A Couple of Multiples: The Reality of Living with Dissociative Identity Disorder
Drew & Garden System
There’s never a dull moment for hosts, Drew and Garden System, who are a couple that have both been diagnosed with Dissociative Identity Disorder. While they are navigating their healing journey, they continue to manage full time careers, raise four teenagers and a house full of pets. Not only do they aim to speak to people who have lived experience with DID and their supporters, but also therapists and anyone who wants to learn more. The podcast talks about Dissociative Identity Disorder in a way that someone who knows nothing about DID will be able to understand, and at the same time is designed to be a resource for therapists, while supporting and validating those with lived experience. Dissociative Identity Disorder is a highly stigmatized mental health diagnosis that has been subject to many myths and misinformation over the years. These myths, along with highly-sensationalized media portrayals, have led to many who still believe this disorder is not real and simply created by therapists who impose themselves on highly suggestible clients. The goal of the podcast is to dispel these myths and educate the world at large the truth about Dissociative Identity Disorder, and the reality of what having this diagnosis really looks like. The brain had to find a unique way to cope in order to survive the trauma people with DID faced from a very young age. Also, this condition is not rare, although many reputable sources still cite it as such. People with DID are ordinary members in your community that you might encounter in your daily life. Drew and Garden System want to shed light on the challenging symptoms people with DID face and share how they have overcome those challenges and found the gifts of joy that all of their parts bring to each other.
Episodes
Mentioned books
Mar 31, 2026 • 57min
Yoga, Somatics, & Dissociative Identity Disorder: An Interview with Amy Beckler LCSW RYT-200hr
Drew & Garden System have an informative discussion with Amy Beckler LCSW on the benefits of yoga and somatic exercises for people living with complex trauma, particularly those experiencing dissociative identities.Wheel of Tolerance - https://livethechange.se/index.php/blog/the-wheel-of-toleranceDissociation Made Simple - https://amzn.to/4uZYmB0 Thank to our sponsors:Healing My Parts - https://www.healingmyparts.org/Healing Selves Therapeutics - https://www.healingselvestherapeuticspllc.com/ Follow us on Instagram: @acoupleofmultiples, @note_to_selves, @seidi_gardensystemFollow us on TikTok: @seidi_gardensystem, @note_to_selvesFollow us on Facebook: A Couple of Multiples - https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61556823127239 Visit our website: acoupleofmultiples.com to sign up for our mailing list, join our private, on-line community Hearts Multiplied, register for peer coaching, consultations, and workshops!Remember, this podcast is not a substitute for therapy. The purpose of this podcast is to educate and provide information on dissociative identity disorder. We share our personal stories, interview guests who also live with DID, and we interview mental health professionals to share their clinical knowledge.And most importantly: remember that every system is different. What works for one may not work for another—and that’s okay. Your journey is valid, your healing is real, and we’re so glad you’re hanging out with A Couple of Multiples.Articles cited in Seasons 4 & 5:Brand, B. L., Sar, V., Stavropoulos, P., Krüger, C., Korzekwa, M., Martínez-Taboas, A., & Middleton, W. (2016). Separating Fact from Fiction: An Empirical Examination of Six Myths About Dissociative Identity Disorder. Harvard review of psychiatry, 24(4), 257–270. https://doi.org/10.1097/HRP.0000000000000100
Mar 17, 2026 • 1h 25min
An Apparently Normal Person: An Interview with Bonnie Armstrong
Drew & Garden System discuss the healing journey from childhood abuse and dissociative identity disorder with Bonnie Armstrong, the author of An Apparently Normal Person. Bonnie's story is unique in that she worked in child welfare and advocacy without realizing she, too, was a survivor of childhood abuse. Her medical struggles helped her uncover the truth about her past.Bonnie R. Armstrong spent decades as an apparently normal person, unaware of the complex dissociative infrastructure that hid much of her childhood from her conscious memory and supported her from inside. Bonnie enjoyed her life as wife, mother, community activist, and a 40-year career that included high-level positions in two Governors' offices. She served as an expert consultant on child and family policy issues with federal, state, county and local governments and philanthropies, and as a national speaker and trainer. She specialized in youth development and child abuse prevention, not knowing that she was also an abuse