Discourse in Magic

Today Jonah tells you about Unconventional.fun 2: Magicland. He’ll explain to you what this is, how it came to be, and then give you six reasons why this may be something that you want to be a part of.  What is Unconventional.fun?  Six months ago, Ben Trane and Jonah launched the first ever eight-bit video-game virtual-magic convention. What that meant was that not only did you have all the cool parts of a convention, like lectures and shows and things like that, but the thing that they did was create a virtual world, kind of like an old video game, where you would mingle around the world with arrow keys. When you got close to other attendees, you could jam with each other. You could hang out because you could see each other’s cameras and hear each other’s voice. So it was kind of like a real magic convention but placed in a video game world. If you wanted, you could go to enjoy the lectures and panels and shows but you could also hang out with the cool kids in the back jamming or just connect with some of your favorite magicians and hangout and talk like you would at a real convention. It was awesome. They had 250 magicians but made two big obvious glaring errors that they are not going to make again. Two Big Mistakes The first big, huge mistake that they made was that they had 13 hours of lectures and shows and panels but they didn’t record a single thing. Which is funny because this is magic 101… record your shows and record your stuff! The first reason why they didn’t record anything was because they were worried that it was all going to crash completely. It was earlier in the whole zoom world. The second reason why they didn’t record it was because they wanted to make it a live event, a kind of in-person thing, so everyone would be there. But what they didn’t realize was that there’s people all over the world and what’s two o’clock for them in the afternoon was maybe the middle of the night for somebody else. So a lot of people stayed up very late to be a part of the whole entire thing, which was epic but a mistake on their part. The second mistake that they made was that they built a video game world. Jonah and Ben teamed together with coders and designers to make a world that was whatever they wanted. And with unlimited creativity, with unlimited power, the world that they built was … a convention center. They built a floor of a hotel lobby, and it was awesome, they had a dealer’s room, a main stage, jamming areas, a bar, and a lot of different cool stuff like you would have at a real convention. But when they decided to do it again, they knew that they had to make something cool. So after the first convention, they sent out a survey asking if people wanted to do it again. And 96% said yes! So they knew they were going to do another one and they knew they were going to have to make some big changes. Two Big Changes The first big change is that they are recording all of the lectures, panels, and shows so you can watch them afterwards if you can’t make it, or like a convention, if instead of a lecture you’d want to meet up or jam with somebody who’s not lecturing at that time, you can totally do that and watch the lectures afterwards. The second big change is that they built Magicland. It’s a magic themed amusement park. So instead of a dealer’s room, they have a midway. Instead of having a bar, they’ve got food trucks. So now when you walk around the virtual world, you are in a unique place that doesn’t look just like a hotel convention center, but instead it looks like something magical and impossible that has never existed before. What To Expect The first Unconventional.fun was a one day eight bit virtual magic convention. And now, Unconventional.fun 2 will be a two day eight bit video game virtual magic convention. And the days that it’s happening are Saturday, February 27th and Sunday, February 28. Unconventional.fun 2: Magicland is the second ever video game virtual magic convention. Just like the first one, there’s lectures, panels, and shows and also you mingle around with the arrow keys. When you get close to the other attendees your camera and mic fade into view. So you can jam, you can hang out, and you can spend time together. That means that if you come find Jonah, we can jam and hang out with him. You can also hang out with some of the other magicians that are there. Not only the ones on the lineup. At Unconventional.fun 2, you can jam with Eric Jones, Suzanne, Caleb Wiles, Asi Wind, Paul Vigil, Moritz Mueller, and so many different magicians that are going to be there. Six Reasons Why You Should Go Number one: lectures.  Ben and Jonah have brought some of the best lecturers together. Not only people who have been crushing in virtual but also just people who absolutely crush it. So not only do they have a John Guastaferro lecture, which is going to be amazing, they’ve got an Eric Jones lecture and Adrian Lacroix lecture. One lecture that Jonah is looking forward to is Asi Wind who will be doing a part lecture, part Q&A called “Fix Your Magic”. You will get to submit your magic problems and Asi will work to fix them and talk about some potential solutions.  Number two: We have an incredible Virtual Magic Panel. Ben and Johan have pulled together a handful of magicians who have been absolutely crushing it in the world of virtual to ask about why, what, and how they’re doing it and figure out how you can do the same thing.  