Positioning with April Dunford

In this episode, I talk about how to take your positioning and translate it into a powerful sales narrative. I cover the importance of testing your positioning and explain why it often fails to make the leap from marketing to sales. I analyze the software transaction process from the buyer's perspective and dive deep into the challenges buyers face when they encounter unfamiliar products. I also tell a personal story about buying a toilet, and share an encounter with a skillful toilet salesman who taught me invaluable lessons about guiding customers. — In This Episode, I Cover: (00:00) Welcome to the Positioning Show (00:15) Today’s topic: How to take your positioning and translate it into a sales narrative (00:50) The right way to test your positioning (03:00) Why I didn’t cover sales pitches in my book, Obviously Awesome (05:09) Why positioning often fails the jump from marketing to sales (06:26) Why product walkthroughs fall short (07:18) How to build a great sales pitch (08:20) Buying is hard (09:30) A story about the time I had to buy a toilet (13:34) Takeaways from my toilet search, and how it relates to buyers (14:21) How a typical software transaction goes (16:14) The product walkthrough from the buyer's perspective (17:12) What happens when the buyer gets overwhelmed (18:49) How a toilet salesman sold me on a toilet (22:54) What we’ve been taught in sales, and whether or not you should follow that advice (24:39) If you want to do a fantastic job of selling, you need to become a guide (25:49) What our positioning describes (26:10) What to expect in my next episode — Where To Find April Dunford: Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/ Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford — Referenced: • Obviously Awesome: https://www.aprildunford.com/books — Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

Today I’m joined by renowned author and guest, Matt Dixon. We explore the concepts from his groundbreaking book, "The JOLT Effect," and uncover the secrets to winning deals and captivating customers. Matt shares how extensive research debunked a myriad of popular sales techniques, including dialing up FOMO and letting the customer do the talking. We talk about how downplaying impact can actually boost your sales, no decision losses and why they happen, why you should avoid discounts and limited-time offers, and specific tactics to improve your first-call deck. Join us as we challenge conventional sales wisdom and offer fresh perspectives that will leave you questioning everything you thought you knew about successful sales strategies. — In This Episode, I Cover: (00:00) Welcome to the Positioning Show (00:15) About our guest Matt Dixon and his new book, The JOLT Effect (03:01) Behind the research for Matt’s book (8:00) Lessons on customer indecision (09:48) How dialing up FOMO increases the odds of losing the deal (12:27) Two reasons why no decision losses happen (15:58) The JOLT effect (19:46) Why your sales reps should offer specific recommendations (24:03) Why you should actually undersell the impact of your product (27:18) Debunking the myth that customers should do most of the talking (31:00) Discounts and limited-time offers (33:51) First-call deck recommendations (37:35) Matt’s company, DCM Insights, and how to get in touch — Where to Find Matt Dixon: Website: https://www.dixonspeaks.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/matthewxdixon/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/matthewxdixon Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/matthewxdixon/ Where To Find April Dunford: Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/ Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford — Referenced: • The Challenger Customer: Selling to the Hidden Influencer Who Can Multiply Your Results: https://www.amazon.com/Challenger-Customer-Selling-Influencer-Multiply/dp/1591848156 • The JOLT Effect: How High Performers Overcome Customer Indecision: https://www.amazon.com/dp/0593538102 • Tethr: https://tethr.com/ • The Dreamforce Conference: https://www.salesforce.com/dreamforce/ • DCM Insights: https://www.dcminsights.com/ • The JOLT Effect website: https://www.jolteffect.com/ — Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

In this episode, I go deep on one of my favorite topics: value. First, I’ll define value vs. differentiated value, and explain why the latter is key to everything. We'll explore how to find the right balance between features and value, and I'll share tips on mastering your product walkthrough and proving your claims to customers. I also cover common mistakes to avoid when segmenting your audience, the job of a market category, and how a strong understanding of your differentiated value will inform successful messaging that resonates with your customers. Lastly, I'll give you a sneak peek of my upcoming book on sales pitches.  — In This Episode, I Cover: (00:00) Welcome to the Positioning Show (00:15) Defining value (01:14) A story about Janna Systems and their biggest competitor, Siebel Systems (04:19) How one sales rep changes everything (07:35) How Janna Systems shifted their positioning and won over Siebel Systems (08:34) Customers don’t care about your features (10:28) Value vs. differentiated value and what really matters (13:15) Value buckets (14:06) Why value is hard to understand (16:06) Helping customers translate value on their own (18:21) Mastering your product walkthrough (20:00) The importance of proving your value to customers   (21:47) Finding your best-fit customer (23:50) Common mistakes to avoid  (25:11) Differentiated value and the job of a market category (27:43) How differentiated value informs messaging (29:30) A tease on sales pitches and my upcoming book (30:00) Thanks for listening, and please leave a review! — Where To Find Me: Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/  Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/  Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford — Referenced: • Janna Systems: https://www.crunchbase.com/organization/janna-systems-inc • Siebel Systems: https://www.oracle.com/cx/siebel/ — Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

