On the Gist, a vice presidential debate starring plexiglass.

In the interview, Mike hosts a roundtable discussion with journalist Richard Kreitner and Vox's Matthew Yglesias to talk about how each of their new books address the problem of an ever-increasing American population. They debate if the U.S. should split into more manageable nations, or if the country should keep pushing population growth. Yglesias' book is One Billion Americans: The Case for Thinking Big, and Kreitner's latest is Break It Up: Secession, Division, and the Secret History of America's Imperfect Union.

In the spiel, Delco, South Philly, and NY tri-state area Italian Americans for Joe Biden.

Podcast production by Daniel Schroeder and Margaret Kelley.

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