Number three: Performances. The last year and a half of magic has gone through changes that it has never seen before because of the full fledged transition from in-person magic to virtual magic. So you better believe that when they say they’ve got virtual magic shows for you to watch, they have the best virtual magic performers in the world performing. You will get to see exactly what it is that they’ve created over the past year and how you can maybe do the same thing, not by taking their tricks (unless they’re for sale) but to get some inspiration from some really incredible virtual magic performances. Number four: A custom world.  Ben and Jonah built an entire custom world with magic jokes. And with unlimited different bits and pieces that are hilarious. They have food trucks, a midway, games, and performance spaces. Big enough for 500 magicians Number five: The jamming.  This is really the thing that separates this from other conventions in the virtual space is that you really can mingle around and you really can jam with anyone. Ben and Jonah are going to be there. All of the performers on the lineup are going to be hanging out and jamming. And there’s a really cool feature in this platform where you can search the name of the person that you want to jam with. They’ll come up and then you can go find them. So if you want to jam with Eric Jones, you just search his name, you click on it and it’ll tell you where in the virtual world he is and go and find him. If you want to go jam with Spidey, it’s exactly the same thing, you can search where in the virtual world he is and go find them. If you’ve got a question for Adrian Lacroix or you want to jam with Chris Mayhew or you want to share some tricks with Michael Feldman. Easy! To find them you type their name in a little search bar and then you go find where their little avatar is hanging out. Number Six: It’s yours forever Every single one of those lectures, performances and panel talks, are being recorded and being given out to you forever. If you just bought this to download the videos afterwards, it would be worth it. Get Your Tickets Today It’s happening February 27th 7:00 PM to midnight Eastern Standard Time and then February 28th is the full day from 9:00 AM to midnight. If you’re interested in Unconventional.fun, Just click the links here to read a little bit about what it’s all about. We would love to see you there. 

Jonah is joined by Ben Seidman to talk about working as a consultant on Mindfreak, appearing on Fool Us, and learning how to throw out everything you’ve heard when designing your own show.  He Started Terrible And Then He Got Better Ben doesn’t think his origin story is all that interesting. He was interested in magic and got his dad to buy him a magic kit and he was really bad at it and then he got better. Throughout his early years he says there were two “aha” moments for him that stuck with him throughout his career. The first was the feeling of “crushing” a show and the second was the realization that he was coming up with ideas that nobody else was doing. One of those first ideas, a pick pocket routine he invented when he was 21, would land him his first consulting job on Mindfreak and open the doors to the rest of his future career performing in magic.    At Mindfreak Ben found himself working between Johnny Thompson and Banachek and for someone so young it was inevitable that he would be feeling some imposter syndrome. But once he offered up ideas that they would say were cool too it was validating enough to allow Ben to give himself permission to admit that the work he was doing had value as well. Ben’s time as a consultant and advisor helped him to find his footing but performing had always been his goal. Each of his favourite magicians followed what he calls the holy trifecta, they’re very creative, amazing on stage, and also very technically skilled. Checking off those boxes are important to Ben as well as creating emotional hooks with the audience but also keeping it really funny.  The Importance of Remaining Original  Ben is a passionate advocate for original content. Far too many magicians, including Ben up to a point, have relied on phrases and jokes and lines from other performers. Perhaps it’s from the culture where we get the magic and included is the patter and the instructions tell you what to say and so you say it. But if you’re going to perform magic the only thing you can guarantee will be original will be you. Everyone is performing magic and it’s all just… magic. If you hear a line that another magician says Ben will emphatically tell you that you should never use that line in your own routine.    Who you are and what you say is vastly more important to your connection with the audience. The things that you say are what create the moments. So look through what you say in each trick and if you’ve ever heard that line anywhere else just cross it out. If you take those things out you still have to fill that space. You will start saying the things that are you because you have to. If you put yourself in a position where it’s sink or swim, something will come out of you.  Pivoting To Virtual  Ben also stuck around to share more about how the past year of virtual magic has been for him. One of the things he’s noticed is that it’s much easier to connect with fans of his work. Normally while touring his name alone would not be a huge draw on the marquee. He might have a lot of fans but they’re spread out all over the world. Now thanks to virtual magic they can all gather in the same place. So rather than performing on a live stage to an audience that might not know who he is, he’s been able to perform to fans who know his work and are excited for his unique brand of magic. And that wouldn’t have been possible before virtual magic.    