What Matters Most

This is not as late as the last episode, only a day behind this time, but this might be the new normal until the conference is over. Nevertheless, it is worth the wait as Tim and I talk about the stable disposition necessary to create the habits needed to create virtue.  This is episode fifteen of season three with Dr. Tim Pawl, Professor of Philosophy at the University of St. Thomas in St. Paul, Minnesota. Tim received his MA and PhD from Saint Louis University and his BA in Philosophy and Theology, BA, magna cum laude from Valparaiso University in Philosophy and Theology. Tim works on metaphysics, philosophical theology, and moral psychology. He says, “In metaphysics I work on truthmaker theory, modality, and free will. In philosophical theology, I have published on transubstantiation, Christology, and divine immutability. In moral psychology I have worked with psychologists on questions concerning how best to grow in virtue, and whether the traditional wisdom of the Christian moral tradition is conducive to growth in virtue.” Tim’s best-known works are linked here and include his books on the Christology of the early church councils, The Incarnation. Cambridge Elements Series. Cambridge University Press (2020); In Defense of Extended Conciliar Christology: A Philosophical Essay. Oxford Studies in Analytic Theology. Oxford University Press, 2019; and In Defense of Conciliar Christology: A Philosophical Essay. Oxford Studies in Analytic Theology. Oxford University Press, 2016. When Tim and I discussed this podcast, though, Tim was interested in discussing his work on virtue and especially a series of articles on virtue in light of both ancient Christian moral teachings and modern psychology. There were three articles in particular that Tim sent to me on The Psychology of Habit Formation and Christian Moral Widom on Virtue Formation, Christian Moral Wisdom, Character Formation, and Contemporary Psychology, and  What is Virtue? The link above will take you to all of these articles. Tim is a significant philosopher on matters that for many of us, myself included, are complex and technical, especially his work on the early councils and their Christological definitions.  What we discussed is also significant and, in many ways, complex too, but there is something about virtue, habit, and personal psychology that is direct and knowable because most of us struggle to live it out our virtues, and wrestle with habits both good and bad. It’s philosophy and psychology that we confront on a regular if not daily basis. How to be good people. Tim mentioned the litany of humility, which I link to here, as a practice that can be of benefit for, indeed, gaining humility.  Tim Pawl is such a careful thinker and I appreciate the care he brought to discussing virtue, virtue formation, and how we can create the habits that allow virtue to flourish both from ancient Christian and contemporary psychological sources. Virtue formation is always important and I suspect always a struggle in every age and for every, or the vast majority, of people. Most of us desire to do better, to live out what matters most to us, and to seek the good whenever we can. But it’s tough sometimes to do it. What can aid us in this? What can help us? But if it is a perennial issue, from a Christian perspective a primal struggle with sin, there are conditions that allow human flourishing more than others. In our own age, one of the major issues that creates the near occasion for sin is social media. One of the bedrock elements of the Christian tradition, emerging from the Jewish tradition, is to tell the truth: Proverbs 12:22: “The LORD detests lying lips, but he delights in people who are trustworthy.” Colossians 3:9 says, “Do not lie to each other, since you have taken off your old self with its practices.” We all have to reckon with our own weaknesses. The Rabbis posited that we had a yetzer ha-ra, an evil impulse, and a yetzer ha-tov, a good impulse, something like a light and shadow side. But when disinformation or misinformation have become the mode of communicating it is difficult to determine what is true. Indeed, lies are even in the words. In what way are misinformation disinformation not simply lying? This is where the ancient Christian tradition and contemporary psychology encourage us to maintain the habit formation that create virtue. We tell the truth. We insist that others tell the truth. We seek the truth and not the lies. We do not promote lies. This is what has troubled me in terms of our shared social world. But virtue is a constant process of growth and it is something that matters not just for individuals but for our shared life in community. Let’s tell the truth. I thank Tim for his conversation and know that there might be other virtues that you are growing in and working on. It’s a worthwhile task. It might not seem it in the craziness of our political climate, but virtue is its own reward. What Matters Most is produced by the Centre for Christian Engagement at St Mark’s College, the Catholic college at UBC. The CCE is a centre at St. Mark’s College that explores the Christian and Catholic intellectual tradition and seek to learn from others, other Christians, members of other religious traditions, and from those who do not claim any particular or formal religious affiliation. Our goal, then, is to talk to a lot of people, to learn from them, to listen to them, and to find out what motivates them, what gives them hope, what gives them peace, and what allows them to go out into the world to love their neighbors. And now some news on upcoming podcast episodes: Coming up next in some order still to be determined are Dr. Fiona Li, the first Archbishop Ireland Chair in catholic studies at St. Mark’s College, and then Dr. Minelle Mahtani of UBC on growing up in Canada with a Muslim and a Hindu parent, and then Dr Paula Fredriksen, one of the great scholars on early Christianity and Judaism, and Dr. Joan taylor, another great scholar of early Christianity and Judaism. Let us know what you want to discuss next on Pop Culture Matters. Follow us at our Instagram page, @stmarkscce, newly revived, and drop us a line as to what you want to see or hear, or at our new Facebook page Centre for Christian Engagement. Or email us with your suggestions to jmartens@stmarkscollege.ca or cceconferences@stmarkscollege.ca. Some upcoming events: The Promise of Christian Education: Past, Present and Future, MAY 1-3, 2025, at ST. MARK'S COLLEGE, VANCOUVER, CANADA. You can find all the information on the speakers and the program on the CCE website. Click here to register. The cost for the whole conference is minimal and the three keynote speakers are free, but you do need to register for Dr. Margaret MacDonald, Dr. Samuel Rocha, and Reverend Dr. Stan Chu Ilo. Some other upcoming events: A webinar with Fr. Jim Martin on April 7 at 5 pm PCT. Building Bridges: Reaching Out to Those on the Margins Is there a place for all people in the Catholic Church? How can everyone feel welcomed and experience God's love in their lives?  Register on Eventbrite now! Past events: Father Andrew Laguna S.J.'s annual Jesuit Lecture on Immigration and Ignatian Spiritual Discernment is available on You Tube now. Dr Ray Aldred's third annual Laudato Si’ lecture, bringing together Indigenous and Christian thought on how to care for creation, is available on You Tube. Dr. Michael Higgins lecture on The Monk and the Pope is now on You Tube. A few thanks are in order. To Martin Strong, to Kevin Eng, and to Fang Fang Chandra, the team who helps me bring this podcast to you, but also makes the CCE run so much more smoothly. I also want to thank our donors to the Centre, whose generosity enables this work to take place at all: Peter Bull, Angus Reid, and Andy Szocs. We are thankful to their commitment to the life of the academic world and of the work of the Church in the world by funding the work of the CCE. I am also thankful to the Cullen family, Mark and Barbara, for their support of the ongoing work of the CCE through financial donations that allow us to bring speakers to the local and international arenas. If you are enjoying the podcast, please let your friends know. It’s the free gift that you can give to all of your friends! And also let people know by rating and reviewing What Matters Most on your favourite podcasting platform. And subscribe to the podcast. If you are listening, please subscribe. It’s free! Thanks again for listening and remember what matters most.     Dr. John W. Martens  

