Testosterone differences across ethnic groups

In this episode of Based Camp, Simone & Malcolm Collins dive into a fan-submitted hypothesis: Could differences in natural sex drive (and testosterone levels) across ethnic groups explain why some populations produce more “weird” kinks/fetishes (tentacle porn, hentai extremes in Asia; BDSM/dungeons in white/Western circles; vanilla/missionary dominance in Hispanic/Latino groups)?

We break down Pornhub session times (Japan slowest at ~11 min, Mexico fastest), search trends by country (lesbian #1 in West, femboy/trans rising in some places), testosterone data (surprising wins for Hispanic men, modest black > white differences after adjustments, Asians often lowest), Catholic vs Protestant horniness (Catholics report more frequent sex + higher approval of pleasure-only sex), historical seduction styles (European chase vs Imperial Chinese “burrito delivery”), and why extreme fetishes might emerge in lower-arousal groups needing more stimulation.

We also touch on emerging trends like sissy/feminization/NTR porn, racial fetishization concerns, and whether Catholicism harnesses horniness for higher fertility. Data-heavy, assumption-busting, and NSFW — viewer discretion advised!

Episode Transcript

Malcolm Collins: Hello Simone. I’m excited to be here with you today. Today we are gonna be discussing a concept a fan of ours brought up. I heard it and I was like, Hey, that’s interesting. I wanna dig into that, see what the data says. So they were like, when they were younger and they were into like the science of racial differences and stuff like this.

They had remembered seeing a hypothesis. And the hypothesis went like this. If you take ethnic groups and you sort them by how horny they get naturally, right? Like, like how horny is this group? How horny is this girl? How susceptible are they? It typically goes Asians at the bottom, then whites, then Hispanics, then Africans.

And he said, and this is potentially why you see. Higher levels of weird kinks and fetish content within populations, like within the most, being within Asian populations, right? ‘cause this is where Tai and all of that weirdness comes from. And, you know, even tentacle porn going back to like, you know, medieval period and stuff

like the Fisherman’s Wife.

And then you see, you know. More, but not as much in white populations than you see less in Hispanic populations. And then you see very little in black populations.

Simone Collins: Well, and and it was posited in these materials that it was because of differing tech. Testosterone levels, average testosterone levels across these groups.

So if you’ve really high testosterone. Your sex drive is a lot higher. So theoretically in groups it had higher average testosterone. You kind of just need less to get turned on. You’re just ready to go. Whereas if you have very low test testosterone, you’ve gotta like, oh, well the temperature is to be just right in this weird turn on and the blah, blah, blah, blah.

And so maybe that’s why, but I, I don’t know. I don’t do, we have data on differing testosterone levels by. Broad ethnic group or geographical cluster or, I don’t know. I didn’t look into

Malcolm Collins: that.

Simone Collins: Yes, there are some observed differences. In average testosterone levels typically measured as serum total testosterone or free testosterone across broad racial or ethnic population groups. Though the patterns are nuanced, often modest after adjustments. Like BMI, obesity, lifestyle factors, and sometimes inconsistent across studies, large scale US data and metadata analysis provide the most reliable insights, primarily comparing groups like non-Hispanic, black, African ancestry, non-Hispanic, white European ancestry, and Mexican-American, Hispanic to, to a lesser extent Asian groups.

Blah, blah, blah. Key findings, African ancestry versus white European ancestry. Men, many studies note show no significant difference in testosterone after age and other adjustments. So not notable difference. Mexican Americans, Hispanic men, often show the highest total testosterone in US studies. That’s interesting.

So they see the Mexican American men as having the highest testosterone. Asian men tend to have lower levels compared to other groups. In available data. So there’s that.

Malcolm Collins: That’s what I found too.

Simone Collins: Okay. Yeah, so, so black men modestly higher free testosterone than white men, east Asian groups lower. But

Malcolm Collins: Hispanics win.

But this is why this, it’s so interesting. I’m going into this and I’m just keep having my assumptions overturned with things that I assumed, like I would’ve assumed black men had higher testosterone than Hispanics, for example.

Simone Collins: Well, you think when you consider even just the the industries in which you tend to see black people por perform like in various athletic fields, and I, you typically associate being an elite athlete with higher levels of testosterone.

So if a population has a. In general, higher levels of testosterone, you’d expect them to be the ones who sweep at the Olympics, for example, right? Like in the, it’s always the runners, like they tend to be from Africa, et cetera, right? Mm-hmm. Basketball players, but that’s, that’s because of height. Why?

Why are, why are Hispanics not cleaning up? In the Olympics. How come?

Malcolm Collins: Well, I suspect it’s due to genetic different. I know we’re not supposed to talk about this, but it’s not just testosterone that matters. Guess Palo, the, the, the person who,

Simone Collins: oh, do you think it’s the, it insufficient height then? So it’s like height plus testosterone equals athletic prowess.

Malcolm Collins: I don’t know. We’re gonna go over a bunch of different studies here. We’re gonna go into a lot of things. What we’ll come away from from today’s episode

Simone Collins: is actually, well, that actually makes a lot of sense. No, sorry. Because Hispanic equals basically European plus indigenous central and South American groups, and they tend to be on average of shorter stature.

So that makes sense.

Malcolm Collins: The indigenous groups are not the Southern Europeans.

Simone Collins: I know, but the whole point is if you are Hispanic, there’s

Malcolm Collins: really not that much indigenous blood in Hispanic populations, by the way. It’s, it’s, it’s well under 25% in most populations

Simone Collins: varies.

Malcolm Collins: It, it, it does vary, but if we’re talking on average

and I think that this is some weird rug pull that the Le Hispanic, when you see Hispanic Latino knows, are not just

Simone Collins: Europeans.

Malcolm Collins: It basically means Catholic Europeans. That is what Hispanic is. It is Southern Europeans. Southern

Simone Collins: European. Oh

Malcolm Collins: yeah. No, it just is, it is the, the Catholic, European, that is, that is the core differentiator between them and Americans. Right. Like and, and

Simone Collins: I guess the selective pressures are there too. Like Northern European Europeans would have been more comfortable with the North American colonies, which were colder at the time of colonization as well.

Whereas Northern, or sorry, Southern Europeans might get to like New England and be like, Uhuh. This is not gonna work for me.

