Defining growth: sales versus long-term strategy

Norm and Joshua unpack growth definitions, tensions between short-term sales and long-term brand investment, and measurement horizons.

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Episode notes

Today’s CMO is being asked to deliver growth in a landscape defined by radical uncertainty and AI disruption.

In this episode of Frontier CMO, Norm de Greve, Chief Growth Officer at General Motors, joins Josh to explore what it takes to drive reinvention inside one of the world’s most complex legacy brands. Norm uses his experience making high-stakes decisions that have defined his career— walking away from $2 billion in tobacco revenue at CVS to steering GM’s resurgence—and turns it into actionable tactics for modern leaders. His thesis: Own the entire business engine, not just the brand.

Learn how to move at the speed of change, without losing your creative soul.

Whether you are navigating the anxiety of the AI era or managing the tension between short-term performance and long-term brand building, this episode offers a masterclass in building sustainable systems for growth.

00:00 – Creative Still Matters in the Age of AI

00:24 – Welcome to Frontier CMO & Norm De Greve’s Journey

01:22 – Inside GM’s Turnaround and Reinvention

02:26 – Why Automotive Is One of the Most Powerful Brand Businesses

05:01 – Bankruptcy as the Catalyst for Change

06:11 – EVs, Profit Pressure, and a New Marketing Model

08:38 – Leading Teams Through Constant Change and AI Anxiety

10:11 – From CMO to Chief Growth Officer

13:48 – Short-Term Sales vs Long-Term Brand Building

23:48 – Rebuilding GM’s Agency Model with MediaMonks and Metropolis

31:34 – Why Brand and Human Taste Matter More in an AI World

34:24 – Field Notes from the Frontier: Growth, Change, and the Human Soul