Pastors Talk - A podcast by 9Marks

Evangelicals are always in danger of losing the gospel because they don’t appreciate the role of the conscience and Christian freedom.The conscience is there to protect Christian freedom—and Christian freedom protects us from legalism. This is important because when legalism is indulged, it can actually threaten the gospel itself.

Jonathan Leeman sits down with Mark Dever to talk about how local churches can more wisely support overseas work.

In conjunction with the Fall 2017 Journal "The Reformation and Your Church," Jonathan Leeman interviews Mark Dever on the Reformation and its usefulness for Christians today.

We just released a Journal on church planting and church mergers. Because neither Mark nor Jonathan wrote an article for it, we devoted this episode of Pastors’ Talk to the topic.Also: this will be our last Pastors’ Talk until September, though we’ll be recording them all summer, so send us your ideas if you have them!SHOW NOTES:— Have you (Mark) ever been a church planter? (2:30)— Why are the topics of planting and mergers worth thinking through? (4:10)— Is there a different skill set for the church planter and someone leading a church merger? (8:00)— What’s some bad advice you often hear for church planters? (9:20)— Do some of the problems stem from a dependence on agencies as opposed to churches? What are agencies useful for? What should they not do that they tend to do? (11:00)— What common wisdom do you have to offer those involved in church mergers? (13:10)— When does the “church plant” become a church? (19:00)— Who should leave a church to go with a plant? (20:00)— Do you have elders first, and then members? Or the other way around? (22:20)

In a few weeks, we’re releasing a new book, Conversion: How God Creates a People, in which Michael Lawrence makes the case that one’s doctrine of conversion has massive effects on one’s philosophy of ministry. In this episode of Pastors’ Talk, Mark and Jonathan talk about this connection.SHOW NOTES:– What’s this new book Conversion about? Why is conversion one of the nine marks? (1:55)– How does conversion affect one’s philosophy of ministry and even preaching style? (5:30)– Do liberal Christians have a doctrine of conversion? Same-sex affirming churches? (7:10)– How does Genesis 3 inform our doctrine of conversion? (9:00)– Is the doctrine of conversion going to become more and more offensive? (14:40)– Biblically speaking, what is conversion? (15:40)– Does “belonging before believing” undermine a biblical doctrine of conversion? Open communion? Spontaneous baptisms? (17:20)– How does a biblical doctrine of conversion affect a pastor’s preaching? (20:00)– How is church discipline an implication of the doctrine of conversion? (23:00)

Delve into the intricate process of receiving and dismissing church members—often overlooked yet crucial for a congregation's integrity. Explore the importance of carefully vetting individuals during membership intake. The discussion highlights how educational journeys, elder interviews, and a clear articulation of the gospel shape a church's identity. Navigate the challenges of faith and repentance, alongside the delicate balance elders face in membership decisions, fostering mercy while upholding biblical standards.

In many evangelical churches, the public prayers are casual, short, and few. Is that a problem? How does this contemporary situation compare to the history of Protestant churches? How should pastors seek to reinvigorate their churches’ prayer practices?Jonathan sat down with Mark to discuss all these questions and more.SHOW NOTES:– In your experience, what does the public prayer look like in the average evangelical church? How does this compare historically? (:50)– Without impugning motives, why do churches play so little? (2:50)– Is there a pattern of corporate prayer in the Bible? (4:00)– Is a church being disobedient if they’re not giving ample time to corporate prayer? (5:25)– What does should the public prayer look like? What is a prayer of praise of confession? Should only men pray publicly? (6:30)– How should a pastor think through his “pastoral prayer” (14:00)?– This amount of prayer can be tough to get through for those not used to it. It slows people down and causes us to actively participate in a service. (21:00)– Why pray “we” not “I”? (24:45)– What about a Sunday evening prayer service? (25:15)

It’s tempting for a new pastor to show up with a laundry list of problems that need to be fixed. But that approach almost never works, and many have left churches worse off due to their hastiness in implementing change. To help pastors with this, Jonathan sat down with Mark to chat about how quickly a pastor should try to make changes in a church.SHOW NOTES:– You’ve said before that young pastors have great acuity, but poor depth perception. Can you explain that? (1:00)– What kinds of mistakes do young pastors take? (2:40)– How did you moderate the pace of change at the beginning of your time at CHBC? (5:50)– Is “change nothing in your first year” good advice? (9:45)– What should a pastor give himself to in the first year? Why is preaching so crucial? (13:00)– Should a pastor deliberately set out to build relationships with those who are disagreeable? How much does that help? (15:55)– Why should some pastors not practice church discipline right away? (18:00)– How much does handing out books help? (19:50)– Three areas of things that might change. (23:00)

They debate whether 'senior pastor' is a biblical title and how practical roles develop. They explore why one regular preacher usually gains informal authority. They talk about how a senior pastor shapes church direction, handles disagreements with other pastors, and steps to take when leadership becomes heavy-handed. They offer counsel for entering a church with an established elder board and cultivating elder unity.

It’s a question countless pastors ask every single day: How can I grow my church?In his new book WORD-CENTERED CHURCH, Jonathan Leeman offers a biblical answer to that question. In summary, God intends to grow his church through the proclamation of his Word—and once proclaimed, God intends for that Word to reverberate out from the pulpit and into the whole church’s life and ministry. WORD-CENTERED CHURCH encourages pastors and church leaders to resist the temptation of pragmatism and to instead build their churches on a more trustworthy foundation.For this episode of Pastors’ Talk, Mark chatted with Jonathan about all this and more.SHOW NOTES:– What’s necessary for a church? Does it require a dependence on the Bible? (:30)– If a church is built on the Word, what room does that leave for good deeds? (4:30)– What’s the role of preaching? Why “Word-centered church” and not “Christ-centered church”? (6:20)– When people think about worship, should they associate it strictly with music? (9:30)– How does the Word reverberate throughout the church and its church’s life? (11:30)– What do you say to the pastor who doesn’t spend time to study the Word? (13:15)– In a church with a lot of nominal Christians, how should preaching being prioritized? (16:30)– What’s Word-Centered Church all about, and how does it differ from Reverberation? (18:00)