S2E3c SPECIAL Groceryshop 2022 Part 3 – Andrew Lipsman of eMarketer & Krystina Gustafson of ShopTalk

Missed Groceryshop 2022? Not to worry, we’ve got you covered! Welcome to another SPECIAL EDITION season 2, episode 3, Part 3, Groceryshop recap!

We’re bringing you 6 great interviews recorded live and in-person at Groceryshop in Las Vegas, NV, bundled up in 3 episodes with 2 interviews each. For part 3, we saved two very special guests for your listening pleasure. Andrew Lipsman, principal analyst for retail and ecommerce at Insider Intelligence gives us a rundown of the top trends across Groceryshop, with a focus on retail media, convenience stores, and a unique perspective on personalization and omnichannel. Then you’ll hear from Krystina Gustafson, SVP Content for Groceryshop and Shoptalk. Krystina gives us the insider’s view of the show, how it’s produced, another view of top trends, and finally, a take on what was NOT talked about at the show. You'll be hard pressed to find a more jampacked 30 minutes of insights!

News alert! We’re back at #20 on the Feedspot Top 60 Best Retail podcasts list, so please keep those 5-star reviews in Apple Podcasts coming! With your help, we’ll move our way further up the Top 20! Leave us a review and be mentioned in a future episode! https://blog.feedspot.com/retail_podcasts/

Meet your hosts, helping you cut through the clutter in retail & retail tech:

Ricardo Belmar, a RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2022 & 2021, RIS News Top Movers and Shakers in Retail for 2021, a Top 12 ecommerce influencer, advisory council member at George Mason University’s Center for Retail Transformation, and director partner marketing advisor for retail & consumer goods at Microsoft.

Casey Golden, CEO of Luxlock. Obsessed with the customer relationship between the brand and the consumer. After a career on the fashion and supply chain technology side of the business, now slaying franken-stacks and building retail tech!

Includes music provided by imunobeats.com, featuring Swag Tag and Brag, and Overclocked, from the album Beat Hype, written by Hestron Mimms, published by Imuno.

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Host → Ricardo Belmar,

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TRANSCRIPT

SPECIAL Edition: Groceryshop 2022, Part 3

[00:00:00] Ricardo Belmar:

[00:00:20] Introduction to Part 3

[00:00:20] Ricardo Belmar: Hello, and welcome to season two, episode three, part three of the Retail Razor Show. I'm your host, Ricardo Belmar.

[00:00:26] Casey Golden: And I'm your co-host, Casey Golden. Welcome retail Razor Show listeners to our un apologetically authentic retail podcast for product junkies, commerce technologists, and everyone else in retail and retail tech alike. 

[00:00:39] Ricardo Belmar: So Casey, what did you think of part two of our grocery shop interview series with those two incredible grocery retailers, Lisa Kinney from Albertsons and Dave Steck from Schnuck Markets.

[00:00:48] Casey Golden: Well, you did say that this episode would be thought provoking and you delivered. Lisa really sliced and diced what's happening in grocery with consumer data. I found it incredibly interesting and related right back to the future of retail media networks in a way I've just never heard anyone talk about it like that before. 

[00:01:07] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, that's right. I mean, Lisa really brought home issues around where the data comes from with all the tech partners that grocers are involved with now, and asked I think, some tough questions about how retail media would bring brands and retailers together and where all those dollars come from.

[00:01:22] Casey Golden: Yeah. And then Dave Steck, I mean, is there any emerging tech that he's not looking into yet? I mean, I don't know, maybe web three, but. 

[00:01:31] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Something tells me that that's not too far behind on his schedule . But yes, I mean, yeah, he, he really showed us how having the right corporate culture just opens the door to doing really creative and innovative things with New Tech in the store. I mean, he's got, he's not only has robots and IoT, he's looking at electronic shelf labels.

[00:01:50] I think there's no limit to where Schnuck's is going, and it's pretty impressive.

[00:01:53] Casey Golden: So for our listeners who haven't checked out part two. You should probably stop right now. Go back. Listen. We'll wait.

[00:02:00] Ricardo Belmar: So, So do we just stop talking now and wait for the listeners to come back or what?

[00:02:03] Casey Golden: Uh, Uh, not really. I mean, we're recording for a reason. We're not live. 

[00:02:06] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Okay. That, Yeah. All right. I know, I know. Just, just kidding. So let's talk about this episode then.

[00:02:10] Casey Golden: Who do you have lined up and tell me, did you save the best for last? Honestly, part two was jampacked full of insights coming at you every minute. 

[00:02:19] Ricardo Belmar: Well, I have to admit, yes, yes, Probably, possibly. Maybe. We did save the best for last, not to diminish anything about our previous guests in any way because they were all really amazing. We got lots of fantastic insights and, and knowledge from everybody. But , this time out, we've got two really amazing guests.

