Authority Hacker Podcast – AI & Automation for Small biz & Marketers

How to Rank on ChatGPT (With Steve Toth)

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Jul 30, 2025

Steve Toth, founder of Notebook.agency and an expert in Generative Engine Optimization (GEO), delves into the future of traffic strategies. He discusses the decline of traditional SEO and the rise of AI-driven traffic sources like ChatGPT. Steve shares eye-opening experiences with inaccurate AI information and strategies to influence chatbot representations of brands. Discover why optimizing for specific consumer questions is more crucial than ever, alongside practical tips for adapting to this rapidly evolving landscape.

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INSIGHT

Brand Presence Dictates AI Reach

Larger brands have greater web presence fueling AI training data, making market penetration harder for smaller players.
Niching down on unique features or ICP needs helps smaller brands compete in AI-driven results.

ADVICE

Use Deep Research to Guide Content

Use deep research tools to identify AI model questions and topics influencing buyer journeys.
Create content targeting these refined queries for better LLM relevance.

ADVICE

Optimize Content for AI Retrieval

Structure content in 100-300 token chunks to optimize retrieval by LLMs.
Use clear, disambiguated, declarative sentences to aid AI understanding and citation.

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Is traditional SEO dead? And is "ranking" on ChatGPT and other AI chatbots the new frontier for traffic and sales?

Many businesses are seeing their search traffic decline, while a new, highly-lucrative source of customers is emerging from AI-driven conversations. But how do you tap into this new channel? And what happens when AI starts giving out outdated or just plain wrong information about your brand?

In this episode, we're joined by Steve Toth, founder of the AI-focused agency Notebook.agency, to break down the new world of Generative Engine Optimization (GEO). We explore the real-world opportunities and the hype surrounding AI-driven traffic.

The game has changed, and what worked for Google yesterday might not work for AI assistants tomorrow. In this episode, you will learn:

👉 The Truth About AI Traffic: Is the traffic from chatbots a tiny trickle or a high-converting firehose? We look at the real data.

👉 Why AI Gets Your Business Wrong: We share our own shocking experience of how ChatGPT described our business using two-year-old information and what you can do about it.

👉 Mastering "Generative Engine Optimization" (GEO): Steve reveals practical, actionable tips to influence what AI models like ChatGPT, Gemini, and Perplexity say about your brand.

👉 Beyond Keywords - Winning "Deal-Breaker" Questions: Learn why optimizing for specific, high-intent customer questions within LLMs is more powerful than traditional keyword ranking.

👉 On-Page & Off-Page GEO: Discover how to structure your website content for optimal AI retrieval and how to correct misinformation about your brand on external sites like Reddit.

👉 The "Truth Alignment Framework": Steve unveils his agency's process for auditing and correcting how AI represents a brand online, ensuring your key features and selling points are accurately reflected.

👉 Prompt Injection & Future-Proofing: We explore some cutting-edge (and slightly controversial) techniques to feed information directly to AI models and discuss where this is all heading.

Stop letting AI misrepresent your business. Learn how to take control of your brand's narrative in the new age of search and turn AI chatbots into a powerful channel for high-intent customers.

CHAPTERS
00:00:00 - Intro: Is AI Traffic Overhyped?
00:02:49 - What is Generative Engine Optimization (GEO)?
00:04:05 - How AI Search Works: "Fan-Out" vs. "Agentic" Queries
00:06:17 - Is GEO Just a New Name for SEO?
00:08:29 - The Risk of Bloating Your Site for AI
00:11:14 - Do LLMs Trust Your Website's Information?
00:12:55 - Tracking Your Brand's Presence in LLMs
00:18:05 - Are AI Recommendations Driving High-Intent Sales?
00:23:08 - Will Higher Conversions Offset Lower Traffic?
00:30:03 - The Step-by-Step GEO Process
00:34:22 - How to Structure Content for AI Retrieval
00:41:31 - Correcting Misinformation & Off-Page GEO