Challenger Cities EP65: Sitopia with Carolyn Steel

Cities are usually explained through buildings, infrastructure, policy and planning. Food rarely gets a look-in.

Which is strange, because for most of human history, cities existed in the first place because we learned how to feed ourselves at scale. Farming allowed settlement. Settlement allowed specialisation. Specialisation gave us civilisation. Long before zoning codes or masterplans, food decided where cities formed, how power worked, and why empires survived or collapsed.

In this episode, I’m joined by architect and writer Carolyn Steel, whose books Hungry City and Sitopia have quietly reshaped how many people think about food and place. Carolyn doesn’t approach food as lifestyle or culture. She treats it as infrastructure. A lens that connects geography, logistics, politics, economics, health and social life in ways that most urban conversations completely miss.

We talk about cities as food machines, moving from Rome, Paris and London to Chicago, tracing how grain, rivers, canals, railways and refrigeration shaped very different political and economic outcomes. We explore how technology didn’t just speed food systems up, but fundamentally altered them, separating calories from nutrition and convenience from ritual.

A big part of the conversation centres on Carolyn’s idea of exo-evolution: the moment when humans stopped adapting themselves to their environment and instead began redesigning the environment to suit their desires. Cities, it turns out, adapt very quickly. Human biology does not.

We also dig into what was lost when markets gave way to supermarkets, how food was deliberately redesigned to remove human interaction, and why eating together remains one of our most overlooked forms of civic infrastructure.

This is a conversation about food, but it’s really about cities. About how we live together, what we take for granted, and why so many urban problems make more sense once you stop looking at buildings and start following what’s on the plate.

Don’t expect to walk through a supermarket in quite the same way afterwards.

In this episode, we cover:

• Why food is one of the fastest ways to understand how a city actually works • How Rome, Paris and London evolved very different food systems, and why that mattered politically • The role of grain, rivers and trade in shaping empires and revolutions • How Chicago became a global food hub through geography, railways and refrigeration • What exo-evolution means, and why cities adapt faster than human bodies • How ultra-processed food and constant availability changed our relationship with eating • Why markets were once the social heart of cities, and what happened when supermarkets replaced them • Eating together as low-tech civic infrastructure in an increasingly fragmented world

About Carolyn

Carolyn Steel is an architect and writer best known for Hungry City and Sitopia, two influential books exploring the relationship between food, cities and civilisation. Her work examines how food shapes the physical form of cities, the way societies organise themselves, and how modern food systems affect health, culture and everyday life.