The Intrazone by Microsoft 365 Make a list and check it twice
In this episode, Chris and Mark talk to Miceile Barrett and Lincoln DeMaris – both from the Lists engineering team. Miceile and Lincoln discuss the innovation in development to bring Microsoft Lists to market – evolving SharePoint lists and beyond across Microsoft 365. You'll hear insights about the new Lists home page, ready-made templates, rules, the coming mobile app, Microsoft Teams integration and more – plus give some fun examples of real customer lists in use today.
Full transcript below and if you click here.
Resources and Info Links:
SharePoint Facebook | @SharePoint | SharePoint Community Blog | UserVoice
Miceile Barrett LinkedIn | Twitter
Lincoln DeMaris LinkedIn
Announcing Microsoft Lists - Your smart information tracking app in Microsoft 365 by Seth Patton, GM, Microsoft 365
Microsoft Lists resource center
15-minute Lists product demo by Miceile Barrett, Program Manager, Microsoft Lists (video)
From Microsoft Teams to Fluid Framework—here's what's new and coming soon to Microsoft 365 by Jared Spataro, Corporate Vice President, Microsoft 365
What's new in Microsoft Teams | Build Edition | May 2020 by Aya Tange, Product Marketing Manager, Teams
Microsoft Mechanics "Teams Build 2020 announcements" video with Jeremy Chapman, Director, Microsoft 365
Microsoft Build, May 19-20, 2020
Microsoft 365 Virtual Marathon, May 27-28, 2020
Galactic Collaboration Summit, June 2 and June 9, 2020
Microsoft Inspire, July 21-22, 2020
Microsoft Docs - The home for Microsoft documentation for end users, developers, and IT professionals.
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TRANSCRIPT
(Music.)
MARK KASHMAN: Welcome to the Intrazone, a show about the Microsoft 365 intelligent internet. I'm Mark Kashman here with my cohost today from the very far distant reaches of, well, about 10 or 13 miles away, Mr. Chris McNulty.
CHRIS MCNULTY: Well, thanks, Mark. It's great to be back here when you. You're always top of my list. And on top of our list this week, we're talking with Miceile Barrett, program manager, and Lincoln DeMaris, principal PM manager, from the OneDrive and SharePoint engineering team.
MARK KASHMAN: Yes. And at the end of this episode, you will know that a list is a list is a list. And one of the newest extensions and evolutions of our story is Microsoft Lists. We're going to talk with Miceile and Lincoln about the newest app in Microsoft 365 Portfolio, Microsoft Lists.
So, Chris, what are your thoughts on lists these days?
CHRIS MCNULTY: Oh, I have – I have a long list of things to say about lists. You know, it's – it's really interesting. If you look at something that seems as esoteric as a data construct, right, you have over the past 20 years, you've had a variety of technologies like Access and Access Web Apps, and Excel. How you store the data shouldn't matter too much for these, you know, low-code/no-code, user-driven, lightweight application processes.
But one thing that we've really observed is making it very easy for people to start with their data, is how you open up the whole application process, if you think about it.
MARK KASHMAN: Yeah, you know, certainly off of our title, you know, you can make a list and check it twice. But I think when you start to do all the things beyond storing the data, you really start to see the value of lists. And you know, in a variety of products and services, you're able to store data and – and present it and work with it.
And I think the unique value with lists in the past and certainly going forward is how you can represent that data, how you can share it, how you can visualize it, how you can augment it over time. It's not something that just is here today and gone tomorrow, but changes.
And I think what's nice about mapping it to a business process is the business process dictates what you need to see and what you need to know, and then asks you what you need to contribute. But I think it's that representation of information, and with Microsoft Lists, it gets a lot more visible, it gets a lot more organized and aggregated together across multiple lists.
But you know, I want to dig in a little bit before we dive in with Miceile and Lincoln to know, you know, from your perspective, because I know you have had, both as a marketer here at Microsoft focused on content services and the lists role that plays into that, but before as an MVP, as a consultant, or anytime you've used lists in the past, how would you say you've used them in the past and how you see them growing up over time?
CHRIS MCNULTY: Well, it's interesting, if you just think back over the past, you know, couple of decades, there's been a sort of pendulum back and forth between high structure and high user touch.
And if you go back, you know, farthest back to mainframe or sophisticated computer databases, those are things that required the high priestesses and priests of data science to be able to construct for you.
And we saw, you know, over time, people sort of came down from the mountain and started breaking them into PC-based databases, like dBase, FoxPro and Access, and spreadsheets really kind of went – in many cases, have provided this data service, in addition to being a calculation service, because people started to find them a very easy place to be able to construct these two-dimensional matrixes, these two-dimensional tables, where they would put in people or locations or sales, or all sorts of things, sometimes to be able to model them and sometimes just to be able to capture the data.
And if you think about Excel, you know, Excel has been described as the number one data format in the world and the number one business intelligence tool in the world, and the number one calculation tool in the world because it's ubiquitous, people are familiar with it, it's flexible, you can make lots of copies. As data starts to explode, that whole "it's in a file" starts to become a bit of a challenge.
That's where SharePoint lists have come in. And SharePoint lists originally are foundational. They have been with the product since its earliest on-premises days. And I think that at their best, you know, they – we're trying to capture some of the great usability features that people intuitively get about working in an Excel file, about I can see a matrix I can pick a single value, I can add formats, I can work with some calculations, but without all of the user error you can get into in Excel, that if you accidentally drag a column to the wrong place, it blows up all the calculations, or someone can email the file to someone else and you've lost the data. he advantage of a list is that it's centralized.
And so, what we have done with lists historically, and I'm really mindful of is, how do you marry kind of the centralized power of a database with the ease of use of something like Excel? And that's where that common structure, I think, really shines for something like a list.
MARK KASHMAN: Yeah, I think there is a role for everybody to play with lists, and it's really across a lot of different scenarios and personas. You know, if you think about the ease of use that we're targeting, already today, a lot of people at different skillsets come in and leverage lists either out of the box or start to extend them.
But I'll say, you know, for myself, I would qualify as somebody that's just about to be a maker, you know, but somebody that really benefits from the out-of-use ease of lists and creating views and ease of sharing.
And so, I know Microsoft Lists, the focus there around making that even easier and more powerful for the common user, but that there's a real spectrum as you start to need a list to do more for you, or you want to start tinkering a little bit more with additional capabilities, either to configure, or really to move into that maker world.
