S1E8 – The Retail Avengers vs The Trials of Digital Transformation & Innovation, Part 2

Welcome to Season 1, Episode 8 of The Retail Razor Show!

For episode 8 we’re letting the Retail Avengers fly solo for Part 2 of our Digital Transformation & Innovation series and dig into understanding three key transformative technologies for retail – computer vision, Internet of Things, and 5G. Why are these so important for retailers, and how can retailers best use these technologies? Shish Shridhar and Trevor Sumner join our hosts for this lively discussion on Clubhouse!

And big news! Our podcast is holding strong on the Feedspot Top 60 Retail podcasts list! We’re sitting steady at #21, so please do give us a 5-star review in Apple Podcasts if you like the show! With your help, we’ll be on our way to a Top 10 spot! 

Check it out here: https://blog.feedspot.com/retail_podcasts/

I’m your host, Ricardo Belmar, a RETHINK Retail Top Retail Influencer for 2022 & 2021, RIS News Top Movers and Shakers in Retail for 2021, advisory council member at George Mason University’s Center for Retail Transformation, and lead partner marketing advisor for retail & consumer goods at Microsoft.

And I’m your co-host, Casey Golden, CEO of Luxlock and slayer of retail frankenstacks!

Together, we’re your guides on the retail transformation journey. Whether you're thinking digital and online, mobile, or brick & mortar stores, we’ll help you cut through the clutter!

The Retail Razor Show

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Host → Ricardo Belmar,

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TRANSCRIPT

S1E8 The Retail Avengers & The Trials of DX & Innovation, Part 2

[00:00:20] Introduction

[00:00:20] Ricardo Belmar: Hello. Good morning. Good afternoon. And good evening, whatever time of day you're listening. Welcome to season one episode eight of the Retail Razor Show. I'm your host, Ricardo Belmar a RETHINK Retail top retail influencer and lead partner marketing advisor for retail and consumer goods at Microsoft.

[00:00:36] Casey Golden: And I'm your co-host, Casey Golden, CEO of Luxlock. Obsessed with the relationship between a brand and a customer. I've spent my career on the fashion side and supply chain technology side of the business. Now I slay franken-stacks!

[00:00:50] Ricardo Belmar: Well, this week, we are circling back to our digital transformation and innovation topic. For part two of this discussion, we had two other members of our Retail Avengers team join us both this time, Shish Sridhar and Trevor Sumner. 

[00:01:05] Casey Golden: I really enjoyed our conversation. We dive into three super interesting transformation and innovation topics that we didn't get into in part one. Last time we dug into how retailers are embracing digital transformation and innovation and where that innovation comes from, whether it's inside or outside of their business.

[00:01:26] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. And that really set the stage for us by focusing on why today's retail, winners are winners and why others are well, not so much. 

[00:01:34] Casey Golden: Right. And maybe most importantly we discussed how much larger retailers and brands budgets are to invest in innovation, which is critical and frankly, new territory for a lot of brands. I don't think a lot of people realize how little investment has gone in to retail technology 

[00:01:54] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. I mean, it, it honestly, it's, this feels like a once in a generation change for most retail businesses to honestly, a really positive change to be sure where we're finally seeing the level of investment that should have been there sooner. And again the people we see winning today, why are they winning?

[00:02:12] Because they started that increased investments so much sooner. So, you know, for listeners who didn't catch that part one discussion that we're, we're giving you the quick 50 cent tour right now. Go back, listen to season one, episode six, get caught up and then come back here for the deep dive into the three new topics. 

[00:02:29] Casey Golden: Yeah, open your pocket book and we'll be here waiting for you.

[00:02:33] Ricardo Belmar: Totally. Totally. We want to be sure and get those extra downloads on the pod too. So be sure and give that one a listen and come back. And if you missed any other episodes, boy, this is a great time to get caught up too. So you don't miss anything. 

[00:02:44] Casey Golden: Maybe we should let everyone know what the deep dive topics are for this episode.

[00:02:50] Ricardo Belmar: I suppose it's best not to keep it a surprise, right? 

[00:02:53] Casey Golden: Not unless it's a handbag or a plane ticket, but okay. So this way we go deep on three amazing topics, 5g, beyond a marketing campaign, internet of things also known as IOT. And of course Trevor's favorite computer vision.

[00:03:12] Ricardo Belmar: Yep. That's right. I am excited and just dying with anticipation. So let's jump into the clubhouse discussion and then we'll come back, wrap things up. Maybe we'll give some extra thoughts on those topics that we didn't get to in the clubhouse session

[00:03:25] Casey Golden: Sounds good. Ricardo. Let's listen to the retail Avengers versus the trials of digital transformation and innovation. 

[00:03:36] Clubhouse Session

[00:03:36] Ricardo Belmar: welcome everyone to the retail razor room today. Thanks for joining us. And we're going to talk about the future of digital transformation and innovation. Zeroing in on three areas of interest, 5g, internet of things, and computer vision. I'm going to let the other speakers introduce themselves here.

[00:03:53] Casey, why don't you kick us off? 

[00:03:54] Casey Golden: Hi there. Casey golden, I'm the founder of Lux lock a retail experience platform. And I've spent a career in the fashion and enterprise supply chain side of the business. Pretty much you name it. I've had to deal with the technology that I'm supposed to use to deal with it.

[00:04:14] So I'm looking forward to always being a part of our digital transformation conversations. There's a lot going on and like to contribute where I can. 

[00:04:22] Ricardo Belmar: All right. Thanks Casey. Shish. 

[00:04:24] Shish Shridhar: Good afternoon. I'm the retail lead with Microsoft for startups and I've worked with retail tech, startups, B2B retail, tech startups, and building out a portfolio of innovative, disruptive startups being in Microsoft for 24 years, really working in the retail industry for about 15 of those 24.

[00:04:45] And I'm also focused on AI IOT. So this conversation today is very interesting for me and looking forward to it. Thank you. 

[00:04:55] Ricardo Belmar: All right, Trevor. 

[00:04:56] Trevor Sumner: Hey everybody. My name is Trevor Sumner. I'm the CEO at perch. We do interactive retail displays and touchscreens at retail.

[00:05:03] What makes them cool is we use computer vision to detect what products people are touching at the shelf and respond with digital media, the moment that they touch it. So it's like minority report really interactive and kind of contextual commerce. And so really excited about this topic today.

[00:05:22] Ricardo Belmar: All right. And I'm Ricardo Belmar host of the retail razor club here on clubhouse. Also have spent the better part of the last couple of decades in the retail tech space, working with retailers, advising them on how to make the best investments in retail technology. Currently at Microsoft as a senior partner marketing advisor for retail.

[00:05:42] And let's go ahead and get things started. So quick summary on last week's session, this is sort of a continuation of our last room here. Where last week we talked more about broadly where digital transformation is headed, how that's fueling innovation in retail and retail tech. We talked about how retailers that are very much embracing the idea of digital transformation and digital innovation are the ones who are succeeding and winning.