Malcolm Collins: Well, they were, they were also really, really we’ve got done our episode with the, the perplexing ideology of Nick Es, where we pointed out that they were really hostile to Catholics, the American colonies, the ISTs could vote in less than half the colonies that Jews could.

Simone Collins: Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: And they, it were less than 2% of the population at the time of the revolution.

Simone Collins: Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: Even in Maryland, the Catholic sanctuary state, there were only around 10% of the population,

Simone Collins: me and

Malcolm Collins: Maryland.

Simone Collins: So, oh, yes. In, in New Jersey, New York.

Malcolm Collins: No, but, but, but this is, this is actually important because in another episode I said from my own experience, Catholic girls appear to be hornier than Protestant girls.

Simone Collins: And a bunch of base camp listeners were like, yeah. Confirmed.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. One of ‘em was like, I live in Glasgow, and if you don’t know. Glasgow Glasgow has two pretty distinct genetic populations. One Protestant and one Catholic, and they hate each other. Mm-hmm. So he’d have some understanding of like pure bred Catholic and Protestant girls.

And he is like, yeah, this is very well known in populations that live with these two groups with distinct identities. So it wouldn’t just be talking on my butt. It is apparently a well noticed thing.

Simone Collins: He’s

Malcolm Collins: so fun.

So apparently this has been studied, and again, not talking outta my butt here. , Andrew Green lead’s 1994 analysis on Sex, the Catholic Experience, drawing from GSS data. . I highlighted that , 68% of Catholics report having sex weekly versus only 56 of non-Catholics, 30% had purchased erotic underwear versus only 20% of non-Catholics.

But that’s a pretty big difference. 30% of Catholics, presumably like, oh, religious roofs had purchased naughty underwear versus only 20% of Don Catholic. 80% of devout Catholic women approved of sex purely for pleasure, , which is much higher than other populations.

.

Another fun finding that I keep finding in here. And I’m not gonna go through all of the, the instances of this ‘cause there’s like 20 instances of it. , But more religious people have sex more frequently. People who attend church more frequently have sex more frequently and they are more satisfied in their marriages.

Malcolm Collins: But I wanna get into this, like, why is this the case? Does the data back it up? Does the data back up?

This idea that this is why, because what this would, if this hypothesis is correct, then it would mean that Catholics are less kinky than Protestants. Because Protestants are less horny than Catholics. That would be the way that the theory works. CR episode, by the way, another episode that you can go into if you’re interested in these topics is, is

Simone Collins: oh God, though, that checks out.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. I mean,

Simone Collins: with the whole Hispanic having higher levels of testosterone theoretically than you need less to get turned on.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah, so you don’t need all the, the weird stuff, right?

Simone Collins: Yeah. Ah,

Malcolm Collins: No, I mean, keep in mind what, what are like Catholic fetishes? It’s like Catholic school girl, like Pope Nun and

Simone Collins: just a ton of, ton of missionary sex, just

Malcolm Collins: like

Simone Collins: vanilla.

Malcolm Collins: When I think of like waspy fetishes, I’m like, oh my God. Like those people are freaks. Like they have like a room in the house dedicated to that nonsense. That, that it takes

Simone Collins: a lot. It takes a lot.

Malcolm Collins: Dsm, dungeon room or whatever, and then it’s like, now you’re going to Japan. Oh, that’s a whole other level.

You have an episode where we talk about why Asians have lower sex drive potentially. Where we argue was low Asian birth rates, partially genetic, and it’s because like a statistically significant portion. In many Asian countries, marriages were arranged marriages.

Simone Collins: Hmm.

Malcolm Collins: It was like 45% over like huge chunks of their history.

Like a

Simone Collins: lot

Malcolm Collins: huge in certain regions. And so that’s, you don’t need to be horny to get pregnant if like, that just happens naturally, right?

Simone Collins: Yeah. If it, if it’s your job, you’re just doing your job.

Malcolm Collins: Go into the pregnancy, you go to ch ching Chch. Well, you actually, you know, I find this really interesting ‘cause we see this in apothecary Diaries, which takes place in the Chinese court with like the concubines and everything like that.

Mm-hmm. And sex is treated so transactionally and like, not as like a big like romantic thing within, in courtly life.

Simone Collins: It was, yeah, it was, it was very,

Malcolm Collins: which is really. I mean, you do see this even from like Japanese literature, now that I’m thinking about it, it’s very like they had like a lot of like horny posting, I guess I’d call it historically, where they’d write to each other.

But it like wasn’t explicitly it wasn’t as explicit as like European horny posting. It was like more like poetic.

Simone Collins: Yeah. I mean, let’s just compare how like Louis the IV or even King Henry VIII would. They, they wanted to actively seduce their partners. You know, as, as kings, you know, they, they sent them gifts and they they wooed them and they tried to convince them with letters and with arguments like they, there, there was.

I mean, well there wasn’t really consent involved ‘cause you don’t exactly turn down a king and everyone’s like throwing and positioning these women for the, the king. There was still like this whole like tete of like, oh, I must, you know, entrance you, I must convince you. And especially with like Louis, well actually with both Louis the 14th and king hangry thei, the, the women were very hesitant from a a Christian perspective too.

Sleep with him out of wedlock. And there was a lot of drama around that. So he, they, there was actually convincing that needed to be done, but like, they really enjoyed that. Chase. You contrast that with the way that partner, like the, the nightly partner for an emperor in the Forbidden Palace would’ve been, they would position.

The, the consorts or concubine names on these, like plaques. I think they were like jade plaques. And of course, like all the palace eunuchs or whatever would like arrange them in a way where they thought like, subconsciously he’ll pick like this lady because, you know, he’s left-handed or right-handed and like this is closer to where his hand is or whatever.

Like they try to position the little, but like, he’s just like selecting a written name, like not even a picture, you know, just like. Choosing the written name and then the woman gets, you know, washed and then wrapped up in, in basically a rug and then delivered burrito style into his bed. Then really, is

Malcolm Collins: that, is that the way it worked?

Simone Collins: Yes, that is the way it worked. And then the, for like a, a very set period of time they would be left alone for their intimate activities, which I loved much, much more fun. Again, in the French court, they’re referred to it as comas. Which is exactly what it is. It is commerce, my friends. But

Malcolm Collins: yeah, way more seduction in European

Simone Collins: royalty.

