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E185 - Henry Shukman: A Zen Master With 40 Years of Practice on Who You Really Are

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Mar 10, 2026

Guest

Henry Shukman

Henry Shukman, Zen teacher, poet, novelist, and creator of The Way app, offers a grounded take on Zen and original love. He recounts a spontaneous awakening, explores how awakening differs from psychological healing, and explains practices like mindfulness, jhanas, koans, and bringing insight into ordinary life.

02:06:05

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Episode notes

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ADVICE

Notice The Voice To Create Space

Notice the constant inner voice to create distance from it.
Henry recommends building mindfulness so you can inhabit the gap between awareness and the running commentary.

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ADVICE

Use Community And Hidden Support Networks

Remember your practice is communal and supported, not solitary.
Henry stresses sangha and unseen networks (archetypal, imaginal realm) as essential support alongside individual mindfulness.

insights

INSIGHT

Samadhi Is Natural Flow, Not A Trick

Samadhi or absorption are natural human flow states accessible in meditation and activity.
Shukman describes jhanas as progressively refined absorptions that novice meditators can unexpectedly drop into.

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What Is Zen and Its Core Practice

01:23 • 3min

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Goal of Zen: Awakening and Living It

04:02 • 3min

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How Zen Spread: India to China to Japan

06:50 • 7min

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Original Love: Our Deepest Nature

13:41 • 4min

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Mindfulness: Noticing the Chattering Mind

17:46 • 4min

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Connection and Sangha as Support

22:07 • 5min

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Samadhi and Flow States in Practice

26:52 • 2min

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Jhanas Explained: Progressive Absorptions

Tasting Awakening: Beach Sunset Insight

35:50 • 2min

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Awakening vs Psychological Healing

38:16 • 9min

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Two Tracks: Gradual Practice and Awakening

47:00 • 4min

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Life Changes, Teaching, and Original Love Map

50:48 • 5min

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Distinct Flavor of Zen: Embodied, Mundane Awakening

56:06 • 4min

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Koans as a Technology for Embodiment

59:51 • 7min

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Working Koans: Breakthroughs and Practice

Daily Life as the Practice

01:15:10 • 13min

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Importance of Daily Meditation Practice

01:28:25 • 6min

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Beauty, Poetry, and Noticing the World

01:34:41 • 14min

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Heartbreak, Grief, and Opening the Heart

01:48:46 • 14min

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Final Truth: You Are Love

• Mentioned in 21 episodes

I Am That

Nisargadatta Maharaj

This book preserves Maharaj's dialogues with followers from around the world who sought his guidance in destroying false identities. His sole concern was with human suffering and the ending of suffering. Maharaj taught that the mind must recognize and penetrate its own state of being, breaking the mind's false identification with the ego, and knowing that 'You are already That'. His discussions are direct, provocative, and profoundly simple, aiming to guide individuals to an understanding of their true nature and the timelessness of being.

#3643

• Mentioned in 13 episodes

One Blade of Grass

Finding the Old Road of the Heart, a Zen Memoir

Henry Shukman

One Blade of Grass is an autobiographical journey of Henry Shukman from his troubled childhood to becoming a healing teacher. The book describes how Zen practice transformed his life, making him calmer and kinder. It demystifies Zen training by casting its profound insights in simple, lucid language and takes the reader on a personal journey into the hidden treasures of life revealed through contemplative practice. The memoir is marked by humorous and moving sections, poetic lyricism, and the author's ability to articulate both inner and outer experiences with precision and nuance.

#3231

• Mentioned in 14 episodes

Original Love

Henry Shukman

Original Love is an essential meditation guide for the twenty-first century. Henry Shukman, a spiritual director and mindfulness teacher, provides a way forward based on four paths—Mindfulness, Support, Absorption, and Awakening—that promote growth and healing through meditation. The book includes inspiring stories from his students and weaves together teachings from Zen Buddhism, Taoism, and other contemplative traditions. It aims to help readers create peace by reducing stress, anxiety, and depression, relaxing the mind and body, easing feelings of worry and anger, and improving decision-making and executive functioning. The book emphasizes the importance of direct experience over intellectual understanding and encourages readers to explore meditation to discover the transformative power of mindfulness and awakening.

Zen teacher and author Henry Shukman offers a clear and grounded introduction to the heart of Zen practice. We explore how awakening is not an escape from life, but a deeper participation in it — a realization that dissolves the illusion of separation and reveals a boundless field of awareness and love.

Henry shares his own spontaneous awakening experience at 19, the profound insight that life is not divided between self and world, and the difficult healing journey that followed. From mindfulness and meditation to flow states, jhanas, koans, and the role of trauma in spiritual growth, this conversation maps out a path that integrates awakening with emotional healing.

Download SAILY in your app store and use our code KNOWTHYSELF at checkout to get an exclusive 15% off your first purchase! For further details go to https://saily.com/knowthyself

Go to https://thewayapp.com/knowthyself to begin your journey with 30 free meditation sessions

André's Book Recs: https://www.knowthyselfpodcast.com/book-list

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00:00 Intro

01:26 An Introduction to Zen

13:10 The Premise of Original Love

17:14 Training the Mind Like the Body

20:54 Freedom From Identification With Thought

27:50 What Are the Jhanas?

32:50 Ad: Saily

33:54 Tasting Awakening for Yourself

45:17 Awakening vs Psychological Healing

50:17 Awakening as an Ongoing Path

54:54 The Distinct Path of Zen

59:13 Koans as a Path to Insight

1:13:53 The Enlightenment of the Mundane

1:20:07 The Freedom of Emptiness

1:26:16 The Necessity of Meditation Practice

1:34:32 Sweeping the Yard (A Zen Poem)

1:43:33 Beauty, Ethics, and Interconnection

1:47:33 The Journey to a Whole Heart (A Poem on Heartbreak)

2:02:58 Original Love in a Fragmented World

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Episode Resources:

https://www.instagram.com/henryshukman/

https://www.instagram.com/theway_app/

https://www.instagram.com/andreduqum/

https://www.instagram.com/knowthyself/

https://www.youtube.com/@knowthyselfpodcast

https://www.knowthyselfpodcast.com

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