Structural Masonry vs. Veneer Explained

Austin contrasts true structural masonry with modern veneer and explains how depth, shadow, and durability differ.

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In this episode, Chris sits down with Austin Tunnell, founder of Building Culture - a real estate development and design-build company based in Oklahoma City specializing in structural masonry construction and walkable, mixed-use urban infill.

Austin's path to real estate is one of the more unusual ones we've had on the show. He grew up a football player in the suburbs of Houston, went to work at KPMG out of college, hated it, and joined the Peace Corps. A chance meeting with a master mason in Panama changed the trajectory of his life. He returned to the US and apprenticed for two years laying brick by hand for $12 an hour in rural Oklahoma while his wife cleaned houses to support them. Today Austin designs and develops some of the most beautiful residential and mixed-use projects being built in America, including an 18-townhome, live-work, and mixed-use commercial project currently underway in downtown Edmond, Oklahoma.

Chris and Austin go deep on Austin's philosophy of beauty, the case for building things meant to last hundreds of years, and the policy, financing, and culture obstacles standing in the way.

We discuss:

- How a chance meeting with a master mason in Panama changed the trajectory of Austin's life

- The difference between veneer brick and true structural masonry, and why almost no one in the US builds the real thing anymore

- Why Austin believes beauty is real, beauty is important, and beauty "connects us to the divine"

- Five simple brick details any developer can use to make a veneer building look dramatically better for almost no added cost

- How fire codes, building codes, and Euclidean zoning quietly destroy neighborhoods and push developers toward the same ugly apartment complexes

- Austin's long-term-hold model for funding new construction infill, inspired by Moses Kagan and ReSeed

- Missing middle housing, walkability, and why a 30-unit townhome neighborhood can feel more like home than any class-A apartment building

About the guest: Austin Tunnell is the founder of Building Culture, an Oklahoma City-based real estate development and design-build firm focused on beautiful, durable, human-scale neighborhoods. Building Culture specializes in structural masonry construction, walkable urban infill, and mixed-use development.

Links:

Building Culture - https://www.buildingculture.com/

Austin on TikTok - https://www.tiktok.com/@austintunnell

Austin on X - https://x.com/austintunnell

Austin on LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/austin-tunnell-2a41894a/

Topics:

(00:00:00) - Intro

(00:02:33) - Austin’s journey with the Peace Corps and how that led him to Masonry

(00:12:26) - Why we moved away from Masonry and toward wood frames

(00:15:19) - What drew Austin to Masonry

(00:19:34) - Learning the craft

(00:24:25) - Why humans gravitate toward humanely built things