Oh yeah. No, no, no. People are like, it was. It was just like a Silicon Valley orgy house in, in Versailles. I’m telling you. It was great. I, I don’t, I, unlike sex, but I, I just, I mean, people who

Malcolm Collins: don’t know the the, the, the French Catholic royalty was like way more debauched than Henry. The Ys was Henry?

No,

Simone Collins: no. Like the whole, like the boy Lynn sisters were sort of like, because they sort of got, they were raised for a certain period of their life in the French court. They were like, oh, that’s like, it was basically like, oh, they’re, they’re trained sluts. They’re gonna do stuff. They, they have the French method.

And we call it like French kids. There’s all these still things that like, are still of our, of our culture that refer to French people being sexually. A little lot, but I wanna

Malcolm Collins: point out here,

Simone Collins: prescribed period of time

Malcolm Collins: that kissing was, was your tongue, which is like the normal way that all humans kiss today was seen as like weird and perverted.

Simone Collins: I don’t dunno if that’s the normal way that all people kiss.

Malcolm Collins: I think

Simone Collins: really when

Malcolm Collins: they start kissing. Yeah.

Simone Collins: I don’t, I don’t think so, Malcolm sorry. Laying in the comments, that’s your default way of kissing and what your, what your racial and ethnic background is. But no, so in, in, in, in the Imperial Court, it’s not done.

So she’s delivered burrito style into your bed. And then, after a, a very like prescribed period of time, the, the palace uns would then like, or your guards would then check in with you and be like, a, as long as you, he wasn’t like, okay, done. Take her away. Like wrap her up.

Ding, ding, ding.

Yeah. Ding ding.

They would like check on him and be like, sir, sir, are you okay? And then they would take her away. She, she wouldn’t stay all night. They would take, could I have

Malcolm Collins: people Dix bring you into my room in a burrito?

Simone Collins: Burrito style? Burrito delivery. Oh, see that? That is what, you know, like the Epstein crowd should have been.

They were like, oh, let’s order Chipotle. You know, let’s chip. Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: So, so continue with stats here because we’re gonna do stats stat, heavy episode,

Simone Collins: right? Sorry guys. Let’s go into it.

Malcolm Collins: Japan.

Simone Collins: Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: So f first we’re gonna go into, ‘cause I found this interesting because I, I think a lot of this is like heavily biased, right?

Simone Collins: Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: Like if you go out there and you do surveys, and we’ll get into this, Japanese people say like, they’re the least kinky of all populations. And I’m like, I know that age

Simone Collins: is like, I think. I think Japanese women are uniquely not kinky. I think they’re the, if I had to picture a, a race and gender that was asexual, it would be the Japanese woman.

I, I feel like when, when they are kinky, it is out of a career driven obligation and they’re doing it. A, I don’t know. I mean, like it, I would love to hear the secret life of a kinky Japanese woman, but the YouTube channels that I watch of Japanese women are, are literally single Japanese women who never show their faces on camera and just make dinner and live in living in tiny apartments.

I actually think it might

Malcolm Collins: be, I mean, I think this is actually true across Asian populations. Mm-hmm. I’ve personally never slept with a nation woman, and one of the reasons why is because seduction techniques that leaned on arousal. Are just completely ineffective on them. They do not respond to arousal in the way that Western women do.

And it might be that I need to use an entirely different set of techniques maybe. But if you look at like, maybe show

Simone Collins: up with another hot guy I mean watch, watch invented in, in Japan. So

Malcolm Collins: yeah,

Simone Collins: I’m using

Malcolm Collins: completely different systems, which I

Simone Collins: don’t think are trying to get, but I think that’s really telling that like the one, the one sort of sexual manga anime genre that like.

Really picked up among women in Japan, didn’t even involve the women. I just, I, I feel like that that kind of signals something. Yeah. A little bit. Yeah. Okay.

Malcolm Collins: So let’s, let’s continue here.

Simone Collins: Leave me outta what they’re saying.

Malcolm Collins: But where I was able to get data that looked reasonable to me was the amount of session time

on Corn Hub because if I look at this, I can tell about how long it takes from beginning to try to get off in, to try to get off. Oh,

Simone Collins: oh, that’s so clever. That’s a great, oh,

well, God,

Malcolm Collins: I know. I’m pretty clever, aren’t I? You

Simone Collins: clever girl.

Speaker: Clever girl.

Malcolm Collins: So Japan had the slowest of any population of 11 minutes and two seconds on average.

Okay. Guess who had the fastest of any population?

Simone Collins: Well, I mean, I’m gonna guess Hispanic men.

Malcolm Collins: Mexico.

Simone Collins: Oh my God. Oh my God. Guess this is, whoa. Who knew?

Malcolm Collins: Guess who had the second fastest?

Simone Collins: I’m gonna have to say African men,

Malcolm Collins: Chile, other Latin American,

Simone Collins: Chile. No, they, but I said, I said Hispanic. I’m okay.

Malcolm Collins: Okay.

Simone Collins: Yeah,

Malcolm Collins: Hispanic.

And then in the middle is United States. And then other Asian countries like the Philippines, or like in between the United States and Japan. Okay.

Simone Collins: Yeah. So there, there are no, there are no, like, they don’t separate out black and white Americans, like non-Hispanic.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You don’t have that,

Simone Collins: but, okay.

Because like, again, the testosterone results were Hispanic men, black men, white men, Asian men.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Yeah. This aligns with the, the castle, the

Simone Collins: testosterone theory. Yeah. Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: Which aligns with, you can watch our episode where we go over why I think that is, somebody was asking why. I just think that ev if, if you’re in a highly deontological structure that bands stuff like masturbation in a historic context, then being hornier might lead to more kids in earlier elopement, which Catholics seem to also need because they get eloped out of potentially more out of like, desire for each other, the not of logic. Whereas when I see Asian women who have settled down with guys, it’s typically out of logic. And I think it’s, it’s, it’s Protestant women as well, like, like it is often out of a sense of logic. They don’t need this external thing because of the cultural frameworks that they always in.

This is just a hypothesis.

Simone Collins: No, I, I, I, I associate Protestant women. With being logically seduced. And then I associate like Jewish women with, with being this combination of passion and logic or, or like, almost like loyalty, tradition and logic. Based Horniness. Oh, they different hor

Malcolm Collins: to Catholics on this front than they’re to Protestants.

