Nature fMRI Study: Empathy Toward Cheaters

In this eye-opening episode of Based Camp, Malcolm and Simone dive into a Reddit-sourced compilation of studies (verified where possible) that set out to prove discrimination against women... but uncovered the opposite: evidence of bias against men in areas like hiring, domestic violence, child custody, education, sexual victimization, and more.

Episode Transcript:Malcolm Collins: [00:00:00] Hello Simone. I’m excited to be here with you today. Today we are going to be going over a number of studies. That reportedly were looking into gender differences in males and females. Oh, and basically found that men have it significantly worse than women and then attempted to cover it up.

Simone Collins: What?

Malcolm Collins: And we’re going to be, yeah, so on the subreddit, because for people to know the base camp subreddit still, it looks like Reddit, like heavily throttled it at one point to try to block it, but it’s still huge. It’s still bigger than Asma Gold or Joe Rogan. So even with the throttling, we’re doing really well, which I love.

And I regularly find great posts in it. And this was from a post in it. Where they list a number of studies and they go through how the studies try to cover things up. And then I use, I sort of try to check this with AI to see like, which of these are accurate representations of this study and where has this post of anywhere taken liberties with the information so that we can be as steelman as we can and to try to get an accurate [00:01:00] vision.

Just how much the, the data is being manipulated. And I think this is what people feel like scientists are the, the, the enemy of men say white men, let’s

Simone Collins: be, well you mean contemporary scientists because,

Malcolm Collins: no, no, these studies go back away. These studies go back to like the eighties.

Simone Collins: Okay. That’s alright.

I’m thinking of the 1880s, Malcolm. They, they were pretty cool.

Malcolm Collins: And I gotta

Simone Collins: have a You’re pretty autistic and faab fabulous. So don’t, don’t come from a gentleman scientist. Okay.

Malcolm Collins: Okay.

Speaker: When is modern science gonna find a cure for a woman’s mouth?

Don’t worry. That’s just a fancy doctor. Word for your brain is broken. Unfortunately, there’s no field of medicine that deals with the brain, but I can give you a pamphlet for a cult.

Malcolm Collins: For Dr.

Simone Collins: Spaceman

Malcolm Collins: and you know, this is horrifying. I, another study I learned about that.

I actually hadn’t heard about it. I don’t know how, I hadn’t heard about this from the subreddit. Mm-hmm. And I, I double checked to make sure it’s real. It’s a real study. So this [00:02:00] was a 2006 study published in Nature. And it looked at men and women playing an economic game, a version of the prisoner’s dilemma with two actors, one who played fairly and one who cheated unfairly.

Participants were then placed in an FMRI scanner and observed the actors receiving painful electric shocks to their hands. Brain scans measured empathetic responses in pain related areas like the anterior insular, anterior cingulate cortex. Mm-hmm. And reward areas like the nucleus humus. Key findings when fair players non cheaters were shocked, both men and women showed activation in empathy related brain areas indicating distress or shared pain.

Simone Collins: Okay.

Malcolm Collins: However, when unfair players, cheaters were shocked, women still showed empathy related activation distress. But when men. Men reduced the empathy that they showed and showed some activation in their reward centers seeking pleasure from seeing the bad guy punished justice.

Simone Collins: Yeah. When

Malcolm Collins: we look at something and we’re like, how [00:03:00] can you want to help these scam artists?

The, you know, the illegal immigrants, et cetera. Right. And because at first I’m like, well, maybe you could. Picture that they’re not actually just like purely negative actors stealing from like orphans and the poor like the Somali you know, scale.

Simone Collins: Right. So you’re, you’re saying that many of the people who are we’ll say, protesting both ice arrest, but also specifically ice arrests that have been ramped up in response to widespread coverage of Somali.

Daycare fraud and transport fraud. It’s not because they don’t believe the fraud is real. It’s that they still for that fraud, just as muchies

Malcolm Collins: for the people who are stealing money from orphans and the poor Oh. Billions of dollars. Right. Tens of billions of dollars. They feel just as much empathy for those people mm-hmm.

As they do for, well, I guess they don’t feel empathy for the people who were stolen from, because to them they’re, they’re just like faceless mops, right? Like they, they, they are

Simone Collins: [00:04:00] incapable. They were the people who were stolen from they in I sometimes, yes, as long as their residents. They were, well, unless they’re not in, but that, that money was tax,

Malcolm Collins: that money was earmarked for daycare centers, the poor orphans,

Simone Collins: stuff like that.

Right? Well, yeah, and, and for public transport and for AU autism services as well. And it’s not just that this money is being wasted. Parents of actually autistic children have a very difficult time getting past wait lists for autistic services because of things like this. So it’s, it’s very annoying.

Malcolm Collins: You’re very annoying. Anyway. So, th that I thought was interesting because it gives me a better insight into what these Karens are actually thinking and why autistic women who think more like men may not have this. Mm-hmm. I’d be very interested if they did it to you, Simon. I think you would the, the, the cheaters, you wouldn’t mind them, them getting comeuppance.

But I thought that was an interesting study to start here. That one was not a misreported study. Wow. So now I wanna get to the, the body of the post here.

Simone Collins: [00:05:00] Okay.

Malcolm Collins: All right. So studies that expect to find discrimination against women often find discrimination against men instead. Oh, by the way for the, the Reddit if anyone’s willing to be a mod, reach out to us.

We need more mods for the subreddit. It helps if you are a part of the community, and we can vet you in any way to make sure you’re not gonna go crazy.

Simone Collins: And thanks to those of you who did reach out and are helping.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah, we just really appreciate

Simone Collins: it. We,

Malcolm Collins: we don’t really have rules. It’s just like, don’t get it banned.

That’s a goal. So like, you know. No threatening to murder people or mention other subreddits. You can’t even mention that you were banned from other subreddits, which I didn’t realize was such a strict rule on Reddit.

Simone Collins: Really?