[00:02:37] One I, I would call a recent fan favorite Andrew Lipsman the principal analyst for retail and e-commerce at e-marketer, Insider Intelligence, and hot off of our Retail Media networks episode. That's quickly becoming one of our most downloaded episodes, by the way ,that I caught up with Andrew at Grocery shop after one of his sessions, and we talked about what some of the biggest trends were across the whole show.

[00:02:58] As we're pretty much near the end of the event at this point. So much of what Stewart told us in part one I think stayed the course for the rest of the show. But Andrew points out some really interesting tidbits about the convenience store segment . And it might just be a, a sleeping giant waiting to surface.

[00:03:13] Within all the talk around, around grocery and food in, in general. So we briefly touch on quick commerce and rapid delivery and the latest from the show on those providers. It was really interesting though to hear his take on personalization and omnichannel and how those, I mean, let's face it, those are not new trends.

[00:03:31] But suddenly they were just front and center at grocery shop. You, you'd think that the grocery industry hadn't heard of those two things before the way they were being talked about. So I think his position will surprise you on those two. And, you have to watch out for our discussion on what was not a trend at the show.

[00:03:48] I'll give you a hint. It rhymes with metaverse,

[00:03:50] Casey Golden: not a hint, 

[00:03:53] Ricardo Belmar: It's not

[00:03:55] Casey Golden: It's not a hint, way to give it away. Um, 

[00:04:00] Ricardo Belmar: on. Okay. You'll see, you'll, you'll see, there, there's a reason for why that's the case and it comes back again in fact, with the second guest for this episode 

[00:04:06] Casey Golden: Okay, so don't keep us in the suspense. I mean, I'm, I'm a co-host and I'm in suspense who's, two. 

[00:04:13] Ricardo Belmar: number two is none other than Krystina Gustafson, SVP of content for grocery shop and shop talk. And if you're like me, you probably remember Krystina from back in her cnbc, retail journalist days. So this is a, a, a real treat of an interview. Krystina and I talk about what makes grocery shop so special, how they put the show together.

[00:04:31] What are the key trends from her perspective ,from what they were trying to accomplish? And you know, while they're similar to what we've been hearing from the other guests, there is a bit of a unique twist, I think, to what she offered. So I won't give that away. You'll have to listen. But we do dig into what some of the big buzz was about, what was happening in the expo hall.

[00:04:49] And I asked her as well about what's not buzzing, You know, i e metaverse, which was not really buzzing at the show. And of course where retail media is headed because I don't think we can possibly do an episode about grocery shop and not talk about retail media. But it's a fascinating insider discussion that I think listeners will really enjoy.

[00:05:06] We have to have Krystina back on the show again. She's so much fun to talk to. 

[00:05:09] Casey Golden: All right, I'm sold. With that lead in there's nothing left to do, but head straight to the interviews. I'm excited to grab some popcorn, get comfy, grab a notepad, and dive right in. So let's listen together to Andrew Lipman and Krystina Gustafson recorded live and in person at Grocery Shop 2022. 

[00:05:28] Andrew Lipsman Interview

[00:05:28] Ricardo Belmar: and welcome To the retail Razor Show Special Edition episode at Grocery shop 2022. 

[00:05:42] I'm here at the show in Las Vegas, Continuing our series of amazing retail transformers to talk all things, grocery and consumer goods. I'm here now with Andrew Lipsman, principal analyst for retail and e-commerce at Insider Intelligence. Andrew, it is awesome to have you back on the show again. 

[00:05:58] Andrew Lipsman: It's great to be back already. Ricardo. 

[00:06:00] Ricardo Belmar: So of course the existing listeners may have heard or watched our retail media networks episode, they'll already be familiar with you. But for new listeners give us a quick, intro to what you do at insider intelligence. 

[00:06:10] Andrew Lipsman: Yeah. as you said, I'm a principal analyst covering retail and e-commerce. So I really cover the gamut of all things, retail, whether that's in store e-commerce and Increasingly advertising where retail and e-commerce intersect with other trends. So retail media Has certainly been in my cross hairs and I've also spent a, quite a bit of extra time in the last year or so focusing more and more on grocery and CPG.

[00:06:33] Ricardo Belmar: So since we are at grocery shop, let's talk about what some of the big trends are that you're seeing here. And they're getting all the buzz. I know you've spoken a couple of sessions that I attended. One panel was a session about emerging tech in the convenience store space. 

[00:06:47] So Kind of thinking back to that and anything else you've seen at the show, what, What are let's say two or three big trends that you're seeing here at the show. 

