

MinistryWatch Podcast
Warren Smith and Natasha Smith
Transparency and accountability are vital to the renewal of the evangelical church in America. Hosts Warren Smith and Natasha Smith highlight the top stories of the week from the unique MinistryWatch perspective and give you a peek behind the curtain to show why and how we do the investigations we do.
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Oct 18, 2024 • 27min
Ep. 407: Cru and LGBTQ Issues, United Methodists, and Pastor Burnout
On today’s program, Cru will stop using its current LGBTQ training program for staff by the end of this year. The change comes after facing accusations that the long-time campus ministry is compromising on biblical sexuality. We’ll have details.
Meanwhile, United Methodist churches in Liberia face protests and unrest as it deals with the fallout of the global denomination’s shift on LGBTQ issues. We’ll take a look.
And, American pastors are burned out and exhausted—but experts say that can change.
But first, a group of people affiliated with Morningstar church in South Carolina are calling for founder Rick Joyner’s resignation—and Joyner is not having it. A group of former MorningStar church members, students, and staff members have signed an open statement calling for MorningStar founder Rick Joyner to resign, among other accountability measures.
Until next time, may God bless you.
MANUSCRIPT
FIRST SEGMENT
Warren:
Hello everybody. I’m Warren Smith, coming to you this week from Amsterdam, in the Netherlands, where I’m attending a conference on Bible translation.
Natasha:
And I’m Natasha Cowden, coming to you from Denver, Colorado. And we’d like to welcome you to the MinistryWatch podcast.
Warren:
On today’s program, Cru will stop using its current LGBTQ training program for staff by the end of this year. The change comes after facing accusations that the long-time campus ministry is compromising on biblical sexuality. We’ll have details.
Meanwhile, United Methodist churches in Liberia face protests and unrest as it deals with the fallout of the global denomination’s shift on LGBTQ issues. We’ll take a look.
And, American pastors are burned out and exhausted—but experts say that can change.
Natasha:
But first, a group of people affiliated with Morningstar church in South Carolina are calling for founder Rick Joyner’s resignation—and Joyner is not having it.
Warren:
A group of former MorningStar church members, students, and staff members have signed an open statement calling for MorningStar founder Rick Joyner to resign, among other accountability measures.
The statement, published by MorningStar Accountability Now on September 23, follows the filing of three lawsuits by victims who alleged child sexual abuse by Erickson Lee during MorningStar programs. The lawsuits also seek to hold the ministry liable for not preventing the alleged abuse.
Natasha:
How has the founder responded?
Warren:
In an email on October 5 to Emily Elston, a leader of the MorningStar Accountability Now group, Joyner said, “I am the one God gave to raise up MorningStar, and I will not abandon my post except by His clearly revealed will.”
The accountability statement has over 200 named signatories, some of whom are former teachers at the church’s Comenius School for Creative Leadership, as well as church attendees, Morningstar staff, and others affiliated with the Morningstar School of Ministry.
Natasha:
In addition to calling for Joyner’s resignation, the statement also calls for an independent audit of the MorningStar board, the credentials of its members, and its policies and procedures.
Warren:
MorningStar does not file an informational Form 990 with the Internal Revenue Service where the board members’ names would be listed, nor does it have them easily accessible on its ministry website.
The accountability statement also calls for an independent audit of the ministry’s child protection policies and for the audit results to be released publicly.
The statement says MorningStar should implement mandatory training on sexual abuse against minors for all staff and volunteers who interact with children.
Natasha:
On September 24, MorningStar’s leadership released a statement saying they “stand with the victims” and are “fully committed to their healing and restoration.”
Warren:
The statement claims MorningStar is working with independent third-party investigators to examine its policies and practices. It does not name the investigators.
The ministry also claims to operate with “strong safeguards, including mandated training and compliance with legal standards.”
In response to criticism of its leadership, MorningStar said it is committed to accountability, integrity, and learning from past “challenges and failures,” but added that it will “resist unjust or unfounded accusations.” Again, no specific “unfounded accusations” were identified.
Natasha:
Next, Cru discontinues LGBTQ training program for staff.
Warren:
Battered by months of criticisms for controversial staff guidance on how to handle LGBTQ-identifying students, Cru (formerly Campus Crusade for Christ) will be removing its Compassionate and Faithful curriculum by the end of the year, according to reporting by WORLD.
In a leaked recording of a Sept. 26 staff meeting, Keith Johnson, Cru’s director of theological education and development, said “Our plan going forward is to integrate our LGBT+ equipping into existing developmental venues. Going forward, we think it’s increasingly important for us to speak in our own theological voice.”
Later, Johnson told WORLD that weaving sexuality training into Cru’s Institute of Biblical Studies for new staff and interns is the logical next step now that most current staff have already completed the training.
Natasha:
What was their curriculum like?
Warren:
Development of the Compassionate and Faithful curriculum began in 2021 in response to the skyrocketing number of college students identifying as LGBTQ. At one time, it reportedly included at least 13 videos by author and podcaster Preston Sprinkle. While Sprinkle affirms biblical marriage, he also advocates addressing LGBTQ individuals by their preferred pronouns and supports the “gay Christian” label for believers who struggle with same-sex attraction.
Natasha:
But critics were quick to respond.
Warren:
Ex-lesbian women’s studies professor Rosaria Butterfield and two former Cru employees, Uriah and Marissa Mundell, are among those who have spoken out.
The Mundells lost their jobs after publicly criticizing the training program and its push for “pronoun hospitality.” Butterfield called out Cru by name as a moral compromiser during her convocation address to about 10,000 Liberty University students in November 2023.
In the leaked audio, Johnson reiterated Cru’s commitment to the Gospel and biblical sexuality, but still did not explain the training changes and mixed messages that followed the public condemnation from Butterfield, or what the new lessons might look like.
Natasha:
Our next story involves Christian refugees.
Warren:
The U.S. resettled more Christians fleeing persecution in fiscal year 2024 than it has since 2016, Open Doors and World Relief said in a report unveiled Oct. 14 as insight for policymakers and voters weeks ahead of the U.S. presidential elections.
The nonpartisan groups reported the numbers of refugees and asylum seekers the U.S. has accepted in recent decades, including Christians and others fleeing religious persecution, and explored how U.S. presidential platform policies will impact the ability of those persecuted for their faith to find refuge here after the November elections.
Natasha:
And what are their thoughts on that?
Warren:
World Relief President and CEO Myal Greene said, “President Trump has pledged to suspend the refugee admissions program, but we also hope that this report will be something that raises voices and attention to this issue, and will persuade him to change his mind if he’s elected.”
Natasha:
We have also seen that the Biden-Harris administration implemented very significant restrictions on the asylum program.
Warren:
That’s right. Both groups were clear in emphasizing that the report remained nonpartisan. Both administrations had done some things well, and both administrations had fallen short in significant ways, according to the report.
Open Doors U.S. President Ryan Brown pointed out the increasing need for the U.S. to provide a safe haven for Christians fleeing persecution, as the organization’s annual World Watch List has noted a multiyear trend of increasingly violent persecution that forces Christians to flee their homelands.
He encouraged voters not to confuse the issue of border security with asylum and refugee access.
Natasha:
Warren, let’s take a quick break. When we return, unrest breaks out in Liberian churches as they struggle to determine where they stand with a denomination they disagree with over gender and sexuality.
I’m Natasha Cowden, along with my co-host Warren Smith, and we’ll have that story and much more, after this short break.
BREAK
SECOND SEGMENT
Natasha:
Welcome back. I’m Natasha Cowden, along with my co-host Warren Smith, and you’re listening to the MinistryWatch podcast.
Next, the story we promised before the break, unrest breaks out in United Methodist churches in Liberia.
Warren:
The United Methodist Church in Liberia has been roiled in recent days over its position on marriage for same-sex couples after the global denomination, based in the United States, voted to strike a 40-year-old condemnation of homosexuality from its governing document.
Clergy and lay members of the 150,000-member Liberian church have been calling for a special session of the annual conference to take a vote on the U.S. church’s decision, but Bishop Samuel Jerome Quire, the resident bishop of the Liberia Area, has refused, citing the importance of maintaining unity in the Liberian church.
Natasha:
Last week, Quire suspended a number of pastors and elders who have persistently asked for the special assembly.
Warren:
The tensions escalated Sunday (Oct.13), when protests broke out at the New Georgia United Methodist Church in Monrovia over the suspension of the Rev. Leo Mason, the church’s senior pastor and an outspoken proponent of traditional marriage. The protests spread to other churches in the capital, prompting riot police to intervene.
Quire later explained the protests were triggered by rumors that he was to go to New Georgia to preside at a wedding between two men. He was due there to install a new pastor.
Natasha:
Why are things so tense?
Warren:
The bishop said the issue of same-sex marriage has been lingering since the General Conference of the United Methodist Church, meeting in Charlotte, North Carolina, April 23-May 3, removed language banning LGBTQ clergy and restrictions on same-sex marriage from the church’s Book of Discipline.
The General Conference also passed measures to restructure the denomination, giving each region greater equity in tailoring church life to its own customs and traditions, including an amendment that awards equal standing to its worldwide regions, including Africa, Europe, the Philippines and the United States.
Natasha:
Did that restructuring help ease the concerns for the African church?
Warren:
Quire said he had explained the General Conference’s decisions to church leaders at the time and urged the denomination’s membership in Liberia to remain calm. But many members want a special session to determine the Liberian area’s relationship with the global denomination.
Regarding churches that have threatened in writing to break away from the Liberian church, Quire said: “They have forgotten their identity. … No local church has the right to remove itself from the United Methodist Church. They have no authority.”
Natasha:
While churches within the U-M-C continue to divide over its issues, two churches in Washington are overcoming decades of disagreement to merge into one body.
Warren:
Across the U.S., churches are closing or merging by force — no longer able to maintain membership numbers or funds to support their buildings and staff.
But for Northside and Sunrise, that wasn’t the case. Both congregations were doing fine financially, Instead, their union was by choice, borne out of a love for each other and a desire to combine their strengths — and put aside their differences — to point more people to Jesus.
Natasha:
Can you share a little background on what brought them to this new point?
Warren:
In early 2020, newly hired Northside preacher Henry Holub — a graduate of Abilene Christian University — reached out to Sunrise preacher Troy Burns, just looking for a “preaching buddy” to talk to. Holub and Burns’ relationship led Northside and Sunrise to host their first event together, a trunk-or-treat, in 2021. They began to cooperate more and more, holding a joint Vacation Bible School, a sweetheart banquet, a picnic, a fall festival and a breakfast for the nearby elementary school.
As members of both congregations became friendlier toward each other, they began to notice each had complementary strengths and weaknesses, Payne said.
Natasha:
Eventually, the leadership from both churches decided to address what they called the elephant in the room: merging to become one church. Some members had already started asking about the possibility.
Warren:
They held their first service last Sunday. The benefits they cited included the ability to fully staff Bible classes for adults and children, twice as many volunteers for church responsibilities, increasing outreach to the neighborhood and providing “a tremendous witness to the world” of Christian unity.
Natasha:
While we’ve been talking about churches – experts weigh in on why so many pastors are burned out and exhausted.
Warren:
The decline of organized religion, the aftermath of a worldwide pandemic, political polarization — and the burden of caring for their congregation’s soul — have left many pastors feeling burned out and wondering how long they can hang on.
The title of a 2024 report from the Hartford Institute for Research summed up what pastors are saying: “I’m Exhausted All the Time.”
Natasha:
Why is that?
Warren:
Scott Thumma, director of the Hartford Institute said that Racial divides and political issues have disrupted faith communities, which have undermined the relationship between religious leaders and their congregations, leading to clergy burnout and discouragement.
Natasha:
And mental health is really challenging for pastors
Warren:
While burnout and poor mental health for clergy may often be gradual, the recovery process requires a lot more intentionality, said Rae Jean Proeschold-Bell, director of the Duke Clergy Health Initiative at Duke University.
That’s why it’s important for pastors to monitor feelings of being overwhelmed so they can be addressed before becoming a larger issue.
Natasha:
What can pastors do to keep themselves healthy and refreshed?