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Oh well. So he goes, sometimes they take it gracefully and report it in their results in good faith, but other times they make excuses for it and we’ll try to cover it up.

Mm-hmm. The following is they list of 13 examples ranging from hiring, discrimination, domestic violence, education discrimination, and child custody discrimination. So, a study about employment discrimination against women and [00:06:00] mothers instead uncovered discrimination against men and fathers. One study on hiring discrimination looked at the effects of marriage and parental status on a person’s hiring prospects.

They expected to find discrimination against women and against mother specifically. What they found instead was that in every cohort, women were preferred over men. Whether single married, childless, or with children, instead of reporting on this novel finding, they instead went in detail about how pregnant women are often discriminated against to non-pregnant women, which they tried to frame as being sexist against women.

The fact that they found that women. Where preferred over men is buried inside the body of the study buffered by Han Wavy remarks about how pregnant women still face other difficulties related to employment,

Simone Collins: which

Malcolm Collins: is

Simone Collins: valid. Sounds like the universal basic income. Research where in the end they found that it really didn’t help people, but what they ended up reporting on was, oh, people say they feel a lot better and [00:07:00] they took more leisure time.

Like they just reported the, the two things that they did find that could plausibly send the message they wanted to send, and just neglected to highlight the other elements of it.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. So this study, specifically what they’re talking here is, is Becker Fernandez and Weissmann 2019 discrimination in hiring based on potential and realized fertility evidence from a large scale field experiment, labor, economics it’s where this is published.

Mm-hmm. And if you put an AI on this the AI is, is funny in the way it tries to get around it. It’s like, well. The study was more about how whether being pregnant affects these things and the other findings weren’t as important. And it’s like, okay, so this is accurate. He reported it correctly and they just were, and he, he points out that it almost sounds salty that the data didn’t come out the way they wanted to.

How much they focused on just the pregnant moms.

Simone Collins: Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: So then a [00:08:00] study on domestic violence against women finds that men are more likely to be victims than women. A 2005 study on domestic violence wrote their entire abstract in a way that implies that domestic violence is significantly worse against women than men.

But the actual body of their research reports the exact opposite of that. A fact that other researchers eventually discovered and wrote about. While not strictly about discrimination, they are guilty of expecting to find that things were worse for women, when in reality it’s men who appear disproportionately affected.

And this was 2007 Women who perpetuate Intimate Partner Violence, a review of the literature with recommendation for treatment, aggressive behavior. And then a, the, the, the offending study that lied about this mm-hmm. 2005, gender and the seriousness of assault on intimate partners and their victims.

Journal of Marriage and Family. So. What, what actually happened in this study. This one is a bit more nuanced. This examines the seriousness of assault injuries, et cetera, and finds male intimate partner [00:09:00] assaults often are more serious or severe than female ones. Though some effects align with general violence patterns.

So. Basically what they’re saying here and what they, they did not like is they’re saying, well, the effects of the abuse are worse when it’s men doing it. And it’s like, well, no dumb men are stronger, women are weaker, right? Like, am I allowed to say that? I don’t know. Is that gonna get clipped out? And they’re gonna be like, how dare he?

I saw a strong woman once I saw a strong, how care can he say women are, are weaker when a strong woman exists? But anyway. You, you know, you know how they argue? Oh my gosh. That pomegranate juice that was foaming like that. You were right. It was fermented. I can feel the effects of the alcohol.

Simone Collins: Oh my God.

Malcolm Collins: Is that safe to drink accidentally home fermented

Simone Collins: concrete?

Malcolm Collins: I always stopped drinking it because it [00:10:00] had so many, whoa, that is strong. Anyway,

Simone Collins: as your mom would say, not gonna lie, I feel a little tipsy. You are in for it, Mr. Oh my goodness gracious.

Malcolm Collins: People know what, I drop something because I stopped drinking.

On screen. If I see, if they see me drinking something that looks purple like this, it’s, it’s pomegranate juice. And I guess this one. Woo. Great. Whoa.

Simone Collins: Yeah. Pomegranate moonshine, ladies and gentlemen.

Malcolm Collins: Great. That was, well, I, it foamed a ton and I was like,

Simone Collins: it’s, I mean, did it taste good? Was it, it tastes

Malcolm Collins: vinegary and pomegranate, which works actually so

Simone Collins: Well, I mean, I guess if things ever get real rough.

I,

Malcolm Collins: I know

Simone Collins: we just have a blizzard. We’re shut in here. You know, if you run out of,

Malcolm Collins: no, not just that, a foam to create like a champagne taste as [00:11:00] well.

Simone Collins: Wow. I mean, posh.

Malcolm Collins: Posh.

Simone Collins: Yeah. I like it. I like it. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I’m, I’m just gonna stick to my, what am I on now? Just five ounces of vodka to get a tiny bit tipsy.

I’m glad you’re getting something out of just a few sips of off po pomegranate juice. You really have cut down. If that’s getting you going.

Malcolm Collins: So what the, the actual study showed was that yes, women do it more, but it’s less severe when women do it, which like, okay, I get the nuance, but like that’s something they, that that’s the more interesting finding.

And then they go to the 1975 National Family Violence Survey uncovered higher rates of abuse against men. Mm. The very first large scale federal study of domestic violence in the United States was carried out by researchers who expected to find higher rates of female victimization compared to male victimization.

Mm-hmm. The results of the study showed that slightly more men than women were victims of domestic violence, including severe forms of domestic violence. So this one showed the opposite on severe forms of domestic violence. [00:12:00] Two of these researchers, ma and Straus and Susan Reman spent the rest of their career to researching this phenomenon and discovering this.

Wow. Reman in particular was the first researcher to coin the battered husband syndrome back in 1977. A concept that would eventually be co-opted by feminists during the 1980s to write it as a myth when applied to men early CTS and so what, what AI is saying here. Also, I note here because I was. A little worried that we were gonna have, obviously Jewish names on all of these.

