Episode #531: Revenue-Based Lending Meets Crypto: Building Leviathan on Sui

In this episode of the Crazy Wisdom Podcast, host Stewart Alsop sits down with Lars van der Zande, founder and CEO/technical architect of Inkwell Finance, for what Lars describes as his first-ever podcast appearance. The conversation covers a wide range of blockchain infrastructure topics, including Lars's work with Sui and Solana blockchains, the innovative capabilities of Ika's programmatic wallets and blockchain of signatures, and how Inkwell Finance is building revenue-based financing solutions for on-chain entities—from AI agents to protocols. They explore the evolving landscape of crypto regulation, the merging of traditional finance with blockchain technology, the future of decentralized legal systems, and how the user experience barrier is being lowered through technologies that eliminate constant transaction signing. Lars also discusses Inkwell's embedded financing approach and their pre-seed fundraising round.

Links mentioned:
- Inkwell's website: inkwell.finance
- Inkwell on Twitter: @__inkwell
- Lars on Twitter: @LMVDZande

Timestamps

00:00 Introduction to Inkwell Finance and Technical Architecture
02:06 Understanding Sui and Solana: Blockchain Dynamics
05:55 The Role of Ika in Inkwell Finance
11:51 Leviathan: Revenue Generation and Financing in Crypto
17:38 The Future of AI Agents and Programmatic Wallets
23:23 Smart Contracts: Legal Implications and Future Directions
25:06 The Future of Inqvil Finance
25:42 Decentralization and Its Evolution
27:32 The Merging of Traditional and Crypto Systems
29:33 Global Financial Dynamics and Market Reactions
31:48 The Collapse of Traditional Financial Systems
32:46 Jurisdictional Shifts in the Crypto World
33:59 Legal Systems and Blockchain Integration
35:57 On-Chain Credit and Financial Opportunities
39:29 The Role of AI in Finance
41:30 Learning from Peer-to-Peer Lending History
43:14 Disruption in Insurance and Risk Management
44:54 On-Chain vs Off-Chain Data
46:54 The Evolution of the Internet and Blockchain
49:12 Future Subscription Models in Blockchain

Key Insights

1. Ika's Revolutionary Blockchain Signature Technology: Lars discovered Ika, a blockchain of signatures built on Sui that enables any blockchain transaction to be signed without revealing the underlying message. Using patented 2PC MPC technology, Ika splits key shares across validators and encrypts them in transit, performing complex cryptographic operations that allow smart contracts on Sui to generate signatures for transactions on any other blockchain. This eliminates the need to build separate smart contracts on each blockchain, fundamentally changing how cross-chain interactions work and opening possibilities for truly interoperable decentralized applications.
2. Programmatic Wallets vs Traditional Wallets: Traditional wallets like MetaMask require manual user approval for every transaction through a front-end interface, but Ika's D-wallet introduces programmatic wallets with policy-based controls embedded in smart contracts. These wallets can execute transactions based on predetermined conditions checked against on-chain data like Oracle prices, without requiring individual user signatures. For example, a Bitcoin D-wallet can hold native Bitcoin without wrapping or bridging to a custodian, and smart contract policies determine when and how that Bitcoin can be transferred, creating unprecedented security and automation possibilities for decentralized finance.
3. Inkwell's Revenue-Based Financing Model: Inkwell Finance is building Leviathan, a revenue-based financing platform for on-chain entities including protocols, AI agents, and individual traders with verifiable track records. Borrowers receive capital based on their on-chain performance metrics like sharp ratio and drawdown, with loan repayment automatically deducted from their revenue stream. The profit split structure allocates approximately 60% to borrowers, 30% to lenders, and 10% split between Inkwell and integrating platforms. This creates a sustainable lending model where flight risk is minimized through D-wallet policy controls that restrict how borrowed capital can be used.
4. Wallet-as-a-Protocol and the Future of User Experience: The crypto industry is moving toward embedded wallet solutions that eliminate the friction of traditional wallet management, with Wallet-as-a-Protocol representing the next evolution beyond services like Privy and Dynamic. Unlike current embedded wallets that lock users into specific applications, Wallet-as-a-Protocol enables single sign-on across multiple applications while users maintain control of their keys. Combined with app-sponsored gas fees, this approach allows non-crypto-native users to interact with blockchain applications without knowing they're using crypto, removing the biggest barrier to mainstream adoption and creating web2-like user experiences on web3 infrastructure.
5. AI Agents as Financial Entities: AI agents are emerging as revenue-generating entities with on-chain transaction histories that create verifiable track records for creditworthiness assessment. Inkwell Finance is specifically targeting this market, recognizing that AI agents will need wallets and capital to operate effectively. The programmatic nature of D-wallets pairs perfectly with AI agents, as policy controls can restrict agent behavior to specific smart contract interactions, preventing unauthorized fund transfers while allowing automated trading or revenue generation. This creates a new category of borrower that operates 24/7 with completely transparent performance metrics, fundamentally different from traditional loan recipients.
6. Cross-Chain Liquidity Without Asset Transfer: Ika's technology enables users to take loans against revenue generated on one blockchain and deploy that capital on entirely different blockchains without moving their original liquidity positions. For instance, someone earning yield on Sui's Fusol protocol could borrow against that revenue stream and deploy capital on Solana opportunities, effectively creating multiple on-chain businesses that generate their own credit scores and revenue to service debt. This ability to read state across different blockchains from within smart contracts opens possibilities for multi-chain strategies that don't require withdrawing capital from productive positions, maximizing capital efficiency across the entire crypto ecosystem.
7. The Convergence of Traditional Finance and Crypto Infrastructure: The regulatory landscape is rapidly evolving with initiatives like the Genius Act and Clarity Act creating frameworks where traditional financial systems merge with crypto infrastructure through mechanisms like stablecoins backed by US treasuries. Companies are increasingly establishing entities in the United States to access capital networks and Delaware's established legal framework while issuing tokens through jurisdictions like Switzerland. This hybrid approach, combined with emerging concepts like Gabriel Shapiro's "cybernetic agreements" that make smart contract parameters legally enforceable in traditional courts, suggests the future isn't pure decentralization but rather a sophisticated integration of on-chain and off-chain legal and financial systems.