Intro

Most frameworks for working with AI agents assume humans should stay in the loop at every phase. That’s the wrong approach, says Cora general manager Kieran Klaassen.

Kieran is the creator of Every's AI-native engineering methodology, compound engineering. His four-step framework—plan, work, review, compound—rebuilds how engineers work with agents. The insight, worked out with collaborator Trevin Chow, is about when to be in the loop and when to step away and let the model handle it. "LLMs are very good at just following steps, doing deep work, working for hours—days even now," Kieran says. "That thing is kind of solved."

Kieran and Trevin describe an AI workflow as a sandwich. Agents are the workhorse filling, and humans are the bread, responsible for framing the problem at the start and reviewing the outputs at the end. 

Every CEO Dan Shipper talked with Kieran for AI & I about why setting the frame of a problem is still hard for agents, why simulated personas won't replace human judgment, Dan's bar for AGI—an agent worth running 24/7 with no off switch—and what Kieran's background as a classical composer taught him about performance, polish, and finding the parts of work that bring you joy.

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Discover more resources in the episode

• Compound engineering plugin: https://github.com/EveryInc/compound-engineering-plugin
• Compound engineering guide: https://every.to/source-code/compound-engineering-the-definitive-guide
• Compound engineering camp: https://every.to/source-code/compound-engineering-camp-every-step-from-scratch

Timestamps:  

 00:00:00 – Introduction and the AI sandwich metaphor
 00:02:33 – What compound engineering is and how it’s evolved
 00:04:27 – The "work" phase of agentic coding is essentially solved
 00:06:27 – Why humans belong at the beginning and the end of an AI workflow
 00:11:06 – Dan's argument for why agents can't change frames—and how this will keep us employed
 00:16:51 – Full automation is a moving target
 00:23:21 – Musical composition as a model for human-AI collaboration
 00:26:39 – Find your place in an AI-accelerated world by leaning into what brings you joy