And, and even the based ones include obviously Jewish researchers, right? They’re on both sides of this guys. Okay. The, the, you gotta, you got a, a, a schleman here who’s, who’s showing that men get abused by women too. So, as I point out, they’re just overrepresented in sort of all educated things. But I, I understand how people get into sort of a noticing pattern recognition mindset.

So, what AI said when I was like, is, is, is this true? Mm. Vinegar, [00:13:00]

Simone Collins: oh my God, you’re still.

Malcolm Collins: Two of those researchers, Maray Straus and Susan Reman, I’m not gonna let something go to waste. I’m like You. She went from, oh

Simone Collins: no, you’re taking after me now. This is

Malcolm Collins: Bad Jar. A spoiled almond butter that made her horribly sick, like she thought she had a really bad flu. And then it turned out she was just eating spoiled nuts and we found the culprit and then she finished with it.

Freaking Malmo for a apothecary diary. And it came up, she admitted it to me afterwards ‘cause we were watching that show and she goes, I synthesize so much. And now she’s thinking, I don’t let things go to waste either. We’ll see how actively sick it ends up making me. And then I can make decisions about drinking spoiled juices in the future.

Simone Collins: Yeah, experimentation is always worthwhile as long as it doesn’t cause permanent serious damage. So be careful.

Malcolm Collins: Two of the researchers Maray Straus in its, yeah, actually, I, I should not have any more of that. That’s a mistake.

Simone Collins: Please don’t. Yeah, please stop. [00:14:00] I, I can handle it. I, I don’t, one, you don’t have my pain tolerance, so that, and also two, you don’t have my stomach.

So also that.

Malcolm Collins: No.

Simone Collins: Okay. Don’t.

Malcolm Collins: So early CTS based surveys like Strauss and gals, found rough gender symmetry in purple. Perpetration rates sometimes slightly higher for men as victims in minor violence. Contrary to expectations. Straus 2010 argues denial of symmetry persisted. This is a real debated area in DV research.

Feminist critiques argue cts overcount situational violence and undercounts coercive control slash severity, where women per date as perpetrators or predominate as perpetrators, ply, and others face backlash. Okay, so. Basically I, I do, because I’ve actually read this research, he, they are slightly misstating it, yes, men face slightly more, but we’re talking like insignificant, slightly more abuse [00:15:00] than, than women face. In terms of the directionality of the abuse in male female relationships this gets more interesting when you’re talking about same-sex women and same-sex male relationships where same-sex women relationships are much more abusive than same-sex male relationships.

Although the most abusive are bisexual relationships which watch our video on like, bisexuals, what’s wrong with you? Because like all of the stats are off the charts when you’re dealing with bisexuals. I, I always thought they would be like between straight people and gays, but it’s like, no, they’re like a more extreme version of gayness with like any, any negative way that gayness affects your wife.

Bisexual affects. About twice as much but even being an abuser. But the, the it is a bit of an overclaim to say too much, and I think it’s, it’s easier to just be like, the shocking thing is it’s the rates were about equal. What I find uniquely hilarious and I think it shows why it is so dangerous to get married to somebody who doesn’t.

Disavow feminism is the sociopathy with the way that feminists handle this. To say [00:16:00] that feminist critiques argue, CTSO over counts situational violence. When women do it, it’s just. Situational violence. They’re just angry.

Simone Collins: They’re just No, they’re just hangry. Okay. Yeah,

Malcolm Collins: they’re just hysterical.

They’re on their period. It’s situational,

Simone Collins: man. I mean, I do see how this could happen though, because I think women feel like they have impunity. So I, I just feel like from a, let’s say you are a male or a female and you are equally mad and in exactly the same situation, you are more likely to actually express.

Violent behavior as a woman because you feel as though you have more impunity and you’re also aware of the fact that technically speaking, on average, you are going to do less damage. I think men are aware of the fact that they, they can really, really, really hurt someone if they don’t control themselves when they fly into a [00:17:00] rage.

Whereas a woman who flies into a rage against a man is not as likely, and she’s aware of this. To get so out of control that physically she will permanently harm or, or break bones or things like that, right? It, it’s, it’s just physically harder for a woman who’s completely blind with rage and acting physically to cause the same amount of damage as

Malcolm Collins: a man.

Look at this woman talking here. Look, look at her. Diffuse defending abusive women.

Simone Collins: Oh, God, no, I’m, no, I’m, I’m explaining why I think women do this. As much as they do. ‘cause because it’s, it still surprises me because I think women are more conflict avoidant in general, aren’t they? Right. Especially because they’ve, not that I, this testosterone.

I mean,

Malcolm Collins: where does the concept of the Karen come from? They’re much, I mean.

Simone Collins: No, but they, the, the, the Karen is famous for attempting to exert force through appeals to authority, not through her, her own [00:18:00] physical action. I feel like,

Malcolm Collins: I don’t know. No. Karen’s become violent like really frequently in videos that I’ve seen.

Simone Collins: Yes, I know. I know. This is gonna be a whole nother repeat of Simone Sides with Bear.

Malcolm Collins: Simone. No, I love that. I have my ti She, she’s just too autistic to be, to not

Simone Collins: try to, I’m trying to think through it, but I, I think I don’t, nevermind. Pretend I didn’t say anything side.

Malcolm Collins: This bear,

Simone Collins: she chose the bear. He chose the man.

Oh guys, I get it. Okay.

Malcolm Collins: I need to warn our audience who is now obviously, and I think rightfully scared of what I have to go through in this relationship that Simone. Almost never beats me. And that I live a, a life without any fear of regular beatings.

Simone Collins: I’m sure you feared for my life when you accidentally dipped your hand into, into my popcorn dish [00:19:00] yesterday flew off the handle.

Malcolm Collins: I was genuinely, I was like, oh, no,

Simone Collins: I’m sorry. I really am sorry about that. I felt bad after

Malcolm Collins: I touched her popcorn and I thought it was for the kids, so I was like, oh, I’ll have some before I, I go service them,

Simone Collins: come for my popcorn and

Malcolm Collins: I got in between and I in her popcorn. Don’t darling. The, like, like a lion or something?