You know, our peer and cohort that we've talked with on the show before, Chax (ph), he is clearly somebody that represents the maker in terms of connecting to the Power Platform and being able to use a list as a backend data source to a custom form with Power Apps or extending a more complex workflow with Power Automate.
And then if I switched over to that final persona, really a grow-up story with somebody that's well known in our community Vesa Juvonen, who would represent that true professional developer, somebody that's going to be leveraging the list API, building a custom solution around it to bring in both push and pull of data, possibly in a very custom user interface with a lot of logic and – and in between for that custom solution or that custom app.
But to know that the element of a list, which is that true data source, and the ease of use, and the spectrum of what you then can configure, customize, or truly build, it gets back to what we really want to make sure people are clear about is a list is a list is a list.
You know, we have talked about SharePoint lists with a lowercase L for a very long time. And now with Microsoft Lists, capital L, it really up-levels that and it makes it a little bit more ubiquitous for more people to engage with them, have a better view of all of your lists, and – and you know, that ease of getting in and out of different lists and configuring them, but that we don't lose that value of being able to add more power, more complexity, when there's that need.
CHRIS MCNULTY: You know, it's interesting, one of the things that you alluded to there is kind of that grow-up story. You know, there's a challenge when someone builds this almost calcified, multi-table database structure, and they built a number of applications screens and mobile apps to tie into it. And then someone says, "Hey, what if we have customers who have more than one office? How do we handle that?"
If you think about something that the software industry has snapped to for the last 20 years, the idea of agile development, that you should, you know, start small, go for quick wins, and just continue making incremental steps, rather than trying to boil the ocean.
And I think there's value, especially in the early days, where you may not fully understand all the data you're collecting, having some flexibility as to how am I going to capture it, do I need to add a couple of additional columns that I didn't expect at the outset, and can I make it simple enough that adding those columns doesn't break all the work that's come before?
I think lists are a great place to have that centralized flexibility, and then you can add things on top of it over time, whether it's reporting through Power BI, or interfaces that you extend into mobile with places like Power Apps, the fact that you can start smaller, you know, make a list you can check twice, avoid the naughty, focus on nice. See what I did there?
MARK KASHMAN: I did. I like it.
Yeah, I think when you look at that similar pattern, you know, it starts to be grounded in everything we're talking about lists, but for SharePoint as a backend content service, its lists, its libraries, certainly files as a big part of that, working with pages, working with the sites themselves, and having that common structure so that people can use out of the box, build and configure.
But I think the true value what you're touching on is that there is a common single source of truth, and that's most important when you think about this type of data, as it fluctuates, as things change, as you make different plans and need to represent that. Changing in multiple locations can be cumbersome, and oftentimes a point of failure when something doesn't get updated.
But with things built in a mindful way, knowing how people are going to leverage it, bringing in and pulling out data, that it's that single source of truth, that is flexible over time, and is really meant to map to what do you need to have it represent at a point in time, and to a certain set of people. You know, you can create different views for different groups, a lot of flexibility.
And I know, our peer, Dan Holm (ph), jokes a lot in the past how he would have liked to have been paid by the list, because he puts so much effort and so much energy into the value that they brought, a lot of the solutions that he built for his customers.
You know, he was certainly a problem-solver then and is now, and I think that statement alone represents what it is that you're saying, and I hope that we get across to our audiences, there is the power and flexibility, and it's usable and powerful to those different personas.
CHRIS MCNULTY: And the thing about list is, you know, are they the place where I would keep track of all the retail transactions for a major online retailer on a second-by-second basis? No, that's not what a list is. Is it a place limited to having a dozen entries? Well, no, that's not what the list is either. It is a flexible, dynamic table. You can store up to 30 million items in it. And our announcements that we made this week, you know, I think really extend the relationships amongst lists.
If you think about it, in databases, you have to establish all these entity diagrams. In SharePoint, and now in Microsoft 365, you may have a couple of lists that are related to each other. And I don't mean formally, but you may have a list of contacts, a list of events, and a list of collateral, and be – just being able to get all of those things, which might live across multiple teams or multiple sites, into a common experience that I can then take with me on a mobile device, you know, I think that's just fantastic potential for what lists can do for us.
MARK KASHMAN: I agree, and I think as we move to now talk to Miceile and Lincoln. I just want to state that even if you hear something in the background, like clinking pans, or some kitchen noise in the background, that that is the Kashman kids. I know that they are currently making a really nice list and have been maintaining a list of recipes. And I think what you're hearing is them trying out one of those new list items that I will tell you all about after I've had a bite, if they will share.
You know, making a list, as easy it is for the Kashman kids, as easy it has been for Chris and Dan and many others to really extend and bring value to customers and partners and now to this recipe that's in the background, but Chris, I think it's now time for us to turn to our experts, Miceile Barrett and Lincoln DeMaris from the SharePoint and OneDrive team, to hear more about Microsoft Lists.
I don't know what's going on behind us, but it's fun. They do know that we're recording. You know, make a list and interrupt it twice, I think is what they're going after.
CHRIS MCNULTY: Today on the Intrazone, Mark, and I are talking, as we mentioned, with Miceile and Lincoln, from the SharePoint, and now Lists engineering team. So Miceile, Lincoln, welcome back to the Intrazone.
LINCOLN DEMARIS: Thank you very much. Mr. McNulty.
MICEILE BARRETT: Thanks, Chris,
CHRIS MCNULTY: Quite a week at Build for Microsoft Lists. And I really, Mark, should bring you in on that because I know you've been instrumental at helping formulate our story about what we're doing with Microsoft Lists. It is really exciting to see all the investments that are out there.
As we're getting going, can each of you tell us a little bit about kind of who you are, how you got to this crazy place called Microsoft in the first place, and what your journey was to start working on lists.
Miceile, if you could get us started.
MICEILE BARRETT: Yeah, thanks, Chris. So as mentioned, I'm Miceile Barrett. I joined Microsoft in 2016. The first product area I ever worked on was actually lists. When I joined, I met Lincoln DeMaris and back in 2016, he had just released the modern UI list experience. And the first thing I ever did when I joined Microsoft was work with Lincoln on this effort to make lists look even more beautiful. So the first thing I did was replace the managed metadata navigation with what we now know and love as the filters pane.
So it's pretty crazy to see the full circle journey of Microsoft Lists, ultimately leading in this Microsoft Lists release, and it's pretty cool to still be doing it with Lincoln, who I met day one of my job here.
MARK KASHMAN: Who is this Lincoln that you speak of Miceile? Maybe we can get Lincoln. Lincoln, who are you?
