

Public Defenseless
Hunter Parnell
Anyone paying attention can tell you that our criminal legal system is perpetuating cruelty and harm, but the complexity of the legal world overwhelms most people simply trying to get through another day.
Public Defenseless explores the rot in the justice system and what we can do about it. Join host, Hunter Parnell, as he interviews top defense attorneys and criminal justice stakeholders from across the country as they pull apart the convoluted web of our criminal justice system.
Like so many of you, Hunter is not an attorney, simply tired of a news cycle and talking heads that offer no real solutions to the ever-growing list of problems we face. Hunter hopes that with this information, you will share his belief that ordinary people still can make a difference.
Public Defenseless explores the rot in the justice system and what we can do about it. Join host, Hunter Parnell, as he interviews top defense attorneys and criminal justice stakeholders from across the country as they pull apart the convoluted web of our criminal justice system.
Like so many of you, Hunter is not an attorney, simply tired of a news cycle and talking heads that offer no real solutions to the ever-growing list of problems we face. Hunter hopes that with this information, you will share his belief that ordinary people still can make a difference.
Episodes
Mentioned books

Jan 18, 2024 • 1h 8min
200: The Problems with Public Defense in Alabama, Arizona, Arkansas, Alaska, and California w/Radley Balko
Today, Hunter is joined by longtime criminal justice investigative journalist Radley Balko to discuss his newest reporting on Public Defender systems around the country. Over his storied career covering everything from police misconduct to legislation like AEDPA, Radley noticed that at the heart of so many cases was poor access to competent counsel. This spurred him in the fall of 2023 to start an investigative series into the inner workings of each state's public defender system. Today, Hunter and Radley discuss the first instalment that covered Alabama, Arkansas, Arizona, Alaska, and California. Guests: Radley Balko, Investigative Journalist Resources: The Watch (Radley's Podcast) https://radleybalko.substack.com/ States of Indigent Defense Part 1 https://radleybalko.substack.com/p/the-states-of-indigent-defense-part Perpetual Crisis in Indigent Defense https://radleybalko.substack.com/p/the-perpetual-crisis-in-indigent Lee Enterprise Arizona https://tulsaworld.com/news/national/on-the-brink-of-crisis-arizona-s-public-defense-system-hit-hard-with-staffing-shortages/article_36323850-9373-11ed-ae95-77f4bfa2e383.html Larry Price https://www.star-telegram.com/news/nation-world/national/article271245217.html#tbl-em-lnvtce7s7qjuyz92fnl Contact Hunter Parnell: Publicdefenseless@gmail.com Instagram @PublicDefenselessPodcast Twitter @PDefenselessPod www.publicdefenseless.com Subscribe to the Patron www.patreon.com/PublicDefenselessPodcast Donate on PayPal https://www.paypal.com/donate/?hosted_button_id=5KW7WMJWEXTAJ Donate on Stripe https://donate.stripe.com/7sI01tb2v3dwaM8cMN

Jan 16, 2024 • 59min
199: The Incredible Success of Missouri's Holistic Public Defense Program w/Annie Legomsky
Today, Hunter spoke with Annie Legomsky, the Holistic Defense Service leader for the Missouri State Public Defender. On this episode, Hunter and Annie discuss the incredible success stories from the implementation of a state wide holistic defense practice. For many, holistic defense seems like a great idea, but they feel they cannot muster the resources to make it happen. This story is an excellent example of the ways an office can creatively find the money to make holistic defense possible Guest: Annie Legomsky, Holistic Defense Services, Missouri State Public Defender Resources: Missouri State Public Defender https://publicdefender.mo.gov/ Partners for Justice https://www.partnersforjustice.org/?gclid=CjwKCAiA75itBhA6EiwAkho9e9CdBk_x6uThQWGw64O6cntNo-BtRCS0NVAh1QsPGqEQ1hDeqTAopRoCltkQAvD_BwE Contact Hunter Parnell: Publicdefenseless@gmail.com Instagram @PublicDefenselessPodcast Twitter @PDefenselessPod www.publicdefenseless.com Subscribe to the Patron www.patreon.com/PublicDefenselessPodcast Donate on PayPal https://www.paypal.com/donate/?hosted_button_id=5KW7WMJWEXTAJ Donate on Stripe https://donate.stripe.com/7sI01tb2v3dwaM8cMN