They’re way hornier than Protestant women.

Simone Collins: Well, I mean, they’re the only ones who have like a, there’s a religious mandate to pleasure your woman. What other

Malcolm Collins: religious do have a religious mandate?

Simone Collins: Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. For people who don’t know this, like, like literally, Jews have a religious mandate to ensure that their woman is sexually satisfied.

And so like Ben Shapiro, when he like thinks that like a woman being white as like a, a disorder or something, he’s like, actually not being a Jew. Well,

Simone Collins: he’s an episte. Yeah, he’s terrible. How dare he?

Malcolm Collins: Okay, so so I decided to go, okay, Japan, like, what are they searching for in terms of the, their corn, right?

Mm-hmm. And it was boring when I looked at like, the, the, the PornHub sets, right? It was like Japanese is the top, then Japanese wife, then milf

, and I’m like, this is weird. Why? Why in Japan are they looking for a bunch of MILF related stuff? And I was like, oh yeah, the average age of the population.

That’s why. It’s because it’s a very, very old population.

Oh.

Simone Collins: So yeah, the young chick is, is a mom.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah.

Simone Collins: Well, no, I mean, I, maybe it’s a good conveyor for big boobs, something about extremely large breasts in Japan. If, if

Malcolm Collins: you want a middle aged woman, right? Mm-hmm. Like if you’re looking for a middle age, like not an actively elderly.

Simone Collins: Yeah. Then it has to be, although, oh my God. ‘Cause you know, we’re, we’re like advertising on some NSFW sites. I found that one of the content filters was granny. Yeah, this is not something I’ve come across in like you when I look at all the NSFW subreddits, granny does not show up like goth girl. Various types of like body features, never granny.

Oh, actually, Randy, this is something

Malcolm Collins: we’re gonna go into here because I wanna talk about changes in not safer work content over time.

Simone Collins: That’s a whole nother episode, man. We’re talking No,

Malcolm Collins: no, no. I want, I wanna

Simone Collins: get super canceled, which is racial and ethnic differences.

Malcolm Collins: I wanna lean, turn on here and we’ll get to it in another episode because I wanna get in the comments of other people have noticed this.

Okay.

Simone Collins: Okay.

Malcolm Collins: So like, I, I think you’re right. I’ve never come across because if you are online and you’re looking at like, drawn corn, right? Like. Anti related stuff. Right. We should

Simone Collins: probably call it popcorn.

Malcolm Collins: Popcorn, right? Yeah. You’re looking at this stuff and what you’re gonna note is if you have some group of things that you’re into, occasionally things that you’re not into will come up with that group of things.

Right.

Simone Collins: Especially if it’s niche, because then basically you have to like carpool your way to being turned on.

Malcolm Collins: Right, right. Yeah. The, the old woman, I have never. I don’t think I’ve ever once accidentally ran into that.

Simone Collins: Nope. Me neither. Me neither.

Malcolm Collins: But

Simone Collins: I didn’t even know it existed until yesterday.

Literally.

Malcolm Collins: But this is a big, but there are two categories of things that have, or three that have become really popular that did not used to be popular. And I see this in content. All the time. Now, when I and I’m not talking about like nineties, didn’t see this, I didn’t see this you know, in the early, like let’s say Circuit 2015.

Okay? So this is a

Simone Collins: long t this 11 years ago.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. So, so, but what I mean is like the internet was still the internet then. It was still free. Whatever you wanted, whenever you wanted it then. Okay. Okay.

Simone Collins: Yes, yes.

Malcolm Collins: This is forced feminization. Yeah. This is ification of men. This is cool.

Simone Collins: Sissy is, is still huge

Malcolm Collins: men transitioning into women.

Yeah. This is. NTR is the other one. That’s, that’s cheating on the partner in a way that’s like psychologically destructive, right? These things were just. I do not remember them being as, as prevalent as they were in the past. And I wonder if it’s something that’s like, if this is actually tied to the like trans phenomenon in our society.

If the popularity of this sort of porn is maybe like convergent with that or if it’s in it triggering it. Because I’ve heard like some trans people be like, they got into like sissy hypno porn and then became trans or something. This is something that they, they talk about on their phone. I mean, you’ve seen this.

Simone Collins: Yeah, no, they totally do. Yes, absolutely.

And Catherine D has talked about this really well. She’s covered it well. If you guys wanna look at it more.

Malcolm Collins: And I never once saw this when I was a kid. I was unaware that this was even a

Simone Collins: no. Totally. I, I don’t, I don’t think this there was any of this. Before, not really.

Malcolm Collins: So I wanna, I wanna, I wanna in the comments, is this like actually something that just like came outta nowhere and is it changing our society more on that in just a second?

Simone Collins: Yeah. Did it exist elsewhere and it was just seen differently maybe?

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. So when I was looking at this boring Japanese stuff, I was like, you know what?

I bet this is because I’m looking at porn. And PornHub. Popcorn. Popcorn. Use that popcorn.

Simone Collins: Popcorn hug.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. So I was like, let’s look at like what younger people would be using like D-list sites, Fana, stuff like that. Okay.

Simone Collins: Okay.

Malcolm Collins: So in 2023 in ti, TR held the number one spot among Japanese users for 11 consecutive months.

Ahead of tags like lolly, which was number two, and submissive man, which was number three.

Simone Collins: No

Malcolm Collins: pregnancy. Number four, Ari, number five.

Simone Collins: Ah.

Malcolm Collins: And if we keep going from here, it’s reverse f then hypnosis, then 3D, then A to noco. What the heck is a token? Noco? I don’t know. That’s word. A

Simone Collins: token. Noco. What is, do

Malcolm Collins: we wanna

Simone Collins: know?

Malcolm Collins: M males with feminine gender expressions. Oh,

Simone Collins: oh, so like fu but with other things.

Malcolm Collins: No, no, no, no. This is what do, what do you call that? She. Fit. What’s, what’s the word for like, girly boy thing? It’s called like

Simone Collins: F boys.

Malcolm Collins: Fem boys. Fem boys.

Simone Collins: She what? She man.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Yeah. No, this is that fem boys is what they’re talking about.

Yeah. Then, then corruption, then beast, then tentacle.