survivor. When she turned fifty, a mysterious and debilitating illness attacked Bonnie, eventually requiring her to use a wheelchair to continue her active life. After six years of testing and continued degeneration, her neurologist ruled out medical causes and referred her to a psychologist. Together, Bonnie and her therapist slowly uncovered her dissociative disorder, her strong internal community, and the secrets of her childhood. Now she has written a memoir that chronicles her healing journey and the ways her system used dissociation to survive and thrive. An Apparently Normal Person: From Medical Mystery to Dissociative Superpower has won several awards and was an Amazon best-seller. Bonnie continues to speak out and write about dissociation and childhood trauma. She also is a life coach, a grandmother and the matriarch of a large extended family. She and her internal community live collaboratively, focused on their joint life's purpose to break generational cycles of abuse and to use every moment and interaction to create a more loving, harmonious world. Visit Bonnie's website: https://www.bonnierarmstrong.com/Buy Bonnie's book, An Apparently Normal Person, here: https://amzn.to/4sl5TsCThank you to our sponsors:An Infinite Mind: https://www.aninfinitemind.org/Healing My Parts: Follow us on Instagram: @acoupleofmultiples, @note_to_selves, @seidi_gardensystemFollow us on TikTok: @seidi_gardensystem, @note_to_selvesFollow us on Facebook: A Couple of Multiples - https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61556823127239 Visit our website: acoupleofmultiples.com to sign up for our mailing list, join our private, on-line community Hearts Multiplied, register for peer coaching, consultations, and workshops!Remember, this podcast is not a substitute for therapy. The purpose of this podcast is to educate and provide information on dissociative identity disorder. We share our personal stories, interview guests who also live with DID, and we interview mental health professionals to share their clinical knowledge.And most importantly: remember that every system is different. What works for one may not work for another—and that’s okay. Your journey is valid, your healing is real, and we’re so glad you’re hanging out with A Couple of Multiples.Articles cited in Seasons 4 & 5:Brand, B. L., Sar, V., Stavropoulos, P., Krüger, C., Korzekwa, M., Martínez-Taboas, A., & Middleton, W. (2016). Separating Fact from Fiction: An Empirical Examination of Six Myths About Dissociative Identity Disorder. Harvard review of psychiatry, 24(4), 257–270. https://doi.org/10.1097/HRP.0000000000000100
Mar 3, 2026 • 1h 7min
Healing From Cult Torture: An Interview with Cheryl Rainfield
Drew & Garden System have an in depth discussion about surviving and healing from cult torture and abuse with Cheryl Rainfield, a survivor living with poly-fragmented dissociative identities. who used creative writing as a tool for healing and to shed light on the truth on cults and human trafficking.Award-winning author Cheryl Rainfield is a nonbinary lesbian who writes novels for teens, drawing on their own trauma and healing experience to write. They’re the author of six books including SCARS, STAINED, HUNTED, and VISIONS; SCARS has their own arm on the cover. Cheryl is a cult torture survivor with resulting polyfragmented Dissociative Identity, and talks about these issues on social media and through articles on their website. Cheryl Rainfield has been said to write with “great empathy and compassion” and to write stories that “can, perhaps, save a life.”CherylRainfield.com . TikTok . Facebook . Instagram . YouTubeCheryl also published an article about how cults utilize aspects of EMDR in their torture and modifications for therapists to help overcome these barriers. Check it out here: https://www.cherylrainfield.com/cult-uses-aspects-of-emdr-in-cult-torture/.Thank you to our sponsors:Petals of a Rose: https://www.dylancrumpler.com/watch-petals-of-a-roseHealing Selves Therapeutics: https://www.healingselvestherapeuticspllc.com/Follow us on Instagram: @acoupleofmultiples, @note_to_selves, @seidi_gardensystem Follow us on TikTok: @seidi_gardensystem, @note_to_selves Follow us on Facebook: A Couple of Multiples - https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61556823127239 Visit our website: acoupleofmultiples.com to sign up for our mailing list, join our private, on-line community Hearts Multiplied, register for peer coaching, consultations, and workshops! Remember, this podcast is not a substitute for therapy. The purpose of this podcast is to educate and provide information on dissociative identity disorder. We share our personal stories, interview guests who also live with DID, and we interview mental health professionals to share their clinical knowledge. And most importantly: remember that every system is different. What works for one may not work for another—and that’s okay. Your journey is valid, your healing is real, and we’re so glad you’re hanging out with A Couple of Multiples. Articles cited in Seasons 4 & 5: Brand, B. L., Sar, V., Stavropoulos, P., Krüger, C., Korzekwa, M., Martínez-Taboas, A., & Middleton, W. (2016). Separating Fact from Fiction: An Empirical Examination of Six Myths About Dissociative Identity Disorder. Harvard review of psychiatry, 24(4), 257–270. https://doi.org/10.1097/HRP.0000000000000100