Warren:
Making plans for incorporating intentional practices can help pastors decrease stress and regain spiritual well-being. During the pandemic, the Duke Clergy Health Initiative partnered with the United Methodist Church for a study on mindfulness practices.
Clergy took eight classes on mindfulness techniques. They participated, on average, for 28 minutes a day for six months. They saw a reduction in stress and an improvement in their heart rate variability — the heart’s ability to recover.
Proeschold-Bell recommended that clergy try a practice called the Daily Examen, which has been practiced by Catholics and other contemplative Christians.
Other intentional practices include exercise, taking time to eat nourishing foods and getting enough sleep. Experts say, The most important thing is taking time away from work and its stressors so clergy can connect and meet their physical and psychological needs.
Natasha:
Warren, we’re going to take another break. When we return, our lightning round of ministry news of the week.
I’m Natasha Cowden, with my co-host Warren Smith. More in a moment.
BREAK
THIRD SEGMENT
Natasha:
Welcome back. I’m Natasha Cowden, with my co-host Warren Smith and you’re listening to the MinistryWatch Podcast.
Warren, we like to use this last segment as a sort of lightning round of shorter news briefs.
What’s up first?
Warren:
The MinistryWatch Index inched up slightly during September but has remained mostly flat for the third month in a row.
That said, the less than .2 percent increase represents a new record for the index, which tracks revenue for 38 large Christian ministries in the nation. On October 1, the revenue of these ministries was approximately $9.9 billion.
Though there was no growth during September, this number represents 8 percent year-to-date, and up about 10.6 percent from its February low this year.
Though the organizations in the MinistryWatch Index have continued to grow this year, almost all of that growth took place in the first six seven months of the year. And this year’s growth significantly lags last year’s rise. In 2023 the Index grew 24.1 percent. The relatively slow growth of the MinistryWatch Index for 2024 could suggest concern about the future of the economy.
All the major indices have seen significant volatility this year. The Dow has seen two corrections this year greater than five percent, and the NASDAQ fell 12 percent from mid-July to early August, though it has since recovered most of those losses.
Natasha:
What’s Next?
Warren:
MinistryWatch, in collaboration with the Trinity Foundation, each month publishes a list of the private planes belonging to pastors and Christian ministries.
The list also includes basic information about their usage by pastors and ministries.
This month’s list is below. Here are a few highlights:
The Trinity Foundation currently tracks 65 ministries that have airplanes.
During September, these planes made a total of 495 flights. This is a significant increase over August total of 428.
Operating costs were approximately $2 million for the month. These costs do not include the cost of the plane itself.
Liberty University remains the biggest user of private aircraft. It typically holds that position month in and month out. Liberty University has an aviation program that uses aircraft for training purposes. We do not include these aircraft in this list.
The Assemblies of God denomination came in a close second, with 29 flight segments.
If you find this information interesting or helpful, you might want to follow The Trinity Foundation’s daily X feed. You can find that account, @PastorPlanes, here.)
But we think that for most people this monthly list will be more digestible and easier to read.
Natasha:
And who is in our Ministry Spotlight this week?
Warren:
Chosen People Ministries, based in New York City, recently saw a drop in its Donor Confidence Score—falling from a 56 to a 51, which means “Exercise Caution.”
The organization does not release Form 990s and does not make its audited financial statements available to the public.
“We’re organized under the IRS as a church—our letter says we’re exempt from preparing a 990, so we don’t have one to disclose,” Chosen People’s CFO David Lee told MinistryWatch. “[Our] audited reports are available if anyone asks, we will release it to them.”
Chosen People is part of a growing number of ministries that have petitioned the IRS to be reclassified as a church, although Lee says that in their 130 years of ministry, they have always been classified as a church under the IRS. “We have congregations, we do mission work,” he wrote.
According to limited financial information from its ECFA profile, in 2023 the organization brought in revenue of $21.6 million, and its total expenses were $19.2 million. The ministry also has $27.1 million in net assets.
Natasha:
Warren, any final thoughts before we go?
Warren:
Webinar: October 24. Understanding MinistryWatch’s Rating System.
Faith Based Fraud
Natasha:
The producer for today’s program is Jeff McIntosh. We get database and other technical support from Stephen DuBarry, Rod Pitzer, and Casey Sudduth. Writers who contributed to today’s program include Kim Roberts, Tony Mator, Diana Chandler, Fredrick Nzwili, Calvin Cockrell, Genevieve Charles, Brittany Smith—and you, Warren.
A special thanks to Baptist Press and The Christian Chronicle for contributing material for this week’s podcast.
I’m Natasha Cowden, coming to you from Denver, Colorado.
Warren:
And I’m Warren Smith, in Charlotte, North Carolina.
Natasha:
You’ve been listening to the MinistryWatch podcast. Until next time, may God bless you.

Oct 17, 2024 • 20min
Ep. 406: How the U.S. Government Can Stop non-Churches From Being Treated Like Churches
Christian ministries and other non-profit organizations have played a huge, positive role in American culture. If you don’t believe me, just read Benjamin Franklin, Alexis de Tocqueville, Robert Bellah, Rodney Stark, Arthur Brooks…the list goes on. Because of the positive influence in our culture, our laws encourage their work. They are not required to pay taxes on revenue, and donors to them get tax advantages as well. In exchange for these advantages, we ask only a couple of things: First, that they actually do the good work they promise to do, and – secondly – that they disclose enough details about their work so that the donor public can confirm that. That disclosure is a Form 990, which all tax-exempt bodies except churches must file with the federal government.
However, churches are exempt from that requirement. That exemption makes some sense, since most churches are small and all of the donors to a local church were members of the church. Today, however, we live in an era of mega churches that are often the center of an ecosystem of related entities – both profit and non-profit. We also have religious advocacy groups that are claiming to be churches even though they don’t have regular services, don’t ordain clergy, don’t marry or bury their members, don’t do anything that we think of as the normal activity of a church. This state of affairs have led some – including those of us here at MinistryWatch – to believe that we need a new regimen of regulations and laws that update those written in another era.
Sharing some of these views is Lloyd Hitoshi Mayer, a professor of law at the University of Notre Dame. He and his coauthor Ellen Aprill have written a new paper outlining changes that need to happen to fix – or at least to bring a bit more up to date – the current situation.
Links to articles mentioned in today’s program.
https://ministrywatch.com/law-professor-advocates-changing-irs-definition-of-church-association-of-churches/
https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=4346286
https://theconversation.com/how-the-us-government-can-stop-churches-from-getting-treated-like-real-churches-by-the-irs-237922
That brings to a close my interview with Dr. Lloyd Hitoshi Mayer, a professor of law at the University of Notre Dame. We’ll have links to the articles we discussed today in the show notes for today’s program.
The producer for today’s program is Jeff McIntosh. I’m your host Warren Smith. Until next time, may God bless you.

Oct 11, 2024 • 25min
Ep. 405: BGEA Sues, Turmoil in the EPC & Kanakuk Sex Abuse Lawsuit
On today’s program, the Billy Graham Evangelistic Association threatens to sue after the group Evangelicals for Harris uses video of Billy Graham to make an anti-Trump ad. We’ll have details.
Plus, a storm is brewing within the Evangelical Presbyterian Church—some are asking if the denomination will stay true to its mission.
And, the leaders of Kanakuk Kamps are the defendants in a sexual abuse-related lawsuit. They tried to get parts of that lawsuit dismissed—and the court has handed down its decision. We’ll take a look.
But first, a class action lawsuit has been filed against Gateway Church and its former pastor Robert Morris. Gateway Church, headquartered in the Dallas suburb of Southlake, has been facing a multitude of allegations and controversies after Cindy Clemishire’s sexual abuse allegations against founding pastor Robert Morris led to his resignation. Now, a class action lawsuit has been filed against the church in federal court by members who are concerned about the stewardship of the money they contributed.
The producer for today’s program is Jeff McIntosh. We get database and other technical support from Stephen DuBarry, Rod Pitzer, and Casey Sudduth. Writers who contributed to today’s program include Kim Roberts, Kathryn Post, Marci Seither, Mallory Challis, Brittany Smith and Christina Darnell.
A special thanks to Generous Giving and Baptist News Global for contributing material for this week’s podcast.
Until next time, may God bless you.
MANUSCRIPT
FIRST SEGMENT
Warren:
Hello everybody. I’m Warren Smith, coming to you from Charlotte, North Carolina.
Natasha:
And I’m Natasha Cowden, coming to you from Denver, Colorado. And we’d like to welcome you to the MinistryWatch podcast.
Warren:
On today’s program, the Billy Graham Evangelistic Association threatens to sue after the group Evangelicals for Harris uses video of Billy Graham to make an anti-Trump ad. We’ll have details.
Plus, a storm is brewing within the Evangelical Presbyterian Church—some are asking if the denomination will stay true to its mission.
And, the leaders of Kanakuk Kamps are the defendants in a sexual abuse-related lawsuit. They tried to get parts of that lawsuit dismissed—and the court has handed down its decision. We’ll take a look.
Natasha:
But first, a class action lawsuit has been filed against Gateway Church and its former pastor Robert Morris.
Warren:
Gateway Church, headquartered in the Dallas suburb of Southlake, has been facing a multitude of allegations and controversies after Cindy Clemishire’s sexual abuse allegations against founding pastor Robert Morris led to his resignation.
Natasha:
Now, a class action lawsuit has been filed against the church in federal court by members who are concerned about the stewardship of the money they contributed.
Warren:
The lawsuit alleges that Morris and Gateway’s leadership represented that “15% of all tithe dollars would be distributed to global missions and Jewish ministry partners, encouraging church members to generously give toward these ends.”
The lawsuit states, Morris claimed in 2023 that Gateway had sent more than $25 million overseas.
The plaintiffs believe that was a misrepresentation, and they are seeking transparency about how the money was used.
In 2021, MinistryWatch reported about the network of ministries associated with Gateway Church—there was little financial and organizational transparency made available to the public.
A former executive pastor never witnessed more than $3 million annually in global missions contributions.
Natasha:
The plaintiffs claim that “Gateway refused to be transparent when trying to answer even simple questions about the use of tithing dollars.”
Warren:
Lead plaintiff Katherine Leach “has publicly and directly delivered a demand letter to Gateway for the return of her tithes pursuant to Gateway’s ‘money back guarantee.’ Gateway has not responded.”
The lawsuit asserts claims for misrepresentation, fraud, and breach of contract.
Natasha:
While we’re on the subject of Gateway, there has been a development in the story a different lawsuit.
Warren:
Clemishire testified before the Texas House Committee on Judiciary and Civil Jurisprudence on October 2 about declining a settlement offer by Morris’s lawyers in exchange for signing a nondisclosure agreement (NDA). The committee was hearing testimony about civil NDAs in child sexual abuse settlements.
Clemishire’s story was made public on June 14.
Clemishire says Morris sexually abused her from 1982 through 1987, starting when she was 12 years old.
Clemishire told the committee she wasn’t just at the hearing to advocate for herself, but for the estimated 42 million adult survivors of child sexual abuse living in the United States.
Natasha:
Next, BGEA Threatens Lawsuit Over Political Ad, First, Warren, can you tell us what the ad is about?
Warren:
The ad begins with a clip of renowned evangelist the Rev. Billy Graham, declaring “But you must realize that in the last days, the times will be full of danger. Men will become utterly self-centered and greedy for money.”
Suddenly, a clip of former President Donald Trump is spliced in where he says: “My whole life I’ve been greedy, greedy, greedy. I’ve grabbed all the money I could get. I’m so greedy.”
For the next few seconds, the ad, which has racked up over 30 million views, flips between Graham’s 1988 sermon, contrasting his points with shots of Trump using violent language, claiming to be “the chosen one” and talking about kissing women without their consent.
Natasha:
That ad, the result of a $1 million ad campaign by Evangelicals for Harris, is now the subject of a potential lawsuit from the Billy Graham Evangelistic Association, the Charlotte, North Carolina-based nonprofit that supports the ministries of Billy Graham’s son and grandson.
Warren:
An Oct. 2 letter, sent from outside counsel and obtained by RNS, threatened to sue Evangelicals for Harris on the basis of copyright infringement.
