What 'let's say' means in practice

Why do so many lessons feel disconnected to students – even when the content is genuinely fascinating? In this episode, Dr James Mannion is joined by teacher and author Hywel Roberts to explore 'botheredness' – a way of teaching that draws students into learning through narrative, curiosity and shared imagination. They discuss why pupils often struggle to see the relevance of what they are learning, and how small shifts in pedagogy can transform a lesson from something students comply with into something they actively care about. As Hywel explains, the key is not entertainment or gimmicks, but creating context, tension and meaning around knowledge. The conversation explores practical techniques such as ‘let’s say’ narratives, teacher-in-role, and the use of story structures built around people, place and problem. These approaches help teachers bring abstract knowledge to life and ‘protect students into learning’ by making them feel safe, curious and invested in the lesson. James also reflects on the challenge many teachers face: delivering a knowledge-rich curriculum that can sometimes feel like a sequence of disconnected topics. Together they explore how storytelling and implementation thinking can help embed this approach into everyday classroom practice. They also introduce a new professional learning programme combining the pedagogy of botheredness with implementation science, designed to help teachers move from one-off inspiration to sustained classroom change. In this episode: - Why students often ask ‘Why are we learning this?’ - The difference between engagement and investment in learning - How stories create curiosity, tension and motivation - The power of ‘let’s say…’ as an invitation into learning - What it means to ‘protect children into learning’ - Using narrative as retrieval and assessment - The barriers that stop imaginative pedagogy becoming routine practice - How implementation thinking can help make botheredness stick Links and resources Hywel's website: https://botheredness.co.uk Implementing Botheredness 2026: https://www.makingchangestick.co/implementing-botheredness-2026 Book a free 20-minute call: https://calendly.com/rethinkingjames/implementing-botheredness-chat-with-james-hywel