Ben is quick to point out that virtual magic shows are not the same kind of magic as a netflix special. You have to make sure you are interacting with your audience, that’s the one major strength you have in a virtual show that you can’t do in a pre-recorded tv special. He’ll also warn you about over spending and over producing your show. You don’t necessarily need a five camera setup with expensive lights and a set. There’s no shame in doing your show on your laptop camera and seeing how it works out before investing more money into your tech. Focus on what you can bring first. Wrap-Up Endless Chain David Jerard. David is a magician and mentalist based out of San Francisco. David is also one of the people that Ben bounces ideas off of. And also Joe Monti. Joe is strange strange man who Ben loves dearly. He also worked on Mindfreak and has a unique perspective and is super goofy. He talks a mile a minute and his brain works just as fast.  What do you like about modern magic? What do you not like? Ben likes that more people have access to magic. There was a time when you only saw magic when you were in the upper crust, now anyone can see magic. Ben doesn’t like that more people have access to magic. There’s a problem with magic becoming trivialised. Far too many people are putting out magic online before it’s ready to be performed. A moment of magic should be a unique thing but if you can access it non-stop, especially from any level of quality, then it’s no longer this profound and beautiful thing.  Take home point Be Original.  If you forge your own path and you put things into the world that have not been seen before then people get to appreciate you for who you are as opposed to who someone else is. In your everyday life and in your magic try to create moments of joy for people by being the best human you can and trying to be truly you. The more “you” you are the more original you will become, in life and in your magic.  Plugs Ben Seidman’s Oracle System is being sold by Vanishing Ink and is available now to pre-order at www.vanishingincmagic.com/close-up-magic/the-oracle-system.  The Oracle System is the only piece in Ben’s repertoire that is available for public consumption so don’t miss out on this unique opportunity.  The best way to find his tv and video appearances is to just go ahead and google Ben Seidman Videos and you can also visit BenSeidman.com You can also follow Ben on instagram @benseidman

Jonah is joined by Ben Train, his Toronto Magic Company business partner, to offer up a glimpse of what life is like at the Toronto Magic Company, how it’s adapted to the world of virtual magic, upcoming events they’re hosting, and the lessons that he and Ben have learned after almost a full year of pivoting to the virtual.   A New Mission Ben and Jonah launched the Toronto Magic Company four years ago with the mission to share magic with public shows and programming for lay people around the Toronto area. When all live events were cancelled in March 2020 they had to shift the Magic Company to an all virtual environment and now their mission is to simply share magic. Now, thanks to virtual magic, Jonah and Ben are able to share magic not just in their geographic area of Toronto but all over the world, which has really helped to make the work they do a ton of fun.  Having Fun With Virtual Magic For Ben, virtual magic has changed his relationship with magic. In the past Ben has been honest about how challenging live shows can be. With all the prep work, stress, and travelling involved it can really take a toll on someone. Virtual magic has reinvigorated Ben and shown him just how much fun there is to have with magic. Ben feels more creative and more free than he could be on stage, he feels comfortable in his setting rather than feeling nervous before shows and for a variety of reasons this past year has helped Ben fall in love again with magic.  For Jonah, there’s always been so much mystery when you go to a private event to perform and you’re not always guaranteed a receptive audience. With virtual magic, Jonah has discovered a world of enthusiastic audiences excited to see magic done in a novel way. There’s something very special happening right now and the full potential for virtual magic is just beginning to be realized.  Living With Your Business Partner  Shortly after founding the Toronto Magic Company, Jonah and Ben made the decision to move in together as roommates to better coordinate their business projects. So what’s it like living together when each of you are fundamentally very different people? Jonah and Ben pull back the curtain on their home and living arrangement and share stories about how they couldn’t have pulled off this company without the other’s unique input. They also share how they overcome creative differences and lessons they’ve learned over the past several years in resolving conflicts and taking risks.  Next Stop, Magicland!  Unconventional.fun is coming back in 2021 and this year they’re taking a bold leap into a magic park setting. You might recall that in 2020 Ben and Jonah hosted the inaugural Unconventional.fun virtual magic convention by recreating an 8-bit virtual hotel environment where magicians could mill about and jam in the lobby and attend lectures and workshops. For their very first time doing it they wanted to recreate the familiar setting of a conventional convention, but this year they’re pulling out all the stops and embracing the creative freedom that a virtual environment offers. This year Unconventional.fun is going to Magicland, a virtual amusement park for magicians. More details will be coming out soon so for now you should sign up to the mailing list by visiting Unconventional.fun to be notified when tickets go live.

