Safety tradeoffs for smaller reactors

Electricity underwrites nearly every aspect of modern life, yet decisions about power, cost, and control are increasingly opaque. New York Times energy correspondent Ivan Penn joins Mark Labberton to unpack how data centres, AI, utilities, and politics are reshaping the grid—and who ultimately bears the cost.

"The real focus is who pays and who gets paid."

In this episode with Mark Labberton, Penn reflects on his journey into journalism, his unexpected path into energy reporting, and how covering power revealed the economic forces shaping daily life.

Together they discuss electricity as a moral and economic issue, the rise of AI-driven data centres, nuclear power's return, utilities versus tech giants, consumer vulnerability, racial inequity in journalism, and faith as a commitment to truth.

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Episode Highlights

"The real focus is who pays and who gets paid."

"Electricity is the most important resource we have."

"The utilities once the Goliath have suddenly become a David."

"We wouldn't have need for any of this if you didn't build a data centre."

"To be able to stop abuse with a pen is a powerful thing."

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About Ivan Penn

Ivan Penn is an energy correspondent for the New York Times, where he reports on electricity, utilities, nuclear power, data centres, and the economic forces shaping the energy transition. He has covered energy and utilities for more than fifteen years and has previously worked at the Los Angeles Times, Tampa Bay Times, Baltimore Sun, and Miami Herald. Penn's reporting has examined nuclear plant failures, grid reliability, climate pressures, and the growing influence of technology companies in energy markets. A longtime journalist shaped by investigative reporting, he is also attentive to issues of equity, public accountability, and consumer protection.

Penn is a graduate of the University of Maryland and was the first black editor-in-chief of its student newspaper. He also holds a master's in global leadership from Fuller Theological Seminary and was a John S. Knight Fellow at Stanford University.

His work reflects a commitment to accuracy, fairness, and public service journalism.

Learn more and follow at nytimes.com/by/ivan-penn

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Helpful Links and Resources

Ivan Penn – New York Times profile https://www.nytimes.com/by/ivan-penn

The New York Times – Energy and Environment coverage https://www.nytimes.com/section/climate

Three Mile Island nuclear plant background https://www.nrc.gov/reading-rm/doc-collections/fact-sheets/3mile-isle

National Association of Regulatory Utility Commissioners https://www.naruc.org

PJM Interconnection electricity market https://www.pjm.com

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Show Notes

• Childhood shaped by public-school educators and nightly news rituals
• Early journalism roots as school weatherman and student editor
• Becoming first Black editor-in-chief at University of Maryland paper
• "It was a powerful thing that I was able to experience."
• Early reporting career across major regional newspapers
• Assigned to energy and utilities beat as apparent punishment
• Broken Crystal River nuclear plant sparks investigative focus
• Anonymous source meeting at a Chili's launches major reporting trail
• NRC documents unlock public-records investigation
• Rare use of anonymous sources, reliance on verifiable documents
• Sixteen years covering nuclear, utilities, and electricity markets
• Nuclear renaissance promised dozens of reactors, delivered only two
• Return of nuclear amid AI-driven electricity demand
• Rise of small modular and advanced reactor proposals
• Debate over safety, fuel design, and reactor scale
• Data centers driving exponential growth in electricity demand
• "Anything connected to the grid plays a role."
• Grid costs shared across homeowners, businesses, and industry
• Tech companies argue for shared infrastructure responsibility
• Consumer advocates argue data centers cause new costs
• Utility regulation spanning local, state, and federal levels
• "The real focus is who pays and who gets paid."
• Tech giants eclipse utilities as dominant financial players
• Consumer advocates outmatched by utility and tech resources
• Journalism as faith-shaped commitment to truth and fairness

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#EnergyPolicy #ElectricityGrid #Journalism #FaithAndPublicLife #AIInfrastructure #Utilities #ClimateEconomy

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Production Credits

Conversing is produced and distributed in partnership with Comment magazine and Fuller Seminary.