In a statement to RNS, the Billy Graham Evangelistic Association said they do not generally comment on potential disputes, but they acknowledged having communicated with Evangelicals for Harris regarding their concerns about the “unauthorized, political use of BGEA’s copyrighted video,” and said they would continue to address the matter.
Natasha:
How did Evangelicals for Harris respond?
Warren:
Evangelicals for Harris released a statement saying “Franklin is scared of our ads because we do not tell people what to do or think. We merely hold Trump’s own words up to the light of Scripture, the necessity of repentance, and Biblical warnings against leaders exactly like Trump,” they wrote in a post on X.
The lawyers representing Evangelicals for Harris also released their formal legal response to the threatened lawsuit. Originally sent on Sept. 28, the letter asserts that the ad does not constitute copyright infringement or violate the Billy Graham Evangelistic Association’s right. They write that the public discussion of Trump’s moral failings is “essential First Amendment expression” and that the use of Billy Graham’s sermon is protected under the Copyright Act.
Natasha:
Warren, let’s take a quick break. When we return, a story about radical giving—one couple cashes in their children’s college funds to invest in a greater future.
I’m Natasha Cowden, along with my co-host Warren Smith, and we’ll have that story and much more, after this short break.
BREAK
SECOND SEGMENT
Natasha:
Welcome back. I’m Natasha Cowden, along with my co-host Warren Smith, and you’re listening to the MinistryWatch podcast.
Next, the story we promised before the break, a story about radical generosity.
Warren:
This story is one in a series we’ve done here at MinistryWatch over the years that highlight examples of, as you say, radical generosity.
This story is about the journey of Leslie and Jason White, who chose to cash in their children’s college funds to invest in their church’s expansion efforts.
After graduating Stanford the couple found a church home that met in a local hotel.
By 2010, the church had grown from one service to three with an additional service on Sunday evenings. One thing was obvious—they were outgrowing their space and needed expansion plans.
Instead of thinking of the building they viewed the project as “making space for lives to change.”
Jason said. “They asked us to come with a number of what you could contribute over the next few years.”
The Whites took the radical step to drain their children’s college fund, and put that money toward the church expansion instead.
Natasha:
Wow, that’s amazing.
Warren:
The church now has over 10,000 members across five different campuses. But that’s not the only growth the Whites have seen.
Natasha:
How so?
Warren:
“We’re seeing growth in our own marriage,” said Jason. “We’re seeing our kids get poured into, and we see all the things happening to the people around us.” And Leslie added. “When you plant the seed, you don’t know who will reap the benefit.”
Natasha:
In our next story, turmoil in an evangelical denomination.
Warren:
A storm is brewing in the Evangelical Presbyterian Church (EPC) and a “meaningful group of churches” are considering other options, according to Pastor Nate Atwood, the pastor of St. Giles Presbyterian Church in Charlotte, N.C.
Atwood has been involved in the EPC since 1988 and held several leadership roles, including serving as moderator of the General Assembly. He says there is a “crisis of confidence in the current stated clerk, moderator, and leadership team” after an overture concerning same-sex-attracted pastors never made it to the floor of the General Assembly this summer.
Natasha:
Warren, can you provide a little background of the Evangelical Presbyterian Church?
Warren:
According to Atwood, the original vision of the EPC when it was founded in 1981 was to be a Biblical, evangelical, constitutional, and Reformed denomination.
Recent events have raised questions about several of those commitments,
Natasha:
What events were those?
Warren:
One concerns sexual identity. The issue arose because Greg Johnson, the Presbyterian pastor of Memorial Presbyterian in St. Louis who says he is homosexual but celibate, left the Presbyterian Church in America in 2022.
Now his church wants to join the EPC. The question has divided the denomination.
Natasha:
And that’s not the only case causing controversy.
Warren:
According to the EPC Book of Government, once a church notifies its presbytery of its desire to leave, the “Presbytery shall take no action to dismiss, dissolve or divide the local church and its elders until all proceedings under this section…are fully completed.”
Beverly Heights, in Pennsylvania plans to leave the EPC and they are maintaining that this process is not being followed.
Beverly Heights filed a complaint with the EPC General Assembly explaining what it believed to be unconstitutional actions.
The church also filed a civil suit in Pennsylvania state court because it is incorporated as a nonprofit under Pennsylvania laws.
In March, the two parties met for a mediation and reached a verbal settlement. However, the church claims that when the presbytery sent the written agreement over, it significantly deviated from the previously agreed terms.
The issues remain unresolved.
Natasha:
What’s our next story?
Warren:
A church staff member at Revival City Church in the Dallas suburb of McKinney was arrested on a family violence charge, according to reporting by WFAA.
David Scarberry, 53, serves as the evangelistic outreach leader for Revival City. He leads teams in evangelistic outreach efforts in McKinney each Wednesday, the church website says.
According to the police report obtained by WFAA, Scarberry was arrested on a charge of continuous family violence. It is not clear from the arrest who Scarberry’s victim was.
Natasha:
What does that charge mean?
Warren:
A charge of continuous family violence, according to the Texas Penal Code, applies when a person, during a period of 12 months or less, assaults a family member. It is a third degree felony.
Scarberry was released from the Collin County jail on a bond. Scarberry called the charges a “misunderstanding” and “false accusations.”
Natasha:
This is not Scarberry’s first run-in with the law.
Warren:
According to Oklahoma records obtained by KERA, Scarberry served a five-year prison sentence after he was found guilty of using an offensive weapon in a felony and two additional drug felonies in 2002.
His ex-wife also filed a protective order against him in 1994 after Scarberry was arrested for assault and battery, KERA reported. The charges were later dropped.
According to its website, Revival City Church is part of the Bethel Leaders network and part of Andrew Wommack’s Ministers Association.
Natasha:
Warren, we’re going to take another break. When we return, our lightning round of ministry news of the week.
I’m Natasha Cowden, with my co-host Warren Smith. More in a moment.
BREAK
THIRD SEGMENT
Natasha:
Welcome back. I’m Natasha Cowden, with my co-host Warren Smith and you’re listening to the MinistryWatch Podcast.
Warren, we like to use this last segment as a sort of lightning round of shorter news briefs.
What’s up first?
Warren:
Motions filed by defendants Kanakuk and ACE American Insurance Co. to dismiss a recent amendment to Logan Yandell’s lawsuit against Kanakuk Kamps for civil conspiracy have been denied.
Yandell’s lawsuit alleges the defendants committed fraud against him by failing to adequately disclose and represent knowledge of sexual misconduct committed against children at the camp by serial child sex abuser Peter Newman, who just days ago was denied the opportunity for parole while serving his life sentence in Missouri.
An amendment made to the lawsuit earlier this year added charges of civil conspiracy, alleging the defendants named in the lawsuit, including Kanakuk Kamps and ACE Insurance Co., conspired together to commit these acts of fraud. It was this amendment that will now be allowed to be a part of the lawsuit going forward.
Natasha:
And who is in our Ministry Spotlight this week?
Warren:
This week, Adventures in Missions’ overall Transparency Grade fell from a C to a D because the organization does not file a Form 990.
According to its Guidestar profile, the nonprofit “is not required to file an annual return with the IRS because it is a church.”
Executive Director Seth Barnes told MinistryWatch the organization’s choice to change its IRS status was “not to escape accountability, but more about not having to go through the process with the government and seek accountability through other mechanisms.”
This includes being in good standing with the ECFA and cutting overhead costs.
Adventures in Missions does provide audited financial statements on its website, and Barnes said the organization’s 990s are available to donors upon request.
According to the ministry’s 2023 Annual Report, its revenue was $10.4 million and its total expenses were $10 million.
Limited financial information from Adventures in Missions’ ECFA profile shows a drop in revenue from 2021 to 2023—falling from $13.8 million to $10.4 million.
The organization’s website describes itself as an “interdenominational missions organization that focuses on discipleship” through a number of programs, including short and long term missions trips, parent ministry, and The World Race. The World Race is an 11-month missions program for people ages 21-30. Participants travel to multiple countries around the world during their time in the program and serve with local ministry partners.
Natasha:
And who did we highlight in Ministries Making a Difference?
Warren:
(A roundup of ministries providing relief after Hurricane Helene)
Water Mission is setting up water treatment systems at multiple locations throughout Western North Carolina after the area was devastated by Hurricane Helene. The systems, spanning from Asheville to Boone, “take dirty water from a local source such as a river, and immediately treat it making it safe for drinking,” according to the ministry. The largest systems can provide safe water for up to 5,000 people a day. Water Mission has 3 stars, an “A” transparency grade, and a donor confidence score of 100 in the MinistryWatch database.
With clean water being a critical component of disaster relief, Samaritan’s Purse is also deploying water filtration systems in hard-hit areas of North Carolina. The systems, developed by Samaritan’s Purse engineers, can provide clean water for up to 10,000 people a day. The ministry has also flown relief supplies—infant hygiene kits, food, water, and medical supplies—on at least 19 helicopter operations. Volunteers with the Boone-based organization are doing what they do best—clearing debris, mudding out homes, and chainsawing trees. Samaritan’s Purse has 2 stars, an “A” transparency grade, but a 56 donor confidence score (“Exercise Caution”).
Convoy of Hope and Nazarene Compassionate Ministries are partnering to provide thousands of Crisis Care Kits to victims of Hurricane Helene. Various Church of the Nazarene congregations in North Carolina are hosting Nazarene Disaster Response (NDR) teams to mobilize supplies and personnel and provide disaster relief. Convoy of Hope has 4 stars, an “A” transparency grade, and a donor confidence score of 79. Nazarene Compassionate Ministries has 5 stars, an “A” transparency grade, and a donor confidence score of 100—the highest ratings in each of the three MinistryWatch categories.
Blessings International is preparing hygiene care kits, first aid kits, and medical supplies for first responders assisting with the aftermath of Hurricane Helene. Blessings International has 3 stars, an “A” transparency grade, and a donor confidence score of 100.
Christian Relief Fund helped clear fallen trees and debris in Valdosta, Georgia, and is providing generators to assist with power outages in Asheville, North Carolina, delivering them via helicopter. CRF has 3 stars, an “A” transparency grade, and a donor confidence score of 97.
Natasha:
Warren, any final thoughts before we go?
Warren:
Webinar: October 24. Understanding MinistryWatch’s Rating System.
Natasha:
The producer for today’s program is Jeff McIntosh. We get database and other technical support from Stephen DuBarry, Rod Pitzer, and Casey Sudduth. Writers who contributed to today’s program include Kim Roberts, Kathryn Post, Marci Seither, Mallory Challis, Brittany Smith and Christina Darnell.
A special thanks to Generous Giving and Baptist News Global for contributing material for this week’s podcast.
I’m Natasha Cowden, coming to you from Denver, Colorado.
Warren:
And I’m Warren Smith, in Charlotte, North Carolina.
Natasha:
You’ve been listening to the MinistryWatch podcast. Until next time, may God bless you.

Oct 9, 2024 • 37min
Ep. 404: How Christianity and Crude Oil Made Modern America
Darren Dochuk’s book Anointed With Oil: How Christianity and Crude Made Modern America has been out a couple of years. But I must confess that I discovered it only recently, and it has changed my perspective about a lot things I thought I knew about modern American Evangelicalism. As you will hear, he outlines how modern Protestantism split in the early 20th century into liberal and conservative factions. The liberal stream was made up mostly of the mainline protestant churches, and the conservative stream became what we know today is evangelicalism. However, what Dockuk adds to this conversation is an analysis of how both streams got funded — by oil millionaires such as John D. Rockefeller on the left and J. Howard Pew and the Hunt Brothers on the right. He has caused me to believe that without these men and a very few others who funded their religious impulses, modern American religious life would look very different than it does today.
Darren Dochuk is a professor of history at the University of Notre Dame, and his previous works include From Bible Belt to Sunbelt, a history of the rise of evangelical conservatism. That book won the John H. Dunning Prize from the American Historical Association. Darren Dochuk spoke to me from his office in South Bend, Indiana.
I hope you’ll join me again on Friday when I’m joined by Natasha Cowden for our discussion of the week’s news.
The producer for today’s program is Jeff McIntosh. Until next time, may God bless you!

