How To Fail With Elizabeth Day

chevron_right

Stephen Grosz - ‘Real love is going to hurt’

whatshot 30 snips

Oct 8, 2025

Guest

Stephen Grosz

In this engaging conversation, Stephen Grosz, a seasoned psychoanalyst and author, discusses the intricacies of love and loss after nearly fifty years in practice. He explores how early family experiences shape our attachments and the role of denial in relationships. Grosz delves into the painful yet essential nature of real love and how failed marriages can lead to deeper connections. His insights into surrender versus submission reveal how intimacy can flourish or falter. Listeners will gain a profound understanding of grief as a catalyst for desire.

52:23

forum

Ask episode

web_stories

AI Snips

view_agenda

Chapters

menu_book

Books

auto_awesome

Transcript

info_circle

Episode notes

volunteer_activism

ADVICE

Use Your Feelings As Clinical Data

When you feel anger or boredom with a client, interrogate why you feel that emotion rather than dismissing it.
Grosz encourages using those feelings as material to understand the patient's dynamics.

insights

INSIGHT

Unconscious Signals Carry Stories

Unconscious, habitual signals (punctuality, movement, gestures) reveal relational meanings.
Grosz shows that small unplanned acts often carry powerful narratives about absence and attachment.

volunteer_activism

ADVICE

Make Room By Accepting Loss

Accept that loss is intrinsic to love and necessary to make room for new stages of life.
Grosz urges listeners to let go of previous attachments to receive new relationships and growth.

Get the Snipd Podcast app to discover more snips from this episode

How childhood stories shape adult suffering

04:07 • 2min

chevron_right

How does denial shape our life story?

06:24 • 3min

chevron_right

Growing up with Holocaust-survivor family dynamics

09:38 • 3min

chevron_right

Why analysts need their own analysis

What failures taught me about seeing clearly

15:13 • 51sec

chevron_right

Why analysis is two people not knowing together

16:04 • 2min

chevron_right

When patients unconsciously test the analyst

17:42 • 3min

chevron_right

Do analysts feel anger or boredom with patients?

20:35 • 3min

chevron_right

What unconscious signals reveal in therapy

How is love built around loss?

29:10 • 4min

chevron_right

How writing as myself replaced writing like an analyst

32:48 • 2min

chevron_right

How family made me less austere as an analyst

35:06 • 2min

chevron_right

Does success and praise matter to you?

What's the difference between surrender and submission?

41:23 • 5min

chevron_right

Why failed marriages can lead to true remarriage

46:34 • 2min

chevron_right

What is a proper psychological marriage?

49:03 • 52sec

chevron_right

How should someone handle breakup grief and hope?

• Mentioned in 34 episodes

The interpretation of dreams

Sigmund Freud

In this seminal work, Freud introduces his theory of the unconscious with respect to dream interpretation and discusses what would later become the theory of the Oedipus complex. He argues that dreams are forms of 'wish fulfillment' and are influenced by unconscious forces and censorship. The book differentiates between the manifest content and latent content of dreams and explores the mechanisms of dream formation, including displacement and the 'dream-work'. Freud uses his own dreams and those of his patients to illustrate his theories, providing a deeply personal and insightful look into the human psyche.

#51921

Love's Labour's Lost

William Shakespeare

Love's Labour's Lost follows the King of Navarre and his three companions as they attempt to swear off women for three years to focus on study and fasting. However, their resolve is quickly tested when they encounter the Princess of France and her ladies-in-waiting. The men eventually abandon their vow and pursue the women, leading to a series of comedic misunderstandings and ultimately, a year-long wait to prove their love. The play explores themes of love, loyalty, and the complexities of relationships.

#10991

• Mentioned in 5 episodes

The Examined Life

How We Lose and Find Ourselves

Stephen Grosz

In 'The Examined Life', Stephen Grosz shares a series of poignant and insightful essays based on his experiences as a psychoanalyst. The book explores how people lose and find themselves through their struggles and transformations, offering a compassionate and intelligent perspective on human psychology. It has been praised for its clarity and depth, drawing comparisons to Chekhov and Oliver Sacks.

Warning: this episode may contain MIND-BLOWING moments.

Stephen Grosz is a practising psychoanalyst and a personal hero of mine. He has worked with patients for more than 45 years and his first book, The Examined Life, drew on these experiences. When it was published in 2013, it caused a sensation and went straight to number one in the Sunday Times bestseller list. Since then, hundreds of thousands of readers, including me, have taken it to our hearts.

Now 12 years on from his debut, Grosz is back with Love's Labour, which asks fundamental questions around how to love and be loved in return, drawing on his almost half a century of clinical expertise.

In this episode we discuss why real love causes suffering, why failed marriages are often the best kind, the difference between surrender and submission in relationships, why loss has to be part of being human and how we can be happy. Plus: a fascinating peek into what it’s like to be a psychoanalyst when I get to ask ‘are you ever annoyed by your clients?’

✨ IN THIS EPISODE:

02:28 Understanding Attachment to Suffering

04:25 The Role of Denial in Our Lives

06:32 Failures and Self-Perception

07:23 Stephen's Childhood

21:46 The Power of Unconscious Signals

25:24 Navigating Change and Loss

26:25 The Anxiety of Letting Go

28:22 The Price of Love

29:23 Writing from the Heart

30:16 Support Systems

32:27 Family Dynamics and Psychoanalysis

36:51 Surrender vs. Submission

45:25 Understanding Pain and Grief

48:25 Final Thoughts and Farewell

💬 QUOTES TO REMEMBER:

The aim of life is to see oneself clearly, and the world clearly.

Psychoanalysis is two people not knowing - together. We have to figure it out together, and that means both of us will make mistakes and I will get it wrong.

These failures brought me embarrassment, unhappiness, and pain. I wouldn't wish them away.

Real love is going to hurt

🔗 LINKS + MENTIONS:

Stephen’s new book - Loves Labour: www.stephengrosz.com

Elizabeth’s Substack: https://theelizabethday.substack.com/

Join the How To Fail community: https://howtofail.supportingcast.fm/#content

📚 WANT MORE?

Dr Nicole LePera - The Holistic Psychologist sheds light on life’s struggles: https://link.chtbl.com/Tlf5L5Jb

Emma Reed Turrell - the psychotherapist and author joins Elizabeth to discuss people-pleasing and the art of setting boundaries: https://link.chtbl.com/zthtQyEm

Alain de Botton - the famed philosopher on how to love and be loved: https://link.chtbl.com/RBaS4VUy

💌 LOVE THIS EPISODE?

Subscribe on Spotify, Apple or wherever you get your podcasts

Leave a 5⭐ review – it helps more people discover these stories

👋 Follow How To Fail & Elizabeth:

Instagram: @elizabday

TikTok: @howtofailpod

Podcast Instagram: @howtofailpod

Website: www.elizabethday.org

Substack: https://theelizabethday.substack.com/

Elizabeth and Stephen answer YOUR questions in our subscriber series, Failing with Friends. Join our community of subscribers here: howtofailpod.com

Have a failure you’re trying to work through for Elizabeth to discuss? Click here to get in touch: howtofailpod.com

Production & Post Production Coordinator: Eric Ryan

Sound Engineer: Matias Torres

Assistant Producer: Suhaar Ali

Senior Producer: Hannah Talbot

Executive Producer: Carly Maile

How to Fail is an Elizabeth Day and Sony Music Entertainment Production.

Find more great podcasts from Sony Music Entertainment at sonymusic.com/podcasts

To bring your brand to life in this podcast, email podcastadsales@sonymusic.com

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Home Top podcasts Popular guests Top books