Simone Collins: You notice that least I, I, am I wrong that the reason that tentacle. Erotic material came to exist was because of censorship loss, and so they used, oh, that’s the narrative.

Malcolm Collins: I have repeated this narrative now as I’ve gotten older.

Simone Collins: You doubt it.

Malcolm Collins: I, that’s true.

I think

Simone Collins: you just think people are hot for.

Malcolm Collins: Reason was if you look at American markets, what you’re gonna see is basically across European markets, the number one search thing is lesbians. And I often mentioned, and then the number two or one of the, the other really high ones is Ari, and I’ve mentioned that one of the reasons is this is for genetic reasons.

Guys do not want to be turned on by seeing another guy having sex was a woman who they

Simone Collins: are

Malcolm Collins: sexually interested in.

Simone Collins: That’s true. It’s a very bad sign. It, it, it’s, it’s, it’s equivalent to death. I mean, if you are your genetic line. Your woman sleeping with someone else and you raising that kid that is, that is basically raising your, your murderer.

It is giving your life to your murderer. ‘cause they’re ending your genetic line. Like if you believe yourself as something beyond just your own biological meat puppet. So it’s a pretty thing. And a lot of

Malcolm Collins: males, not all males, but have a incredibly strong resistance to the conception of another guy. And that’s why this form in the West, but interestingly

Simone Collins: Well, and which makes sense because if you think about it any, any guy who like on a genetic level would be super chill with that.

Well, their genetic line wouldn’t exist very long, would it? So, yeah, go on. Right.

Malcolm Collins: Asians don’t seem to have the same resistance to this, so they don’t seem to have the same discuss towards it. I mean,

Simone Collins: well, it wouldn’t be necessary if you had arranged marriages and, and, and a lot of societal controls over women and who they were able to.

Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: So women weren’t sleeping around with other people. Actually, within parts of the Japanese part, women did sort of sleep around. There was something called like serial, it’s a longer phenomenon for a different episode, but I don’t think it was that big that it affected the genetics.

Simone Collins: Yeah, not if it’s happening in Imperial Courts.

You’re talking about like the top. 0.01%.

Malcolm Collins: So, so then I was like, okay what is it now? Because this was when NTR was popular in Japan. So NTR has become less popular now. Now it’s number two. Do you know what’s number one in Japan right now?

Simone Collins: I, I, I couldn’t, I, I honestly have no idea.

Malcolm Collins: Submissive min,

Simone Collins: I mean, this is, this is the country from which the vegetarian man concept emerged well before.

A lot of other like specification or asexual men tropes or trends emerged. So, you know, Japan’s on the forefront of everything.

And

Malcolm Collins: I decided to see what men were like. American men were looking up on these, these more perverted sites, right?

Simone Collins: Mm-hmm.

Malcolm Collins: The number one for American mens on these sites were all the Japanese people were looking up NTR.

Simone Collins: Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: Small breasts.

Simone Collins: Oh, ‘cause the, because

Malcolm Collins: that’s, that’s the American non-legal way to search for

Simone Collins: oh, oh, oh,

Malcolm Collins: oh. You’re so disappointed in the world. Again, as we point out with males, you have this conundrum where the traits that are used to signal that something is a woman and can be impregnated are inversely correlated with the treats that extend to the links of the fertility window, EG wide hip ratio, and larger breasts.

And so men yeah.

Simone Collins: Yeah. Well, I guess like the, the really nice thing for all the guys who get criticized for being into big titties in the end. You know,

Malcolm Collins: they’re not into Yeah,

Simone Collins: yeah. You know, they’re not Epstein. And so that’s nice. You know, that, that’s, I feel like that that gives you cache these days.

You know, it’s super not cool to be into the young ones these days.

Malcolm Collins: Anyway, to continue here.

Simone Collins: Oh God.

Malcolm Collins: Other the next most popular tag in the US within these sites specifically is f then Monster girls. Then, I don’t know what words I’m allowed to say here, then something then NTR then vanilla, then harem.

Like Americans are actually pretty tame when compared, right? Like

Simone Collins: well, and Ala has found this in her big kink survey. In the end, most people are just really into very vanilla concepts. And as a general rule of thumb, the most thing that men want is just really enthusiastic female partners who want their magical.

Wand inside their treasure box and their, the women want men who are super into them too. Who just can’t control themselves from desire around them. That’s it. It’s so simple. It’s, it’s so stupid. So,

Malcolm Collins: Let’s get into the, into BDSM by ethnic group.

Simone Collins: Because, yeah, it seems to me like such a weird as in what is that?

W-E-I-R-D, like white educated something, something like very, we’re very sort of like white Protestant ish thing.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah.

Simone Collins: Let’s get out the rule book and all the equipment and, and you’re right, it’s, yeah. So

Malcolm Collins: by far, by more than double whites, this was in the kink identity and sexuality study.

Mm-hmm. Participate in BDSM at, at double the rate of the next highest participating ethnic group.

Simone Collins: Mm-hmm.

Malcolm Collins: Do you know what the next highest participating ethnic group was

Simone Collins: in the Japanese

Malcolm Collins: blacks?

Simone Collins: Really? Yeah. No, I don’t see them in any, like when I, when I see like either produced by or starring BDSM related stuff, I don’t really see black people.

Like either African Americans or just Africans. That is so weird. You go to

Malcolm Collins: about cross ethnic attractiveness, like which ethnic groups find other ethnic groups attractive versus unattractive? Blacks are generally considered the least attractive ethnicity, which is why they’re not as common in pornography.

Simone Collins: Oh, but you know, also why it’s, it’s a little bit of a, a problematic look.

Malcolm Collins: Oh yeah, that could

Simone Collins: I think it just makes people really uncomfortable to see that and they’re like, you know, I don’t like the way I feel. I, I don’t feel comfortable. Yeah, yeah. Have a

Malcolm Collins: white dominatrix was like a black sub or whatever.

I’d be like,

Simone Collins: let’s, let’s, let’s not, let’s not put the, let’s not put the, the dark skinned person in chains. I’m not. Okay. There’s like a

Malcolm Collins: in his, in, in, in their mouth or something,

Simone Collins: like walking around like, no, no, something’s wrong.

Malcolm Collins: Like I can, the, the reason I keep saying like the man is the sub, because as a woman I’d be like, I can sort of see that, right?