Sorry for the lateness on this incredible episode! The busy-ness of preparing for the conference and working on a few academic papers led to a two day delay. But this is a long episode and Paul and I had a terrific conversation, so I hope that makes up for some of my tardiness!   This is episode fourteen of season three with Dr. Paul Gavrilyuk, Professor and Aquinas Chair in Theology and Philosophy at the University of St. Thomas in St. Paul, Minnesota.  He has been published in nine languages, and his books include The Suffering of the Impassible God (Oxford, 2004), Histoire du catéchuménat dans l’église ancienne(Cerf, 2007), The Spiritual Senses: Perceiving God in Western Christianity (co-edited with Sarah Coakley, Cambridge, 2012) and Georges Florovsky and the Russian Religious Renaissance (Oxford, 2014).  Paul is also a founder of IOTA, the International Orthodox Theological Association, and of Rebuild Ukraine, a humanitarian organization that raises money for Ukraine’s defenders, civilians, and refugees.  Paul is a notable theologian, but as you will hear in this episode he was born in Kiev and educated in the Soviet Union, which was not in the habit of producing a lot of theologians in the 20th century. Paul talks about his conversion experience, his move to the US to study theology, and the realities of authoritarian governments, that he grew up under and which are expanding today. We also discuss his remarkable new Oxford Handbook of Deification, of which he is one of three editors.    Paul Gavrilyuk is an incredible theologian, prolific and learned, and a dear friend. We traveled together through Greece and Turkey teaching early Christianity to 25 undergraduate students many years ago and have shared so many hours at conferences, in classrooms, learning together and simply being together. What a delight to spend this time together again. For me, the most impressive part of Paul’s story, though, is his incredible journey from the Soviet Union to the Church and to an internationally renowned theologian. His story of conversion and the acts of bravery necessary by him and by others to bring his vocation to fruition are humbling. We are in a time of creeping, perhaps moving faster than that now, authoritarianism, and acts of bravery might be essential for us to continue to build a world of concern for all, but especially for those in the most need of support. Paul’s work with Rebuild Ukraine does just that – it cares for those impacted by the senseless war of Putin against the people of Ukraine. This is not a distant war to Paul and his family, it is a war against his home.  Why talk about theology during a time of rising autocracy and oligarchy around the world? While it can be misused for bitter an cruel ends, theology is what sustains so many during times of crisis, war, and persecution. It keeps our minds on what matters most. It reminds us that war is a failure brought on by men who seek power, money, and fame. It is not what sustains us, it is what creates hate and begets cruelty. Paul’s research on theosis or deification points us to our true goal: love of neighbour, love of God, and the hope of life in the presence of God, becoming more and more like God. And what it is to become more and more like God says the Apostle Paul is love. And what love creates on earth are the fruits of the Spirit: Galatians 5:22-23 defines the person who is living in accordance with the Holy Spirit as showing these fruits: love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, and self-control. When you are lost in a sea of disinformation and people trying to create hatred against one another, ask yourself this? Where do I see the fruits of the spirit? What Matters Most is produced by the Centre for Christian Engagement at St Mark’s College, the Catholic college at UBC. The CCE is a centre at St. Mark’s College that explores the Christian and Catholic intellectual tradition and seek to learn from others, other Christians, members of other religious traditions, and from those who do not claim any particular or formal religious affiliation. Our goal, then, is to talk to a lot of people, to learn from them, to listen to them, and to find out what motivates them, what gives them hope, what gives them peace, and what allows them to go out into the world to love their neighbors. And now some news on upcoming podcast episodes: Coming up next is Dr. Tim Pawl, a philosopher, on virtue, and then Dr. Minelle Mahtani of UBC on growing up in Canada with a Muslim and a Hindu parent, and then Dr Paula Fredriksen, one of the great scholars on early Christianity and Judaism. Let us know what you want to discuss next on Pop Culture Matters. Follow us at our Instagram page, @stmarkscce, newly revived, and drop us a line as to what you want to see or hear. Or email us with your suggestions to jmartens@stmarkscollege.ca or cceconferences@stmarkscollege.ca. Some upcoming events: We have a webinar with Fr. Jim Martin on April 7 at 5 pm PCT. Building Bridges: Reaching Out to Those on the Margins. Is there a place for all people in the Catholic Church? How can everyone feel welcomed and experience God's love in their lives? Register on Eventbrite now! The Promise of Christian Education: Past, Present and Future, MAY 1-3, 2025, at ST. MARK'S COLLEGE, VANCOUVER, CANADA. You can find all the information on the speakers and the program on the CCE website. Click here to register. The cost for the whole conference is minimal and the three keynote speakers are free, but you do need to register for Dr. Margaret MacDonald, Dr. Samuel Rocha, and Reverend Dr. Stan Chu Ilo. Past events: Father Andrew Laguna S.J.'s annual Jesuit Lecture on Immigration and Ignatian Spiritual Discernment is available on You Tube now. Dr Ray Aldred's third annual Laudato Si’ lecture, bringing together Indigenous and Christian thought on how to care for creation, is available on You Tube. Dr. Michael Higgins lecture on The Monk and the Pope is now on You Tube. A few thanks are in order. To Martin Strong, to Kevin Eng, and to Fang Fang Chandra, the team who helps me bring this podcast to you, but also makes the CCE run so much more smoothly. I also want to thank our donors to the Centre, whose generosity enables this work to take place at all: Peter Bull, Angus Reid, and Andy Szocs. We are thankful to their commitment to the life of the academic world and of the work of the Church in the world by funding the work of the CCE. I am also thankful to the Cullen family, Mark and Barbara, for their support of the ongoing work of the CCE through financial donations that allow us to bring speakers to the local and international arenas. If you are enjoying the podcast, please let your friends know. It’s the free gift that you can give to all of your friends! And also let people know by rating and reviewing What Matters Most on your favourite podcasting platform. And subscribe to the podcast. If you are listening, please subscribe. It’s free! Thanks again for listening and remember what matters most.     Dr. John W. Martens  