Oct 4, 2024 • 26min
Ep. 403: Hurricane Helene Relief, Barnabas Aid, Ethnos 360
On today’s program,, Christian ministries are on the forefront of relief efforts as cities in Western North Carolina grapple with loss after Hurricane Helene. We’ll take a look.
And, a Georgia congregation locked out of their own building after splitting from its parent church. We’ll have details.
Plus, the missions organization Ethnos 360 faces a lawsuit after a victim alleges that another missionary child abused her…and the ministry is continuing to allow the perpetrator access to other children.
But first, the United Kingdom has launched an investigation into Barnabas Aid.
The producer for today’s program is Jeff McIntosh. We get database and other technical support from Stephen DuBarry, Rod Pitzer, and Casey Sudduth. Writers who contributed to today’s program include Kim Roberts, Bob Smietana, Tony Mator, Brittany Smith—and you, Warren.
Until next time, may God bless you.
MANUSCRIPT
FIRST SEGMENT
Warren:
Hello everybody. I’m Warren Smith, coming to you from Charlotte, North Carolina.
Christina:
And I’m Christina Darnell, in for Natasha Cowden, also coming to you from Charlotte, North Carolina. And we’d like to welcome you to the MinistryWatch podcast.
Warren:
On today’s program, Christian ministries are on the forefront of relief efforts as cities in Western North Carolina grapple with loss after Hurricane Helene. We’ll take a look.
And, a Georgia congregation locked out of their own building after splitting from its parent church. We’ll have details.
Plus, the missions organization Ethnos360 faces a lawsuit after a victim alleges that another missionary child abused her…and the ministry is continuing to allow the perpetrator access to other children.
Christina:
But first, the United Kingdom has launched an investigation into Barnabas Aid.
Warren:
Barnabas Aid — also known as Barnabas Fund, which aids persecuted Christians — is being investigated by the Charity Commission in the United Kingdom. On Sept. 17, the commission opened a statutory inquiry into the ministry based on allegations of a “£15m ($20 million) hole in the finances of its global network,”
Christina:
Additionally, Barnabas Aid is almost three months late in filing its latest financial accounts, according to the Charity Commission’s website.
Warren:
In August, Patrick Sookdheo, founder of Barnabas Aid, was suspended from his role in the organization due to concerns about financial mismanagement and a toxic work culture.
Noel Frost served as chief executive of the international organization, according to the Church Times. He also was removed from his position earlier this year due to allegations of misconduct and financial impropriety.
A Barnabas spokesperson told The Telegraph the investigation is ongoing, and “if it reveals that there has been any financial wrongdoing, then we are committed to recovering it.”
Christina:
Barnabas Aid has offices in several countries, including the United States, and also has an international office called Nexcus International.
Warren:
Nexcus was previously called Christian Relief International (CRI), but the name was changed to enable Barnabas Aid to “provide aid to countries where Christianity is prohibited,” according to Barnabas Aid USA CEO Jeremy Frith.
A letter dated August 14 by self-described interim international chief executive of Nexcus, Colin Bloom, said an independent investigation has found “serious and repeated contraventions of internal policies” and had brought “evidence of serious financial impropriety” to light.
According to the Barnabas Aid website, Nexcus (formerly CRI) serves as the international office for all Barnabas Aid ministries worldwide. Nexcus is registered in the US, but has an office in the UK.
Christina:
Our next story hits close to home for us, Warren.
In North Carolina, our neighbors to the west of Charlotte are dealing with the aftermath of Hurricane Helene, and Christian ministries are on the front lines.
Warren:
In the days since Hurricane Helene swept through mostly rural areas of nine states, Kevin King, executive director of Mennonite Disaster Service, has been working to make plans for how to best respond, despite spotty phone service due to downed cell towers and roads and bridges that have been washed out or blocked by fallen trees.
On Tuesday (Oct. 1), King was cheered as disaster relief workers from Mennonite communities around Ohio and Pennsylvania arrived outside Asheville, North Carolina, with chainsaws and earth-moving equipment to help clear the back roads as government services focus on main thoroughfares as well as search and rescue. “It’s good to hear sounds of chainsaws bringing hope,” he said.
Six more Mennonite heavy equipment operators are expected to start work Wednesday, bringing the total volunteers on site to about 30.
Christina:
And they’re not the only ones providing relief
Warren:
Other groups, such as Southern Baptist Disaster Relief and Samaritan’s Purse, have also been active in North Carolina.
Tom Beam, Southern Baptist Disaster Relief’s director for North Carolina, reported that volunteers are working in eight counties in that state.
Water Mission, a South Carolina-based engineering nonprofit that helps supply clear water around the world, has staff that live in storm-affected areas. In response, the nonprofit, which has recently begun doing disaster relief in the U.S., sent six water filtration systems and 175 generators to affected areas.
Christina:
And World Vision is active there too.
Warren:
That’s right, World Vision, has been sending truckloads of water as well as muck-out kits, generators, phone chargers, blankets, coolers and blankets to Florida and North Carolina. Reed Slattery, national director for U.S. programs at World Vision, said the supplies are being distributed from local churches, such as St. John Baptist in Arden, North Carolina, just south of Asheville.
“Our goal is to get supplies to the whole region,” said Slattery, who will head to the Southeast later this week to assess additional needs.
Christina:
Next, A big win for Pregnancy Centers in New York
Warren:
Pregnancy resource centers (PRC) in New York will continue offering abortion pill reversal assistance after they won a preliminary injunction in federal district court last week.
Summit Life Center and Evergreen Association — doing business as EMC Frontline Pregnancy Centers — won an injunction preventing New York Attorney General Letitia James from enforcing New York statutes against them to keep them from informing the public about Abortion Pill Reversal (APR), its safety, and its effectiveness.
Christina:
The injunction will remain in place until the underlying lawsuit is fully resolved.
Warren:
According the federal lawsuit filed on behalf of the pregnancy centers by the Thomas More Society, James began threatening PRCs and the national Abortion Pill Reversal Network in April with notices-of-intent-to-sue, claiming that “recipients’ truthful noncommercial statements about APR constituted commercial fraud under two state statutes.”
James threatened to silence the promotion of APR, but not the procedure itself.
They filed a lawsuit to defend their free speech, free exercise, and due process rights to continue speaking about APR.
Thomas More Society Vice President Peter Breen said in a press statement, “This injunction marks a critical victory for New York’s pregnancy help organizations.”
Christina:
Warren, let’s look at one more story before we take our first break,
Warren:
A missions agency that has faced allegations of historical abuse within its ranks is now being sued by an alleged victim.
Ethnos360, formerly New Tribes Mission, is being sued by a minor female, identified in the lawsuit as A.W., and her parents George Grant Whidden and Tracey Whidden in the 18th Judicial Circuit Court in Seminole County, Florida. The plaintiffs reside in Florida, and the Ethnos360 headquarters is located there.
The lawsuit says AW was abused by another child while they were living at a missionary training center, but that neither Ethnos nor Missouri authorities, where the training center was, took adequate steps to investigate.
Ethnos360 did not reply to a request for comment before the time of publication.
Christina:
Warren, let’s take a quick break. When we return, deaf people have been gathering at a Dallas-area church for 40 years to worship in their own service.
I’m Christina Darnell, along with my co-host Warren Smith, and we’ll have that story and much more, after this short break.
BREAK
SECOND SEGMENT
Christina:
Welcome back. I’m Christina Darnell, along with my co-host Warren Smith, and you’re listening to the MinistryWatch podcast.
Next, the story we promised before the break, the deaf community is considered by some to be one of the most unreached people groups in the world.
Warren:
In 1981, Terry and Cindy Heidecker, both of whom are deaf, began the ministry to provide an opportunity for deaf members of the community to worship in a way that is more familiar to them rather than having to adjust to a service geared toward the hearing.
Legacy offers Bible classes and a worship service in sign language, with interpretation for those who are hearing. The worship service is also streamed online for those who are homebound.
Christina:
According to the U.S. Census, at least 13% of the population is deaf or experiences some kind of hearing loss. And yet, this group remains one of groups that is considered most unreached with the Gospel.
Warren:
McTee encourages more churches to pick up the mantle of outreach to the deaf. He acknowledges that it comes with challenges, but says it will be worth it. Challenges include a lack of ministers who are deaf nor enough qualified American Sign Language interpreters.
Legacy is trying to increase its outreach to the deaf in the surrounding community, especially
children and teens. They have started hosting a deaf festival in early November with food and games.
They want to reach the whole family by showing the parents that Legacy is a safe, caring place for their children where they can learn more about God.
Christina:
Next up, a Georgia congregation is locked out of its building after a church split.
Warren:
On Sept. 25, the pastors of Winder Church (formerly War Hill South) found themselves locked out of their own sanctuary in Winder, Georgia.
The move to have the locks changed came, they said, without warning, but was not entirely unexpected.
Christina:
Why is that?
Warren:
Five months prior, the small satellite campus, which draws an average of 45 people on a typical Sunday, had disassociated from its parent organization, War Hill Church, due to a string of scandals previously covered by MinistryWatch, including an alleged robbery cover-up and abusive treatment of PTA moms.
Associate Pastor Johnny Hicks from Winder Church, told MinistryWatch that War Hill never formally asked the Winder congregation to vacate the building, and no eviction notice was posted. Hicks also raised questions about the use of funds by War Hill.
Christina:
So what’s next for Winder Church?
Warren:
Though Winder Church is currently a flock without a home or an alternate plan to obtain one, Price has no regrets.
“Winder Church, we counted the cost and paid it,” Price posted Thursday on social media. “If any one of you has been helped by this, it was worth it! Setting our eyes on what God has in store for us! No turning back, no turning back.”
War Hill Church did not respond to requests from MinistryWatch for comment.
Christina:
Next, Protestia Founder J.D. Hall has been found guilty of embezzlement.
Warren:
Two years after losing his pulpit and popular polemics ministry due to “serious sin,” J.D. Hall has been found guilty of embezzling his former church, Fellowship Baptist Church (FBC) in Sidney, Montana.
A deferred sentencing agreement filed Sept. 10 in Richland County District Court requires Hall to pay $15,454 to FBC to restore funds he misused while serving as its pastor.
If Hall complies with all the requirements of the plea agreement over the next three years, the felony embezzlement verdict will be wiped from his record. Those requirements also include reporting to a probation officer, abstaining from drugs and alcohol, and honoring a ban on weapons ownership.
Christina:
Warren, we’re going to take another break. When we return, our lightning round of ministry news of the week.
I’m Christina Cowden, with my co-host Warren Smith. More in a moment.
BREAK
THIRD SEGMENT
Christina:
Welcome back. I’m Christina Cowden, with my co-host Warren Smith and you’re listening to the MinistryWatch Podcast.
Warren, we like to use this last segment as a sort of lightning round of shorter news briefs.
What’s up first?
Warren:
In July 2021, Spoken Worldwide announced it had launched a three-year program with the Seed Company to provide 20 Bible translation projects for language groups whose primary means of communication is oral, not written.
As of March 2024, all of the 20 languages have been chosen and the translation projects started, according to Ed Weaver, president and CEO of Spoken Worldwide.
Weaver told MinistryWatch a number of the projects are taking place in countries that are hostile to the Gospel and thus cannot be revealed, but he named several others including Nigeria, Ghana, South Sudan, Zambia, Indonesia, and the Philippines.
To determine which languages it chose for oral translations, Spoken used The All Access List from Every Tribe Every Nation—a list of those without a Bible of any kind in their heart language.
Weaver said he expects that the New Testament equivalent of the first four translations will be completed by 2026.
Christina:
And what’s our next story?
Warren:
It’s a new month, and we have a new list.
We have a list of the 50 largest evangelism and discipleship ministries, according to the MinistryWatch database.
We typically see little movement among the top ministries on this year’s list. Cru is so much larger than the others, so it has been in the number one spot for the five years we have been publishing this list.
However, number two Young Life continues to grow significantly, though its rate of growth slowed from the dramatic $100 million growth spurt it showed last year. The Fellowship of Christian Athletes also increased by $20 million, or more than 10 percent from the previous year.
We also see seven new ministries on this year’s list. They are Crossway/Good News Publishers (20), Orange/The Rethink Group (25), Josiah Venture (32), Revival Today (45), Community Bible Study (46), Cadence International (48), New Song Ministries (49), and Mission Arlington/Mission Metroplex (50).
