Scaling programs: veterans and MAPS protocol

In this episode of The Psychedelic Podcast, Paul F. Austin speaks with Dr. Paul Ryder, founding minister of the Congregation for Sacred Practices, about an alternative framework for psychedelic work rooted in spirituality, ritual, and community rather than medicine alone.

Paul Ryder shares how his own experiences led him to treat psychedelics as sacraments, and why he believes the medical model, while valuable, represents only an early phase of the psychedelic renaissance. Together, they explore how CSP operates as both a church and a seminary, training licensed ministers to hold ceremonies ethically, safely, and within a religious legal framework.

The conversation also examines the role of community in long-term transformation, the distinction between therapists and ministers, and why practices like breathwork, meditation, and integration circles are central to spiritual development. Throughout, Ryder offers a grounded perspective on how psychedelics can support not just healing, but maturation, responsibility, and a deeper sense of purpose.

You can find the full episode summary and related resources here: https://thethirdwave.co/podcast/episode-342/?ref=278

Episode Links

• The Congregation for Sacred Practices

Episode Sponsors:

• The Practitioner Certification Program by Third Wave's Psychedelic Coaching Institute.
• The Microdosing Practitioner Certification at Psychedelic Coaching Institute.
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