Like if it was a black woman and like a white guy, like being the dom, I’ve

Simone Collins: never seen that. No. And still I would be. I would be super uncomfortable seeing that. I’d be like, no,

Malcolm Collins: no.

Simone Collins: Shut it down. Shut it down.

Malcolm Collins: Everybody shut it down. But this aligns with the earlier hypothesis. So the most intuit group being whites, the next being blacks and the least, it’s so

Simone Collins: surprising

Malcolm Collins: being Hispanics.

Now there is one group that’s below Hispanics at an absurdly low number, which is Asian.

Simone Collins: That’s so wild.

Malcolm Collins: Now, I don’t know. Why? ‘

Simone Collins: cause there, there’s a huge genai genre for,

Malcolm Collins: no, there really isn’t

Simone Collins: much bondage for, well what, what is, I guess what Shava is just gonna be different. There’s not even an English word for that.

We have to use a Japanese one. Explain that. Explain what you’re talking

Malcolm Collins: about

Simone Collins: to people. I’m talking about elaborate tying up of people, which isn’t ex, I mean, it, it is clearly a form of bondish. People are being bound. That it’s like, it’s pretty, and you can like suspend people and you have to do all these elaborate classes because it, it could be very dangerous.

You could cut off someone’s, I’ve never seen an agent who

Malcolm Collins: was into that. I have seen a lot. Yeah.

Simone Collins: But it’s called Ari. It’s, and it’s, it’s, I

Malcolm Collins: know it is. We, we appropriated it and made it like a western thing, but I have never seen a nation that was into it, nor have I ever seen it in Hai.

Simone Collins: Yeah, but you’ve, you also not had, you’ve not had an Asian girlfriend, so what would you know?

I don’t know that that very much confuses me. I’m very, because also, like I rem I remember when, when I was a teenager in Japan, staying at this really specific hotel in Osaka. There was this one bridge where all of the local sex workers would like slap on their little post-it notes. Like they would advertise their themselves and their phone numbers on these little cards, but they would be like, post-its.

So you could just stick them to like a phone booth or stick them to like a bridge. And I would just like prance along the street just collecting all of them. You know, like, like elf. Collecting gum off of things and chewing it. Just so excited. And a bunch of them showed ropey things, so I don’t know.

I’m confused then.

Malcolm Collins: You know what? I bet Asians are just lying in this survey. That’s

Simone Collins: what my takeaway is. They’re just liars. Yeah. I You’re liars, you’re lying

Malcolm Collins: liars.

Speaker: And to me, people might say things like, Liar! Tell us what you know, you goddamn liar!

Simone Collins: Also, that was like 10 years ago though. So things, things change to your point. Right? I mean, I think that demographically Japan has changed a lot and that might’ve just been for like a group of, of, of men that are now also, that’s a very, that was, those were offline.

Maybe there’s a difference between the people who, I think like an older generation is going to hire sex workers both because they have more wealth and because they grew up in an age where you couldn’t get your tion online. Okay, I’m gonna drop a hypothesis

Malcolm Collins: here. It just came together in my head for me.

Simone Collins: Okay.

Malcolm Collins: Okay. So it is not necessarily that Japanese wouldn’t be more turned on by this stuff than vanilla sex given their lower arousal states. However, japanese people when they’re looking for things that arouse them mm-hmm. Are more likely to turn to online content Yeah. Over something they can do as a partner.

Sure. And white people are more likely to turn to something they can do as a partner as opposed to online stuff. Now, now they’re still more likely to turn to online stuff. I’m just talking about disproportionately when contrasted with Japanese people.

Simone Collins: Oh yeah.

Malcolm Collins: For Japanese people who were, any types of things that could be stimulated by BDSM play.

Mm-hmm. These types of things were better stimulated for them by something more extreme. Whether it’s like goro, this is like extreme gore related stuff. Like extreme, like this person’s like a, a slave or a captive scenarios or like extreme. Like just more extreme stuff,

Simone Collins: like all the monster girl stuff too.

Malcolm Collins: Monster girl stuff. Stuff that we wouldn’t even consider BDSM because it is so extreme.

Simone Collins: You know what, I bet that VO also had its origins in, in Japan. I bet it would. Like,

Malcolm Collins: maybe like

Simone Collins: something maybe, but stuff is

Malcolm Collins: so extreme that you wouldn’t consider it normal content, right? Yeah.

Consider it like weird other

Simone Collins: content.

Yeah. Like, not, not the normal stuff that you would, you would immediately turn to if you were like, what turns people on. Right.

Malcolm Collins: Whereas in the America specifically. Yeah. Because people still were having relationships and stuff like that, and I think still wanted to do this stuff with a partner.

Yeah. They conceptualized BDSM as being what, what kink is, as opposed to like just purely fictional scenarios, which happen more in Japan.

Simone Collins: Mm-hmm.

Malcolm Collins: So it’s not due to a lack of desire for this, it’s due to a lack of desire of doing this with a partner.

Simone Collins: Could be. Yeah. I don’t know. Tell me more.

Malcolm Collins: Okay. Now let’s, let’s go to different what things if, if we’re not doing these extreme sites are coming up as like the main types of, production of, of corn was in each reason. So within the west, AI said that the west disproportionately is big into BDSM power exchange and fetish place. So I EEG stuff that real people are doing. Mm-hmm. Whereas in east Asia, it was Shari, which you said HAI and aesthetic bondage. So like, interesting, but like that makes sense, right?

Like it’s, it’s, it’s the conceptual stuff more within Latin America. Group dynamics and romantic kink, and it produces Latin America, produces very little corn. Very little sexual content altogether. Which again, would align with this thesis that we have here. Mm-hmm. And then and then black countries also produce very little and when they do, it’s often racialized fetishes, which I found very interesting.

Simone Collins: Oh, no, don’t do that guys. Don don’t do it. Don’t do it.

Malcolm Collins: A lot of the, so you gotta really, you know, take it with a grain of salt. Sure. So an example of what I mean by this is when I was trying to. Get an understanding of like how different groups said that they liked participating in, in, in stuff. It was like, well, keep in mind that black men are, are more interested in pleasing women than white men.

And I was like, that doesn’t sound like what I’ve heard from people, that black men spend a longer time trying to please women. And then I was like, what journal posted this? Journal of black psychology? I was like. Okay. Okay, that makes sense. But I would be interested if, if, if that is, I mean people can, who’ve had more experience with, with both groups can let us know if, if my intuition is wrong here.