That means, of course, a like number of ministries fell off the list. They include Anabaptist Foundation, Mennonite Brethren Foundation, Operation Mobilization, Tim Tebow Foundation, Crown Financial Ministries, Institute for Creation Research, and Youth for Christ International.
You can see the complete list at MinistryWatch.com
Christina:
And who is in our Ministry Spotlight this week?
Warren:
Kairos Prison Ministry. We focused on this ministry because it has dropped out of the ECFA. The nonprofit also does not release its Form 990s to the public.
In light of the organization’s ECFA membership change and lack of 990 information, Kairos now has a MinistryWatch Donor Confidence Score of 48, an “Exercise Caution” designation.
While the organization does make some audited financial statements available on its website, these statements don’t provide the full scope of financial information a 990 would, like the salaries of its board members and executives.
According to its 2023 audited financial statement, Kairos had revenue of $6.8 million.
Kairos declined to provide a comment for the story.
Christina:
And who did we highlight in Ministries Making a Difference?
Warren:
Samaritan’s Purse has committed to donate an additional 20 armored ambulances to Israel’s emergency services system in honor of three American Israeli men killed by Hamas. This is on top of the 22 ambulances and two medic stations already committed. Samaritan’s Purse is also deploying tractor trailers with disaster relief supplies to five U.S. cities hit hard by Hurricane Helene.
Trail Life, a Christ-centered scouting program that aims to “grow godly men,” continues to see a massive growth surge in new members after Boy Scouts of America changed its name to Scouting America back in May. This fall, as students head back to school and Trail Life gears up for a new season, 5,000 new members have joined the ranks, eclipsing the ministry’s 60,000-member mark. Trail Life is one of our top rated ministries, with a donor confidence score of 98.
Christina:
Warren, any final thoughts before we go?
Warren:
Webinar: October 24. Understanding MinistryWatch’s Rating System.
Christina:
The producer for today’s program is Jeff McIntosh. We get database and other technical support from Stephen DuBarry, Rod Pitzer, and Casey Sudduth. Writers who contributed to today’s program include Kim Roberts, Bob Smietana, Tony Mator, Brittany Smith—and you, Warren.
I’m Christina Darnell, in Charlotte, North Carolina, in for Natasha Cowden this week.
Warren:
And I’m Warren Smith, also in Charlotte, North Carolina.
Christina:
You’ve been listening to the MinistryWatch podcast. Until next time, may God bless you.

Oct 2, 2024 • 16min
Ep. 402: Leaving The Network: A Conversation with Reporter Kim Roberts
The Network is a group of churches started by Steve Morgan, a pastor who began his career as part of the Vineyard USA association of churches, but left that group to start his network of churches in 2006.
Until recently, the network had 26 member churches. Morgan is the lead pastor of Joshua Church in Austin, Texas. But in the past few months, families and even some churches have been speaking out about the practices of Morgan and The Network.
Today, we talk with reporter Kim Roberts, who has been covering The Network for MinistryWatch. Below is a transcript of that conversation.
Warren
Your story begins with a woman named Melanie and her estrangement from her daughter that she believes is because of The Network.
Before we talk more about Melanie, I want to mention that we use only her first name in today’s story. It is generally the practice of MinistryWatch to only use named sources. In this instance, because Melanie is trying to strike a balance between warning others and maintaining the possibility of reconciliation with her daughter, we agreed to only use her first name.
So, with that said, what can you tell me about Melanie’s story?
Kim
Melanie raised her children in a Christian home. So she was happy her daughter was getting involved in church while at college. But then she noticed their conversations change. Her daughter started to seem disconnected.
Warren
Then she really became disconnected.
Kim
She did. Melanie said that she hasn’t heard her daughter’s voice in two years. Her eldest daughter cut off contact with her on November 29, 2022, after Melanie expressed concerns about her daughter’s church and its practices. She sent her daughter a link to a website with stories of heartbreak from people affiliated with The Network.
Warren
Her daughter had joined Foundation Church, a Network church led by Justin Major, while she was a junior at Illinois State University.
Kim
That’s right, and this was not the first time she had disconnected from the family. Not long after her 21stbirthday in 2017, Melanie’s daughter announced she would be getting married to a young man she had just met. They were married within 10 days of meeting.
Six months later, Melanie received a text that her daughter and new son-in-law would need time to themselves and would have no contact with Melanie and her family for a year.
Warren
Melanie and her husband agreed to respect their daughter’s wishes and after about a year, they got together and things started to improve, Melanie said. What happened next?
Kim
In January 2020, Melanie helped after the arrival of her first grandbaby. While she loved spending time with her daughter and her family, Melanie was soon told not to send any text messages to her daughter without including her son-in-law also.
When she was in the area, Melanie asked to have lunch with her daughter but that was “not allowed.”
Warren
Despite the continued inexplicable boundaries and family strain, Melanie again helped when the second grandbaby arrived in May 2022. During the visit, Melanie said the two had good conversations, and she was optimistic that healing was occurring.
Kim
Then in October 2022, when Melanie was on her way to visit her father for his birthday, she offered to drop by so her eldest grandchild could sign the card to his great-grandfather.
Her daughter’s response was “upsetting” and “bizarre.” “I respectfully decline your request,” her daughter wrote in a text response, claiming the child didn’t know Melanie’s father.
Her daughter didn’t join the family Thanksgiving celebration that year and a few days later, Melanie shared her concerns about The Network of churches to which her daughter’s church belonged.
Warren
That was in 2022. And that’s her texts were blocked and communication ceased.
And in your story, Kim, you wrote something really interesting. Quoting Melanie, you wrote:
“I feel like if you have a close family, they will try to put a wedge there. They want to eliminate the family as a threat. The pastor becomes the father figure.”
Kim
That’s right, and that idea is a part of Melanie’s motivation to expose The Network.
Melanie began searching online and found similar stories. She wanted to warn others, so she created Families Against Cults on Campus (FACC). That effort includes a You Tube page with content about The Network, including testimonials.
Warren
The YouTube channel has gotten tens of thousands of views. So it is starting to get noticed.
What else can you tell me?
Kim
The leadership structure of Network churches and the alleged emphasis of the principle of “obeying your leaders in all things” is a red flag for the several dozen families who have joined FACC. They hope to stop the inflow of new recruits into Network churches, which are often planted near college campuses where they recruit members.
The FACC members have all been negatively impacted by connections to Network churches. In many cases, family members have cut off contact with them without explanation.
Warren
Can you give me another example?
Kim
Lori Hallatt is still hoping for a restored relationship with her son. She hasn’t had a conversation with him since May 2023 when he texted that he “needed distance” and would “reach out when ready.”
Warren
Lori Hallatt posted her testimonial on the Leaving The Network website. Can you read a portion of it?
Kim
She wrote this:
“I have come to discover in talking with others who have left the Network, this type of family division is not unique to my family; in fact it is quite prevalent. I have spent hours on the phone in recent weeks talking with other parents who have also been cut off from their family members who attend Network churches.”
Warren
And at least in this situation, there seems to be a bit of a break.
Kim
Now her son has reached out and asked his parents to come visit for a conversation on October 7. Hallatt will drive 10 hours in hopes that she can have a relationship with her son again.
Warren
Kim, I first heard about The Network when I got an email from a man named Andrew Lumpe. What can you tell me about his story?
Kim
Andrew Lumpe had been involved in three different Network churches since its inception. He had served in leadership roles, including serving on boards of elders.
In 2019 he raised concerns to leaders in The Network about Steve Morgan’s background. Morgan had been arrested for aggravated criminal sodomy in 1987 while serving as a youth leader for the Reformed Latter-Day Saints. The case against Morgan was ultimately diverted.
Lumpe said Network leadership declined to conduct an investigation, so he and his wife left. They were shunned by many previous friends.
Warren
Since leaving, Lumpe says he has learned of hundreds and even thousands of individuals who have been negatively impacted by The Network.
An online forum, Leaving the Network, was created to “platform the stories of those who have left Steve Morgan’s Network of Churches and to create a public record of the inner workings and history of The Network.”
Kim
The Leaving the Network group has heard from many families who noticed rapid changes in loved ones who became involved in a Network church. Examples include drastic personality changes, loss of interest in hobbies, significant financial commitment to the church, abrupt priority shifts, Network gatherings prioritized over family celebrations, and increased control of their lives by Network leaders.
Warren
This activism seems to be having an impact.
Kim
During the process of raising awareness about alleged problems in The Network, four churches have announced their departure from the Network of churches.
On August 31, Isaiah Church in Madison, Wisconsin, posted a statement saying it was formally disassociating from The Network because of an inability to resolve concerns about “leadership theology, church governance, and past decisions with network leadership.”
“It has come to the point that we believe we have exhausted all avenues and withdrawing from the network is the appropriate action for Isaiah Church due to our biblical convictions,” the statement continued.
Warren
On September 8, Vine Church in Carbondale, Illinois—a church founded by Morgan—posted a statement saying it would now be an independent, local church and no longer part of The Network.
The same day, North Pines Church in Kalamazoo, Michigan posted a similar statement that its board of overseers had “unanimously decided to end our affiliation with our prior church network.”
Kim
About a week later, a fourth church — Hosea Church in Raleigh, North Carolina — announced it had “lovingly ended [its] official association with that network due to differing theological positions regarding leadership and local church governance.”
Warren
The Leaving The Network group wasn’t wholly satisfied by these departures.
Kim
The Leaving the Network website said none of these churches addressed the “call to action” by former leaders from Network churches, which calls for an investigation into Morgan’s arrest, any potential victims of abuse, concealment, abusive systems, and leader behaviors.
Warren
Now, Kim, here at MinistryWatch, we try to get both sides of the story. Did you reach out to The Network and attempt to get its side?
Kim
MinistryWatch reached out to Joshua Church in Austin where Steve Morgan is lead pastor to ask for comment, but we did not receive a reply.
Warren
Kim, thanks for this fascinating story. And please keep us posted if you hear of any new developments.
Kim
Will do.
Warren
That brings to a close this EXTRA episode of the MinistryWatch podcast. As I mentioned earlier, this story about The Network came to us from Andrew Lumpe, a reader of MinistryWatch. If you have a story you’d like to see us cover, we’d like to hear from you. You can send your email to info@ministrywatch.com
Thanks to Kim Roberts for being with me on this week’s EXTRA episode.
The producer for today’s program is Jeff McIntosh.
Until next time, may God bless you.

Sep 27, 2024 • 29min
Ep. 401: Steve Lawson, Steve Morgan and The Network, and Vince Bantu
On today’s program, longtime pastor Steve Lawson was removed as pastor of Trinity Bible Church in Dallas over an ‘inappropriate relationship’ with a woman…now, ministries are dropping the author and teaching fellow as ripples of his affair spread. We’ll take a look.
And, devastated families share stories of being cut off by adult children involved in The Network—an association of churches started by Steve Morgan. We’ll have details.
Plus, two prominent pastors announce their plans for retirement.
But first, Fuller Seminary Professor Vince Bantu is being accused of a secret second marriage. Covenant Seminary in St. Louis, Missouri, the denominational seminary for the Presbyterian Church in America (PCA), acknowledged that former professor Vince Bantu engaged in an inappropriate relationship with a student during his tenure there.
The producer for today’s program is Jeff McIntosh. We get database and other technical support from Stephen DuBarry, Rod Pitzer, and Casey Sudduth. Writers who contributed to today’s program include Kim Roberts, Jessica Eturralde, Tony Mator, Mallory Challis, G. Jeffrey MacDonald, Daniel Ritchie, Marci Seither, Aaron Earls, Brittany Smith, and Christina Darnell.
A special thanks to Baptist News Global for contributing material for this week’s podcast.
Until next time, may God bless you.
MANUSCRIPT
FIRST SEGMENT
Warren:
Hello everybody. I’m Warren Smith, coming to you from Charlotte, North Carolina.
Natasha:
And I’m Natasha Cowden, coming to you from Denver, Colorado. And we’d like to welcome you to the MinistryWatch podcast.