Today I’m joined by Hana Abaza, an experienced SaaS Marketer. Most recently, Hana served as Shopify’s Global Head of Revenue Marketing where she helped them reach billions of dollars in revenue. In today’s episode, we discuss how Shopify successfully moved upmarket as they introduced Shopify Plus. We explore the competitive alternatives they faced, how they differentiated their offerings, and the importance of their partner influence program. Together we cover storytelling (and what most people get wrong), differentiated value,and the importance of understanding your customer’s point of view.  — In This Episode, I Cover: (00:00) Welcome to the Positioning Show (00:40) About our guest Hana Abaza, and what to expect in this episode (02:34) Shopify’s growth trajectory and why they decided to go upmarket (05:04) The first time April heard Shopify pitch Shopify Plus (08:17) Shopify’s competitive alternatives   (10:22) How they launched Shopify Plus and differentiated it from Shopify  (12:53) The positioning timeline (14:32) How they shifted Shopify’s positioning and the customer perspective (16:09) Utilizing their partner influence program (18:43) The importance of customer word of mouth (19:43) How and when the sales team was enabled  (23:30) Shopify’s corporate narrative and the value props for different segments  (27:25) Why most rebrands are a waste of time (29:25) Storytelling, and what most people get wrong (34:00) How April approaches differentiated value and competitive alternatives  (37:00) Understanding the customer's POV (40:49) What’s next for Hana (43:03) Thanks for listening — Where To Find Hana Abaza: Website: https://hanaabaza.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hanaabaza/?originalSubdomain=ca Twitter: https://twitter.com/hanaabaza Where To Find April: Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/  Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/  Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford — Referenced: • Shopify Plus: https://www.shopify.com/plus — Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

Today’s episode is absolutely loaded with information. I cover the challenge of positioning for a single-product company compared to a multi-product company and share two specific examples on the topic. I also discuss how to handle positioning for segments, what happens when you have multiple segments to target, and the importance of your positioning resonating with your target champion. — In This Episode, I Cover: (00:00) Positioning a single-product company vs a multi-product company (02:37) An example from IBM’s positioning (08:00) An example of Salesforce’s positioning (11:22) How to handle positioning for segments (15:59) What happens when you have multiple segments? (19:02) How to position for various personas (24:34) The most important thing to do when doing persona positioning (26:18) Thanks for listening — Where To Find Me: Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/ Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/ — Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

In today’s episode, you’ll learn why understanding your competition is critical for positioning and how many people get it wrong. I share a story about the deceptive nature of data and why you need to carefully evaluate bad-fit customers. I talk about how to discover your true competitors and recount a story of a failed sales pitch that taught me the importance of clearly understanding your value from the customer’s point of view. I also dive into the story of Segway, why they failed initially, and why avoiding market categorization is a huge mistake. — In This Episode, I Cover: (00:00) Defining positioning (00:53) A story about how data can lie to us (05:25) Lessons on “bad fit customers” (06:52) How to think about competition (09:26) How to discover who your real competitors are (11:50) The question all customers ask (13:24) The benefits of great positioning (13:49) A failed sales pitch, and what it taught me about the importance of understanding your product’s value (20:45) Why avoiding categorization is a massive mistake (21:49) A story about Segway and why you need to position your product in a market category (25:37) Thanks for listening — Where To Find Me: Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/ Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/ — Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

Join me for our first episode, where I share how a simple shift in positioning saved a product from failure, igniting my passion for positioning. I’ll explore Clayton Christensen's Jobs To Be Done Framework and how it revolutionized my approach. I'll walk you through my 5-step methodology and outline exactly how I got here. I'll also reveal why the methodology alone isn't enough to nail your positioning and what you can expect more of on this podcast. — In This Episode, I Cover: (00:00) Welcome early adopters! (00:50) A story about the first product I ever worked on, Watcom SQL (09:11) How a shift in positioning saved Watcom’s product (09:57) What I learned as VP of Marketing (12:02) The positioning statement (14:18) How I approached positioning as a multi-year engineering problem (14:42) The 5 pieces of positioning (15:31) How to solve for the best answer (17:19) How I got started (and why you shouldn’t approach positioning this way) (19:11) Clayton Christensen’s Jobs-To-Be-Done Framework (20:03) The famous milkshake story and what it taught me (22:26) The steps to nail your product positioning (24:09) Why this methodology won’t take you all the way there (25:39) Feedback and thanks — Where To Find Me: Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/ Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/ — Referenced: Crossing the Chasm: https://www.amazon.com/Crossing-Chasm-3rd-Disruptive-Mainstream/dp/0062292986 Competing Against Luck: https://www.amazon.com/Competing-Against-Luck-Innovation-Customer/dp/0062435612 — Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

The podcast delves into practical positioning strategies for tech companies, offering real-world examples and experiences to help entrepreneurs and marketers improve their approach to standing out in the market.