The Business of Open Source

Jono Bacon’s passion for building communities has been a driving force in a career taken him from Canonical to GitHub to founding the Community Leadership Core community accelerator. In this episode, Jono shares his definition of community, how a community can create a movement and the differences between the two. We also get a bit of insight into how he developed his passion for building communities and why he continues helping companies build and support theirs through the Community Leadership Core. When Jono speaks about communities he is involved with, he uses “we” instead of “I” to describe their achievements, so I had him dig into that a bit more as we explored the power dynamics that have a huge influence on the success of a community or movement. Highlights:I introduce Jono, who is the founder of Community Leadership Core (0:28)Jono shares more about his passion for building communities and why he started Community Leadership Core (0:51)Jono goes into his background, discovering how Linux was created, and finding connection to others through open source (2:47)Jono reflects on his time at Canonical and what he learned (10:46)How Jono defines and thinks about “community” (13:10)The difference between building a community and creating a movement (15:50)Using “we” vs “I” in communities to encourage collaboration (18:05)Where Jono sees companies missing the mark in community building (20:03)Jono explains what delivery looks like in the context of community (22:31)Jono shares examples of successful communities (27:05)Communities Jono enjoys participating in (28:44)How to start a community from scratch (31:22)A quick summary of the Community Leadership Core (32:40)Links:JonoLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonobaconTwitter: https://twitter.com/jonobaconCompany: communityleadershipcore.com

Michael Cheng is an M&A Specialist who has had an extensive career that includes a former stint at Facebook as a Product Manager and his current role as a Lawyer. In this episode, Michael returns to the show to have an in-depth discussion around acquisitions. Michael shares his thoughts on why most acquisitions leave everyone involved feeling unsatisfied, and what he thinks should be done by both parties to mitigate the high failure rate of acquisitions. We also chat about the common grievances founders have after going through an acquisition, and the approach Michael recommends to mitigate those regrets. Michael also shares insights on why it’s harder on an open-source company to be successfully acquired if they are in between being a purely services-based or SaaS company. Highlights:I introduce returning guest Michael Cheng, whose illustrious career spans roles as a Product Manager for Facebook, a Lawyer, and an M&A Specialist (00:22)Michael gives some background on his career history and why he’s pursued so many different roles (01:00)Michael and I discuss the bird’s eye view of the steps it takes to get acquired (02:23)Why most acquisitions fail (06:11) The common grievances that sellers have after going through an acquisition (08:11)Michael’s thoughts on the likely outcomes for acquisitions of open-source companies (10:28)What open-source founders can do to favor a successful outcome when approaching an acquisition (13:32)How Michael thinks success should be measured when evaluating the outcome of an acquisition (17:56)Why looking at the open-source community of companies being acquired is so crucial and often overlooked (22:13)How the due diligence process is different for an open-source startup versus a SaaS company (25:20)Michael describes how each core function in a company is affected by an acquisition (28:12)The advice Michael would give to founders to help them make peace with the outcome of an acquisition (33:42)How you can connect with Michael to learn more (37:02)Links:MichaelLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/priorart/Twitter: https://twitter.com/SYOTFSCompany: https://www.aalyria.com/

Lars Kamp is the Co-Founder and CEO of Some Engineering, the makers of Resoto. In this episode, Lars describes what he’s learned from founding and working at multiple start-ups, as well as the main differentiators he’s experienced founding his first open-source startup. Lars describes his though process when it comes to selecting co-founders, and illustrates why it’s even more important to be discerning when selecting investors. Lars and I also discuss the advantages that open-source gives to founders who are focused on the distribution strategy for their product, and Lars reveals why he is a big proponent of having docs be a part of your product-led growth strategy. Throughout our conversation, Lars’ insights create a detailed picture of what second-time founders think about and how SaaS startup experience relates to open-source business strategy. Highlights:I introduce Lars, who is the CEO and Founder of Some Engineering (00:23)Lars describes what he does at Resoto and the user groups they work with (00:47)How a tweet by Jeff Barr inspired Lars and his co-founders to start working on Resoto (01:37)What it was like for Lars to start a company with co-founders he didn’t know very well (05:03)Why Lars went from working with closed-source SaaS companies to founding an open-source company (07:26)The main differences Lars has found between founding a SaaS startup and an open-source company (09:24)Lars describes the value he sees in investing in really good docs (10:44)Why Lars focuses more on distribution than product as a second-time founder (13:19)What third time founders think about and what they don’t (16:18)Lars’ advice to founders (18:40)Why Lars sees a big advantage in open-source business models, especially when it comes to distribution (20:09)The advice Lars would give himself if he could go back in time to the early days of Resoto(28:31)How to get in touch with Lars (32:23)Links:LarsLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/larskamp/Twitter: https://twitter.com/l1rsCompany: https://some.engineering/