LINCOLN DEMARIS: Hi. Well, my name is Lincoln DeMaris. And let's see, my journey at Microsoft. Well, boy, I guess it was around the year 2004. I was a plucky Midwestern youth attending a career fair, and I saw a career fair booth for this company called Microsoft. And I'm like, yeah, that sounds pretty cool. I'll give them a resume. And 14 years later, I'm here.
I started on the SharePoint team working on web content management and ECM. I've been involved with a whole bunch of different parts of SharePoint, from OneDrive to document libraries to team sites. Now I'm the proud product owner of lists. And it's been a fantastic journey, and I plan on sticking around for quite a while longer.
MARK KASHMAN: Your pluckiness is coming through loud and clear, and I think that is going to be my new favorite word for this week.
So Lincoln, let's stay with you for a second. The Intrazone audience may be familiar with SharePoint lists, which is course lowercase L, and starting at Build and moving forward, we're excited to share all the new work-tracking elements that you're building into what we now refer to as Microsoft Lists, capital L.
Can you share more on how behind the scenes have been planning and designing with the team in this new phase of innovation for lists?
LINCOLN DEMARIS: As we all know, remote work is super-hot right now. And in particular, there's this category of app that we see gaining a lot of traction, mindshare, winning a lot of fans, and frankly, generating a lot of venture capital, and sort of this category of apps we call work management apps.
And these are – these are really magical tools, because it allows just about anybody to sign up, sign in and create their own database. And from that database, just about anybody can build a lightweight tracking app for their team.
And so, I'm not going to name any names, but I'm sure most of you listening have – have your favorite app in this category, and you're – you're thinking of a few different examples right now. But these are really transformative tools, because they allow anybody to be a maker in a really real way that enables real productivity on their teams.
We looked at these apps, and we thought to ourselves, well, we do this already, we have this thing called SharePoint lists. In fact, we've had them for 20 years. I mean, that observation is correct. Lists today are a work management tool. But you know, when you look at them, and you compare it with some of the offerings in the marketplace, the UI is not quite there. The capabilities are powerful, but maybe accessible only for the most sort of dedicated SharePoint fans and makers, right? You can build incredible things with lists today, but it's not quite a tool for everybody in the same way that these other apps in the Marketplace are.
And so, that's – that's really kind of the frame around what we're doing with Microsoft Lists. We're taking a 20-year-old technical asset, a great – a good product, and turning it really into a great product.
CHRIS MCNULTY: You know, it's interesting hearing you talk about that, because, you know, we've been working in this space together for a while as well. And, you know, if you go back a couple years, you know, at the time, modern lists felt like the end of a journey. And I think we can look back and say, oh, that was really just the beginning of being able to do even more.
MARK KASHMAN: Only when you get philosophical, Chris, right.
MIKE MCCUNE: Yeah, but, I mean, like, you know, it's funny, we've talked before about the year of the list. I'm really hoping we're looking forward to the decade of the list.
MARK KASHMAN: Oh, absolutely, centuries even.
So, Miceile, we want to hear from you just to start to ground a little bit more of what is Microsoft Lists, what are the capabilities. Can you highlight one or two common scenarios before we get into the feature set that highlight these, you know, now easier to build and use lists like Lincoln was describing?
MICEILE BARRETT: Absolutely. The Microsoft Lists makes it, as everyone's saying here, more easier than ever for someone to create a custom business solution. And so, the real value that this app adds is to helping our users get started faster and adding all the data that they need even easier so that they can ultimately have this app-like experience. And
so, when users start going into the new list app, they will start to see eight out-of-the-box templates that they can start using immediately. Two of my personal favorites that I want to call attention to here are Issue Tracker and the Event Itinerary.
I work in tech, and so specifically to me, the Issue Tracker has been most helpful for providing visibility into our flight rollouts and ensuring that any blocking issues are identified.
And with these templates, it's, you know, two to three clicks, and you have a list created with all of the schema defined, a scenario right there that you're ready to start using, and all the formatting there. So as soon as you start adding the data that matches your scenario, it looks beautiful, it's easy to use, and there's no barrier to getting started anymore, which makes this a very fast experience.
MARK KASHMAN: Yeah, you know, I saw a pretty early demo that you all shared as we we're prepping, and you know, when you see the move from clicking and choosing one of the templates, like you had mentioned, and it starts with what effectively looks like a blank list to get started. And as you fill out the details, before you've done any formatting, any choices, any configuration, it's already baked in that the color scheme is there, when you have certain criteria that's met. When you change status to X or Y based on that template, it's already there, it really became a magical experience that I knew you could do those things in the product, but that they were already there on the first day of the list, that was really nice to see.
MICEILE BARRETT: Yeah, absolutely. And I think that's a pretty important step for us to take with the Microsoft List experience, where you no longer need to be a list pro or have years of experience to know where all of the hidden features are. Right now, we're just putting them right in front of our users and giving them a scenario that's common across multiple different industries, so that they could click and get inspired on how to use lists, while also being able to just start immediately.
And I think that that's one of the greatest things that I really liked about this new experience is the second you click that new button, you're staring at eight different scenarios that you don't really have to think about. You get to just pick the one that matches what you're doing today.
And that really removes that initial thought of what am I going to do, which columns do I need, are they going to be pretty, how do I make them a certain color, that type of thing, and it makes it just a great experience.
MARK KASHMAN: Yeah, I am so thrilled to – you know, I'm going to be honest and say we are reintroducing the concept of templates into the list universe. Longtime SharePoint fans in the audience will remember the good old days, when we used to have an event list, we used to have an issue tracking list, we had a contacts list; we had kind of all these lists templates, and they were really kind of the decade-old manifestation of what Miceile is talking about. It's a quick way to get started along a particular use case.
When we went to modern in 2016, we sort of left those behind, because we observed there wasn't a ton of usage on these things. And so, we made this sort of data-driven decision to leave them behind. And we since learned that people really miss these sorts of inspirational starting points. Longtime SharePoint fans maybe will have a built of nostalgia about our old template ecosystem, and it's coming back in a new way.
MICEILE BARRETT: And then one of the other common scenarios that I am extremely excited to highlight is, when you do have these lists, we are now adding the ability to simply visualize it in a way that makes sense, so the ability to show and hide the columns easily, render them in a card-like structure, which I know we've been demoing a couple of times here.
But as you'll see throughout the different releases, it's becoming easier and more intuitive than ever. And so, it just makes it really straightforward and removes the barrier of having to think through what you want your data to look like at the end, because you could just do it so easily now that it makes it a really great experience. And you can save it, you can make them the default; it makes it a really powerful tool that no longer requires hours and hours of prep.