[00:06:53] Andrew Lipsman: Yeah, well, it's certainly biased towards the sessions that I was in. 

[00:06:56] And I've been running around. and haven't seen as many other sessions as I would've liked, but convenience does seem to be a bigger trend. They've done a nice job with the convenience track. 

[00:07:04] And I guess my viewpoint is that it's maybe under appreciated and not talked about quite enough, but it's a pretty formidable retail space. Obviously a lot of brands are flowing through there and there's a lot of innovation happening on a lot of fronts, the tech cashierless checkout. 

[00:07:20] Retail media are starting to have that conversation and how it's used and deployed in C stores. And then really just the broader delivery and quick commerce space. That convenience is a huge, huge trend. In terms of driving consumer behavior. So I think all those things intersect in interesting ways and I was glad to be a part of that session. 

[00:07:38] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. I agree when convenience is definitely an interesting one. That's the, one of the things I enjoyed in your session on There's a little bit different spin. I think, to how a lot of the technologies and things that, that the grocers are talking about that maybe get applied a little differently in convenience. 

[00:07:52] Andrew Lipsman: Yeah. And you know, the one that's kind of interesting. cashierless checkout, for example, automated checkout. On the one hand convenience, you kind of want to get in and out, but also lines aren't that bad. 

[00:08:03] But We talk about it there because it, it kind of started with Amazon Go and that format, and that really was driven by the need for camera technology to be able to work in a space. And it worked better in small format 

[00:08:15] So I'm curious how that plays out longterm. Grocery store format, everybody hates the checkout line. So that's where, that's where the real strong use case is and now the technology is getting a lot better to enable that. 

[00:08:26] Ricardo Belmar: You mentioned retail media. And we've talked about that before, and I think that's clearly been a major trend here at the show, you see it everywhere that you walk around the halls with the Walmart connect advertising. What are you seeing in the context of retail media around convenience? 

[00:08:40] Andrew Lipsman: Well, I mean, I just think about. you know, I'm I'm a big proponent of the trend of in-store retail media. I think it's going to emerge. I think there's a lot of opportunity for digital signage and screens to start entering into the physical space more. 

[00:08:53] Where I think it's particularly interesting in convenience is that while you've got in most cases, the cooler aisle that is visible, right? When you walk in. So it's not on the periphery. Like it is in a grocery store. And, or in the center aisle. And I think that that visibility. maybe makes it more impactful. 

[00:09:10] And also. I can just see c-stores really taking to it. And so I'm watching that carefully. to see if, if we start to see a bigger rollout of that in the c-store format. 

[00:09:19] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. That's going to be interesting to compare how that kind of weighs in against what the grocery is doing now with their retail media networks. 

[00:09:27] Andrew Lipsman: And I think that's it. When you walk into a, C-store also, you're probably much more open to that brand and you don't necessarily know what you want I'm thirsty, right? Or I'm coming and going into grab beer. That's a perfect time to put that brand impression in front of the customer.

[00:09:41] Ricardo Belmar: I did notice some of the speakers talking about how they're either seeing kind of a consumer shift in terms of thinking about, you know, what do I need to buy food wise for the week versus now more thinking around, what do I want to buy for tonight? 

[00:09:53] Andrew Lipsman: Yeah. Instant delivery and quick commerce space. 

[00:09:56] I mean that that's so interesting. My, my biggest question here, as we see maybe some consolidation and some players leaving the market, what's going to happen. 

[00:10:04] Is there enough of a regular use case for most consumers? I've said first time I used goPuff it was amazing. I got my order in 14 minutes. 

[00:10:12] The second time it was during rush hour. And I got my order in 25 minutes. Still a 

[00:10:16] Ricardo Belmar: still. Pretty impressive. 

[00:10:17] Andrew Lipsman: Right. I was in the middle of preparing dinner, so that's good. But I haven't seen a lot of other occasions for me to keep using it. So that's really, my question is how, how often are people going to be doing this. Now?, I'm maybe not the core consumer. The millennial and gen Z consumer, I think is much more acclimated to this behavior. So maybe that's where the market grows from. 

[00:10:36] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, that could be an I I noticed as you have a pretty much all of those now providers have been on stage at some point grocery shop. And I noticed every single one of them had mentioned the key metric for them is increasing order volume and order frequency. And I've noticed many of them talking about branching out from just food, into other retail spaces, as a way to kind of supplement and have a, I'll say it's kind of a reason to give the consumer why they should use that service multiple times a week. for example. So they need ways to drive that order volume. And if grocery and convenience isn't enough, then they'll go partner with other retailers to add onto it. 

[00:11:09] Andrew Lipsman: Yeah. I mean for me, it's interesting how I branched out into more categories. My first was a, you know, a late night order, so it was ice cream and a indulgence. Right. 