This is episode 13 of season 3 of What Matters Most, featuring the Venerable Rev. Dr. Robert James, Associate Professor, Anglican Formation and Studies at VST.  Apart from his work in Anglican studies, Rob is a biblical scholar and has written and published a book of stories from the Bible designed for storytellers to use with children in children’s homilies or Sunday School or church camps. The first book is on stories from the NT, but there is a second coming on stories from the OT. The illustrator for both is the Reverend Amanda Ruston. The book is called Fifty New Testament Stories for Storytellers. It was terrific to have on the podcast again my good friend Rob James, a Great Friend of the Podcast, a GFOP as they call it on the Men in Blazers podcast. He is a master storyteller and you might even be able to find some examples of him teaching, singing, and playing his stories on YouTube from his days as a priest in England if you poke around.  Here's a few to get you started! One, Two, Three! I can tell you that his presentation of the story of Jesus teaching how should we pray at the SBL meetings in the Children in the Biblical World session in November 2024 in San Diego had 68 biblical scholars up on their feet doing all of the motions and uttering all of the words as he led us through that story. It was a highlight of the whole conference. But Rob’s work on telling biblical stories for children allows us to think about what we want children to learn from the Bible, and not just children, but adults. Why are we telling these stories for children? Knowledge of these stories and persons is essential for understanding art, music, culture and their influence on English speaking and other cultures. But there are other more important issues also. Some of it certainly is just to let children know about what the Bible teaches, but is this just an issue of teaching morality? Here’s how you need to behave, or practice your faith, here are good things to do unto others, and here are good things to believe. Certainly, all of these things are worthy. But I wonder if simply letting children know about the people in the Bible and what it teaches goes beyond cultural considerations and even moral considerations and simply allows children to encounter God and the nature of God and to reflect on, think about, and even wrestle with questions of purpose and meaning. This sort of wrestling is not beyond children, they do it naturally and have insights about God that transcend their age and simplicity. Rob’s work lets this happen naturally and gently, allowing the stories to teach the children and to teach us. Because thinking about Rob’s work in writing a children’s Bible also made me reflect on and work to understand the purpose of the Bible for adults. What do we hope to get from the Bible? What do we expect from it? Whom do we encounter there? Why are we reading the Bible? What Matters Most is produced by the Centre for Christian Engagement at St Mark’s College, the Catholic college at UBC. The CCE is a centre at St. Mark’s College that explores the Christian and Catholic intellectual tradition and seek to learn from others, other Christians, members of other religious traditions, and from those who do not claim any particular or formal religious affiliation. Our goal, then, is to talk to a lot of people, to learn from them, to listen to them, and to find out what motivates them, what gives them hope, what gives them peace, and what allows them to go out into the world to love their neighbors. And now some news on upcoming podcast episodes:  Coming up next is Dr. Paul Gavrilyuk on the Oxford Handbook of Deification and Orthodox theology, IOTA, and his organization Rebuild Ukraine. After that will be Dr. Tim Pawl, a philosopher, on virtue, and then Dr. Minelle Mahtani of UBC on growing up in Canada with a Muslim and a Hindu parent. Let us know what you want to discuss next on Pop Culture Matters. Follow us at our Instagram page, @stmarkscce, newly revived, and drop us a line as to what you want to see or hear. Or email us with your suggestions to jmartens@stmarkscollege.ca or cceconferences@stmarkscollege.ca. Some upcoming events: We will have over 40 presenters from Asia, Africa, and North America at The Promise of Christian Education: Past, Present and Future, MAY 1-3, 2025, at ST. MARK'S COLLEGE, VANCOUVER, CANADA. You can find all the information on the speakers and where you can register at the CCE website. The link is in the show notes to both the conference website and the registration page. The cost for the whole conference is minimal and the three keynote speakers are free, but you do need to register for Dr. Margaret MacDonald, Dr. Samuel Rocha, and Reverend Dr. Stan Chu Ilo. On March 3, 2025, Father Andrew Laguna S.J. will be offering our annual Jesuit Lecture on Immigration and Ignatian Spiritual Discernment. Past events: On January 27, 2025, Dr Ray Aldred offered the third annual Laudato Si’ lecture, bringing together Indigenous and Christian thought on how to care for creation, our common home. It is available on You Tube. Dr. Michael Higgins will have already spoken to us on February 10, 2025 on The Monk and the Pope. This lecture is now on You Tube, and you can find all of the links on the CCE website or on St. Mark’s YouTube channel. A few thanks are in order. To Martin Strong, to Kevin Eng, and to Fang Fang Chandra, the team who helps me bring this podcast to you, but also makes the CCE run so much more smoothly. I also want to thank our donors to the Centre, whose generosity enables this work to take place at all: Peter Bull, Angus Reid, and Andy Szocs. We are thankful to their commitment to the life of the academic world and of the work of the Church in the world by funding the work of the CCE. I am also thankful to the Cullen family, Mark and Barbara, for their support of the ongoing work of the CCE through financial donations that allow us to bring speakers to the local and international arenas. If you are enjoying the podcast, please let your friends know. It’s the free gift that you can give to all of your friends! And also let people know by rating and reviewing What Matters Most on your favourite podcasting platform. And subscribe to the podcast. If you are listening, please subscribe. It’s free! Thanks again for listening and remember what matters most.     Dr. John W. Martens  

This is episode 12 of season 3 of What Matters Most, featuring Dr. Don Baker, Professor of Korean Civilization at UBC in Asian Studies since 1987. The story you will hear him tell about Catholicism in Korea and about the Gwangju democratization movement or resistance in 1980, some of which he was present for, is powerful and moving. It is also a story of the power of moral resistance and the cost of such resistance to many individuals, a cost paid by many with their lives. But the fight for democracy in Korea against military dictatorship is also a story of the worth of such a resistance that included many religious people and many ordinary Koreans.     Don also traces the history of Catholicism in Korea, which arrived with some elite neo-Confucian scholars only in 1784, with the Protestant church arriving a full century later in 1884. It is a story of persecution and martyrdom and Don has written about this in a number of books, including Catholics and Anti-Catholicism in Choson Korea and Persecution and Martyrdoms: Korea. It is a story of suffering, but also of resilience and faithfulness. This is a powerful episode and it was moving to me to hear it, I suspect it might be for you too, and more significantly it was moving for Don who witnessed the events of the democratization resistance at Gwangju in 1980 to recount the story of suffering. Dictatorship is never the pathway forward and it took great moral courage, resilience, and many lives to cast off the Korean dictatorship. This is the kind of moral courage needed today to defend democracy all over the world. The nuns and priests, other religious figures, and the ordinary people of Korea showed this great resistance and as a result the Catholic church in Korea is the most respected religion there to this day, a Church without scandal. But it is a Church that emerged from great suffering too starting soon after its arrival in Korea by Koreans themselves, neo-Confucian scholars who found writings about Catholicism by Matte Ricci in China and brought it back themselves in 1784. There were no priests in Korea when the persecutions against Korean Catholics began. They had brought the religion themselves and made it their own and persevered. This is truly an episode about what matters most, about the choices people made to accept suffering to remain faithful to their beliefs, and about people in the 1980s, nuns and priests included, who were willing to stand up for democracy against dictatorship. This is something all of us need to keep asking, what matters most to us, what is more important to us than more money or more power? Because these things do not satisfy at the deepest level. Every day one sees political leaders, billionaires, striving for more, and more, more money, more countries, more power, while the many go without enough to eat or a place to live. The Korean Catholic church demonstrates that better than that is a life lived in tune with the truth and in tune with the deepest hopes of human beings, freedom, integrity, and truth. Strongman come and go, but the truth cannot ultimately be buried or persecuted out of existence.    