[00:06:10] There's no doubt it continues to hold true that the retailers that wisely invest in the right technologies in ways that support their business and customers, not just for the sake of technology are the ones doing the best.

[00:06:23] And we also talked about where new investments are going to be coming from in various different areas in retail tech and fuel retail spend. Where IT groups and retailers are going to focus on that and which groups outside of IT even were going to look at different investment areas. And then we also talked a little bit about where retail tech startups are coming from, how they're seeking investment.

[00:06:45] And the fact that retailers themselves are starting to take on investment in those tech startups and how that's going to have an impact over the next few years in retail. So with that this week, we're going to narrow in on a few key areas that we touched on last week, but that we have previously talked a little bit about, but not really dove in deeply yet in, in this group.

[00:07:06] Computer Vision

[00:07:06] Ricardo Belmar: And since Trevor, you mentioned it, at the end there around computer vision. Why don't we start with that one? And let me just ask us some somewhat open question to the other speakers here on the panel, where do you see the most impact today with computer vision in retail, and where do you think that impact is going to be reflected and say by 2025?

[00:07:26] And how do you think it's going to change? Let's kick off the discussion with that?

[00:07:29] Trevor Sumner: I think, I think, you know, generally like the most like most technologies, it starts with basics, right? And so I think computer vision is really interesting in, in being able to understand the physical world and translate it into information that can be leveraged, optimized in interesting ways.

[00:07:49] And right now I think that a majority of it is looking at planagram enforcement, it's looking for out of stocks on inventory, things where they're cost centers to where there can be, basic optimizations to make things more efficient. Some of it is in, warehousing and in the back office inventory management there.

[00:08:11] But just looking at what's what's on the shelves, what's not on the shelves knowing what needs to be refreshed, et cetera. I advise a company called cooler group that does a little cameras that are attached into cooler doors that can take a look at what's in it because often, the coolers at a seven 11 are actually refreshed by the brand like a Pepsi or Coke.

[00:08:30] And so now they know which stores they actually have to go to and which ones they don't and can make their operations much more efficient. So that's where I think it starts, there are some basic, retail, analytics and retail next, and other people who are looking at traffic flow.

[00:08:43] But it's really basic. And I think it's going to get really interesting when you get granular down to the product level, but that's where I think kind of the base starting is. And we can talk a little bit about some of the exciting areas of where it's going.

[00:08:54] Shish Shridhar: I can think from a vision perspective. Yeah. Trevor covered everything that's going on. And the use cases are growing all the time. I've seen some interesting use cases as well when it comes to vision. So the most common is something that Trevor pointed out, which is the on-shelf availability, the planogramming, and, and really determining where, whether it is in compliance.

[00:09:19] And then. The main part of what Travis is doing, which is engaging the customer through, through video. And there's another company that I work with called cooler screens. There's also presenting media content on the cooler doors based on who is engaging with it. And all of that. In addition to that, the other interesting scenarios that I've seen popping up in addition to loss prevention is fresh food where video is being used to determine the freshness of food though there's another sensor at play that I've seen being used in addition to video and sort of augmented, and those are smell sensors. There is a company I'm working with out of Canada called Stratusint, and that is using smell sensors, and they train their models for different types of food for greens and others, to really determine what's the smell like when it is about to get spoiled.

[00:10:14] And then they hook it up to dynamic pricing system so that when it's fresh food, they can start dropping the price and driving promotions and things like that. So that there is a reduction of food wastage. So that's sort of an interesting use case that combines video and smell sensing.

[00:10:32] The other aspect of course, is in, within the store itself, that behavioral analysis of, of the customers where exactly are people moving around, which are the busy parts of the store at what time of day, and is a busy what's the demographics, is it you know, 20 year olds, 20 year old males females, it, it analyzes that information to get a better understanding of the store layout and, and where exactly the fast moving items are conversion as well, based on where people go to.

[00:11:04] And is there a conversion in those areas? So there's some interesting insights that, that companies are driving, just using video analytics which is super interesting. 

[00:11:14] Trevor Sumner: Yeah. That's a common one with looking at the demographics for video delivery and cooler screens.

[00:11:19] Which raised, I think just raised $80 million is doing some cool things and, a bunch of companies quividi and mobilize and others who are basically using demographics to determine , what to put on digital screens. But to your point, that the other way this is going is, you know, a lot of retailers are looking at their retail spaces as advertising networks and putting up large digital signage networks and they're selling that right now on a here's what my traffic is at this specific time in this type of store by demographics. So you can target by demographic, but where they're missing right now, and it's having a good conversation about this is that's not how media people want to buy on a CPM or, Hey, you want to reach, you know, 30 to 35 year olds or whatever it is that they want to know more kind of on the cost per interaction and verified impression side.

[00:12:09] And so that's a little bit of the frontier about, where it is right now, which is overall kind of demographics and CPM detection to be able to do much more kind of verified interactivity, verified engagement and kind of more CPC metrics. And I think that's gonna once you get there, you will see, like, if you look at it, 1% of digital media spend happens where 85% of transactions occur in store.

[00:12:39] So, you know, like that is going to be a major shift when they can crack that code and provide people, the data attribution that they need. 

[00:12:46] Shish Shridhar: Yep. And the, the other scenario that I failed to mention is the live streaming aspect, which is gaining a lot of traction. And there's multiple scenarios where livestream shopping is becoming a big part of brick and mortar retail where, it's either the store associates or personal shoppers, really driving that engagement and enabling the video to be shoppable.

[00:13:12] And that's again, another really interesting area where edge AI comes in, where the video streams you can detect, what products they're looking at and be able to based on, on what it is detecting. You're able to add it to your cart and, be able to buy directly from video. And I think that's a really interesting area that's growing s growing 

[00:13:31] Ricardo Belmar: so we've got a lot of good examples there from shoppable video to traffic analytics. I like the point Trevor raised about turning your store and treating it like media as relates to digital signage networks and how we can leverage video analytics and understanding the demographics of customers to know how to target content.

[00:13:52] I think that's something that will be really interesting as that develops. And then we also had an example, which was actually one of the first ones I was thinking of as well, that Shish brought up around analyzing store shelves particularly in, in grocery where I've seen a number of examples lately.

[00:14:08] Oftentimes coupled with robotics, which I didn't list that as one of the key elements here, but we've seen a lot of use cases for grocery, with robotics or the robot leveraging computer vision and shelf analysis. Well, moving down the aisle to understand where they're empty spots that need to be replenished quickly and kind of helping to alleviate some of the more tedious functions in running the store and having associates just check for things that are running low and restocking, but now having some added intelligence in advance to know where exactly do I need to replenish things. So there, there are things we can see coming that help both from a store operations side of the house to just general experience factors around the signage and around content that's being placed in front of customers, as well as analyzing effectiveness of that through computer vision from video analytics and video analytics, I think is also interesting because I've seen that that's been around for a few years now.