Feb 17, 2026 • 48min
You Can Heal: Jade Miller, Peer Support Specialist
Drew & Garden System share powerful healing stories from Jade Miller, a peer support specialist. Jade Miller is a multiple, writer, and peer support worker who helps others living with dissociative experiences find community, language, and grounding. Through her coaching at Peer Support for Multiples and her upcoming Safe Harbor Peer Respite Center, she's building spaces where complexity and healing can coexist. Her teaching and writing emphasize belonging, integrity, and the quiet power of survivors leading their own recovery.Safe Harbor Peer Respite CenterThank you to our sponsors!Alix Amar with Dissociative Creative ExplorationsHealing My PartsFollow us on Instagram: @acoupleofmultiples, @note_to_selves, @seidi_gardensystem Follow us on TikTok: @seidi_gardensystem, @note_to_selves Follow us on Facebook: A Couple of Multiples - https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61556823127239 Visit our website: acoupleofmultiples.com to sign up for our mailing list, join our private, on-line community Hearts Multiplied, register for peer coaching, consultations, and workshops! Remember, this podcast is not a substitute for therapy. The purpose of this podcast is to educate and provide information on dissociative identity disorder. We share our personal stories, interview guests who also live with DID, and we interview mental health professionals to share their clinical knowledge. And most importantly: remember that every system is different. What works for one may not work for another—and that’s okay. Your journey is valid, your healing is real, and we’re so glad you’re hanging out with A Couple of Multiples. Articles cited in Seasons 4 & 5: Brand, B. L., Sar, V., Stavropoulos, P., Krüger, C., Korzekwa, M., Martínez-Taboas, A., & Middleton, W. (2016). Separating Fact from Fiction: An Empirical Examination of Six Myths About Dissociative Identity Disorder. Harvard review of psychiatry, 24(4), 257–270. https://doi.org/10.1097/HRP.0000000000000100
Feb 3, 2026 • 1h 22min
Old Before Their Time: An Interview with Dr, Frank W. Putnam
Welcome to Season 5!Dr. Frank W. Putnam shares the results from a 35 year long study, the Female Growth & Development Study, which he co-founded with the late Penelope K Trickett, PhD, on the effects of childhood maltreatment, particularly childhood sexual abuse.Frank W. Putnam, MD, is a child and adolescent psychiatrist and an internationally recognized expert on the health effects of child abuse and family violence. He helped to create the Dissociative Experiences Scale.You can buy a copy of Dr. Frank W. Putnam's book here: https://amzn.to/4bPU2gcThank you to our sponsors:Transitions Delaware LLCHealing Selves Therapeutics PLLCFollow us on Instagram: @acoupleofmultiples, @note_to_selves, @seidi_gardensystemFollow us on TikTok: @seidi_gardensystem, @note_to_selvesFollow us on Facebook: A Couple of Multiples - https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61556823127239 Visit our website: acoupleofmultiples.com to sign up for our mailing list, join our private, on-line community Hearts Multiplied, register for peer coaching, consultations, and workshops!Remember, this podcast is not a substitute for therapy. The purpose of this podcast is to educate and provide information on dissociative identity disorder. We share our personal stories, interview guests who also live with DID, and we interview mental health professionals to share their clinical knowledge.And most importantly: remember that every system is different. What works for one may not work for another—and that’s okay. Your journey is valid, your healing is real, and we’re so glad you’re hanging out with A Couple of Multiples.Articles cited in Seasons 4 & 5:Brand, B. L., Sar, V., Stavropoulos, P., Krüger, C., Korzekwa, M., Martínez-Taboas, A., & Middleton, W. (2016). Separating Fact from Fiction: An Empirical Examination of Six Myths About Dissociative Identity Disorder. Harvard review of psychiatry, 24(4), 257–270. https://doi.org/10.1097/HRP.0000000000000100
Oct 14, 2025 • 40min
The Price of the Podcast: The Risk of Public Disclosure & Addressing Misconceptions of Dissociative Identity Disorder
