Jess Sponable on VTOL, propulsion, fuels, policy, launches, you name it!

Meeting notes for Sponable on Tuesday , August 5, 20245 interview:

We welcomed back Jess Sponable, who shared his expertise on the feasibility of the Golden Dome defense system, drawing from his experience with DARPA and DCX. Jess explained that while Golden Dome is technically possible, it would require significant software and sensor technology development, and he noted that the US has robust safeguards against nuclear threats. David and Jess briefly touched on the anniversary of the atomic bombings of Japan to end World War II but did not focus on that topic as part of this program. We did briefly discuss the historical context of nuclear weapons and the decision to drop the atomic bomb to end World War II, emphasizing the potential human cost of an invasion of Japan. I expressed gratitude for President Truman's decision, which he believes saved millions of lives. I then shifted the conversation to vertical takeoff and landing (VTOL) technology, tracing its origins to science fiction and highlighting key figures like Phil Bono and Max Hunter who advocated for fully reusable VTOL systems.

Jess discussed the evolution of single-stage-to-orbit and vertical takeoff and landing (VTOL) concepts, highlighting early crude designs and the Chrysler Beta space shuttle concept. He shared his experience with the DCX program, which flew a subsonic proof of concept demonstrator for a vertical takeoff, landing Lox hydrogen-powered rocket. Jess noted the advantages of VTOL systems, such as a simple launch complex and rapid turnaround times, and mentioned that technology has improved significantly since then. He also mentioned two ongoing efforts for single-stage-to-orbit horizontal takeoff and landing and discussed various companies, including SpaceX, Blue Origin, Rocket Lab, and Relativity Space, that are working towards 100% reusability in space travel.

Our guest discussed the reliability and safety of future flight systems, particularly focusing on vertical takeoff and landing vehicles. He compared the engineering challenges of these systems to the development of traditional aircraft, emphasizing the need for reliable engine performance and lightweight designs. David explained that modern rocket engines, with their high thrust-to-weight ratios and simplified designs, could lead to safer and more efficient flight systems in the future.

Jess talked about the potential of liquid natural gas as a cheap and clean propellant for future space travel and point-to-point transportation systems. He explained that New Frontier Aerospace, his company, is focusing on developing a system that is more reliable and cost-effective than traditional airplanes, with a target of 2-hour travel times to 98% of global destinations. I mentioned that other companies are experimenting & developing point-to-point travel using orbital vehicles. Jess said that his New Frontier Aerospace is developing a different approach that avoids going to orbit, using a throttle-down rocket for long-distance travel. He also noted that their engine is in the final stages of qualification and will be used in both an orbital transfer vehicle and a delta-wing shaped airframe configuration for initial flights.

Jess proceeded to discuss the noise levels of hypersonic vehicles, explaining that while they would be loud during takeoff, the noise would be minimal at cruising altitude of 160,000 feet, similar to a refrigerator or dishwasher. He noted that flight testing would be necessary to determine exact sound levels, and initial operations might focus on unmanned air vehicles. He also described their orbital transfer vehicle, Bifrost, which can transport payloads between various orbits and lunar orbit, powered by their Maelstrom engine.

Jess was asked about his company's status as a private, equity and government contract-funded entity. He noted a potential for future public listing but currently focusing on careful growth. He explained that while interns have been considered, the company prioritizes experienced hires due to its early stage and ITAR restrictions on hiring foreign students. David also addressed questions about the DCX hardware, which is now in museums, and clarified that while the company aims to operate from airports rather than spaceports, noise and regulatory concerns need to be addressed with flight test data. He emphasized the importance of operability in system design and distinguished his company's approach from competitors like Boom Aerospace, highlighting its focus on vertical takeoff and landing, lower cost, and potential for both military and commercial markets.

Jess went on to discuss a small rocket vehicle with 6 feet by 6 feet dimensions, weighing 3,000 pounds and providing 3,000 pounds of thrust, capable of 5 km/s delta-V and carrying 200-400 kg payload from LEO to GEO. He explained that while the vehicle could be scaled up, larger configurations would require higher propellant mass fractions and different tank configurations, with Falcon 9's second stage as an example of a high-performance design at 87-88% propellant fraction. Jess also noted that LOX/LNG is significantly easier to refuel in orbit than LOX/hydrogen, and discussed the possibility of using multiple engines for lunar lander applications, with existing commercial landers demonstrating feasibility on Falcon 9.

Advancing Space Exploration and Technology

As we were coming to the close of the program, our guest discussed the progress and challenges in space exploration, highlighting the importance of vertical takeoff and landing systems in the commercial space industry. He expressed optimism about the future of space travel, emphasizing the potential for rapid growth in reusable launch systems and the role of NASA in facilitating this progress. He also addressed the development of nuclear fusion, noting that while significant breakthroughs are still years away, commercial investment in the field is encouraging. He concluded by advocating for continued innovation and collaboration between the private sector and government agencies to advance space exploration and technology.

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