Brad sits down with Dr. Rachel Wagner, Professor of Religious Studies at Ithaca College and author of Cowboy Apocalypse, for a sobering and necessary conversation about why guns hold such powerful meaning in American life. Prompted by recent mass shootings, the episode explores how firearms have become more than tools or political symbols and instead function as sacred objects tied to religion, masculinity, and apocalyptic imagination. Dr. Wagner introduces the idea of the “cowboy apocalypse,” a myth rooted in frontier nostalgia, the fantasy of the lone hero, and the belief that violence can restore order in a chaotic world. Together, Brad and Rachel unpack how this story continues to shape American responses to fear, danger, and social change.

The discussion traces how Christian theology, end times thinking, and cultural certainty have fused with gun culture, turning weapons into symbols of protection, identity, and belonging for some, while representing terror and exclusion for others. Brad and Rachel examine the evolution of the NRA from a gun safety organization into a political and quasi religious force, the role of masculinity and whiteness in defining who is seen as a “good guy with a gun,” and how moments like January 6 reflect a kind of live action role play driven by these myths. The episode closes with a powerful reflection on democracy itself, emphasizing that dialogue, complexity, and empathy are incompatible with the certainty promised by violence. It is a challenging conversation that invites listeners to confront the stories Americans tell about guns and what those stories cost us.

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