Jonah is joined by Mat Franco where they get to discuss his dominating performance on America’s Got Talent, opening up a For-Real-Life show in Vegas, and knowing from an early age that Mat was destined to live his dream as a magician. Ever since he was five, Mat has dedicated his life to learning and performing magic, from show-and-tell in kindergarten, to the college touring circuit, to winning on America’s Got Talent, to producing a show in Vegas.  No Backup Plan Seeing magic on TV, a five year old Mat asked him parents for some magic tricks and soon after he was performing for his kindergarten class. By elementary school he was performing on stage for the local high school and from then on it’s been non-stop performing. He might claim that he went to business school as a backup plan but the reality is he never had one, it’s always been magic. Tough and ruthless was the name of the game when it came time to get booking to perform on the college circuit and through a mix of good luck, a good show, and being able to speak the language of leadership and business to those who were doing the booking Mat found himself performing for colleges across America.  Winning Wasn’t The Plan The idea for signing up for America’s Got Talent was to be able to get footage of his acts to use to book more gigs at colleges. It was never his intention or belief that he would progress through the competition all the way to winning in the finale. But, as Mat puts it, he was “young, stupid, naive, and tenacious” and able to problem solve his way to adapt the tricks he had in his inner rolodex to performing on the show.   Still A Beginner In Magic Mat still considers himself a beginner in magic and it’s that mindset that he believes has helped him to achieve the success he has found. He never had big dreams, the most he hoped for was to make magic and share it with people. At the end of the day it’s all about attitude, personality, entertaining people, interaction, that’s the real magic, that’s the x-factor, that is intangible. Wrap-Up Endless Chain Bill Malone  What do you like about modern magic? What do you not like? Shows like the Carbonaro Effect and Fool Us which are reframing magic for modern audiences in a way that’s positive and uplifting. For a time magic was being associated with cruel pranks online and it’s nice to see it moving away from that. On the other hand magic is currently suffering from a voyeuristic approach, where people mostly watch magic being done to other people, and Mat would like to see new ways to present magic that allow the person watching it to be more directly involved in the experience.   Take home point I do believe experience is the best teacher. I believe you should follow your passions. And I’m also a believer in good solid technique in whatever it is you’re doing. Not to overlook a good solid base, a good solid background in technique, a toolbox to draw from, that will allow you to create better things. If you get really good at the scales you can write better songs.  Plugs You can listen to Mat co-host the Mind Over Magic podcast with Eric Ditelman Instagram @matfrancomagic Twitter @matfrancomagic Youtube And be sure to visit matfranco.com

Today, we are talking about the three systems that every virtual magician needs in their business. A lot of people ask me, how is it that I can have a podcast, and a virtual magic business, and interview people, and coach magicians, and also post on social media everyday, how I do all of those things. And the answer is not that I wake up really early and drink a ginger root tea or have apple cider vinegar at 6AM, none of those things are true.  The reality is, I rely on systems to make sure that my business grows, even when I’m not putting in the work, and systems are critical for your business because having systems in place, having things in place that work, means that one unit of input doesn’t necessarily mean one unit of output. One unit of input could mean two or five or ten or twenty units of output.  A Lead Generating System For many of us, we do what’s called hope marketing, which is we cross our fingers and we hope that somebody inquires on our website or asks us about what we’re doing. And the reality is if we do not have a system to bring people into our business, then we don’t really have a business. We don’t really have something that regularly makes money. We only make money when other people want us to make money.  So we need to have a system to bring leads into our business. Now you’ve probably been in magic long enough to know that there’s not just one way to do this. It could be social media, you could do ads, you could do events, ticket events, live streams, email outreach, email newsletter, cold calling, referrals… there’s a million different systems that you can have, but just ask yourself right now, do you have a lead generating system? Is there something that if I said tomorrow, I need you to push the button that’s going to bring more leads into your business. Would you know what button to push? A Sales System If you do not have an organized system that takes an interested person to an inquiry, takes an inquiry to a phone call, takes a phone call to a pitch, and then a pitch to a close. Then what happens is you basically just