CHRIS MCNULTY: You know, it's a really interesting time, I think, for us to expose the audience a bit to what we announced today. We'll definitely have links to all of our announcements in the show notes.
But Lincoln, I was wondering if you could take our audience, you know, from your perspective. What are the top three or four things that we have announced this week that people can really come to expect on a list? You talked about templates, but what are some of the others?
LINCOLN DEMARIS: Yeah, templates is really big. I am most excited to announce is our brand-new list home experience. So everything we're talking about today is an evolution of SharePoint lists, and we're bringing SharePoint lists forward and adding a bunch of cool stuff. But we're adding a new high-level entry point to the M365 suite nav. You're going to see a tile in your suite nav menu, and it's going to be called lists.
When you click lists, you're going to see all the favorite and recent lists that you have accessed. And so, this includes lists across your team sites, and lists that you've created in your own personal space. So it's like OneDrive is sort of a one-stop shopping place for all of your files; this app is a one-stop shopping place for all of your lists.
This experience also makes it easy to get started. So there's a big new button at the top. You can create a new blank list, a new list from Excel, a new list from existing, or a list from one of our templates.
So I'm really excited about how this new list home experience makes it easier than ever before to jump in, get started, and get back to your list. Super excited about that one.
Really excited also about the improvements we've made to fundamental editing. We have an awesome new view type called grid, and it's an evolution of what we've called Quick Edit in the past. And we've really poured a ton of energy into building an industry-leading experience there.
Miceile, you have anything to say about that?
MICEILE BARRETT: Yeah, absolutely. Lincoln's been talking about the past here, and we've got Data Sheet, Quick Edit, and now we're going to Grid.
And one of the goals that we set for this was users should be able to add their data as easily as possible. So I'm very excited for our users to start being able to use their keyboard to add everything and be able to use an inline experience that's even faster than the form experience, with the same capabilities that we've supported, but with a refreshed UI that is significantly improved.
So we'll still have our drag and drop to drag and fill, we'll still have copy and paste, but really bringing in every single type of field type to be edited in line and showing them in visually appealing ways that makes sense so that the data is easily recognizable.
LINCOLN DEMARIS: Plus, it's fast, it is so fast. Like you can't blink when clicking on a list or you're going to miss it. Lists just pop into view. The interactions are so crisp. It feels like a brand-new product. It's really amazing to work with. I'm so excited about the GridView.
The last thing I'll say, just I can't have a discussion about lists without talking how excited I am about the new calendar view. So this is one of our top feature requests in lists ever since the modern days. I'm super pumped to announce that we're bringing back beautiful calendar view to lists.
And so, any list, you can create a view that looks like a calendar, and you can view your items inside that calendar view. And so, that's a great way to look at events or items or deliverables that are coming up in the past, do now plan for the future plan, plan for the present?
CHRIS MCNULTY: Well, I wouldn't say we're just bringing it back, because, you know, there was a classic calendar view. We're bringing it forward. It's all of the goodness of, you know, list home and templating and all those other things. You know, it's going to get all of that and more.
LINCOLN DEMARIS: You're right.
MARK KASHMAN: Miceile, one of the fairly new experiences, especially the Create experience that we're bringing to Microsoft Teams, there is the concept of a lists app now in Teams. Can you explain or describe a little bit around that experience of creating or bringing in existing lists when it comes to working in Teams?
MICEILE BARRETT: Yeah, absolutely. So to give a little context here today, in Teams, you can go and copy a URL, and basically the URL will render inside of Teams. And we have taken a lot of strides to make that experience a lot more Teams focused. So you can now go into Teams, and without ever having to leave the Teams client, you're able to create a new list using any of the templates, and Teams actually has three of their templates that are specific to them. And you can use anything else. You can create a custom list, a list from Excel, a list from an existing list, all with inside of Teams.
And then as you'll see in some of these releases, the visual appearance in Teams, it feels native. It's no longer this sense of just taking a website and putting it into Teams. It's fast. It feels like it belongs inside of Teams. I almost like to think of it as like a theme that we put on the list, so that everything you would expect to work inside of Teams just does.
And then additionally, there's a lot of value with using a list inside Teams. The one that I like to always call out is the fact that you can have a conversation on your list items in a Teams channel. And users might be familiar with this experience on a document or a file, where you can go into that file and have that conversation on that file in the context of the Teams channel. And so, bringing that ability to a list item really makes it easier than ever to collaborate on these individual records, so that you have all the contacts in the right place.
MARK KASHMAN: I think it's a game changer anytime you bring in a mindful way content right next to the conversation, and to be able to do that at the list level is always important, but to really direct somebody's attention, the call for, you know, them to help out, to fill out something or just to review whatnot, that ability to do that at the list item level, especially on lists that could be quite large, you know, several 100 or thousand items, it really makes it a more targeted, better experience for the person you're bringing into the conversation.
MICEILE BARRETT: Absolutely. I want to add on one thing here. Another feature to kind of go off what Lincoln was talking about is a feature we're releasing called Rules. And Rules generally speaking will allow our users to configure actions based on Item data changes.
And this is a really awesome experience I'm excited for people to try out, because it takes about five clicks in less than 20 seconds to set one up, and you can do some really cool things.
For example, the one that I use is the ability to send emails to a person in a person field when I update a status of another column. And so, having these rules that are easy to set up and fast are great.
I can also turn it off at any time. There's a simple toggle switch, which makes it even more powerful. So I can determine which ones are running at which time.
So I'm excited for people to start trying them out and giving feedback on what they're using them for.
LINCOLN DEMARIS: Yeah, it really transforms lists, like the Rules feature rules rules, I'll just say that. It really transforms lists from something that feels like a pretty-looking database, maybe a single point of truth, into a true collaborative application, like really reaching out and bringing people back into the fold when there's work to be done. It really transforms lists into a tool for productivity.
MARK KASHMAN: Yeah, I think it's one of the key differentiators, too, when people start to not only try to understand what lists are and how they'll use them, but you know, how is it different from me just writing down on a piece of paper or tracking it in something like a OneNote, or a Word document. It's that nature of collaboration. And I think you all are building it in a way that is very tactile, and direct and certainly friendly, because it works just as you would expect it to.
MICEILE BARRETT: Yeah, and we can't have this conversation without calling out the fact that we're now building a list mobile app, because everything we're talking about is just as necessary on the go.
And so, we should absolutely make a call out there that everything we're doing with this collaboration will be available in a mobile app, so that there's no – there's no friction between where you're working.