I could, I could see the

it was it was you know, in the nature documentaries when the one lion comes in and like tries to eat the other lion’s kill and it’s not ready to give the,

Simone Collins: yeah.

Malcolm Collins: And it gets that like, like what are you thinking?

Simone Collins: Nevermind. I take back what I said. It makes perfect sense that this many women are, the aggressors I was wrong

Malcolm Collins: was

Simone Collins: wrong.

She didn’t,

Malcolm Collins: by the way, actually, like I did you, did you like grab my hand or something?

Simone Collins: No, I [00:20:00] didn’t. No. I just, I, I, I said a thing that your mom used to. Often say,

Malcolm Collins: yeah, yeah, yeah. So even when you’re really mad, you don’t like, hit me or anything. So I, I get away without the aggression. Fortunately I did get hit very aggressively by multiple of our children yesterday.

Now they are larger now, and I hadn. Thought through how much making them love fighting me is going to become a problem as they become incrementally larger and now as a group can take me down.

Simone Collins: Yeah, because they fight very gently with each other. They do not fight gently with Malcolm. They just, that’s when they, that’s when they don’t pull punches.

It, it’s when they don’t, they, they play for keeps. He is a literal punching bag.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. I’m literally like, how

Simone Collins: hard then he can get hurt. Well, it’s because they respect you so much and you’re, you’re their strong, safe place. So of course there’s nothing they could ever do that would hurt you because you can defeat Krampus.

You can defeat the balu, you can defeat [00:21:00] wingos. Right? So of course they could never hurt you. It is logical of God. Am I defending? I’m defending abusers.

Malcolm Collins: You’re defending the abusers.

Simone Collins: What is wrong with me?

Malcolm Collins: A woman defends a bear. You see the bear and you immediately rush like,

Simone Collins: hold on. Look at this little bear.

I not sign with bears when I always

Malcolm Collins: say, maybe the bear was hungry. Maybe he was hungry. Maybe that’s why he ate the family.

Simone Collins: I hate that I’m sitting here just proving all of

Malcolm Collins: the reasons. You’re actually like the police. At, at, at a Bears invaded somebody’s, this is, you end up putting the bear in the episode where the bear was living in the guy’s house in California and the government wouldn’t let him evicted.

And your response to this horrifying scenario was like, the guy isn’t trying hard enough.

Simone Collins: Oh my God. And yesterday my dad was saying that. Coyote cubs that the mother had set her cubs loose and that the coyote cubs had eaten [00:22:00] nine of their chickens. And I was like, well, at least the coyote cubs aren’t hungry.

What again, what is, yes, this is a very female response, I guess, right? That that, well, I’m sure the, the person who did the damage needed to do it, but then I guess it goes to show what a feminized take it is when you hear. Anyone saying something like, well, the person who stole my bike, I’m sure they needed it more when really, no, these are actually, not to use more leftist terms, but these are larger systemic problems.

When someone steals your bike, they’re not actually riding their, your bike to their job that they’re. Working hard at to feed their family? No. It’s part of this massive bike trafficking chain that is run largely by one man based in Mexico, and there’s an amazing, I think, planet Money episode about it, again, to reference leftist media, but.

Malcolm Collins: And this whole thing is it you, I always give the reference to [00:23:00] the vash, the stampede, you know, quote about not knives argument was, was vash. I always thought it was so interesting, there was a villain’s argument against the hero when the villain was clearly in the right, in this argument that, you know, you can’t save a spider.

And the butterfly, if you save the butterfly, eventually the spider’s going to starve. You know, you have to be decisive and choose one. And the same way that like.

Speaker 6: I didn’t want to kill the spider. I wanted to save them both. What are you talking about? Unless the spider caught the butterfly, it would die of starvation anyway. You can’t save both, don’t you know that?

Speaker 5: It’s not right to make that choice so easily. Both of them are living creatures, Knives. BUt

Speaker 6: I’m not wrong about this, Rem. If you just keep saving the butterflies, the spiders will die. Yes, but Wanting to save both is just a naive contradiction. And what would you have rather had us do, just stand and think about it? In the meantime, while we do that, the spider eats the butterfly

Speaker 5: What’s

Speaker 6: wrong with

Speaker 7: you, Knives?! don’t you understand?! [00:24:00] I wanted to save both of them, you idiot!

Speaker 6: Don’t make any sense, Bash.

Malcolm Collins: We can’t live in a world where sometimes a Karen isn’t shot and ice officers are harassed. Either ice officers are inconvenienced or we don’t get to shoot.

Karen’s, and I don’t, I don’t understand, by the way, I’m joking here. She literally hit a law enforcement agent with her car, and the other guy literally attacked a police officer while he was armed holding a gun, right? Like, yeah, they may have knocked the gun outta his hand first, but you ask anyone.

Hey, if you attack a law enforcement officer while armed, what do you think is the most likely outcome of that? You get shot? Yeah, you get shot. And, and shocked. Peek at you face from the left right now. But the, the point here being is, is there there are bad actors in society and, and we have to address them, you know, like, and [00:25:00] I think they, they’re outing themselves and I think we need to be societally as aggressive towards them as they were towards us on the, let’s call them the, capitol building protest day when a bunch of our side ended up in jail for like eight years for stuff. Way less bad than is happening at ice protests right now. Right? Like, they’re throwing bricks at like passerby cars that aren’t even involved in this, that could easily end up killing someone, right?

Like this is. Horrifying what’s being done. We’ve had multiple instances of them opening up shootings. I love that. There was that one where everyone was like, oh, there’s a shooting at the ice detention facility. Can you believe how evil Right wingers this was right after, I think the Charlie Kirk shooting.

It was a few days after that. Mm-hmm. And everyone was like, look, the right does shootings too. And then it turned out it was leftist trying to shoot the detention agents. They just missed and shot the detainees. And nobody ever talked about it again after that. ‘cause obviously, duh. Left wing [00:26:00] shooting a tent.