[00:11:19] When I was in the middle of preparing dinner, I was missing an ingredient. But also, I was trying to do dishes as I was preparing dinner and I realized I was out of dish soap. And by the way, I could actually use a new scrubber. So, right. So. I ended up 

[00:11:32] Ricardo Belmar: could think of other things. 

[00:11:33] Yeah. 

[00:11:34] Andrew Lipsman: into household essential. So And then the other use case that has come up in my household is you're sick and you just. It's not easy for a parent to go out to Walgreens or CVS to get cold medicine. It's nice when it comes to you. 

[00:11:46] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, that's a good point. And that's one of those, kind of tangible use cases for why you have to have it now.

[00:11:51] Andrew Lipsman: Yep.

[00:11:51] Absolutely.

[00:11:52] Ricardo Belmar: That makes sense. So another interesting I talked about this briefly before we were recording. Lots of talk about personalization. 

[00:11:59] And you know, the first thing I think of when I hear everybody talking about that as well, haven't we been talking about personalization in retail for, for years now. 

[00:12:07] And It's almost like there is an awakening with the grocery space that I actually need to worry about this, that, you know, if everybody's talking about.

[00:12:15] omni-channel and, and how, like I'm going to use that to optimize my profitability and kind of compensate for high cost of e-commerce. What do you, what do you think is going on there in all this personalization talk that's happening?

[00:12:28] Andrew Lipsman: Well, In general, I glaze over when I hear personalization because it's this big nebulous term. But then my, my second impulse is to say, well, let's break it down. What, when does personalization really matter? So in a digital experience, 

[00:12:40] Here's a perfect. example. When I go and do an Instacart order or another e-commerce order. 

[00:12:46] I like the fact that it knows what I got last time, and it can and can serve up those relevant, basket building, items right away. So that streamlines my trip and you know, it's already done half the work for me. 

[00:12:57] That's a nice version of personalization, Obviously coupons and things of that nature. Getting the right coupons. To the right consumers. 

[00:13:05] Is isn't a major benefit. So I think the applications are pretty strong. in the grocery category in a way that it isn't always elsewhere. 

[00:13:13] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, no, that makes sense. That makes sense. 

[00:13:15] It has a little bit more, I guess I'm going to say direct value. For the consumer and something that, that speaks right to a need in the moment 

[00:13:23] Andrew Lipsman: Absolutely. But I'm the wrong consumer because I just it's too much noise to try and manage coupon. So I I know

[00:13:29] Ricardo Belmar: I agree

[00:13:29] Andrew Lipsman: I'm, I'm different than most consumers. But it just, I, I go right past that.

[00:13:34] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Same here. I'm just like that. 

[00:13:37] Is there anything that surprises you that people are either not talking about at all, or that there's very little conversation going on. 

[00:13:43] Andrew Lipsman: I think I've only seen the word metaverse twice the whole conference on a couple of booths. 

[00:13:48] Ricardo Belmar: Right. Yeah.

[00:13:49] Andrew Lipsman: and that's a good thing. Although as you and I were talking about before we recorded

[00:13:54] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. 

[00:13:55] Andrew Lipsman: Maybe the metaverse, you know, the best use case for it isn't food shopping. 

[00:13:58] Ricardo Belmar: That's right. Yeah. 

[00:13:59] And I did actually hear in, in fairness, right, did hear one of the CPG brands on stage bring up that point exactly in that way. 

[00:14:07] And She mentioned ,I can see a fashion use case. I think that's a pretty clear cut one, but if the consumer can't taste it or smell it or understand.

[00:14:16] what it's really going to be for them in the metaverse, then what's the value in them engaging with, with a food brand. In this matter. And so. The conclusion was kind of, well, I just don't know how to, how do I define the value here for the consumer? If it's not valuable for our consumer, why should we invest in it.

[00:14:32] Andrew Lipsman: Yeah. Grocery shopping. I don't see that use case very strongly. But listen the metaverse today, I would say is really gaming and, and kind of the evolution of gaming. But gamers are an irrelevant audience, and so having brands, especially if you're a brand that, Mountain Dew or, or the like that, that really core to younger consumers That's relevant. So they should be in gaming. In game advertising. And if you want to call it a metaverse call a metaverse. 

[00:14:56] Ricardo Belmar: Right. Yeah but it's still at the, so more of like a brand affinity brand awareness kind of play rather than the true commerce environment. 

[00:15:02] Here's another one for you, that There was an interesting announcement by Firework. It was a live streaming provider with a new partnership they have with Walmart. Now to bring livestreaming to Walmart's e-commerce. And I find this interesting and where I see these live streaming developments, I've been a big proponent that, that live streaming is going to be meaningful. For commerce, but I, I I've signed. 

[00:15:23] Altered my view, at least a little bit. I'm curious, but you think that It's not really being driven by the social media platforms anymore. It's this really seems to be more about very customized things with a core technology that a retailer or a brand can acquire. Integrate it with their platform at their own site, and then use that as their live streaming interface for consumers. And if you go to Firework's booth here at the show, I noticed that they're showing examples of, you know, a grocer who's doing the live cooking session.

[00:15:50] And I'm going to assume here for the moment That that makes sense if they can somehow tie it into the e-commerce platform And I'm watching the live stream and they say, you know what? I'd like to make that tonight. Where's the button I click or tap to actually put in a grocery order for all those ingredients. 

[00:16:04] Andrew Lipsman: Yeah. So I'll say that I do buy the premise of bringing that media experience to where it's contextually relevant. But I will also say that media is competing with viewing other media

[00:16:17] Ricardo Belmar: Right. That's 

[00:16:18] Andrew Lipsman: And so the, I think there's a high quality bar. And so what I think you could also see as a lot of players experiment with the format. And they're just not going to do it all that well. We've seen Amazon live has not taken off. And part of it is like, 

[00:16:31] They haven't gotten the right influencers. the content is not there. And so, 

[00:16:35] Ricardo Belmar: Right. It's just not 

[00:16:35] Andrew Lipsman: consumers tune out. So I will just say that what I'm looking for for that to work is the content has to be great. 

[00:16:41] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, that makes sense. 

[00:16:41] Now I agree. I agree. It definitely has to have the right content. A lot of it, I think, has to do again, like what you were saying earlier. It has to do with what the consumer is thinking and doing in the moment. And how applicable is it?

[00:16:51] Andrew Lipsman: Absolutely. 

[00:16:52] Ricardo Belmar: Well, Andrew, once again, this has been an amazing discussion with you, so glad you can come back on the show again today. 

[00:16:58] If Listeners want to reach out to you get in touch with you, learn more about the work you're doing. What's the best way for them to reach out.

[00:17:04] Andrew Lipsman: LinkedIn is the easiest. That's where I share my work and where I listen to all the smart people on LinkedIn and learn from them. That's a key input to my analysis is learning from the other smart people in the industry 

[00:17:16] Ricardo Belmar: have to agree with that, but we're always in a learning mode in this industry for sure 

[00:17:21] Andrew Lipsman: A hundred percent.

[00:17:21] Ricardo Belmar: Great. Well, Thanks again, Andrew.

[00:17:23] I appreciate you joining me today. 

[00:17:24] Andrew Lipsman: Thanks for inviting me. 

[00:17:25]

[00:17:25] Krystina Gustafson Interview

[00:17:25] Ricardo Belmar: Welcome to the retail razor show special grocery shop edition for 2022. 

[00:17:41] I'm here continuing our series of conversations with retail transformers and talking, all things, grocery and consumer goods, And I'm thrilled to be joined right now with Krystina Gustafson, SVP of content for Grocery shop, Krystina, it's fantastic to have you here. 

[00:17:57] Yeah, 

[00:17:57] Krystina Gustafson: I'm thrilled to be here. Thanks so much for making it out to the show and taking the time to chat with me.

[00:18:02] Ricardo Belmar: I appreciate it. So tell us a little bit about just some of the background. Like how is this Grocery shop comparing to past ones? What are you seeing is kind of the interesting things that have caught your attention. Maybe feedback from attendees versus past editions. 

[00:18:16] Krystina Gustafson: Yeah, it's a great question. I think first and foremost, just sort of a statistic wise, our biggest show to date. So we have 4,000 attendees joining us here in Las Vegas about double the size that we were last year, which was a little down just given the nature of where we were in the pandemic cycle. I have to say when, when we came back to Las Vegas last year, I thought there was going to be no similar buzz that would, that would sort of meet the bar of last year's. It was really just kind of the first time that everyone was getting back together after the pandemic, it sort of felt like people were, were running around just buzz, completely excited. 

[00:18:50] We actually were losing speakers because they'd come to the speaker lounge and then they'd get distracted because they saw someone that they knew they got very excited. They would, they would kind of run off. And so actually we've had to sort of implement a longer lead time for, for people to come to the speaker lounge ahead of their session. Exactly. Exactly. 

[00:19:05] But no, I think what's been really fascinating to see as it's just a different kind of buzz, this year right. It sort of feels like last year, it was just that, you know, first day of school, excitement, you know, you're, you're back with all your friends and it's so fun. And this year it feels like a very big buzz around the content again and just kind of what people are here to learn. They feel very hungry for knowledge.

[00:19:23] And I think a lot of that is just this inflection point that we're at in the industry today where, you know they don't have to innovate anymore, quite frankly. Right?

[00:19:30] If they kind of want to stop and say, Hey, we're seeing a slow down in the economy, consumers are going back to stores. You know, this isn't necessarily the top of our priority list anymore. And so I think everyone that's here are the folks that realize this transformation is real.

[00:19:43] And so they're just really hungry to meet with other people who are of a similar mindset. And, and make those connections as well as kind of learn from from folks. 

[00:19:52] Either with their peers at table talks, which are, you know, sort of group discussions or in the more traditional sort of track session formats where they're hearing from, from other speakers. 

[00:19:59] Ricardo Belmar: I've been through different sessions at the show of this week, the content has been really, really wonderful.

[00:20:05] There's been a good variety of things. You know, great, great, great choices on the speakers by the way. I think that's been really, really fantastic. 

[00:20:11] This year, I loved the, the mix of different retailers that you have with some of the brands.

[00:20:15] I think it kind of felt to me I could be wrong, but it felt like compared to the last Grocery shop I was at was the 2019 one. And compared to that one, it was a lot more sessions that had a mix of retailers and brands, which always feels kind of interesting because you could expect sometimes there's gonna be a little bit of tension in that discussion topic, but I think it's worked out really, really well in a lot of the sessions. 

[00:20:33] Krystina Gustafson: Yeah, To be honest, it's something we've always strived for. So I'm glad to hear that. It's, it's something that you've, you've sort of seen come through in the sessions themselves. I agree with you, you know, I'm a reformed journalist. I like to say. So I always sorta think about, if you're reporting a story, you have to have your three different sources, right.

[00:20:48] And so a lot of times you want those to be sort of, two folks within the industry. Maybe you want a consumer, maybe you want a regulatory board, but, but the point of it is by having three different perspectives, you kind of triangulate to something that everyone in the audience can relate to. And not just kind of have, retailer one, echo what retailer two saying, and then followed up by retailer three. So we work really, really hard, not just to curate the session topics, but the mix of perspectives that you're going to hear on any given topic.

[00:21:12] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, so, one thing that I've found interesting this year. And again, I'm comparing to a few years back from my personal experience. But the kinds of technologies, that we're talking about, It feels to me like we're, we're not talking about the things I might necessarily have expected was had evolved from previous years.

[00:21:27] And maybe that's to be expected just Because of where we are and you know, what, everything that happened through COVID for grocers and, and brands. 

[00:21:33] Are you seeing something similar? Does it look the same from your perspective?

[00:21:36] Krystina Gustafson: It's a really good question. You know, we, we kind of came out with this thesis of just kind of where grocery e-comm is on a digital maturity scale, you know, pre pandemic throughout the pandemic and then where we are today. And I think previously, it was just kind of, people were testing and learning, you know, they were testing the waters, they were just kind of doing, quite frankly, the basics, right. 

[00:21:55] Whether it was working with third-party partners, for things like delivery, whether it was just kind of like, you know, testing and experimenting with personalization, I think to your point, those things are still very important today, but people are thinking about sort of, how can they take this one step farther? 

[00:22:07] So from our perspective, it went from kind of like the nuts and bolts to, Okay.

[00:22:11] We have to stand this up because we quite frankly have no choice if

[00:22:14] Ricardo Belmar: Right now it's table stakes. 

[00:22:15] Krystina Gustafson: Yeah, exactly, if we don't roll out curbside, no one's going to get their groceries. No one's going to be able to eat. So, so let's just kind of like push it out as fast as possible. I think from there, people have kind of been fine-tuning those products, But in addition to it, people are thinking about how the future of online grocery can look different. And what I mean by that is, you know, It's always been about convenience and it will still be about convenience. Heck we added an entire track dedicated to the theme of convenience.

[00:22:37] Ricardo Belmar: I went to a number of those sessions. 

[00:22:38] Krystina Gustafson: But however, It also needs to be about experience. And so I think from our perspective, it's about, making sure you're still, you know, getting to see those technologies that you really need to run your business. We understand everyone has finite budget, so we need to make sure that we're still representing those sorts of businesses, but then also giving people the flexibility to imagine what it could look like in the future, whether it's using livestream shopping, you know, Is it going to be the metaverse. 

[00:23:02] So we didn't lean too heavily into that at the show,

[00:23:04] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, I noticed that.

[00:23:05] Krystina Gustafson: it's not. I don't think As big of an opportunity. at least currently for grocery as maybe fashion 

[00:23:10] Ricardo Belmar: Maybe more maybe longterm. 

[00:23:11] Krystina Gustafson: Exactly, exactly. But, You know, we want to make sure that we do have some perspectives on that represented so that people can, you know, start thinking what? This might look like 10 years down the road.

[00:23:20] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. You know, an Interesting note as you've mentioned on the convenience track, one theme that I heard a lot of are from both retailers and brands that they're seeing consumers take a perspective, that rather than thinking ,what do I need to buy for the week?

[00:23:34] It's now what I want to buy for tonight. 

[00:23:36] Krystina Gustafson: Yeah. Well, it's so Interesting.

[00:23:38] And you know, it was also, I I've heard this from a couple of other speakers. I think Fidji Simo from Instacart was one, one person to talk about it. And actually I think from door dash, they were talking about it as well. It just really depends on what the shopping occasion is. Right. I feel like we've constantly heard. 

[00:23:52] Oh, you know, 15 minutes delivery is so great when you forget a certain ingredient. It's like, how often does that actually 

[00:23:57] Ricardo Belmar: Exactly. 

[00:23:58] Krystina Gustafson: We hear that phrase so 

[00:24:00] Ricardo Belmar: It's always like the first use case. Everyone brings up, But really how often, if you think about it yourself, how often are you in that position? 

[00:24:05] Krystina Gustafson: it's a Very very and quite frankly, if that happens, let's play my excuse to like order takeout. So I actually thought it was really interesting. 

[00:24:12] Oh, gosh, I wish I could remember the speaker who was talking about this, but It was essentially saying you know, 15 minute delivery isn't necessarily something that isn't going to work. It just needs to be a part of a broader portfolio. Right. So. If door dash is going to do, you know, 15 minute delivery. That's great. But they also need to have sort of a, the longer lead time sorts of options so that they can make those 15 minutes deliveries profitable and kind of the same thing to, to a retailer as well.

[00:24:34] Ricardo Belmar: Right, right. So I have to ask you this question too, for your thoughts, because if I were to pick the one thing that I feel like almost everyone has talked about, and frankly, just walking down the hall. you see it visually everywhere. and that's retail media networks,

[00:24:49] Krystina Gustafson: I knew you were going to say it. I 

[00:24:51] Ricardo Belmar: You knew where I was going with that. 

[00:24:53] Krystina Gustafson: Yeah. It's it's so funny. You know, when we are programming the show, We're always so careful because every single spot on our agenda is merit based. Right, We don't do any pay to play. That's a really big sort of sticking point for us. And so I think we've always been very careful when we're selecting technology vendors to speak on stage, it's, you know, we want you to be strategic. 

[00:25:11] Obviously we want you to talk about your solution, but we want you to, to sort of bring some thought leadership to this and talk about an authentic way. And we were laughing. We're like, we're going to have these conversations with the retailers, because all they want to do is go on stage and plug their retail media networks. 

[00:25:24] Ricardo Belmar: cause they're now in the business, right. Of selling to other businesses. They're suddenly a B2B business instead of just a B2C 

[00:25:29] Krystina Gustafson: Yes, it's getting very, very complicated. But no, I hear you. It's, it's been a huge theme of the show and I think just everyone Is very aware of the growth that is expected to come out of this. I think for me, a lot of the interesting discussions are about you know, sort of who's doing it well, what CPG brands need from their retail partners, thinking again, sort of about what's to come and sort of how these will play out in physical stores because I think that's also been kind of a big theme throughout the show is just kind of how, how the physical store is transforming. 

[00:25:54] And so it's going to be a really interesting space to walk over the next couple of years. 

[00:25:58] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, it's interesting. I was talking with one of the speakers earlier that in one of my previous roles I did a lot of work with and this'll be dating a and I'll take them on a technology perspective of delivering digital signage solutions into stores. And I was joking with someone, you know, back in those days. As if we're only talking 2015, maybe. 

[00:26:18] You know, one of the pitches as a digital signage technology provider, we always had was to every retailer ,you know, you could turn this into a media network, right? You can talk to the brands that you sell and actually, so position advertising on these screens. Have you thought about doing that? 

[00:26:31] And what I find fascinating is that now everyone's talking about this now, right? We just don't use the words, digital signage, because that's, that has an awful connotation. Apparently. But I find that when we talked about it before, because I as the technology provider then was talking to someone in IT, about that. And it wasn't really an IT technology message. It was really more of a marketing, advertising message. 

[00:26:53] Oh, And it didn't involve people in store operations. So it tended to just go nowhere with most retailers that we tried that with, and it's just night and day difference with where we're at now 

[00:27:02] Krystina Gustafson: I love that point because I think that's so often what we kind of try to, I don't want to say the word preach, but I guess it is kind of preaching in some capacity. It's like you can't dismiss innovation at any capacity, right.

