting go of what no longer serves us and welcoming new connections Practical activation exercises, such as writing vows to yourself, that you can practice to strengthen your relationships with yourself and others Plus, Jen and Amy debut a new segment called “Zero Damns to Give” where they suss out what stuff really matters in this stage of their lives and what can be cast off, allowing them to step into full authenticity—without guilt, shame, or over-explanation.***SegmentsZero Damns to Give: Unapologetic midlife editionThought-provoking Quotes:When I observe someone making a polite but clear boundary, I respect it. I’m impressed. – Jen HatmakerCan you come to the place where you admit, I miss myself? And myself is not my labor. Myself is not my roles. Myself is a living soul and one of the things that feeds my soul are my friendships but those got neglected because I was told that to be a good leader or to be a good mom, I had to deprioritize the things that nourished me. – Dr. Thema BryantIf a community is not ready-made, something for you to join, it’s something for you to create. – Dr. Thema BryantOur wellness is more important than our loyalty. – Dr. Thema BryantResources Mentioned in This Episode:Matters of the Heart: Healing Your Relationship with Yourself and Those You Love by Dr. Thema Bryant - https://amzn.to/40XMql6Homecoming: Overcome Fear and Trauma to Reclaim Your Whole, Authentic Self by Dr. Thema Bryant - https://amzn.to/4hVYQ4cThe Homecoming Podcast with Dr. Thema Bryant - https://soundcloud.com/dr-thema-bryant-davisGuest’s Links:Thema’s website - https://drthema.com/Thema’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/dr.thema/Thema’s Twitter - https://x.com/drthemaThema’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/ThemaBryantDavisThema’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCxpb1ZdNd6M99Fhaw09H81QThema’s Podcast - https://soundcloud.com/dr-thema-bryant-davisConnect with Jen!Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmakerJen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmakerJen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmakerThe For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Back in the olden days of the 1990s with our dial-up internet and AOL accounts, twelve-year-old Brian Kelly was at home honing his budding interest in travel planning by booking his family vacations and maximizing the reach of his family’s points and frequent flyer miles. Cut to a few decades later and that hobby (which started as a small-time blog powered by affiliate-marketing, which his mom was convinced was a scam) has evolved into a whirlwind operation that the world now knows familiarly as “The Points Guy”. Brian Sherpas us through all of the twists and turns of booking travel to eliminate the headaches and get THE MOST bang for our buck.Highlights from this chat include:  Why Brian thinks this is “the Platinum Age of Travel”  Mastering family travel – Brian has been to sixteen countries with his two-year-old and is currently planning a month-long trip to Thailand with his newborn so he’s figured this out! How, when leveraged correctly, you can finance your travel using your loyalty points The 3 main types of rewards to have on your radar Surprisingly helpful hacks to avoid jetlag And Jen shares a hilarious story about a flight to Spain seated next to a nun that quickly got out of hand Segments:Rant or Rave: Early Airport ArrivalsGenXCellence: 80s/90s Travel***Thought-provoking Quotes:When people tell me that because of my knowledge, they were able to get the family together this year, that’s why I do what I do.– Brian KellyHaving points in a transferable currency is like an insurance policy. – Brian KellyFind where the deals are. That’s how you really save. Let the deal define your destination, especially if you’re booking multiple tickets. That’s when you save real money. Spend your money on the horseback riding experience, spend it on the meals, and the fun. – Brian Kelly You need to be your own advocate. I see people melting down in airports and getting bullied around, screaming at airline agents – the ones who hold all the power. I think people need a mentality shift because they assume they are owed something when they’re not. You need to know when to ask for favor and when you are owed something. It makes all the difference. – Brian Kelly To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Description:Jen first met Tressie McMillan Cottom the way most normal people meet – under the bright lights on the set of an Oprah special, invited by Ms. Winfrey to speak on a panel, along with other influential voices including Rebel Wilson, Amber Riley, Katie Sturino, Jamie Kern Lima, Busy Philipps and others to talk about diet culture, the harmful narratives we have surrounding our weight and our bodies, and how we can begin reframing the conversation away from one centered in shame to one focused on body acceptance. The entire studio was gobsmacked by Tressie which is fitting given that she is a prominent cultural commentator and Professor at UNC Chapel Hill. Her work explores the loaded and nuanced ideas like racial capitalism, beauty standards, the exploitation of higher education systems, but in a way that we ordinary Joe’s can understand. We knew immediately that she was destined to be a guest on our show and today is the day.Segments:Bless & Release: The News Cycle***Thought-provoking Quotes:I think every life has a trauma so there’s nothing really special about mine. But whatever your trauma is, you are usually faced with a decision, which is, do I want to be who I was before this or am I going to be something different? – Tressie McMillan CottomI love really hard questions. I am my happiest, most connected, most joyful, when I am trying to disentangle a really hard social problem that I think everybody has got wrong. I’m really attracted to those things where our beliefs are totally counter-intuitive, where our gut is telling us something is there but the picture is fuzzy, and I think I’m attracted to that because my path was so abnormal and so unique and I know that I wouldn’t have existed if people had just gone along with what was supposed to be. – Tressie McMillan CottomI thought my grandmothers sounded as intelligent as my professors and so I really struggled with the idea that there was something counterfeit or illegitimate about them and their stories and the things that I had learned from them. - Tressie McMillan CottomHistory is weirdly comforting when we can look at our worst impulses and know this isn't the first time we’ve faced this level of chaos and inequality and systemic injustice. It’s just our generation’s turn. – Jen HatmakerResources Mentioned in This Episode:Leave us a voicemail- https://jenhatmaker.com/podcast/ Click the “Send Voicemail” tab on the right side of the pagePantsuit Politics - https://www.pantsuitpoliticsshow.com/Allison Gill - https://allisongill.com/The Daily Beans | News with Swearing - https://www.dailybeanspod.com/Lower Ed: The Troubling Rise of For-Profit Colleges in the New Economy by Tressie McMillan Cottom - https://amzn.to/4hv6dPFThick: And Other Essays by Tressie McMillan Cottom - https://amzn.to/3Co8gWXDr. Tressie McMillan Cottom’s New York Times newsletter - https://www.nytimes.com/by/tressie-mcmillan-cottomTressie’s MacArthur Fellowship - https://www.macfound.org/fellows/class-of-2020/tressie-mcmillan-cottomOprah + Weight Watchers: Making the Shift special - https://www.weightwatchers.com/makingtheshift/?srsltid=AfmBOortVultNvf8Oy7KWezSW1X6uVsvMm9ziScOvAzxUg3XsWQ_2H44Guest’s Links:Dr. Cottom’s website - https://tressiemc.com/Dr. Cottom’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/tressiemcphd/Dr. Cottom’s Twitter - https://x.com/tressiemcphdDr. Cottom’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/tressiemcmillancottom/Dr. Cottom’s podcast - https://tressiemc.com/podcast/ Connect with Jen!Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmakerJen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmakerJen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmakerThe For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy.  To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices