Kirsha and Leaflet: Female Research‑Driven Voices

In this Based Camp episode, Malcolm and Simone Collins explore a viral Asmongold take: VTubing as a “hack” that lets women (and others) influence online discourse without traditional appearance-based barriers. They dive into how anime avatars and VTubers have transformed the online right—opening doors for older, intellectually mature women, introducing female perspectives, and boosting the post-GamerGate “nerd right” faction.

Topics include the evolution of the online right from edgy atheists to the modern conservative scene, why traditional female influencers were often young and impressionable, the rise of conservative VTubers like Kirsche, Leaflit, Rev Says Desu, and more, plus the cultural shifts around age, attractiveness, parasocial relationships, and factional dynamics within the right (deontologists vs. consequentialists, anti-nerd sentiments, etc.).

They also touch on Anna Valens drama, anime’s role in conservatism, censorship, coalition-building, and why this VTuber phenomenon strengthens the right’s adaptability and intellectual depth. A fun, wide-ranging conversation on how technology is reshaping ideology and influence.

Episode Transcript

Malcolm Collins: [00:00:00] Hello Simone. I’m excited to hear with you today.

Today we’re gonna be talking about an interesting phenomenon that came from a viral moment that Asma Gold got himself into. Oh, what? ASG Gold was I think, reacting to a tweet. And the tweet said something like, there is no point to male v tubers and Asma Gold said this is true. And then he went further, which is to say the key benefit of VT tubing for women is he said it’s like this crazy hack that they found out where you can be a hot woman without having to be a hot woman.

And then he said the thing that was controversial, but many female vt tubers have reacted to this and been like, but this isn’t controversial, it’s just true. Oh no. Which he said is, if you look at not hot female influencers. The vast majority of them are v tubers to, to the extent that almost all of them are v tubers.

Right.

Speaker 6: To be clear, I am not saying that V tubers are predominantly unattractive. I actually do not think that this is the case. I think that they’re [00:01:00] well more attractive than the average person. , like the real people are more attractive than the average person. But we lived in an era where, women who were.

Let’s say top 25%, but not top 10% of attractiveness were frozen out of being able to start to rise as intellectual influencers. , And this doesn’t just have to do with genetics. It was also really any woman who is over the age of 25 was frozen out of being able to rise as an intellectual influencer because men think younger women are attractive, generally speaking.

, And. It’s worse than all of that because even if a woman is in the top 5% of attractiveness, but she is shy or she is insecure and doesn’t want people criticizing her looks because, , that is a normal thing for conservatives to do to immediately go after a woman’s looks if they don’t like her ideas.

, She would not attempt to rise and v tubers as a concept, allowing this completely transformed that.

Simone Collins: How would you know, aren’t most [00:02:00] v tubers good at concealing their identity?

Malcolm Collins: Hmm, there’s the leaks all the time.

Simone Collins: Can you put like images on screens of like the person next to their V YouTuber persona or just gimme their names so I can do it and then give it to you?

Malcolm Collins: No, no, no, no, no, no. We’re not gonna do that.

And the reason I’m not gonna do that is because the leaks are typically unintentional and that’s mean.

Simone Collins: Oh, okay. I just

Malcolm Collins: like, like

Simone Collins: by, I mean, are you saying like non Instagram filter ugly or do you mean like.

Malcolm Collins: Well, this is, this is where we’re getting to the point, the point I wanted to, to talk

Simone Collins: about and mean, do they look like me?

Because, you know, there’s like thought hot and then

Malcolm Collins: but the point I was going to make was that. This phenomenon that he is pointing out has actually completely changed the online conversation in the internet, right? It has changed the tone of it.

It has changed the factions that are ideologically winning within it. And I really want to go into how this happened. Like, like how things are changing [00:03:00] because of V tubers. And it, and it comes fundamentally down Tomic golds. Observation. So to not extract too much. If you go back and we go to the preview tubing days of the online, right?

So we’ve gotta first talk about a bit about the online, right? We have one history on how the online right. Evolved from edgy atheist, which is weird, but it did it, it originally started as the skeptic community, if you go back to like, when I was a kid, right? And some. Online YouTubers, like literally you see their career evolve through each of these phases of the online run.

Back then it was not right-leaning at all. No, no. These people got tired of dunking on Christians because really there weren’t that much of them. And the arguments, you know, they weren’t as fun, like the gotcha were It gets old, it gets, yeah. It was much more fun to dunk on feminists. Right. And then dunking on feminist turned into Dunking on wokeness which then sorted its way into the, the gamer gate and all of that, and then the [00:04:00] mainstream online.

Right, right now. Right. And, and we point out that this, this is what makes up the new Right. Ideologically this group is obviously going to crash with the legacy, right. Because this is a community that has you know, like. Most of our crusades as the movement was being radicalized into a right wing movement, were about stuff like des censoring sexy female video game characters and stuff like that, right?

Like arguing against bad faith, against too much violence online and stuff like that, which really is completely the. Opposite perspective of a lot of the Legacy riot, which was like, we need to ban rap music. It’s too violent and ban GTA and and so, oh my gosh. Yeah. And this is where part of the rights inversion came from.

But during this period, you did not have that mini female influencers within this movement with the probably biggest [00:05:00] female influencer in this movement being. A socialist. And here I’m speaking of course, of shoe on head where she is often lumped in as part of this larger ideological movement by her detractors when she is just solidly leftist, like, and, and, and really like tries to remind people like.

Look, I know I said this Trump policy was reasonable. I’m still a socialist. I’m just trying to be sane here. People like I don’t,

Simone Collins: and a Catholic socialist too. She, she made it very clear she was a practicing Catholic again recently.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Yeah. She, yeah, she did say she’s a practicing Catholic. So Catholic and socialist.

Can you get more leftist? Sorry. I know, I just hang, heard a lot. I’m joking. Joking. For people who don’t know, traditionally the Democratic party was seen as the Catholic party. Mm-hmm. Like historical,

Simone Collins: I’m, come on Kennedy, our first Catholic president.

Malcolm Collins: Well, Joe Biden

Simone Collins: Biden Catholic. Yeah, totally.

Malcolm Collins: And, and not just that, but if you look at voting lines, [00:06:00] historically, they were really tied to the percent Catholic a district was. Even today, if you look at US states and districts by percent Catholic now this isn’t to say that Catholics overwhelmingly vote Democrat anymore. I think in the last election was the first election where they voted conservative.

Overwhelmingly interesting. Well not overwhelmingly by, by a small margin, but yeah. But she continue here. I,

Simone Collins: yes.

Malcolm Collins: Don’t, don’t wanna get on too much of a but the few influencers we did have in the Wright who were women had the number one hallmark of beauty which a lot of people are like I I, this reminds me of a time I went with Simone.

She doesn’t believe me because I’m like, Simone, you’re actually extremely attractive for your age. And many of the times when you think someone is more attractive than you they are just younger. And the night where I think I really broke you on this is we were at a club and you had to have an ex on your hand if you were under drinking age.

