Reflections: What We'd Do Differently

What does it take to guide visitors through histories that are genuinely contested and emotionally charged? In this episode, I'm joined by Brandon Dillard, Director of Historic Interpretation and Audience Engagement at Thomas Jefferson's Monticello, and Kelsie Paul, Director of Learning and Visitor Experience at the Frick Pittsburgh, to explore how both institutions have reimagined their guided experiences in response to the complicated legacies of their central historical figures.

We talk about the long evolution of interpretation at Monticello, from the site's earliest tours to the integration of slavery and the story of Sally Hemings into the core narrative. Kelsie shares the process behind the Frick's "Gilded, Not Golden" tour - a ground-up redesign of Clayton's 30-year-old house tour that involved consultants, an advisory board, difficult internal conversations and a willingness to start from scratch.

We also dig into what it means to support guides doing this work: hiring for empathy, investing in training, facilitating ongoing dialogue, and empowering guides to be facilitators rather than lecturers. And we reflect on the civic role of historic sites in a polarised moment, including how Monticello is approaching the 250th anniversary of the Declaration of Independence.

Whether you're working at a historic house, leading tours in any kind of museum or cultural space, or thinking about how to hold space for complexity in your guided programmes, I think you'll find a great deal to take away from this conversation.

The Art Engager is written and presented by Claire Bown. Editing is by Matt Jacobs and Claire Bown. Music by Richard Bown. Support on Patreon

Episode Links:

LinkedIn Kelsie: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kelsie-paul-39561b199/

Frick website: www.thefrickpittsburgh.org

Frick Instagram: @frickpittsburgh

Recent article on Clayton: https://www.pittsburghmagazine.com/places-we-love-clayton/

LinkedIn Brandon: www.linkedin.com/in/brandonmdillard

Monticello website: https://www.monticello.org/

Monticello Instagram: @tjmonticello

Show Links:

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