Group Chat: Practical Concerns

The more that I read the fathers’ writings and about their spiritual struggles, the more I understand that what we need to see is the desire that is the foundation their life and driving force behind their behaviors.  Our life is to be an urgent longing for God who has given everything to us and revealed his desire to draw us into his life. Our spiritual life cannot be an abstraction; something that exist in the mind alone. Nor can it be a kind of rigorous moralism where one is driven by fear or an intense scrupulosity; rooted in the doubt of God’s compassion and mercy. 

We have had to read the Evergetinos very closely and with a critical eye; for the stories capture for us the fathers’ struggle to hold on to the one thing necessary while maintaining a balanced understanding of what it is to be a human being. This is a difficult thing for people to do in general and for the fathers we find that there withdrawal from society intensified and complicated this struggle. We have noted in past discussions the tendency to project the struggle within the human heart onto others as the cause of their anger, lust, etc. In reality, the battle lies within.

Having said this, we must understand that desire is the heart of the spiritual life. It is the one thing that we should be seeking to inflame from moment to moment and day to day. This the fathers understood; especially those who had experienced a radical intimacy with God and purity of heart. When one has tasted the sweetness of the kingdom, the life and love of the living God, then the urgency of one’s desire for God and holding on to what is precious becomes the goal of life. When one’s heart has been touched by the Beloved one can think of nothing else. And when one has lost that intimacy through ingratitude or sloth, the depths of pain in the heart is equally great.

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Text of chat during the group:

00:01:43 Fr. Charbel Abernethy: This is the best reflection I’ve read on Climacus’ description of the prison in The Ladder of the Divine Ascent:
The visitation of the uncreated Light generates the most intense desire which does not allow man any rest on earth. When speaking to his monastic community, Father Sophrony indicated that the prisoners in The Ladder of Saint John Climacus were not ordinary people. They were not people to be despised as sinners who were expelled to be punished. They were people of unrestrainable desire for God, who had known the uncreated Light and then lost it after having sinned in one way or another. They voluntarily went to that prison, determined to die rather than to betray the covenant they had made with God in the beginning. As we read, some of them were so totally consumed by the pain of their desire and repentance, that they passed to the other life even before they had reached the tenth day of their abode in that prison.
00:01:49 Fr. Charbel Abernethy: There is a verse from the Psalms which truly describes the state of those prisoners: ‘Lord, remember David, and all his afflictions: How he sware unto the Lord, and vowed unto the mighty God of Jacob; surely I will not come into the tabernacle of my house, nor go up into my bed; I will not give sleep to mine eyes, or slumber to mine eyelids, until I find out a place for the Lord, an habitation for the mighty God of Jacob.’ In my humble opinion, there is not a more perfect expression of the gift of longing for the living God than this verse of prophet David. 
Archimandrite Zacharias Zacharou 
“Monasticism”

00:12:35 Suzanne Romano: Nothing in chat

00:12:36 Maureen Cunningham: Nope

00:12:41 Fr. Charbel Abernethy: This is the best reflection I’ve read on Climacus’ description of the prison in The Ladder of the Divine Ascent:
The visitation of the uncreated Light generates the most intense desire which does not allow man any rest on earth. When speaking to his monastic community, Father Sophrony indicated that the prisoners in The Ladder of Saint John Climacus were not ordinary people. They were not people to be despised as sinners who were expelled to be punished. They were people of unrestrainable desire for God, who had known the uncreated Light and then lost it after having sinned in one way or another. They voluntarily went to that prison, determined to die rather than to betray the covenant they had made with God in the beginning. As we read, some of them were so totally consumed by the pain of their desire and repentance, that they passed to the other life even before they had reached the tenth day of their abode in that prison.

00:12:49 Suzanne Romano: Yes

00:12:50 Julie: Yes

00:12:50 Maureen Cunningham: Yes

00:12:55 Fr. Charbel Abernethy: There is a verse from the Psalms which truly describes the state of those prisoners: ‘Lord, remember David, and all his afflictions: How he sware unto the Lord, and vowed unto the mighty God of Jacob; surely I will not come into the tabernacle of my house, nor go up into my bed; I will not give sleep to mine eyes, or slumber to mine eyelids, until I find out a place for the Lord, an habitation for the mighty God of Jacob.’ In my humble opinion, there is not a more perfect expression of the gift of longing for the living God than this verse of prophet David. 
Archimandrite Zacharias Zacharou 
“Monasticism”

00:12:59 Troy Amaro: Reacted to "This is the best ref…" with 👍

00:23:47 Adam Paige: Reacted to "This is the best ref..." with 👍

00:23:55 Julie: Beautiful

00:26:46 Bob Čihák, AZ: Reacted to "Beautiful" with 👍

00:52:14 Catherine Opie: Fr. with priests who are in the world they are working with young boys all the time mentoring them as servers and during the mass there is a lot of close contact holding vestments etc. I had never really considered this situation in this way. And we are told these days that human touch is necessary for good mental health as well.

00:52:15 Sr. Charista Maria: Fr. are you familiar with Aelred of Rievaulx, Saint of Holy Friendship? Some of what he shares is different than this. Yes it is scary out there though.

00:52:55 Sr. Charista Maria: St. Aelred is very personable though prudent.

00:56:35 Forrest Cavalier: Like most acolytes, nothing inappropriate happened as I served as an acolyte under many priests for 10 years. Nothing inappropriate. The number of abusers is a small percentage. Too many, but a small percentage. That means that this requirement is not difficult.

00:56:52 Sr. Mary Clare: Concerning priests with altar boys, It takes prayer and discernment to lead the boys to Jesus rather than to themselves. A holy reserve can go a long way. Loving others without any possessive love.

00:57:37 Catherine Opie: Reacted to "Like most acolytes, ..." with 👍🏻

00:57:44 Catherine Opie: Reacted to "Concerning priests w..." with 👍🏻

00:58:22 Lori Hatala: Do you think a lack of reverence contributes?

00:59:02 Sr. Charista Maria: Reacted to "Concerning priests w..." with 👍🏻

00:59:13 Dennis M: Reacted to "Concerning priests w..." with 👍🏻

00:59:24 Sr. Charista Maria: Reacted to "Do you think a lack ..." with 👍

01:13:54 Maureen Cunningham: Yes loud

01:15:44 Suzanne Romano: Isaac speaks about the senses being the conduits of a darkening of the soul. I think he says we have to starve them.

01:15:55 Maureen Cunningham: Desert Fathers went to desert fight the evil.

01:20:54 Sr. Mary Clare: Your beautiful explanations are very balanced. Thank you!

01:21:46 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You

01:21:47 Catherine Opie: It becomes clearer all the time how

01:21:51 Sr. Charista Maria: very good Fr.

01:22:06 Janine: It was great Father! Thank you!

01:22:28 Andrew Adams: Thanks be to God! Thank you, Father!

01:22:35 Suzanne Romano: God bless!

01:22:36 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂

01:22:44 Catherine Opie: God bless

01:22:48 Bob Čihák, AZ: You're always on target, Father. The targets change, thank God!

01:22:48 Troy Amaro: Thank You Father.

01:23:05 Maureen Cunningham: We're do you listen