It’s just not what I’ve, I’ve heard on the street.

Simone Collins: I feel like the general, my finger on the pulse of discourse and what I’ve seen across everything that I’ve kind of just ingested over the past 10 years. Is it black men are seen as satisfying women more sexually? That’s like what I’ve, yeah, it’s just my gen.

I think it’s like the reputation. So I mean, normally stereotypes exist for a reason. Right?

Malcolm Collins: So, let’s go via country for the most common search terms.

Simone Collins: Okay.

Malcolm Collins: On sites for like King, we can get a better, maybe. Maybe we’ll find some pattern here.

Simone Collins: Okay.

Malcolm Collins: Okay. Okay. United States the most viewed category is lesbian.

After lesbian is Latina, which again, it’s so sad

Simone Collins: given that lesbians are fake news. There’s like this, just this concept that people wish was real.

Malcolm Collins: Then milf, I think MILF is a sign of an aging society. ‘cause I did not think mil. That’s a really good point. Growing up.

Simone Collins: Absolutely.

Malcolm Collins: Then Asian, then hint tight.

No, white’s not on here yet. Then Ebony, then wait. White’s not on here at all. I guess it’s just assumed that if you’re just looking up

Simone Collins: Yeah, just like sort of default they’re gonna be. And that’s, that’s certainly what I’ve seen.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. By default they’re

Simone Collins: gonna be white women.

Malcolm Collins: Mexico, milf number one, aging society, then lesbian.

Philippines. This I thought, interesting pane. Filipino women, number one, right?

Simone Collins: All

Malcolm Collins: right. They’re looking for like their own group. Then hit type, then just MILF across the board here. Brazil starts with F Boy. Oh no. Transgender is number one in Brazil. Then F Boy is number two.

Simone Collins: I feel like the chicks out.

Bri Brazil has fun. You know, they’re just, they’re going for it.

Malcolm Collins: Well, that’s not a good sign for a society

Simone Collins: in terms of, you know, surviving. No, I mean, in terms of their birth, race don’t look good. But fta, everyone’s going out. Okay. Malcolm, are we gonna go out having fun or we not. Okay.

Malcolm Collins: I, I’ve got a place, the Rome clip here, about how F boys destroyed Rome.

The Fall of Rome.

Joe Rogan had this to say on his podcast fascinating that the end of empires, they get really concerned with gender and hermaphrodites the Roman fem boy. Fully grown and willing to take on the role of a common Roman woman. Even the emperor himself donned girly outfits, mascara, and held many chamber parties . The Roman Senate began having debates to determine if quote, being with a fem boy was a totally gay thing. After all,

Malcolm Collins: To continue here. Germany, lesbian number one, then milf France, Latina.

Simone Collins: Okay. What’s number four? What’s going on there? Interesting.

Malcolm Collins: Anyway. Yeah, it’s so wrong. Basically across western countries, lesbian is number one. United Kingdom lesbian, number one, Australia lesbian, number one. Russia is transgenderism than FM boy.

Simone Collins: Russia. Russia, that

Malcolm Collins: is not.

Simone Collins: Russia fem boy Russia. A guess behind that Steely Russian man stereotype is a sensitive feminine.

Malcolm Collins: Fem boy lover.

Simone Collins: Fem, fem, fem boy lover. Who just wants to be let out? Just let me out The snow.

Malcolm Collins: People. Okay, so Simone,

so there were a bunch of other studies, but I didn’t find ‘em interesting, so I’m not gonna bore our fans with them. But thoughts, Simone?

Simone Collins: I am surprised by Hispanic men, but also that makes sense in a culture that has been subject to the evolutionary bottlenecks for hundreds of years by Catholicism, which really leverages it like harnesses horniness in order to survive.

Yeah, and like sort of leverages and shapes it as though it’s some kind of like energy that it’s like and I feel like that that might have something to do with it. And so that, that surprised me. Yeah, that’s, that’s very interesting. I guess some stereotypes make sense, you know, like in terms of like, well, these are the countries that you go to and you have to worry about being hit on and catcalled more.

That kind of checks out Right. You know?

Malcolm Collins: Yeah.

Simone Collins: So that, yeah. I’m still not convinced that like the really weird, esoteric. Kinks out there, you know, like squids tentacles. And because it doesn’t have to be squids, what am I saying? I’m not being inclusive enough. Whatever I, I, I think that’s more cultural.

No, I mean, maybe it is a product of, of being, I don’t, I just don’t understand why they’re necessarily a product of lower levels of, of turn on.

Malcolm Collins: I don’t know. I think it’s a hypothesis. I’m, I’m

Simone Collins: like, here’s, here’s, here’s a, here’s a counter theory. Wait, let me present my counter theory. Why? If you weren’t a perv, would you figure out that you were into tentacles?

Right? Like, because you just looking

Malcolm Collins: at anything to feel something like,

Simone Collins: and one day or the market doesn’t

Malcolm Collins: do it

Simone Collins: for me. Doesn’t do it for me. Oh, this is it. That’s my

Malcolm Collins: feeling. I feel, no, I mean, you look at like hand tire or something like that, right? Japanese people go really hard with trying to induce emotional states in people within their, like corn, right?

Like, they’re like, we need to go all the way.

Simone Collins: It’s not, you have to, you have to read through like 15 pages of plot development to get to some kind of, everyone’s wearing clothes, nothing’s, you know, it’s so, yeah, you’re right, you’re right. I, I do not have the attention span for it. I’ve never been able to like, go through, even just out of curiosity, manga based, or like, because I’m just, I’m like, man gets to the point. I I don’t have time for this.

Malcolm Collins: Well, okay, so other, other I’m, I’m gonna look for some like white Protestant ones that are like known. The, the famous one is white Protestant women in effing dogs. Like, that’s like,

Simone Collins: that’s a white, white Protestant woman

Malcolm Collins: thing.

Oh, it’s such a, it’s such a thing. It’s such a thing. It’s like an internet joke. Is, yeah. Like,

Simone Collins: I feel just with, with any sort of online no-no material. Your default female actress or, or female participant is gonna be white.