cross your fingers every time that somebody asks you about an event. Because you’re hoping that they decide that it’s good for them. And obviously it’s a two way decision, you know, we’re not deciding if they should hire us, but certainly by having a system, you can be very, very sure about what needs to happen at each phase of the process, instead of hoping that they know what they want, how they want it, when they want it, you decide how it works. You tell them what you offer, what’s most popular, what they should get. You tell them that you schedule phone calls. You tell them how it works, because otherwise you are beholden to their buying process. If they want to buy later, if they don’t want to buy now, if they’re not interested, if they want this and not that you have to do whatever it is that they want. So instead build out your sales system. An Outsourcing System Maybe you’re wondering how it is that I can have a podcast episode every Thursday for the past four years and be a full-time magician and produce ticketed shows and run a coaching program and all of these different things. The answer is outsourcing. I hire out the things that I’m not so good at. There’s only important bits that I do. I write the posts, I say the podcast, but it’s critically important that I find incredibly talented people to put in positions where they do something better than I could ever do. It was cheaper for me because instead of me spending five hours, hours that I totally could have and should have spent doing way more important things, I spent those sitting in front of my computer editing. So ask yourself what processes in your virtual business right now are you doing that maybe you shouldn’t be doing. What pieces can you hand off to somebody else that you do not have to do. Upgrade Your Business These are the three systems that every virtual magician needs. I hope that this was helpful for you. If you want some help doing this, if you want some assistance, then send an e-mail to info@discourseinmagic.com with the word “Upgrade” and I’ll tell you a little more info about the private coaching that I run for virtual magicians.

Jonah is joined by Moritz Mueller where they discuss how to reach out to some of the biggest names in the magic world, different theories of magic and how it can practically apply your work, and how Moritz prepares and learns his own tricks. Moritz is an incredibly talented magician and, at twenty years old, he’s very young for someone with his expertise and skill. So what is he doing that other magicians aren’t? How has he accomplished in less than ten years of sleight of hand that other magicians haven’t been able to do in twenty or thirty? In this interview Jonah and Moritz talk about coin magic and card magic, how to bump elbows with the best of the best, and what it was like to appear on Ellen!  The Magic At Home Advantage Moritz had one major advantage over many other magicians in that his father was already a hobby magician. As Moritz was developing his own interest in magic his father would point out when a trick he was looking to purchase was worth his time or not. Having a magician in the family to help guide his early years meant bypassing a lot of the experimenting that other magicians have to face. By the time he was ready to start performing on his own he already had years of mentorship. What grabbed Moritz’s attention to magic was the small details. How a very small change in detail can have a major impact on a trick’s effectiveness. Those minute details captured Moritz’s ambitions; he would spend years just practicing and learning all the nuances he could and refining those small details. Eventually he drew the attention of others who invited him to attend conventions where he would meet some of the biggest names in the magic community and begin learning and befriending them. If you ask him how he’s ended up with so many big names as personal contacts he’ll happily point out that many of the people he’s met in the magic community are very open to being approached and contacted. As long as you approach them with respect and express your feelings and ask a question you might find that a lot of people are more willing to respond in kind than you might think.  The Man Who Has Practiced One Move 10,000 Times Rather than casting a wide net Moritz focused a very narrow beam early on. It can be very overwhelming thinking that you need to learn all of these many moves to be a successful magician and you can either end up burning out or never developing enough skill in any one move to really be successful. So, being inspired by a famous quote from Bruce Lee, Moritz focused on one thing at a time obsessing over the tiny changes he could do to a single move and it was in coin magic that he discovered was a great playground for him to practice in. Moritz has a lot to say about coin magic. It’s difficulty stems from how simple it is at its core. There are only so many effects possible and the methods are oftentimes equally simple. But there is a very steep learning curve and so much that needs to be done before it even begins to be deceptive and that is what Moritz finds so interesting. He attributes much of career success in magic to the time he invested in coin magic early on because there is so much work that needs to be done before you can even call it magic.  