That’s just another day in the, the city right now, right? Like, we just expect that like, oh, some trans person tried to shoot people again.

Speaker 7: Nice to meet you, . Listen, if you ever need anybody murdered. Please give me a call and you, you’re giving him card. No.

Code of ethics. I will kill anyone anywhere. Children, animals, old people, doesn’t matter. I just love killing

Speaker 6: you.

Malcolm Collins: Okay. So to continue here. 20 10, 30 years of denying the evidence on gender symmetry and partner violence implications for the prevention of treatment.

This is about the, the research we’re talking about above. So, related to this is the fact that Aaron Pricely discovered the same thing on the ground after opening the world. First domestic violence center for women in Britain. All of the relevant parties here took this in stride and bravely went against the status quo.

So when, so like when they tried to open this, they found, oh, about half the people who are coming are men. In some instances, they even received death threats and bomb threats from feminists for trying to help men. All three are widely [00:27:00] celebrated in the men’s rights movement.

Simone Collins: Oh my gosh.

Malcolm Collins: But th th this is wild here, that you open a domestic violence shelter.

You allow it to sometimes help men and feminists will threaten to bomb you. When they say, and they get mad at you for saying All lives matter. They really. Do not mean, oh. Well, it’s just we need to focus on this discriminated group. They really do not believe all lives matter. All victims matter. It is some lives are more equal than others.

And the reason they had to remake that movie is so that you wouldn’t know the, the context of what is meant by that. That when somebody

Simone Collins: wait. Animal Farm was remade. Are you saying that?

Malcolm Collins: Oh yeah. They remade it. They remade it. And what was funny is it was remade by a Christian company that like did a lot of Christian shows before.

Okay. And they, and they made the core bad guy, not the pigs, but a stand-in for Elon Musk who drove like a cyber truck. Are you

Simone Collins: serious?

Malcolm Collins: Capitalist. And we’re like super pro business and [00:28:00] stuff.

Simone Collins: What?

Speaker 12: , pigs and humans working together.

Speaker 8: All animals are equal. But some are more equal than others.

I parked the car. Let’s have no one do that again.

Speaker 10: Animal farm. Okay. Cautionary tales

Malcolm Collins: yes. Should we have done an episode on this? I thought that this was too saturated in the right wing media that I didn’t

Simone Collins: even do enough.

Oh, wait, this happened recently?

Malcolm Collins: Presumably this is like a, this last month or like a two months ago.

Simone Collins: Okay. I sorry. I, this is my first time hearing about it. Okay. That’s wild. That’s like

Malcolm Collins: in it. Yeah. It’s

Simone Collins: life. It’s life action.

Malcolm Collins: No, no. He, he plays.

Simone Collins: Oh, he voices wanna be. Wait, so if it’s anti-capitalist, then how?

Nevermind. Wait, let’s not go down that rabbit hole. Let’s keep talking about,

Malcolm Collins: well, actually I do need to, because I haven’t mentioned this point on the show in a [00:29:00] while and I used to mention it a lot and it’s something that people really need to get.

Simone Collins: Okay.

Malcolm Collins: The gay pride flag. Okay. It meant everyone under the rainbow, every color stood for like, art, liberty, et cetera.

It wasn’t like, you know, gays, lesbians, whatever.

Simone Collins: Yeah. It’s not like male, male attracted people. Are represented only by the rainbow spectrum and then no one else.

Malcolm Collins: It, it, it meant inclusivity. That was the entire point of putting thera saying the full spectrum.

Simone Collins: Yes.

Malcolm Collins: Everyone under the rainbow.

Simone Collins: Mm.

Malcolm Collins: The progress pride flag, or as we call it on the show, the colonizer’s flag.

They took the flag that meant inclusivity and literally started defacing it with. Additional signs for specific groups. So a flag that meant equality was literally defaced with signs to say, [00:30:00] but yes, but these groups need to be more equal than other groups. And which groups is it? It is brown and black people.

And trans people. It is literally, there could not be a more perfect representation of the urban monoculture. Of its conquest over cultural institutions. When it hangs it from a institution, it’s saying, I conquered this, then that flag. And we need to recognize it for what it is. It is a defaced sign of inclusivity.

And the reason why that’s not obvious to people is because the lesson of animal farm is no longer top of mind for people. Mm-hmm. Whenever somebody says, well, but some groups are more equal than others, you need to be like, well wait a second here. That’s literally just animal farm.

Okay. While there are a few quote unquote honest studies out there, the most well known okay, sorry. Several studies on sexual assaults have found near equal rates of male victimization as female victimization. While there are a few quote unquote honest studies out there, the most well [00:31:00] known try to hide this.

Fact, in their research, the primary strategy they use is to divine female on male grape as something else that’s not grape. Recently the CDC came under fire for this Stimple Meyer 2014. The Sexual Victimization of Men in America. New Data Challenge, old Assumptions. American Journal of Public Health.

No. So this was funny. I put this in ai and AI just goes accurate. C-D-C-N-I-S-C-V data shows similar rates of made to penetrate for men versus grape for women in some years. But, but I love that AI always eats to sit for the other side, but definitions differ. Grape, often coated as penetration of the victim.

Well, then definitionally women can’t do it.

Simone Collins: I feel like the men can’t be raped. Argument, is it? It hits me very similarly to the, well, women have a way to spontaneously abort pregnancies. They don’t want argument like, I’m sorry, how does this make sense? [00:32:00] Ex, explain this to me, but whatever.

Malcolm Collins: All right. A study trying to prove that mothers are discriminated against in family court instead found the exact opposite and then tried to hide it.

A study from late 1980 on child custody discrimination expected to find discrimination against mothers and not fathers, LOL. But I How could you even think you were going to find that? You’d have to be so dumb. So cooked in the feminist narrative to think that child custody course don’t discriminate against fathers.

