88: Tommy Preson Phillips: Leaving the Church and Looking for Christ

Oct 16, 2024

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Take Away Ideas

Deconstruction isn’t about losing faith, but about re-centering on Jesus.
Doubt and curiosity are essential tools in questioning rigid religious structures.
The power dynamics of church leadership need reevaluation; Christ-like leadership centers on humility and service.
The shift from religious laws to virtues (like love, peace, and self-control) is essential for spiritual growth.
The church should create space for dialogue, shared meals, and mutual support to foster genuine community.
People are drawn to authenticity—leaders who admit their doubts and embrace communal wisdom.

Introduction:
Tommy is introduced as a musician and pastor with a love for art and church life. He shares about his background growing up in a Southern Baptist family, his love for music, and the early influence of church culture.

Journey into Ministry:
Tommy discusses how he found himself leading a church in his early 20s, dealing with church scandals, and eventually growing his congregation into a space for those questioning faith.

Deconstruction and Rebuilding:
Tommy explains his personal deconstruction process, including moments of doubt and skepticism. He talks about how his church evolved after leaving a traditional evangelical denomination.

Church Growth and New Models:
The conversation turns to how Watermark Church functions as a community for both deconstructing Christians and new believers, focusing on shared meals, dialogue, and Christ-like leadership.

Power, Capitalism, and Faith:
Tommy critiques the influence of power and capitalism on modern church structures, contrasting this with the teachings of Jesus, and emphasizing the need for a "cross-shaped" leadership model.

The Role of Doubt and Curiosity:
Tommy highlights how doubt and curiosity are vital for spiritual growth, encouraging open questioning of scripture and long-held beliefs.

The Future of the Church:
The episode ends with a discussion on the future of the church, Tommy's optimism about the current shifts in faith communities, and his belief that God's work is revealed in moments of upheaval.

Links:

Book: https://www.zondervan.com/p/invisible-jesus/
Music: https://presonphillips.bandcamp.com/
Watermark Church: Watermark Church Website
Substack: https://tommypresonphillips.substack.com

Sponsors
Quoir Square 2 Class: https://www.bk2sq1.com/square-2-next-steps-into-reconstruction (Promo code: Liminal for 10% off)

Kineo Center: https://www.thekineocenter.com/cohort (mention "Liminal" in Application for $100 off)

Monk Manual: https://monkmanual.com/LIMINAL (10% off all merchandise)

Connect
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