Jan 11, 2024 • 1h 6min
198: Ending Mississippi's Criminal Law "Dead Zone" and the Challenge of Securing Public Defender "Wins" w/Andre de Gruy
Today, Hunter is once again joined by Mississippi State Public Defender Andre de Gruy to discuss the criminal legal system in Mississippi. Specifically, Hunter and Andre dig into how the state ended the "dead zone" in the legal system that left incarcerated people without counsel for more than a year. They discuss the on going problems in making the changes meaningful improvements in the overall legal system, and after that, they touch on the state's attempt to take over the judicial system in Jackson Mississippi. Guests: Andre de Gruy, State Public Defender, Mississippi Resources: State Take Over of Jackson's Judiciary https://www.cnn.com/2023/04/21/us/jackson-mississippi-judicial-system/index.html https://www.naacpldf.org/press-release/plaintiffs-celebrate-victory-in-challenge-to-mississippi-h-b-1020/ https://www.wjtv.com/news/politics/mississippi-politics/hearing-held-on-naacps-lawsuit-against-house-bill-1020/ https://www.mississippifreepress.org/38790/state-run-jackson-court-can-move-forward-after-judge-again-denies-naacp-request Mississippi Dead Zone https://6ac.org/mississippis-dead-zone-highlights-the-urgent-need-for-state-level-reforms/ https://www.propublica.org/article/mississippi-courts-unprepared-to-ensure-poor-defendants-have-lawyers https://www.propublica.org/article/mississippi-supreme-court-poor-criminal-defendants-lawyer#:~:text=That%20means%20Mississippi's%20%E2%80%9Cdead%20zone,indictment%20%E2%80%94%20persists%20in%20many%20counties. https://www.pushblack.us/news/states-public-defender-system-leaves-many-dead-zone Mississippi Public Defense System https://www.propublica.org/article/mississippi-courts-wont-say-how-they-provide-lawyers-for-poor-clients Contact Hunter Parnell: Publicdefenseless@gmail.com Instagram @PublicDefenselessPodcast Twitter @PDefenselessPod www.publicdefenseless.com Subscribe to the Patron www.patreon.com/PublicDefenselessPodcast Donate on PayPal https://www.paypal.com/donate/?hosted_button_id=5KW7WMJWEXTAJ Donate on Stripe https://donate.stripe.com/7sI01tb2v3dwaM8cMN

Jan 9, 2024 • 1h 35min
197: Chipping Away at Virginia's Cruel Legal System, One Policy at a Time w/Rob Poggenklass, Andy Elders, and Ashley Shapiro
The conditions with which Public Defenders must fight under are set in the state house. That's why Hunter is so excited to speak with one of the best criminal law policy groups in the country, Justice Forward Virginia. Rob Poggenklass, Ashely Shapiro, and Andy Elders join the show to discuss some of the slate of policy reforms they are hoping to tackle this legislative cycle. From prospective Fourth Amendment waivers to child felony expungement cases, Justice Forward Virginia has an impressive and comprehensive agenda to reshape Virginia's rotten criminal legal system. Guests: Rob Poggenklass, Executive Director, Justice Forward Virginia Andy Elders, Chairman of the Board, Justice Forward Virginia Ashley Shapiro, Vice Chair of the Board, Justice Forward Virginia Resources: Lend your voice to Justice Virginia's Policy advocacy https://justiceforwardva.com/blog/2023/11/27/2024-justice-reform-lobby-day-registration Follow Justice Forward on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/JusticeForwardVa Twitter https://twitter.com/justicefwdva Instagram https://www.instagram.com/justicefwdva/ 2024 Agenda Items https://justiceforwardva.com/2024-priorities Issues https://justiceforwardva.com/issues Contact Justice Forward VA https://justiceforwardva.com/contact Contact Hunter Parnell: Publicdefenseless@gmail.com Instagram @PublicDefenselessPodcast Twitter @PDefenselessPod www.publicdefenseless.com Subscribe to the Patron www.patreon.com/PublicDefenselessPodcast Donate on PayPal https://www.paypal.com/donate/?hosted_button_id=5KW7WMJWEXTAJ Donate on Stripe https://donate.stripe.com/7sI01tb2v3dwaM8cMN

Jan 4, 2024 • 1h 17min
196: The Coalition Trying to Abolish the Death Penalty in Nevada w/Nancy Hart and Chris Peterson
After our sobering conversation about the Parkland Shooting case on Tuesday, Hunter continues looking into the death penalty in today's episode. Joining him to discuss the abolition of the death penalty in Nevada is Nancy Hart and Chris Peterson. Nancy is the President of the Nevada Coalition Against the Death Penalty and Chris is the Legal Director at the ACLU of Nevada. Together, they bring decades of experience in the criminal legal and death penalty abolition space, and both expertly lay out the policy, ethical, and practical reasons why the death penalty needs to end in Nevada. Guests: Nancy Hart, President, Nevada Coalition Against the Death Penalty Chris Peterson, Legal Director, ACLU of Nevada Resources: Nevada Coalition Against the Death Penalty https://nvcadp.org/ https://www.facebook.com/nvcadp https://twitter.com/nvcadp https://www.instagram.com/nvcadp/ ACLU of Nevada https://www.aclunv.org/ Contact Hunter Parnell: Publicdefenseless@gmail.com Instagram @PublicDefenselessPodcast Twitter @PDefenselessPod www.publicdefenseless.com Subscribe to the Patron www.patreon.com/PublicDefenselessPodcast Donate on PayPal https://www.paypal.com/donate/?hosted_button_id=5KW7WMJWEXTAJ Donate on Stripe https://donate.stripe.com/7sI01tb2v3dwaM8cMN