It, it’s, no, I

Malcolm Collins: understand. But this is like a joke in manos fierce circles. I don’t know if it’s a real phenomenon, but it is a manosphere joke. Is that like the type of woman who you see, but

Simone Collins: also like when it comes to. Dudes having deep, deep relationships with animals. It’s also, that’s Latin American

Malcolm Collins: dude.

It’s like normal in Columbia. Donkey shows are a Mexican thing. Like bestiality in dudes is a Latin American thing.

Simone Collins: Oh, I guess you’re, you’re right. We, we, we talked about, what were they called? Tiana something.

Malcolm Collins: Do you want a donkey chair? No, but we don’t know if those are real, but what we do know is real, a hundred percent is real, is that in some Columbia towns it was just completely normal.

Did Was that young man? Having relations with that donkey

they say, yes, that’s right. What did he say? Normal? No, no trouble at all. Normal. So enjoy the company of donkeys.

So they say that basically that’s the first wife, the first lover that they have.

Simone Collins: Oh. But like when, when you wanted to, to prepare for your first night in bed with your wife, you would first

Malcolm Collins: go

Simone Collins: have a go with the donkey

Malcolm Collins: and it’s still normal today in in

Simone Collins: person. I would be so angry as a woman to know that he. Stuck it in a donkey before, like that’s not, did you clean it? It’s not a

Malcolm Collins: donkey, by the way.

Sheep, I think is what they use.

Simone Collins: Well then it covered in lanolin. Have you touched like a, a sheep? Do you know how greasy sheep are? Yes.

Malcolm Collins: I, I, I don’t wanna think about it. Okay. Simone doesn’t, I’m not,

Simone Collins: it’s not my, it’s not my thing either.

Malcolm Collins: I’m not into, I’m just, what’s it, sorry. I’m trying to think of other ones that like I.

Vampires, white people are into vampires, but let Latinas are into vampires too. From what I’ve seen,

Simone Collins: everyone’s into vampires. Malcolm

Malcolm Collins: Asians. I have not seen Asians into vampires.

Simone Collins: Yeah. Well, and a Twilight is not like, oh,

Malcolm Collins: stories.

Simone Collins: White,

Malcolm Collins: furries, furries,

Simone Collins: Protestants, white Catholics,

Malcolm Collins: furries have not taken off in, in East Asia, even though they have some of the best furry media out there.

B Stars, I think it’s the best furry media

Simone Collins: yeah.

Malcolm Collins: Ever made.

Simone Collins: Well, in Japan is the country of mascots. There’s like a mascot for the airport. There’s a mascot for year bathroom. Those are

Malcolm Collins: mascots. Yeah, they’re, they’re not big into furries there. And in Latin America, furries are not as big despite all other parts of nor nerd culture being much larger.

See our episode on why are Latin Americans such a bunch of nerds? So, yeah. And it’s not just Latin American, it’s Catholics more broadly, like Manga like, like the number one market in the world is like Yeah.

Simone Collins: But as you discussed in that episode, a lot of that had to do with like licensing fees and the cost of distributing.

Malcolm Collins: That doesn’t explain why Manga is so popular in France,

Simone Collins: because it’s good. Okay, shut up.

Malcolm Collins: It. Catholics have better taste in nerd culture. I’m just gonna

Simone Collins: in clothing too. They win, they win. They

Malcolm Collins: do, they do. They have better taste in nerd culture. I’m just gonna be honest, the, the Pope did an anime girl, like, come on.

Simone Collins: No, but also like the Pope has the best religious garments. So,

Malcolm Collins: dude, true.

Simone Collins: They, they got style

Malcolm Collins: right? Maybe this is where the film boy stuff is coming from.

Simone Collins: Who knows? I don’t know. That was interesting though. And you know who you are. We, we love you. Thank you for sending us that interesting thought to start our day.

Malcolm Collins: Our

Simone Collins: audience is great and we, we love

Malcolm Collins: everyone

who

Malcolm Collins: I have from this that I wanna pull on. I wanna pull on this thread. I’m gonna need some comments to pull on this thread.

Simone Collins: Okay.

Malcolm Collins: Did like ification stuff and Oh yeah.

Simone Collins: Where did that come? When did it come?

Malcolm Collins: Did this actually like come? Because when I go to Google Trends, it looks like the trend line has only been going down since Google Trends started recording this in 2004.

Oh, but maybe people have just stopped searching it on Google because they. It’s not the way people find they’re embarrassed.

Simone Collins: Yeah. We all have better methods now.

Malcolm Collins: Everybody knows that’s not a good way to find

Simone Collins: stuff. Don’t do that. Don’t do there. There have been enough subpoenas. We don’t need that. But

Malcolm Collins: is it actually that much more common than it used to be?

Is it actually true?

Simone Collins: It feels new to both of us. Yeah. It’s not just you, Malcolm. I feel that way too. But also I, I didn’t look into it and or even know about it until very recently. So it could just be one of those, those, once you see it, you see it everywhere. Things for us personally, as, as just like people who’ve discovered this.

So I dunno, anyway

Malcolm Collins: I don’t, yeah, so I wanna get that because if it’s not, if this is actually a new phenomenon, I wanna chart it against the, the, the emergence of the trans movement. Yeah. I think we might find something interesting there.

Simone Collins: We’ll check it out. Yeah. All right. Well, I love you.

Malcolm Collins: Love you too.

Simone Collins: You want Hawaiian buns with the mango curry?

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Why not? It was actually a pretty tan, it wasn’t a mango curry. It was a pinang curry.

Simone Collins: Oh, it was, there was mango in it, but there’s something

Malcolm Collins: was there or so yeah, I mean, if you’re doing it with, with buns, just like toast steps and buns and put it on the side and I’ll put it on top and, and

Simone Collins: okay.

Malcolm Collins: We’ll

Simone Collins: see if it works. Or I can put it over rice too, if you’d prefer.

Malcolm Collins: It will be better over rice.

Simone Collins: Okay, over rice. I love you. Bye.

Malcolm Collins: I love you. Bye.

Okay, you go sideways. I go this way.

No, they got crushed into each other!

あなたと過ごした最高の最期 あなたと知ったあなたの未来に答えてくれその度に

あなたと過ごした最高の最期あなたと過ごした最高の最期

新しい知識が待っている あなたと過ごした最高の最期 I know .It’s

not .I can do it .You want me to go sideways ?You want me to go sideways?

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