State-sanctioned marriage has long been regarded as one of the bedrocks of a stable society. But in recent times, this venerable institution has become the focus of intense debate, as those long denied the right to marry clamor to be let in and those determined to keep marriage the way it’s always been threaten to amend the constitution in “defense” of marriage. In the heat of battle, few have stopped to ask whether the state should be in the marriage business in the first place – until now. John and Ken welcome Tamara Metz from Reed College, author of Untying the Knot: Marriage, the State and the Case for Their Divorce.