Public Defenseless 58: Are Public Defense Unions the Key to Systemic Reform? w/Sam Allison-Natale and Bob Kolstad
Are public defense unions the solution to reform?
In this episode, Hunter speaks with Sam Allison-Natale, Executive Director of the Kansas Holistic Defenders, and Bob Kolstad, a public defender in Hennepin County, Minnesota.
They'll walk you through everything you need to know about public defense unions and the philosophy behind them. Giving you a behind-the-scenes view, you'll learn the realities behind unions, the goals, and why they are necessary.
Then, Bob and Sam will discuss collective organizing and the ethics around it. They'll share how they mobilize public defenders and how they get past the individualistic society of today.
With their endless enthusiasm, Bob and Sam share a refreshing vision of unity and hope.
Key Topics and Takeaways:
- Bob and Sam talk about how they got into public defense. [7:02]
- Why the Minnesota union is so successful. [16:45]
- The ethics of unionization. [24:00]
- Why people should take the burden of collective action. [37:10]
- The racial lens of collective action. [48:07]
- What led to the Minnesota strike. [57:12]
- Organizing collective action. [1:02:34]
- How to get from a place of individuality to unity. [1:07:50]
Guests:
Sam Allison-Natale, Executive Director, Kansas Holistic Defenders
Bob Kolstad, Public Defender, Hennepin County, Minnesota
Resources:
Public defenders vote to strike; justice system could come to a halt
Minnesota's top public defender reappointed over objections from rank-and-file
Minnesota's public defenders vote no confidence in agency head
The Secrets of a Successful Organizer
Michelle Alexander Plea Deal Strike
Memorable Quotes:
"The weakness of unions generally in Kansas is something that affects the shape of Kansas politics across the board." (23:36, Sam)
"The public defense system is under duress. I mean, severe duress." (24:50, Bob)
"This discussion about collective action versus individual action, and the fact that everybody is stuck in an individual mindset is what allows the system to function." (33:00, Sam)
"The fact is that organizing for a strike, building a credible strike threat can get people really, really far in fighting for the kinds of things that they need to have." (40:39, Bob)
"I think that we are in a situation of such dire need that people want to be invited into a struggle for something greater." (43:13, Hunter)
Contact Hunter Parnell:
hwparnell@publicdefenseless.com