Jan 2, 2024 • 2h 8min
195: Securing Life over Death in the Parkland School Shooting Case w/Casey Secor and Kate O'Shea
Today, Hunter is honored to speak with two people from the defense team of Nikolas Cruz, Casey Secor and Kate O'Shea, to discuss their role in securing a life sentence over the death penalty. Today's episode touches on an incredibly sensitive, complex topic about one of the most horrific crimes committed in recent memory. Throughout this episode, Kate and Casey draw on their years of expertise in fighting against the death penalty to explain how this incredible tragedy occurred. As is always the case in death penalty cases, Hunter, Kate, and Casey reveal the incredible advantages the prosecution is afforded, but despite these advantages, three jurors voted for life over death. In response, Florida has done everything in their power to make it easier for the state to execute people. Hopefully by the end of this incredible conversation, you will understand why Florida's response is one we should emphatically reject. Guests: Casey Secor, CEO and Senior Staff Attorney, Suzerain Capital Defense Kate O'Shea, Mitigation Specialist, Suzerain Capital Defense Resources: Suzerain Capital Defense https://www.szrn.org/ Parkland Judge Reprimanded https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation/florida-supreme-court-reprimands-judge-for-conduct-during-parkland-shooting-trial Florida's Multifaceted Expansion of the Death Penalty Raises Constitutional Concerns https://www.americanbar.org/groups/committees/death_penalty_representation/publications/project_blog/florida-expands-the-death-penalty/ Floridians for Alternatives to the Death Penalty https://www.fadp.org/fl-innocence-list/#:~:text=Florida%20leads%20the%20nation%20with,for%20every%20three%20people%20executed.&text=Three%2Dfourths%20(22%20of%2030,survivors%20are%20people%20of%20color. Contact Hunter Parnell: Publicdefenseless@gmail.com Instagram @PublicDefenselessPodcast Twitter @PDefenselessPod www.publicdefenseless.com Subscribe to the Patron www.patreon.com/PublicDefenselessPodcast Donate on PayPal https://www.paypal.com/donate/?hosted_button_id=5KW7WMJWEXTAJ Donate on Stripe https://donate.stripe.com/7sI01tb2v3dwaM8cMN

Dec 22, 2023 • 9min
Thank You for the Past Year and the Year to Come
Contact Hunter Parnell: Publicdefenseless@gmail.com Instagram @PublicDefenselessPodcast Twitter @PDefenselessPod www.publicdefenseless.com Subscribe to the Patron www.patreon.com/PublicDefenselessPodcast Donate on PayPal https://www.paypal.com/donate/?hosted_button_id=5KW7WMJWEXTAJ Donate on Stripe https://donate.stripe.com/7sI01tb2v3dwaM8cMN

