Copywriting and Pitch Skills

In part one of this week’s triple author interview, literary agent Carly Watters sits down with Mai Nguyen to discuss her deeply personal novel ‘Cleo Dang Would Rather Be Dead’. Mai shares the heartbreaking real-life loss that inspired the book and how writing fiction became a vessel for processing grief. They dive into the challenge of portraying “bed-rotting” grief on the page, balancing darkness with humor, and why a funeral home setting became the perfect device to move the story—and the character—forward. The conversation also explores envy in grief, the taboo of infant loss, and how community and connection can bring someone back to life.

Part two pivots to Carly Watters chatting with Lindsay Wong about her genre-bending novel ‘Villain-Hitting for Vicious Little Nobodies’—a dark, hilarious story blending horror, history, and autofiction. Lindsay breaks down the book as a story of choicelessness, intergenerational trauma, and what women sacrifice to survive under capitalism and cultural expectations. They dive into corpse marriage, villain hitting, and how myth and reality collide to explore power, class, and rage—especially for women who aren’t allowed to express it. The conversation also unpacks world-building through power dynamics, writing discomfort as a craft tool, and navigating multiple POVs. 

Part 3 dives deep into craft, character, and the messy reality of writing the book you actually need to write—not the one you started with. Laurie Frankel breaks down how voice isn’t found—it’s earned through hundreds of drafts, and why early pages are often just writers “circling the building” until the story clicks. The conversation explores smart craft choices like easing readers in with minor characters, using names as free character development, and why your protagonist’s job should serve the story’s needs, not just realism.

Note: CeCe Lyra is a literary agent at Wendy Sherman Associates. If you’d like to query CeCe, please refer to the submission guidelines at www.wsherman.com. Carly Watters is a literary agent at P.S. Literary Agency, but her work on this podcast is not affiliated with the agency, and the views expressed by Carly on this podcast are solely that of her as a podcast co-host ​and do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, policies, or position of P.S. Literary Agency.

Find us on our socials:

Threads: https://www.threads.net/@the_shit_about_writing

https://www.threads.net/@biancamarais_author

https://www.threads.net/@carlywatters https://www.threads.net/@cece_lyra_agent

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/the_shit_about_writing/

https://www.instagram.com/biancamarais_author/ https://www.instagram.com/carlywatters/ https://www.instagram.com/cece_lyra_agent/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/TSNOTYAW

Websites: www.theshitaboutwriting.com, www.biancamarais.com, www.carlywatters.com and www.cecilialyra.com

Bookshop.org affiliate page: https://bookshop.org/shop/theshitnoonetellsyouaboutwriting

To sign up for our Substack newsletter, head to https://theshitaboutwriting.substack.com

Our Sponsors:
* Check out Chime: https://chime.com/TSNOTYAW
* Check out Quince: https://quince.com/tsnotyaw
* Check out Rosetta Stone and use my code TODAY for a great deal: https://www.rosettastone.com
* Check out Wayfair: https://www.wayfair.com


Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands