

Principal Matters: The School Leader's Podcast with William D. Parker
Principal Matters: The School Leader's Podcast with William D. Parker
With William D. Parker and Friends
Episodes
Mentioned books

Aug 11, 2025 • 15min
MONDAY MATTERS with Jen Schwanke and Will Parker – Trustworthy vs. Trust-willing
Hello, Principal Matters Listeners! Welcome back to another conversation about Jen’s new book, Trusted: Trust Pillars, Trust Killers, and the Secret to Successful Schools, available August 17th. Pre-order your copy now! Today, Jen Schwanke and Will Parker will be talking about what sets this book apart from a lecture on how to be trustworthy. Their conversation goes over the difference between being trustworthy versus being trust-willing. Being trust-willing as a school leader means trusting the professionals you work with; truly believing in the team that you work with. Listen to the episode to learn more about how being trust-willing will make you a better principal!
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Aug 6, 2025 • 51min
PMP460: Digital for Good with Richard Culatta
A quick note to listeners:
Before this week’s interview, Jen Schwanke and Will Parker take a few minutes to discuss the following listener question:
What other practical ways (like your student handbook) can you rethink for sending positive messaging to your students and school community?
Listen in to hear their response!
Meet Richard Culatta:
As the CEO of ISTE+ASCD, Richard Culatta is focused on creating the next generation of innovative learning leaders. Richard has served as the Chief Innovation Officer of the state of Rhode Island and was appointed by President Barack Obama to lead the US Department of Education’s Office of Educational Technology. His book, Digital for Good: Raising Kids to Thrive in an Online World (Harvard Business Publishing) aims to help create conditions for healthy tech use at home and school.
Join Jen Schwanke as she sits down with Richard Culatta, the visionary CEO of the newly merged ISTE and ASCD. This insightful conversation delves into the powerful synergy created by bringing together these two leading education organizations, exploring how their combined strengths are poised to better support administrators, technology experts, and educational innovators. Richard shares the compelling rationale and exciting opportunities arising from the merger, emphasizing the unified focus on enhancing the learner experience. Tune in as they discuss collaborative initiatives addressing critical contemporary issues, from navigating disruptive social media through their partnership with META to providing educators with robust resources for evaluating educational technology. Finally, Richard offers valuable insights from his book, Digital for Good, advocating for a nuanced approach to student technology use centered on screen value.
A Unified Force for Education:
Richard Culatta discusses the strategic merger of ISTE and ASCD, highlighting how this unification of curriculum and technology leadership will create a more comprehensive support system for educators, ultimately prioritizing the learner experience. He also provides insights into the initial plans for their annual conferences, which will be held concurrently but remain distinct events.
Addressing Social Media Challenges:
Richard discusses the impactful collaboration between ISTE, ASCD, and META, which resulted in the launch of “school mode” on Instagram. This innovative feature equips verified school administrators with crucial tools for the expedited review and removal of disruptive content and facilitates direct communication with the platform.
Navigating the EdTech Landscape:
Similarly, ISTE and ASCD have a forward-thinking approach to the ever-evolving world of educational technology. Under Culatta’s leadership, they focus on fundamental principles of effectiveness – curiosity, engagement, safety, accessibility, and research-based practices – helps educators discern valuable tools from fleeting trends. Additionally, they are raising standards for edtech vendors at their events and have launched edtechindex.org as a resource for reviewed educational applications.
Empowering Educators and Leaders:
Culatta offers insights into key initiatives such as Generation AI, a program aiming to train 200,000 teachers in the effective integration of artificial intelligence for learning. The conversation also highlights the new instructional leader certification and the upcoming “Instructional Leader of the Year” award, designed to recognize and support district-level learning leaders.
Rethinking Screen Time:
Richard Culatta shares the core message of his book, Digital for Good, advocating for a shift in focus from mere “screen time” to “screen value.” He emphasizes the importance of modeling healthy digital behavior and encouraging parents and educators to consider what children are doing online rather than solely the duration. Using the analogy of food, he illustrates how different online activities hold varying levels of value.
Now It’s Your Turn:
What are ways your school would benefit from the ideas offered in Digital for Good?
The post PMP460: Digital for Good with Richard Culatta appeared first on Principal Matters.

Aug 4, 2025 • 19min
MONDAY MATTERS with Jen Schwanke and Will Parker – Trusted: A New Book by Jen Schwanke
Hi, friends. Jen Schwanke is excited to announce that her new book, Trusted: Trust Pillars, Trust Killers, and the Secret to Successful Schools, will be released on the 17th of this month! Over the next several weeks, Jen and I will be using the Monday Matters episodes to dive into each of the chapters of her book. This week, we are talking about chapter one: Trust in schools, why it’s broken, and how to get it back. If you would like to read along as we discuss each chapter, you can pre-order the book now via the ASCD website. On that note, we would love to hear your thoughts as we work through her book! Feel free to share your thoughts with us by commenting on this post or by emailing us at will@williamdparker.com or jenschwanke@gmail.com. We hope you enjoy listening to us as we dive into each chapter of Trusted, and, as always, thank you for doing what matters!
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Jul 30, 2025 • 42min
PMP459: Unlocking Academic Achievement with David Young
A quick note to listeners:
Before this week’s interview, Jen Schwanke and Will Parker take a few minutes to discuss the following listener question:
As I step into a new role at a new school, how can I make a difference in a school that is struggling with disengaged teachers without being seen as a ‘monster’ by the teachers I want to help?
Listen in to hear their response!
Also, Jen Schwanke now has her own newsletter! You can sign up for it here.
Meet David Young:
David Young is the CEO of the Central Kentucky Educational Cooperative in Lexington, KY. He resides in Danville, Kentucky, with wife Holly and their triplets – Mason, Connor, and Emma. David is a long-time school and district leader, having served as a principal and assistant superintendent before beginning work in his current role. Interestingly, David shares that when he began his career, he had no intentions of ever becoming a school or district leader.
Under the guidance of David and his team, schools and districts across central Kentucky have experienced great improvements in both standards mastery and student achievement while working to implement the Measurable Results system. He is also the author of the book, Unlocking Academic Achievement: A Principal’s Guide To Improved Measurable Results.
Extrapolating the Best From Your Superstars:
David Young’s book is a handbook for school leaders from someone who has done the work. A significant portion of Unlocking Academic Achievement discusses how school leaders can scale excellence in their own schools through identifying, studying, and extrapolating the best from super-star teachers. In order for a school to improve, there needs to be a foundation built for that improvement. David suggests that school leaders visit their best teachers’ classrooms to establish a list of best practices that can then be implemented across an entire school. Doing so will help teachers better understand what is expected from them and how to ask for help when they need it.
Utilizing the Expertise Within:
Another argument David Young makes in Unlocking Academic Achievement is that it is crucial for school leaders to utilize the “expertise within” their schools in order to reach their targeted destinations with student achievement. It is important for leaders to believe that their school already has what it takes to achieve what they want to achieve. David points out that in any given school, there are individuals who either have expertise or who can develop expertise. Certainly, bringing in outside expertise can help teachers develop their own expertise, but teachers can also learn from others within their school when trying to gain expertise. By tapping into the expertise at a school internally, school leaders are creating a return on their investment.
Congruence with Standards-based Teaching:
Throughout Unlocking Academic Achievement, David argues that the science of teaching is as important as the art of teaching, and that congruence with standards based teaching is in integral part of the science of teaching. David states that when teachers plan lessons, they need to pay attention to the key components of state standards. Specifically, teachers need to pay close attention to the verbs in state standards. If they don’t, students will fall behind in their learning. Teachers need to stay congruent with standards so that they can make sure students are learning what they are supposed to be learning. Likewise, school leaders need to focus on congruence when problem solving when students aren’t learning what they are supposed to be learning.
Staying Connected:
Listen in to hear the entire conversation! To wrap up the episode, David Young extends his thanks to teachers and principals who are currently working in education.
You can stay connected with David Young via the following:
EdVantange Podcast
His website: davidyoungeducation.com
X: @davidyo333 or @edvantageed
The post PMP459: Unlocking Academic Achievement with David Young appeared first on Principal Matters.

Jul 28, 2025 • 16min
MONDAY MATTERS with Jen Schwanke and Will Parker – Lessons From Climbing Mt. Massive
Lessons from Climbing Mt. Massive
On June 26, 2025, my son Jack and I summited Mt Massive, at 14,429 feet, the 2nd tallest peak in Colorado. That one sentence sums up an impossibly difficult-to-describe one-day adventure that he and I have dreamed about for a long time.
The day began at 4:30 AM, when we made coffee, ate a quick breakfast, and drove to the base of the mountain, parking in a gravel lot near what I believe was the Arkansas River.
From there, we put on our backpacks, adjusted our hiking poles, and set off up the trail. It was 5:30 AM by this time. We traversed through pine forests, many of the trees damaged or killed by pine beetles years before. The trail moved gradually up, and for the next four miles, we kept going, crossing two creeks — one using a fallen tree, and the other stepping across on rocks like steps over the rushing water.
As we moved higher and away from the damaged forest area, we began to encounter more ground cover, wildflowers, and healthy pines. As we came out of the forest cover, we could see Mt. Massive looming ahead. To reach it, however, would require three more miles of switchback trails through areas of small brush, grass, and more flowers.
To say it was a breathtaking view is an understatement. As we paused on the trail, we could look behind us at the pine forests below, and surrounding us were miles of mountain ridges, gray from the distance but covered in rivulets of snow marking the beginning of Spring in the mountains.
From a distance, I’ve wondered what those green spaces were like between the forest and barren mountain tops. As we walked along this in-between space, I was overwhelmed by the immensity of the space, the variety of shrubs and grasses, the rocky soil, and the occasional marmot with a wagging tail, running between shrubs and rocks.
Jack, always full of knowledge, explained to me that the lichen on the rocks in this area, which is a combination of fungus and algae, decomposes over time, creating soil, from which the grasses and flowers grow. It takes hundreds of years for this process to happen, which is why it is important for hikers to stay on the trail and not damage these delicate ecosystems.
Here we encountered our first snow. Across the grassy and shrub-filled areas, small snowpacks were visible. Jack pointed out that the pink tinges in the snow are created by bacteria, so hikers should avoid eating snow.
Eventually, we followed the trail higher until we were surrounded mostly by rock, and with the increasing altitude, we were both struggling to breathe. Our steps slowed, and we had to pace ourselves by looking ahead to a clump of rocks as our destination for stopping.
At this point in the hike, we had only seen two other hikers on the ridges ahead. As we headed into this rocky place on the trail, we heard a voice behind us. A young man, dark-headed and walking without a hat or hiking poles, said hello. He was a college student, named Ming, from Colorado Springs, he explained, extending a handshake. He grew up in Boulder and loves climbing.
When we told him this was our first 14-er, he said we had chosen a challenging one, but encouraged us that the summit would be worth it. And with that, he was off up the trail, bounding like a mountain goat. Jack and I looked at each other and laughed. Then we continued our plodding steps, one at a time, wondering if we really could reach the top. Each time I spotted Ming ahead of us, I was encouraged that it was possible.
As we neared the base of the summit’s first peak, I was really struggling with the thought of traversing the ridges it would take to reach the very top. But as we stepped up the trail, suddenly we were at the ridge of the base. In front of us opened an expanse of mountain ranges — endless miles of snow-capped ridges. The sight was so stunning, I actually felt like electricity was running through my entire body. The rush of endorphins was enough to motivate me to keep going.
The climb from here was almost like crawling. There were a couple of places where the pass from ridge to ridge required passing through snow-covered boulders. As we reached the height of one ridge, we would work our way to the next. Eventually, we saw the highest point, and a hiker who was standing on top with his phone out, capturing the moment.
Jack and I reached the summit a few minutes later, and the hiker moved away so that we could have our own moment there. We sat for a while eating and drinking, and just soaking in the horizon of mountain ranges west, north, and south of us. To the east of us lay the forest floor from which we had come that morning, and beyond that lay the town of Leadville, Colorado, where Missy was waiting back at the home we rented.
As we were coming down the summit, we stopped to call her, and Jack called his girlfriend. It felt so amazing to have reached the top and hear their sweet voices celebrating with us.
The climb down was much longer than we expected. Somehow, in the adrenaline of the early morning, we had hiked seven miles up, and we anticipated the hike down would be twice as fast. It wasn’t. The pounding of our feet on dirt trails and rocky pathways was harder than we had expected. We tried to pause to take in the beauty of the landscape.
We began to pick up the pace once we hit the tree line again, but the thought of making it back to the car became all-consuming. We also ran out of water as we hit the last three or four miles. With our water bladders in our packs dry, we carried less weight, but we were also thirsty and had made the good choice of packing extra water in the car for our return.
We crossed back over the two streams, walked back from the healthy green forest into the blighted lower parts, and eventually walked down the long path to the river running by the gravel road and lot where we had parked. It may have been the most excited we have ever been to see a car.
Lessons learned
The drive home was quiet and reflective, but the next day, I asked Jack what lessons he learned from the trip. Here’s what he said:
Lesson 1: Be prepared for it to be harder and longer than expected.
Even though we had trained for months prior to the climb, hiking on the weekends back home, the altitude and trail conditions were still more difficult than any training we had done. Of course, this will be true for anyone reaching high achievement.
Lesson 2: Take more water.
We felt pretty good about our water supplies because of the previous training and never running out. Lesson learned, however, that carrying extra reserves would have paid big dividends at the end of the trail and saved us three to four miles of longing for a drink till we reached the car.
Lesson 3: Two is better than one. He said, “I couldn’t have done that hike by myself. It’s really helpful to have a partner.”
Lots of research backs up this important reminder: we almost always achieve more (psychologically and in practice) when we partner with someone else on achieving difficult goals.
Lesson 4: Mentally prepare for the downhill as the uphill – it’s harder in its own way, and the result of fatigue.
Jack and I had given lots of thought, conversation, and preparation for the mentality we would need to adopt when we hit uncomfortable altitudes. We didn’t anticipate, however, the mental toll of the climb down. Of course, when you are tired and the adrenaline subsides, you should expect the downhill can feel like a more difficult chore than you anticipated.
Lesson 5: Take more time downhill – faster doesn’t mean a better hike.
Having said lesson 4, lesson 5 was something we talked about later too. We passed by some breathtakingly beautiful fields, forests, and waterways without stopping to enjoy the view. Maybe it is unrealistic to expect to be fully present when you’re tired, but it was something we talked about later — wishing we had paused to be in the moment instead of being so fixated on the pace that we missed out.
Let’s Wrap This Up
At one point, I remember looking at the back of Jack’s head as he walked in front of me. His ears were red from the day in the sun. His brown pants were the color of the dusty trail at our feet. His image was enveloped by the blue sky above, with white clouds hovering, the surrounding green of shrubs and grass, the yellows, purples, and whites of flowers along the trail and stretching out to pine forests of green — and the entire horizon surrounding us with other gray peaks covered in rivulets of snow. I tried so hard to imprint this memory in my mind.
At 56 years old, I realize the opportunities for moments like this are limited. For Jack, at 19, the opportunities are still boundless.
For school leaders, the lessons above may sound familiar as you reflect on the school year. Every season brings a significant climb for you, your teachers, students, and community. The hard work is always worth it when you help others achieve their goals, but a few practical reminders can help you maintain perspective along the way.
As you step into a new season, may you be prepared for the reality that reaching goals may be harder than expected, being well-resourced is essential, collaborating with others is more effective than going it alone, the downhill can be just as challenging as the uphill, and it’s important to pause and enjoy the moments along the way. Most importantly, though, is to remember the “why” of the climb — building memories, growing deeper in relationships, and leaving a lasting legacy for someone else to carry forward — these are the best outcomes of our work and our lives.
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Jul 23, 2025 • 46min
PMP458: Permission to S.H.I.N.E. with LaVonna Roth
A Quick Note to Listeners:
Before this week’s interview, Jen Schwanke and Will Parker take a few minutes to discuss the following question:
What should I be thinking as I step into the school year, especially if I am starting a new role?
Listen in to hear their response!
Meet LaVonna Roth:
With almost 20 years of experience speaking on four continents, LaVonna Roth helps leaders across various industries ditch self-doubt, break barriers, and step boldly into their shine. Through her signature S.H.I.N.E.® Framework, she draws on emotional intelligence, brain sciences, and wellness to create impactful and transformative experiences.
To open the episode, Jen recalls first seeing LaVonna present years ago, finding herself impressed by LaVonna’s focus on the human side of leadership, rather than just technical skills. LaVonna shares her diverse professional background, including teaching and corporate experience, and how negative experiences motivated her to start her own business, emphasizing the importance of treating people well.
S.H.I.N.E. Framework:
LaVonna explains the “S.H.I.N.E.” framework, which stands for “Self, Heart, Inspire, Navigate, and Exceptional.” It’s designed to help individuals identify their strengths and passions, inspire others, navigate challenges, and ultimately become exceptional leaders. She stresses that leadership is not just a title, but about making an impact. She addresses the common “imposter syndrome,” noting that it can be overcome by focusing on strengths and personal values. The S.H.I.N.E. framework is meant to be integrated into existing practices, rather than being a separate program, making it something that school principals could adapt and adjust to their own learning needs.
Challenges and Pressures of Leadership:
The conversation delves into the pressures and challenges faced by school leaders, including dealing with higher leadership, policy changes, and maintaining morale. LaVonna advocates for using “appreciative inquiry,” a method of focusing on past successes to find solutions, rather than dwelling on problems. She emphasizes the importance of building a supportive team and recognizing the value each member brings. The discussion also touches on the pervasive nature of imposter syndrome, attributing it to societal pressures and comparative culture, and encourages individuals to define their own measures of success.
Aligning Work with Passions and Strengths:
LaVonna and Jen address the importance of aligning one’s work with their passions and strengths, and not feeling pressured to conform to external expectations. LaVonna shares personal stories of impactful moments, highlighting the importance of recognizing and celebrating individual contributions. She encourages listeners to focus on their unique strengths and passions, and to create a life that aligns with their personal values.
Staying Connected:
LaVonna can be found at igniteyourshine.com and on social media platforms like Instagram (@igniteyourshinenow) and LinkedIn (@LaVonna Roth). You can also connect with her via email: lavonna@igniteyourSHINE.com
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Jul 21, 2025 • 18min
MONDAY MATTERS with Jen Schwanke and Will Parker – Your Greatest Joy Is Not What You May Think
Welcome back to another installment of Monday Matters! This week, Dr. Jen Schwanke and I are discussing chapter 13 from my new book Whose Permission Are You Waiting For? An Educator’s Guide to Doing What You Love. The focus of chapter 13 is based on avoiding the mindset that our greatest joy has to be in the work we do. It can be really easy to let your work define your whole identity. As individuals who work hard jobs with long hours, school leaders are especially prone to this kind of thinking. Separating one’s identity from one’s job is hard when you spend eight, nine, or ten hours at work every day. The reality of our world is that we live in a time where hard work is celebrated and promotions are encouraged; chasing the next big work achievement is hardwired into most of us. So, it is important to remind ourselves that work does not have to be our entire identity. Sometimes, work will be disappointing. It may not be as fulfilling as we wanted it to be, or we end up hating the job that comes with the promotion we longed for. If you are reading this, take some time today to reflect on what brings you joy both at work and outside of work. Listen in to hear our full conversation on this topic!
On another note, Jen Schwanke has a new book coming out soon! Visit the ASCD website to learn more!
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Jul 16, 2025 • 40min
PMP457: Listening To Your Teachers with Karen Borchert
Meet Karen Borchert:
Karen Borchert is the founder and CEO of Alpaca, a company with a mission to make it easier to support teachers. Karen started off in secondary education, but most of her career is as an entrepreneur, helping to grow high trust, highly aligned teams.
Karen started Alpaca to combine her passion for education with her experience in building employee engagement, leadership and management teams. Alpaca believes that asking teachers more about what they need, providing those things in delightful ways, and creating a way to show gratitude to teachers could change the way teachers feel about work. Alpaca is on a mission to create the first employee culture platform built just for K-12 educators.
Karen holds a Bachelor’s degree in Secondary Education and Teaching from Wake Forest University and an MBA from Georgetown University’s McDonough School of Business.
Before founding Alpaca, Karen had experience in operations, product management, and entrepreneurship. She held leadership roles at organizations such as ROKA, Flywheel, and Election Systems & Software, and co-founded Keen Guides, a platform for multimedia tours. Her professional journey also includes contributions in consulting and the nonprofit sector.
Today, Alpaca supports thousands of teachers across the country. Their unique model of semantic pulse surveys, and turn-key teacher recognition programs offers a new way to support educators.
Founding of Alpaca:
Karen shares the story of what inspired her to found Alpaca with Principal Matters listeners. Her years of work in employee engagement led to her desire to start a school related company. Throughout the process of founding Alpaca, Karen spent a lot of time interviewing teachers about their experience working in schools. She shares that she realized how many teachers purchase school supplies out of pocket, and decided to find a way to get those supplies into teachers’ hands easily. Thus the idea for Alpaca Packs was born.
Cutting Through the Noise:
One area of focus for Alpaca is providing solutions to school leaders to build credibility with their teachers as being trustworthy and appreciative. Karen suggests that school leaders learn to cut through the noise that often accompanies their job by listening to teachers. Specifically, Karen tells school leaders that they should stop listening to solutions and start listening to teachers. Karen lays out five core values that Alpaca employs to help school leaders build credibility with their teachers:
Listen to teachers
Write thank you notes
Tell stories
Elevate every educator
Bring out the best
Listen in to the interview to hear Karen dive into these core values in more detail!
Recognizing and Celebrating Teachers:
Next, Karen Borchert shares practical ways that leaders can recognize and celebrate teachers, especially as they plan for a new school year. She encourages listeners to begin the school year by creating a cadence and a habit of listening to and supporting teachers. There are several ways that Karen shares leaders can create this cadence, through scheduling time to listen to feedback from teachers and then acting on it. Building school culture doesn’t happen because of one isolated event, but rather a habitual practice of building culture.
Practicing What She Preaches:
Karen spends a lot of time traveling to events across the country to help leaders rethink the ways they can encourage and retain teachers. Furthermore, she applies those same lessons with her team at Alpaca. Once a month, the employees at Alpaca fill out a survey describing how they are doing at work. Each week, Alpaca holds a team meeting, during which Karen listens to feedback and lets the team know what changes will happen each week. The Alpaca team also constantly has calls with their customers to hear how they are using their products and what changes they can make.
Staying Connected:
You can find out more about Alpaca and the work they do on their website: www.getalpaca.com
The post PMP457: Listening To Your Teachers with Karen Borchert appeared first on Principal Matters.

Jul 14, 2025 • 23min
MONDAY MATTERS BONUS with Ohio Academy Grads Mastermind
In this episode, I wanted to share some feedback from another Mastermind group I’ve met with in 2024-25. These leaders include:
Julieta R. Flowers – Principal, Discovery Community School, Toledo, OH
Kelly Brodzenski – Principal, Beacon Academy, Canton, OH
Laura Krulik – Assistant Superintendent & Title II/Civil Rights Coordinator, Utica Shale Academy (Southern Local Schools), Salineville, OH
Sherwin Ealy – Principal/Administrator, A+ Arts Academy – Maybury Campus, Columbus, OH
Dr. Kenneth Goodrum – Principal, PBIS Coordinator & Title IX Investigator, Dayton Business Technology High School, Dayton, OH
In this conversation, each leader shares feedback on the following:
What motivated you to become part of the Mastermind?
What are some common challenges you have shared with fellow Mastermind members?
In what ways have content discussions contributed to your leadership development?
What reasons would you give someone else to consider joining a Mastermind?
A big thank you to these leaders for their service to their schools and for their commitment to collaborate!
If you’d like to learn more about becoming a part of a Mastermind, reach out to Will at will@williamdparker.com
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Jul 7, 2025 • 15min
MONDAY MATTERS with Jen Schwanke and Will Parker – Life Liturgies
Happy Monday, Principal Matters listeners! This week, Jen Schwanke and I are talking about chapter 12 from my new book, Whose Permission Are You Waiting For? An Educator’s Guide to Doing What You Love. The premise of this chapter is on something I like to call “life liturgies”: practices, routines, and rituals that define a person and their beliefs. Defining one’s life liturgy can be hard, so Jen and I discuss practices that listeners can employ to help the definition process. Intentionally reflecting on factors like health, mindset, movement, and personal relationships can help one regain focus on what truly matters.
School administrators often spend their time at work managing craziness. Amidst all the craziness, it is extremely valuable for school leaders to spend time each week being quiet and present. Previously, I have shared the story of becoming a shell of who I once was when starting out as an administrator. Figuring out my life liturgy through intentional reflection helped bring me back to life and allowed me to be both the school administrator and the father that I needed to be. Sometimes, staying present means putting away your phone and taking control of your mind. Other times, it means ending a habit that is detrimental to your well-being. Whatever intentionally staying present looks like for you, it will take an enormous amount of self-discipline. If you would like to learn more about life liturgies, or just want to spend some time reflecting with another person, Jen and I would love to hear from you! You can reach us via email at jenschwanke@gmail.com or will@williamdparker.com. Thanks for listening in today and, as always, thank you for doing what matters!
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