Walking Your Own Path Moritz knows that there’s no real “right” way to live your magic life and thinks that what it comes down to is reflection. How often do you stop along your path and actually think if this is the right thing? How often do you question why you are working on a certain routine or a certain move? What Moritz has always tried to do is realize wrong turns as soon as possible by stopping and questioning himself. Moritz’s advice to you is if you find yourself practicing a lot of things at once and you find yourself so scatterbrained that you can’t keep track of what you’re doing then that might be a sign to keep it simple and focus on one thing at a time. And also read more magic books instead of youtube videos. The theories found in those books will help you understand what you’re seeing in those videos so much more that your entire perspective on magic will shift. There’s not that many magic theory books out there and Jonah has a whole bookshelf of recommendations that you’ve likely heard mentioned dozens of times in the past on this podcast but Moritz can’t recommend “Expert Card Technique” enough. The theory part is so good that Moritz believes that it’s put so concisely that it’s a very good all rounder of magic theory.   Wrap-Up Endless Chain Jan Logemann – “He is just an amazing close up performer… you can’t really put him in a box, he just does great magic” What do you like about modern magic? What do you not like? Moritz likes that he’s seeing people use gimmicks in ways he hasn’t seen before, especially on Instagram. To an extent where the gimmick is being used in a way that can only work on Instagram. What Moritz doesn’t like is the overconfidence of new magicians who think that they don’t need to hear what you have to share.  Take home point What is the right amount of the characteristic that you have? What is the right amount of work? It’s really important to question yourself like that. And capture your own excitement point. That is the most important resource that you have for your magic, your own excitement. That thing that makes you giggle, that thing that gets your heart going, that thing that really inspires you, keep pursuing that and you will get closer and closer to what it is that you want.  Plugs You can follow Moritz on Instagram @moritzmueller00

This is not an episode. This is a thank you.  2020 was a really, really strange year for everybody. It was a strange year for me, and I assume it was a strange year for you too. A Year Of Firsts It was a year full of firsts. It was the first time we had our calendars wiped clean. It was the first time that we all did virtual magic shows. And it’s the first time that many of us rose to that occasion. For me, it was a lot of really crazy firsts. All in 2020, we released episodes with Juan Tamariz, Derren Brown, and Teller, which snuck out just before the end. Thank You! And the reason I’m recording this episode is to thank you. To thank you all so much for your support, not just your support in this year, not just your support in the last few episodes, but your support in the last few years. Your support in being a part of this from the start, you know, I know many of you have been listening to this since day one, and I know there’s so many different things that you could be doing with your time, so much different content you could be consuming. And I am so glad that you spend it all here with me. So thank you, thank you, thank you so much. New Year Resolutions In the past, I’ve done new year’s magic resolution episodes. I used to do them with Tyler. I used to do them with Ben and Jackie and Chris, but this year because of the quarantine, because of the pandemic, because of the, everything I want to say this. Last year, when we did the episode, one of the pieces of feedback that I got from everybody was that usually when I do episodes, I’m either doing an interview or I’m either giving out advice, but the new year’s magic resolution, I kind of give a peek behind the scenes as to what’s going on in my life. What’s going on in the Toronto magic company. And what my mindset is going into the new year. So instead of us doing an episode about all the things we had planned for 2020, and then how all of those plans went horribly wrong instead, Ben and I are going to be doing monthly Toronto magic company episodes here on the podcast. So we’re going to be tuning in once a month to share what we got planned, what’s going on. And if you’re interested in what we’re doing, how we’re handling virtual, if you want to see us doing virtual magic shows, we’re going to be talking about all that, all of our plans, Unconventional.Fun, all of that good stuff. Get More From Behind The Scenes In 2021 So this episode I’m recording because I want to say thank you.  Next episode will be back to interviews, but I just want you to know that over the next 12 months, basically, I’m going to be doing some more behind the scenes episodes to share with you what I’m doing, what I’m up to and what I’m thinking as well. Thanks so much for being here this year and the last five years of this podcast existing, you guys mean the world. I love you all so much. See you next Thursday, Peace!