What Matters Most is produced by the Centre for Christian Engagement at St Mark’s College, the Catholic college at UBC. The CCE is a centre at St. Mark’s College that explores the Christian and Catholic intellectual tradition and seek to learn from others, other Christians, members of other religious traditions, and from those who do not claim any particular or formal religious affiliation. Our goal, then, is to talk to a lot of people, to learn from them, to listen to them, and to find out what motivates them, what gives them hope, what gives them peace, and what allows them to go out into the world to love their neighbors. And now some news on upcoming podcast episodes: Coming up next is Reverend Dr. Rob James on children's Bibles, Dr. Tim Pawl, a philosopher, on virtue, Dr. Paul Gavrilyuk on orthodox theology, growing up in the Soviet Union, and the new Oxford Handbook on Deification that he co-edited,  and Dr. Minelle Mahtahni on her memoir “May It Have a Happy Ending." Let us know what you want to discuss next on Pop Culture Matters. Follow us at our Instagram page, @stmarkscce, newly revived, and drop us a line as to what you want to see or hear. Or email us with your suggestions to jmartens@stmarkscollege.ca or cceconferences@stmarkscollege.ca. Some upcoming events: We will have over 40 presenters from Asia, Africa, and North America at The Promise of Christian Education: Past, Present and Future, MAY 1-3, 2025, at ST. MARK'S COLLEGE, VANCOUVER, CANADA. You can find all the information on the speakers and where you can register at the CCE website. The link is in the show notes to both the conference website and the registration page. The cost for the whole conference is minimal and the three keynote speakers are free, but you do need to register for Dr. Margaret MacDonald, Dr. Samuel Rocha, and Reverend Dr. Stan Chu Ilo. Other events: On January 27, 2025, Dr Ray Aldred offered the third annual Laudato Si’ lecture, bringing together Indigenous and Christian thought on how to care for creation, our common home. It is already available on You Tube. By the time you hear this podcast, Dr. Michael Higgins will have already spoken to us on February 10, 2025 on The Monk and the Pope. This lecture is now on You Tube, and you can find all of the links on the CCE website or on St. Mark’s YouTube channel. On March 3, 2025, Father Andrew Laguna S.J. will be offering our annual Jesuit Lecture on Immigration and Ignatian Spiritual Discernment. A few thanks are in order. To Martin Strong, to Kevin Eng, and to Fang Fang Chandra, the team who helps me bring this podcast to you, but also makes the CCE run so much more smoothly. I also want to thank our donors to the Centre, whose generosity enables this work to take place at all: Peter Bull, Angus Reid, and Andy Szocs. We are thankful to their commitment to the life of the academic world and of the work of the Church in the world by funding the work of the CCE. I am also thankful to the Cullen family, Mark and Barbara, for their support of the ongoing work of the CCE through financial donations that allow us to bring speakers to the local and international arenas. If you are enjoying the podcast, please let your friends know. It’s the free gift that you can give to all of your friends! And also let people know by rating and reviewing What Matters Most on your favourite podcasting platform. And subscribe to the podcast. If you are listening, please subscribe. It’s free! Thanks again for listening and remember what matters most.     Dr. John W. Martens  

This is Episode Eleven of Season Three, featuring Dr. Gerald Schlabach, an emeritus professor in the Department of Theology at the University of St. Thomas in St. Paul, Minnesota, where he taught for twenty years and also served for six years as chair of the Department of Justice and Peace Studies. Previously he taught history at Bluffton College, a Mennonite liberal arts college in Ohio. Gerald received his doctorate from the University of Notre Dame, where he studied ethics in the Department of Theology. During much of the 1980s, he worked in Central America with Mennonite Central Committee, an organization dedicated to peace, justice, Christ-like service and global education. A Roman Catholic as of Pentecost 2004, Gerald is a Benedictine oblate, is deeply involved in the Bridgefolk movement for grassroots dialogue and unity between Mennonites and Catholics, and continues to call himself a “Mennonite Catholic.” He is the author of numerous books. Check them all out at his website. I will mention here a few of them, Sharing Peace: Mennonites and Catholics in Conversation, Unlearning Protestantism: Sustaining Christian Community in an Unstable Age, and the book we will focus on here A Pilgrim People: Becoming A Catholic Peace Church Gerald and I were colleagues for twenty years and you can hear in our conversation what those who have worked alongside him know: he is thoughtful about his faith and he takes seriously the need to live out his faith in community, with care and support for those who have been marginalized, and in tune with the Gospel. His work in Guatemala continues to this day. With author Juan Ajtzip, Gerald is helping to bring to English readers A Mayan Witness to Blessed Stanley Rother. Juan Ajtzip was the first Mayan director of La Voz de Atitlán, a radio station founded by the missionary team from Oklahoma that included Father Stanley Rother, a missionary priest from Oklahoma, who has been declared a martyr for the faith (December 2016) and was beatified by Pope Francis (September 2017). He served and lived with the Tz’utujil Maya people of Santiago Atitlán, Guatemala, from 1968 until his assassination on July 28, 1981. I really appreciated his book A Pilgrim People: Becoming a Catholic Peace Church, and what it means to be a peace church, Catholic or otherwise, and how to live out non-violence. I asked Gerald about the accusations that non-violence is simply naïve, not attuned to the harsh realities of life, too idealistic, and Gerald movingly spoke of how one has to deal with feelings of anger created by war and conflict, drawing on Bruce Cockburn’s searing song “If I Had a Rocket Launcher.” But Gerald challenged the assumption that war works, that war is the best way to solve problems, and argued that non-violence works better than we might expect. Does violence really work? It might be more realistic, less naïve, to invest in strategies of non-violence. He cited Why Civil Resistance Works: The Strategic Logic of Nonviolent Conflict by Erica Chenoweth and Maria J. Stephan by Columbia University Press. Non-violence they argue from the data is 4x as likely to succeed, 10x as likely to result in a durable, sustainable democracy 10 years later than violence and war. For Christians in general, Catholics in particular, we need to recognize that national identity should not trump the Sermon on the Mount. If you want to make an argument for Just War, going back to Augustine, then this requires taking seriously the demands of this late antique theory, which is serious and limited. But we ought to ask ourselves first: how can we avoid violence? How can we work for pacifism instead of Just War? How can we have a proper patriotism but love all of our neighbors? How does violence create and relate to immigration? Gerald recommended Jonathan Blitzer’s book, Everyone Who Has Gone is Here: The United States, Central America, and the Making of a Crisis to understand how violence brought about so many of the issues related to immigration in the USA today.   