Getting New Technology Adopted (with Dov Katz)

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Sep 24, 2025

Dov Katz, Developer productivity and tooling lead at Morgan Stanley, shares insights on overcoming resistance to technology adoption in large organizations. He discusses the importance of management buy-in and grassroots enthusiasm among developers. Katz emphasizes practical strategies for using tools like OpenRewrite for upgrades and reducing technical debt. He debates deterministic tools versus AI for refactoring and explores the collaborative nature of open-source initiatives, particularly highlighting how banks can work together through FINOS.

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ANECDOTE

OpenRewrite Came From A Chance Introduction

OpenRewrite arrived at Morgan Stanley almost by accident after seeing it in another vendor's stack.
That demo triggered an internal mission to explore upgrade-at-scale automation.

ADVICE

Provide Curated Stacks And Upgrade Paths

Give developers curated stacks, libraries, and standards to reduce toil and improve productivity.
Keep stacks updated and provide upgrade paths tied to those curated libraries.

ADVICE

Sell To Developers And Leaders Simultaneously

Drive both developer enthusiasm and leadership buy-in in parallel when introducing new tools.
Create internal advocates and roadshows so teams demand access while leaders see the value.

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Getting new technology adopted in a large organization can feel like pushing water uphill. The best tools in the world are useless if we're not allowed to use them, and as companies grow, their habits turn into inertia, then into "the way we've always done things." So how do you break through that resistance and get meaningful change to happen?

This week's guest is Dov Katz from Morgan Stanley, who specializes in exactly this challenge - driving developer productivity and getting new practices adopted across thousands of developers. We explore the art of organizational change from every angle: How do you get management buy-in? How do you build grassroots developer enthusiasm? When should you use deterministic tools like OpenRewrite versus AI-powered solutions? And what role does open source play in breaking down the walls between competing financial institutions?

Whether you're trying to modernize a legacy codebase, reduce technical debt, or just get your team to try that promising new tool you've discovered, this conversation offers practical strategies for navigating the complex dynamics of enterprise software development. Because sometimes the hardest part of our job isn't writing code - it's getting permission to write better code.

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Morgan Stanley: https://www.morganstanley.com/

OpenRewrite: https://docs.openrewrite.org/

Spring Framework: https://spring.io/

Spring Integration: https://spring.io/projects/spring-integration

Apache Camel: https://camel.apache.org/

FINOS (FinTech Open Source Foundation): https://www.finos.org/

Linux Foundation: https://www.linuxfoundation.org/

Moderne (Code Remix conference organizers): https://www.moderne.io/

Code Remix Conference: https://www.moderne.io/events

Kris on Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/krisajenkins.bsky.social

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Kris on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/krisjenkins/