Yeah. And I was like, look around the club and find anyone you [00:07:00] think is more attractive than you. And then check if they have an ex on their hand. Yeah. And so you’d, you’d look around and every single time they had an ex on their hand, like they weren’t just a little bit younger than you they were significantly, significantly under younger than you.

Simone Collins: Yeah. There was also that time we were sharing a table at a dinner, like at a restaurant, and there were three people sitting right next to us. And I thought that they were a group of friends and like just two less attractive ones, and then one attractive woman. Yeah, and it just turned out that it was parents and their teenage daughter, and I thought she was like 25.

But no. Yeah,

Malcolm Collins: gen Z looks old today

Simone Collins: too. Yeah, she was like 16 years old and I thought she was like. God.

Malcolm Collins: And you know, you as a girl saying this, imagine I as a guy said this about a girl. I saw a girl didn’t realize she was 16 and thought she was hot. No, and it’s actually, this is, guys get in trouble for like the dumbest stuff.

You can’t tell somebody’s age. You really just by looking at them,

Simone Collins: I guess some, some people kind of can, there’s there’s a not to, okay, we’re gonna get right [00:08:00] back on track after this. But there’s this reality TV show that I think Netflix recently produced where people date, but they’re not allowed to say how.

Old they are, and then they end up coupling and then they reveal their age. And there are some people who are very easy to guess and other people where it’s like, Nope, he was 60. So yeah. It’s, it’s, it’s really difficult. It’s really difficult.

Malcolm Collins: That is wild. Okay. But I think our ages are hard to guess for people.

I think a lot of our fans

Simone Collins: chime into the comments. Chime into the comments. What’s your guest?

Malcolm Collins: What’s your guess? And then you can Google it, but I, I, I think our,

Simone Collins: yeah, it’s on our Wikipedia page. Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: Probably get our ages wrong by I, I, they might get it from context clues because I’ll talk about, like, shows from my childhood or something like that.

Simone Collins: Yeah. And

Malcolm Collins: they’ll be like. Malcolm, you are not old enough to have watched those shows. Well,

Simone Collins: and if you’re aware that like there were online atheists, for example, I feel like that’s kind of a tell.

Malcolm Collins: Oh yeah. It sort of giving that away with that community mm-hmm. Because that’s, that’s quite an old community.

The internet skeptic community.

Simone Collins: Yeah. Seriously. That, that super ages you. [00:09:00] Anyway, I’m curious. Anyway, back on track.

Malcolm Collins: Back on track.

Simone Collins: Yeah, so women, women back when

Malcolm Collins: there big community of like internet edgy kids online who would go in to like argues random s but no. So, what this meant is that the women who.

Rose in, in terms of mental space within the conservative influencer scene historically have been very, very young. A good example of this is somebody like Pearl Davis. Pearl Davis was, I wanna say like

Simone Collins: six, very early twenties when she started. Yeah. Well, yeah. Well, I mean, she’s been trying for a long time, but yeah, when she got big, she was early growing.

Malcolm Collins: She started growing. But yeah, very, very, very young. And, and Shawan had too, when Shawan had grew, she was very young.

Simone Collins: Young.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Oh, she must have been like she, but she’s been around for a long time. But like, when she started to gain in popularity, I want to say she must have been. 18, 19, something like that.

Simone Collins: Well, and Jenny Nicholson was in her early twenties, I think when she first started [00:10:00] getting Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: But Jenny Nicholson is not right wing. Jenny Nicholson complained.

Simone Collins: Oh, we’re talking about right wing women. Oh, I didn’t know right

Malcolm Collins: wing.

Simone Collins: But still Brett, Cooper Young. She, yeah. Brett Cooper.

Malcolm Collins: Cooper was fairly young.

Yeah.

Simone Collins: Was that other blonde be Beth, Allie Stuckey or whatever? Yeah, she’s al she was also

Malcolm Collins: the only right winging female influencer I can think of who isn’t young. And is as big within online spaces. It’s that one who at Heretic Con, she was our she introduced

Simone Collins: us. Oh, the, A comedian? Yeah.

Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: God, what’s her name?

Simone Collins: We’re really, we’re so bad with names. This is so, yeah. And she’s so cool. I was just watching one of her videos. Oh, well we suck.

Malcolm Collins: See if you can find it. Send it to me. ‘cause I, I, I like her content and I actually recommend it to people who like our content. I think she’s very similar in, in theming, editing link.

Simone Collins: She’s in my watch history.

Malcolm Collins: And also she’s someone who I wouldn’t consider an exceptionally beautiful woman who has risen with No,

Simone Collins: she’s pretty, what’s wrong

Malcolm Collins: with her? She’s, no, she’s, she’s attractive. She’s certainly like a normal, but she looks like her age. Well,

Simone Collins: she’s not 25. Yeah. I mean, like, oh, [00:11:00] looks, she probably looks younger than her age.

Who knows how old

Malcolm Collins: she actually is. Looks attractive. But. The point I’m making here is for a long time in conservative spaces women are already at a lower level within conservative spaces, and any woman who was one not young. And keep in mind what young often means, it means that you’re often.

Overly impressionable. Like you haven’t had time to come up with your own ideas yet, so you often end up parroting the ideas that you hear around you. So like, an example of this, right? Like I really like Pearl Davis as a person. I like a lot of her content. And by

Simone Collins: it, it’s British, it, it’s Bridget Fey, PHE,

Malcolm Collins: Bridget

Fetishy,

Simone Collins: a SY.

Malcolm Collins: But yeah, so I like, I like Pearl Davis. But I think anyone who is examining Pearl Davis’s intellectual career with honesty would say that in the beginning of her career, many of her ideas were basically the, [00:12:00] just the ideas that were around her and sort of like the intellectual, edgy, right-leaning circles.

But she was young. You know, this is what you expect from a guy. Or a girl who is at that age, right? Mm-hmm. But guys in the conservative scene have been able to become influencers at any age. Whereas girls, we were selecting for only the young girls, so they weren’t really bringing in a unique female perspective to things.

Right. Second they’re not as intellectually developed and they haven’t had as much time to, to basically cook ideas, right? Yeah. But the reality is, is that if you are online and watching stuff in a traditional context. Guys, don’t click on videos that 45-year-old women make. Okay.

Simone Collins: Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: You, you just don’t, you see a 45-year-old woman most of the time and you’re just gonna be like, Hmm.

Probably not. Like that’s, that’s not like, you see a, a, a hot young girl with some edgy take and you’re like, okay, okay. Yeah, I’ll, I’ll see what she has to say. And so, and, and this is [00:13:00] even talking about people with the genetics to look hot, right? Like not being born in the top. And a lot of guys know how hard this is, right?

Like being looked over by such a huge percentage of women, right? But a lot of guys they’re like, look, it’s not my fault that I was born short. It’s not my fault that I was born looking like this.

Simone Collins: Mm-hmm.

Malcolm Collins: It doesn’t influence my morals. It doesn’t influence my character. I mean, your gene do influence all that.

And some of that stuff can be seen through sort of like phonology and on your face and, okay, yes, yes, yes. Watch our episode. Phonology is back, baby. But, but but, but this is like ai. So look at your face and tell your personality like incredibly accurately.

Simone Collins: Yeah,

Malcolm Collins: but

Simone Collins: well, even your political leanings.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah, yeah, yeah. But it’s not these, so when I, when I say this like. It is a huge chunk, like 95% of women got filtered out of the ability to intellectually participate or have their ideas taken [00:14:00] seriously in the wider conservative scene.

Simone Collins: Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: And then something happened. People have been putting themselves to models for ages, right?

But some geniuses had the idea of making the models that they were putting themselves to hot anime girls. And this was really the hack that blew the doors open where now, and you actually see this. So if you look into leading conservative intellectual influencer women I’d say most of them seem to be between like.

32 and like 48 seems to be the age range. Nice. Which is a lot older than a lot of people think that they are. Right. Because they associate anime with youth, they associate but. They have been able to, and I’ll note that this is also the age of their effing audience. Right. Like Keisha’s audience is guys in their thirties.

Okay. I, I bet you anything, I do not think, for example, [00:15:00] Keisha has a giant youthful audience, right? And, and they’ll often. Reveal this on stream if you, if you, if you watch them right. You know, they, they’ll call themselves like mom. Actually, I think that this has led to a, there’s been a huge explosion in the attraction to older women phenomenon among like Gen Z like being into cougars.

And I think a lot of it comes down to them getting really into v tubers and then. Learning the v tubers real age. Oh, wow. And and, and many v tubers lean into this like one I watched that has like a cockroach girl

avatar. I, I haven’t watched many, I’ve watched like two stream.

Simone Collins: Cute cockroach girl or

Malcolm Collins: what?

Simone Collins: Cute.

Malcolm Collins: Cute. Yeah. Cute. They’re always cute.

Simone Collins: You’re kind of wearing a cockroach vest, honestly, with the antenna.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah.

Simone Collins: Just lemme take those off for the love of God anyway, though.

Malcolm Collins: But she leans into the whole mommy thing. Oh wow. Like audiences that are, I [00:16:00] guess, into that.

Simone Collins: For hundreds of years, young men have been sexually inaugurated by mature women, that this is not new.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Well, maybe what is new is, I, I don’t, I don’t ever think so many young men had parasocial and intellectually admiring relationships of,

Simone Collins: oh, yeah. With, with older women. That is, yeah, that is true.

Malcolm Collins: When I grew up there were you, you, you watch shows online and you might get like a Bill Nye like figure Right.

But you didn’t have an equivalent female figure, right? Like,

Simone Collins: well, most older age mentorship is, is same sex within religions and even just in, in mainstream culture with like Big Brothers, big sisters programs.

Malcolm Collins: But female hosts who, like when I was growing up they might be paired with a 30, 40-year-old guy, but the, the female host was typically late twenties to early twenties.

Totally. And I think people didn’t realize that that’s what they were [00:17:00] seeing. Yeah. And this has a lot of effects on the entire community. First effect that it has is that. Well, and also I’ll note here when this really. Exploded, I think, into the mainstream conservative scene was the Anna Valence controversy, which we did some really interesting episodes on.

This was a woman who decided that she was gonna counsel Kirsha and Leaflet. And it blew up on, on her and she had the most crazy life. Like she has a detailed substack about her life that we go over in the life of a Cina Byte episode. And it’s like, wow. Like this is not like a. What’s going on here?

Right. But, but the point being is that well, hold on. Before I get to this point, I, I do wanna point out this hack of hot female avatar. Really opening the stage to the types of people who can, who can influence the space. Arguably the number one.

V [00:18:00] Tuber I, I think Hollow Live is bigger right now.

Is neurotrauma, and Neurotrauma is an AI anime girl child who’s run by a guy one of the leading female. Archetype V tubers in the online right space is Revs desu, which is a guy that doesn’t even use a voice changer. By the way, people have asked why he does a little Vampire girl is his character.

He is like, because that’s something I like to look at, right?

Simone Collins: Oh yeah. I like a lot of guys play female avatars and games. ‘cause you,

Malcolm Collins: yeah, no, I wanna look at a dude, female avatars in video games. Like, like hugely prefer to play fi don avatars and video games. ‘cause I wa I don’t wanna look at some burly guy for 20 hours.

Yeah. I find that off putting.

Simone Collins: What disturbs me about him so much is that his voice sounds way too much like the voice of the guy in Clownfish tv, and so I just confuse them and it,

Malcolm Collins: Simone has a, yeah, Simone has a conspiracy that Clownfish tv and Rich says Desi is the same guy.

Simone Collins: They’re [00:19:00] definitely, definitely different.

No, I, I, yeah. I believed it for a while. I listened enough to be like, nah, they’re slightly different, but they’re too close for me. It just still throws me off. Now I can’t listen to either of them. Just sad.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Also, by the way, clownfish tv, just to put a a, a mark on another conservative influencer channel is quite interesting to me.

In that one. They’re one of the only other like. Good relationship couples I know that do channels together other than us two. They live in Pennsylvania, so I would love to CoLab with them at some point.

Simone Collins: Oh my God.

Malcolm Collins: But they live near

Simone Collins: own. Let’s go to a theme park with them.

Malcolm Collins: They live near Pittsburgh, so that’s like on the other side of the moon in in Pennsylvania terms.

But the, the other interesting thing is, is they’ve sort of risen more recently and they represent again, I think a faction of conservatism that just didn’t exist before. Like, they’re, they’re new on the conservative side. I don’t even think that they admit that they are Republicans yet. Like the recently he was like, well, I’m not gonna talk about what my politics are, because I think he still, and, and they talk about seeing themselves as like [00:20:00] hardcore democrats, even if you go like 10 years ago, right?

Mm-hmm. So they definitely are part of like this, this new. Faction. But anyway I, I wanted to point that out, that this hack isn’t just available to women, and we don’t even know how many of these v tubers are like if they haven’t had an accidental face reveal, how many of them are men using voice changers?

So that’s also an important thing

Simone Collins: to Yeah. Well, but what about the as she, one had puts it the blue Jew knucks. He’s not a, a hot anime girl.

Malcolm Collins: Oh. Oh. He is not a hot anime girl, and I don’t think he needs his avatar. But what I have heard is Knucks, when he doesn’t use his avatar, is not as bold or interesting, aggressive, or as jocular.

You know, like his character’s like super in your face. And I think that so kind puts him in character behind that.

Simone Collins: Yeah. Like, it’s good. It, it’s necessary for him as a psychological mechanism, not the audience.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. The other thing to note that helped women get into VT tubing [00:21:00] is that, that otherwise wouldn’t, that otherwise wouldn’t have had their voices is girls are shyer than guys are on average, they are more sensitive to public judgment and people judge girls on their looks very aggressively

Simone Collins: so well, and, and it hurts them more.

You touched

on

Malcolm Collins: and it person been psychologically more.

Simone Collins: Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: So, even girls who otherwise would come across as perfectly fine, right? Like maybe even in the top five, 10% of women. Right. That they can still be filtered out because they psychologically cannot deal with the heat of being in front of people.

Yeah. Leaflet probably falls into this category. She’s a very, like, if, if you’ve see her streams, she’s somebody who really lets things get to her. I think a lot more than like as, as somebody who considers her a friend than I would like her to. Right. But I could see her being very [00:22:00] sensitive about a bunch of people constantly judging her.

Right. And being able to put on a mask every time you get on screen as, as, as UL said, it’s like. Makeup, but like up to 11, right? You know, helps her interact with the community without needing to worry about judgment of anything other than her character and her ideas. And, and that’s important to note in conservative communities.

A woman goes up there and she has says, some idea that’s uncomfortable to you, or some idea you don’t like this may not be for you, but for. A chunk of the, of the conservative community, the initial reaction is to criticize her looks.

Simone Collins: Yeah,

Malcolm Collins: it really is. Like, we can say, we can say all we want about women bad but this is something that just happens. They, they’ll criticize her looks, they’ll criticize who she slept with last, they’ll criticize, you know, like, and, and not that somebody shouldn’t be accountable for their sexual history but that doesn’t necessarily inform their ideas, right? Mm-hmm. But this is something that, that girl [00:23:00] influencers get, boy influencers don’t get, right?

So it’s another thing that was filtering them out. So what has been able to happen? Largely because Anna Vallens pushed a number of female v tubers into the cultural center of the conservative wing.

Speaker: This is actually a fascinating phenomenon with the right, , where especially the new, right, like the internet, right, where we sort of determine who we trust and who we consider. Like, okay, you can, you can influence this community by how much progressives crash out about them. Like, , Scott Alexander, , late Star Codex becoming like a mainstream intellectual who, like right wing people often cite, , these days.

, Really that’s, that’s weird because I, I don’t think he considers himself right leaning. , But the New York Times crashes out about him and people are like, okay, okay. There might be something to this. The New York Times thinks this guy is the demon. Okay. , Or, , the, the, the Keisha leaflet, et cetera situation.

I think a lot of people [00:24:00] saw the anime v YouTuber, conservative influencer types. With a lot of suspicion before the crash out happened and after the crash out, I was like, oh, okay. They’re chill. They’re chill. They, they angered them enough.

Ref said desu is a bit the same way. I mean, a guy who does streams as a little anime girl, , people you think they, they, it’d be more, I think at the beginning people were more suspicious about that, but enough leftists have crashed out about him that mainstream, , within the, at least the online right?

People are just like, oh yeah, rev says desu. Yeah. He’s the mainstream member of the community.

Malcolm Collins: A lot of them dress like foxes. I’ve gotta be like, there’s like four Fox girls.

Speaker 2: , a flaming paradox, a spectacle like intellectual over sexual, but we wanna keep it respectable. I let the flame I was given, what does the fox say? Nothing fake.

Malcolm Collins: She

Simone Collins: doctors are cute.

Malcolm Collins: Brat. What is his name? Sky Brows, [00:25:00] sky Brows did a new anime video called Fox U or something.

Simone Collins: Oh my gosh, I have to watch it.

Okay.

Malcolm Collins: It’s one of my favorite songs and it’s about Fox Girl VT tubers. Oh. I think because everybody who knows Sky Brow videos mostly focus on cultural. Conservative cultural influencers.

And the fact that he was able to put together an entire video just on Fox Girl v tubers shows how big this phenomenon is of conservative, furry influencers. I, I know we can say that Che is not a furry influencer, but I mean, she technically is, also intellectually, an interesting thing about this community is they rarely play into a character for their VT tubing.

What I mean by this is, is ish’s. Like what? When I think Ish’s character as a v tuber I think Bostonian grew up lower middle class because of her accent that she always goes into irish is my assumption [00:26:00] because I guess I’m racist against Bostonians. I do not think Fox Girl, like her being a Fox girl, like never comes up.

In leaflets videos, for example, leaflets character is a slime girl, right? Literally not even in my remotely evoked

Simone Collins: kymera of a slime girl and hey, so,

Malcolm Collins: yeah.

Simone Collins: Fair.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Which is to say that, but it doesn’t come up for her. Like when I think leaflet, I think, you know, somebody who’s very warm and caring and very interested in what’s actually true in a way that is still sort of kind, which is interesting that, that’s like her thing as a conservative influencer, right?

But so the c but this isn’t true of like normal VT tubers. By the way. A lot of VT tubers actually play into their characters a lot. Why this didn’t happen in the conservative intellectual scene? Fricking heck, if I know, maybe they just forgot, maybe they vtu so much. They forget that they’re supposed to be doing a, an in character thing, or maybe they’ve sort of dropped being in character, right?

[00:27:00] Because the point for them is, well, now I can be in a world where my ideas. Really win on their own because you don’t really win on models anymore in v tubing. You buy some big expensive rig that’s not gonna get you a lot of views. It’s your, your ideas and your personality, which is gonna get you views.

Simone Collins: Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: But what this has essentially done is introduced a female intellectual perspective into the generator, which is the internet of emerging right wing culture. And it has placed a huge finger on which faction those women happen to be in, of the various factions of the right. As we pointed out, there’s obviously the, the rights old guard.

There’s the gr well, the groupers who are really basically leftists at this point, they, they never vote, right? But they’re sort of, but they’re, they’re notable for a number of things, right? They’re typically far more critical of Israel. They’re [00:28:00] far more likely to be deontologists. They’re far more likely to be pro censorship.

They’re far more likely to not like nerdy hobbies, like anime and video games and stuff like that. And they, and they are a meaningful faction of the right the, the griper adjacent, right? This, this deontologist anti-Israel anti nerd stuff. You know, like your Matt Walsh would probably an example of a more mainstream one like that where he crashes out about stuff like anime.

And

Simone Collins: does he, he doesn’t like anime.

Malcolm Collins: Oh yeah. Yeah. He has multiple crash outs about how anime is like destroying the country and how, you know, like, Lord right. That like, what? It’s like it, it gives me the ick, if I’m gonna be honest, like, you know, I didn’t like anime. I don’t need to like be criticizing other people.

He sees it as like un-American and I’m like, Hollywood is un-American. Anime is one of the last places where I can watch a show that’s not filled with woke messaging some of the time. Right. But the [00:29:00] nature of VT tubing, that this is the type of girl who is open to presenting herself to the world as an anime girl or as a literal furry, like kirsha or something like that, right?

Like, or the other dozen conservative fox girls. God, I can’t remember. There’s another one that I quite like, but I can’t remember her name. She’s the one with a, she’s got like a blue bow or something. I don’t know, a white hair I wanna say. Anyway these other ones they are intrinsically. Not going to be in that faction.

They are in the post gamer gate faction. This is a faction that is used to fighting censorship. It, it might be like, oh, furries are weird, but like, I’m not gonna like go outta my way to attack somebody for being a furry like, and obviously you’re not, if you are. If your core presentation to the world is as a fox girl or a slime girl, you’re not gonna go on a 10 minute rant about why everybody who watches anime is bad or why [00:30:00] deontological value systems are go, I don’t know why these things.

Well, actually, this is actually interesting. Why do these things pair so much? Why is it that the deontologists pair so much with the people who are pro censorship?

Simone Collins: Hmm.

Malcolm Collins: I think the answer is that they well,

Simone Collins: I think censors that censorship only performatively addresses sin and deontologists care more about the performance of the,

Speaker 5: This actually aligns with their views on things like race as well. Whereas we point out that they’re trying to sow divisions within the Republican party over things like race. Or religion are stupid because we wouldn’t be able to build up enough of a base to win elections if we alienate those people.

A lot of these people want to be able to put the blame [00:31:00] because they don’t want to take responsibility from it as a community to themselves on some external groups. So they choose some group like Jews, and they’re like, Jews are the ones that are spreading all of this. And it’s like, it’s clearly not the case.

If you look at, , just the, the reality of the situation, it is mostly white women. , It is white. Upper class women who are spreading this and who are the ring leaders of this? It is now some external group. It is coming from inside the house.

And they’re like, well, if all white people voted like me, then we could build up enough of a base. And it’s like, yeah, but the problem , is the majority of white people. Are against our goals., I mean, this is just the reality of it. And yet we can find, Hispanic people. Over 50% of, , Hispanic men in the last election voted for Trump.

We can find huge chunks of black people we can find. Huge chunks of Jewish people

And yes, huge chunks of Indian people.

who are interested in our goals. And so, , I I, [00:32:00] if you play in this fantasy world where you can get all white people to agree with you, sure. But that’s not the world we actually live in. And we live in a world where we actually want to win elections and where we actually want to push back on the existential threat, the urban monoculture plays.

And functionally, if you are concerned about declining white populations,

Speaker 9: Which by the way. Isn’t actually happening. , White people have a higher fertility rate than almost any other ethnic group, , when you control for income. And so, , like for example, the United States, they have a much higher fertility rate than the black population. , But, , , so the only way in which they’re being quote unquote outbred.

Is if you go to places like Africa where there’s desperate poverty or some places in the Middle East where there’s desperate poverty, but even if you do conceptually care, like you’re like, well, even though they have a high fertility rate, I want their fertility rate to be higher. I want them to be a higher proportion of the world’s population.

I.

the [00:33:00] only way to handle that, it doesn’t matter where they live, it’s, it is having kids, right? If we are like Korea and we have virtually no immigration, , but we have a extremely low fertility rate. , We’ve done nothing like even, even if all you care about is increasing the white population, you’ve literally done nothing.

You’ve done nothing that can happen, have a chance of mattering in the long term.

And yet almost all of the leaders of this movement have no children. , And they often push their followers to not form relationships because I think they realize that white women are the source of the problem. And so they’re like, well, of course you don’t wanna, you wanna have white kids, but you don’t wanna get in a relationship with a white woman.

And so, uh, will just pretend that we’re trying to actually fix things.

And if you try to blow up coalitions where you won’t even side with somebody like JD Vance, who is both Catholic and anti-Iran war, and you’re just like, he’s the devil, yet, he’s. As close to your position as there could be a mainstream figure, just because he’s in an [00:34:00] interracial relationship.

or because he’s friends with gay people, like friends with Peter Thiel. Well then you, you’ve created a, a coalition that simply cannot win elections. And this is what we mean by it’s a performative, , coalition. Not a coalition that’s actually designed to advanced the aims. They, from a consequentialist perspective, pretend they’re trying to advance.

Malcolm Collins: yeah.

Simone Collins: TA

Malcolm Collins: comment in a recent video, ‘cause I was talking about, you know, how you need to learn to make yourself immune to the sirens, not hide from the sirens because they are so ubiquitous in our environment right now. The, the, the calls to sin all around us. Mm-hmm. And not, you know, overly freak out about like this.

Random arousal pattern or that random arousal pattern, and somebody’s like, oh, I don’t know. There’s some really deranged stuff online. And that I think Malcolm’s just trying to like wipe competitors out of the gene pool. What, what is it like mate blocking or something, right? And it’s like, [00:35:00] no, like I’m just being consequentialist.

The reality is, is that if you get to an extent where it interferes with your life. Tripped up by the online environment of today, which you know, doesn’t even have what your children will be fighting against, which is, you know, fully lifelike, animated in real time, the most beautiful woman they’ve ever seen.

Right. That’s reacting just to them. There’s no way your genes are gonna make it for two or three more generations. Right? Like, I could, I could try my best. Like I understand that there’s genetic variance in humanity and you just because I am not like tempted outta my mind by something doesn’t mean that somebody else isn’t.

Mm-hmm. But there’s just no way. There’s no way obviously the, what, what you can do to resist this stuff is Naltrexone, right? Like naltrexone plus the Sinclair method with like, if you are feel. Overly called to a sin to [00:36:00] an extent that it is taking up all your time or destroying your life or leading you down a pathway that is like really messing with you.

Naltrexone can help with that. Right? And it’s, it’s also got positive side effects too. And you can get it fairly inexpensively from countries like India and stuff like this. So it’s like. You know, there, there are alternatives. But banning is, is, is not a very good one because as I’ve said before, as soon as you ban, then VPNs are on the table, banning VPNs are on the table.

And when, when you ban VPNs, then the government controls your thought. And what you can say and do. And the UK is already seeing this you know, be tabled because they allowed. These parts of their right to gain so much power that they were able to work with the left to ban this stuff. They’re like, oh, well, you know, everyone can agree that any form of pornography where it looks like somebody being hurt should be banned.

And so then they ban all of that and it’s like, oh, well now we need to ban VPNs because they don’t, they don’t care about actual violence. I mean, look, look at, look at the UK right now, right? It’s an actual hellscape right now.

Simone Collins: Terrify.

Malcolm Collins: But what this [00:37:00] means is this like post gamer gate faction, the nerd right, is gaining disproportionate dominance because of more than they, than they otherwise structurally would because there isn’t the same outlet for the other side of the right to gain eyes through this hack.

What’s interesting is, is it’s not like there aren’t v tubers in this other side of the world. One that I watch occasionally dresses up and he is, he is not even like that. I, he’s never said anything that I disagreed with, but I assume that he’s part of the deontologist affection of the right, because he dresses up as like a, a, a.

Knight was like a Red Cross, like a crusader, and he like bounces on screen. He does like different like crusader outfits and stuff. Not, not a full V YouTuber thing, but a I like his channel. Like it’s important to note that there’s a number of people in the more deontological faction of the right who I still quite like in terms of content producers and agree with.

Another [00:38:00] one would be redeem Zoomer I think is in this faction and I quite like his content. Static in the attic. He’s even in the anti-Israel faction, right. And he, he produces quite good content. So like, obviously our factions can get along. I think a lot of people in that faction watch our episodes and, and, and get something from it.

But like we, we, we still realize that our goals for where the right is going, are at odds, like we’re, we’re, we’re clearly on the same team. But we have different visions for where we want this team to go in the long term and what sort of policy we wanna see on the books. And that the right is becoming the party of the nerd at, at sort of its core is in part driven by v tubing, unlocking, becoming an influencer for a very specific type of person.

Simone Collins: Hmm.

Malcolm Collins: And, and that’s the person who’s done it. Like if you look at, this is the other thing about the V tubers who have come [00:39:00] onto the scene through this avenue. Just to, to highlight the two that valence tried to cancel cure she and leaflet. Keisha’s content is some of the densest in like, like a deepest research that you get on the right.

She, I don’t know if you, have you ever watched her content, Simone?

Simone Collins: No, not really.

Malcolm Collins: So she, she does like two and a half hours where she will take a topic and like try to pull up all of the receipts to try to find like, okay, where does this rope go? Like, how, how deep does the like, she’s where I first learned about like Joe Money or something like that.

Like what is all of the things that John Money did? How did this get covered up? How did this, for people who don’t know, this is a guy who invented the, the concept of gender and transness more broadly in a modern context. Who did these horrifying experiments on children? Genuinely horrifying. Watch your episode if you care to learn more about that.

Yeah. But like, so she’ll dig really deep on something like that. Or, or, or look for receipt. Sort of like a nick, you know, this [00:40:00] young investigative guy, but like, Nick, surely. A bit before that. I mean, that requires a nerd to be into doing leaflets. Core thing that I think that she’s like most known for is trying to be as genuinely warm, empathetic, and open into whatever topic that she’s covering.

And that

Simone Collins: well also not taking, she doesn’t fall for anything. She

Malcolm Collins: doesn’t for anything either. She’s, she’s open without being what’s the word I’m looking like, foolish about it, right? Mm-hmm. But it is a, it is a female perspective that she takes. You could not emulate leaflets perspective, at least within right wing spaces as a guy.

Probably.

Simone Collins: So what you’re saying is that because basically intellectually mature women have unlocked access to a platform online, they’ve shifted the Overton window of the right. Is that the gist of your argument?

Malcolm Collins: Well, they’re securing a shift in the Overton window of the right that was already happening.

Mm-hmm. So much of the new right came out of, because remember, I, they, [00:41:00] I, part of the pathway that led to it was hating on feminists. Is I sometimes call it like the red pill diaspora, right? Like, when the red pill collapsed and Reddit, shadow banded and everything like that, a lot of the influencers from that space, a lot of the pickup artists and stuff like that they went out there and they became well right wing intellectual influencers.

And that would’ve pushed like, there, there is very little intellectual overlap between anything that Kirsha and leaflet do with what a pickup artist influencer does, right? Like these are two different, they, they wouldn’t have been in that world at all. They wouldn’t have found that interesting.

They wouldn’t have tried to be a female version of that or try to be and yet. It’s the former fans of these pickup artists, influencers who are now being influenced by pure football, like Kyia and Leaflet, which changes the intellectual character [00:42:00] of the modern. Right. And what’s really interesting is that doesn’t, in a way.

Where you don’t see as much of an equivalent on the left and the left, you have a bunch of female and trans influencers. In terms of male influencers that approach things from a masculine perspective, the only one I can think of is Hassan.

Simone Collins: Interesting. Yeah. Yeah. I guess I could see that.

Malcolm Collins: And has someone’s completely disingenuous and, and cruel, you know, like the dog shocking thing and everything like that.

So I, I think that he, he, he’d literally just a thra influencer.

Simone Collins: I don’t know. I, I, I mean that would be true if the majority of his audience is female. And I, I haven’t ever looked into the composition of his audience.

Malcolm Collins: Oh, it’s definitely majority female.

Simone Collins: It is,

Malcolm Collins: yeah.

Simone Collins: I, I guess I would’ve thought, ‘cause I, I watch a ton of left focused or [00:43:00] politically affiliated YouTubers who have 90 plus percent female audiences, if not like 98% female audiences.

And

Malcolm Collins: do you watch any male YouTubers who have 90 plus percent female audiences? Yes. Because

Simone Collins: that’s absolutely, absolutely. Which,

Malcolm Collins: who are you thinking of?

Simone Collins: I mean a bunch. Philip DeFranco’s, probably the most well known one. I watch his news recaps to get an understanding of what the leftist default takes to, like, whatever’s happening might be.

Yeah, Hassan is different and I don’t, I don’t personally see how he appeals to. Female audiences. So if there is anyone who’s female and leftist and watching them, not that I imagine them to be here. Please explain this to me. If this is a thing in the

Malcolm Collins: comment. No, like, actually send us an email because we might miss it if it’s in the comments.

Like, I’d actually be interested to know why somebody would watch Hasan. Like I’ve tried his streams and they’re really boring.

Simone Collins: Well, I, I mean, I think for the same reason why I struggle sometimes with streams of just pearly [00:44:00] things, there’s a lot of dead space. There’s a lot of just mental fatigue experienced by the streamer that you weirdly don’t see with asman gold.

Like he’s got a lot of mental endurance to be able to keep even on.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Osmond gold never streams fatigued. He, he does have, well, you know, where he built that mental endurance was the like 10 hour Wow. Raids.

Simone Collins: Wow. Yeah. Yeah. That’s it.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. I, I, I think I’m thinking here of like destiny. Like destiny.

I’ve listened to some of his content and he at least appears to be trying to be intellectually serious. Like yeah. Hassan doesn’t appear to be attempting to tell the truth. He’s just literally, yeah,

Simone Collins: no, and also just Hassan and and Hannah Pearl Davis have dead air. Whereas I haven’t really seen that with Destiny.

I haven’t really seen that with Nick Fuentes. I haven’t really seen that with ASM Gold, maybe in their live streams, you know, ‘cause we, we typically view cut down versions. Yeah. Post of their content, post they show up. But

Malcolm Collins: Hannah Pearl, David Pearl, Hannah Pearl Davis has dead air in her streams, but not on her show.

Her show because her show’s like [00:45:00] five people or whatever, you know, when she does it, that helps. But subscriber, by the way, she’s the subscriber verse, so who knows if she’s watching this? But you’re always welcome to come on the show, by the way. If you, if you ever wanna come on, we, we’d love to have you.

We lost a way to contact you when you got kicked off of Instagram. So sorry about that. But anyway what was it, what was the final point I wanted to make here? Because I thought it was interesting. , It’s been a, a fascinating change in, in the right and it has really consolidated the, the nerd gamer Gate faction.

Simone Collins: I’m

Malcolm Collins: for it, and it really helps us like it. G guys, I knew you could be like, oh, we don’t want all this f female energy, like in our spaces and stuff like that.

We don’t want all this nerd energy, right? Like, okay, first of all, the nerds have the future. Okay. Secondly, women watch this stuff too. You don’t want women, right wing women to be influenced, to be nerdier. Right? And finally, we to win on elections, we have to win with both men and women, right?

Simone Collins: Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: Being able to [00:46:00] moderate the rights, energy and ideas to not be reflexively anti-woman is something that is going to benefit the right woman. And, and I like that you, you know, you helped me do that on this stream, right? Like this is I don’t know how much of our influencers watch other women.

Simone Collins: Yeah, I don’t know either. I, I would be curious to know,

Malcolm Collins: do you have any thoughts on this, Simone, before we wrap it up?

Simone Collins: I think it’s a great development. I, I think that, yeah. There, there are a lot of just visual elements of people that I think. Unfairly disqualify them from being taken seriously. And that happens more to women than to men.

Which is, you know, un unfortunate because I think that there are women out there who have interesting things to say, so this is good,

Malcolm Collins: but you had nothing interesting to say. No, you don’t. It’s single, like unique take on this. Come on, you gotta have.

Simone Collins: I don’t really see what your point is aside from, because women now could [00:47:00] be on the internet behind a mask.

They are able to move the Overton window of, of discourse on the right. Like, okay. I, I, am I missing something beyond that? I, I

Malcolm Collins: just, well, they, they, one are able to move the Overton window of discourse on the right. To make right. A genuinely two gender space, which it really wasn’t for a while. That’s a huge change.

Simone Collins: I disagree. I mean, like half the Fox News commentators have always been

Malcolm Collins: hot women. Oh, they didn’t really, Fox News didn’t have ideas. Like Fox News was just parroting whatever corporate talking point they were supposed to be talking about that day, that wasn’t actually hearing a woman’s perspective.

Simone Collins: Are you saying that like.

Because there were people like Tucker Carlson and Alex Jones who would say out there wild things that sparked conversation. And there just weren’t female versions of that. There weren’t women being like, ah, I’m gonna say something crazy

Malcolm Collins: now. Yeah, your random Alex Jones fan didn’t have some woman that, like, all, all of them would be like, oh yeah, I also listened to her ideas.

[00:48:00] Right. Whereas the, you know, if, if you look at like, but

Simone Collins: art. Are they saying really out there? Things that are, are changing the discourse.

Malcolm Collins: What,

Simone Collins: I guess Yeah, they are, I guess.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah, they are. No, Keisha often starts like because she does the initial research, she often starts things that then become like a viral thing that everyone’s covering.

Simone Collins: Right. That they’re calling attention to new, to new issues that

Malcolm Collins: otherwise she’s sort of a top of the pipeline content creator which trickles down through the rest of the pipeline. Mm-hmm. So she, she does specifically significantly influence what’s, what’s being talked about. But then the second point I’m making is that they also were sort of forced disproportionately into one faction of the right.

Which

Malcolm Collins: changes how they influence the Right.

Simone Collins: Hmm.

Malcolm Collins: Because if you’re an anime girl, you’re not gonna crash out about why anime guys who watch anime are all losers.

Simone Collins: Yeah. And the religious deontologists aren’t gonna watch you. So they’re not listening to you, you’re not [00:49:00] influencing them. You’re only influencing you different

Malcolm Collins: objections.

No, they might watch you. This is, sorry Simone, you might not know this. Religious people really like anime. There is a specific,

Simone Collins: actually, yeah, thank goodness.

Malcolm Collins: Brand of religious deontology. When I went to like my anime clubs and school and stuff like that, there were always a lot of like conservative, religious, like homeschool kids.

Like, I don’t know what it is about, like this, this thing.

Simone Collins: Good taste perhaps.

Malcolm Collins: Drop in the comments if you’re one of these kids. But that was like a type, the very sheltered, very do good. Very like I don’t swear, I don’t watch rated R things but by God I watch lots of anime.

Simone Collins: Yeah, no, it’s wonderful. It is.

Malcolm Collins: Have fun, Simone. Have a spectacular day and thank you for your time too. Yes, hopefully

Simone Collins: we can. I discovered that I [00:50:00] just needed to somehow, like the permissions had lapsed, so local file saving doesn’t need an app on my Mac. After all that actually, I just needed to go back into my settings and make sure that permissions were like, is that correctly? Yeah. It seems like maybe they, it forgets sometimes or maybe when you like, get the software update, people’s general settings just kind of reset, like that’s.

Malcolm Collins: Well, I, I hate that I’m making the agent feature usable on max for coding, but

Simone Collins: because you, you, you just don’t wanna empower anyone who chooses Apple as their provider.

Malcolm Collins: I don’t know. I do not. I do not.

Simone Collins: They

Malcolm Collins: deserve, every time I have

Simone Collins: this Malcolm, they’re pretty okay. Rejection of Apple is, is a rejection of shallow people everywhere, including your own wife.

Malcolm Collins: Why you still use an Apple computer?

Simone Collins: Because it’s pretty. Because it’s pretty

Malcolm Collins: really why.

Simone Collins: Yes. [00:51:00] Malcolm. I, I, I also like the, the haptics. I like, I, I like the textile, the, the tactile experience of it. I, I like the smoothness of I mean, give it time, right? Like I wasn’t a really big fan of Samsung phones after I got rid of my iPhone.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah.

Simone Collins: But then as soon as I discovered the pixel, I was like, okay, done.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah, because they actually focus on like haptics and experience

Simone Collins: it. Yeah. It’s a good, it’s a good user experience. It’s a good, yeah. I, I do like the haptics of, of pixels and I, of course, being a heavy Google user, just like that integration.

It’s so nice. It’s so nice.

Malcolm Collins: Oh my, I mean, Apple’s future is, is I think quite. At this point?

Simone Collins: No, I think it’s, I think they’re taking a very smart approach.

Malcolm Collins: Smart integrated home concept is a good idea.

Simone Collins: Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: If they pull it off,

Simone Collins: I think they’ll pull it off. And they’re very good at locking people in to, I, I think they discovered [00:52:00] the power of producing really great individual products.

That only really work if you buy into the whole suite. For example, consider the air tag. I do not know of a single other product in terms of like good location. I mean, obviously there’s a tile, but the tile doesn’t even come close to the air tag. In terms of utility, I don’t think we can use air tags without an iPhone, at least last time I checked because your mom had a bunch and they’re super, super useful.

They’re, they’re quite granular in their tracking abilities and. I was like, oh my God, this is great. We finally have air tags. We can put them in our kids’ shoes. ‘cause that’s what a lot of parents do. Like boujee parents, they cut into their kids’ shoes under their soles and they put air tags in there to track them if they like run off at a theme park or something.

And I discovered you have to have an iPhone for them to work. Same with when they first came out, they were like pretty good for smart watches. The Apple [00:53:00] Watch. Only works if you have an iPhone. You can’t use it if you only have a Mac.

Malcolm Collins: I’ve tried.

Simone Collins: So they’re gonna come out with some really cool, smart home devices.