But instead discovered that men were six times less likely to gain custody compared to identically placed women. Not only did their publication attempt to use dishonest statistical shenanigans to hide this, they tried to bury the raw data and prevent other researchers from double checking their findings.

Mm-hmm. Their study is still widely cited by researchers as well as by random people on the internet because it is. The only study that on the surface found discrimination against mothers in one meta study, it sticks out like a so [00:33:00] sum in comparison to around 10 other studies that found the exact opposite.

You can read the meta study here and a list of sources on page 9, 7 4 in the footnotes. The me meta is Beyond Economic Fatherhood, encouraging divorce fatherhood to Parent. And then the offending study was 1989. So keep in mind this has been happening since the late eighties gender bias study of the court systems in Massachusetts.

So, science has been cut for a while. The story of how one researcher discovered that the study was fraudulent and how he came into possession of the raw data that they had tried to bury can be found here. 1995 misrepresentation of gender bias in the 1989. Support of the gender bias committee of the Massachusetts Supreme Judicial Court, breaking the science.

Ooh, maybe we could do an episode on that. By the way, an episode I just queued up to work on is average racial attractiveness of men and women. I’ve never seen somebody do a breakdown of that, and I I Are you just like, are you just, are you just [00:34:00] gunning for a van here?

Simone Collins: I, I thought we were gonna try, try to be good.

We just are, we just, we can’t help ourselves. I’m not gonna

Malcolm Collins: make this subjective. I’m gonna have a tear list that’s done by scientists.

Simone Collins: Oh, thank goodness. That solves all of the problem. That is. Why not just fine, fine, fine, fine.

Malcolm Collins: Well, I think that some you know, ethnicities get blurred, right? Like,

Simone Collins: blurred blurt, what, what is this blurt?

Malcolm Collins: Some ethnicities have a high ancy between the males and the females. Attractiveness,

Simone Collins: disparity,

Malcolm Collins: discrepancy like for example,

Simone Collins: okay, I am sorry. You’ve been hit by poisoned ferment, Bob for seeing this. The signs, oh no.

Malcolm Collins: Shut up. This is abuse. This is what I deal with. I was just trying to save the family money.[00:35:00]

Simone Collins: Oh

Malcolm Collins: my God. And I was tasting the delicious pomegranate juice.

Simone Collins: I can’t feel my fingertips. It’s so cold in here. And you’re drinking expired pomegranate. We need. We gotta figure something out, man.

Oh God. Okay. Keep going. So you’re gonna do an episode on that? Yeah. Any, any final thoughts here on the, no

Malcolm Collins: wait, we’re not done yet.

Simone Collins: Oh, God.

Malcolm Collins: So, the, the, god, actually, I’m just gonna read an AI response here and you could tell how much this is true from how much it tries to say it’s not true, and the ways it tries to say it’s not true.

Simone Collins: Okay.

Malcolm Collins: This is a contested claim from men’s right sources, a contested claim that doesn’t say it’s not true. The report stated fathers who actively seek custody. Get primary joy at custody around 70% of the time. Refuting pervasive maternal bias claims. [00:36:00] Rosenfeld’s critique argues the SAT was misleading.

EEG didn’t distinguish contested versus uncontested cases. Used a small sample of father’s thinking that is. Accurate, then That’s a very accurate contested con con contest.

Simone Collins: Contestation,

Malcolm Collins: contestation meta-analysis and other studies show mothers will win most contested cases overall, but fathers who pursue aggressively often succeed at higher rates.

I highly doubt that. Not clear fraud, but selective presentation. Yes, that’s fraud. Come on. But anyway, to continue going here. Unsubstantiated reports that women were being underrepresented in medical research has created a large gap against male medical research. The researchers in this case may not have a bias, but their research was conducted against a general assumption that medical research was unfairly focused on men.

The complaints were loud enough to inspire research into the topic where it was [00:37:00] quickly found that far more interest and money. Put into women’s research than men’s research, including even in areas where men are known to be affected more. Recently, John Oliver repeated these myths despite some of his research being almost 20 years old now.

So this has been happening for a long time at this point. Oh, wow. 2001.

Simone Collins: I mean, most of the media coverage is about how. All scientific research is oriented around white men in their twenties and no other group is represented. And I mean, historically that has been a serious problem, hasn’t it? I mean, and it still is an issue.

It’s

Malcolm Collins: been more of a problem that white people are overrepresented, but this is in part because we weren’t allowed to do medical experimentations on other groups after like Tuskegee experiments and everywhere. And they’re knickers in a twist. And so now most medical experiments are done on white people.

‘cause nobody wants to say you did a medical experiment on some other group. And so there are given drugs that aren’t good for them. Nobody cares. Nobody cares about actually going. Nobody used to

Simone Collins: use the word knickers in the same paragraph as Tuskegee. Experiment.

Malcolm Collins: When did I say the N word?

Simone Collins: You said knickers.

Malcolm Collins: Knickers.

Simone Collins: You [00:38:00] close. It’s too close. You can’t do that. You can’t use the worders. You sounded like you were

Malcolm Collins: saying the other word.

Simone Collins: That’s why you said you can’t use the word knickers.

Malcolm Collins: Knickers. Okay.

Simone Collins: God, especially not when you’re a little tipsy.

Malcolm Collins: Recently bar, this was 2001, did medical research routinely exclude women an examination of the evidence epistemology.

And then John Oliver repeats these in his, in, in the midst in his coverage of gender bias in the healthcare field. Men are human. A study that’s with an art. I think an article here, men are Human, where they talk about and repeat John Oliver showing stuff that is untrue. His show is just.

An entirely untrue show if you ever covered something that you know a lot about. It’s, it’s basically just fiction. A study expecting to find discrimination against girls in math and science is said, found that boys are discriminated against in literally every [00:39:00] single subject. Before we get to this one, sometimes people will say like, you guys make mistakes on your show too.