[00:27:12] Like we were joking about the metaverse earlier and saying, okay, well we don't see the application today. It Doesn't mean there's 

[00:27:17] Ricardo Belmar: Doesn't mean there won't be.

[00:27:18] Krystina Gustafson: Right. And there's going to be elements of that, AJ Dalal from Publicis Sapient actually did a presentation on, on what the applications for the metaverse could for the future of our industry and he was talking about it from, from, I would say more of a CPG perspective, but you think about sort of the opportunities for loyalty, you think about just kind of like actually assigning a value to some of these like NFTs or, or, you know, it doesn't have to be sort of this pie in the sky version of the metaverse that we're all reading about. Right. And so I think it's very easy to just kind of laugh and say, oh, that's never going to work. Right, But there are going to be certain building blocks to your point that even if they don't work today, maybe 10 years down the road, 

[00:27:52] Ricardo Belmar: right. right. 

[00:27:53] Krystina Gustafson: about 

[00:27:54] Ricardo Belmar: Or there could be, it could come surface up to the top and then priority for that. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. 

[00:27:59] So last thing I wanted to ask you about.

[00:28:01] What's your perspective on how the expo hall fits into the overall grocery shop experience, if there's anything in particular. that is catching your attention, that you're hearing feedback from folks about what they're experiencing walking through the expo hall. 

[00:28:15] Krystina Gustafson: Yeah, it's a great question. I mean, I think from our perspective, all week. I shouldn't say all we care about but the biggest priority. is that it's buzzy. Right. And that there's a lot of energy. And I have to say our I can take absolutely no credit for this, but our sales team and our ops team have done a fantastic job. Just kind of reinventing. I always thought that our our expo hall was very elevated. Just from, from sort of an experience, but we've really built up our lounges. So we have a relaxed lounge where you can go and sort of get massages. We have a swag store this year.

[00:28:41] We've never 

[00:28:42] Ricardo Belmar: I saw it. 

[00:28:42] Krystina Gustafson: store before, so you can kind of go in and grab your Shoptalk Cuddy, which by the way, We're not allowed to grab because we have to save them for the attendees. So I'm praying. There are a couple of leftover.

[00:28:50] Yeah. I'm. There's some leftover after the show, but, you know, get your grocery shop, branded water bottle and there's stuff in there I'm from sponsor. So that's been really fun. So I think. For us, it's just kind of trying to make sure the exhibit hall is a place that people want to be quite frankly I would say the addition to that is our hosted retailers and brands program is always kind of the heart of what we're trying to do.

[00:29:11] I think serendipitous connections are fantastic. And, and, and, you know, everyone comes here, right. To see who they're going to run into have spontaneous conversations. But at the end of the day, sometimes a little bit of pre-planning. It goes a really long way. And so I think. 

[00:29:24] It kind of pairing that just kind of buzzy fun exhibit hall experience with the hosted program, where you come into the event having pre-planned meetings with, if you're a solution provider retailers or brands, or, you know, vice versa. 

[00:29:36] You know you're going to get ROI. And so I think in those capacities, like it makes it a little bit easier for you to be like, yeah, I'm just going to go grab a margarita and kind of like, enjoy the ride. 

[00:29:44] Ricardo Belmar: Right, right. Yep. Absolutely. Absolutely. 

[00:29:47] Well, Krystina, thank you so much for joining me here. It's been a pleasure chatting with you. I'd love going through all the ins and outs of what's going on here at grocery shop and you know, just kudos again, to pulling off such a great event. It's been a fantastic experience. 

[00:30:00] Krystina Gustafson: Awesome. Well, it's been good to have you here and thanks for having me join you. 

[00:30:03] Ricardo Belmar: Great. Thank you! 

[00:30:03]

[00:30:03] Show Close

[00:30:03] Casey Golden: We hope you enjoyed our show and we can't ask you enough to please give us a five star rating and review on apple podcast to help us grow and bring you more great episodes. If you don't wanna miss a minute of what's next, be sure to smash that subscribe button in your favorite podcast player. And don't forget to check out our show notes for handy links and more deets. I'm your host, Casey Golden. 

[00:30:38] Ricardo Belmar: And if you'd like to learn more about the two of us, follow us on Twitter at Casey c golden and Ricardo underscore Belmar, or find us on LinkedIn. Be sure to follow the show on LinkedIn and Twitter at retail razor. Plus our YouTube channel for videos of each episode and bonus content. I'm your host, Ricardo Belmar.

[00:30:54] Casey Golden: Thanks for joining us.

[00:30:56] Ricardo Belmar: And remember, there's never been a better time to be in retail. If you cut through the clutter until next time, this is the Retail razor Show.