[00:15:02] I think even before we started really associating that with computer vision, a number of the analytics vendors started promoting video analytics, verge of basic traffic analysis in your store, understanding hot zones in the store and looking at those traffic patterns to kind of help you make decisions around where to place products in the store, where you might want to make changes based on what's most attractive.

[00:15:24] And what's the most common path through the store. In fact cause you to rearrange fixtures in the store to accommodate that. So I think there are a number of really interesting use cases there. I want to come back to a couple of areas here that I think were the most interesting. One is specific to the digital signage and content placement that you mentioned Trevor.

[00:15:44] So I I've been, dealing with digital signage for a long time and lots of different flavors. And I always remember, we'd have years where people would declare it. This is going to be the year of digital signage where every retail store is going to start peppering their, their fixtures and displays and walls with screens to get so much available content that's out there and leverage that in the store at the place of purchase.

[00:16:08] And I'll say one of the things that I always found was the most challenging for the majority of retailers in that scenario was actually getting the content for the store, which maybe sounds a little counterintuitive, but I found that with most retailers, the issue was refreshing the content and making enough of a volume of content available so that if you did want to take advantage of the more clever things where you rely on let's say you want to rely on the video analytics to tell you which content to place on what screen, based on the demographics.

[00:16:39] So, or customer information you have of who's actually in your store. It takes a lot of content to be available. Even if that content may not get shown on the screen, you need to have access to a significant enough amount of content to make this interesting and to get the right ROI on it. And in the past my experience, and I'd be curious, Trevor if you've seen similar or Shish if, you've seen similar as well. You know, a lot of retailers just weren't prepared for that volume of content. I think there was an assumption that if I had content on my YouTube channel, I just reuse that. Or if I had advertising content that I'd use for TV spots or other out-of-home video that I leveraged that, but it might not necessarily be the right content at the right moment in that customer journey when people are walking past the screen.

[00:17:24] Shish Shridhar: So one of the areas that I'm kind of seeing it in a lot of uptake and interest in is really retailers trying to monetize that opportunity where shelf edge, for example, the shelf edge video that Kroger experimented with some time ago. And there's other companies like SES imagotag , that's also working on where, what they're really doing is they have a platform in the background that enabled suppliers to bid based on the insights that is being gathered in the store the insights of behavioral data where exactly do people dwell?

[00:18:00] What are they looking at? What time of day what's the demographics and using that information. And feeding it back to suppliers so that they can bid for specific content to be displayed in specific areas at specific times. I think that is the area that there is a lot of movement in, and a lot of retailers are looking at this as an opportunity to monetize and have suppliers really use their content and push it down.

[00:18:30] And then this is based on, the insights that is gathered in the store. And that's something that I I'm seeing a lot of. And I think that's going to grow. 

[00:18:38] Thank you. 

[00:18:39] Trevor Sumner: Yeah. think it's interesting because traditionally, this has been hard, like a lot of digital signage systems. You were supposed to go with a USB and update the content and that's crazy.

[00:18:49] Right. And so internet connectivity is starting to be solved. You have Walgreens installing 5g in 9,000 stores. You know, we're seeing store wifi networks being updated and to, to Shish's' point that, we're moving towards a programmatic model. And you know, the part of the problem was they didn't go big enough.

[00:19:09] Right. And so you didn't have the network of inventory, it's like, I think of these programmatic networks is like banner ad networks for a variety of reasons. I think this, type of programmatic buys meant to be, you know, interruptive media and much more promotional based like a banner ad.

[00:19:25] But you need a big network so that you have people to bid on it, and then you need this attribution, which they also didn't have. They said, okay, well, I've got this many people in store. Why don't you advertise it to them? Like, well, what are the demographics? Okay. I lit up the advertising, what are my what's my sales stuff look like, oh, you won't share sales data with me.

[00:19:42] Like, how am I supposed to buy this stuff? Went on Facebook or Instagram or Google. I can measure exactly demographics, target very finely, look at clicks, which had conversion rates and have all that data. I can't. Yeah, go back to a world where, I know my advertising is working on half, but I don't know which half kind of thing.

[00:20:01] So I think that that's fundamentally changing. And I think underlying that is that kind of conductivity and people making big budgets. Like I think, you know, I was talking to somebody that, that like Kroger Kroger is hiring like 60 ad salespeople. So if you're asking me like, when is that happening?

[00:20:19] It's this world happening it's happening right now. Right. That Kroger's got this, you know, side company called 84 51 doing analytics video, that kind of stuff. Walmarts media network is now extending into store CVS put out an RFP to you know, 500, 800 stores with huge digital signage networks.

[00:20:38] So I think it's happening now. And, you know, over the course of the next year, you're going to see this because. It's a huge opportunity. Again, you know, only 1% of digital media spend is happens in store where 85% of transactions occur. I just think retailers need to continue to evolve their offerings, share data, so that you can look at demographic targeting, verifying interaction, some of the stuff that cooler screens as doing, and then also provide sales data.

[00:21:08] Like if you spent, what is my return on ad spend? Like, you need to answer that question or you're not going to get the ad dollars. And if you expect it just to come from trade dollars, I think you're missing out on the pie of, of, of where the media spend is. 

[00:21:21] Casey Golden: I completely agree. I really see a lot of this democratizing data and relief.

[00:21:29] A lot of the handcuffs that have been on it. I think it's going to be shared much more freely because it's going to be easier to get. And you're either a good partner or you're not. 

[00:21:39] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, I agree. I think there's a key point there about being a good partner. If you think about what the brands for the products that you have in the store are used to experiencing, I think you've hit on the right point there where those brands are used to having access to that data.

[00:21:53] So they can calculate that return on ad spend. They know exactly whether this particular ad spend was the one that helped you make a denser and make, make. On purchases. They want to know that they don't want to just take, essentially take it on, on faith that yeah. I spent this money with you as a retailer and you showed an increase in sales, but do I even really know if it was sales that I care about because it was my product versus others in the category.

[00:22:17] I think that's important to have the granularity that you can talk back to your partners and share that information with them is going to be critical. And that's, what's going to help these things grow and expand. I would say that if we kind of look out a few years into this, what does, what does it look like?

[00:22:33] You know, you have a combination of much more intelligence around signage for content display, but it beyond just signage. I think if we think of computer vision and this maybe will help us kind of shift into a discussion on a more internet of things, type of things more of a. Three-dimensional capability, which I know Trevor's going to jump in here and tell me more about in a moment, but you know, the ability to actually interact with the merchandise in a way that also triggers new content on surrounding displays and tandem between sensors and computer vision, all helping to improve that experience for the customer.

