Where Did All the Middle Managers Go?
Mostly Growth
Outro
Closing credits, production note, and signoff from the hosts and producer Ben Hillman.
In this episode of Mostly Growth, CJ, Kyle, and Ben start with Carl’s infamous “AWS from the car” rant before diving into a sharp, funny breakdown of corporate title inflation and the slow death of middle management. From “Founding BDRs” to self-proclaimed “VPs of vibes,” the crew dissects why org charts are flattening and how that changes leadership, accountability, and hiring. Then, in a classic Pricing Model Roast, they unpack why hybrid and usage-based models are both brilliant and broken, what outcome-based pricing gets wrong, and why take rates might secretly be the future. The trio closes with thoughts on momentum, AI urgency theater, and how to manage teams without burning them out—or yourself in the process.
Timestamps:
00:00 Carl from the Car on AWS
01:04 Mostly Growth intro theme
01:27 CJ’s flight back from LA (and the fake Wi-Fi warning)
02:00 “I finally learned where Mississippi was”
02:45 LA traffic and Nobu dinner with Ben
04:08 Ben’s history lesson: why LA is a transportation nightmare
06:34 “Clip it down” — segue to the main topic
07:20 Title deflation and the death of middle management
09:12 “Founding BDR” and generic LinkedIn titles
11:00 The problem with VP title inflation
12:31 The vanishing middle manager
14:03 “Bonfire of the Middle Managers” and why it matters
15:52 Shout-out to good managers everywhere
18:00 Pricing Model Roast — lightning round
19:49 Why hybrid pricing is the “best worst” model
22:12 Usage vs. commitment pricing in the AI era
25:09 Outcome-based pricing and cash-flow pain
31:23 Take-rate pricing and marketplace dynamics
33:29 Momentum is not a moat — but maybe it’s a boat
36:22 How fast companies really move in AI
38:38 Building urgency without burning out your team
41:10 Business Partners: The LinkedIn follower illusion
42:46 The optimal number of direct reports
45:24 Pricing in the Real World — why book publishing is a scam
Episodes Referenced:
The $1 Trillion AI Bubble: Nvidia, OpenAI, and the Feedback Loop
Decoding the Psychology of Price in the Age of AI | Michael Stanisz
996 Culture, Exploding AI Bills & SaaS Chaos
Links:
https://x.com/shamusmadan/status/1978471423522840643/photo/1
https://www.economist.com/business/2025/10/05/bonfire-of-the-middle-managers
https://www.growthunhinged.com/p/7de0e352-fd0f-4f75-bc70-f1adaa483a4a
https://investing101.substack.com/p/momentum-moat
https://www.amazon.com/Formula-Universal-Laws-Success/dp/0316505498
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