MARK KASHMAN: Yeah, and we were pretty open that we are getting started with disclosure around Build time. A lot of what you're working on and we've been talking about will come in the summertime. The list mobile app will be later in the year.
But the value, you know, Lincoln or Miceile, that notion of accessing a list today through anything mobile has been maybe a bit of a blocker. And I see what you're building, and I know when it comes, it'll be a breath of fresh air for people to engage with lists, to edit them, to share them, to create them, which, you know, even seems like a crazy notion to do on a mobile. But I've seen what you're working on, and I think that's really exciting.
LINCOLN DEMARIS: When you look at our competitors, you realize, well, that isn't a crazy notion. It's just taking mobile further than we ever have before on the SharePoint team, frankly.
And when you – when you look at lists today inside the SharePoint, the SharePoint app, it's at best a companion experience. You can view the data in your list, but you can't edit it arbitrarily. And so, that's – we're really looking to make the list app more than just a companion app, but a first-class way to do anything and everything.
And so, if you're a primarily a mobile user, and you like to do everything on your phone, including add the data, manage schema, tweak rules, you can do that all on the go.
We haven't yet announced the timeline for this. It will be later this year. Pretty much everything else we're talking about in this podcast is going to come out this summer, so you'll be able to try it in June or July, but the mobile app is going to trail a little bit.
CHRIS MCNULTY: But I want to really kind of emphasize that to the audience. If we go back over the past year, you know, we've created this new, lightweight, form editing experience attached to lists because sometimes – and Lincoln, you and I've spoken about this many times – sometimes you want to do something that's very fast and clean and quick. I just want to grab three or four fields, change the order, change the layout. I don't need to build an entire application around it.
And one thing that we know customers have been doing is they're going all the way to Power Apps and Power Platform to build basically a mobile app, when really all they want to do is they just want to take a list with them, so if they get a good idea, or they get a question, or they're talking to a customer on the fly, they just have the convenience of that, without having to go through a whole application building experience.
LINCOLN DEMARIS: Oh, yeah, absolutely. We are as invested as we ever have been in our connection between lists and the Power Platform. And connecting lists to Power App or Power Automate is still the best way to build a totally custom line of business application using lists as the storage layer.
But as you pointed out, hey, Power Platform is great, but it's the Power Platform, not the simple platform, right. And so, if all you want to do is open the form inside of a list, and the form is important, like the form is one of the things that makes a list special and distinguishes it from any other type of spreadsheet thing you might find like inside of Excel, or inside of a word table.
And so, if all you want to do is make some lightweight tweaks to that form, we're working on – we have some great new features that make that quick and easy. And so, if you want to just drag and drop and change the order, we actually shipped that last year. We're building in some more, a little more sophisticated capabilities there, like the ability to do simple branching.
And if you're a little more sophisticated, you can create custom headers, footers, and multicolumn layouts directly in SharePoint forms without Power Apps. And so, we're really excited to launch that and get feedback on that as well.
CHRIS MCNULTY: You know, but I do think it's important to emphasize, there's a grow-up story, isn't there, that even though you can start with a completely no-code solution like Microsoft Lists, and as your needs grow and get more sophisticated, you can move up to the some code level of Power Platform, if you need to.
LINCOLN DEMARIS: You're absolutely right, start simple, and as your team grows, and your requirements grow, gradually become more and more sophisticated and do more,
MARK KASHMAN: We want to turn the heat up just a little bit in the context that we, of course, have been talking about things that you've known and have been working on for a little bit, but there's one area that we wanted to explore, which is what we hope to do is to provide that clarity on those common questions we get, usually when we talk about Microsoft 365 and various applications that are offered within the portfolio, just some common FAQs.
And so, Miceile, we wanted to ask you, when you think about Microsoft Lists, alongside a Task Manager or something like Excel, how do you differentiate knowing what you're building and grounded it in those rights scenarios?
MICEILE BARRETT: Yeah, absolutely. I feel the heat, Mark.
LINCOLN DEMARIS: Turning up the heat.
MICEILE BARRETT: There are two ways that I want to think about this and walk through. The first way is in the most fundamental sense, Excel is a spreadsheet and lists is a database. And this means that in the list, you get that data integrity through our multiple field types. And in Microsoft Lists, each row of your data is a record.
And so, when you're thinking of a record as a business entity, it can really help drive a process, which takes me to my second thought here, which is, Microsoft Lists allow you to drive a workflow. So yes, they are great to store large amounts of data in a schematized way, but the really unique value of the list that kind of differentiates it from a Task Manager or Excel is the ability to drive a project from start to finish in a way that's completely customizable to you, based on the project that you're driving.
And I think that that is something that takes a little while to sink in when I say it in the sentence, a very long sentence, but really using the product to take your – whether it's a three-week project or a three-year project, and ensure everything is on track, and being able to easily identify any gaps or misses. And that's where Microsoft Lists comes in and through, you know, being a database and having all these different integrations, it's really powerful to help you land that project with the correct tools.
LINCOLN DEMARIS: Yeah, I'm sure we've all experienced scenarios where somebody, some project manager on a team starts this big old Excel file to track deliverables or tasks or track anything and everything, and sort of they ask for collaborative input across the team.
And these sort of giant Excel sheets kind of turned into messes, right? Like someone filters the list, and that filter sticks when they save it. And then people are confused when they come in, because there's no notion of personal views. And so, it's sort of bending Excel to a use case it was never really intended for.
You know, Excel is a spreadsheet. It's meant to track numbers and do number crunching, and it can do a whole bunch else, because inherently tables are flexible data structures and you can do many different things, just given a table and a document.
But lists, as Miceile said, are really purpose built for that sort of collaborative tracking scenario where you have input from a bunch of stakeholders into a central point of truth, and you want to drive progress and next steps on those things.
MARK KASHMAN: And I would just add real simply, too, that, you know, the way that you've built both the current technology and things that existed already is there's also a blend of how you can use Excel with a SharePoint list.
If you had started, for whatever reason, in Excel, you can import that, as Miceile had mentioned getting started, import a table of data as a list, new list. And at any point in time, you can choose to export to Excel sort of as a one-way view to do that analysis that Lincoln was talking about.
So I do like the new capabilities and the differentiators, but at the same time, it's not always an or; it can be an end, especially when the scenario dictates.
LINCOLN DEMARIS: Totally right.
MICEILE BARRETT: Yeah, absolutely.
CHRIS MCNULTY: Come on, Mark. Turn up the heat. Turn up the heat a little bit more.