[00:23:08] But at the same time generating the kind of data that brands are expecting to see for those products that they might get in other mediums, like an social, for example, where, you know, they'll know things, basic things like click-throughs I'll know, impressions, they'll know, viewing Tom, if it was a video, if you have a content that's going in a store and it's, you have multiple products in the category and a display case, of course, each individual brand is going to want to know, well, which product did the customer stand there looking at the longest? Was it mine? Was it a competitive product and the category? Which one did they pick up? How long did they hold it, did that. Was that was that followed by a sale. Those are the kinds of data points they're going to want to know which in other digital marketing mediums, you know, all of this data is there today.

[00:23:52] Internet of Things

[00:23:52] Ricardo Belmar: And it's been missing, in that store format. And these are areas that, there's so much room to free that data and make it more accessible to both the retailer and the brands to act on. I think there's, there's a significant, powerful capability that that's coming there and you can start to see it now, but I think we're going to see this much more ubiquitously in the years to come.

[00:24:11] So let's take advantage of this and kind of shift a little bit more into things like sensors and other internet of things. A couple of the examples we talked about have already touched on this. I'm going to circle back to grocery cause that's one of my favorite topics here and examples with shelf sensors that help you understand when you need to replenish that shelf.

[00:24:31] Okay. Sensors that help you understand the temperature in your cooler cases? You know, my, one of my favorite examples are grocers who are leveraging these sensors and coolers, and then having robotics go up and down the aisle and capture the, those data points, send them out so that we don't need to waste any employee's time with having to run around with the temperature sensor to actually check those times.

[00:24:53] You can do thousands of these temp checks throughout the day, and know exactly where you may have a problem coming up. You know, exactly if you're going to need maintenance, you know, exactly. If it was going to be an issue with product safety without having to ask people to repeatedly, go out there and take on this tedious task.

[00:25:08] So there's operational benefits of sensor type devices like this. Then there are things that are more experience driven and display cases shelf counts. We've heard a couple of these examples. Shish, Trevor you've both mentioned some. When it comes to leveraging the data generated by these sensors, I can see an example where, store associates who are engaged with the customer in a more personal one-on-one experience might be able to leverage data, being generated by sensors throughout the store. So that when someone says, you know, do we have something it's immediately available to them? And they know exactly where it is in the store, for example, without having to search or find it.

[00:25:46] We've seen some past examples of places where a customer in a fitting room, for example, realizes, oh, I need a different size of this particular merchandise. I have to wait until I talk to someone that, to tell them that I need help finding that. But if you have the right sensors in the fitting room and the right tags on the merchandise, you know exactly what merchandise is there, and you can offer an experience to the customer to, for example, tap on a screen or tap on their own device that sends a message to someone else in the store that says exactly what it is they need.

[00:26:13] And they can just bring it over to them. And I think that would bring a new level of in store personalization for that, that we've seen examples of this, but it hasn't quite gone mainstream. And I think that's something that's yet to come. But , I'll put it out to everybody else on the panel or some other examples where you see this area of IOT and then sensor technology, helping to improve that in store experience.

[00:26:35] Shish Shridhar: A couple of things that I, I I'm fascinated about is also the sensors driving automation. And one of them is, you know, the sensors that are detecting the shelves looking at availability of products or lack of availability of products, and then kicking off a process either as a notification to store associates, to replenish or kicking off a reorder process in the back end.

[00:27:00] So those kinds of automations are interesting. In addition, also video analytics that notices a spill in a particular aisle then creates a task automatically for a store associate or an employee to be able to, to be aware of what's going on in the store. Whether it is assistance needed for a customer based on behavioral data, whether it is detecting a potential fraud and it's it's notifying people.

[00:27:29] So that kind of an automation is, is kind of fascinating where the sensors, the noxious detecting information, but it kicking off processes and book flows in the background. And, and that's an interesting area that, that, that is happening. The other part of it is the, the range of senses. As I mentioned earlier, where for us aunts on shelf availability, there's weight sensors, there's video analytics.

[00:27:56] And then there is other kinds of sensing as well to detect whether with a product is going bad. Like for example, I mentioned smell sensors. So those are getting to be interesting as well, where there's a lot of sensors in place for detecting what's going on in store. The, the other one that I think is fascinating is sensors that bring in the experiences or what happens online into the store.

[00:28:24] A good example of that is retargeting where as a shopper may have done a search online using their account, gone to, you know, the online store and then done a search picked a product, but not actually bought it. Then when they walk into the store with a mobile device, it automatically detects that they've walked in and could potentially do a retarget or promo and so on.

[00:28:49] It also can act on dwell times. It knows that I have dwelled in front of a product. It indicates that I've got interested in the product, but I've not bought the product so that information can be acted on as well. When in the store or online that retargeting from store to online. And the other way around is sort of interesting areas that, that sensors come into play.

[00:29:13] Thank you.

[00:29:17] Trevor Sumner: Yeah. And I think as you look towards the future, right now, people have been talking about facial recognition as part of that identity closed, looping the identity from online to in store. And so, you know, we'll see how far we go down that and some of the privacy concerns or whether we'll tolerate these things, but that's why I thought, the whole face scan technology for payments was really interesting is because, you know, that's basically creating that facial ID library, which can then be used throughout the store. So I think some of that stuff, as you look at it is really a Trojan horse. And you know, one of the things I look at with all of these is just like, who is doing these clever things to capture data for computer vision. So when, for example, like we talked a little bit about identifying products from pictures, so you can do or video, so you can do social selling, right?

[00:30:04] So live shoppable videos. Well, where do you get the product imagery, right? Because you can hold the product and lots of different ways in a video, et cetera, et cetera. Well, what target does is, you know, during the, in the checkout counter when you scan the product, it has, it has cameras.

[00:30:19] And so you, you, you, you know, scan the product at lots of different angles, you know, just as people. And they take pictures of it. And then when they get the UPC code that they say, okay, all right, great. This is pro products to XYZ, 12 ounce that that's at the top and they have, you know, 50, a hundred pictures of that product, every scan.

[00:30:39] And so they have an immense fiber library of images of a product in every different direction. And it's a clever way to build a product recognition database. Right. And so, you know, at the same way that facial scanning for payment is a clever way to create facial identity, you know, a database. And so then when I look at all these technologies that are being adopted and when I think about Walmart giving away, you know, 700,000 devices to, to, to their employees, I always think, okay, what new access to data are these guys building and leveraging for the future.

[00:31:16] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, that's a good point about the, as I like to think of it, the volume of data that we're now generating by using these technologies and what are we going to do with that data, who's going to get access to it. And how will they be able to take advantage of it in a, in a positive way? 

[00:31:30] Casey Golden: think a lot of the computer vision and these types of technologies going in store, we'll be able to fill in a lot of gaps and add context to digital data that we've been sitting on.