Generally, we try to correct those mistakes in the next episode, but the number one place, if you, if you actually look our con. Our feed and you’ll see people saying you made mistakes. It’s almost always people from a specific religious community that I think are and, and note here I’m not talking about like, it’s always what we attack a lot of religious community.

We, we try to get based on a lot of traditional religious concepts on this. And it’s typically them saying. What you said about my community is not accurate or our history is not accurate here. And I think a reasonable person would either be, like, in some cases you’re just nitpicking and for the point of the point that they’re making what they said was correct or you might be too biased to see that they have a point on this stuff.

If we come across as broadly accurate when we’re critiquing other religious communities to you. But [00:40:00] just we only mess up with your community. That’s probably something to dig into. And where I’ve made mistakes on that, like I did make some mistakes with the Thomas Aquinas and Augustus of Hippo thing.

I try to not make those mistakes again and speak more clearly on those specific points. But anyway and we did accidentally mix up Basham, bolem, ta and

Sabo Levy.

Malcolm Collins: Whatever in, in one episode. So we, we that, that’s the most embarrassing religious mix up I’ve ever made. But to continue here a study experimenting the find discrimination against girls in mass and science in.

I already read that. Okay. Another study on educational discrimination expected to find discrimination against female students. In part to explain why girls struggle in math and science, they instead found exactly the opposite of this. The male students were discriminated against in every subject, including even math and science.

The study was honest in how they reported the results, so, and the researchers were humble enough to admit that they expected to find different results in the [00:41:00] abstract. And then I asked in AI about this, and it said, accurate. The experiment found a two to one preference for women over identically qualified men in tenure track stem hires except when men were more accomplished.

Researchers were surprised by this and were honest. And then in a another study, the one that they were just referencing here in a AI says, accurate in Israel, blind grading, removing names. So teachers are biased against boys in all subjects. And, and this, this meant that even in subjects for girls typically outperform boys, the gap is widened.

When teachers know that boys are there to, to send a young boy to a school is just wild. You know, we’ve taken ours out and now seeing that there’s like games that he can play that just like do school. For him it’s like

Simone Collins: 2008 hitting milestones way faster. Yeah. If, if you are, if you have a boy in school, especially a young boy, a young active boy, and you could.

Feasibly possibly homeschool him. Maybe because he worked from [00:42:00] home, cannot recommend it enough.

Malcolm Collins: Stick him in front of a computer all day.

Simone Collins: Well, on a treadmill desk, that is underrated. Standing desks and treadmill desks for kids, I’m discovering. Highly underrated.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah, do 2008, we do gender stereotypes, reduce girls or boys, human capital outcomes guidance from a natural experiment.

Journal of Public Economics, an unpublished experiment meant to find discrimination against women in stem instead found evidence of the opposite.

How could you possibly think there was discrimination against women in stem? You’d have to be so F brain cooked to the researcher masked the voices of candidates so that their gender wouldn’t be known. The idea was that female candidates would do better than what they do when their gender is known.

She instead found that gender in the blind process benefited men instead of women. Indicating that there was gender discrimination against men. She never followed through with a large scale study because the researcher, a feminist, didn’t get the results that she wanted from her preliminaries trials.

Simone Collins: Hmm.

Malcolm Collins: 2016, this [00:43:00] tool gender swaps, the voices of tech, job candidates. Here’s what happened, the Washington Post. So they ended up covering this. And this is wild because it was a two to one difference.

Simone Collins: Oh no. Oh.

So many bad looks here.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. A study about employment discrimination in Australia found evidence of discrimination against men instead of women.

Mm-hmm. Another study on gender blinding performed in Australia was meant to find discrimination against women, but instead found discrimination against men.

Simone Collins: Well, you know what’s, so what’s even worse about this is you can ask. Pretty much any man living in a developed country these days. And they’d be like, well, obviously like I, I’ve been living this, but they are being gaslit about it.

No, you’re not,

Malcolm Collins: you’re

Simone Collins: not the, you’re the aggressor. You’re the patriarchy. We need more representation of women and everyone who’s not you. And that’s, IIII can, I can only imagine what [00:44:00] that is like I, I can, I can I maybe slightly vicariously lived that through you. But it, it must be incredibly frustrating, especially for young men who absolutely have been living this and just everyone’s like, no, no, you’re not.

No, no, no. We’re not

Malcolm Collins: discriminated. And this is, but the bear, think of the bear.

Simone Collins: I’m sorry. I’m sorry. I, I am part of the problem. Do I need to go on my apology tour now?

Malcolm Collins: Mm-hmm. Yeah. You gotta, you gotta do your, your. You gotta go full plural. Davis, Simone, all the way Proman. She’s, she’s very, very proman in her stuff.

She’s the most pro male person I have seen online more than any men’s rights advocate that I have seen. I think, I think that she can afford, you know, you can be that far when you’re a woman. So, a widely cited study on orchestra auditions supposedly found evidence of discrimination against women is flawed and may manufacture the opposite.

The [00:45:00] results were not statistically significant since the data was flawed to begin with, which is perhaps what allowed the original researchers to mold it to their predetermined conclusions. However, it does support the idea that men are discriminated against. A fact that shows up in their data tables plain as day.

Inside the study related Vancouver Symphony holds blind composition Competition causes outrage when all the women nerves are male and mostly white. VSO promises to discriminate against white males next year. Can remember when I saw that coming out on men’s Right stuff. Feminists inspired investigations into pay discrimination against women at Google.

And the BBC instead found that men were being underpaid.

Simone Collins: Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: Adding to these comments, this brings the total up to 11. Here we have, I’m sure

Simone Collins: d the data differently. Women would actually be able to show that men are still out earning them. And the problem I, I would imagine is that men are more qualified.

So that for, for the same level of qualification, men are being [00:46:00] paid profoundly less, but men are probably still being paid more because they’re the vast majority. Like there, there just are not enough women who are qualified in these very highly paid roles, if that makes sense.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Andy this is posted, I guess I should say who posted it?

