Gal Beckerman — author of the new book How to Be a Dissident — joins the Chuck Toddcast for a timely conversation about what it actually takes to resist authoritarianism, written explicitly for an American audience that he argues is now experiencing something abnormal and authoritarian for the first time. Beckerman, drawing on his years of reporting on historical resistance movements, identifies the qualities that successful dissidents across cultures and eras tend to share: the ability to step away from human conformity, a deep sense of pessimism that paradoxically motivates action, and a willingness to be reckless in ways that expose the cruelty of the system they're fighting — whether that's putting children in harm's way during the Birmingham civil rights protests, setting oneself on fire to prove a point, or Alexei Navalny choosing to return to Russia knowing he would likely lose his life. He explains why killing dissidents often backfires by making them immortal, why humor and satire are uniquely powerful tools that authorities have always tried to suppress (medieval rulers banned satire for a reason), and the simple question every dissident eventually faces: "Can I live with myself?"
The conversation turns to what Beckerman sees happening in America right now. He praises the No Kings protests for ramping up demonstrations strategically and points to Minneapolis during ICE's occupation as a moment where ordinary Americans demonstrated genuine dissident behavior. Beckerman makes the provocative argument that the most effective dissidents tend to come from within the system rather than from outside it. He compares Hungary's recent overthrow of Orbán, which was made possible by years of civic organizing in rural areas building the sense of community needed to believe change was possible, with America's institutional capitulation under Trump. He argues Americans weren't prepared to act because they'd never faced this situation before, but that ICE's actions in Minneapolis genuinely woke many people up, They close with cautious optimism: Trump has shaken Americans out of complacency, voter turnout is at its highest in a century, the country has become more sophisticated about protest, and that most dissidents don't realize they've succeeded in the moment they're acting.
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Timeline:
(Timestamps may vary based on advertisements)
00:00 Gal Beckerman joins the Chuck ToddCast
01:45 The book is intended for an American audience
02:15 Americans are experiencing something abnormal & authoritarian
03:00 The conditions for a “normal life” are being impeded on in America
03:30 We saw true dissidents in Minneapolis during ICE occupation
05:00 Most people are hardwired to conform, Minneapolis didn’t
05:30 Dissidents say “no” when their conscience is being violated
06:30 The most simple question for dissidents is “Can I live with myself?”
08:30 What made Soviet dissidents successful vs. modern Russians?
10:00 Soviet Jews were oppressed, but also couldn’t leave
10:45 Soviet Jews broadcast to the world that they were basically prisoners
12:30 Orban’s fall in Hungary had been percolating for years
13:30 Civic organizations in rural Hungary had been organizing
14:30 The sense of community helped people think Orban could be defeated
15:30 No Kings protests have been smart about ramping up demonstrations
16:00 People can join No Kings for their preferred cause & find community
17:30 Are the most effective dissidents the people who came from the system?
18:15 Navalny in Russia was a creature of the establishment
19:15 Liz Cheney didn’t work as a dissident since she wasn’t from Trump wing
20:45 The qualities found in dissidents transcend cultures and eras
22:00 Dissidents have to be able to step away from human conformity
22:45 Pessimism is a common quality in dissidents
24:15 If you think things will get better, it doesn’t motivate you to act
25:30 The difference between fatalism and pessimism
27:15 Humor and satire are a great way to speak to broader audiences
28:30 The absurdity in satire cuts through
30:00 Satire was pulled down by authorities during the middle ages
30:30 Why is recklessness the mark of a successful dissident?
31:30 Putting children in harms way in Birmingham showed cruelty of segregation
32:45 People set themselves on fire to prove a point
34:00 Navalny risked and ultimately lost his life by going back to Russia
35:30 Killing dissidents can make them immortal, make them more powerful
37:45 It’s important to understand what qualities make for a powerful dissident
38:45 We’ve seen institutions and people capitulate in America
39:30 Disney settling with Trump put a permanent stain on corporate owned media
42:00 Americans weren’t prepared to act because they’ve never faced this situation
42:45 ICE going to Minneapolis really woke up many Americans
43:15 Being a citizen does demand hard choices sometimes
46:15 Israeli society is organized around the idea that citizenship is active work
47:00 The upside to the Trump era, is the highest voter turnout in a century
48:30 Trump has shaken many Americans out of their sense of complacency
49:30 America has become more sophisticated about protesting
51:15 America wants change badly, they keep voting for it
52:00 Change takes time and people are increasingly impatient
54:00 What lesson do you hope people most learn from your book?
56:45 Moral choices are a burden, but are also creative acts
58:15 Most dissidents don’t know they are successful in the moment
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