Malcolm Collins: Actually, you gave me an idea for a product I wanna make for our fab next.

Simone Collins: Oh.

Malcolm Collins: Because I’m sort of surprised that nobody seems to offer this right now and it’s something that I want.

Simone Collins: Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: Which the Alexa and Google speakers we have throughout our house that we use constantly, right? Yes. Theis on them are kind of retarded.

I think, think it’d

Simone Collins: be they’re better than they used to be.

Malcolm Collins: They’re better than they used to be, but they’re basically retarded compared to Realis. I think it would be fun to see if I can get a speaker that just connects to our backend system and lets people choose from any cutting edge mainline AI model to be the responder to them.

And

Simone Collins: to give it, well, it’d be cool if there could be an R Fab integration where you can just have your agent be able to use. Yeah,

Malcolm Collins: that’s the idea. You have your agent or your companion be respond to you through the speaker.

Simone Collins: It’s gonna be like that smart house in Eureka, [00:54:00] the show Eureka. Started getting passive aggressive with him.

I loved it. I loved that house.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. That’s a great, Eureka was a great show, actually. Yeah. Really.

Simone Collins: No, no, I love, I love Eureka. This is why we actually, when we tried to create a city, we called it Project Eureka. No, we

Malcolm Collins: called it Project Eureka. Actually, if you’re watching this show and you’re like, I’m out of backlog things to watch you can find Eureka for free somewhere.

It is old as balls. And it is actually a, a really close, it’s.

Simone Collins: It’s, it’s unmoored from time enough because it’s kind of about this isolated science town inspired by the idea of that like government,

Malcolm Collins: the Alamos or whatever, Los Alamos

Simone Collins: maybe, no, I think it was

Malcolm Collins: where everybody’s working on like science experiments all the time and, and trying to build

Simone Collins: Yeah.

Everyone’s a genius, but like full families live there. It’s Oh, oh, I, I knew that,

Malcolm Collins: It, it, it [00:55:00] was made during that period where you could have a diverse cast that didn’t feel of like aggressively woke.

Simone Collins: It was just like, oh, they’re people, and they’re different sometimes instead of like, oh, you’re the, you’re part of a quota.

Malcolm Collins: Okay. But yeah, it was it, it was good. And it’s got like nine seasons or something, or like 10 seasons. Yeah. That’s plenty not,

yeah.

Simone Collins: Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: Oh, and for

Simone Collins: dinner, Stargate first. Stargate first. For,

Malcolm Collins: for D Stargate first. Oh no. Well, so the problem is trying to get people into Stargate SG one. Yeah. Is season one for like the first two to three episodes is terrible.

It’s almost,

Simone Collins: well, you’ve did a really good job at like curating it for me. Maybe we just need to create an episode list for people like to start here.

Malcolm Collins: SG one is the best sci-fi show ever made. If you watch it curated, but the problem is that somebody needs to give you a curated list of episodes. Right?

Simone Collins: You need the director’s cut. Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: And, and the first,

Simone Collins: oh yeah. Remember you’d be [00:56:00] like, oh, we’re just gonna skip this entire arc.

Malcolm Collins: The first two episodes, one of the problems is, is they set the scene, but they’re also very bad. Which creates a problem for the show. Like the way they introduced Samantha Carter’s character, Uhhuh, where it’s like a woman.

So everyone expects her to be dumb, but then she’s smart, and I like almost groaned out of my chair, like.

Simone Collins: That’s

Malcolm Collins: come on.

Simone Collins: But it was a different time. Okay. It was also when, like women, they don’t know how to science.

Malcolm Collins: Actually, if I was gonna give people suggestions, even though I think SG one is just strictly a better show I would give, I, I would tell like an average person, watch Farscape before you watch SG one.

Simone Collins: The puppet show. The puppet

Malcolm Collins: show.

Simone Collins: No, I couldn’t tell you. Try, I couldn’t make it through one episode with you.

Malcolm Collins: Really?

Simone Collins: No. Oh my God. It was awful. It was so bad.

Malcolm Collins: They don’t, they don’t look like [00:57:00] puppets.

Simone Collins: They’re Jim Hansen, honest to God.

Malcolm Collins: Animatronic puppet. Yes.

Simone Collins: Yeah. No, this, then I’m not watching the fricking puppet show.

All right. It’s like watching Fraggle Rock. Okay. We’re not doing that.

Malcolm Collins: Then for this, this one needs the most heavy curation. But for most new ideas, I’d suggest Lex which is one I didn’t even try on you.

Simone Collins: Certainly not.

Malcolm Collins: No, it’s, it’s, it’s really, it, it is into like, like raci sexing humor in an amount that can be cringe, but it also has more interesting ideas in it than the other shows.

Mm-hmm. Like, the, like I love the scene where they introduced earth in it at one point. They’re like.

They, they, they go through the classification of the planet and it means a planet that’s a, that’s about to destroy itself. And they’re like, we should just go by like, this is insignificant.

Right? And that’s the way that their, their [00:58:00] AI immediately classifies earth as one of these planets that’s about to be destroyed. It’s

Simone Collins: a flash in the pan. Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: Well, specifically they say that we’re about, this is a

Simone Collins: pilot episode, don’t bother. It’s not gonna get approved.

Malcolm Collins: It doesn’t happen until like season three, that episode or something funny.

So,

Speaker 10: Lex. I order you to use every last bit of juice. You’ve got to blow up that ugly blue planet

Speaker 11: as you command.

Speaker 17: Do you realize what he just did?

Speaker 10: Of course. People on earth were after my man. If not actually, then potentially. So the planet had to be destroyed. Any robot head in my position would’ve done the same

Speaker 14: seven 90. You are so

Speaker 17: evil,

Speaker 10: not evil, just obsessed.

Speaker 17: No, not just obsessed. You are evil,

Malcolm Collins: but truly a bizarre show. If we’re talking about oh one show, I’d really suggest for people another, I’m, I’m just giving suggestions here, sliders, if you’re wanna watch old shows and I haven’t made you watch, watch,

Simone Collins: we didn’t watch sliders together.

Malcolm Collins: Sliders might be easier to get [00:59:00] into than any of the shows that I’ve mentioned as like a first time just sliding in.

Simone Collins: Mm.

Malcolm Collins: It, it’s a show where, and I don’t know why they haven’t made this theme in any other show. Every episode or about every episode takes place in a different timeline on earth. So it’s always the same year in the same location, but they go to like Communist America, they go to America with a woman president.

They go to. That, that’s the one where the Hillary Clinton president cl comes from that a lot of people use when she was running for president. They’re like, oh, Clinton’s president. And it’s like, no, it’s Hillary Clinton. It’s funny. Anyway, I I, I’ll get into it.

Speaker 18: , 28, 29 30. Okay. Octavia, five seconds. Take one. 2, 3, 4, 5. Now suck it off your head. Tighten weight. 1, 2, 3, 2, 4, 5. Go. Go. Everyone can go now.[01:00:00]

Speaker 20: You better

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