In this episode, we are talking about if and why you should run your own ticketed virtual magic show and Jonah is going to give you five reasons why you may want to do your very first ticketed virtual magic show. #1: It Makes Money Let’s be honest, it makes money. Why do you think that people keep doing them? Because they’re profitable. They make money. There are dozens and dozens of people who know and love you, and they know that you do magic and they love your work. But they don’t get the opportunity all that often to support you. Maybe they don’t live in the same city as you, maybe they’ve got kids and they don’t get to leave their house all that often to go to your events. Maybe you don’t put on a lot of ticketed public events. So the first reason why you should do this is because there are so many people in your network who wants to come see you perform and they’ve just never been given the opportunity and this is a wonderful opportunity. #2: To Test Your Material The second reason why you may want to put on your own virtual magic show is because there is no better place for you to test material. Think about it, you’re inviting all of these people to come watch you and these are likely people, especially your first few shows, who know you. They like you. They trust you. These are people in your community. Maybe people on your newsletter, maybe these are people who are on your social media channels, who you’ve been friends with, who you’ve been communicating with. This is the safest environment for you to test out new material that is going to potentially make it into your professional or corporate level shows. #3: It’s Easy! The third reason is that it is easy. I’m going to be honest with you. I have produced ticketed events, both in-person and online, and the amount of moving parts that you need to put in place to do an in-person event is way harder than for an online event. When renting out a space and selling the tickets yourself, the costs associated with that are astronomical. The cost associated with doing it in virtual are very, very reasonable. It’s the cost of zoom. Which you already have, and then whatever processing fees for whatever software you use for the tickets, maybe it’s Eventbright, maybe it’s Well-Attended. And if you’re really savvy and you’ve done a few of them and you want to start experimenting into Facebook ads, then you can start spending some money there. But compared to in-person events, you’ve got to spend money on traveling there and back. You got to spend money on dry cleaning. You’ve got to maybe spend money on drinks or on food and on going out. There’s all these different things you have to spend money on. There’s different objects or items needed to bring to the venue, which are costly for you to bring. At home, you don’t have any of that. So if you ever dreamed of doing your own show and selling tickets or dreamed of having your own theater or dreamed of putting on your own show, this is basically the easiest least expensive way to ever, ever try it out and it’ll make you money. #4: Brings In New Bookings The fourth reason, and this is kind of sneaky too, is it is one of the best ways I have found in the world of virtual to bring in new bookings. When somebody goes and they see your virtual magic show, maybe they go to it for free, or they pay $10 or $20 or $50, whatever, they see your virtual magic show. And now they think, “Wow, that’s something I want to do for my friend!”, or, “Wow! That’s something that I want to do for my company!” Every single person who goes to see your show either works at a company or their husband or wife works at a company or their kids go to a school or their kids are having a birthday party. There are so many opportunities for an individual to want to hire a virtual magician that you putting on a ticketed show is more or less your audition to all of these people to tell them, “Hey, I am open for business and you can hire me if you’d like to, because I do virtual magic shows and they look. Epic.” #5: It’s Fun! I know that I’m going to sound a little bit like a sixth grade talent show, but the fifth reason why you should put on your own ticketed virtual magic show is it’s fun. It is fun. It is really, really, really fun. When you do a company show or you do a show for a big bank or whatever, 50-75% of the people there didn’t sign up to go to a magic show. For the most part, they didn’t even know that there was going to be a magic show! So then when you show up, you have to win them over. When somebody who is in your network, someone who’s known you in the past, buys a ticket to your show and then comes to the show, they’re going to have a good time. Because they like magic and they like you. They’ve already self-selected themselves. So your show is going to have better laughs, more fun, better thank-you’s and wonderful testimonials that come afterwards, just because you decided to step outside of the box and put on a virtual magic show of your own. Join The Upgrade Academy If you need help, if you need a little bit of assistance with putting on your own ticketed virtual magic show, then let me know, send me a message and I will tell you a little bit about some of the fun stuff that I do. Upgrade Academy, which is my private coaching group starting this January. If you want some help going crazy in the virtual space, let me know, I’d be pumped to help you.