Xbox Hacks or z. Is very Reddit name. Yes. How is Reddit fun again? Base camp Reddit is actually, like, I have started checking Reddit regularly again, and I haven’t done that in ages, but I, I just do it on the base camp sub the base camp. ‘cause it’s, it’s like, you know, kata in action, but like 10 times as large.

And, and way more Mimi.

Simone Collins: I follow R out of the loop because it helps me understand what people think is important to the media, like topics that people want to have explained. But then it also helps me understand what the go-to left is. Take on it is, which is helpful.

Malcolm Collins: You

Simone Collins: we’ll say Left is center take.

Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: My wife here. Watches mostly leftist media. Oh, even

Simone Collins: profoundly. Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: You, [00:47:00] you watched this podcast where they did an episode on us that was entirely wrong. Like you said, they were the most factually wrong. Anyone who’s ever been about us.

Simone Collins: Yeah. A bit fruity with Matt Bernstein. Love that podcast. You

Malcolm Collins: watched them.

Simone Collins: I love, I love snark though. So

Malcolm Collins: I think we might be the only like right wing podcast where one of the hosts is actually like really up with what’s going on in left wing media and yet doesn’t even know standard right wing memes, but like Animal Farm was remade and Elon Musks was made the villain.

Simone Collins: Yeah, that’s, that’s

Malcolm Collins: really funny.

Christian Media Studio.

Simone Collins: Wow.

Malcolm Collins: Talk about, actually a really fun thing happened quite a whim since you don’t watch the Game on Media. And I know actually we, we have a lot of listeners, so I do not think watch the game or media. So no worry about video game. That’s about medieval times. It’s called I say a Knight’s

Path.

Malcolm Collins: looks really good.

Simone Collins: Okay.

Malcolm Collins: Anyway and it’s really cool actually. So they made it super realistic about medieval times, but then [00:48:00] they included like monster type stuff in it, but only stuff that you would find at the illustrations in old manuscripts. Oh,

Simone Collins: that’s cool.

Malcolm Collins: Giant snails and

Simone Collins: like killer rabbits.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Like giant snails and killer rabbits,

Simone Collins: giant snails and killer rabbits.

That’s awesome.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Like, oh, that looks so fun. And somebody ask them, they go, are, are you gonna put something like L-L-G-B-T in this game in one of the comments? And they’re like, no, we won’t use our game to push your agenda. And. The, the lefties freaked out about it. And in the meantime, there’s this other game called 1385 x Luxe or something.

Mm-hmm. They basically takes place in a similar time period, but it’s about a lesbian romance of a knight, which you female night which never would’ve happened in this time period. And

Simone Collins: sort of arc come on. I mean, at least there are,

Malcolm Collins: wasn’t lesbian.

Simone Collins: I mean, you don’t know that.

Malcolm Collins: I think,

Simone Collins: am I doing it again?

Okay. We need to shut this down before I get,

Malcolm Collins: she was [00:49:00] incredibly devout and, and all the chds are going for this one game is doing really

Simone Collins: well. Yeah. What is more lesbian than a nunnery Malcolm? Just

Malcolm Collins: because, and then they complained that they made the love interest in the other Knight’s game. They go, she looks too clean.

And makeup and basically pretty to be a medieval woman. And they’re like,

Simone Collins: oh, I thought you were gonna say to be a lesbian. Oh, why did

Malcolm Collins: I just say that? No, this is, no, this is not the lesbian, the, the, the lesbian looks dirty and ugly. Okay. I’m not gonna put love interest in the game that everybody likes.

And so. The, the we’re, we’re hoping we’re gonna begin to see a resurgence of, of good media. You just need me to get on my project of making Minneapolis 2026. That, that’s where they’re fighting right now. Minneapolis, right?

Simone Collins: Yeah, Minneapolis. By the way, would you mind getting the kids, ‘cause I can’t bear to go outside again.

Malcolm Collins: Okay. I’ll go get the kids. I love

Simone Collins: you. Do you want me to, do you want me to call? Yeah. Cool. Okay, great. I love you very much and this is insane and I’ve, I’ve stepped in it too many times for us to keep recording plus it late, [00:50:00] so, right.

Malcolm Collins: Mrs. Bears, I gotta make a song about Simone and Bears.

Simone Collins: Look at the bear.

Do he needs your nose, he needs you two side with him. Yes.

Malcolm Collins: Look at his face. He’s like this woman, this bear.

Simone Collins: What is going on, sir?

Malcolm Collins: That look, he is never seen himself. I think he is like, whoa.

Simone Collins: No, he likes looking at himself in the mirror. Do you see yourself? No. I don’t know. I don’t know what’s going on, but anyway yes, please. I will, I will call and thank you and I love you. All

Speaker 13: In the woods, so deep and dark. Simone walks alone at night. She meets around. I’m grizzly there. Under Pale Moon life, the man might talk, my charm might [00:51:00] live, might cause a fright, but the bear just roars and hugs real tight. What a lovely sight.

Over every man out there without care, you’ll replace the guys with pause and fur. So Simone’s got a new love story First time. Valentine

the beast. He’s wild and full of claw. She smiles and says he. Honest deer. No hidden flaws, no texts at 3:00 AM. No games, no endless calls. Just honeypots and forest walks answering nature’s calls. O chose bear, ditching [00:52:00] a. It’s really rare. You’ll trade the patriarchy for a furry. Simone’s new boyfriend’s got four legs in the end.

Now Malcolm’s left to wonder why she sides with claws and teeth while he’s out here defending men grinding his teeth. She’ll picnic with the big old brute salmon from the stream and whisper. More predictable than any man’s bad. Maybe one day she’ll come back home with bear hugs for the crew, but till then, she’s dancing wild where the tall pines grew.

Malcolm sings [00:53:00] this silly tune, half laughing, half in fear. My wife’s replaced all human kind.

With one big fuzzy, dear Simone, you chose the bear. Now. The forest is your love affair, boys. Hello and

Simone.

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