So, we need to ask, what can we do to build a civilization of love? The pilgrimage we need to take is one of love, which does not avoid or evade hard questions, and takes seriously the fears and worries of others, and our own sinfulness and anger, but the biblical visions of love need to be our end goal on our journeys, our attempt to help create a new earth. This might seem particularly difficult now in an age when politics seems to be getting uglier and uglier and crueler and crueler. But now is the time to put it into practice. If Christian nationalism is wrong what is right? If Constantinianism is wrong, what is right? For Christians, it has to be love across borders. What Matters Most is produced by the Centre for Christian Engagement at St Mark’s College, the Catholic college at UBC. The CCE is a centre at St. Mark’s College that explores the Christian and Catholic intellectual tradition and seek to learn from others, other Christians, members of other religious traditions, and from those who do not claim any particular or formal religious affiliation. Our goal, then, is to talk to a lot of people, to learn from them, to listen to them, and to find out what motivates them, what gives them hope, what gives them peace, and what allows them to go out into the world to love their neighbors. And now some news on upcoming podcast episodes: Coming up next is Dr. Don Baker of UBC on Catholicism in Korea and why Catholicism is such a respected religion there and Dr. Tim Pawl, a philosopher, on virtue and maybe we can get him to talk about the Trinity too. Let us know what you want to discuss next on Pop Culture Matters. Follow us at our Instagram page, @stmarkscce, newly revived, and drop us a line as to what you want to see or hear. Or email us with your suggestions to jmartens@stmarkscollege.ca or cceconferences@stmarkscollege.ca. Upcoming Conference:  You can now register for The Promise of Christian Education: Past, Present and Future, MAY 1-3, 2025, at ST. MARK'S COLLEGE, VANCOUVER, CANADA.  Consider joining us in Vancouver in 2025 for the conference. The cost will be minimal to attend the concurrent sessions of the conference itself, only $60 and I think you will find it stimulating and challenging. It will be exciting. The link is in the show notes to both the conference website and the registration page. Three confirmed keynote speakers are Dr. Margaret MacDonald, Dr. Samuel Rocha, and Reverend Dr. Stan Chu Ilo. These keynote or plenary sessions are free for all, so look for the registration information on our website now. Other Events: On January 27, 2025, Dr Ray Aldred offered the third annual Laudato Si’ lecture, bringing together Indigenous and Christian thought on how to care for creation, our common home. It is already available on YouTube.  On February 10, 2025, Dr. Michael Higgins will be speaking about his new biography of Pope Francis called the Jesuit Disruptor. You can register online at Eventbrite now! On March 3, 2025, Father Andrew Laguna S.J. will be offering our annual Jesuit Lecture on Immigration and Ignatian Spiritual Discernment. A few thanks are in order. First of all, I am grateful to Martin Strong, who guides me in the podcasting world. Second, the episodes are edited, engineered, and produced by Kevin Eng who is the first listener to all the episodes and helps me pick out those opening snippets which do so much to set the tone for each episode. Thank you, Kevin, for all of your expertise and support. Finally, to the Fang Fang Chandra, the CCE assistant, who helps me bring this podcast to you, but also makes the CCE run so much more smoothly. I also want to thank our donors to the Centre, whose generosity enables this work to take place at all: Peter Bull, Angus Reid, and Andy Szocs. We are thankful to their commitment to the life of the academic world and of the work of the Church in the world by funding the work of the CCE. I am also thankful to the Cullen family, Mark and Barbara, for their support of the ongoing work of the CCE through financial donations that allow us to bring speakers to the local and international arenas. If you are enjoying the podcast, please let your friends know. It’s the free gift that you can give to all of your friends! And also let people know by rating and reviewing What Matters Most on your favourite podcasting platform. And subscribe to the podcast. If you are listening, please subscribe. It’s free! Thanks again for listening and remember what matters most.    John W. Martens Director, Centre for Christian Engagement, St. Mark's College at UBC

This is Episode Ten of Season Three, featuring Dr. Ruben Rosario Rodriguez, the Clarence Louis and Helen Steber Professor in Theological Studies at St. Louis University. He holds a Ph.D. in Systematic Theology from Princeton Theological Seminary (2004). Dr. Rodriguez is also a Presbyterian minister.  Ruben is also an expert in the work of John Calvin, the divisive 16th century reformer from France who became a major figure in Geneva during the Reformation of the 16th century. Today we are discussing his book Calvin for the World: The Enduring Relevance of His Political, Social, and Economic Theology.  As I mentioned, Calvin is divisive, for some people a hated figure, often based upon his view of double predestination, that is, God's absolute sovereignty in the salvation or damnation of the human soul and his role in the death of Michael Servetus. Ruben’s book is an attempt to give a fuller representation of who Calvin is and what he actually says. I invited Ruben on not just because we share a great love for 70s punk rock, the Ramones, Tom Verlaine, and many others, but because I heard he had taped a podcast with a Calvinist leaning podcast that then reneged on posting the podcast, perhaps because of certain theological disagreements. That did sit right with me: this podcast is about asking questions and getting to know people and what matters most to them. We do not have to share all of our beliefs in common to befriend each other or to listen to each other. I enjoyed our conversation and I really enjoy Dr. Rodriguez’s honesty and integrity as a person and as a theologian. I knew little about John Calvin prior to my conversation with Ruben, but I know a lot more now, even if I am only scratching the surface and though I am no Calvinist. But it is good to get to know people better, especially historical figures who have shaped our world and our thought in ways perhaps even unknown to us, and especially figures who often just function as stereotypes in our thoughts. For me his book fulfilled its major stated goal: “to correct many of the misconceptions about Calvin perpetuated by an inadequate knowledge of his work.” Others more expert in Calvinism than me will know more about many of the issues Ruben and I discussed, but I appreciated his book and its consideration Calvin’s Theology of Public Life and how his analysis of Psalm 82:3-4 “fits” with a preferential option for the poor and liberation theology; though I’m still not sure why Calvin does not think it proper to topple tyrannical governments, Ruben presented Calvin’s view of “two kingdoms” as an argument for seeing Calvin as a proto-liberationist with respect to illegitimate governments that act contrary to the word of God. I appreciated the connections between liberation theology, Archbishop Romero, and Calvin’s theology of civil governance. I was also intrigued by Calvin’s desired “egalitarian communal structure” and his rejection of “authoritarian absolutism in either the Church or the State” and Ruben’s argument that Calvin could be seen in favor of religious toleration. Ruben also offered an interesting comparison between Bartolomeo de Las Casas and Calvin with respect to treatment of indigenous people and others. It’s an interesting point, as later in South Africa Calvinism played a role in the building of the apartheid state of South Africa. Yet, Ruben argues and shows the ways in which Calvin’s thought also inspired resistance to white Christian nationalism. The events in Sharpeville and especially Soweto emerged from African Christians in the movement to take down apartheid. Alan Boesak, the African Calvinist church leader, enlisted Calvin theologically to argue white supremacy in Christianity and the apartheid state. This resulted in the Belhar Confession, linked here, which stood resolutely against apartheid.  