MARK KASHMAN: I'm trying.
LINCOLN DEMARIS: That was an easy one. I feel like Miceile knocked that one out of the park. Come on.
MARK KASHMAN: I think she did too. So I think if we turn to Lincoln – are you ready Lincoln? You might want to – you might want to get an ice pack for your forehead.
LINCOLN DEMARIS: Yeah, okay, I'm ready.
MARK KASHMAN: We know Microsoft Lists builds off of SharePoint lists. You lead with that, and we really want to ground that as the truth, as the data source. And we've talked about how you can integrate with the Power Platform using lists as a data source.
But what I really want to ask is, is this a new thing? Is this an old thing? Is this an evolution? Is this a revolution? What are we looking at here?
LINCOLN DEMARIS: Well, I think Chris was very philosophical and artful when he put that modern lists was the beginning of a journey, not the end of a journey. And I'd say we are at a similar inflection point now where we look back and we look forward and we realize that there's just one lists product here, and we continue to bring it forward.
The key distinguishing thing that I'll say, I'll say again, is when we shipped modern lists, there was sort of a choice. We asked people to consider tradeoffs. Because there were tradeoffs between classic and modern. Classic had a set of capabilities that modern didn't, but modern had this fresh look and feel, and – and it had its own set of capabilities that were unique to modern, and we made people choose.
There is – there is no choice anymore. There's just one list product. Classic still does exist, by the way. We've – we've sort of officially removed the ability to opt in entire tenancy out of – out of modern lists, but the granular switches still exist, and they will exist for quite some time. So if you're listening to this podcast, and you still have a dependency on classic lists, rest assured that we're still there for you, and we have no plans to pull that out. But there is no additional bifurcation that's happening between lists experiences.
So everything that we've talked about with templates and rules and calendar view and the new grid, if you use a list today, you're going to benefit from all of those features. If you don't use lists today, we invite you now to come in, get started, give it a try, and tell us what you think
MARK KASHMAN: Yeah, that last part was really what the – the habanero I was going to throw at you was, I've been using list classic. I moved it to modern. I accepted all of that. I've been using the list for two years now. And now this new functionality, which I'm really excited for, it comes in, and yes, I do get it. You already answered the question, but I think that was the habanero on top to make it the superheated question, which was, what about those existing lists? What's the expectation? And really, I think the way that you're building it and designing it is they just get all the goodness, and there won't be an interruption whatsoever.
CHRIS MCNULTY: What I was just thinking about, as you were talking, is I remember in the 2012, 2013 era, we were talking kind of about the dawn of cloud, and there were people who were saying, you know, at some point in the next few years, there are going to be features that you, you know, can only get in cloud and you can't get on premises. And there's going to be a point where it's just better than what you could do on premises. And people scoffed.
And I think we're really in a similar junction right now, Miceile, with where we are with modern and classic. And, you know, we've been saying for a while, modern is the vehicle we use to deliver innovation to our customers. But I think we're not just talking about a slogan; we're saying specific things with mobile app and homepage experience and templating, and all of these things.
Like, do you think that, you know, five years from now, like, at some point, you know, what would – what do you think the role of classic becomes as we continue to drive Microsoft Lists forward?
LINCOLN DEMARIS: I see the role of classic as a host for legacy applications. There's absolutely a defensible use case for classic even in today's world, even – even a year from now with all of these improvements that we have coming down the line. And that's if you've – if you've invested deeply in a legacy application that has specific customizations, be it on Custom Action, or JSLink, or any of those other extensibility points. And you know, think of that app as frozen in time and serving a purpose.
And I'm thrilled that I – that we run a service that powers those legacy applications, but they're just that, they're legacy. And they're around because they're important, they're entrenched. But looking forward, from this point forward, I don't see any – any reason to use classic lists for net new things. You're just passing up on too much innovation, too much goodness, too much support, and too much continued innovation.
MARK KASHMAN: Well, one of the things we didn't yet talk about, and I think is clearly there in classic, clearly there in modern, and clearly there as we go forward is the role that developers will tap into through the list API, leveraging the Microsoft Graph.
I am not a developer, so I don't want to talk too far out of my comfort zone, but whenever I think of that grow-up story, we talked about going from the out-of-box list experience, using the Power Platform for that low code, you know, quick innovation, time to market. But there really is still a category of building true custom solutions with the Lists API, with a custom user interface, or other form or other technology. That's a part of our classic history, but it is still grounded in, you can still use the Lists API today going forward as well.
LINCOLN DEMARIS: Oh, yeah, absolutely.
MARK KASHMAN: Okay, so well, let's take you out of the hot seat and move us into the fun zone. I'm going to virtually put my clown nose on, if that makes it fun, maybe make it scary for some people. But without naming names, and I'd love to hear from both of you, we'll start with Miceile, what – what is the craziest list or scenario that utilizes a list that you've seen a customer use or a partner build for a customer? Again, without naming names, can you describe a little bit about a crazy list thing that you've seen, Miceile?
MICEILE BARRETT: Yeah, absolutely. The – the one that's coming to the top of my mind is maybe a little more inspiring than crazy, but it does have some crazy details here. So this list came about during the COVID-19 pandemic, and I saw a customer using this list to monitor chemical production across 200 different chemical plants. And ultimately, this list was then used to determine which plants could be leveraged to shift their priorities and meet this new demand of sanitation chemicals.
And that's inspiring to see that our product could lead to such an effective approach, but the thing that kind of blew my mind was this list had over 70 fields, with 500 people collaborating on it weekly. And there were I'm not sure off the top my head how many items in this list, but it was a very crazy experience seeing the customer just scroll through those 70 fields, and they have, you know, descriptions on all of them. So it was – it was a very interesting use case of lists that worked. It worked very well for them. And I was also really excited to see so many people collaborating on it at once and just having great success with it.
And so, that is probably the craziest one that I have seen, that I can think of in the most recent times. I would also say the list is still in use, and last I heard from the customer, it's getting adopted globally, which means that the 200 sites is going to expand to 2,000 sites. I'm extremely interested to see what this list looks like in a month, and different ways that they're still using it.
One of the favorite things I saw in there was the fact that they added like a really cool hookup to Power BI. And so, when I was, you know, playing around with it, and they gave me control, it was just a really fast experience to filter and then see the Power BI board shift. I thought it was a really great implementation.
MARK KASHMAN: Cool.
CHRIS MCNULTY: Yeah, that's crazy, crazy cool. That's a great story of like, why lists are essential. And you know, that's not something you would ever want to try to do in Excel. That's a great story.
