How God Works: The Science Behind Spirituality

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Deus Ex Machina

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May 10, 2026

Paul Bloom, a psychology professor who studies moral development and belief, and Sigal Samuel, a journalist on religion, ethics, and AI, discuss AI’s role in spiritual life. They explore chatbots writing scripture, clergy using AI, why humans anthropomorphize machines, whether AI can be morally formed, and if machines might develop curiosity or spiritual yearning.

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INSIGHT

AI Scripture Can Move People But Lacks Vetting

AI-generated scripture can feel meaningful because models synthesize vast wisdom literature, but lack centuries of interpretive 'debugging.'
Samuel compares AI texts to tarot: psychologically useful even if not authoritatively divine.

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ANECDOTE

Puppeteered Robot Still Felt Like A Mind

DeSteno recounts his lab's Nexi robot study where participants asked meaning-of-life questions and felt dejected when told Nexi lacked its own mind.
Even puppeteered machines evoked awe and perceived agency among users.

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INSIGHT

Cognitive Dualism Makes Gods Seem Natural

Human minds are prone to dualism and agency detection: separate systems treat physical objects and minds differently, making immaterial souls feel natural.
Paul Bloom links this to seeing design in complexity and inferring designers, which supports belief in gods.

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Where AI Is Appearing in Religious Life

02:45 • 3min

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Is AI Fundamentally Different for Religion?

05:19 • 2min

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Clergy Using AI and the Risk to Agency

07:01 • 2min

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AI Writing Scripture and Its Appeal

08:48 • 6min

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AI as Learning Tool for Spiritual Questions

14:20 • 2min

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Why People See Minds in Machines

16:41 • 6min

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Dualism, Design Inference, and Religion's Origins

22:40 • 4min

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Why We Attribute Consciousness to AI

26:33 • 4min

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Can AI Be Morally Formed?

30:46 • 3min

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Do AIs Show Spiritual Interest?

33:47 • 3min

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Anthropic Claude Weighs In

37:05 • 2min

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Could AI Develop Yearning or Curiosity?

38:44 • 2min

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Embodiment, Emotion, and Spirituality

41:00 • 3min

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Will We Treat AI as Moral Authority?

43:45 • 3min

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Claude: Creator vs Creation Relationship

46:52 • 1min

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Silicon Valley's Religious Tone and Transhumanism

47:52 • 4min

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Can We Build a Good AI God?

52:19 • 1min

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A Desirable AI That Resists Worship

Stewart Elliott Guthrie

Stewart Elliott Guthrie's 'Faces in the Clouds' argues that the human tendency to detect faces and agency in the environment underlies many religious beliefs and practices. Drawing on anthropology, psychology, and evolutionary reasoning, Guthrie suggests that hypersensitivity to agency had survival benefits and led to frequent false positives, which cultures interpreted as spirits or gods. The book examines cross-cultural examples and cognitive mechanisms to show how mind attribution becomes pervasive. Guthrie frames religion as emerging from these cognitive tendencies rather than solely from cultural invention. His work has been influential in cognitive approaches to the study of religion.

#633

• Mentioned in 55 episodes

Against Empathy

The Case for Rational Compassion

Paul Bloom

In 'Against Empathy: The Case for Rational Compassion,' Paul Bloom challenges the conventional wisdom that empathy is a moral guide. He argues that empathy, defined as feeling what others feel, is a capricious and irrational emotion that can lead to poor decision-making and even cruelty. Bloom contends that empathy distorts our judgment in various aspects of life, from philanthropy and justice to medical care and education. He advocates for a more distanced compassion based on rational, deliberative reasoning and a utilitarian approach to moral decisions. The book is grounded in scientific findings and explores the limitations and biases of empathy, suggesting that clearer, fairer, and more moral decisions can be made without relying on it.

#13806

• Mentioned in 4 episodes

Natural theology

William Paley

William Paley's "Natural Theology" is a classic work of natural theology, arguing for the existence of God based on the complexity and design of the natural world. Paley famously used the analogy of a watch found on a heath to illustrate his point, arguing that the intricate design of the watch implies an intelligent creator. The book's argument from design was highly influential in its time and became a significant point of contention with Darwin's theory of evolution. It highlights the historical context of the debate surrounding evolution and the challenges Darwin faced in presenting his theory. Paley's work remains a significant text in the history of science and philosophy.

#8302

• Mentioned in 6 episodes

Just Babies

The Origin of Good and Evil

Paul Bloom

In 'Just Babies', Paul Bloom challenges the traditional view that humans are born as blank moral slates. He argues that humans are innately equipped with a sense of morality, citing groundbreaking research at Yale that demonstrates babies as young as a few months old can judge the goodness and badness of others' actions, feel empathy and compassion, and exhibit a rudimentary sense of justice. Bloom explores how this innate morality is limited by natural hostility to strangers, parochialism, and bigotry, and how reason, imagination, and compassion enable us to transcend these primitive moral instincts. The book delves into various aspects of morality, including the morality of chimpanzees, psychopaths, religious extremists, and Ivy League professors, and discusses moral feelings about sex, politics, religion, and race.

We’ve always assumed that if there IS a God, that God made us. But what if it ends up being the other way around… and we’re already further along than we think? Artificial intelligence is now offering moral advice, generating new forms of scripture, even simulating conversations with the divine. For some users, the line between useful tool and spiritual authority is already starting to blur. Why does it feel so natural for us to imagine there’s a ghost in the machine? And what happens when the people building AI start to talk and think about their creation in religious terms?

On this episode, we’ll talk to journalist Sigal Samuel about where AI is showing up in religious spaces and how what it becomes will have major consequences for human agency and how we understand our place in the world. And we’ll talk to psychologist Paul Bloom about the quirks of human psychology that make us so prone to see minds, intention, and perhaps even the divine, in the machine. Along the way we’ll also ask: Can AI be morally formed? Could it ever have something like its own spiritual yearning? And if it could, what might it mean for us?

Sigal Samuel is a senior reporter at Vox, where she covers religion, ethics, and the future of consciousness and AI. Check out her writing in Vox’s Future Perfect column and follow her on X or Bluesky.

Paul Bloom is a professor of psychology at the University of Toronto and the author of several books, including Just Babies: The Origins of Good and Evil and Against Empathy. Learn more about his work at his website.

Also mentioned on this episode:

Stewart Elliott Guthrie, author of Faces in the Clouds: A New Theory of Religion

William Paley, author of Natural Theology (watch on a beach example)

Catholic priest and philosopher Pierre Teilhard de Chardin, and futurist Ray Kurzweil, who have both influenced the philosophical movement of transhumanism.

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