Drew & Garden System share a deep and personal story of how disclosure and having this podcast affected their personal lives. They discuss the consequences of fear and stigma that people with dissociative identity disorder face. They address system management, switching, and littles and how their systems work together to maintain employment and lead successful lives. Thank you to our sponsors:Healing Selves TherapeuticsPetals of a RoseFollow us on Instagram: @acoupleofmultiples, @note_to_selves, @seidi_gardensystem Follow us on TikTok: @seidi_gardensystem, @note_to_selves Follow us on Facebook: A Couple of Multiples - https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61556823127239 Visit our website: acoupleofmultiples.com to sign up for our mailing list, join our private, on-line community Hearts Multiplied, register for peer coaching, consultations, and workshops! Remember, this podcast is not a substitute for therapy. The purpose of this podcast is to educate and provide information on dissociative identity disorder. We share our personal stories, interview guests who also live with DID, and we interview mental health professionals to share their clinical knowledge. And most importantly: remember that every system is different. What works for one may not work for another—and that’s okay. Your journey is valid, your healing is real, and we’re so glad you’re hanging out with A Couple of Multiples. Articles cited in Seasons 4 & 5: Brand, B. L., Sar, V., Stavropoulos, P., Krüger, C., Korzekwa, M., Martínez-Taboas, A., & Middleton, W. (2016). Separating Fact from Fiction: An Empirical Examination of Six Myths About Dissociative Identity Disorder. Harvard review of psychiatry, 24(4), 257–270. https://doi.org/10.1097/HRP.0000000000000100
Sep 30, 2025 • 54min
Supporting the Challenges of Living with Dissociative Identity Disorder
An unscripted interview: Drew & Garden System discuss supporting the challenges of living with dissociative identity disorder. Topics include disclosure, boundaries, and ideas for those who are supporting loved ones with DID.Thank you to our sponsors:Healing Selves TherapeuticsTo Life! CounselingFollow us on Instagram: @acoupleofmultiples, @note_to_selves, @seidi_gardensystem Follow us on TikTok: @seidi_gardensystem, @note_to_selves Follow us on Facebook: A Couple of Multiples - https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61556823127239 Visit our website: acoupleofmultiples.com to sign up for our mailing list, join our private, on-line community Hearts Multiplied, register for peer coaching, consultations, and workshops! Remember, this podcast is not a substitute for therapy. The purpose of this podcast is to educate and provide information on dissociative identity disorder. We share our personal stories, interview guests who also live with DID, and we interview mental health professionals to share their clinical knowledge. And most importantly: remember that every system is different. What works for one may not work for another—and that’s okay. Your journey is valid, your healing is real, and we’re so glad you’re hanging out with A Couple of Multiples. Articles cited in Seasons 4 & 5: Brand, B. L., Sar, V., Stavropoulos, P., Krüger, C., Korzekwa, M., Martínez-Taboas, A., & Middleton, W. (2016). Separating Fact from Fiction: An Empirical Examination of Six Myths About Dissociative Identity Disorder. Harvard review of psychiatry, 24(4), 257–270. https://doi.org/10.1097/HRP.0000000000000100
Sep 16, 2025 • 1h 2min
Understanding Recovery & 12 Steps for Dissociative Identities: An Interview with Dr. Jamie+ Marich
Drew & Garden System have an illuminating conversation with Dr. Jamie+ Marich on recovery, the 12 step program, and dissociative identity disorder. They touch on important topics such as sponsors, adaptations and language, and considerations needed for recovery.Resources: https://jamiemarich.substack.com/p/does-aa-work Thank you to our sponsors:The Institute for Creative Mindfulness & Healing Selves Therapeutics!Visit acoupleofmultiples.com to learn more about our online community, consultations, and to join our mailing list to keep up to date with Drew & Garden System!Follow us on Instagram: @acoupleofmultiples, @note_to_selves, @seidi_gardensystem Follow us on TikTok: @seidi_gardensystem, @note_to_selves Follow us on Facebook: A Couple of Multiples - https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61556823127239 Visit our website: acoupleofmultiples.com to sign up for our mailing list, join our private, on-line community Hearts Multiplied, register for peer coaching, consultations, and workshops! Remember, this podcast is not a substitute for therapy. The purpose of this podcast is to educate and provide information on dissociative identity disorder. We share our personal stories, interview guests who also live with DID, and we interview mental health professionals to share their clinical knowledge. And most importantly: remember that every system is different. What works for one may not work for another—and that’s okay. Your journey is valid, your healing is real, and we’re so glad you’re hanging out with A Couple of Multiples. Articles cited in Seasons 4 & 5: Brand, B. L., Sar, V., Stavropoulos, P., Krüger, C., Korzekwa, M., Martínez-Taboas, A., & Middleton, W. (2016). Separating Fact from Fiction: An Empirical Examination of Six Myths About Dissociative Identity Disorder. Harvard review of psychiatry, 24(4), 257–270. https://doi.org/10.1097/HRP.0000000000000100