Warren:
On today’s program, longtime pastor Steve Lawson was removed as pastor of Trinity Bible Church in Dallas over an ‘inappropriate relationship’ with a woman…now, ministries are dropping the author and teaching fellow as ripples of his affair spread. We’ll take a look.
And, devastated families share stories of being cut off by adult children involved in The Network—an association of churches started by Steve Morgan. We’ll have details.
Plus, two prominent pastors announce their plans for retirement.
Natasha:
But first, Fuller Seminary Professor Vince Bantu is being accused of a secret second marriage.
Warren:
Covenant Seminary in St. Louis, Missouri, the denominational seminary for the Presbyterian Church in America (PCA), acknowledged that former professor Vince Bantu engaged in an inappropriate relationship with a student during his tenure there.
The incident arose because of an investigative article published in Christianity Today about Bantu’s alleged secret marriage.
Covenant said after the student filed a Title IX complaint against Bantu, the seminary confronted him, he confessed to the relationship, and he resigned from his position in 2018.
Natasha:
But he didn’t stop teaching.
Warren:
That’s right, Bantu joined the faculty of Fuller Seminary in 2019 as an associate professor of church history and black church studies.
Covenant said they were contacted by Fuller about the reason for his departure and they “shared with Fuller Seminary all the details of what had happened in 2018.
Natasha:
He doesn’t just teach at Fuller, he’s also a pastor.
Warren:
Bantu left his co-pastoring position at Outpour Community Church shortly after the Covenant complaint, and founded a new church, Beloved Community Church. He also began meeting with two other pastors as part of an accountability group.
Those pastors, Darren Young and Thurman Williams, met with Bantu regularly to provide moral support and mutual discipleship. Young and Williams told CT about Bantu’s alleged secret marriage to a second wife based on conversations with him during accountability meetings. They said he argued that one way for him to avoid sexual temptation was to marry multiple women.
Natasha:
Is Fuller doing anything about these allegations?
Warren:
General Counsel Lance Griffin said in a statement.“Fuller Seminary is committed to thoroughly investigating any allegations of inappropriate conduct,We are aware of these allegations and can confirm an internal investigation is underway.”
Natasha:
Along similar lines, leaders respond to Steven Lawson’s moral disqualification.
Warren:
Last week, MinistryWatch reported that Trinity Bible Church of Dallas had “indefinitely removed” its lead pastor Steven J. Lawson “from all ministry activities” due to an “inappropriate relationship” with a woman.
Lawson has been a leading figure in evangelical circles. In addition to pastoring at Trinity, Lawson is the founder of OnePassion Ministries. He was professor of preaching and dean of D.Min. studies at The Master’s Seminary (TMS), and frequently preached for John MacArthur’s Grace Community Church (GCC) and its conferences.
Shortly following Trinity’s announcement (Sept. 20), both GCC and TMS scrubbed Lawson from their websites, but have yet to formally address Lawson’s moral failure.
Natasha:
How has the church responded?
Warren:
On Sunday, Trinity Bible Church of Dallas Elder Mark Becker addressed his congregation for the first time since Lawson’s dismissal.
He acknowledged the emotional and difficult week following Lawson’s removal, and noted that while questions persist, the focus will be on how the church will move forward. He gave no further information on the nature of Lawson’s moral failure.
Natasha:
Lets look at one more story before we take our first break, what do you have?
Warren:
Less than two months ago, Pastor Rodney Finch told his Calvary Chapel Cary congregation in Apex, North Carolina, “The time for me to go is now.”
Finch’s resignation came amid an uproar over the discovery he had listed the church property for sale without telling anyone—the latest in a long string of alleged scandals, lies, secrets and financial missteps.
But on Sept. 22, Finch was back in the pulpit. And the pastors he’d tapped to replace him were gone, having announced their own resignations the previous Sunday.
Natasha:
What happened?
Warren:
In audio obtained by MinistryWatch, Finch addressed church members after the service to explain his return. He admitted that, behind closed doors, he had made a deal with the other pastors, Ralf Stores and Scott Burrell, that he would not relinquish his authority until the church agreed to a plan to fund his retirement, using profits from the future sale of the church.
Then, when the leadership offered Finch a payout amount, he refused to sign what he called “almost like blackmail,” because the contract required him to simultaneously surrender his authority rather than quit at a later time of his choosing.
Natasha:
Finch railed against the former board and pastors for suspecting him of attempting to secretly form a limited liability company to steal money from the sale of the church. Their treatment of him, he claimed, had helped push him out the door.
Warren:
He said, “I had had it, I am not the guy who ever even wanted to be a pastor, to be quite honest with you. I have been serving the Lord in this church for 30 years out of total obedience to God. I don’t need it. I didn’t want it. I don’t need it.”
As previously reported by MinistryWatch, those 30 years have been mired by a host of issues, such as soliciting funds for a new church building that was never built and keeping budget information and even the church by-laws hidden from his own team. Another scandal was Finch’s long struggle with a drug addiction he hid from his congregation even as he pushed the board to cover $50,000 of a luxury rehabilitation program—which he then quit without telling the church.
Natasha:
Warren, let’s take a quick break. When we return, parents devastated when their children cut off contact after getting involved in Network churches.
I’m Natasha Cowden, along with my co-host Warren Smith, and we’ll have that story and much more, after this short break.
BREAK
SECOND SEGMENT
Natasha:
Welcome back. I’m Natasha Cowden, along with my co-host Warren Smith, and you’re listening to the MinistryWatch podcast.
Next, the story we promised before the break…
Warren:
The Network is…well…a network of churches was started by Steve Morgan, a pastor who began his career as part of the Vineyard USA association of churches, but left that group to start The Network in 2006.
Until recently, the network had 26 member churches. Morgan is the lead pastor of Joshua Church in Austin, Texas. But a number of churches have recently left The Network, and that has generated scrutiny about Morgan and his organization.
Natasha:
And you’ve got a specific example of those concerns.
Warren,
Yes, we heard from one mother who says churches in The Network operate in a cult-like manner. Some of those behaviors resulted in her become estranged from her daughter and son-in-law.
This mother, Melanie, began searching online and found similar stories. She wanted to warn others, so Families Against Cults on Campus (FACC) was born and began creating content, including testimonials.
The YouTube channel has gotten tens of thousands of views.
By the way, we use only Melanie’s first name because she fears retribution.
Natasha:
An online forum, Leaving the Network, was created to “platform the stories of those who have left Steve Morgan’s Network of Churches and to create a public record of the inner workings and history of The Network.”
Warren:
The Leave the Network group has heard from many families who noticed rapid changes in loved ones who became involved in a Network church. Examples include drastic personality changes, loss of interest in hobbies, significant financial commitment to the church, abrupt priority shifts, Network gatherings prioritized over family celebrations, and increased control of their lives by Network leaders.
MinistryWatch reached out to Joshua Church in Austin where Steve Morgan is lead pastor to ask for comment, but we did not receive a reply before time of publication.
Natasha:
Next is the latest from Kanakuk Camps.
Warren:
“Protect Children. Support Survivors. Protest Pete Newman’s Parole!” are the opening lines readers will see when they click on the new website, protestpetesparole.com.
As the September 25 parole hearing for serial child sexual abuser Peter Newman approached, survivors and advocates call for support in urging the Missouri Department of Corrections Board and Parole to deny his possible release. Previously, survivors and advocates have urged concerned citizens to write letters to the parole board expressing their grievances regarding Newman’s crimes.
Natasha:
How is this website involved?
Warren:
This new website offers visitors a way to fill out an online form to submit their letters directly to the parole board. The form includes the option to submit an editable pre-loaded statement or follow a template to craft your own.
In addition to letter-writing, the website also links to a petition against Newman’s parole, which will be “submitted to the Missouri Parole Board as part of Newman’s hearing.”
Natasha:
How is his parole possible?
Warren:
Despite being sentenced to two life terms plus 30 years — a total of 90 years, with 30 counting for each life sentence — Newman is eligible for parole after serving just 15.
Natasha:
Now that the parole hearing has taken place, what can be expected next?
Warren:
After a hearing, the parole board typically takes eight to 12 weeks to come to a decision. If Newman’s parole is denied, he will be eligible for a reconsideration hearing every one to five years until a release date is established. The new website reminds viewers that all evidence from the Sept. 25 hearing can be used in future hearings, including contributions to the petition as supporters continue to sign.
Natasha:
Our next story has to do with helping Churches keep their buildings.
Warren:
As many as 100,000 church-owned buildings are expected to be sold or repurposed by 2030, according to an analysis by the Hartford Institute for Religion Research.
Though Sunday attendance has recovered in part from COVID-19 restrictions, a decades-long decline has continued to take its toll, and the squeeze on churches has only gotten tighter in the post-pandemic economy.
As a result, congregations face hard choices about what to do with large sacred structures that are underutilized, costly to keep up and suffering from deferred maintenance.
Natasha:
But a recent gathering of churches hopes to make a difference
Warren:
100 church leaders and congregants who gathered online and in person Friday and Saturday (Sept. 20-21) to hear from a lineup of real estate experts about how to reimagine a new future for church buildings. The Future of Church Property conference, organized by Princeton Theological Seminary, focused on turning community needs into grants, partnerships with developers and new business-driven income streams.
Natasha:
What were some of the take-aways from the conference?
Warren:
Congregations were urged to consider social enterprise, a term for using business principles to address social problems while generating revenue. Attendees heard about congregations that had escaped financial dire straits and galvanized new ministry momentum by leasing space to the public for community and commercial use.
The assembled church leaders were directed to resources such as the Good Futures Accelerator course from Rooted Good for other ideas on how to forward their missions while raising revenue.
Natasha:
And some churches have used their property to help with the housing crisis.
Warren:
Churches with land or buildings that can be developed into housing have huge opportunities in the current housing crisis. Take Arlington Presbyterian Church, for example, across the Potomac River from Washington, which built 173 affordable housing units, working with a nonprofit developer who pieced together $71 million in direct funding and tax breaks for the project from multiple sources.
The project not only allowed the congregation to keep a presence at its location, but it also spawned new energy for the congregation as it has mobilized to reach out to its new community and serve its needs.
Natasha:
Warren, we’re going to take another break. When we return, our lightning round of ministry news of the week.
I’m Natasha Cowden, with my co-host Warren Smith. More in a moment.
BREAK
THIRD SEGMENT
Natasha:
Welcome back. I’m Natasha Cowden, with my co-host Warren Smith and you’re listening to the MinistryWatch Podcast.
Warren, we like to use this last segment as a sort of lightning round of shorter news briefs.
What’s up first?
Warren:
Pastor, author and radio personality Chuck Swindoll announced he will preach his final sermon as pastor in October.
Swindoll has been pastoring at Stonebriar Community Church in Frisco, Texas, since 1998.
Still, at almost 90 years old, Swindoll insists his age will not keep him from continuing to serve in other ministry-related capacities.
Swindoll will turn his attention to his broadcast ministry, Insight For Living, which he has led and preached with for over 45 years.
Jonathan Murphy, the former chair of Pastoral Ministries at Dallas Theological Seminary, will now serve as Stonebriar’s senior pastor.
Natasha:
What’s next?
Warren:
Sunday, September 22, marked the 19th anniversary of Pastor Steve Gaines’ leadership at Bellevue Baptist Church in Cordova, Tennessee. It also marked a new transition for one of America’s largest Southern Baptist churches—finding a new pastor to lead the 30,000-member congregation.
Gaines read a letter from the pulpit announcing his retirement. He said, “My race as senior pastor of Bellevue is coming to an end, but my commitment to you is to keep running with all my strength and effectively hand the baton to the next senior pastor,”
Gaines, 66, served Southern Baptist churches in Alabama and Texas before coming to the Memphis area of Tennessee to pastor Bellevue Baptist Church. Gaines served as SBC president from 2016 to 2018. He is also former president of the Tennessee Baptist Pastors Conference.
Gaines assured them he is not leaving or retiring, but simply changing direction.
Gaines said he plans to travel more and minister at different churches as an itinerant preacher. Bellevue will remain his ministry’s home base. The couple also looks forward to spending more time with their four adult children and 18 grandchildren.