MARK KASHMAN: Lincoln, since you've been using lists for gosh, you know, since you were a plucky child.
LINCOLN DEMARIS: I just have to use it one more time.
MARK KASHMAN: Maybe let me ask this in a different way. What is the pluckiest list scenario that you've ever seen?
LINCOLN DEMARIS: Oh, man, you just – you had to change my answer. My answer before was going to be craziest list I've ever seen is the list of improvements that are coming later this year.
CHRIS MCNULTY: Oh stop.
LINCOLN DEMARIS: Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Cool. Is that – is that sufficient or do I have to keep talking? Okay, fine, I'll keep talking.
Like, I don't know, the thing that I love to use the most to tell the story of lists together with Power Platform. I wish I could name a name, but I'm not going to name a name. I'm just going to say that this is a scenario that's used in an environment where you have to manage a lot of chaos, a lot of guests, people coming into a space, and it's used as an incident management application.
So you know, somebody throws up, or flips over a table, or smokes in a hotel room, boy, a list is there to capture that and to orchestrate a response to that incident. That really gets to sort of the nature of having a central place to track everything and having great mobile applications for people on the ground, built on top of Power App, to actually do the – to actually click the buttons when there's an incident that needs to be responded to.
MARK KASHMAN: This sounds like a great location for rock stars to visit.
CHRIS MCNULTY: Can I give you a crazy list I saw?
MARK KASHMAN: Yes.
CHRIS MCNULTY: It was a list of libraries. And this was for a compliance department for a pharmaceutical company, that they've gone through a number of integrations, and they wanted to assess the criticality, the ownership and so forth.
So they wrote scripting to go through, and anytime someone had or built a new library, they added it to a master list. And the list itself, it was a list – since libraries are also lists, it was a list of lists.
MARK KASHMAN: Awesome.
LINCOLN DEMARIS: Just about the geekiest thing you've ever heard.
MARK KASHMAN: I love it.
Well, I'm going to round us off with maybe not quite as crazy or as plucky as you all, but just one thing close to home for what Chris and I do, and of course, that Lincoln and Miceile contribute too often in the work that they do is the Microsoft 365 roadmap.
Now the public entity that you would go to, to see what we're working on, is driven on a different content management platform, and that's all good. But all the work that we do now across all the teams internally that work on Microsoft 365 apps for lists, for Yammer, for SharePoint, for OneDrive, for Exchange and Outlook, and the list goes on, that is a long list of apps, but every feature that gets put onto the roadmap now is actually managed and stored and put through a process with a Microsoft List. It's actually now in a SharePoint list.
And they've really been building moving from a proprietary system that had its own logic and form and whatnot – it was a good system, but it certainly wasn't as easy to use, it wasn't functional at the scale that we were getting to. And now we've transitioned fully to that tool, which is a tool built on a SharePoint list.
And it really brings it to a much easier use case for Chris and I to contribute, and then get notifications and awareness for other stakeholders like Lincoln and Miceile, to make sure we've got it right. And there's a review process before it goes live onto the site.
But it's a crazy notion for us to have switched, I think very quickly from that proprietary system to standardizing on SharePoint lists for everything we do for the Microsoft 365 roadmap. It's, I think, been a really great switch, and I'm really pleased and proud of how the product is supporting it.
CHRIS MCNULTY: Yeah, thanks for that mention.
MARK KASHMAN: Absolutely. Thank you for the tech.
So we've got the – we've got the features and scenarios. We've got the heat in the past. The last thing is, we just want to thank you for your time. Thank you for joining us on the Intrazone.
And as always, we want to hear a little bit more of how people can learn more about what you do as an individual, highlight to some of the things that your team is doing, whether that's Twitter, whether that's through blogs, any recent assets that you worked on closely that you want to highlight to point people to. Miceile, we'll start with you. How can people find out more about you, and maybe some of the recent work you've been doing?
MICEILE BARRETT: Yeah, absolutely. To see a highlight reel of everything we've been talking about for this new product, check out the list demo video. It's about 15-17 minutes of pure demos and will hopefully inspire folks to start making Microsoft Lists for their team.
And if you want details on me, personally, you can follow my twitter at Microsoft @MSFTMiceile.
MARK KASHMAN: We will make sure to put that in the show notes, the links to the video, and of course how people can see your LinkedIn profile, and of course, follow you on Twitter.
And Lincoln, what can we highlight and call out here for our audience?
LINCOLN DEMARIS: Yeah, I think there's some upcoming virtual events that are happening this summer, that are going to be a great way to learn all sorts of things about what the – what the product team is working on across M365. And lists will have a seat at that table. I'm going to be recording a session for that. And so, when these guys give you the list of conferences, write them down and tune in for a more detailed update on what we're working on at those events.
MARK KASHMAN: Yeah, I will just tell you, as your PMM peer, I appreciate all of the effort that you've been putting into making sure that we highlight and showcase Microsoft Lists, not just because you're working on them, but because you're also good at communicating what people do with it and these assets I've seen, and I've certainly been working on with you, and – and we'll make sure that they're front and center so that people can see more about what we've been talking about.
But thank you for your time. Thank you for your – your work on Microsoft Lists.
Chris, any final words?
CHRIS MCNULTY: Yeah, just you know, again, Lincoln and Miceile, it's great to have you back on the Intrazone. And as always, we would love to present you with our basket of virtual gifts, which is fame in perpetuity on the Intrazone website. So thank you very much.
LINCOLN DEMARIS: Wonderful. I'm going to enjoy these virtual chocolates later this afternoon.
MARK KASHMAN: All right. Well, you all stay safe and have a great rest of your day.
LINCOLN DEMARIS: Wonderful time.
MICEILE BARRETT: Thanks, Mark. Thanks, Chris.
LINCOLN DEMARIS: Thanks, everyone.
CHRIS MCNULTY: Thank you. Bye-bye.
[Music.]
MARK KASHMAN: So Chris, I think we've gotten a sense of what you and Dan and others that we know, and how they use Microsoft Lists, or SharePoint lists in the past. Do you have any good customer examples just to ground it in terms of what we know our customers are dealing with lists today?
CHRIS MCNULTY: Absolutely. So about a year and a half ago, I spent some time with Marks and Spencer, the global retailer that's based in London. Marks and Spencer has a very traditional SharePoint intranet. It's a modern intranet, but I think we can start to call it traditional. And it is orchestrated around lists.