[00:31:42] It'll be a lot easier to understand unconventional a recommendation like building out unconventional recommendation engines and really understanding how people are really shopping in store to improve the way that items are merchandised and assorted or even planned for online.

[00:32:05] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. That's another good point on the data aspects of it as well. Let me go back to, you know, again, so keeping this in the context of IOT and sensors, that we also just talked about computer vision, you know, the data piece reflects on all of these, especially around the volume of data, as well as your, where it's being used, how it's being used.

[00:32:26] 5G

[00:32:26] Ricardo Belmar: let's kind of connect this to the communications mean that that's going to become available both to the store and to other locations because of 5g. I'm going to kind of, I want to start with you Trevor, cause I know you've talked quite a bit and this was one of your predictions. If I recall at the beginning of the year as what was going to happen and what 5g would open.

[00:32:44] Within retail for this year. So I'd like to get your thoughts on how you see 5g kind of connecting the dots here and helping us move all this data around to where it needs to be. 

[00:32:53] Trevor Sumner: Yeah. I mean, the I in IOT is connectivity, right? It's connectivity to the internet. And you know, it's just amazing how bad store and vendor wifi is.

[00:33:03] I mean, it's, it's, it's horrible. Right? And they changed the password. They block ports, they do all these other things. It's not evenly distributed in store. They just didn't do a good job with it. And 5g promises to be able to solve this through, greater throughput, faster connectivity, the latency on a connection is much, much lower and then the devices can talk to each other.

[00:33:27] And so you can have really dense networks , of nodes, of devices and sensors and all these things kind of operating independently on very kind of low cost hardware. And so, the IDC projects that , you'll see about a 10 X increase in IOT in retail in the next four years. And like, this is happening now, right?

[00:33:48] Like Walmart, I think is processing 5 billion IOT messages every single day. And so people are doing it now, and this is where you're seeing like Walgreens implementing 5g across 9,000 stores. And, and what they're saying is there all these things that we talked about, right. They want inventory scanning robots, planagram enforcement, robots.

[00:34:08] They want interactive displays. They want all this type of stuff. And the reality is it's the dirty little secret about why this has been such a difficult business is all the operational low-level stuff that can go wrong. And it's especially hard when you don't have connectivity and you don't have visibility into what's going on.

[00:34:29] So I think it's just as a super core tenant to be able to network all these devices with lower cost hardware, much more reliable ubiquitous throughout the store. And it'll make engineering and development and deployment much less expensive, which then opens up a new suite of applications like, , for perch, we started off like doing these high-end displays for like Joe Malone, but our fastest growing customer segment right now is in grocery because we've got the price point to a place where it made sense. And, part of that is looking at the, hardware technologies and some clever things we've done around the financing and other things. But part of it is just the underlying technologies enabling, shifts in cost structure that make a lot of sense. 

[00:35:15] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. I think that's a good point.

[00:35:17] And to your point about the the wifi, I've always been saying to retailers in the industry, you know, the only thing worse than no wifi in a store is bad wifi, because it's even more frustrating than when you can't get connected, the fact that you get connected, but then it's terrible makes the experience a hundred times worse.

[00:35:35] Trevor Sumner: Yeah, totally. And, because of that, I shipped with a 4g router with every single one of our Perch units, and that adds, 200, $250 in cost per unit that adds somewhere between five and $25 per month. So that's, another 60 to $300 on an annual basis.

[00:35:56] And so like that, that just pushes you off into too expensive territory for a bunch of stuff, as opposed to here's the CPU that speaks 5g right out of the bat. I don't have to buy any of that networking stuff and I don't have to pay Verizon or, Vodafone or whoever you're using. And all of a sudden, you're shaving 25% off my cost basis and operating this.

[00:36:18] I mean, that's, that's solid amount, but what that really does is it opens up whole new tiers of applications that make this kind of sensor enabled future possible. 

[00:36:29] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. That's a good point on a cost difference there. And then I think I'll even throw in there's some other advantages that will hopefully get opened up as the 5g carrier define what more detail specific services that make sense for retailers. You know, there are capabilities in 5g that lets you carve out dedicated capacity within a channel. So for example, a retailer could say, I want to have some dedicated connectivity between a set of stores and maybe a fulfillment center distribution center, or maybe I want to have a distinct channel back to a supplier for specific things or, you know, those digital signage media networks we talked about earlier.

[00:37:07] If I want to keep that separate such that it doesn't interfere with other store traffic which in the past has always produced the strangest of problems. I can't even begin to count how many different retailers I've worked with where fundamental performance issues in the store just came down to one set of technology interfering on the communications link with other technologies, all fighting for the same capacity. And nobody really realized that these things needed to have just some dedicated carved out capacity. So 5g should allow for some of these new models to, to appear, to let things function a little bit smoother with dedicated capacity and space for all the different things going on in the store to kind of play nicely together and share in that space, which is something that you know, I remember when 4g started, you know, that was supposed to be one of the promises, but I think we quickly learned that it just wants to really have the strength to do that in store compared to building a solid wifi network instead.

[00:38:03] Casey Golden: A hundred percent. Trevor really said it well with not having our stores with premium wifi. It's one thing to be able to make a phone call or look something up on the internet.

[00:38:14] But when we get to engage with more AR applications and hologram tech and just all the types of immersive technologies that will be able to be powered onsite it could get really interesting and really innovative as long as these systems can, can actually run. 

[00:38:32] Trevor Sumner: Yeah. I'll give another example, right?

[00:38:34] It's like, we're talking a lot about computer vision. Well, where does the vision processing happen? If you can't transmit video streams over, a significant sized internet pipe to some central location, you have to do it locally, which means that you have really powerful CPU's that cost money, right?

[00:38:53] So, our Perch CPU's costs, like a media players, 400, 500, $600, and they're capable of doing, a reasonable amount of vision processing. Now, if you can just communicate that video stream to some central server to be processed afterwards now at zero and not zero, but near zero.

[00:39:10] And so, it's tremendous what, again, the, challenge has been the costs, the maintenance, the, the way that these things break down, the more you can make them dumb sensors that can communicate through thick pipes to centralize processing. That's aware of all the sensors and looking at how it's not just a video from one view, but it's video from multiple views. You can do more intelligent computer vision and analysis and do that centrally once that model takes hold. It's just it's an exponential shift in computing power and, and intelligence and also an exponential shift, lower income.

[00:39:49] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. Yeah. I agree. And then just thinking more about, this video example, what better model than if you could take all of these devices and systems generating these video streams, especially for example, if we're talking about live streaming out of the store, what better model than to try to push that out over 5g and not even have it on the store network at all?

[00:40:08] Not have it go over the wifi, not to have it go over the same store network. That's driving all your POS transactions, but separate it and have it go out of her 5g on a low latency systems so that it gets good performance to all the people watching that video. Likewise, if it's sensor-based generating this, these video files or video streams and it, because it's shelf technology, that's looking for gaps for replenishment. You want accuracy. And the best way you're going to get accuracy is to have reliable high capacity connectivity for that. So I think those are all good models that really speak to what we can hope to accomplish here with 5g. 