Natasha:
Next, More Americans are dying of opioid abuse, but fewer churches are serving those with opioid addictions
Warren:
A Lifeway Research study found Protestant pastors say their church is currently serving people with opioid addictions, but that support is primarily spiritual. Almost 3 in 4 (72%) offer spiritual support including prayer or discipleship. Fewer say they’re providing physical support including food, shelter or clothing (41%) or a 12-step program or other support groups for substance abuse (32%). Around 1 in 5 (21%) say they aren’t doing any of these, while 1% aren’t sure.
Statistically fewer churches today say they are offering spiritual support, down 10 percentage points from 82% in 2018, or substance abuse support groups, down 8 points from 40%.
Natasha:
And who is in our Ministry Spotlight this week?
Warren:
Avant Ministries, headquartered in Kansas City, Missouri, no longer makes its Form 990 public.
According to its Guidestar profile, the organization is now classified as a church.
Because it does not make its Form 990 or its audited financial statements public, Avant’s Donor Confidence Score is now a “Withhold Giving” designation of 36 with a D Transparency Grade.
According to limited financial information from its ECFA profile, Avant Ministries’ revenue was $26.9 million in 2023. Its total expenses were $25.4 million with $25.4 million in net assets.
The ministry’s website states it is “an interdenominational, multinational missionary sending organization that has focused on planting and developing churches in the unreached areas of the world since the 1890s.”
Natasha:
And who did we highlight in Ministries Making a Difference?
Warren:
On September 28, Elim Christian Services is hosting its annual Dutch Fest, complete with Dutch fare, wooden shoe dancers, reptile shows, petting zoo, train rides, and Elim’s Dutch Village shops. All proceeds go to Elim, which serves Illinois youth and adults with disabilities through its school and other programs. Elim also offers consulting services to schools who need expertise in special education. Elim Christian Services has 5 stars, an “A” transparency grade, and a donor confidence score of 100—the highest in each of MinistryWatch’s three database categories.
Five hundred and fifty kids participated in Miracle Hill Ministries’ Kids Ninja Challenge, running a ninja obstacle course to raise $140,000 for the South Carolina ministry. Miracle Hill provides the most comprehensive homeless services in the state. Other areas of service include children’s foster care program and an addiction recovery program. Miracle Hill Ministries has 4 stars and an “A” transparency grade in the MinistryWatch database, and a donor confidence score of 90.
Natasha:
Warren, any final thoughts before we go?
Warren:
8 Tales of Transformation
Webinar: October 24. Understanding MinistryWatch’s Rating System.
Natasha:
The producer for today’s program is Jeff McIntosh. We get database and other technical support from Stephen DuBarry, Rod Pitzer, and Casey Sudduth. Writers who contributed to today’s program include Kim Roberts, Jessica Eturralde, Tony Mator, Mallory Challis, G. Jeffrey MacDonald, Daniel Ritchie, Marci Seither, Aaron Earls, Brittany Smith, and Christina Darnell.
A special thanks to Baptist News Global for contributing material for this week’s podcast.
I’m Natasha Cowden, in Denver, Colorado.
Warren:
And I’m Warren Smith in Charlotte, North Carolina.
Natasha:
You’ve been listening to the MinistryWatch podcast. Until next time, may God bless you.

Sep 26, 2024 • 5min
Ep. 400: New Website Campaigns Against Kanakuk Sex Abuser Pete Newman’s Opportunity for Parole
“Protect Children. Support Survivors. Protest Pete Newman’s Parole!” are the opening lines readers will see when they click on the new website, protestpetesparole.com.
As the September 25 parole hearing for serial child sexual abuser Peter Newman quickly approaches, survivors and advocates continue to call for support in urging the Missouri Department of Corrections Board and Parole to deny his possible release. Previously, survivors and advocates have urged concerned citizens to write letters to the parole board expressing their grievances regarding Newman’s crimes.
This new website reminds viewers of these instructions. It also offers viewers a way to fill out an online form to submit their letters directly to the parole board. The form includes the option to submit an editable pre-loaded statement or follow a template to craft your own.
In addition to letter-writing, the website also links to a petitionagainst Newman’s parole, which will be “submitted to the Missouri Parole Board as part of Newman’s hearing.”
Despite being sentenced to two life terms plus 30 years — a total of 90 years, with 30 counting for each life sentence — Newman is eligible for parole after serving just 15. This is the minimum portion of his sentence that must be completed, according to RSMo 217.690 which mandates that offenders serving multiple sentences totaling 45 or more years must complete at least 50% of one sentence before parole eligibility.
After a hearing, the parole board typically takes eight to 12 weeks to come to a decision. If Newman’s parole is denied, he will be eligible for a reconsideration hearing every one to five years until a release date is established. The new website reminds viewers that all evidence from the Sept. 25 hearing can be used in future hearings, including contributions to the petition as supporters continue to sign.
Access to MinistryWatch content is free. However, we hope you will support our work with your prayers and financial gifts. To make a donation, click here.
In the event Newman were to be granted parole, he would go to an offender treatment program for “approximately 12 months of therapy and a Sex Offender Assessment Process,” designed to help offenders reintegrate into regular society and prevent recidivism, the website explains.
However, survivors and advocates note concerns regarding his ability to avoid returning to abuse.
According to Elizabeth Carlock Phillips’ statement, while the prosecution estimates Newman’s victim count to be in the hundreds, “clinical experts estimate (the count) to be between 2,000 and 5,000 due to the patterns of his perpetration, (his) amount of unfettered access and time with children year-round and the victim count known at sentencing.” She argues the impact of his crimes is far deeper than a simple felony charge, calling him a “murderer” who “butchered the souls of boys with his deceit and abuse, some even to their graves.”
Phillips’ submitted her statement on behalf of her late brother, Trey Carlock, who died by suicide due to the traumatic effects of his abuse by Newman. She says Trey was “silenced to his grave” by Newman’s abuse compounded by further civil litigations, which included a Non-Disclosure Agreement.
This article was originally published by Baptist News Global. It is reprinted with permission.

Sep 25, 2024 • 16min
Ep. 399: What’s Going On With Evangelical Giving?
Giving is down among evangelical Christians, according to a new study by Infinity Concepts and Grey Matter Research.
The study—called The Giving Gap: Changes in Evangelical Generosity— found that 61% of evangelicals say they gave to their church in the last 12 months. That is down 13 percentage points from 2021 when 74% reported giving to their local congregation.
On today’s podcast, we unpack the results of that survey with one of its authors, Mark Driestadt. He’s the president of Infinity Concepts and someone I’ve come to know and respect over the past few years as one of the “wise men” in ministry fundraising, marketing and communications. Here’s our conversation, which we had via zoom last week.
The producer for today’s program is Jeff McIntosh. I’m Warren Smith. Until next time, may God bless you.

Sep 20, 2024 • 28min
Ep. 398: Bible Society of India, Alistair Begg, Morningstar Fellowship
On today’s program, the former president of Bible Society of India has been arrested for financial corruption related to his position at another ministry…raising questions about how he handled finances at the Bible Society. We’ll take a look.
And, an Illinois pastor has made it his mission to provide his community access to healthy food…by setting up a low-cost grocery store in a food desert.
Also, Alistair Begg announces his 20-25 retirement.
But first, Morningstar Fellowship Church in South Carolina is facing two more lawsuits that are alleging sexual abuse. Two more lawsuits have been filed against MorningStar Fellowship Church in Fort Mill, S.C., and its leaders for not reporting sexual abuse allegations to law enforcement.
The producer for today’s program is Jeff McIntosh. We get database and other technical support from Stephen DuBarry, Rod Pitzer, and Casey Sudduth. Writers who contributed to today’s program include Kim Roberts, Jessica Eturralde, Bethany Starin, Tony Mator, Aaron Earls, Brittany Smith, Christina Darnell—and you, Warren.
A special thanks to Lifeway Research for contributing material for this week’s podcast.
Until next time, may God bless you.
MANUSCRIPT
FIRST SEGMENT
Warren:
Hello everybody. I’m Warren Smith, coming to you from Charlotte, North Carolina.
Natasha:
And I’m Natasha Cowden, coming to you from Denver, Colorado. And we’d like to welcome you to the MinistryWatch podcast.
Warren:
On today’s program, the former president of Bible Society of India has been arrested for financial corruption related to his position at another ministry…raising questions about how he handled finances at the Bible Society. We’ll take a look.
And, an Illinois pastor has made it his mission to provide his community access to healthy food…by setting up a low-cost grocery store in a food desert.
Also, Alistair Begg announces his 20-25 retirement.
Natasha:
But first, Morningstar Fellowship Church in South Carolina is facing two more lawsuits that are alleging sexual abuse.
Warren:
Two more lawsuits have been filed against MorningStar Fellowship Church in Fort Mill, S.C., and its leaders for not reporting sexual abuse allegations to law enforcement.
A previous lawsuit was filed on August 7 against MorningStar and its leaders alleging that Erickson Lee used his access to children through the church’s “Young Special Forces” program to groom and eventually abuse children in the church.
Lee was arrested in May on charges of criminal sexual conduct with a minor and on September 5 entered into an offered plea deal to serve nine years in prison, according to Randy Hood, attorney for the plaintiffs.
Natasha:
What are these new lawsuits?
Warren:
Two more alleged victims have come forward to seek accountability for their abuse from Morningstar Fellowship Church and its leaders.
All of the lawsuits have been filed anonymously by John Doe #1, John Doe #2, and John Doe #3 who are now over age 18, but were 13 years old when the alleged abuse began.
Leaders named in the lawsuit include Rick Joyner, David Yarns, and Erickson Lee’s father, Douglas Lee, who was the former head of security for the church.
“This is about accountability and responsibility,” Hood said. “Churches have to create policies and procedures to protect children. They need to monitor and supervise people who are over children.”
Natasha:
Because of previous allegations of sexual assault at MorningStar in the early 2000s, the lawsuits claim that Joyner, Yarns, and Lee knew of the risks and had a duty and opportunity to protect vulnerable children from being exploited and abused while participating in the youth programs at MorningStar.
Warren:
Instead, the lawsuit asserts, the leadership ignored “signs of provision of alcohol and pornography to minors and signs of sexual exploitation or abuse of minors by church staff, members, or volunteers.”
The claims against MorningStar and its leadership are for negligence, gross negligence, recklessness, civil conspiracy, and the intentional or reckless infliction of emotional distress.
Natasha:
Next, an official associated with the Bible Society of India was arrested for financial corruption.
Warren:
Last September, Anglican Bishop P.C. Singh, who served as the president of the Bible Society of India from 2019-2022, was arrested for criminal breach of trust, cheating, forging documents, and criminal conspiracy while transferring the government land given on lease to the Church of North India.
Singh is accused of selling land that didn’t belong to him for 30 million Rupees ($360,000) then keeping the money. He was later arrested again for money laundering charges. Singh was removed from leadership in the Church of North India in 2022.
Natasha:
How is that linked to the Bible Society?
Warren:
Rev. Chittranjan Polson, who served as auxiliary secretary for the Allahabad Auxiliary of the BSI, is uneasy about Singh’s former leadership role at BSI and whether he and his associate B.K. Patnaik might have been part of covering up financial irregularities Polson discovered while examining the auxiliary’s finances. According to social media posted by BSI, Singh was first elected as its president in 2019.
Polson brought these irregularities and concerns to the attention of the United Bible Societies (UBS) in July 2023. He reached out again in June of this year.
He says his service at the BSI auxiliary was terminated after he raised his concerns about the alleged corruption.
Natasha:
Did the United Bible Societies respond?
Warren:
After several requests over the course of a few weeks, UBS told MinistryWatch that “there has been no indication or evidence of financial misconduct involving BSI funds that would have triggered any internal reviews, either by the BSI or UBS…The BSI operates under a constitutionally established leadership structure, where the General Secretary, as Chief Executive Officer, is solely responsible for overseeing financial and administrative matters.”
UBS clarified that Singh’s position as president was honorary only with no financial authority at BSI but was removed from that position “after the controversy surrounding him became public,” which was in 2022.
Natasha:
Next up, a pastor has been sentenced for Fraud.
Warren:
A federal jury has sentenced Miracle Mansion CEO Michael Mandel Baldwin to two years of prison for using the mansion project to front an investment scheme.