And now some news on upcoming podcast episodes: Coming up next is Dr. Gerald Schlabach on his new book, A Pilgrim People: Becoming a Catholic Peace Church, Dr. Don Baker, and Dr. Tim Pawl. Three episodes of Pop Culture Matters are out. I hope you enjoyed the conversation Martin and I had on Christmas films.  What’s up next for Pop Culture Matters? We are considering the wonderful and recently ended HBO series Somebody Somewhere, a show which perhaps surprisingly has church as an integral part of its world. Let us know what you want to discuss next on Pop Culture Matters. Follow us at our Instagram page, @stmarkscce, newly revived, and drop us a line as to what you want to see or hear. Or email us with your suggestions to jmartens@stmarkscollege.ca or cceconferences@stmarkscollege.ca. Some upcoming events: You can now register for The Promise of Christian Education: Past, Present and Future, MAY 1-3, 2025, at ST. MARK'S COLLEGE, VANCOUVER, CANADA. We will have over 40 presenters from Asia, Africa, and North America. The webpage for the conference is now available at the CCE website, where you can find information on the speakers and where you can register for The Promise of Christian Education: Past, Present and Future, MAY 1-3, 2025, at ST. MARK'S COLLEGE, VANCOUVER, CANADA. Consider joining us in Vancouver in 2025 for the conference. The cost will be minimal to attend the concurrent sessions of the conference itself, only $60 and I think you will find it stimulating and challenging. It will be exciting. The link takes you to the conference website and you can find a registration link there.  Three confirmed keynote speakers are Dr. Margaret MacDonald, Dr. Samuel Rocha, and Reverend Dr. Stan Chu Ilo. These keynote or plenary sessions are free for all, so look for the registration information on our website now.  Some other upcoming events: On January 27, 2025, we will have an in person and virtual event with Dr Ray Aldred, who will offer the third annual Laudato Si’ lecture, bringing together Indigenous and Christian thought on how to care for creation, our common home. Register here. On February 10, 2025, Dr. Michael Higgins will be speaking about his new biography of Pope Francis called the Jesuit Disruptor. Register here. On March 3, 2025, Father Andrew Laguna S.J. will be offering our annual Jesuit Lecture on Immigration and Ignatian Spiritual Discernment. A few thanks are in order. First of all, I am grateful to Martin Strong, who guides me in the podcasting world. Second, the episodes are edited, engineered, and produced by Kevin Eng who is the first listener to all the episodes and helps me pick out those opening snippets which do so much to set the tone for each episode. Thank you, Kevin, for all of your expertise and support. Finally, to the Fang Fang Chandra, the CCE assistant, who helps me bring this podcast to you, but also makes the CCE run so much more smoothly. I also want to thank our donors to the Centre, whose generosity enables this work to take place at all: Peter Bull, Angus Reid, and Andy Szocs. We are thankful to their commitment to the life of the academic world and of the work of the Church in the world by funding the work of the CCE. I am also thankful to the Cullen family, Mark and Barbara, for their support of the ongoing work of the CCE through financial donations that allow us to bring speakers to the local and international arenas. If you are enjoying the podcast, please let your friends know. It’s the free gift that you can give to all of your friends! And also let people know by rating and reviewing What Matters Most on your favourite podcasting platform. And subscribe to the podcast. If you are listening, please subscribe. It’s free! Thanks again for listening and remember what matters most.    John W. Martens Director, Centre for Christian Engagement, St. Mark's College at UBC

This is Episode Nine of Season Three, featuring Dr. Megan Fritts. Megan Fritts joined the UA Little Rock philosophy faculty in the School of Human Inquiry in 2022. She received her Ph.D. in 2020 from the University of Wisconsin-Madison. Her work intersects with several subdisciplines, including technology ethics, medical ethics, action theory, 19th century philosophy, and philosophy of religion. Her current projects focus on ways in which emerging technologies threaten to undermine essential conditions for human flourishing. Dr. Fritts teaches several courses at UA Little Rock, including Ethics and Society, Technology Ethics, Philosophy of Science, and 19th Century Philosophy. She is also the co-host of Philosophy on the Fringes, a podcast that applies rigorous philosophical thinking to unexpected topics. In this podcast, we discuss the problem of evil, or theodicy. I was led to invite Megan onto the podcast after reading her recent article in Religious Studies called Creation as divine absence: A metaphysical reframing of the problem of evil,  an open access article to which I have linked here. This is an ancient and perennial problem in theology and philosophy, dating back to the ancient Greeks and ancient Christianity. The problem is simply stated: why would, in the Christian understanding, an all-powerful, all-knowing, all-good God – omnipotent, omniscient, omnibenevolent – allow evil and suffering to flourish in the world? Megan Fritts looks to Simone Weil, the French Catholic philosopher to help us understand the presence of evil and the absence of God. There is, however, no easy solution to the problem of theodicy for anyone. It is difficult to make sense of profound evil and suffering regardless of one’s theism or atheism or non-theism. In this vein, I also want to offer a link to Yujin Nagasawa’s new book The Problem of Evil for Atheists, which is also available as open access online. Although framed as the problem the problem of evil for atheists, Nagasawa also considers the problem of evil for traditional theists, pantheists and axiarchists, as well as atheists and non-theists in both the east and west. Finally, Megan recommended Simone Weil's works Waiting for God and Gravity and Grace.  And now some news on upcoming podcast episodes: Coming up next is Dr. Ruben Rosario on Calvin for the World, his new book, Dr. Gerald Schlabach, Dr. Don Baker, and Dr. Tim Pawl. Three episodes of Pop Culture Matters are out. I hope you enjoyed the conversation Martin and I had on Christmas films.  What’s up next for Pop Culture Matters? We are considering the wonderful and recently ended HBO series Somebody Somewhere, a show which perhaps surprisingly has church as an integral part of its world. Let us know what you want to discuss next on Pop Culture Matters. Follow us at our Instagram page, @stmarkscce, newly revived, and drop us a line as to what you want to see or hear. Or email us with your suggestions to jmartens@stmarkscollege.ca or cceconferences@stmarkscollege.ca. Some upcoming events: You can now register for The Promise of Christian Education: Past, Present and Future, MAY 1-3, 2025, at ST. MARK'S COLLEGE, VANCOUVER, CANADA. We will have over 40 presenters from Asia, Africa, and North America. The webpage for the conference is now available at the CCE website, where you can find information on the speakers and where you can register for The Promise of Christian Education: Past, Present and Future, MAY 1-3, 2025, at ST. MARK'S COLLEGE, VANCOUVER, CANADA. Consider joining us in Vancouver in 2025 for the conference. The cost will be minimal to attend the concurrent sessions of the conference itself, only $60 and I think you will find it stimulating and challenging. It will be exciting. The link is in the show notes to both the conference website and the registration page. Three confirmed keynote speakers are Dr. Margaret MacDonald, Dr. Samuel Rocha, and Reverend Dr. Stan Chu Ilo. These keynote or plenary sessions are free for all, so look for the registration information on our website now.   