Dec 21, 2023 • 1h 11min
194: Aurora City Council's Continued Effort to Disband the Public Defender Office w/Elizabeth Cadiz
For the last episode of the year, we are returning to the Aurora Municipal Office to unpack the ongoing effort by the Aurora City Council to disband the Public Defender Office. This time, Hunter is joined by the new Chief Public Defender, Elizabeth Cadiz. Over a long career in the office, Elizabeth has seen the incredible corruption and Constitutional violations. Over the last year, she helped to orchestrate an amazing challenge to the city attorney's office pattern and practice of discovery violations. Following this victory and her taking over the office, City Council is one again determined to remove the office in favor of a "cheaper" alternative. While the City Council continues to say this is about costs, but a look back at the history of this office indicates that City Council is simply tired of having a zealous advocate stand in the way of their tough on crime agenda. Guests: Elizabeth Cadiz, Chief Public Defender, Aurora, Colorado Municipal Public Defense Resources: Aurora lawmakers agree to analyze privatizing public defender's office https://sentinelcolorado.com/metro/aurora-lawmakers-solicit-bids-to-privatize-public-defenders-office/ Local News Coverage https://www.cbsnews.com/colorado/news/aurora-considering-getting-rid-public-defenders/ https://www.cbsnews.com/colorado/video/aurora-considering-getting-rid-of-public-defenders/ Offense for the defense: Aurora public defenders take the stand https://sentinelcolorado.com/metro/offense-for-the-defense-aurora-public-defenders-take-the-stand/ ACLU Letter to City Council https://www.aclu-co.org/en/news/letter-aurora-city-council-regarding-resolution-concerning-aurora-public-defenders-office Defender's Union of Colorado Op-Ed https://sentinelcolorado.com/opinion/columnists/guest-column-aurora-council-gop-has-ulterior-motive-in-targeting-public-defenders/ Prosecutors ordered to review cases after Aurora office failed to provide defendants with knowledge of discredited cops Aurora city attorneys review, notify impacted defendants of lacking 'Brady letters' Aurora lawmakers give 1st OK to mandatory jail time for shoplifting, despite lack of cost data Aurora lawmakers impose mandatory 3 days in jail for shoplifting more than $300 Aurora council defends cuts to diversity office, public defender, police monitor in first round of budget voting Impacts of Mandatory Minimum Sentencing: https://law.asu.edu/sites/default/files/pdf/academy_for_justice/7_Criminal_Justice_Reform_Vol_4_Mandatory-Minimums.pdf https://www.sentencingproject.org/reports/long-term-sentences-time-to-reconsider-the-scale-of-punishment/ https://www.brennancenter.org/our-work/analysis-opinion/end-mandatory-minimums NLADA Report on Aurora Office ACLU Report on Municipal Courts Colorado Contact Hunter Parnell: Publicdefenseless@gmail.com Instagram @PublicDefenselessPodcast Twitter @PDefenselessPod www.publicdefenseless.com Subscribe to the Patron www.patreon.com/PublicDefenselessPodcast Donate on PayPal https://www.paypal.com/donate/?hosted_button_id=5KW7WMJWEXTAJ Donate on Stripe https://donate.stripe.com/7sI01tb2v3dwaM8cMN

Dec 21, 2023 • 26min
BONUS: Public Comment on the Privatization of the Aurora Public Defender
As a follow up to my conversation with Elizabeth Cadiz, Chief Public Defender of the Aurora Colorado Municipal Public Defender, here are some of the public comments made before City Council on 4 December 2023. Be sure to listen to my conversation with Elizabeth for the full context of these speakers! If you would like to watch the speakers on youtube, the city council meeting can be found at this link with the relevant parts starting at 27 minutes. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fmeK_lsixF4

Dec 19, 2023 • 1h 9min
193: What Went Right, What Went Wrong, and What is Next for Idaho Public Defense w/Kimberly Simmons and Paul Riggins
Today, Hunter sat down with Kimberly Simmons, the former Executive Director of the Idaho Public Defense Commission, and Paul Riggins, a private criminal defense attorney in Idaho, to discuss the past decade+ of public defense in Idaho. Like so many county based systems covered on the show, Idaho was once a patch work model where the quality of representation a person could expect depended almost entirely on where that person was arrested. Seeing the flaws in this model, Idaho took major steps to start to create more uniform standards and control of the system, but it failed to produce the results everyone wants. Tune in to hear how and why Idaho now stands on the verge of its second major public defense overhaul in just the past decade. Guests: Kimberly Simmons, Former Executive Director, Idaho Public Defense Commission Paul Riggins, Criminal Defense Attorney, Idaho Resources: Tucker v Idaho https://www.acluidaho.org/en/cases/tucker-v-state-idaho 2010 NLADA Report https://leg.mt.gov/content/Committees/Interim/2015-2016/Public-Defender/Committee-Topics/id_guaranteeofcounseljseri01-2010_report.pdf Bonnie Groller Law Review Article https://www.uidaho.edu/-/media/UIdaho-Responsive/Files/law/law-review/articles/volume-52/52-2-groller-bonnie-c.pdf?hash=41687452DF19CF85049D75A8B8EFA3B9F4AC0242&la=en Idaho Workload Study https://pdc.idaho.gov/wp-content/uploads/sites/11/2018/03/PDC-WORKLOAD-STUDY-online-version.pdf Idaho Public Defender Overhaul https://blog.idahoreports.idahoptv.org/2023/03/23/legislature-approves-public-defense-overhaul/ Contact Hunter Parnell: Publicdefenseless@gmail.com Instagram @PublicDefenselessPodcast Twitter @PDefenselessPod www.publicdefenseless.com Subscribe to the Patron www.patreon.com/PublicDefenselessPodcast Donate on PayPal https://www.paypal.com/donate/?hosted_button_id=5KW7WMJWEXTAJ Donate on Stripe https://donate.stripe.com/7sI01tb2v3dwaM8cMN