On August 20, the jury sentenced Baldwin, 55, to 27 months in prison followed by three years of supervised release on charges of wire and securities fraud.
Natasha:
Can you give us some background?
Warren:
In October 2021, authorities arrested Baldwin for allegedly swindling members of a Charlotte, N.C., church out of hundreds of thousands of dollars. According to the indictment, he used that money to fund his personal lifestyle.
Court records say that Baldwin deceitfully obtained over $740,000 from investors by promising to use their funds for the development of the Miracle Mansion, including purchasing land.
According to court records, Baldwin misled prospective investors and victims by claiming that high-ranking administrators at Chick-fil-A and Hobby Lobby, as well as The Kennedy Center, had approved and backed Miracle Mansion. High-ranking officials from Hobby Lobby and Chick-fil-A, on the other hand, testified during the trial that they were unaware of Baldwin and his idea and did not endorse it, refuting Baldwin’s allegations.
While operating as the Miracle Mansion’s CEO, Baldwin was working as the assistant pastor and musical director for Crossroads Baptist Church in Northern Virginia, where his brother is senior pastor and his father is the church’s founder and pastor emeritus.
Natasha:
Warren, let’s take a quick break. When we return, Heavenly Square Grocery fills a gap in an Illinois food desert.
I’m Natasha Cowden, along with my co-host Warren Smith, and we’ll have that story and much more, after this short break.
BREAK
SECOND SEGMENT
Natasha:
Welcome back. I’m Natasha Cowden, along with my co-host Warren Smith, and you’re listening to the MinistryWatch podcast.
Next, the story we promised before the break…
Warren:
When you walk into Heavenly Square Grocery in Danville, Illinois, you’ll notice three things: it’s clean, everyone is friendly, and the food is priced fairly.
Heavenly Grocery opened its doors this past spring, on May 1, in a part of Vermilion County that’s considered a food desert.
Pastor Thomas Miller, pastor of New Life Church of Faith, which owns the shopping center where Heavenly Square Grocery is located said “There are 11,000 people in a 2-mile radius of our location, and they have no access to healthy food,” “The purpose for this location was that we saw a big need to support the community.”
Natasha:
Timothy Meneely, medical director of Carle Medical Office Center at The Riverfront in Danville. Noted that Illinois has 102 counties and Vermilion County ranks at 100 in the state for health outcomes. This grocery store is trying to make it easier to access healthy food for those who need it most.
Warren:
In addition to the grocery store, there is now a community garden, a mobile market that drives through main sections of the county, and a kids program that educates about health and diet.
They even worked with distributors to get Heavenly Square Grocery re-zoned, so pricing was lowered appropriately for the area’s needs.
Once Heavenly Square Grocery is turning a profit, Miller said he plans to use those funds to open a restaurant or a laundry mat, something that provides support to the community.
Natasha:
Our next story involves a defamation case
Warren:
The Supreme Court of Texas heard oral arguments this week related to the case of plaintiff Jane Roe suing Southwestern Baptist Seminary and its former President Paige Patterson for defamation related to a sexual assault she reportedly suffered in 2015.
Roe claims Paige Patterson provided false and defamatory information about her in an attempt to “defend [his] reputation” that were then produced in three separate publications.
The case was filed in federal district court, but on appeal the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Fifth Circuit certified two questions about Texas state law for the state’s highest civil appellate court to answer.
Natasha:
What are the questions?
Warren:
Can a person who supplies defamatory material for publication be liable for defamation?
If so, can a defamation plaintiff survive summary judgment by presenting evidence that a defendant was involved in preparing a defamatory publication, without identifying any specific statements made by the defendant?
Natasha:
What’s the background to this case?
Warren:
Roe was a student at Southwestern in 2015 when she claims to have reported an attack and rape on campus to then-President Paige Patterson. Issues about how Patterson’s comments about women and his handling of sexual assault charges eventually led to his termination as the seminary president.
There’s a lot more on this story and how the oral arguments and counterpoints to the two questions in our full story so I’d encourage you, if you’re interested to check it out on MinistryWatch.com
The Texas Supreme Court will send its opinion of these two questions to the Fifth Circuit for use in its review of the underlying federal case. The Texas Supreme Court will not decide the case on its merits.
Natasha:
Next, a southern California pastor has been arrested for child sex abuse.
Warren:
For three years, police in Ontario, California, had their sites on a local pastor suspected of child sexual assault, but lacked enough evidence to act.
Then in July, another alleged victim came forward.
On Sept. 5, police made their move, and as ChurchLeaders.com reports, 47-year-old Jose Alcides Vasquez was arrested at his home about 50 miles away in Menifee.
The eight charges against Vasquez include lewd and lascivious behavior with a child under 14, aggravated sexual assault of a child under 14, oral copulation with a child under 16, and two counts each of oral copulation with a child under 10 and sodomy of a child under 10.
The abuses allegedly occurred at Vasquez’ former residence in Ontario, and police believe he may have other victims.
Vasquez surrendered without incident and is being held on $500,000 bail at the West Valley Detention Center in Rancho Cucamonga.
Natasha:
Our next story has a similar theme.
Warren:
A Colorado Springs pastor MinistryWatch reported on a year ago has been sentenced and is serving time in prison.
Last September, investigators discovered that Jonathan Shaheen, 31, was exchanging explicit images of and with two underage girls—one 9 years old and the other 5 years old—through the girl’s mother, who was once his lover.
According to the arrest affidavit, Shaheen expressed interest in having sexual intercourse with the two children, as well as their mother, who texted the photos to Shaheen.
In 2022, police traced the texts to Shaheen while investigating the mother and her partner in New Mexico for exploiting children.
Natasha:
So what happened with that case:
Warren:
Judge Jill Brady sentenced Shaheen to two years in the Department of Corrections with a mandatory three-year parole upon release. He is not currently listed as a sex offender.
Natasha:
Warren, we’re going to take another break. When we return, our lightning round of ministry news of the week.
I’m Natasha Cowden, with my co-host Warren Smith. More in a moment.
BREAK
THIRD SEGMENT
Natasha:
Welcome back. I’m Natasha Cowden, with my co-host Warren Smith and you’re listening to the MinistryWatch Podcast.
Warren, we like to use this last segment as a sort of lightning round of shorter news briefs.
What’s up first?
Warren:
Truth for Life radio Bible teacher Alistair Begg announced his retirement as senior pastor of Parkside Church in Cleveland, Ohio.
Begg, 72, broke the news to his congregation Sunday, Sept. 8, giving a projected end date of Sept. 14, 2025.
The Scottish-born evangelical, well known for his radio broadcasts syndicated on over 1,800 networks across North America, explained the early announcement is intended “to make it clear [it] is not precipitous.” He also said the advance notice will help his “ambition to pass the baton safely into the hands of my successor” and will give the church “time to adjust to the prospect of and to prepare in a timely way for what this transition will mean.”
Natasha:
What’s next?
Warren:
Like other Americans, pastors are deciding who they’ll vote for in the November election.
Compared to previous elections, however, they’re much more hesitant to share their preference.
Almost all U.S. Protestant pastors (97%) plan to vote in the 2024 presidential election, according to a Lifeway Research study conducted Aug. 8-Sept. 3, 2024. But almost a quarter (23%) refused to answer the question of whom they’ll cast their ballot for.
Natasha:
But that means three-quarters of them did answer. What did they say?
Warren:
Among those who plan to vote and shared their preference, 50% say former President Donald Trump is their choice, while a quarter (24%) back Vice President Kamala Harris and 23% are undecided. No third-party candidate garnered more than 1% support.
Self-identified evangelical pastors are more likely to vote for Trump (61%), while half of mainline Protestant pastors (50%) say they support Harris.
Half of U.S. Protestant pastors (50%) say they are either a registered member or consider themselves to be a part of the Republican party. One in 5 (18%) are Democrats, and 25% say they’re independent.
Natasha:
Next up is MinistryWatch’s August Index.
Warren:
The MinistryWatch Index inched up slightly in August but has remained mostly flat this summer.
That said, the less than 1 percent increase, to 156, represents a new record for the index, which tracks revenue for 38 of the largest Christian ministries in the nation. On August 1, the revenue of these ministries was $9.9 billion.
Though there was no growth during July, this number represents 10.6 percent year-to-date.
Though the organizations in the MinistryWatch Index have continued to grow this year, that growth significantly lags last year’s rise. In 2023 the Index grew 24.1 percent. The relatively slow growth of the MinistryWatch Index for 2024 could suggest concern about the future of the economy.
A recent survey conducted by MinistryWatch of ministry executives found that fundraising has now replaced finding and recruiting staff as their top leadership concern. This concern seems well-founded. A recent survey found that giving by evangelicals is down.
Natasha:
And who is in our Ministry Spotlight this week?
Warren:
Orange, a children’s ministry that develops curriculum for churches, saw its Ministry Watch Donor Confidence Score (DCS) drop to a 55 this week. That takes it out of the “Give With Confidence” category and lowers it to the “Give With Caution.”
The DCS is based on 20 questions about how a ministry operates. Questions are weighted, and answers help determine a ministry’s overall score. Orange lost DCS points, in part, because it is not a member of the ECFA and does not have “at least four independent board members for every non-independent member.”
Natasha:
Those are not the only reasons to exercise caution, are they?
Warren:
In addition, the ministry has been in the news this year due to sexual abuse allegations against its founder Reggie Joiner. Back in April, both Joiner and CEO Kristen Ivy resigned unexpectedly from the organization—with Ivy disclosing a past inappropriate relationship with Joiner. A month after the resignation, Ivy accused Joiner of “clergy sexual abuse.”
In 2023, the ministry had a revenue of $27.2 million and its total expenses were $28.5 million. According to its 990s, Orange has spent more than it has made three of the last five years.
In 2023, Reggie Joiner collected a salary of $462,292, and Kristen Ivy received a salary of $357,709. Its board chair, Joel Manby, was paid $93,465.
Natasha:
And who did we highlight in Ministries Making a Difference?
Warren:
Highland Baptist Church in Waco, Texas, has opened its Wellness Center to the community on Mondays as an urgent care. Volunteer medical professionals offer services free of charge to treat non-life-threatening conditions, regardless of whether or not patients have health insurance. The church’s Wellness Center also offers courses in finance, ESL, citizenship, and birthing classes.
The Sunset International Bible Institute’s Adventures in Missions (AIM) program has partnered with Ultimate Escape to provide counseling on sexual trauma for young adults training to become missionaries. Steve and Holly Holladay—both of whom were victims of sexual abuse themselves—started Ultimate Escape in 2004 to address addictive sexual behaviors in teens, but have since expanded the ministry to help people of all ages with an added focus on sexual trauma.
Two foundations and a corporation are investing in Water Mission to help launch a professional water utility in Uganda. The Conrad N. Hilton Foundation, the Stone Family Foundation, and Georg Fischer Corporation are collaborating to provide safe water access to rural communities in the country’s Luuka District, where just 9% of people have access to safely managed drinking water services. Water Mission has 4 stars and an “A” transparency grade in the MinistryWatch database, and a donor confidence score of 100.
Ministries of Jesus raised $67,640 through its benefit golf scramble last month. MOJ provides holistic care to people in Oklahoma through medical care, dental clinics, licensed counseling, social services, and more. Ministries of Jesus has 5 stars and an “A” transparency grade in the MinistryWatch database, and a donor confidence score of 98.
Natasha:
Warren, any final thoughts before we go?
Warren:
8 Tales of Transformation
Webinar: Introduction to Intelligent Giving with Al Mueller of Excellence in Giving.
Natasha:
The producer for today’s program is Jeff McIntosh. We get database and other technical support from Stephen DuBarry, Rod Pitzer, and Casey Sudduth. Writers who contributed to today’s program include Kim Roberts, Jessica Eturralde, Bethany Starin, Tony Mator, Aaron Earls, Brittany Smith, Christina Darnell—and you, Warren.
A special thanks to Lifeway Research for contributing material for this week’s podcast.
I’m Natasha Cowden, in Denver, Colorado.
Warren:
And I’m Warren Smith in Charlotte, North Carolina.
Natasha:
You’ve been listening to the MinistryWatch podcast. Until next time, may God bless you.