And one of their major operations is, as they have sales promotions that they need to notify their sales staff, they just add an entry to a list. And that is something that has served them well because by adding something to a list, it automatically populates the page. People who work in a particular product line, such as home or food or clothing, they can see what's going on there through the portal.
One of the things that I was talking to Marks and Spencer about out was they were then taking those, that promotional idea, which drove things to portals, and extending those to mobile devices using Power Apps.
Using exactly the same foundational technology, they were able to make sure that as new promotions were coming in, that they could alert people who might be out on the selling floor, and then be able to access that promotional information on the fly.
So if a customer asked them a question, they didn't have to run to a back office to go run a search; they could just look up and say, yes, cranberry tea breads are going to be on sale for another two weeks, even though they're in the clothing department.
And what they were looking at a year and a half ago, was kind of the next frontier for Microsoft Lists, was how can we also bring all of this great intranet and mobile experience into the Microsoft Teams world.
So it's thinking about what we've been doing with lists historically. I'd love to kind of reach back and find out where Marks and Spencer and some of our other customers intend to take our next generation of technology here.
MARK KASHMAN: Yeah, super interested in that as well. And with that Marks and Spencer concept, or how they're actually putting it into their production, I love the idea that there is a way to add an item very easily. There is that notion of awareness to notify an individual or a group. But moving beyond what might feel like you're raising awareness or assigning somebody a task is then it becomes this additional source in their database to act like a FAQ, near or real time, for people that actually are on the show floor and answering questions or looking up ideas, or if they come across an issue, to be able to then put that in there to have some information added to it, which would be hopefully the answer.
But I really like that concept of an FAQ. But obviously, for where they take it next, we should check in with them and get back to our audience about it,
CHRIS MCNULTY: That would be great.
[Music.]
CHRIS MCNULTY: Up next, the Intrazone takes a look at events going on in and around the virtual world.
So Mark and I are coming to you today from close by, or actually from the exact cloud location for Microsoft Build, May 19th and 20th.
How's it out there in your cloud, Mark?
MARK KASHMAN: It's feeling good, it's feeling good. The news is flying and love to be a part of it.
Microsoft Lists is plugged in to Build. There's a session that we're a part of, with Mike Amerland. And of course, all of our news and disclosures and all that stuff is now out into the world, including this new episode.
Great thing about Build is it's digital and free, like a lot of our events that we're talking about today. It's two days. It's all online. And certainly, if you're engaged today, and tomorrow, being May 19th through the 20th, feel free to jump in to Build and watch a lot of sessions. If you're a developer, it's very targeted to you, but there's a lot of great new information. A lot of – lot of things were released today. But certainly if you can't join in on these days, it'll be available soon on-demand.
CHRIS MCNULTY: So there are also a number of Microsoft 365 focused virtual events coming up throughout May and June, and the next one up is the Microsoft 365 Virtual Marathon, brought to you by the team behind the SharePoint conference, as well as Microsoft itself. It'll be running May 27 through 28th at a cloud near you.
MARK KASHMAN: The next one by a third-party event that we work closely with is the Galactic Collaboration Summit. This is going to be two days on June 2nd and 9th, and across both those days there will be different content, so it's not a repeat, and a lot of great speakers, a lot of great content. Again, Microsoft is taking a part in providing breakout sessions. There will be a keynote with Jeff Teper actually at all of these three events.
And the Galactic Collaboration Summit. I think as we mentioned before in a previous episode, Chris summarized it really nicely, has some of the best way to represent speakers. If you – if you're a Star Trek fan, check out how the Galactic Collaboration Summit promotes speakers. It's really cool
CHRIS MCNULTY: If you thought that the technology world should get introduced to science fiction since there wasn't enough geekiness in it already, the Galactic Collaboration Summit is for you. It is happening in the Milky Way Galaxy, according to their collateral, which is interesting, because a Galactic Collaboration Summit suggests that it's collaboration amongst galaxies.
MARK KASHMAN: I think they make sure that once you register, they certainly give you access to the Hubble Space Telescope, so you'll make sure to be able to tune in that way
CHRIS MCNULTY: And back down on Earth, limited solely to the globe, GlobalCon 2, coming up June 15 through the 19th. It is a five-day event. Focused on Microsoft 365, following on the heels of GlobalCon 1, sure to be succeeded in the future by GlobalCon 3.
MARK KASHMAN: Yeah, and to wrap out our events here, just looking a little bit further down into July is our partner event, Inspire. That's July 21st to the 22nd. That's Inspire.Microsoft.com. It's very partner oriented, but there certainly is to be product news and information that Microsoft pushes out at that time.
CHRIS MCNULTY: So if you are sponsoring an event, if there's something that you'd like us to promote or share here on the Intrazone, feel free to reach back to Mark and to me through our channels. We'd be happy to feature it on an upcoming podcast.
[Music.]
CHRIS MCNULTY: Well, Mark, we've checked another Intrazone episode off the list, haven't we?
MARK KASHMAN: Yeah, I think so. I mean, on the list of Intrazone episodes, we're getting up there. And in terms of a list of features that we covered about Microsoft Lists, that was – that was quite a list.
CHRIS MCNULTY: I think this is at the top of my list of list-oriented episodes of the Intrazone, 100%.
MARK KASHMAN: 100%. I love it. Yeah, I will – I will plus one that and maybe just add a column so that I can put my name next to your name, so that we can be a same row item in this list of lists.
CHRIS MCNULTY: That will be a quick edit, won't it?
MARK KASHMAN: Sure will, sure will.
CHRIS MCNULTY: Before I make any more bad puns related to Microsoft technology, I'm just reminded, we will share links to all of the actual news that Lincoln and Miceile shared about Microsoft Lists. And many thanks to them for their time.
MARK KASHMAN: Check out our show page at aka.ms/the Intrazone.
CHRIS MCNULTY: And if you're curious about other Microsoft programs, and why wouldn't you be, check out aka.ms/microsoft/podcasts. Find a new show today.
MARK KASHMAN: You can email us at theIntrazone@microsoft.com, or on Twitter @SharePoint, @Mkashman, and @CMcNulty2000. We'd love to hear from you about ideas that you have for the show, or anything that you want to provide as feedback.
CHRIS MCNULTY: Spread the news about podcasts, especially this one. If you enjoy this show, please help us help more people. Share the SharePoint love and subscribe at a local Oort cloud at the top of your list and wherever you get your podcasts.
MARK KASHMAN: We are your hosts, a list of two, Mark Kashman and Chris McNulty, and you've been listening to the Intrazone, a show about the Microsoft 365 lists-driven intelligent intranet.
[Music.]
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