Amanda “Robby” Robson is a Partner at Cowboy Ventures and the co-host of the Open Source Startup Podcast. In this episode, Robby shares insights on what she’s looking for in open-source founders to potentially invest in, including the importance of being able to manage both your community and your paid model simultaneously. Robby and I also discuss the importance and pitfalls of choosing a monetization strategy, as well as the dangers of having too many monetization models too soon. Throughout our conversation, Robby highlights the specific challenges that open-source founders face, and how she’s seen successful founders either avoid or overcome them. Highlights:I introduce Robby, who is a Partner at Cowboy Ventures and the co-host of the Open Source Startup Podcast (00:22)Robby gives some insight into how she evaluates startups from an investment perspective, and the peculiarities that go into evaluating an open-source startup (00:45)The nuances of evaluating the market opportunity for an open-source company (05:20)A common mistake Robby seeks early stage founders make when evaluating their market size (08:06)Robby shares what she’s learned about best practices for seed-stage startups who are looking to determine their monetization strategy (10:02)The dangers of having too many monetization models as an early stage startup (13:22)Traits that Robby feels are most valuable for an open-source founder to possess (14:48)Robby reveals the common traps that open-source founders fall into (17:13)Why Robby feels that successfully monetizing an open-source company has more to do with resources than timing (19:46)Robby’s thoughts on whether she would ever found an open-source company and how she would approach it (21:18)How Robby’s thoughts have changed on whether open source projects need to intentionally become a company or vice versa (23:44)What it’s like to advice against the open-source business model as a venture capitalist (29:10)Links:RobbyLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/amanda-robson-7227685b/Twitter: https://twitter.com/amanda_robsCompany: https://www.cowboy.vc/

Daniel Izquierdo, Co-Founder and CEO at Bitergia, shares his fascinating journey from academia to the open-source realm. He discusses the unique challenges and metrics involved in measuring open-source communities, emphasizing the importance of data contextualization. Daniel highlights Bitergia's cooperative model, focusing on sustainable growth for employees and customers. He outlines strategies for community engagement through data, the balance of open-source principles with business, and how they navigated different business models before finding their niche.

Leszek Manicki, Engineering Manager at Wikimedia Germany, shares his experiences with getting more contributors to open-source projects while maintaining high security standards. He discusses the challenges and lessons learned from Wikimedia's efforts, and gives recommendations for other organizations. Leszek also highlights the importance of simple architecture and the benefits of outside contributors. He shares his hopes for positive socio-economic change through representing a non-profit organization at a commercialized event.

Brian Proffitt, Senior Manager of Community Outreach at Red Hat’s OSPO, discusses the value of events for lead generation, testing positioning and messaging, and community-building efforts. He shares insights on measuring ROI, optimizing lead gen events, and maximizing the impact of community events. Proffitt emphasizes the importance of gathering live feedback, refining communication based on customer reactions at in-person interactions, and collaborating between events teams and marketing departments.

Kim McMahon is the leader of Open Source Marketing & Community at Outshift by Cisco, which is Cisco’s emerging technologies and innovation unit. We recorded this episode at Open Source Summit EU, and talked about Kim’s strategies and tactics related to helping guide users to the correct edition of your product — ie, decide whether the open source option or a commercial option is best for them.Kim talked about the tricky balance open-source companies must strike between embracing open-source principles and driving revenue as a business, Kim’s tactics for community building and why it’s so important to be clear on why you want to build a community and the outcomes you expect from your investment in community building. Highlights:I introduce Kim, who is the leader of Open Source Marketing & Community at Outshift by Cisco, as she joins me at the Open Source Summit EU in Bilbao (00:25)Kim gives an overview of the talk she is giving at the Open Source Summit, which is on the topic of self-identifying when to shift to a managed version of open-source products (01:35)Kim and I discuss the different personas of open-source software users, and the role that product-led growth plays for open-source companies (03:07)Why Kim feels it’s critical to not treat your community as a sales database but rather to provide educational content to drive sales of open-source products (09:10)Kim and I discuss the challenges of marketing an open-source project and whether positioning truly falls under marketing (10:49)How Kim created a feedback loop on her team between sales, marketing, and product to ensure alignment when bringing open-source products to market (13:31)Kim walks through her thought process for community building from scratch (17:23)How Kim evaluates if a community-building strategy is working or not (24:34)What Kim learned about being a part of a community by being a member of a food co-op (28:09)Where to connect with Kim and learn more about her work (34:44)Links:KimLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kimmcmahonco/Twitter: https://twitter.com/kamcmahonCompany: https://eti.cisco.com/

Alexander Krüger is the Co-Founder and CEO of United Manufacturing Hub, an open-source company that develops software for the manufacturing industry. Throughout our conversation, Alexander describes the unusual path he took in going from a services-based consulting company to a product-led company. He also describes the opportunities and challenges of selling open-source software to an industry that has historically been slow to adopt new technology, as well as his choice to hone a go-to-market strategy before exploring fundraising. Highlights:I introduce Alexander, and he gives some background on his company United Manufacturing Hub (00:22)How Alexander decided to develop open-source software for manufacturers (01:39)Alexander describes the early days of launching United Manufacturing Hub and how he got his first customers (04:06)How long it took to go from a consulting firm to a product-based company (06:57)Why it’s important to Alexander that United Manufacturing Hub is an open-source company (08:20)Alexander describes the go-to-market strategy at United Manufacturing Hub and how it impacts their fundraising efforts  as well as their monetization model (11:06) Alexander describes an interesting mistake he made and what he learned from it (19:10)How different it is to sell open-source software in the manufacturing space versus other industries (21:31) The biggest challenges facing United Manufacturing Hub today (22:35)Alexander describes the pros and cons of going from a services company to a product company (25:44)Where people can go to learn more about United Manufacturing Hub and connect with Alexander (29:38)Links:AlexanderLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alexander-krueger/Twitter:Company: https://www.umh.app/

Steven Renwick, CEO of Tilores, shares insights on their decision to forgo open sourcing their entity resolution system. Renwick explains how initial assumptions about open source shifted after evaluating business needs and investor feedback. He discusses the complexities of maintaining proprietary control while addressing customer transparency and security concerns. With valuable lessons on naming startups and navigating market positioning, this conversation highlights the nuanced choices faced by tech companies in today's landscape.