[00:40:40] I would, put the stake in the ground now that says, if we're talking 2025, right. That's for three years out, we're going to see 5g quite widespread across stores everywhere in one form or another, even if it's just doing, and I'll put just in air quotes, because it's not like it's an insignificance activity, but even if it's just supporting live streaming, I think that's going to be a significant factor just right there to help facilitate the adoption of that technology.

[00:41:06] So I would even put it into those terms where I think this is what you were saying, Trevor is, is you reduce the cost to simpler devices that have that connectivity built in you're lowering that cost basis and making it easier to adopt these new technologies in the store and make it more ubiquitous across the entire brands store fleet.

[00:41:23] So this might be a good point to pause and I'll, ask, if anyone in our audience has a question we've taken a trip across computer vision IOT. We had some digital signage sprinkled in there and we've ended up at 5g. I'm curious if anyone in our audience has some questions.

[00:41:38] Questions

[00:41:38] Ricardo Belmar: I think I see a hand raised there.

[00:41:41] All right, Jamie. Welcome to the stage.

[00:41:42] Jamie Tenser: Well, hello, greetings. This is a great conversation. I really want to compliment every one of the speakers today, as it brings together some ideas that I've been thinking about for a long time. My, my real question, I guess right now is how inextricable are in-store media and in store sensing, we've tended to look at them as sort of separate areas of pursuit.

[00:42:06] Is it really converging into one thing? And I wonder what the panelists think about that. 

[00:42:11] Ricardo Belmar: Oh, that's a great question. You're really getting at what point is the store really starting to look like pure media, right? 

[00:42:18] Jamie Tenser: Well, yeah. And, if it's all right, I'll say that one of the statements I repeated for years is what I called the retail media ecology principle that the store is a communications environment for brand messages. That's on the front page of my website. So I'm a believer going in, but it does feel like the forces are converging as several people said today.

[00:42:42] So I'll shut up and I'm very curious what the smart folks have to say about it.

[00:42:46] Trevor Sumner: Yeah, I mean, look, I think it goes back to this, people don't want to put just straight digital signage, flashy texts that says maybe it's Maybelline, maybe it's Maybelline, maybe it's Maybelline. It doesn't really help.

[00:42:57] it doesn't help the shopper because it's not contextual and it also doesn't help the brand because they can't measure it. They don't know if it's working or not. And so sensors allow both you to be more intelligent and providing the right message at the right time and also to be able to attribute, you know, kind of action.

[00:43:14] So one of the things that we're doing is using computer vision to detect when somebody takes a product away from the shelf. So if the retailer doesn't want to share store level sales data with you, you don't need it. . Like somebody picked up, you know, the tide package and they walked away with it.

[00:43:30] So let's just say, let's call that a sale because 90% of the time it is, and we can say, you know, does that, does that work based upon, kind of the metrics that you're looking at? I mean, we're for example, we just made a major launch with Purina at Meyer supermarkets at two hundred stores.

[00:43:45] And, we're getting all this kind of interesting data, but one of the most interesting pieces of data to me is like, I can actually price this on a cost per click basis. If clicking on a product is the same as picking up a product in store. And it's one third that of Facebook. And it's like, oh, well, if media buyers start looking at this and be like, whoa, whoa, whoa, what do you mean one third?

[00:44:04] Like maybe we need to do a lot more of this. Right. But until you start putting it into terms that people like $8 CPM, $20 CPM dollars CPM, a couple who cares about a CPM, did it, did people take the action? And that's what people need to see to really open this up. And that's kind of the hope of IOT. 

[00:44:23] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah.

[00:44:23] I think I would add to what Trevor said that really what we're looking at here is, is it an awareness issue we're trying to address with media in the store or is it more an impact on conversion? And I think Trevor, you gave some really good examples there where, if you're just, popping up that Maybelline message, that's just trying to get awareness, right? That's trying to get your attention to say, Hey, I'm here. But if we think about the customer journey, what particular customer went through that they got to this store, especially where we are now, we know that those customer journeys have changed because of the pandemic.

[00:44:53] We know that more often than not now they're starting as a digital journey and ending up in the store, ultimately converting. So if we take that as our premise and to Trevor's point, what value is it to have content that shows up in some form of media in the store, that's just designed to get your attention?

[00:45:13] And just get you to notice. I already know it's there but if I came to the store, then in this example, my journey has brought me here because there's some reason I wasn't ready to make this purchase. When I started researching it online, I want to see it. I want to touch it. I want to see, I might want to compare it to other products in the same category that I know the store might have five different options of.

[00:45:34] And because of that, if suddenly now I see some additional added value content that gives me meaningful information about the product and that's leading into a conversion. And to Trevor's point, I agree completely with this. Now it's measurable. Now I know that that media had an impact because if I know that this is in front of a display that has multiple products and there's sensors that tell me exactly which product the customer picked up and I displayed some form of content.

[00:45:59] And then later I know that product was purchased by this customer. I can map that direct impact and that's to me as much more meaningful than, than the traditional, Hey, look at me. I'm here kind of promotional material.

[00:46:11] Casey Golden: A hundred percent. I mean, I went to Ikea last weekend and there was a huge screen in front of the staircase on the second floor. And it was an ad. And obviously I'm looking for something because I'm walking up to the screen. I'm like, okay, nothing happens when you touch it. It was an ad for Ikea, not a product, but Ikea I'm like, I'm already here.

[00:46:36] Can you show me a map? And that adds value. Do anything, something that adds value to my journey because obviously I've already made it into Ikea. So I don't need an advertisement that shopping at Ikea is great. 

[00:46:49] Ricardo Belmar: You need something much more specific. Yeah. 

[00:46:52] Casey Golden: But it would have been nice to see something else. Maybe even something that was upstairs since I'm at the bottom of the staircase.

[00:47:01] Trevor Sumner: Yeah. I mean, the way I think about shopping is it about, it's fundamentally about connecting people and products and stores and departments are all kind of like abstractions and collections of this idea, but really what needs to happen is understand the interactions at a people and products level and, you talk about the journey starting online.

[00:47:20] It's like, part of it is because that's the first measurable place, right? I think there's plenty of interactions of people walking. If you've walked down a supermarket aisle, you've probably seen a hundred thousand products in the cleaning goods category and you don't even register which ones you've kind of, like subconsciously you do, but , it's not measurable.

[00:47:42] And so, you gotta be able to measure. Measure what people are interacting with. And so that's why fundamentally like at perch, we're really focused on that being the really centered the universe. Like those, those people product connection.

[00:47:55] Ricardo Belmar: Yep. I'll all good points out. Shish did you have something you wanted to add on this one.