Jonah is joined by none other than Teller himself to discuss his history in magic, the challenges of producing Fool Us during a global pandemic, and how he views a world where every magic secret can easily be researched online. Not Always The Silent Type Teller wasn’t always silent and he opens up about his early days struggling as a magician performing for fraternities that wouldn’t pay attention to him and would throw hard candy and cups of beer at him. As he got more silent in his routines he found that the audiences got drawn in and would pay more attention. As Teller puts it, he discovered he had an innate skill for lying with his body.  Before he was one half of the most famous magic duo in the world he was a public school teacher. Invited by Penn to a renaissance fair, he took a leave of absence to explore the possibility of working as a magician full time and never returned to his old job. But it would be years of performing in relative obscurity mixed with a dash of major financial losses from failed attempts before they would end up performing off Broadway in the 80’s and begin to change the magic business forever.  Magic For TV From their infamous appearances on David Letterman, to their mind warping presentation on Saturday Night Live, to producing Fool Us today, Teller has had a great deal of opportunity to consider how to create magic for a television audience. He and Penn learned quite early on that the best way to perform on camera was to perform towards someone, like David Letterman, and to use the stage as an opportunity to bring the audience backstage with them and become culpable in the acts, like on Saturday Night Live where the audience in the studio could see they were upside down long before the audience at home was aware of the illusion. All of those lessons they have learned have culminated into Fool Us where instead of performing for the camera the contestants on the show perform for Penn & Teller.  The Game of Magic Fool Us also breaks one of the other “rules” of magic and encourages the act of trying to figure out how the trick is done. Teller is honest about his feelings that for many people watching magic that’s a major part of the fun of magic. By framing their entire show around trying to guess how a trick is performed they’re also able to acknowledge and embrace how most people consume magic while still speaking in code to preserve secrets and not truly bring the audience backstage. While most people attending a magic show are trying to figure out how the trick is done, in reality they probably don’t really want to know how it’s done as Teller points out that most magic secrets are really very dull, boring, and usually involve grueling mundane tasks. The better the trick looks on the stage the more dull the trick is back stage. So for Teller it becomes a balancing act of finding out how much “backstage” to appear to let the audience in on while in reality preserving the fantastic qualities of what the audience thinks is really going on.  Wrap-Up Endless Chain Teller thinks we would have great fun with Piff The Magic Dragon and one magician that Teller finds absolutely fascinating is Bob Farmer What do you like about modern magic? What do you not like? Teller likes the proliferation of magic on the internet like being able to watch performances online that you otherwise wouldn’t see. Teller doesn’t find very satisfying magic that is just being done for the camera lens and doesn’t give him the fair chance to do the intellectual part. If it just looks impossible and is impossible then it doesn’t feel like the “game” part of magic is as fun.  Take home point “My definition of misdirection is the story you get the audience to tell itself. If you think about that for a while you may find it a very fruitful definition of misdirection. What you’re trying to do is to get the audience is to tell itself a story. You’re inducing them to tell that story to themselves. And what’s you start thinking of those terms, it’s a helpful concept”.  Plugs If you think you have what it takes to appear on Fool Us then you should e-mail FoolUsCasting@gmail.com and you will be invited to send a videotape of what you are proposing and Teller will never know about it. If you’ve never watched any of the zombie movies that Teller made with Ezekiel Zabrowski then you really should look into it.

This episode with Jonah is going to be ridiculously short because it’s not really an episode. But First, Congratulations Jonah wants to say two things. The first thing is to say congratulations. This year has been really strange. And for many of us, it kind of all accumulated to December, which was for many of us, our busiest virtual magic month ever, where 12 months ago, not one of us was doing virtual magic. So you owe yourself a pat on the back for an interesting, fun, and strange, and a little bit of a hopefully memorable year that you’re going to remember for the rest of your life. Give yourself a Pat on the back for some of the amazing stuff that you’ve done. And Now, For Something Completely Amazing The second reason for this episode is to tell you about next week’s episode. At the end of every Discourse in Magic podcast, Jonah asks each guest about the “Endless Chain”. In order to keep the podcast going on for eternity, each guest is asked to recommend another guest that would be perfect for the show. There are two reasons why Jonah does this. The first reason is to help introduce us to new people that we don’t know and help to keep the podcast go on forever. But the second reason is to get in contact with some very specific, very hard to reach people, who have a lot of important things to say in the world of magic. It is without exaggeration that we tell you that the episode coming out next week is one of the most exciting episodes that we have ever released. Not only is this someone who you know and love, but he over delivered on the episode and we are so excited to share it with you. We can’t say too much about who it is yet, but what we can say is, for those of you that get it, we hope this makes up for our April Fools prank a few years back…