Socrates in the City Jonathan Pageau and Mary Harrington: Reality in a Disenchanted Age
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Apr 20, 2026 
Jonathan Pageau, an icon carver and commentator on symbolism and medieval cosmology, joins Mary Harrington for a wide-ranging conversation. They explore medieval cosmology versus modern mechanistic vision. They trace memes, gargoyles, and apotropaic symbols as contemporary symbolic forces. They discuss narrative, cultural fragmentation, and how a shared orientation toward the transcendent might restore meaning.
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Medieval Cosmology Reclaims Human Experience
- Medieval cosmology centres human phenomenological experience as primary, not the detached scientific vantage point.
- Jonathan Pageau argues Galilean cosmology alienates us by forcing a view as an outsider, while medieval vision grounds daily rhythms and meaning.
Origins Give Moral Bearings Not Just Facts
- Origin stories provide hierarchy of values that shape how people live, beyond technical or material explanations.
- Pageau compares asking the origin of Michelangelo's David to asking only the quarry location — technical answers miss meaning.
Politics Loses When You Ignore Narrative
- Narratives are real structures that yield objective results and conservatives lost ground by ignoring how stories shape politics.
- Pageau says conservatives are often characters in other people's stories because they haven't set the narrative.