[00:47:59] Shish Shridhar: I can thank the, you know, the way that all the systems across the store are going is the becoming in a connected systems. So the sensors really detecting behavioral information within the store and combining it with your behavioral data, if that is available outside, online, and then making recommendations and real time just-in-time is really the direction we're going.

[00:48:25] And that's where the, the signage within the store kind of interacts and works in tandem with the sensors and the data and this combined with inference models. So when we kind of combine the data, there'll be a collecting from external sources, the sensors that is collecting behavioral data within the store and.

[00:48:50] Applying AI models to it, to be able to determine in time, what is the most relevant and personalized messaging that can be delivered to you? I think that's the direction we are really coming with, but that combination of iOT and AI. 

[00:49:05] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. That's also a good point that that there's data to be acting on in near real-time based on the situation.

[00:49:11] And I think Casey's example Ikea was a good one where if you were, if you had a system that was taking in that data in the moment, then that's allowing you to make real time decisions on how to adjust the media offered to that customer for, for the particular scenario that they're in. And That to me is a pretty good step in the right direction for digital signage in particular.

[00:49:34] I know plenty of older digital signage systems where the, it lacks this sort of intelligence and everything was pre-programmed, but pre-programmed for sort of a default environment where you did really take into account how that customer's visit is changing while they're there. And that's something that I think, you know, to, to your point, you know, if you have the right sensors, the right even if it could be computer vision based, it could just be an IOT sensor, you have the right technology components there.

[00:49:59] You can act on the data in a more intelligent way.

[00:50:01] Jamie Tenser: And just let me say, thank you for addressing my ideas. I have to sign off because they have something coming, but this is one of the most timely conversations I've been able to listen to. About retail innovation in a long time. I appreciate it. If in my hat to you all, thank you. 

[00:50:18] Ricardo Belmar: Any other questions from the audience at this time,

[00:50:21] if not, I'm going to turn to my fellow speakers today. Casey, any final thoughts 

[00:50:26] Casey Golden: final thoughts is just keep it going every single step forward and new piece of technology implemented, failed or successful as a step forward. 

[00:50:37] Ricardo Belmar: All right. Excellent Any final thoughts? 

[00:50:39] Shish Shridhar: Yeah, the right now we're seeing a lot of these solutions in silos. So the IOT and the AI and 5g, all of them coming together.

[00:50:47] But I think what we are going towards is them becoming an entire ecosystem that integrates and does intertwines with each other communicating information one to the other. I think that's the direction we're going in. And that's my big takeaway. 

[00:51:02] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. I agree with that. I think you're absolutely spot on, on that one that is typically, I think happens right in the, in the adoption cycle with these new technologies, you see them in very unique, specific use cases in silos.

[00:51:14] And then when they start integrating with other new technologies, you really start to see the magic. Trevor, any final thoughts. 

[00:51:19] Trevor Sumner: Yeah, the only final thought I'd have I was going to say something cheesy. Like there is an I, an IOT, but but what's really, I think interesting to me is, is we're going to start to learn what actually really happens in retail stores.

[00:51:31] And the reality is we don't know, and we have lots of theories, like like in planagram design, there's this notion that you want to put your products at eye level, because eye level is buy level, but you say, and we don't even know if it's true. The answer is it's sometimes true and we're actually starting to get data to show when it is true when it's not true.

[00:51:49] And it's just suddenly people who've been doing planograms their entire life for like their entire careers. It's like this can't be right. And I'm like, yeah, it's right. It's just like, well, that changes everything. Right. And I think when we get this, these types of sensor technologies and this insights into what actually happens, what actually drives customer behaviors, how customers, actually get impressions or products before they go online. And what is the importance of that and the attribution to the sales cycle? I there's just so much that's going to change. And I think, the people who embrace data and think about data and share data with their partners, if you're a retailer sharing that data with your brand partners, they will spend more with you.

[00:52:30] Your customers will spend more with you. You'll become a more valuable platform. And all of this becomes just kind of this reinforcing cycle. And, there's people investing very heavily in this and it's coming and it's exciting. So I'm going to leave into the weekend. Excited 

[00:52:50] Ricardo Belmar: here, here to that.

[00:52:51] I'm with you on that one, Trevor. I think we are absolutely going to start to learn significant new insights from data gathered in store that, that you're right. We've always made assumptions as an industry. We've. I had expected behaviors that we think we know when all we ever had to look at was a final sales data from the point of sale.

[00:53:11] And compared to the mountains of information we get on e-commerce and online, I think you're, you're spot on, on that one. We're going to, as each of these technologies gets adopted, we're going to find out some truly meaningful differences of what happens with customers in store that hopefully won't be too shocking, but hopefully we'll just validate a lot of things, but I'm sure there's going to be an equal amount of new things we see that are, are very unexpected that we're going to be able to take advantage of. 

[00:53:38] The risk to getting left behind is, is significant. I think at this point, and hopefully every retailer has either learned a lesson for themselves or observed it from others during the pandemic. And as we come out that the need for innovation is greater than ever because consumers are coming back to stores.

[00:53:54] So, on that note we'll go ahead and thank everyone for sticking through the session with us. I hope you enjoyed today's discussion on future digital transformation, innovation, particularly around 5g IOT and computer vision. Thanks everyone. And have a great weekend coming up here. 

[00:54:11] Recap Discussion

[00:54:11] Ricardo Belmar: Welcome back everyone. I hope you enjoyed our deep dive into computer vision, IOT, and 5G. 

[00:54:23] Casey Golden: Shish and Trevor are just phenomenal. I'm so lucky to actually be standing in the same room with them at Shop Talk. 

[00:54:29] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, it was 

[00:54:32] retail's big reunion. Yup. 

[00:54:34] Casey Golden: we ever going to really have five G

[00:54:37] Ricardo Belmar: You mean other than a neat little symbol on your phone 

[00:54:40] Casey Golden: yeah.

[00:54:41] Ricardo Belmar: that it'll actually do something for us? Yeah you know, I guess it's coming. It's coming. I mean, you know, we had some good ideas come up in the discussion there. Trevor and Shish brought up some good, good thoughts there on 5g. I have to admit when, during, I'll say peak hype over that, I remember hearing people talking about how retailers are just going to totally dismantle all their, all their store networks and just put everything on 5g. And I thought, you know, I'm not so sure about that. I think we're looking in the wrong place. And I think it's interesting that all the things we talked about around 5g in the clubhouse session, they were all new things. We're not talking about converting and replacing old activities and old concepts went into stores and how we move data around the retail business. We're talking about new things and I think that's what really, really matters. 

[00:55:26] Casey Golden: So does that mean, we won't get cell service in Bloomingdale's on 59th street.