Sep 2, 2025 • 1h 16min
Ketamine Assisted Therapy & Dissociative Identity Disorder: An Interview with Melissas Parker, LMHC
Drew & Garden System discuss all things related to ketamine-assisted psychotherapy, other psychedelics, and dissociative identity disorder with Melissas Parker, LMHC.Thank you to our sponsors: (sponsorship of this episode does not indicate an endorsement of KAP or psychedelic therapies.)Healing Selves Therapeutics - https://www.healingselvestherapeuticspllc.com/Yvonne Fall, LPC -https://www.yvonnefalllpc.com/Resources:Maps.orghttps://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10979792/https://www.natalierusspsyd.com/therapy-harmhttps://www.yalemedicine.org/news/ketamine-for-depressionVisit acoupleofmultiples.com to join our private, online DID community ($10 or $30/monthly memberships), schedule consultations, and join our mailing list!Follow us on Instagram: @acoupleofmultiples, @note_to_selves, @seidi_gardensystem Follow us on TikTok: @seidi_gardensystem, @note_to_selves Follow us on Facebook: A Couple of Multiples - https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61556823127239 Visit our website: acoupleofmultiples.com to sign up for our mailing list, join our private, on-line community Hearts Multiplied, register for peer coaching, consultations, and workshops! Remember, this podcast is not a substitute for therapy. The purpose of this podcast is to educate and provide information on dissociative identity disorder. We share our personal stories, interview guests who also live with DID, and we interview mental health professionals to share their clinical knowledge. And most importantly: remember that every system is different. What works for one may not work for another—and that’s okay. Your journey is valid, your healing is real, and we’re so glad you’re hanging out with A Couple of Multiples. Articles cited in Seasons 4 & 5: Brand, B. L., Sar, V., Stavropoulos, P., Krüger, C., Korzekwa, M., Martínez-Taboas, A., & Middleton, W. (2016). Separating Fact from Fiction: An Empirical Examination of Six Myths About Dissociative Identity Disorder. Harvard review of psychiatry, 24(4), 257–270. https://doi.org/10.1097/HRP.0000000000000100
Aug 19, 2025 • 1h 12min
Queering EMDR Therapy & Understanding Dissociation in the LGBTQIA+ Community: An Interview with Rev. Karla Fleshman LCSW, MDiv
Drew & Garden System have an open-hearted discussion with Rev. Karla Fleshman on her contributions to Queering EMDR Therapy, an upcoming book edited by Roshni Chabra LMFT and with a forward by Dr. Jamie Marich. They dive into Rev. Karla's battle with cancer, spirituality, how gender identity can contribute to dissociative experiences, and how one can find healing and community.Preorder Queering EMDR Therapy here: https://queeringemdr.com/You can reach out to Rev. Karla Fleshman LCSW MDiv here: https://transitionsde.com/about-karla-fleshman-lcsw-mdiv-2/ Thank you to our sponsors:To Life! Counseling - https://tolifecounseling.com/Healing Selves Therapeutics - https://www.healingselvestherapeuticspllc.com/Visit acoupleofmultiples.com to contact us, to schedule a consult with Garden System, to join Hearts Multiplied, our on-line DID community, and join our mailing list for exclusive resources!Follow us on Instagram: @acoupleofmultiples, @note_to_selves, @seidi_gardensystem Follow us on TikTok: @seidi_gardensystem, @note_to_selves Follow us on Facebook: A Couple of Multiples - https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61556823127239 Visit our website: acoupleofmultiples.com to sign up for our mailing list, join our private, on-line community Hearts Multiplied, register for peer coaching, consultations, and workshops! Remember, this podcast is not a substitute for therapy. The purpose of this podcast is to educate and provide information on dissociative identity disorder. We share our personal stories, interview guests who also live with DID, and we interview mental health professionals to share their clinical knowledge. And most importantly: remember that every system is different. What works for one may not work for another—and that’s okay. Your journey is valid, your healing is real, and we’re so glad you’re hanging out with A Couple of Multiples. Articles cited in Seasons 4 & 5: Brand, B. L., Sar, V., Stavropoulos, P., Krüger, C., Korzekwa, M., Martínez-Taboas, A., & Middleton, W. (2016). Separating Fact from Fiction: An Empirical Examination of Six Myths About Dissociative Identity Disorder. Harvard review of psychiatry, 24(4), 257–270. https://doi.org/10.1097/HRP.0000000000000100
