Psychedelics Today Robin Kurland-West - Questions and Challenges in Providing Integration Services
Aug 22, 2018
01:10:57
Download Introduction During this episode of Psychedelics Today, your host Kyle Buller interviews Robin Kurland-West, a licensed marriage and family therapist based out of California. Kyle and Robin chat about challenges and other questions in regard to providing psychedelic integration services. Psychedelic integration is a new territory, and there are plenty of questions to still answer and cover. Show Notes About Robin Kurland-West
- She offers integration services through her therapy practice.
- Robin had questions about how to create an introduction practice and how to follow up.
- She was licensed in 2010 and graduated from the California Institute of Integral Studies in 2006.
- About a year ago she decided to do a karma cleanse and began to talk to a friend about psychedelics.
- Her friend sent her a podcast that spoke to her.
- She was doing some shadow work and dealing with her addiction experiences.
- She said a prayer over the psilocybin and was open to what it would show her.
- A spirit appeared and the forest started sending her messages.
- It was a female spirit and used two trees to illustrate the inside of her brain.
- It taught her that her mind was holding onto negative beliefs.
- She taught her that she needed to let go, that it was "all so absurd."
- What has been the difference between experimenting in college vs. doing the work as an adult?
- In college, it was seen as a party drug.
- She had a hard time having conversations with people.
- She doesn't see it as a party drug anymore, it's something that you honor.
- She now views it as a medicine that heals parts that have been cut off.
- Having had a history of addiction, some people are afraid psychedelics might be addictive.
- Psychedelics are non-addictive because other drugs are about escaping, and psychedelics are about being fully present.
- What is integration work for you and how do you approach it?
- This is new territory for her after having her own experience.
- She joined a network called the psychedelic support network.
- Because it's not yet legal, it's a bit of a struggle.
- She offers pre and post ritual services.
- People meet with her and do a pretty thorough assessment.
- They set the intention for the experience.
- Afterward they look at what some of the messages were and how to incorporate it into their daily lives.
- Do you help with dosage?
- She focuses more on intention setting because she's still new at this.
- She refers people to resources to help with other things.
- Is there a therapeutic approach you use with people?
- She uses expressive arts therapy to tap into the unconscious and subconscious.
- She always uses family systems, there's usually a root to behavior.
- She uses CBT and DBT.
- She uses journaling and narrative therapy.
- It's an opportunity to rewrite your story - a new perspective to an old story.
- She uses mandala work and drawing.
- She has them stand up and move around.
- Utilizing movement to integrate is huge.
- After having her profound experience with psychedelics, she finds it to be a warm blanket she can reach for to remind you that things are different now.
- What type of challenges have you had providing integration services to people?
- She wants to know how soon she should see a client after they start on this journey.
- How many times should she see a client after, and how many times?
- It could be more individual.
- She started to do psychotherapy to go deep and heal.
- It's possible to put your medical license at risk by providing certain services.
- She can't sit with people when they have their experience and has to be clear that it's a decision that they're making.
- She has to detach herself from a lot of it.
- She likes the idea of immediacy in following up with clients.
- She sees a client 3-4 times beforehand to make sure they're healthy enough and set intention.
- Afterward she wants to see them soon so they can hold onto the gold they discovered in the journey.
- How do you choose the right psychedelic experience for a person?
- The idea of doing a diagnosis to find out what will work is tricky.
- Throw it back on the person to see what they're looking for.
- It's not a scary experience, but you want to make sure you're with someone who's trained.
- There's a couple that wants to come in and do integration therapy together.
- She wants to meet with them individually and together beforehand.
- People are in therapy to discover themselves and they might find something different than they've been looking for.
- How do you approach people who think integration specialists can get them drugs or be a guide during experiences?
- She says it isn't about her telling them to use illicit drugs and she doesn't do drugs with them or hook them up.
- The difference between integration therapy and a guide:
- A guide is someone you trust who sits with you.
- An integration therapist is just pre and post where she's not involved in the drug.
- Have you had any clients reach out trying to integrate a really difficult experience?
- Not yet, but she's looking forward to it.
- She would ask questions about what they saw and felt.
- She would bring in the arts to map it out and they can look at it together.
- You can have a psychedelic experience without having psychedelics.
- Is there anything you're looking forward to with clients?
- In traditional therapy right now, she's coming up against blockage in some of her clients.
- She sees a lot of people being stuck, and that's the hardest part.
- She's excited to see the light turn back on in people's eyes and see them be healed.
- She wants to see people be present with themselves and each other so they can have a fuller life.
- How do you approach therapy and coaching?
- She just does the psychotherapy, asking questions.
- She appeals to a clients inner resources.
- Do you do any online work?
- She only does in-person work, every once in a while she does a phone session.
- She works holistically, so people don't just focus on the mind, also the body and the spirit.
- Do you get people reaching out from all over the place?
- Yes, because her name is on the psychedelic support list.
- She filled out an application and had some correspondence with the organization.
- What are some of your favorite podcasts and resources?
- The Psychedelic Salon Podcast
- I don't see psychedelics as a party drug anymore, it's something that you honor, a medicine.
- I like to see my clients soon after their experience so they can hold onto the gold they discovered on their journey.
- People are in therapy to discover themselves and they might find something different than they've been looking for.