[00:55:32] Ricardo Belmar: Well, that remains to be seen. And maybe, I dunno, maybe you're making a good side argument there for better wifi, but I'm going to, I'm going to stay away from that wifi conversation. Don't get me started on, on bad retail, wifi. It's my number one, retail pet peeve is bad wifi. All right. So I'm going to put you on the spot now, Casey. I didn't warn you, but I'm doing it anyway of the three topics, 5g, IOT, and computer vision, which do you think is the most transformative for retail? 

[00:56:00] Casey Golden: Things that we can deploy now. That's what I like best.

[00:56:04] Ricardo Belmar: That's a great answer. 

[00:56:07] Casey Golden: So I'm placing my bets on computer vision. It has an incredible potential to flow through the entire organization and not just a department. I think it's completely under utilized today. And fashion is a visual industry. Commerce is visual. How do we sell our products with video media? 

[00:56:27] Ricardo Belmar: Right. 

[00:56:27] Casey Golden: video content is at an all time high adoption rate.

[00:56:31] I mean, it's finally normal. 

[00:56:33] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. 

[00:56:34] Casey Golden: So I think, 

[00:56:35] Ricardo Belmar: that before. Yeah. 

[00:56:35] Casey Golden: Measuring and deciphering images and videos is still predominantly very human interpreting that. The success, what makes it a success? We're missing a lot of insights that computer vision can make a big impact. And I don't even think we know how big of an impact it can make because I just haven't seen it deployed strong enough.

[00:56:57] Ricardo Belmar: early stages yeah,. It's 

[00:56:58] still the early stages. That's true. 

[00:56:59] Casey Golden: But just even for what is it. The ability to back channel data entry and tagging alone,

[00:57:07] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah. 

[00:57:08] Casey Golden: that could be millions of additional data points on products that we've been selling for a decade.

[00:57:14] Ricardo Belmar: Right. Good point. Good point. Yeah. . It, it all, it does always come back to data, right? It comes back to getting more, more data. Knowing more about your customer. 

[00:57:21] Casey Golden: You don't get a pass. Ricardo, where are you placing your bets?

[00:57:24] Ricardo Belmar: Oh, I knew you'd ask me that. I knew you'd ask me that. So at the risk of being really cagey about this, and this may not come as a big shock, I'm also going to say it's computer vision, but more so as a means to an end, and you were kind of getting at it too. So here's what I mean. So for me, the 5g IOT, those are really enablers. They're going to enable. Yeah. Well, the thing is by either connecting them together in new ways, like we were just saying for 5g, new types of connectivity to do new things, that way, move data around or enabling a new way of gathering that data, which let's face that's what IOT is for.

[00:57:57] Right. Where every use case we always talk about now, it seems for IOT, it's all about getting a new data set that a retailer can use for whatever purpose it is. It's inventory management, supply chain, you name it, but you know, computer vision, it takes those and it kind of fuels a new experience around it. So you're not just transforming the value of the data brought in by the other two. . Kinda got into that, right at the end of the clubhouse discussion, it was turning more into a little bit of a data discussion. We had that great question from Jamie Tenser that kind of brought that up. He connected the dots to retail media which, another favorite topic of ours on the show, retail media networks, and connected that with all three of these things and for me, computer vision, it's almost like it's the glue that puts all of these things together and builds an experience around it. So to me, that's what makes it the most transformative one, because it's all about more and more data for retailers to leverage, to learn more about customers and how they engage. 

[00:58:49] Casey Golden: A hundred percent, understanding the visual world can change the way we think and how we engage with literally every aspect\. I mean, we were consumed like, what is it? Seven hours a day. People are spending online. We're looking at, I mean, it changes the way we search how we discover new products, but it's going to change what we see, why we see it, how we process it.

[00:59:11] And that frankly, it's, it's going to change the way that we do business.

[00:59:15] Ricardo Belmar: At the end of the day, that's why we picked those three topics because they really are the ones if you take them together now that they're just going to change so much about how retail is done.

[00:59:24] Casey Golden: Yeah. I mean, media is going to have a huge play with computer vision.

[00:59:28] Ricardo Belmar: Yep. No doubt about it. No doubt about it. I'm thinking we're going to have to do another show later. Maybe more, just specific on, maybe retail media, maybe another one on, on retail data. But there's, there's some, there's some good discussions to be had there. All, all around. 

[00:59:40] Casey Golden: Yeah. I mean, we're creating a lot of new visual experiences. And so with these new visual experiences or AR, or gosh, amount of 

[00:59:50] Ricardo Belmar: AR is another one we should do. 

[00:59:51] Casey Golden: that the amount of information that could literally be pulled in from the way that people engage in the metaverse 

[00:59:58] Ricardo Belmar: yeah, That too.

[01:00:00] I'm thinking Casey, that's the note we need to end on because if I let you keep going, you're going to create like 60 new episodes we're going to have to record in like no time to cover all this

[01:00:08] Casey Golden: I I know! 

[01:00:09] Ricardo Belmar: And be even more work for us. 

[01:00:11] Casey Golden: how lucky are we? 

[01:00:12] Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, 

[01:00:12] Casey Golden: Yeah, it is that time back to the other work, the real work. This is all the fun.

[01:00:18] Ricardo Belmar: Right. 

[01:00:19] Casey Golden: that counts as work.

[01:00:20] Clubhouse Thank You

[01:00:20] Casey Golden: Well, before we close, I'd like to thank everyone who joined us on stage for this clubhouse sesh to talk innovation, transformation, and ask questions. A special shout out 

[01:00:30] Ricardo Belmar: a Jamie Tensor, principle VSN strategies and no stranger to the Retail Razor room on clubhouse. Thanks Jamie for that great question I mentioned earlier about tying our discussion to retail and media and how it all connects the dots between digital and physical together, which of course is a favorite topic of ours on the show.

[01:00:48] And for those who didn't catch it, one of our top 10 predictions for 2022. 

[01:00:53] Casey Golden: Thank you Jamie. So Ricardo, that's a wrap. Kind of actually , always wanted to say that.

[01:01:00] Ricardo Belmar: It is, and that brings us to a close. 

[01:01:04] Show Close

[01:01:04] Casey Golden: If you enjoyed our show, please consider giving us a five star review on apple podcasts. Remember to smash that subscribe button in your favorite podcast player so you don't miss a minute. Want to know more about what we talked about today? Take a look at the show notes for handy links and more deets.

[01:01:20] I'm your cohost, Casey Golden.

[01:01:21] Ricardo Belmar: And if you'd like to learn more about us and stay connected, follow us on Twitter at caseycgolden and Ricardo_Belmar, or find us on LinkedIn. Be sure and follow the show on Twitter at RetailRazor and on LinkedIn and on our YouTube channel for video versions of each episode and the occasional bonus content. I'm your host, Ricardo Belmar. 

[01:01:39] Casey Golden: Thanks for joining us 

[01:01:40] Ricardo Belmar: and remember there's never been a better time to be in retail, IF you cut through the clutter! Until next time, this is the retail razor show