Some other upcoming events: On January 27, 2025, we will have an in person and virtual event with Dr Ray Aldred, who will offer the third annual Laudato Si’ lecture, bringing together Indigenous and Christian thought on how to care for creation, our common home. On February 10, 2025, Dr. Michael Higgins will be speaking about his new biography of Pope Francis called the Jesuit Disruptor. On March 3, 2025, Father Andrew Laguna S.J. will be offering our annual Jesuit Lecture on Immigration and Ignatian Spiritual Discernment. A few thanks are in order. First of all, I am grateful to Martin Strong, who guides me in the podcasting world. Second, the episodes are edited, engineered, and produced by Kevin Eng who is the first listener to all the episodes and helps me pick out those opening snippets which do so much to set the tone for each episode. Thank you, Kevin, for all of your expertise and support. Finally, to the Fang Fang Chandra, the CCE assistant, who helps me bring this podcast to you, but also makes the CCE run so much more smoothly. I also want to thank our donors to the Centre, whose generosity enables this work to take place at all: Peter Bull, Angus Reid, and Andy Szocs. We are thankful to their commitment to the life of the academic world and of the work of the Church in the world by funding the work of the CCE. I am also thankful to the Cullen family, Mark and Barbara, for their support of the ongoing work of the CCE through financial donations that allow us to bring speakers to the local and international arenas. If you are enjoying the podcast, please let your friends know. It’s the free gift that you can give to all of your friends! And also let people know by rating and reviewing What Matters Most on your favourite podcasting platform. And subscribe to the podcast. If you are listening, please subscribe. It’s free! Thanks again for listening and remember what matters most.    John W. Martens Director, Centre for Christian Engagement, St. Mark's College at UBC

Welcome to the third episode of Pop Culture Matters, a conversation with my good friend and yours Martin Strong. Today we’re talking about Christmas movies, our favorite Christmas movies, and what we think makes for a good Christmas movie.  We asked a lot of people on campus at UBC and St. Mark’s and on social media, what their favorite Christmas movies are. Here’s a list of a bunch of them, in no particular order that people mentioned to us:  Love, Actually; White Christmas; It’s a Wonderful Life; Elf; While You Were Sleeping;-Miracle on 34th Street; Muppets Christmas Carol; The Shop Around the Corner; Christmas with the Kranks; Rudolph; A Christmas Story; The Ref; Home Alone; The original Grinch; The Bishop’s Wife, Christmas in Connecticut, The Man Who Came to Dinner, Holiday Inn, Alistair Sim’s Scrooge;  Fred Claus, The Holdovers, Tokyo Godfathers, Batman Returns, A Very Harold and Kumar 3D Christmas, About a Boy, Scrooged, Die Hard, The Santa Clause, The Nativity Story, and Bad Santa. Why are these are favorites and what do we think is need to be a Christmas favorite? Get comfortable and cozy with your loved ones and settle in with a cup of hot cocoa and a Christmas cookie. If this podcast hits some of the right Christmas notes, you’re going to change your selfish ways and be transformed by the warmth of Christmas.   Christmas movies are fun, but I think Martin hit it on the head when he said the best ones are also earnest. Not saccharine, not too sweet, but warm, uplifting, and hopeful. They encourage us to be better. They point us away from commercialization to what really matters in life.  They often call us to transformation, often through the use of angels or spirits, who show us the better path and how to embrace the joy of the life through Christmas time. And sometimes they do indeed move into the Christmas story, the nativity of Jesus, as with Linus reciting the story of Jesus’ birth from Luke as he explains the true meaning of Christmas to Charlie Brown and the whole Peanuts gang. Or in the Bishop’s Wife, when David Niven’s Bishop says the gifts to give Jesus are lovingkindness, warm hearts, and a stretched out hand of tolerance.    Merry Christmas from all of us at the Centre for Christian Engagement  and St. Mark’s College. Merry Christmas to Martin Strong for joining me in this venture! Merry Christmas to Kevin Eng for editing and engineering this episode and integrating all the wonderful music in the podcast. Merry Christmas to Fang Fang Chandra, the CCE assistant, who helps me bring this podcast to you, but also makes the CCE run so much more smoothly. Merry Christmas to Kenton McDonald-Lin for the interviews on the UBC campus that spiced up this Christmas episode.  Merry Christmas to all of our donors to the Centre, whose generosity enables this work to take place at all: Peter Bull, Angus Reid, and Andy Szocs. We are thankful to their commitment to the life of the academic world and of the work of the Church in the world by funding the work of the CCE. I am also thankful to the Cullen family, Mark and Barbara, for their support of the ongoing work of the CCE through financial donations that allow us to bring speakers to the local and international arenas. If you are enjoying the podcast, please let your friends know and give the gift of What Matters Most by also rating and reviewing What Matters Most on your favourite podcasting platform.  Thanks again for listening and remember Merry Christmas.    Since St. Mark’s Centre for Christian Engagement seeks to enable the creation of a culture of encounter and dialogue, let me invite you into that discussion. Follow us at our Instagram page, @stmarkscce, newly revived, and drop us a line as to what you want to see or hear. We’ll post there with a question as to what you are most interested in. I will also post the question on Facebook @biblejunkies. We will be moving to a CCE Facebook page, but in the meantime, feel free to check us out @biblejunkies. When we decide what’s next, we’ll let you know and then we can all make sure to watch it or listen to it or read it before the next episode of Pop Culture Matters. Or email us with your suggestions to jmartens@stmarkscollege.ca or cceconferences@stmarkscollege.ca. John W. Martens

This is Episode Eight of Season Three, featuring Fr. Ryan Duns, S.J., Department Chair and Associate Professor of Systematic Theology in the Theology Department at Marquette University. He received his Ph.D. from Boston College in 2018. Reading from his Marquette web page, I can tell you that “Ryan Duns, SJ works at the intersection of philosophy and systematic theology. He has published on Karl Rahner, Jean-Luc Marion, René Girard, and his most recent work has involved a sustained engagement with William Desmond’s metaphysics. His dissertation, “Spiritual Exercises for a Secular Age? William Desmond’s Theological Achievement” argued that, when read as a form of spiritual exercise (Pierre Hadot), Desmond’s philosophy can re-awaken a sense of the Transcendent.” Today we will discuss his new book Theology of Horror: The Hidden Depths of Popular Films. We discuss what horror is, how it makes us feel, what it can teach us, and what is the dark transcendent. Is Advent and Christmas the time to discuss horror and its meaning? I suspect Halloween might be more traditional, but Ryan Duns argues that in the incarnation the divine breaks through to show us our world is shot through with sin. Jesus is the light that reveals the dark transcendent. To get a taste of it, please watch the short film Lights Out on YouTube. It’s less than 3 minutes long, then come back.  And now some news on upcoming podcast episodes: Coming up next is Dr. Christine Evans on Pop Culture Matters and the movie The Night of the Hunter, Fr. Ryan Duns on the theology of horror, Dr. Megan Fritts Cabrera, Dr. Ruben Rosario, Dr. Gerald Schlabach, and Dr. Tim Pawl. Dr. Christine Evans and I have already recorded the next Pop Culture Matters episode, inspired by a recent viewing of The Night of the Hunter and and excellent lecture by Christine at VIFF. We discuss Robert Mitchum's creepy and dreadful film. Follow us at our Instagram page, @stmarkscce, newly revived, and drop us a line as to what you want to see or hear. When we decide what’s next, we’ll let you know and then we can all make sure to watch it or listen to it or read it before the next episode of Pop Culture Matters. Or email us with your suggestions to jmartens@stmarkscollege.ca or cceconferences@stmarkscollege.ca. Some upcoming events: And now some news on upcoming podcast episodes: Coming up next is Dr. Megan Fritts Cabrera, Dr. Ruben Rosario, Dr. Gerald Schlabach, Dr. Don Baker, and Dr. Tim Pawl. What a lineup! Two episodes of Pop Culture Matters are out. I hope you have listened to them. Martin and I are ready for more and we are going to talk about Christmas films. What makes a film a Christmas film? What is your favorite Christmas film? Why is it your favorite? Let us know what you want to discuss next on Pop Culture Matters. Follow us at our Instagram page, @stmarkscce, newly revived, and drop us a line as to what you want to see or hear. We’ll post there with a question as to what you are most interested in. I will also post the question on Facebook @biblejunkies. We will be moving to a CCE Facebook page, but in the meantime, feel free to check us out @biblejunkies. When we decide what’s next, we’ll let you know and then we can all make sure to watch it or listen to it or read it before the next episode of Pop Culture Matters. Or email us with your suggestions to jmartens@stmarkscollege.ca or cceconferences@stmarkscollege.ca. Some upcoming events: You can now register for The Promise of Christian Education: Past, Present and Future, MAY 1-3, 2025, at ST. MARK'S COLLEGE, VANCOUVER, CANADA. We will have over 40 presenters from Asia, Africa, and North America. The webpage for the conference is now available at the CCE website, where you can find information on the speakers and where you can register for The Promise of Christian Education: Past, Present and Future, MAY 1-3, 2025, at ST. MARK'S COLLEGE, VANCOUVER, CANADA. Consider joining us in Vancouver in 2025 for the conference. The cost will be minimal to attend the concurrent sessions of the conference itself, only $60 and I think you will find it stimulating and challenging. It will be exciting. Details are now on the website.  Three confirmed keynote speakers are Dr. Margaret MacDonald, Dr. Samuel Rocha, and Reverend Dr. Stan Chu Ilo. These keynote or plenary sessions are free for all, so look for the registration information on our website now.  Some other upcoming events: On January 27, 2025 we will have an in person and virtual event with Dr Ray Aldred, who will offer the third annual Laudato Si’ lecture, bringing together Indigenous and Christian thought on how to care for creation, our common home. A few thanks are in order. First of all, I am grateful to Martin Strong, who guides me in the podcasting world. Second, the episodes are edited, engineered, and produced by Kevin Eng who is the first listener to all the episodes and helps me pick out those opening snippets which do so much to set the tone for each episode. Thank you, Kevin, for all of your expertise and support. Finally, to the Fang Fang Chandra, the CCE assistant, who helps me bring this podcast to you, but also makes the CCE run so much more smoothly. I also want to thank our donors to the Centre, whose generosity enables this work to take place at all: Peter Bull, Angus Reid, and Andy Szocs. We are thankful to their commitment to the life of the academic world and of the work of the Church in the world by funding the work of the CCE. I am also thankful to the Cullen family, Mark and Barbara, for their support of the ongoing work of the CCE through financial donations that allow us to bring speakers to the local and international arenas. If you are enjoying the podcast, please let your friends know. And also let people know by rating and reviewing What Matters Most on your favourite podcasting platform.  Thanks again for listening and remember what matters most.    John W. Martens Director, Centre for Christian Engagement, St. Mark's College at UBC

Welcome to the second episode of Pop Culture Matters, a discussion with Dr. Christine Evans of UBC on the 1955 movie, The Night of the Hunter. She is Assistant Professor in the Department of Theatre and Film at UBC.    Christine Evans brings a wealth of knowledge about film and is a captivating speaker. How did we come to speak about The Night of the Hunter and not a more recent film? Martin Strong invited me to see the film in the VIFF Pantheon series and I went along with him one Sunday to watch it. Prior to the film, there was a short lecture scheduled, and I groaned a little inside. A lecture before the film? But it was Christine Evans and she is a master teacher. I was enthralled by how she placed the film in its historical context, explained its use of cameras and light and shadow, and how she prepared us to watch the film. This is the only film directed by Charles Laughton, and it stars the great Robert Mitchum, Shelley Winters, and Lillian Gish, and while it did not do well at the box office, it is now seen as a great American films, one of the Pantheon. Martin and I will soon discuss more recent films, but it was essential I thought that we discussed this film in all of its fogginess, vulnerability, and tension. Once the film started that day, I was surprised to find that it began with passages from the Sermon on the Mount and that the biblical themes and passages ran throughout the film. Not only that, but the biblical themes were related to my own area of research: children in the Bible. We talk about these biblical passages in our conversation, but I also return to some of these passages at the end of the podcast as not all of them fit in the context of our conversation.   If you haven’t watched the film yet, track it down. I watched the film two more times on the streamer Kanopy after viewing it at VIFF, a free streaming service which I have through my local library, but I am sure it is available in other places too.  You can listen to the podcast before watching the film, just as I heard Christine speak about it before I saw it, and you will gain a lot from listening. 70 years on, as Christine said at VIFF, there are no real spoilers, but if you can see it before you hear this discussion that could help you understand our conversation more fully. On the other hand, even after watching the film three times, you will hear Christine explain elements of the film that I completely missed – she is the expert – as well as hear me mispronounce Zizek, which might lead me to hand in my academic card.  So, thanks to Martin for making this conversation happen and to Christine Evans for helping us make sense of the movie The Night of the Hunter.  Since St. Mark’s Centre for Christian Engagement seeks to enable the creation of a culture of encounter and dialogue, let me invite you into that discussion. Follow us at our Instagram page, @stmarkscce, newly revived, and drop us a line as to what you want to see or hear. We’ll post there with a question as to what you are most interested in. I will also post the question on Facebook @biblejunkies. We will be moving to a CCE Facebook page, but in the meantime, feel free to check us out @biblejunkies. When we decide what’s next, we’ll let you know and then we can all make sure to watch it or listen to it or read it before the next episode of Pop Culture Matters. Or email us with your suggestions to jmartens@stmarkscollege.ca or cceconferences@stmarkscollege.ca. Thanks to Kevin Eng for editing and engineering this episode. Thanks to Fang Fang Chandra, the CCE assistant, who helps me bring this podcast to you, but also makes the CCE run so much more smoothly. I also want to thank our donors to the Centre, whose generosity enables this work to take place at all: Peter Bull, Angus Reid, and Andy Szocs. We are thankful to their commitment to the life of the academic world and of the work of the Church in the world by funding the work of the CCE. I am also thankful to the Cullen family, Mark and Barbara, for their support of the ongoing work of the CCE through financial donations that allow us to bring speakers to the local and international arenas. If you are enjoying the podcast, please let your friends know. And also let people know by rating and reviewing What Matters Most on your favourite podcasting platform.  John W. Martens